Model Boat Mayhem

The Shipyard ( Dry Dock ): Builds & Questions => Working Vessels => Topic started by: Baldrick on January 02, 2018, 05:06:13 pm

Title: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on January 02, 2018, 05:06:13 pm: As there is no sign of my next intended build kit on the horizon yet I am lining up for a build of the steam tug Cervia. I am going this time for a GRP as being confined to the house in the winter I cannot make sawdust in large quantities . So, I have lined up the hull shell together with a copy of the Vic Smeed plans and am thinking about the plan of campaign.
First the rudder frame, have determined the shape this needs to be and as some areas are a bit slim plywood does not seem man enough, perhaps a brass /ply /brass sandwich or else mill it out of aluminium. Need to think along this !

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/02/20180102_155254.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/874fQ)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on February 21, 2018, 07:50:35 pm: Started at last , making rudder frame out of 6mm brass bar.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/21/20180221_175423.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/ByADX)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on February 21, 2018, 08:20:45 pm: Very nice 👍👍
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ballastanksian on February 21, 2018, 10:52:09 pm: It is nice to see a bit of model engineering :-))
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: BrianB6 on February 22, 2018, 05:12:47 am: A lot better than my effort :embarrassed:
Just a brass bar epoxied to my home made fibreglass hull
I did have a scale rudder but found a partly balanced one gave more control at slow speeds.
Even after 40 years I have not got round to finish painting it.
Not quite in it's bottom housing.

( someone should change the American spell checker to English. It is not fiberglass! )
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on February 22, 2018, 01:19:02 pm: Thanks for the replies Guys, I wonder how this rudder is going to perform in practice ? I assume that the cranked rudder shaft gives a purchase on the rudder resistance that a straight shaft would not. Makes it a right B***** to model though.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/22/Image-22-02-2018-at-12.39.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/Byg3V)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: missyd on February 22, 2018, 03:11:11 pm: Wonderful work with brass!!!! :-))
I hope it will work as well as the partly balanced one ....
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on February 25, 2018, 01:28:41 pm: One thing I forgot to allow for was the Durante length of the propeller nose . I am going to attack this with the Dremel and slice off a few mm, it looks stupid as is. Or perhaps take the cone off and just put a nut on

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/25/Image-25-02-2018-at-13.13.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/B3MLX)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: derekwarner on February 25, 2018, 09:29:58 pm: A technical superb outcome Balderick :-))..............is the shaft M3?.....if so I could post a brass acorn nut over ok2 ........Derek
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on February 25, 2018, 10:05:17 pm: Quote from: derekwarner_decoy on February 25, 2018, 09:29:58 pm
A technical superb outcome Balderick :-)) ..............is the shaft M3?.....if so I could post a brass acorn nut over ok2 ........Derek

No it's M4, but thank you for your generous offer , also your comments.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on February 26, 2018, 03:44:26 pm: Cervia,s prop nut. She didn’t have a domed nut so you can cut it off and be correct.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/26/8ECA8746-FAD5-4910-8BF6-21D84A8C72A4.jpg)r
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on February 26, 2018, 07:32:01 pm: Quote from: tugmad on February 26, 2018, 03:44:26 pm
Cervia,s prop nut. She didn’t have a domed nut so you can cut it off and be correct.

That's good news thanks,

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/26/8ECA8746-FAD5-4910-8BF6-21D84A8C72A4.jpg)r
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on February 26, 2018, 09:18:48 pm: That picture was taken the last time that the old girl was slipped , over 30 years ago.she is moored in the inner harbour at Ramsgate where the picture was taken.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on March 13, 2018, 04:57:54 pm: OK oversize acorn duly modified, rudder completed, time to start dressing the hull ready for a primer undercoat

.
(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/13/20180313_160456_002.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BIrIo)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on April 13, 2018, 07:47:13 pm: Seem to have forgotten to post on this for a while, have rubbed down the hull, installed the framework and cut the deck out ready to glue down. Did not realise till this point just how banana shaped the tug hull is , have to resort to some serious clamping to get the ply to take the correct shape

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/13/20180413_164918.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BXm9h)

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/13/20180413_164928.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BXFEB)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ballastanksian on May 07, 2018, 08:24:57 pm: She's looking good Baldrick! I like your build board. Are the stations a scale standard or convenient for your projects in particular?
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on June 03, 2018, 03:01:05 pm: Quote from: ballastanksian on May 07, 2018, 08:24:57 pm
She's looking good Baldrick! I like your build board. Are the stations a scale standard or convenient for your projects in particular?

Sorry late reply. The board is for another project which is very much on the back burner at present.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on June 03, 2018, 03:06:52 pm: Started work on Cervia again, making the anchor winch . Just forked out 5p for the cog wheel. Hope Madj' is not miffed by the hole, or the metal blacking dip coming up shortly.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/20180603_144519_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BSOfM)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: derekwarner on June 03, 2018, 03:42:41 pm: Baldrick.....I won't tell of you indiscretion......if you keep mine under your hat %)

I needed to drill & tap M2 tapping's in my de-oiler top so needed a ''doubler plate" disk ......

1. say 20mm diameter x 2 mm thick
2. brass/bronze rust free
3. so easy to soft solder
2. easy to drill & tap with M2 tapping's & to drill with a 1/4" bore

Hey presto.....it cost me $2.00 from my pocket change......you can just still see the vertical serration lines on the coins OD.....great value :-X
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on June 10, 2018, 07:00:24 pm: Not having had the heavies round from HM Mafia to duff me over I have been progressing the hull to the point where I can start on the fiddly stuff.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/10/20180610_183202.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BT89w)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: TugCowboy on June 10, 2018, 08:53:52 pm: Looking excellent, is the rudder serviceable? I get paranoid closing things in since I had a failure a few years ago and it required an all new deck after. Although looking at your brass work I doubt that is going to be an issue
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on June 10, 2018, 09:47:15 pm: yes I have given the rudder a few heavy knocks accidentally while handling the hull , sufficient to turn the servo 90deg and nothing has deranged . In fact the offset rudder pivot arrangement is very sturdy , probably due to the fact that you have four fulcrum points. Not sure how styrene would stand up though if as clumsy as me.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on June 15, 2018, 11:20:29 am: Scratchbuilt windlass, probably needs a few micro dollops of thick black grease because the original was never all black and shiny Had to dig the old Unimat 3 out of the shed and dust off the rust dirt and cobwebs. Must give it a good once over as I will be needing it for a few more bits soon. Great little tools, unstoppable providing you do not cook the small size motor.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/15/20180615_094044_001.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/Bj02V)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Footski on June 15, 2018, 12:14:38 pm: A beautiful job and a great looking model.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on July 06, 2018, 09:38:45 pm: (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/06/20180706_155335_001_resized_1.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/B5wFB)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on July 12, 2018, 05:06:42 pm: (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/12/20180712_165845_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/Bdq6u)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Tafelspitz on July 12, 2018, 08:42:03 pm: Very tidy work :o :-))
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on July 22, 2018, 04:20:59 pm: (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/22/20180722_160356_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BqQzS)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on July 28, 2018, 05:30:18 pm: Decided to make the upper works of Styrene in the hope it would better replicate steel plating.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/28/20180728_165602_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BVihV)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on July 30, 2018, 09:07:42 pm: (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/30/20180730_191406_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BVlDm)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ballastanksian on July 31, 2018, 08:31:54 pm: The styrene superstructure looks realistic as steel Baldrick A bit of Humbrol paint mixed with a little talc stippled here and there to suggest painted over rust would add a little weathering should you want to, but as it is, it looks crisp and tidy with less of the effort required to make wood smooth with fillers etc etc.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on July 31, 2018, 09:06:45 pm: Hi ballstanksian , thanks. I would like to introduce a bit of weathering, think I will try on a few trial strips to see how I manage. I have been thinking about the colours scheme. Current photographs of Cervia show her topsides in a farmyard brown livery which I am not sold on. I have found one photograph her her during her working life in a red (orangey) brown which I have obtained a can of spray pant to a similar colour. It may be that the colour render of the old colour print is not true to the original hue but it is without doubt more colourful.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/31/cervia-gallery-5.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BV46K)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on August 01, 2018, 05:08:46 pm: Cervia had a casing colour of Dark teak gloss, all of her working life, the funnel red is best replicated using Humbrol No 100 Matt red and then gloss varnishing it, as I have not yet found a colour to match at all as we used to mix it using red lead powder and linseed oil. Her decks where they were steel was red oxide gloss and the boot topping at the bow was Emerald green, and the windlass side plates were also green as was the capstan casing over the steam engine and gears.
(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/08/01/004A8E63-7747-486A-A7D5-14FC48147127.jpg)
(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/08/01/31A52B7C-14E5-4A38-B1DD-961B94D57528.jpg)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on August 01, 2018, 08:48:21 pm: NOW . That's what you get from a decent forum, grade A feedback Thanks tugmad
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on August 01, 2018, 08:53:19 pm: :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) 7
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on August 10, 2018, 03:39:41 pm: Cost of model shipbuilding scratch built cross bollard Materials 50p,Labour (7 hours @ £10 hour) £ 70. Total= £70.50p. OR:-
50p for 7 hours of enjoyment ? PS still need 4 more

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/08/10/20180809_185950_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BkEQQ)

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/08/10/20180810_112817_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/BkbNu)

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/08/10/20180810_140955_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/Bkpv1)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on August 21, 2018, 12:29:46 pm: And the cable winch.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/08/21/20180821_115248_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/J2uPQ)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: derekwarner on August 21, 2018, 12:41:43 pm: 'Labour (7 hours @ £10 hour')...you are selling yourself short Baldrick. 8) ....

What is the size of the 6x bolt heads in the Bollard mounting plate?............ Derek
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on August 21, 2018, 01:31:12 pm: Quote from: derekwarner_decoy on August 21, 2018, 12:41:43 pm

What is the size of the 6x bolt heads in the Bollard mounting plate?............ Derek

1.25mm across flats , representing 1.25" full size.
PS , I come quite cheap.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on August 29, 2018, 04:28:17 pm: A totally carp Bank Holliday weatherwise does aid progress on fiddly bits.

.(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/08/29/20180829_144154_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/J8jTM)

.(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/08/29/20180829_160318_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/J8lDD)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on September 05, 2018, 09:50:52 pm: (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/09/05/20180905_214458_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/J8V9m)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on September 23, 2018, 05:39:40 pm: hinges look a tad chunky, wonder if I need to file them down a bit.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/09/23/20180923_172837_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JZHUG)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on October 06, 2018, 02:06:39 pm: Twas the bendy curvature of the front of the deckhouse that took most time . Perhaps I can pick up a bit of speed on the rest (at least till I get to the smoke stack )

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/06/20181006_123000_resized_1.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JayCn)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on October 15, 2018, 08:22:30 pm: (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/15/20181015_200301_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JNLYp)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on October 20, 2018, 08:05:58 pm: Goose neck vents for the fuel tanks, how to scratch them ? thought I would try this way ; First a piece of 4mm copper tube and make two 9/10 cuts 1/2mm apart and bend to give the neck shape.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/20/20181019_153340_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JNWeh)

Then mould some Super Sculpey to rough shape over the end and give it 15 min at 130C in the oven.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/20/20181019_153932_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JNhkB)

.File and emery paper it to shape, the Sculpy is quite easy to work.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/20/20181019_165003_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JNGze)

finished and painted , at present just pushed into a drilled hole in the tank top . Look reasonable to scale, from photographs the Cervia vents I would assist be about 6-8" dia.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/20/20181020_163343_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JNOwX)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on October 27, 2018, 04:00:24 pm: Jumping around a bit I started to look at the lifeboat davits. Not a lot of info on the plans except they are Welin Mclaughlin and not much on the web, have done a hand drawn sketch from photo's on the Cervia site to give me some templates to work to. I intend to make them from styrene with a bit of discreet reinforcement to stop the arms twisting. The drawing is showing the tops of the arms a bit too thin, I will need to beef this up when building.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/27/20181027_145847_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JNweQ)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ooyah/2 on October 27, 2018, 09:33:12 pm: Quote from: Baldrick on October 27, 2018, 04:00:24 pm

Jumping around a bit I started to look at the lifeboat davits. Not a lot of info on the plans except they are Welin Mclaughlin and not much on the web, have done a hand drawn sketch from photo's on the Cervia site to give me some templates to work to. I intend to make them from styrene with a bit of discreet reinforcement to stop the arms twisting. The drawing is showing the tops of the arms a bit too thin, I will need to beef this up when building.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/27/20181027_145847_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JNweQ)

Baldric,

About 40 years ago I started S.T.Cervia from Vic Smeads Drawing at 1/4" -ft as a free plan, I progressed as far as getting the bulkheads and frames made and decided that it was too small so redrew it to 3/8" -ft which turned out the best idea as it is now powered by a Scotch boiler and a Stuart D10.

Like you I found it difficult to get any info on the Davit but was fortunate enough to have a cousin who was the oiler on the Waverley ( John Lees )and when she was laid up in Glasgow for the winter I was able to take some sketches of the Welin Mclaughlan davit fitted
to her.
I have had a search for my sketches but after 2- house moves , no luck but here are 2- pics of the davit that I made using plastic card and they are still strongly fixed after all the years , possibly need re painting.
I hope that they are of some help to you.

George.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on October 28, 2018, 07:51:08 am: Cervia’s davits. (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/28/5C43255F-10F6-418D-A6E1-A9FA27520177.jpg)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on October 28, 2018, 06:27:06 pm: Thanks both for your valuable input , I can see I have to amend my drawing , especially in the area of the stool for the restraining arm. In this respect I assume the rod or arm is telescopic so that it can extend to allow the davit to swing forward to the lifeboat deployment position. I have been looking at this drawing and note the crank handle which would seem to be for releasing the adjacent locking bolt allowing gravity to take over.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/28/0cab01e0.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JNmwR)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on October 28, 2018, 06:35:29 pm: (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/10/28/20181028_163449_resized_1.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JNFrG)

Version 2
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 01, 2018, 01:40:45 pm: (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/01/20181101_131013_resized_1.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JP2j4)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 03, 2018, 07:14:34 pm: OK' so lets play spot the missing rivet

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/03/20181103_162101_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JPaDX)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 05, 2018, 09:09:30 pm: Had a request from the yard for a supply of the smaller cross bollards for the mooring ropes . Thought it would be easier to make them out of boxwood rather than brass like the original bigger one. Prototype seems OK , just need 5 more

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/05/20181105_190600_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/Jy81l)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 09, 2018, 05:15:50 pm: Onwards and Upwards.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/09/20181109_162252_resized.jpg) (http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/Jy3Q9)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Brian60 on November 09, 2018, 06:21:53 pm: The cross bitts can be had from Cornwall Model Boats, made in plastic and in various sizes, cheap as well.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 10, 2018, 12:45:42 pm: Quote from: Brian60 on November 09, 2018, 06:21:53 pm
The cross bitts can be had from Cornwall Model Boats, made in plastic and in various sizes, cheap as well.

OK for cross bits but if anyone knows a retailer who does a fire monitor of the type fitted to Cervia I would like to know, otherwise it's back to scratch building .
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 13, 2018, 07:26:03 pm: OK scratch building it was, not exactly correct in every respect but acceptable if you do not look too hard. And yes I need to buy a tin of red paint next time I am near a model shop.

Hang on where the heck has the green attachment icon gone ?

have i found a workaround

https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/13/20181113_172858_resized.jpg) (https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JMt6u)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 14, 2018, 04:52:55 pm: Need to rub a bit of the red paint off the snozzle

(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/14/20181114_163807_resized.jpg) (https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JMN5R)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 16, 2018, 05:52:37 pm: Make a start on the towing hooks , thought for quite a while what to make these of , ended up with styrene and brass.

(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/16/20181116_173521_resized.jpg) (https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JKWjP)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 18, 2018, 03:08:49 pm: (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/18/20181118_144702_resized.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JKpDm)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on November 18, 2018, 08:18:17 pm: (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/18/20181118_200307_resized.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JKd0o)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on November 18, 2018, 08:19:26 pm: Very nice Baldrick 👍👍👍
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 01, 2018, 09:36:52 pm: Thanks tugmad.
coming back cold and looking at the photo I suppose the fill covers on the oil tanks would have had a turnbuckle or latch to hold ihem tight
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Neil on December 02, 2018, 12:02:51 am: that tow hook in styrene looks the dogs doo dahs.

I don't know why, when scratch building, people shy away from the stuff...….a great medium open to many uses. :-))
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 02, 2018, 09:08:34 am: Thanks Neil.
Have to agree that Styrene is nice stuff to work with . Previously always been a wood guy but since using styrene find it so clean and precise that it allows you to incorporate greater detail. You can bend it , cut it , etch it for doorways etc glue it taking care not to get the solvent fumes too much. Paint takes to it like a dream. you can carve it and imitate wood by rough sanding and woodstain. Only thing it won't do is go through the mini bench saw.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 13, 2018, 04:40:04 pm: Stonking great big chufferoony. I thought first of all that I had got my dimensions wrong, particularly as she is ( was ) an oil burner but that is the correct size . It appears that she was built so that at anytime she could be converted to coal burning which doubtless accounts for the size of the stack.

(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/13/20181213_162300_resized.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JW0Zw)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on December 13, 2018, 07:04:35 pm: Hi Baldrick, that odd shaped plate on top of the funnel is only a cover plate ,put on to stop rain getting down there .put on by thr chaps that are restoring her.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: JimG on December 13, 2018, 07:30:31 pm: Havn't you got it backwards? Funnels normally tilt to the rear not the front. :o
Jim
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 13, 2018, 07:49:38 pm: Quote from: JimG on December 13, 2018, 07:30:31 pm
Havn't you got it backwards? Funnels normally tilt to the rear not the front. :o
Jim

Sorry, my sense of humour , wondered if anyone would twig it. should have known.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 13, 2018, 08:08:10 pm: Quote from: tugmad on December 13, 2018, 07:04:35 pm
Hi Baldrick, that odd shaped plate on top of the funnel is only a cover plate ,put on to stop rain getting down there .put on by thr chaps that are restoring her.

Hi tugmad.

Confess to having got into a dilemma here. The drawings (can't bring name of draughtsman to mind {:-{ ) show a profile plate or shroud to the top of the stack. It shows on the plan projecting forwards of the front edge of the stack , the inner line is the line of the inside of the flue when projected upwards. This however does not show up on the elevation. What I took to be this on photo's must be the cover plate you mention . If it is not correct I will zip it off before painting . cheers

(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/13/20181213_193830_resized.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JWCFp)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on December 13, 2018, 08:45:14 pm: A couple of pictures of Cervia,s funnel one with Watkins colours which were from the bottom 1/2 funnel height black with the top half split 50/50 red and black.
The other in ship towage colours with the added blue band and thecElliot flag attached in the red section.
The separating bands around the funnel were only 3” half round bar with no vertical strips on the outside at all,
The funnel size on the drawing is the complete outer shape shown as the funnel top it is quite a large oval.
(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/13/F06CBB09-512B-4087-B1EE-AE8CD8010E80.jpg)

(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/13/3CE28BFC-9DE2-42EF-8A12-1FFF78E09A5E.jpg)
(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/13/8EB3ED47-1847-4164-874C-FF6636D32296.jpg)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: derekwarner on December 13, 2018, 10:31:50 pm: Baldrick.....I have a slightly different take on your Plan set

The oval shape superimposed AFT of the engine roof level oval simply represents the shear or angle of the chimney toward the AFT end of the vessel. The blackened area is simply the only overlapping profile between the two and is of no consequence in any build

The yellow lined oval is the actual inter funnel casing, the green lined oval is the outer shell casing of the funnel. The is an air space between the two was also used for modest heat exchangers or water heaters

If weight was not an issue, an internal oval formed pasti-card representation [sprayed flat black on both sides] would be scale like

You mention that Cervia was oil fired, but was capable of a relatively simple modification to be coal fired. So the designers included a coal fired chimney

Naturally a hand fed coal fired boiler required a larger volume of air draw & hence the larger surfaced area [and taller] chimneys over a pressurized oil fired boilers etc

Derek
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: BrianB6 on December 13, 2018, 11:59:36 pm: Quote from: Baldrick on December 13, 2018, 08:08:10 pm

Confess to having got into a dilemma here. The drawings (can't bring name of draughtsman to mind {:-{ )
Vic Smeed :-))
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Capt Podge on December 14, 2018, 12:17:25 am: Hello, I've only just stumbled across this thread, looks like a very interesting build - I'll have to have a good read through :o

Regards
Ray
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 14, 2018, 02:37:54 pm: Quote from: BrianB6 on December 13, 2018, 11:59:36 pm
Vic Smeed :-))

+ O0 Thanks --VIC SMEED.. It's a b****r when old age knocks the memory out.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 14, 2018, 02:49:49 pm: Quote from: derekwarner_decoy on December 13, 2018, 10:31:50 pm
Baldrick.....I have a slightly different take on your Plan set

The oval shape superimposed AFT of the engine roof level oval simply represents the shear or angle of the chimney toward the AFT end of the vessel. The blackened area is simply the only overlapping profile between the two and is of no consequence in any build

The yellow lined oval is the actual inter funnel casing, the green lined oval is the outer shell casing of the funnel. The is an air space between the two was also used for modest heat exchangers or water heaters

If weight was not an issue, an internal oval formed pasti-card representation [sprayed flat black on both sides] would be scale like

You mention that Cervia was oil fired, but was capable of a relatively simple modification to be coal fired. So the designers included a coal fired chimney

Naturally a hand fed coal fired boiler required a larger volume of air draw & hence the larger surfaced area [and taller] chimneys over a pressurized oil fired boilers etc

Derek

Yes , thanks Derek I have it in my mind clear now. Sad Thing, in my heyday I used to be a design draughtsman.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ooyah/2 on December 15, 2018, 12:01:18 pm: Hi Baldrick,
Like you I was a design draughtsman in my earlier years, about 50 years ago I made "CREVIA" from Vic Smeads free plan and progressed as far as making the frames but at 28" I decided to redraw the plan to 3/8" to ! ft to give a 42" O/All length and power the model by 2- Motor cycle 6 V batteries with a blower mother from a Bus..
The model was about 60 % made before being mothballed for 30 years before resurrecting it and installing a D10 engine with a Marine Scotch return flue boiler, I would think it's about 80% completed with still some detail to finish but unfortunately I don't have the space to complete it nor do I have the inclination to do so, so it will be left as is, it still performs well.

I like you wondered at the beginning what the lip at the funnel top was for but soon realised when installing the steam plant it was ideal for making an air space around the funnel. The funnel was made with 1/32" ply and I made a liner out of printers Litho plate which has served the purpose well, so I guess that I arrived at the reason for the lip by accident.

Do you by any chance know if she was launched as a coal burner or an oil burner, when I built the superstructure I made the hatches as coaling hatches, which may be wrong ?

Keep up the good work of your build, I wish that I had the skill to work with wood but prefer to butcher metal. Here are a couple of pics of the funnel and liner.

George.

P.S. Did you know that CERVIA is in trouble at present (https://theisleofthanetnews.com/2018/11/27/ramsgate-rnli-at-work-to-keep-steam-tug-cervia-afloat-as-she-takes-on-water/ )
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on December 15, 2018, 12:09:46 pm: She was built as an oil burner, but had the timber coaling hatches fitted over the bunker tops to cover the access holes and fillers.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 15, 2018, 02:45:26 pm: Hi George thank you for your interesting reply , the bunkering as tugmad says. However the Vic Smeed drg does not show the hatch covers but indicates the tank tops and manholes , but it does show the ledges for the covers (wondered what they were ) perhaps the covers were not in place when VS saw it. I have built it without the covers , {:-{ .
Looking at your plan view photo, the shape at the flue top is obvious , what threw me was the tapering ellipse on the drawing which is not visually correct but a graphic interpretation that the surface plane of the top is not flat but inclined , albeit only 6 deg.
Shame about Cervia's bottom problem , just hope she is not going to become a static dry display. We have a separate thread running on this .

Cheers
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 26, 2018, 05:00:56 pm: Being Xmas and done the family visiting bit I thought time to get back to modelling . So its make a ladder to get up the funnel time . After the prerequisite think about it phase, decided on brass wire and soldering. Had the Dremel gas torch/ soldering tool for a while now but not used it much , found it a bit of an animal but now just about getting the hang of it and liking it . Igniting it was my problem , operating the small latch, pressing the fire up to the piezo and then getting the valve to sustain flame is a bit of a caper and it is the lack of decent instructions, just having diagrams which do not fully explain the operation did not help. However now I have it sorted I can recommend it.

(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/26/20181226_162404_resized.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JGUWB)[/si
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 27, 2018, 05:21:54 pm: (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/27/fullsizeoutput_c1.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JGhYT)

Images also show a rather ugly vent pipe running up fixed to the funnel but don't think I want to include that.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on December 28, 2018, 08:00:36 am: Hi Baldrick, that vent pipe was actually very important as it is the boiler safety valve steam release pipe, when the boiler pressure reached its working pressure, the safety valves 2 of them would lift and release excess steam into the athmosphere via that pipe, and boy it could make you jump when it happened.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ooyah/2 on December 28, 2018, 08:44:48 pm: Quote from: tugmad on December 28, 2018, 08:00:36 am
Hi Baldrick, that vent pipe was actually very important as it is the boiler safety valve steam release pipe, when the boiler pressure reached its working pressure, the safety valves 2 of them would lift and release excess steam into the athmosphere via that pipe, and boy it could make you jump when it happened.

Hi Tugmad,
In the early days when my model was electrical driven, like Baldrick I left out the large black pipe going up the rear of the funnel not knowing what it's purpose was.
However when I returned to the model many years later and converting it to steam propulsion I realised what the pipe was for but as the superstructure had to be removable I made a safety valve exhaust pipe to go over the valve and up the inside of the funnel and the superstructure was then able to be fitted over the the boiler flue and the valve exhaust pipe as it is to this day. Also the engine exhaust goes up the inside of the boiler flue to about 1" from the top of the flue which gives off a very good representation of smoke when under steam.

Can you explain the purpose of 2- ladders going up the outside of the funnel ?

George.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: derekwarner on December 28, 2018, 09:01:06 pm: Morning George & Baldrick......

With respect to the two [2] ladders shown in the Plan View of the chimney....could be just a land based Draftsman with little understanding

From the earlier image if a Cervia build.....it would appear that the main boiler safety valves were hard piped upon the Stdb side of the funnel as marked up in red.....this pipe would be without any restrictions from engine roof top to pipe mouth

The vessel steam pipe for the Horn or Whistle as some times referred to is on the Port side of the funnel ladder....hidden by steam but marked up in yellow

The single ladder would have been to gain maintenance access to the Horn/Whistle

Derek
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 28, 2018, 10:11:56 pm: Hi Gents , thanks for comments .
Derek, Just one ladder , the Vic Smeed plan is a bit confusing because he has drawn either the vent or whistle steam pipe going up the back of the funnel behind the ladder rungs making it look like two ladders. Maybe it was run like this in earlier days when he saw it. I assumed the ladder was so the crew could polish the whistle, but I could be wrong about that
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ooyah/2 on December 29, 2018, 06:23:36 pm: ]

Quote from: derekwarner_decoy on December 28, 2018, 09:01:06 pm
Morning George & Baldrick......

With respect to the two [2] ladders shown in the Plan View of the chimney....could be just a land based Draftsman with little understanding

Derek

Derek,
Please get your brain into gear before down crying the draughtsman that drew up the plan for CERVIA. ( Vic Smeed ) as previously named.

As it happens he is now deceased at the fine old age of 95 so can't reply to your snide statement.

Vic Smeed wrote and published many books on model building, Aero, Military, Aero engines and boat related articles and was a very fine designer.
There are still many plans and books available so I would suggest that you do some research into his name and it just may change your attitude towards his "understanding" and of his capabilities to produce the amount of information that he put out during his life time, which has helped many people in the hobby of Boat and Aero modelling and many other builds..
George.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 29, 2018, 07:31:36 pm: As ooyyah/2 says, Vic Smeed was a superlative draughtsman and modelmaker and probably the best of the post war generation for both model boating and model flying designs. To say he was exceptional doesn't even begin to cut it.
Colin
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: derekwarner on December 29, 2018, 09:01:59 pm: George....yes, I am aware of the history and amazing volume of work by Vic Smeed, and his contribution to the hobbyist fraternity. I have purchased a number of his Publications and Plans from 40 years back

As a retired Draftsman yourself, you will be aware in the days prior to digital scanning of original Drawings, most Drawing Offices employed a number of talented, however unqualified persons in the role of Drawings Tracer... this being the persons engaged to copy and trace original works onto a new medium suitable for the rigors and potential damage in the printing process

It was not my intention to suggest Mr Smeed [himself] made the error and clearly I should have used the word Tracer, as Mr Smeeds original work would not have shown a twin ladder

From this, it would appear that the error of the twin ladder was not picked up on review, by a qualified Draftsman

It could have been that both or either the Tracer or the Draftsman were land based

So if by innuendo your comments suggest to offend, I unreservedly apologize to the Trustees of the Publishing Estate of that Gentleman for any such suggestion of Litigation.......

Derek
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ooyah/2 on December 30, 2018, 11:45:05 pm: Derek,
Thanks for your apology but how much greater it would have been had you not tried to put the blame on an unknown draughtsman & tracer.
Vic Smeed was the sole designer and draughtsman of the Cervia drawing, as his hand and style can be seen on many other of his ship and plane designs and you must agree that he was not a man of little understanding.

George.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ooyah/2 on December 30, 2018, 11:48:27 pm: Quote from: Baldrick on December 28, 2018, 10:11:56 pm
Hi Gents , thanks for comments .
Derek, Just one ladder , the Vic Smeed plan is a bit confusing because he has drawn either the vent or whistle steam pipe going up the back of the funnel behind the ladder rungs making it look like two ladders. Maybe it was run like this in earlier days when he saw it. I assumed the ladder was so the crew could polish the whistle, but I could be wrong about that

Baldrick,
Apologies for interrupting your Thread, I look for ward to further progress and if you search Cervia's resting place at Gravesend there is a head on pic of the single ladder going up to allow the servicing of the steam whistle, the steam pipe comes up the Port side of the ladder and takes a 90deg horizontal bend and then another vertical 90 deg bend into the whistle.

Best wishes to all and a happy New year

Lang may your lum reek wi other folk's coal

George.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on December 31, 2018, 08:19:27 am: The Cervia Has actually been in the inner harbour at Ramsgate for the last 30 years or so.not Gravesend where she was based when working as part of the London tug fleets.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ooyah/2 on December 31, 2018, 08:55:38 am: Quote from: tugmad on December 31, 2018, 08:19:27 am
The Cervia Has actually been in the inner harbour at Ramsgate for the last 30 years or so.not Gravesend where she was based when working as part of the London tug fleets.

Thanks mate, My mistake.
George.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: derekwarner on December 31, 2018, 09:07:58 am: 'how much greater it would have been had you not tried to put the blame on an unknown draughtsman & tracer".

George.....the representation of the twin ladder on the Drawing did not appear during printing by a paper fold on the axis of the vessel or magic

Life is not a blame game, however a logical understanding of how such discrepancies could occur is always best

Derek
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ooyah/2 on December 31, 2018, 10:20:50 am: Quote from: derekwarner_decoy on December 31, 2018, 09:07:58 am
'how much greater it would have been had you not tried to put the blame on an unknown draughtsman & tracer".

George.....the representation of the twin ladder on the Drawing did not appear during printing by a paper fold on the axis of the vessel or magic

Life is not a blame game, however a logical understanding of how such discrepancies could occur is always best

Derek

Derek,
There is a mistake on the drawing, doesn't matter if there's 1- ladder or 2- ladders and the person responsible is the name on the DRG and that is Vic Smeed.

The mistake is not the point, it's that you besmirched the good name of Vic by stating his lack of "understanding" to which you have apologised so just let it go.

There will be no further comment from me as I consider the matter closed.

George,.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Nordlys on December 31, 2018, 12:26:10 pm: (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/31/20181228_103204.jpg)
(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/31/20181228_103047.jpg)
(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/31/20181228_103221.jpg)

Tugmad Im sure you'll like this! I was down at Ramsgate overnight Fri -Sat and toured the harbour.
Two Border patrols amongst the many craft moored up and your ST Cervia looking pretty ship shape above the water
I must say.
N

***Text now fixed/resized***
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Nordlys on December 31, 2018, 12:30:52 pm: My text has become unreadable somehow?
Anyway, I was down at Ramsgate overnight Fri - Sat and toured the busy harbour. Two Border Patrol craft amongst the many craft moored up.

I though the St Cervia looked pretty shipshape above the water.
Tugmad - enjoy!

Nord.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: tugmad on December 31, 2018, 12:33:13 pm: You didn’t notice the builders foam hanging from the holes under her stern then Peter?
All the best matey.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on December 31, 2018, 01:02:14 pm: She's starting to look like my model. You can see the effects of the emergency operations, bags of sand and cement tarpaulins and pump hoses cement muck and rubbish on the after deck by the engine room door. At least she's floating.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Nordlys on December 31, 2018, 01:02:26 pm: I was rather bleary eyed Tugmad after a late night session at the Brasserie out on the harbour wall and then up at the crack of Noon to get these pictures!
Now I see the foam tho'!
N
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Nordlys on December 31, 2018, 01:13:22 pm: (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/31/20181228_103350.jpg)

(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/31/20181228_103104.jpg)

Last two photos I have.
N
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Nordlys on December 31, 2018, 01:15:14 pm: Doesnt want to display my text full size ?

Thats my last two photos Baldrick for your build reference!

N
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on January 06, 2019, 07:18:00 pm: (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/06/fullsizeoutput_c6.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JOQX1)

Nothing like Christmas to get a bit of relaxing modelling in. Decided to build the deckhouse before starting the lifeboat davits. Happy with the result but this is attempt two. Attempt one was a failure , I still have things to learn about building in Styrene, attempt one taught me that you can't build a piece like this using only 1mm sheet. It is just too flexible and will warp out of square , I found that if the base is 2mm and I also made the spine wall 2mm (bits you can't see) the result is sound and does not go out of shape. Live and learn.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: ooyah/2 on January 06, 2019, 07:29:25 pm: Baldrick,
Very neat ,Styrene is a material that I haven't worked with apart from the Davit on my model which has lasted for the past 40 years, I am much happier Butchering Metal.

Happy New Year to one and all

George.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on February 01, 2019, 03:46:17 pm: (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/01/fullsizeoutput_ce.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JHHRv)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on September 06, 2019, 05:26:21 pm: Bowling season is almost over, time to get back to Cervia while eyesight holds up. Ease myself with some small bits, brass lanterns for the navigation lights (from scratch of course ).

(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/09/06/fullsizeoutput_ef.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JESNP)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on October 01, 2019, 04:11:03 pm: One lifeboat davit. One more to go.

(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/01/fullsizeoutput_f3.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JbXl2)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Tug Hercules Fireman on October 01, 2019, 10:05:35 pm: Excellent Build.

Would You be so kind as to post a closer up photo of Your Windlass?

Looks excellent. Thank You.
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on October 02, 2019, 03:33:42 pm: Thanks Rick .
This is windlass as it stands , was going to add spindles and wheels for the brakes when I can work out a way of making them so they will be reasonably strong

cheers Balders

(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/02/fullsizeoutput_f5.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/JbO6L)
Title: Re: The old B's new ST Cervia build
Post by: Baldrick on March 08, 2020, 08:11:31 pm: https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/(https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2020/03/08/fullsizeoutput_192.jpg) (https://www.modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/image/ZOrp9)