Topic: Marten, Howes & Baylis PB4 (Read 28782 times)

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS · « **on:** November 20, 2009, 12:16:46 am »

This wonderful engine was built by the extremely talented late Peter Baylis of MHB. I wanted to share this engine with the forum members here because I thought that some of you would like to see this rare engine. This engine was a proto type and is the only four cylinder that was ever built by MHB. The engine has never been steamed but has been run very briefly on air. I can say that it runs very smoothly and the beautiful craftsmanship stands as testimony to Peter's talents as a model engineer.

Bunkerbarge · « **Reply #1 on:** November 20, 2009, 07:46:27 am »

Absolutely beautiful, many thanks for sharing the pictures with us Nick. Who is going to be the brave man to put that into a boat?

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS · « **Reply #2 on:** November 20, 2009, 08:06:42 am »

I can't even bring myself to run it on steam for fear of it losing it's pristine condition let alone install it in a boat.

Brian Marten told me that this was the last engine they ever built. I feel like an over protective guardian of it. I feel the only boat worthy of this engine would have to be a MHB boat. It was originally designed for their torpedo launch which was going to have twin port and starboard Topaz style boilers.

kiwimodeller · « **Reply #3 on:** November 20, 2009, 09:38:33 am »

Nick, a lovely looking piece of craftmanship. For those of us who are not fully conversant with the more complicated engines such as this could you please do a run down on some of the features? For instance does the valve control speed and direction and if so how? I thought it needed two separate controls on a slide valve engine. What is the set of gears and lever at the front of the crank for and what are the four tubes down the side of the engine, do they oil the bearings? Thanks in anticipation, Ian.

Underpressure · « **Reply #4 on:** November 20, 2009, 10:17:23 am »

Until I saw your photos, I had not realised just how much Cheddar 'borrowed' from MHB for the Proteus and Gemini engines. I have a Gemini here and the family ancestry is clear.

Shame not to use the engine, but on the other hand, there is an awful lot of history right there!

Thanks for sharing.

Neil

Bunkerbarge · « **Reply #5 on:** November 20, 2009, 11:48:22 am »

I'm sure Nick will clarify but it looks to me like the lever at the flywheel is a reversing lever, using gears to reverse the engine in a very neat arrangement. The valve on the steam inlet will therefore be for engine revs control only.

From what I can see the oil cups on the tops of the pillars supply the small tubes going to the piston rods. What a lovely way of doing it.

Beautiful engine but I think it would be a shame to sit and simply look at it forever. It would look superb in a MHB hull though!

gondolier88 · « **Reply #6 on:** November 20, 2009, 11:49:55 am »

Beautiful, what a lovely engine.

Would be a shame not to use it Nick- you could always build a copy though i'm sure.....

Greg

HS93 (RIP) · « **Reply #7 on:** November 20, 2009, 11:57:45 am »

Hear is a single version for my mini Vap plus cheddar boiler , they did a one two and three cylinder plus the one off four.no reverse on mine so using a gear box.there was a three for sale recently but I missed the end or I would of had a good go at buying it.

peter

Underpressure · « **Reply #8 on:** November 20, 2009, 02:55:55 pm »

Quote from: Bunkerbarge on November 20, 2009, 11:48:22 am

I'm sure Nick will clarify but it looks to me like the lever at the flywheel is a reversing lever, using gears to reverse the engine in a very neat arrangement. The valve on the steam inlet will therefore be for engine revs control only.

Yes, that is spot on Bunkerbarge. At one time Cheddar did a mixer for two servo's, that would shut off the steam and move the gear engagement then reopen the steam all on one stick. The alternative is just to use the throttle stick to open the steam feed and have another channel (and servo) change the gears.

HS, like that single. I've never seen one of those before.

Neil

derekwarner · « **Reply #9 on:** November 20, 2009, 03:23:34 pm »

Ian.....the tumbler gear sets are 'Maudsley' reversing gears ...I tried to post a jpg earlier but the

stopped me ....Derek

PS when you consider the design.......there is no syncromesh or clutch....so.....must ZERO the engine RPM .....then jiggle the reversing lever whilst establishing the first revolutions of the opposite direction

Todays model representation displays a single lever @ 90 degrees for a servo..........however I believe the actual mechanism would have been a dual fulcrum on either 'side' of the engine with substantial mechanical advantage .......

Bernhard · « **Reply #10 on:** November 20, 2009, 03:35:23 pm »

Great Engine Nick.........IT IS MADE TO BE USED...SO IN A BOAT WITH IT,,,,,,,,,,,

Regards Bernhard

sheerline · « **Reply #11 on:** November 20, 2009, 04:50:47 pm »

I am inclined to agree with Berhard, when the creator of this engine built it, he did so with the intention that someone would get the joy of running it. If keeping it in a glass case gives you joy and pleasure then that is absolutely fine, but if kept that way it would still tarnish over the years and one day, someone would inherit it as a tarnished engine , strip it down and polish it up again. That would probably do it more damage than having it correctly set up as a running machine. It doesn't fulfill it's intended role if it sits on the shelf, neither does it do justice to the designers efforts. We only come this way once so enjoy to the full the beautiful gifts the designers and builders of such exotic machines have given us.
Personally, I would run it and derive great satisfaction and pleasure from the fullness of ownership.

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS · « **Reply #12 on:** November 20, 2009, 05:59:05 pm »

Hi Ian, Derek is correct, the gears on the front of the engine's crankshaft is a "Maudsley" reversing mechanism which requires one servo. The engines speed is controlled by the throttle valve located on the side of the valve chest by a second servo. The vertical column supports are partially hollow with oil cups at the tops of them. There are small brass tubes pressed into the sides of the support columns which the oil from the oiling cups flows through to provide lubrication to the piston rods. The crankshaft is supported by a number of stainless steel sealed ball bearings.

Hi Neil, The Gemini was born out of the PB2 design from MHB. John from Cheddar was good friends with Brian and Peter from MHB and was given permission to borrow the design to produce the Gemini engine. The designs for the PB2 were never sold to Cheddar, they were just on loan as long as Cheddar produced the Gemini engines and supplied them to MHB for use in their kits. Both the Gemini and the PB2's are great engines!

Hi Peter, That is a neat compact steam plant. I really like the single cylinder engine. Thanks for sharing.

Hi Sheerline, Well said! I completely agree. In fact you have all have made very good points here. The engine probably should be used and enjoyed since that was the reason it was built. I still feel that it should be placed into a MHB kit though. Would you agree? I think it would be neat to put the engine into the MHB torpedo launch with the twin boilers as it was originally intended for.

Best Regards,

Nick

Underpressure · « **Reply #13 on:** November 20, 2009, 06:43:44 pm »

Nick,
that would be one speedy model.

I remember MHB attending a Cheddar open day with a prototype Der Seekadett, that had the triple engine fitted (just before Cheddar started to produce their engines). Something went wrong with the radio and the model shot across the full width of Cheddar's demo lake at full speed, hit the slope at the edge of the lake and shot up onto the bank.

Needless to say, John Woodroffe thought it was fantastic (he did love fast steam boats).

There was no harm done and the model was back on the lake a short while later.

Neil

HS93 (RIP) · « **Reply #14 on:** November 20, 2009, 07:16:42 pm »

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS

I saw the torpedo boat test at cheddar, the where the normal how can we make it lighter cannot remember the engine for test they had a Proteus boiler I think.can you not get the test hull I think they had a few made I was going to get one but gave up the waiting, I think he had done the front deck gun at the time, and most of the plans

Underpressure

I was there the weekend the Proteus was realised and Ian had Put one in a slim hull speeding about the lake and pulling the dingy.
only picture I could find at short notice

Underpressure · « **Reply #15 on:** November 20, 2009, 08:57:53 pm »

HS,
I was also there that day, small world. The model was called Arrow.

I can't remember if it was the same weekend, but do you recall they fitted a Proteus and boiler into the dingy. Ian and I then sailed around the lake in the dingy, driven by the Proteus with Ian operating the 'plant' and me using an oar to steer.

gondolier88 · « **Reply #16 on:** November 20, 2009, 09:19:45 pm »

You know you guys really should join the SBA and get 'proper' steamboats!!!!!!!!!!!

Greg

HS93 (RIP) · « **Reply #17 on:** November 20, 2009, 10:27:17 pm »

Quote from: Underpressure on November 20, 2009, 08:57:53 pm

HS,
I was also there that day, small world. The model was called Arrow.

I can't remember if it was the same weekend, but do you recall they fitted a Proteus and boiler into the dingy. Ian and I then sailed around the lake in the dingy, driven by the Proteus with Ian operating the 'plant' and me using an oar to steer.

Yep that was it a very warm weekend. I joined the club that day. and Test it was the the steam plant in the row boat that had no rudder , where you thee when john slipped putting the ,markers out. no one dear laugh, did you go to the meals of a night.

gondolier88 l how many will take a wheelchair without me being manhandled ? Oh that many

peter

gondolier88 · « **Reply #18 on:** November 20, 2009, 10:40:21 pm »

Fair eonough HS93

Greg

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS · « **Reply #19 on:** November 20, 2009, 10:44:44 pm »

Here's a photo of the MHB Torpedo launch.

HS93 (RIP) · « **Reply #20 on:** November 20, 2009, 10:50:53 pm »

is that yours?

peter

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS · « **Reply #21 on:** November 20, 2009, 10:58:18 pm »

I wish it was! It was built by a friend on the east coast of the States. I believe this was the first or second hull ever made.

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS · « **Reply #22 on:** November 20, 2009, 11:00:43 pm »

What is going on with Cheddar's old facility? They had a beautiful shop and lake. Is anyone using the building?

gondolier88 · « **Reply #23 on:** November 20, 2009, 11:07:06 pm »

Beautiful hull!!! Who has the rights to it now?

Greg

Underpressure · « **Reply #24 on:** November 20, 2009, 11:12:14 pm »

Quote from: MONAHAN STEAM MODELS on November 20, 2009, 11:00:43 pm

What is going on with Cheddar's old facility? They had a beautiful shop and lake. Is anyone using the building?

The building was taken on by a company that work on highly classified projects. The land all belonged to John's brother Ken and his widow sold the factory but not the land beyond, so although the company would prefer the steam club was not there, they cannot evict them as Ken's widow wants them there.

Peter knows more about the recent history of the club than I do, but the it's still there and I have arranged to visit on the next club day.

Peter,
I remember John slipping in, and the stunned silence. I did not go to the evening meal, as I only live 20 minutes drive from the lake. If you had a boiler test done by the club that weekend, then I carried it out. I was the only boiler tester at the club for about 18 months, although we did have a guy in the Lake District and a couple more over in Essex.

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Author Topic: Marten, Howes & Baylis PB4 (Read 28782 times)

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS

Underpressure

Underpressure

Bernhard

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS

Underpressure

Underpressure

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS

MONAHAN STEAM MODELS

Underpressure