Model Boat Mayhem
The Shipyard ( Dry Dock ): Builds & Questions => Steam => Topic started by: xrad on November 26, 2015, 02:01:12 pm
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Hello, Have another project in the works: a forty inch open steam launch. Sourced the hull and engine locally in Ohio. PMResearch #8 engine and Ministeam launch.
Built the engine last night. I bought the machined kit. Very nicely machined and made. Heavy bronze base casting. All parts brass, copper, or bronze except spring washers and shafts which appear to be stainless. I did change the piston nuts from brass to stainless steel. Took about two hours to assemble. I polished the oscillating mating surfaces to 600grt on a small piece of plate glass. You will have to make a press guide (see pic, top center pin and base device) to press in the 2 3/16 bronze bearings.
Then you will need a 3/16th undersized reamer to finish out the bearings internally as they compress a bit when pressed into the engine base. You may also have to ream out the pivot pin bearings with 3/16th undersized reamer. A bit of filing and cleaning (including the crank shaft machined ends) and she goes together very well. Adjusting the piston rod length to find the sweet spot was a matter of a few turns of the rod and locking the rod nut. Split teflon piston rings X2 per side fit on easily. O rings for the glands work well. Size is about 4x3x4. Hardest part is cutting out the four paper cylinder gaskets. I have a hole punch which definitely saved time and made for nice round holes.Ran great right after assembly at low psi in both directions.
You will not need many tools, but you do need:
good small regular screw driver
600 grt paper
small allen wrench
3/16th undersized reamer
bearing guide for press (shaft should be 6-8 thou under 3/16th diameter to allow for compression of bearing)
#3 wrench
pliers
locktite
sharp knife
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diwGIN3AWtc&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diwGIN3AWtc&feature=youtu.be)
In the end, you will be satisfied with this engine. Runs well and builds easily. I chose this engine and hull so that I could focus on the boiler build in this launch. I try to really learn how to build at least one or two main aspects of each of my models. It can become cumbersome at times to make all the parts (engine , hull, boiler, design, etc) for all of my builds. So I try to focus on an aspect of each build more seriously to improve and challenge my skills.
Plan for boiler: scratch built 3 inch dia vertical gas fired copper
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Bonjour Xrad,
Very good choice, we know this machine and it is quite powerful : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsRs65FekEM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsRs65FekEM)
Just a remark, as it is a 8 cm3, it needs some steam to run and if you wish autonomy, think about a large boiler. In France, we are lucky because we find easily 100 mm (4") or 120 mm (4,7") x 2 mm thick copper tubes for our boiler. That allows us to use 32 or 40 mm inside tubes to be able to heat it with > 200 g/h gas torchs (with a gas attenuator/regulator to control correctly the strengh of the torch).
To my opinion, to save steam, you can use a large 4 blades propeller (I use a 3,5" on my Liva 1, but a smaller 5 blades can also be uses, I will do this on my next secret project where I have no room for a large diameter) ==> to be taken in account with you install the propeller shaft.
On my current 1,40 m renovating launch poject Liva 2 (5,6 cm") I am installing 100 x 200 mm boiler and a 27541 4 blades Propshop propeller : https://photos.google.com/album/AF1QipO1-pDNgnTUK3fwTBh31aM7R0AWKGht7NANjTkt
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I fitted one of these engines to a 45" Kingston Moldings 1912 Yacht Tender with a 7" x 4" vertical boiler which was made locally. Initially we fitted a 3" four blade prop but recently swapped to a 3.5" four blade. Last Sunday it ran for 45 minutes and the boiler was still 1/3rd full. The only problem we have is that it wants to get up and plane at way over scale speed even on just a little throttle. It does not like to go slow!
I am sure you will be very happy with the engine as long as you put a big prop on it.
Cheers,
Ian.
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thx for tips fellas. I have a few feet of 3 in dia boiler tube so I will be using this. Plus I have the formers for 3in diam as well. Also have a bunch of thick walled 3/16th fire tubes from another boiler project, so will use these too.
this engine needs about .6 in3 per rotation. I would like to have about 20 in3 water available to boil minimum(about 2/3rds of boiler water volume (which is about 7/8ths total boiler volume)). this is about 32000 in3 of steam. rotations to be about 240rpm. ~144 in3 steam per min. So in a perfect world, I should get almost 3 hours of run time!
Factor in heat loss, condensation, engine friction, leaks...and I subtract 75% of this time. So i should get about 30-45 min run time....
This means I need about a 500 ml boiler water volume.
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Bonjour xrad,
Personnally, I do not calculate, I manage to integrate what I can buy ==> I will be very interested to have the results of your measures in the real life compared to these assumptions.
For example, to my opinion, 240 rpm is too low for this machine, based on what I have seen on my friend's boat. He tried to build a speed boat with it, but hopefully, it is slower than my one ok2 : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G-zjiwAiwE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G-zjiwAiwE) As you can see it, it smokes a lot at only 45 psi...
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3in diameter boiler too tall. Decided to go with 4in dia as there was 8in of cheap 'L' pipe on ebay today. The center of balance was too high with the 3 in dia boiler when at the volume of 500ml water + head space + allowance for fire tubes.
just have to figure out how many fire tubes(more for increased heating surface) v. loss of volume (decreased run time). probably need about 20 or so.
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Hi Xrad, can you please post the details of the supplier of the hull. Is it Mini Steam? If so is it correct that they also have a large (54") tug hull? Thanks, Ian.
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Bonjour Xrad,
You wrote "3in diameter boiler too tall. Decided to go with 4in dia ..." but if 3 in is too tall, 4in is even taller ! Could you explain me this assumption ?
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Kiwi: Yes, ministeam. Under steam engines, select show all. towards the end of the list.
https://ministeam.com/acatalog/Boats---Marine-Engines.html
rhavrane: Building a vertical boiler. I want to keep center of g lower. So I go with wider boiler diameter. Same 500+ ml volume to be boiled.
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Bonjour Xrad,
I had not thought about this alternative :-)) On my side, impossible to test the center of gravity of my launch, it is too long for my bath tube {:-{
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6mXKSRqPPQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6mXKSRqPPQ) Never mind, I have several issues to solve before being able to navigate and I know it ill not be stable.
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Bonjour Raphael.......if the bath is not big enough >:-o, you must sell the house for one with a bigger bath O0
Question......in your video...at 1:50 to 1:56, is the motor shaft slipping in the flexible coupling? ..... Derek
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Bonjour rhavrane!
Here is what you need:
http://www.orientaltrading.com/web/browse/processProductsCatalog?Nrpp=10000&sku=49%2F403&BP=PS490&source=google&ms=search&cm_mmc=Google-_-%5BOTC%5D+%5BShopping%5D+-+Product+Type-_-New+-+Product+Type-_-_mkwid|s|pcrid|83819744768|pkw||pmt||pdv|c|&cm_mmca1=OTC%2BPLAs&cm_mmca2=GooglePLAs&cm_mmca3=PS490&cm_mmca4=FS39&cm_mmca5=Shopping&cm_mmca6=PLAs&cm_mmca8=&cm_mmca10=Shopping&cm_mmca11=49%2F403&gclid=CNadguHdyskCFQ8uaQod7BMEQQ&categoryId=377320&Nrpp=10000
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Bonjour,
A swimming pool in my flat ? Excellent :} :} :} but imagine my wife coming back from her job and discovering it in the dining room... She is already upset by the room taken by my babies...
Derek, you are right, I actually have loosen the gimbal screws as it is not so fmexible in fact and I have already ordered a double one, I have just the room for. Advantage, the double acting gimbal is supposed to be more "permisive" for permissive for irreparable misalignment.
http://www.cap-maquettes.com/contents/fr/search.php?searchphrase=cardan (http://www.cap-maquettes.com/contents/fr/search.php?searchphrase=cardan) (For my 5 mm diameter requirement, I have just been obliged to buy several references to be assembled).
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Received the fiberglass hull. It is not made by ministeam. Compared to other hulls I have, this one was a bit disappointing. Its size and shape and proportions are perfect. But for some reason, the entire gel coat was sanded with what looks like 300-400 grit. I suspect that the original gel finish was not up to par and to hide it, the whole hull was sanded. Not what I expected. But luckily, I had planned to paint the hull...possibly dark green or black. Have not decided.
A great book I just purchased is 'the steam launch.' If you do not have this and you are a fan of steam boating, you need to find a copy. Hard cover with MANY pics and details of many steam launches, boilers and engines. I found a hard cover version for less that 30$.
http://www.amazon.com/The-steam-launch-Elliott-classics/dp/0964120402
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Built the boiler (mostly) today. Took about 6 hours. Went with 3 inch diameter and ~7.5 inches tall boiler body. Still have to make cone and finish fittings, lagging, and firebopx. Chimney has pressed in brass top. Sized was mostly dictated by review of many images in the 'Steam Launch' book.
I used 15 3/8 thick walled copper tubes. Got them from Reeves or somewhere a few years ago. Copper boiler tube is .1 in thick and ends are .7 in or so. Brazed in bottom end first. then fit tubes and top end and brazed them. Don;t forget to drill a small hole for gas to escape from inside boiler. I drilled at location for relief valve bung.
All fire tubes are 6 inches long. Makes it easy as originally bought in 12 in length. One end is swaged (so tube does not fall through when assembling or brazing) just a bit with the swage punch (7$ on ebay). Cut them all, swage them all, apply flux to all, insert all. Assembly line fast.....
I did have to oversize 3/8th ream the fire tube holes. The bottom after brazing, and the tops before assembly as the fire tubes were a hair over 3/8th diameter.
Had to anneal the ends 6 times. Hammered over an oak former. Some will say the my holes are too close, but with end cap thickness and the extra support from the fire tubes, I am not worried.
Note: I did add another ring of silver solder to the BOTTOM end cap at side facing down(when brazing the fire tubes). Although there was plenty of solder on the first pass, the bottom tubes final brazing was the third pass, and it only sealed the whole unit better.
I had no issue with the first end cap shifting when brazing the top, and vice versa. My garage was about 15 degrees, so I had to give the whole boiler general heat with the big propane torch, and then used controlled MAPP/oxy fine tip for pinpoint heat at all joints. The silver flowed very nicely and went where I directed it. I did have to build a brick fire box for the second and third brazing cycles as the propane tank was losing expansion.
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A tip for forming the silver rings, wrap a spare tube of same diameter however many times as needed. For me, I made 31 wraps, so nice 3/8th spring, which is then cut to create rings. These do not have to fit perfectly. The solder will flow to where you tell it to by your heating. Of course, it is noce to have them fit perfectly....
Also, I used 1/2 inch on center for the fire tube spacing. This allowed me to get 5 tubes across with the centered hole. I just used a two pointed compass to put fine scratches into the copper ends. These were then drilled to 1/4, and then cut out to 3/8th with the step drill.
Have to order a few bungs and the sight glass ends as apparently, I ran out. I could machine the bungs from brass, but I am going to try to find bronze ones....
I built this boiler with the to end cap round edge UP because I was considering using the extra head space for a top steam outlet...still have not entirely decided. Built this mostly by feel, and not so much by planning.....should hold about 400+ ml's...so I should get some decent run times without refilling...
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chimney mostly finished...
Made several paper cones. Copper cone cut out with shears, annealed, hand formed, and then hammered over cone shaped oak form. Took a bit to get it right. The cone and ring riveted and all silver soldered together with chimney. Will polish and pickle when I get some more citric acid from the health food store...
In side the cone is a copper band cut from the original pipe. This is a spacer to maintain proper cone height above the fire tubes. There is a small gap between the cone bottom and the boiler wall for the wood lagging.
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xrad,
Neat boiler, I am assuming that you have a space above the top of the fire tubes after you have fitted the top cone and chimney.
Have you considered using the space to fit either a feed water heater or a steam dryer, here are 2- pics of a recently built test boiler with a steam drier fitted.I am a great believer in using any space to make the best of any heat that has passed thro' the fire tubes. Boiler is 3" dia x 6" between end plates.
Just a thought.
Keep up the build.
George.
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Thanks Ooyah. Spacer ring allows for one or so loops of 'superheater' coil. It is being considered.
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I did put a 'super heater' coil or two in place. Bronze post not drilled through. 3 solder joints and tapped 3/16 40 on top. Made some boiler bushes 1/4 x 40 from 655 si bronze. Machines like a champ, does not melt before the silver solder flows. Inexpensive .5 inch dia rod from online metals. 19$ per foot makes a whole lot of bushes and threaded unions. One threaded pipe made for the safety valve. Had a pin hole leak in one bush and one of the bottom tubes so spent a few hours chasing those down. I use two flame method where general heat to boiler by the big torch and fine point HOT flame to the solder joint allow good control so things don't all fall apart when trying to fix a hole. Cleaning out the 1/4 x 40 threads....
Boiler mostly together..... held cold H2O pressure to 200psi no issue....
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I hope you're not going to clean it up too much. I think the boiler looks good with the "distressed" look
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Thanks Essex! Sorry, my son and I made a citric acid bath so he could learn about some basic chemical reactions...so it got cleaned! But I am sure it won't take too long to get back to the dirty look. I designed the boiler so that it is easy to remove the top, just undo one strap, so that if I wanted to re-clean the funnel, it would be easy and the lagging won't fall off. three strap clamps worked out great. Stained mahogany lagging.
Forgot to mention that I had a tap break off just below flush on the top bung of the water vale earlier today...must have had a crack in it....anyway, had to cut the bung off, punch it through, make another, get the old parts out, and braze new one in....good hour + wasted on that goof.....
Steamed up for first time without any leaks! :-) :-) :-) Steamed to 50+psi popping the valve in 10 min flat on a half empty gas can and boiler about 3/5th usable fill. I am using a ~2.5 bix round burner which works well when not full of water! Got at least 20 min with the safety valve staying open.
So this should be a nice combo with the oscillating twin and a medium sized refillable gas tank. Leaves room for a water tank..... . Have not decided how to finish the bottom of boiler..maybe a faux coal door..something to cover the holes and mounting screws...
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Ah well
Does look nice tho
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xrad..............looking good.... :-))...just an idea %)
Selective black high temperature gloss to the boiler top cone cap & a band of polished copper prior to the chimney top
Derek
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Thanks guys! That does look nice Derek. Maybe a band of color to match the hull which could be gloss black over dark green.... have to see how the hull comes out....
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I put on a new full gas can and started to get some burner back burning. bored out the vent holes a bit more and opened up the base of the funnel shaft to max (I did not open it all the way to try to conserve heat in the boiler, I guess the original design worked too well). With the gas on very low flow, the burner works great, and heat flow through the boiler is very good. No heat back flow out of the base vent holes, and the boiler heats up even faster now, and I use less gas! Seems to all be just about a near perfect design for time to boil, amount of fire tubes, boiler diameter, burner size, gas usage, amount of usable water volume, and length of steam time without refill ....
correct form and function = :}
short vid of steaming:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nu7EAk0y1EY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nu7EAk0y1EY)
Nice day here so I picked out some 5 year dried cherry wood from the log pile and milled up some planks for the launch build..smelled really good.
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Very powerful machine :-)) , we know it in France and a friend has two of them HERE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsRs65FekEM) in his Clyde Puffer.
You will have fun with it if the boiler is powerful enough t feed it.
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Thanks Rhavrane. This boiler is a super steamer! No problem to run the twin...I was actually thinking of changing to a vertical twin, but smaller than my Milduras/Stuarts...
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Bonjour,
Smaller boiler means less autonomy. To my opinion, a 8 cm3 machine needs steam, and I imagine you would like more than 20 minutes on the pond before being obliged to pick up the boat and refill it. Besides this, I see a manual water pump, so would you install a coupled one which would answer to my question ?
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not sure where 8cc's comes from? I think we had this conversation before? bore and stroke for PM#8 is .5 x .75 = about .147 ci then minus piston volume and x2 for 2 cylinders = about 4 cc total volume.
Funny part is that with this boiler, more steam will go out of the safety valve than through the engine. I am going to try a smaller burner....
No coupled water pump. I want the challenge of a hand pump and the uncertainty of when to fill the boiler! ok2
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And x 2 for double acting.
Jerry.
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yep that's right! thx for correction Jerry.....even at 8cc's , plenty of steam from the boiler for this small engine. Free wheeling it was running at least 20 min on the bench at medium rpms....
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Bonjour,
20 minutes is not enough for me, especially if I wish being able to navigate in two 10' maneuverability consécutive tests in a friendship competition with a friend between. I hope you understand my point of view when I talk about boats (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ViFILbv5-IA) of more than 15/20 kilos...
In France we almost never use manual pumps to refill ou boilers. I tried and installed one on my open launch Liva (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOcpmwRUadU) 1 but have never been able to use when she is on the water (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElYtqlvtB-4). Earth is too lo fo me and the baby too unstable {:-{ [size=78%] [/size]
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rhavrane, you would enjoy one of my other launches, the 50 inch one with setup for electric boiler level sensor and automatic simplex water pump....could stay out for as long as the gas burns....
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1,27 m ! She looks actually great, I confirm, I would like it :-))
Which steam machine ? Any video of her interior or during a navigation ?
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She has been on the lake a few times but I never took video. Unfortunately, she has now become a shop dust collector.
Boiler: refurbed and redesigned, engine: Mildura 5001rc. One of the nicest engines. All bronze and stainless, except iron crank. Runs very smoothly at slow speed.
Only have this early video done several years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wWb5GQl-pw
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Thank you for this link, I saw a beautiful steam plant.The Mildura can be a very good and smooth steam machine, it is a copy of the D10 ! Hopefully, you had pumps ;)
Its is not common at all In France, I have not seen yet any one during steam meetings.
Leaving boats on shelves is not my philosophy, all my babies navigate, even less than once a year for the ones I can not manage alone, too big, large, heavy, but they navigate :-)) [size=78%] [/size]
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Thanks rhavrane. This particular Mildura was a complete mess when I bought it. Someone had placed incorrect sized screws into many of the holes, parts missing and assembled incorrectly. Needed a new crank and much care. But it was cheap. Now she runs well.
The factory http://www.miniaturesteammodels.com/assembled (http://www.miniaturesteammodels.com/assembled) is still in business and is quick to ship out parts.
Once in a while , the mildura 5001 comes up for sale at a discount new refurb from factory on ebay (~900$)
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In order to get the volume I wanted for the 3 in diameter boiler, it's height turned out to be a bit too much to look good in the launch. So...either shorten the boiler, build a new launch, cut a hole in the bottom of the launch , build a new boiler, .......or add a bit of freeboard to the launch. This last idea was the answer and the way I did it was by adding 3/4 inch to the deck height. This will then be covered by 1/16 ply and the 1/16 mahogany planks.
The launch has a more robust appearance now, which is the look I want anyway. I also trimmed out the fiberglass interior of cockpit a bit to gain more room. Pics of paper plan for ply deck cover being traced and partly cut. General layout of boiler and machinery....
Also made a change to a 2 inch round bix burner. Works as well as the bigger burner but does not have to have the gas valve all the way down to lowest setting.
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Bonjour,
Having several launches with horizontal boilers, I have to confess that a vertical one gives a real touch of reality. It seems to my opinion that you have made a good choice, my issue with vertical is the stability of the launch. Remember what happened HERE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjvEwi0MSwI) to a launch which is too thin for its boiler I think.
And please a little explanation of this sentence (with pictures ?) because, if I understand the words, I do not the technical meaning :
"Also made a change to a 2 inch round bix burner. Works as well as the bigger burner but does not have to have the gas valve all the way down to lowest setting"
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Regarding the burners: 2.5 inch does not allow for enough air flow along sides and up the fire tube(with chimney design as it is), so the heat backs up and the burner gets so hot it 'backburns' on any setting that is much more than having the valve 'craked' open. So I changed to the 2 inch burner which works fine with the gas valve open a bit more. No backburning. Steams just as quickly. Both burners running on #5 jet. Gas usage is minimal with either burner.
Did some deck work, self explanatory pics. 16 inch depth on the saw.
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Bonjour,
:-))
Another question, Will you use a gas attenuator ("Régulateur (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2tK4TV4wb44)" in French, regulator is perhapsa fake as it is "détendeur') ?
Il feel, am I wrong ? that it is not a common accessory for lot of steam builders.
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No gas regulator, just slow flow setting at gas valve provides plenty of gas for good heat.
Finished the planking in 1/16 mahogany x about 1/4 or so wide. Before staining, wash the deck with a wet rag. don;t soak it, just enough to moisten the planks. Then I mixed the 'caulk.' I wanted an easy way to fill the seems, so here it is ... I tried tightbond brand but it reacted with the flat black model masters acrylic. Then I tried Elmers carpenters glue. Perfect mix. Use about 1/2 - 3/4 oz glue with 1/4 - 1/3 of that in flat black paint, and a few drops of water. mix up real well. then pour on damp deck and squeegee into all grooves. be sure to get into all the spaces! Does not matter how messy you are. The glue does not penetrate into the mahogany very well, but it is thick enough to fill the cracks....
when done, place on some scrap wood so that the deck does not stick to table top or paper.... stay tuned for more...
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About an hour of sanding and then some stain. Natural(color on the paper towel), followed by a bit of red and then brown. If you do not want a heavy stain penetration, and want to keep the wood closer to natural color, use a natural or very light stain first to penetrate the fibers, then follow with darker stain to enhance the grain.
As you can see, the 'caulking' came out just fine. It actually has a very subtle contour irregularity (from drying/water content/shrinkage) which makes it look even better...
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Bonjour,
On my mahogany Liva V deck, I have just used a large quantity of linseed oil :
Before:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-b7huna6bRKk/UVX4nsrF-HI/AAAAAAAAKCU/m8t6FFwN8Ug/s128-Ic42/IMG_1711.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-rqKawh-atSk/UVX4reQ58ZI/AAAAAAAAKCY/bO17j3K3UBM/s128-Ic42/IMG_1716.JPG)
After :
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-TEjie9O2-OM/UYKwd4vyqwI/AAAAAAAAHSM/8N7VuXf5X5I/s512-Ic42/IMG_1783.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-AsS6n2yb7V8/UVX4utuSXDI/AAAAAAAAKCY/8GUftQE6t3M/s128-Ic42/IMG_1719.JPG)
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Looks nice rhavrane. But finish could really jump out with 600-1000 grit paper and a 3-4 coats of tung oil. Gives that wood that deep old style luster.....
I was considering tung vs polyurethane for my final finish....
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Bonjour,
I do agree with you Xrad for the polish, but I do not know "tung oil" and G...le trad does not help me <:(
What is it ?
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Ancient Chinese oil.
http://www.artantiquequebec.com/huile-abrasin.htm (http://www.artantiquequebec.com/huile-abrasin.htm)
You will need at least 4 coats with fine polish in-between.
(http://www.essentialhardware.com/media/catalog/product/cache/2/image/380x/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/7/7/775304.jpg)
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Thank you :-))
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Your welcome. :-))
Metalwork: Steel (good old 'will definitely rust' steel) rudder , silver soldered to stainless shaft, brass side plates silver soldered to steel rudder heel for added strength and better appearance. Prop from
http://www.harbormodels.com/propulsion.html (http://www.harbormodels.com/propulsion.html)
Picked up 10 lbs of lead #7 shot for ballast.
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Bonjour,
In France, we have several possibilities to buy propellers but the best come from Propshop. I have personnaly experienced the impact of the choice of an appropriate propeller coupled to a steam machine and saved about 30% of autonomy by using large propellers example HERE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVl2NCWmyXA)
And my launch Liva 1 (7,5 cm3, 1,20 m, 8 kilos) has a 3,5" four blades propeller :
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-83uI_AJC0fI/TB-Tnb-C-TI/AAAAAAAAKPU/J1kv_sTS86kq2lYnqAcRZPIjfTbJ42giQCCo/s128-Ic42/Helice2_Liva1.jpg)
Just one concern, Propshop stops the steam picth to the 2,75" propellers, so my 4,5" propellers for my D10 have a standard pitch as I have no room for 5" propellers. Perhaps should I have tested a five blades but the price becomes :(( [size=78%] [/size]
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you can adjust propeller pitch, to some degree, by yourself (by eye or with jig). I have done this on several props. Also, when I am unsure of diameter, I buy larger propeller and trim down to what I need. Takes practice and time.
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some fitting out. Epoxied deck to hull. Epoxied prop stuffing tube. Forward and rear ply decks fitted. Once everything dries, I can do a ballast float in the tub....
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I like the result of your caulking method. Very nice.
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Thanks KNO3. Should be no leak!
bent some 18 gauge steel for boiler base. Brazed on a round steel ring for boiler base. x2 drilled/tapped steel retaining ring for 4-40 stainless screws, which pass into small holes in copper boiler base, holding boiler in place. Copper boiler holes are not tapped, and a few thou oversized, as is the steel retaining ring, allowing for expansion.
Made some diamond plate(tread plate, checker plate) steps to hide some of the underlying metalwork. Apparently, some form of tread plate was used around turn of century on ships....will take the shine off with acid later...
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I like this warning, makes me want to clean the dust off my half finished models(was on my other steam launch build)!
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Ok, deck almost done. Honey stain to give that old timey old wood depth. Will varnish or polyurethane...have not decided yet... Lots of steaming in my homemade wood steamer...just use a wall paper steam remover and hook it into a few plastic pipes. Steam time depends on wood type. Just have to cut out the cap rail for the cockpit and make a few brass parts and the basic topside is done......
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I needed four 1 inch cleats for my launch. I looked through many model supply sites, but could not find the size, quality, or design I wanted. So made these four cleats milled from stock brass in about 2 hours. First, mill stock to height(in my case .3 inch), then run 1/4 ball end down both long sides, then trim off four 1 inch long pieces and mill assembly line style. Using same setup for same cut four times on four cleats. First, ball mill the outside of each cleat horn. Change to a 1/8 end mill and bisect the cleat horns, then flip piece 90 degrees and mill out the inside of each horn with same 1/8th mill. Next, flip cleat into 'horns down' position and using a fly cutter, thin the base or spar . Reverse position and center drill for two mounting holes, one at each end. Using a 'soft' abrasive wheel on my bench grinder, the rough mill cuts were smoothed and a small round finishing file used to open up the horns a bit. Lastly, the bolt holes were drilled through. Just a bit of final filing and polishing to do.
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About time!.............these cleats look about 100 years old to the naked eye %)......are the mounting drillings countersunk or counterbored?
Will these be fixed with slotted head brass screws >>:-(...or blind head rivets & bolted up from below? :-))
Now I also understand this is a work in progress ok2.....but that boiler top cap [between the red arrows] could use a few coats of stove top black gloss O0
Derek
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At least someone is paying attention to this build! Yes, slotted brass screws 0-80 size, countersunk....not bolted through. Probably a 'no' on the gloss black...would make my workboat look too good! or....maybe yes...don't really know...
Did decide on dark green gloss hull color...probably with a black or dark red band at rub rails...so maybe the boiler will get gloss black...don;t know yet.... :o
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You could try semi-gloss paint. Gives a nice and forgiving finish.
By the way, good to see this build moving on.
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Thx guys! Mental error: I was calling brass 'chocks' as 'cleats' above...obviously , they are chocks...
Here are two 'bits' (sometimes called 'bitts')....not a cleat, and not a bollard...
Wood for the bits is wild cherry cut from an old dead tree in my yard. I always like to incorporate something from my yard into my wood model builds...don't know why... The deck will be cut, and these passed into deck once location is determined. The post was trimmed/squared to size. The brass cross rod was machined with the rod ends the same diameter as the middle section so that the rod passes through the post without issue.
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Looking good.
Same basic approach could make some good cleats. Much nicer than my hand filed wooden ones.
Landlocked.
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In America, chocks, over here, fairleads. Simples.
Jerry.
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Thx guys! Some more building. Sheet mahogany over plywood with basswood edge for seats. Floor will receive wood grating. Waiting on some copper for water reservoir and condenser. Rudder servo under steering gear box, and engine servo to go under one of the seats....
Mounted the cleats and bits....
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did it again.... mounted the 'chocks!' and bits....must be a mental block for me
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Deck grating installed.....
Assembly line fashion: Pre-stain the grid pieces(3mm spaces), then four corners glued, then lay one side grid, then the other side, then glue one side and apply to ply decking... ~5-6 hours install time..
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That +++++ box style wooden grating is very prototypical xrad :-))......I remember 60+ years ago thinking my feet would fall in between the planks ......
[the open launch had a one Lunger petrol + belt strap over the flywheel to start]
1. What color will you stain the lower hull?.....bilge water green? or a similar tone to the grating itself?
2. What Brand & reference scale are the grating kits....I have a need for a similar quantity in the future 8)
Derek
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Hey DD! Bottom to be dark green....British racing green (or close to it).
Gratings:
http://modelexpo-online.com/Wooden-Ship-Modeling
MS2876 Gratings, 60mm square, 3mm holes
Fast shipping in USA, excellent products.....
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Condenser: 2.5" copper pipe with brass and bronze fittings. Had to make this condenser twice as while brazing the 2nd end cap the first time through, it slid down into pipe and silver-soldered itself in the wrong place. Second time through, I remade the wood end-cap mold a bit tighter, and really annealed/hammered the end cap copper so that the fit was very snug/smooth into the pipe with almost no air gaps.....
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it looks great.
With the PM engine do the cylinders have cover or is that the outside of the cylinder.
Gerald.
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Thanks! corrugated cover held in place by end caps...
(http://www.modelmachinist.com/images/PM-8M_dtl_med.jpg)
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Is there room to add thin wood cladding to the outside of the cylinder covers?
I think that would look good and also improve the efficiency slightly.
Gerald.
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Hi Gerald. I guess you could add wood. would take a bit of effort as you can't strap the cladding to the cylinders or metal cladding as straps can only go 3/4 way round the cylinders (valve design). Or, you would have to machine a new set of cylinder end covers with wood grooves. Cylinder heat loss is probably the last on the list for improving efficiency. First would be leaky throttle/reverse valve. Second, piston seal friction losses. You could stuff a bit of heat proof exhaust wrap, packing the fibers into the space between the cylinders and the provided metal cladding...
but it definitely would look cool to have wood cladding on this engine....
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I have been looking at my PM8 engine and thinking it would look good with some different parts highlighted in colour. I have not yet decided which parts and what colour .
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Like this?
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Like this?
Yay that looks good, like it
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yeah, that look nice. I like the red. I was considering painting a bit of the stack and the engine, but can't decide on color...grey, green, red.... I will wait until hull is painted and decide. Engine is easy to remove, and so is stack, to paint down the road if wanted.
Finished the condenser and wood mount, and ran exhaust pipe into stack. Hopefully, it is tall enough that most liquid not condensed in can runs back down into can, and not too much down into boiler. The exhaust pipe extends a few inches up inside the stack.
PS: 'Baldric' = Tony Robinson? :-)) I'm a Black Adder fan, especially the early episodes.....and Hugh Laurie in BA and Jeeves and Wooster.. Great and funny actors...
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Some paint applied. Not so happy with the Rustoleum green gloss. You have to be very careful when applying so as not to create drips. Seems to be an exponential application curve...all looks fine with several light coats, then all of a sudden, it pools and runs. I suspect the solvent releases the underlying paint even though instruction say you can apply several light coats within first hour. Had to redo a few areas. Also, even with a good sanding of hull, primer, and alcohol wipe, several pinhole areas developed likely due to retained mould release agent in the fiberglass. these were all fixed. I also added five coats of 2X rustoleum gloss which went on great. It did not affect the green and coated very well. Have to do a bit of touch up along the lower rub rail as some paint came off with the tape. Spent some time chasing dust hairs in the paint as I was painting in the garage. Everything shows up on dark surface.
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starting to all come together....the complex deck curves really show nicely. main steam line to engine, gas line and one servo/radio battery install to go.....and almost forgot, have to make the wheel...and finish cockpit caprail...
hard to show the true hull color...will have to get some outside pics when done.
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Almost there....
first vid:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxQ63EWNP0U&feature=youtu.be
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That looks great , lovely looking launch. At very much a guess an all up weight of 6Kg and with that PM 8 engine it will scare the hell out of the ducks on the pond if you let it rip.
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Thx Baldrick!
Had to replace the plastic universal joint due to binding. Made my own universal. Standard dog bone joint made from bronze rod and hardened steel pin /ball (removed from kyosho RC car axle). Easy to make. 3/8th bore on both ends and oversized pocket for pin ball. Pin ball is pressed onto shaft and lightly peened in place. It's tight enough and not going to come loose. If it does, I will silver solder it. Grooves for pin slightly oversized. This allows about 1mm or so of play so that the prop shaft and motor output shaft don't have to be perfectly aligned axially. 3mm grub screws. Plus, now the propshaft does not put any axial pressure on the motor driveshaft .
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Nice. What exactly was the problem with the universal joint?
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the motor drive shaft and the prop shaft did not line up exactly as the motor mount settled a bit during glue-in (so that the 'projected' shafts did not meet exactly in the middle of the universal joint no matter how the universal was positioned) . I tried re-positioning the motor, but that did not work. Motor shaft and prop shaft are true. Additionally, I had to bore the universal brass ends to 3/8th. the plastic squirmed a bit in the lathe so the holes were off just a tad. The combination of these two issues caused binding and prop shaft wobble. The new dog-bone has enough play that shaft alignment is not an issue and prop shaft and motor shaft run smoothly.
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Cap rail cut, steam bent, and stained. This cap sits on top of mahogany laminated ply frame w/one layer on inside of cockpit, and two layers on outside(image post 79). Will get PU coat tomorrow. Cap rail has a splash lip that overhangs outside cockpit combing just a bit. Gives the rail a nice shadow and makes for a more substantial appearance. Dust all over deck. Nearly feels like a full size launch!
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Yes that shadow does give a nice illusion %) of the repeated deck level cap-lip ...I had to go back to image .1461 to confirm that it wasn't there before.........
Yes as you say 'dust on the deck'......this just shows that the camera has better eyes than we have O0
Derek
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Hello!
Very nice boat to look at! :-))
Cheers.
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I have used these http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5mm-to-8mm-CNC-Motor-Shaft-Flexible-Coupling-Coupler-for-3D-Printer-5mmx8mm for years and never had a problem ( and please Derek no academic comments regarding torque strength and durability after all these are models.
Cheers
John
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Well dam you guys over there make some good 'Dogs & Bones'..I reckon this set in your steam drive line could handle a few thousand scale kW and a few degrees of offset or misalignment {-)
So sitting here in the middle of South Australia this morning...not much more to do than read Text Books...but we needn't bother southsteyene2 with anything from the datasheets..... %) ...afterall, these are only models
Derek
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Kyosho 'swing' shaft. hexagonal rod with slip on pin balls at each end. 5$ at hobby store. I pulled off pin ball and pressed on to bronze universal. Looks better than the plastic universal!
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final coat of cockpit semi-gloss poly U. Waiting on a few RB07540 handrail shorty stanchions from Cornwall. At ~.50$ each, cheaper to buy than to make.... Another few coats of gloss poly on the deck and throttle servo install and ready for the lake..
and have to name her.....
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A bit more progress. Came up with a name. Had some .5" x 2" brass plates engraved at
http://www.engravecon.com (http://www.engravecon.com)
Very fast shipper. Picked the thicker 'softer' brass plate and 'Victoria' script. Order all at same time if you want them to all look the same. I ordered 2 for bow, but decided later to add the stern plate which was just a bit different in size. No one would notice unless you are picky. Plates come with adhesive back, which is great for centering first, then drill/set mounting screws. I had to drill the screw holes in the plates. Drill plates first before mounting.
Next was the grab rails and stanchions. I used .1" diameter bronze welding rods. I think they cost about $ each or so. It's the length that is hard to get from standard model suppliers at reasonable price. So this is a great option. Brass stanchions from Cornwall Model Boats RB07540. I like Cornwall site very much because they take the time to describe the fittings better than others. I needed a certain height off the wood rail and theses were perfect. 2.5mm hole diameter fits .1" rod just right. Remember, if you put a stanchion every 5" for 25", you need 6 stanchions.
Installing stanchions: Mark holes, drill holes, drop of CA in holes, insert and twist in the stanchion. Keep turning until stanchion base flush to deck. I used a short length of rod as a tool to insert stanchion and as a guide to tell how well hole lines up with wood rail. Curve the rod and slide it in before final trimming and rounding of ends. Sometimes as form or function, the rods pass through the end stanchions, and sometimes, the rods are fit into a part drilled end stanchion leaving a 'ball' end. I chose to pass the rod through the end stanchions. Like the look better. To keep rods from wandering, a drop of CA was added to only one stanchion hole on each side. Easy enough to break free if needed.
Also brazed up an flag pole mount. Waiting on a 5" 48 star cotton flag, antique off ebay. Have to be period correct!
All fun to do, and the look is just right. Stanchions offset the bronze rod enough for me to tie on Lipton tea stained bumpers, which was the whole point.
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Flag pole: received my 48 star vintage US flag yesterday. Spent a few hours making the pole. On the lathe, SLOWLY removed excess from some very dense hardwood I had left over from floor sample. It began as a 3/8th or so square stick. First pic is of the end hole for live center. Never cracked! You can see the very tight dark grain. Fine sanded and one coat of gloss poly applied. Today, machined ball end and made some attachments for rope. It came out just right in size and vintage look for Marcava.
One nice thing about doing the pole on the lathe is that the flex in the pole was greater at the live center end which gave the pole a nice taper.
just a few more things to finish......
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Looks great, where did you get it from, I would like to find an old Canadian Red ensign.
Regards,
Gerald..
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Thx Gerald. Ebay...search vintage, old, flag, stick flag, antique, small, etc...
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Servo box and mount: Machined from aluminum with bottom, side, and top 3-48 mounting holes. Mini servo.
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Finished wheel. Brass and bronze silver soldered and mounted to a post. 72 degrees drilled holes on rear face and for spokes. Rear face holes for silver solder. Wheel turns, but non functional. Hemp wrapped handles.
I am using a Spektrum 6 radio because it has several throttle set-ups , including 'no' spring return and easy adjustable ratchet or friction position hold...and a whole bunch of extra channels. And it has a really easy to use timer...flick one of the levers to start timer countdown to buzzer. Good for me as I can run for 20 min max before having to bring her in for boiler and gas fill( this is the dependent way of running, more risk, more fun for me) Also made a universal joint cover.
See vid:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWXKqWnk1NE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWXKqWnk1NE)
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That smart looking Chap %) at the helm has a little of an Australian look with his hat brim split etc......
What scale is he?,.... was he pre dressed with his linen jacket & blue denims?,..... & what was the source?
Wheels like this usually have a significant King Pin..... being the wheel position/setting for straight ahead O0
Derek
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The chap is the only 10" figure I could find dressed for the part. Perfect fit. This skipper knows when his boat is running true. Maybe I will tie a white wrap on the dead center spoke to help him out a bit between slugs of rum!
PS: I think he is modeled after an Australian! :}
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That is suppose to be Jed Clampett from the show "Beverly Hillbillies'. Did you check to see what its value was before you opened the package?
Gerald.
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Less than what I paid....which was 7$ on ebay :-)) and his #$# hat is glued to his head! On the plus side, he came with a rifle, just in case there is a duck in the way....
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Ok, will have to look could use the whole Clan, Especially Eely May. Always like a crew on models.
Gerald.
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The deck looked too new for the boiler/engine. So....scraped and sanded and re-stained with more natural base and honey (and less red) for grain contrast....few more coats of poly to go.
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semi-gloss.... Almost done...and ready for the pond
2 thin coats 50/50 semi gloss and mineral spirits followed by 600 grit, one coat undiluted semi gloss, no sanding.
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Looking very nice
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Thanks!
First run on lake. A bit breezy.
Short vid:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hf_oXZ_BPYU (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hf_oXZ_BPYU)