Topic: Lena......my first boat build. (Read 33060 times)

Unsinkable 2 · « **on:** May 08, 2015, 09:44:07 pm »

Please re position this post if necessary.

Hello to all, I started my boat last week by drawing up the plans. I found some downloadable plans and re drew due to the poor quality and general lack of information. I then started work on cutting out some planks for both the deck and hull. I did this by cutting down the edge of a 18mm thick sheet of pine to a depth of around 4cm and then cut a thickness of 2 to 3 mm along the length with my circular saw. this gave me 2x 8mmwide planks 2.4 m long with each cut. (the blade is 2mm thick) thus 2x8+2mm = 18mm thick.
Today I glued up all the deck and made a few frames for the hull. tomorrow ill try and finish the deck shape and the rest of the frames. Ill try and get some photos on here as the build progresses.

Now for some beginners questions....
Is one layer of planking (2-3mm thick before sanding) enough for a hull?
The wood is pine, what putty is best to seal and shape the hull with or is that 2 different processes?

This project will be finished, I may be new to boats but I have built lots of other models.... thanks for any advice and help..U2

Tug-Kenny RIP · « **Reply #1 on:** May 09, 2015, 09:31:36 am »

Hello U2 and welcome to the Forum.

I have just followed this route that are taking, so to save a lengthy dialog here, may I recommend you have a look at the Blog under the title Seabex One.

Whilst not professing to be in any way clever, it will give you an idea of how I did what you are tackling, and how I am getting around the million problems that it presents. Please don't copy the bit about the thumb going through the saw blade.

We would indeed like to see some pictures as you go along and will be helping you with any questions. Scratch building is such a pleasure. I'll move your thread to working oats section once you get started.

Cheers

ken

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #2 on:** May 09, 2015, 10:14:29 pm »

Hi Ken, I have already read the Seabex one thread with great intrest I must say I did learn a few things, some what to do and some what not, eh hem

. So car body filler is good enough over one layer of planking, good, that makes things a lot easier. I have a couple more questions but I will put them in a different section....

I see youre going to move my post to "oats", I heard that bees are in decline but I didn't realise it was to the extent that it now affects forum posts.....

Lena..... well today I finished shaping the deck and made almost all of the "bulkheads" not frames as I put in my previous post. eh hem

I will get round to posting pics..... U2

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #3 on:** May 10, 2015, 09:01:39 pm »

I had a good building day today and got some more bulkheads made,

I also managed to make the blocks which will hold the masts as well as making a start on the rowing boat that sits on the ship.
The blocks for the masts were plunge routered to create a good smooth hole then the fronts and backs of the blocks were cut and sanded to produce the rake angle when fixed between two bulkheads. Care had to be taken because the tops of the bulkheads have a slight difference in height above the water line due to a deck that is lower in the middle compared to the bow and stern. one of the bulkheads also doubled up as a support for the motor. I ran out of bulkhead material otherwise I would have had them finished.

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #4 on:** May 12, 2015, 08:22:59 pm »

I took some photos yesterday so I might be able to get them on here soon.

Today I managed to finish all the bulkheads and started to connect them. Another day like today and I think it will be time to start planking the hull

Im off to try and get the photos uploaded...... U2

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #5 on:** May 15, 2015, 10:50:10 pm »

Finally some photos!

First I drew the plans...

then I made some bulkheads and incorporated the mast supports...

I made a deck..

Then cut some more planks

Strange shape structure but I'm sure it'll work

We'll see how it turns out later...... Hopefully

A side view..

This planking is taking ages, I've been on it for two days now and it's still not finished...

My OH insisted that her teddies with new knitted hats get in on the picture, she thinks that they are going on the finished boat....... She thinks wrong.

derekwarner · « **Reply #6 on:** May 16, 2015, 02:53:56 am »

Hi U2.........planking to me is expressing a work of beauty in model ship building, however a few comments & questions

1. I agree planking thickness to ~~~3 mm is a good start

for a hull of these proportions
2. What type of glue are you using?
3. pine timber is a fast growing coarse grained timber and prone to splitting when bent, although I see no evidence in your planking
4. you mention you drew the plans......did you create the water lines & hence the frame profiles?

The reason I ask is not a criticism ...simply an observation of a profile glitch between frames 7, 8 & 9.......[I have the Tee Shirt from a previous build]

I have marked one frame in green where it looks too fat, I have also marked also marked the next frame in red where it looks to skinny

The result here is that the planking over the frames 7, 8 & 9 loses the smooth contour flow...and is a series of straight lengths & bumps

When we view the end elevation plan in the hull profiles view below we see the profile of frame 8 may be the glitch.... Derek

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #7 on:** May 16, 2015, 06:52:37 am »

Hello Derek and thank you for taking the time to look at my build.
The reason that the frames look a little fat and or skinny is a little technique I am trying. First all the frames are made to the same 5mm thickness, (see earlier photos) then where there is a curve in the hull I added some extra thickness and sanded it to the hull contour. I only did this because the extra surface area allows for more adhesion to hold the planks in place. Once in place I have three mm thickness to be able to sand and get a lovely smooth contour. It seems to be working so far although time will tell.

I got the plans from freeship plans. Two sheets, one sheet is a drawing of the ship and the other is a side and plan view. The size of the drawing is about 15cm total length and if you try to zoom in it goes all pixelated and blurred. Add to that all the details are numbered for a close up view (about 15 items) but only 3 or 4 are shown bigger. mmm

I copied as much as I could onto a bigger sheet by zooming the scale on the screen to 1metre =1cm and multiplying by 4. that gave me a 26metre boat turning out at 104cm model. The frames numbered 1 to 9 were on the drawing, the a,b,c and d frames were added by me to give a little more structural support.

I just had another look at the photo and realise that it may be the camera angle that makes it look a bit flat because on the boat its a lovely smooth curve

As for the glue well erm (U2 lowers his head and twists his right foot from right to left) its superglue.......
I tested a few planks by gluing them and then trying to snap them apart and it was always the wood which broke first so I assume its strong enough.
I will be sealing all the wood both inside and out before im finished.

and the point about the wood splitting, your right some did, I bend it before gluing it in place and the ones that split didn't get used.

As long as it floats and looks reasonable when its finished I'll be happy...... watch this space. U2

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #8 on:** May 16, 2015, 07:19:27 am »

On the plan there is something in front of the ships wheel. Its a poor plan and the detail of this item is missing. I am assuming its possibly a compass of some description. Could this be a good assumption for a boat built around 1875?

any help appreciated...... info photos drawings anything really, thanks. U2

derekwarner · « **Reply #9 on:** May 16, 2015, 07:59:49 am »

U2......if this the item you describe........GOOGLE ships binnacle..........there are 100's of images .......as you suspect, it is the stand housing for the ships compass

...... Derek

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #10 on:** May 16, 2015, 09:14:31 pm »

Ah Derek, yes it is and thank you for that. I'm glad I put the drawing on it came in handy along with your squiggly pen.

Today I managed to build all the 'bridge?' and I will now google the binnacle so I can finish it off tomorrow. I made a couple of photos but they're not going on tonight.... maybe tomorrow. U2

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #11 on:** May 17, 2015, 09:12:40 pm »

Yesterdays and todays photos...

Todays efforts.....

Yesterdays efforts....

smileyjon · « **Reply #12 on:** May 26, 2015, 09:22:16 pm »

Fascinating . . . . great stuff

Jon

PICKETBOAT · « **Reply #13 on:** May 31, 2015, 09:10:33 am »

Hi unsinkable 2

This is excellent for a first build. My first build was carved from the solid. I had not got the confidence to attempt plank on frame. Well done.

My only observation is that when building scale wooden ship models it's always a good idea to choose the timber carefully and try and get some stock built up before you start cutting.
Pine is readily available and cheap however it brings it's own problems, The grain structure on a lot of modern pine (not all varieties) reflect it's quick growing nature, and the wide bands of the grain are often not to scale. This is not a problem if in it's eventual finish it is painted, however quick grown pine can contain a lot of resin which in certain warm conditions can come through the paint and cause problems. Bending course grain timber can be a problem too. For future reference an excellent timber for hull construction is Canary Poplar (sometimes called Tulip wood). It has a fine grain, contains no resin, is stable, glues well and is soft enough to easily machine and sand. In strips it can be practically tied in a knot so bending is easy. Your local timber yard should be able to get you some. It's down side is that it's colour can vary from white through green to dark purple, so it's probably best for painted hulls. Deck planking is best done with Lime wood (Bass wood if you're in the USA) or Sycamore which is very good but a bit harder to sand.

Open grained timbers like Oak, Teak and some of the Mahogany family are ill suited to scale models (but great for full sized vessels). Again the open grain looks out of scale and needs an immense amount of filling to get a decent painted or varnished finish.

Non of the above is intended as a criticism of this excellent model. I just wish some one had told me the above when I set off building ship models. It would have saved a lot of time.

Keep up the build log as I would like to see the finished model.

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #14 on:** May 31, 2015, 08:05:53 pm »

Picketboat, wow, thanks for the info and for the nice comments. Gulp, I never thought about wood choice it was just a spur of the moment decision to build a boat and I had an 18mm thick 2.4metre sheet of pine so I just cut it into strips and off I went.....

I was lucky enough to meet a woodworker who supplied me with about 8 (I'll check next time I'm in the garage) pieces of different types of wooden off cuts. You can see two different kinds I used to build the boxes that sit on the deck. I live in France and the guy wrote all the names on the wood in French so I'll have to translate them and see what I have got. I'll finish the hull with the pine and then seal it and hope that there is no resin leak. If there is, well I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.....

As for the grain, well the hull will be painted and the deck will be stained. The deck will be somewhat out of scale but hey it's a beginners mistake and I'm learning as I go along......

I took some more photos yesterday so if I can prize the computer off my daughter I'll upload the photos......U2

ballastanksian · « **Reply #15 on:** May 31, 2015, 08:29:26 pm »

I have agonised over wether it is more economic to cut your own or buy ready cut planks.

Bandsaw blades can be costly to replace unless you know of a local sawwright who can reweld the blade together (assuming it isn't blunt!) and circular saw blades waste a lot of wood per cut, and need sharpening to get the best cut. There has been a recent thread about narrow cut circular saw blades on this forum.

Obviously you are enjoying your build suggesting that the choice of wood has not been an issue, so if free, this negates my thoughts, but if you go down the route of buying timbers, it may be worth costing the one way of obtaining planks against the other.

At the end of the day it is our hobby initially as an individual pastime when building our model, so you have a budget or a source of cheap (or even better FREE!) material, so it is the choice of the individual wether to cut their own or but ready cut strips.

I love seeing people making plank on frame hulls, and while I respect that GRP is a more stable material, the smell and feel of wood is peerless. I look forward to see how your build goes.

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #16 on:** May 31, 2015, 10:01:24 pm »

Balastanksian, hi there, once again I never even considered the cost I just had the wood at hand and I cut it with the saw I have. After reading a few threads, posts and replies on here I would definitely consider the type of wood if I build another boat and also maybe even see my local woodworker who provided the samples to see about cutting the strips....

meanwhile.... some more photos.....

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #17 on:** May 31, 2015, 10:09:14 pm »

Latest photos.....

I did some more planks....

But only one side is finished (I know your supposed to build evenly but hey.....)

The masts line up pretty well....

I made/ finished some more bits

And placed them on the deck to have an idea what they might be like...

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #18 on:** May 31, 2015, 10:16:24 pm »

I decided with help from you guys that there were no skylights in the deck and that they must be coal scupper covers...

The chimney support will be raised as needed when the time arrives

General rear view

General front view

...... U2

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #19 on:** June 07, 2015, 08:43:45 am »

I have had a busy week at work this week so I didn't manage to get as much as usual done on my boat. This week its a different shift so I should be able to progress again. That said I did receive my order from Steve at model bits..

but when I checked the prop was too small

NOT Steves fault

I had ordered the wrong one

Ill contact him and ask about an exchange as I haven't opened the packet.

I did however manage to install the propshaft and run the motor as well as make some non working boat hoists...... update photos this evening all being well.... U2

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #20 on:** June 09, 2015, 08:39:13 pm »

Mmmm all wasn't well, my computer plays up now and again but its OK today so here are my updates....

I fitted the motor and positioned the rudder servo....

I somehow expected the UJ to be a bit smaller but they are great...

The motor is secure and runs smooth albeit only in one direction at the moment

It lines up reasonably well which is good enough for me

then I made some bits,
(please note that as a first build I am only trying to recreate "a good likeness" of things and not a full scale replica)

Made some "sticky out bits" around the propshaft...Oh and slapped on a ton of filler...

Then removed 3/4 of a ton of filler to obtain a reasonable shape....... for starters

More soon............... hope you like it U2

PICKETBOAT · « **Reply #21 on:** June 09, 2015, 10:07:08 pm »

This looks excellent. Can't believe it's a first build!

Please remember that just filler on wood, subsequently painted, can expand and contract letting in water. A good plan is to coat the outer hull surface with GRP resin and tissue. When sanded down this forms a good surface to paint. Many modellers also use the same combination on the inside (between frames) to create a very stable and strong hull.

Glad you discovered Mr Tranter who is an excellent supplier and very helpful.

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #22 on:** June 10, 2015, 07:10:57 pm »

Thanks Picketboat, I never even thought of that. I have coated the inside with resin (well most of it, the rest tomorrow) I did it whilst there was still a hole in the side (see above photo) I should have done it on the underside of the blocks that connect the frames but I forgot. Luckily I realised before it was to late and coated them.
I finished the planking today so tomorrow I'll coat the new planks. I also plan to lay some fibreglass mat pieces soaked in resin all over the inside and incorporate some ballast (lead shot) in the resin.
As well as that I intend to have two removable pieces of ballast and two interchangeable different weight and length keels. IE remove the heavy ballast and add the heavy keel, depending on conditions. OTT? I hope not!
More photos when I get something done...... U2

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #23 on:** June 16, 2015, 09:32:25 pm »

Looks like a GRP mould....

Unsinkable 2 · « **Reply #24 on:** June 16, 2015, 09:47:07 pm »

Some gremlins keep nickin me photos

Ill try again tomorrow......U2

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Author Topic: Lena......my first boat build. (Read 33060 times)