Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length.

[Pointy]

Hi Guys,

Just wondering what you do when your pride and joy gets stones thrown at it. I mean where do you stand from a legal point of view in defending your property?
I was alone at Black Park on Sunday when two ****ers (in their late twenties?!) started thowing stones at my Prinz. If I put down the controller to go to them the boat would have been a stationary target and was worried someone may even nick the controller when I was dealing with them. So I just sailed it out of range, no hits but very very close.  They gave up and went away, think they wanted me to fight them but there were two of them and it was very public. I can understand this from toddlers but not adults. What can you do about it and has it ever happend to you and what did you do?

[boatmadman]

Hi,

I think you probably did the best thing - treat them as the idiots they are and stay out of their way. You would only risk more trouble by challenging them, unfortunately, as you were alone you were at a big disadvantage.

Not the ideal solution I know, but prob the safest one.

Ian

[J.beazley]

I think Ian is right on this one, its just some people dont understand the time and money spent on our models and want to spoil it for us.

personally i think there jelous as they havent got the brain power to build or enjoy the hobby like we all do.

Jay

[Colin Bishop]

they havent got the brain power

Cretins like that haven't got brain power full stop! They probably chuck stones at the ducks when there are no models about.

[bigH]

Stay well away from the monkeys cage, you are quite right, they are looking for YOUR RESPONSE and could well  be setting a trap for you.   I usually get my mobile phone out so that they can see me takeing photos of them and can hear me phoning the police.

[chromedome]

I think I may have brought the model along side where I was standing.

   chromedome

[Younger at 70]

I would have got the mobile out and taken a pic and made a phone call the only time I have have a problem it worked like magic the culprits did a runner also two 7 stone GSD,s along-side me may have helped
                              Cheers
                                 BobB

[Colin Bishop]

I suppose the most tempting answer would be to equip your warship with live ammunition...

[kendalboatsman]

I suppose the most tempting answer would be to equip your warship with live ammunition...

I was thinking along those lines to Colin. Maybe a scale Roman Bireme with a working ballista on board to throw stones back would be the answer  (Need a devil smiley.)

[MCAT]

Pointy
Sorry to hear this I am a member of the Black Park model club, and have only seen this from kids
glad to hear no damage done , the phone idea sounds the best way, I don't know if the park
rangers can help. they might give you there number they could call the police unknown to the
idiots. I will ask a committee member on this, may be a dead end worth a try.

don't let it spoil your hobby and the enjoyment of Black Park.

Mick

[gary r uk]

Hi Pointy
i am ashamed that your enjoyment of my local park was spoilt by the retards i would have done the phone thing and then asked them when it was your turn,glad he suffered no damage.
if you had said that you were going i would have waited the whole family went to the lake on sunday.
channel dash on 1/4/7 weather will be glorious sailing from 0900.
gary

[Stavros]

Absolute idiot as the lads have said a photo on the mob phone and call eh police would work wonders!! Stavros

[slewis]

phone calls ! photos on phone !
Would do No good at all . Digital photos (like the ones on your phone ) are not admissible in a court of law as evidence as they are too easily manipulated to show what you or anyone else wants . Such is technology unfortunatley .
Personally I would of parked up and gone to speak to the idiots in a language they understand . It does help being over 6ft and over 15st (not fat ) .

Just bear in mind the digital pic bit thats correct 

Shane

[Younger at 70]

bet you can't move as quick as a GSD in full flight though Shane ::)

[Bunkerbarge]

phone calls ! photos on phone !
Would do No good at all . Digital photos (like the ones on your phone ) are not admissible in a court of law as evidence as they are too easily manipulated to show what you or anyone else wants . Such is technology unfortunatley .
Personally I would of parked up and gone to speak to the idiots in a language they understand . It does help being over 6ft and over 15st (not fat ) .

Just bear in mind the digital pic bit thats correct 

Shane

I don't think the fact that the pictures would be admissible is the point here.  The very knowledge that they are being photographed would hopefully make the thugs stop and think and realise that someone is taking steps to deal with them.  Usually low lifes like this are cowards anyway and easily give up when some one takes such a step.  I wouldn't imagine for a second that they would know whether the pictures are suitable evidence or not.

[Pointy]

Thanks alot for the response guys. I know the sensible thing to do is ignore them but so many things depend on what happens on the day and what kind of state you are in. I still had a good time at beautiful Black Park and most people were really nice, hell I even had strangers taking pictures of the Prinz!

Thought of calling you Gary but didn't make it down until 2pm! Hope to go this Sunday about 11ish. Have now repainted the Arado and added decals and its sitting on a nice scratch built catapult!

[MikeK]

phone calls ! photos on phone !
Would do No good at all . Digital photos (like the ones on your phone ) are not admissible in a court of law as evidence as they are too easily manipulated to show what you or anyone else wants . Such is technology unfortunately .
Personally I would of parked up and gone to speak to the idiots in a language they understand . It does help being over 6ft and over 15st (not fat ) .

Just bear in mind the digital pic bit thats correct 

Shane

If that is true, Shane, where does that leave speed cameras etc etc or do they still use good old fashioned film. Never seen a copper queueing up at Boots with his latest bit of evidence 

MikeK

[uboatbuilder]

this is one thing that annoys me is the young kids that are left to do what they want, they throw stones, and just have to touch when its out of the water. so me and my brother have to stand guard to make sure none of the little brats touch them. I know its not there fault, they're too young to understand and we explain why they shouldnt but we sholdnt have to, its the parents, they can see whats going on and they cant be so ignorant that they dont realise how much time effort and money goes into our models. they should be keeping control of them. however if stones are thrown i dont get a chance to do anything as dads the one to give the parents a mouthful or a very nasty look before anyone else gets a chance. . The look is normally enough :)

Grant :)

[BlazingPenguin]

Sort of same thing happened to me whil fishining a local park, about 7-8 'young cherubs' demanded a go at my gear, and in the process informed me that they could nick and I couldnt do anything, because the rest of them would steal the lot while I chased the instigator...

Result; A 13ft carbon rod thwapped vigorously abou the head of Mr Mouth....much to his amazement.
They then made off to 'get his dad'....exit stage left!

the drama is the fact that kids today have learnt they have in effect a 'green light' to do as they please, with no respect to parents, police or anyone other themselves, strange that they do tend to bang on about 'respec'.....man!

[uboatbuilder]

Im only 19 so it wasnt that long i was one of them but when i was i knew what was wrong and what was right, and what i could and couldnt do. among the early teens Its the street culture or what they like to call being "Gangsta" and its taking over and i hate it its so stupid and they cant even speak proper english these days. but with the toddlers it just depends on how much the parents care and theyd care alot if they were given the bill for damages :) :)

Grant

[DavieTait]

phone calls ! photos on phone !
Would do No good at all . Digital photos (like the ones on your phone ) are not admissible in a court of law as evidence as they are too easily manipulated to show what you or anyone else wants . Such is technology unfortunatley .
Personally I would of parked up and gone to speak to the idiots in a language they understand . It does help being over 6ft and over 15st (not fat ) .

Just bear in mind the digital pic bit thats correct 

Shane

Sorry Shane but thats just not true at all about Digtal photographs. The police ALL use digital cameras nowadays and there are software programs available to the authorities that can find 99% of alterations to any photo. About the only people that could get around the check systems would be MI5/MI6/CIA as the photo needs to be in a very very high resolution format originally ( think an image size of 24mb minimum ) so that when you rescale it down to "normal" image sizes ( 1024x768 or 2048x1536 ) the blending is lost in the compression. I've been involved in photography for as long as I remember and Digital photography for 5 years and I can spot an altered image without needing software it stands out that badly.

Best thing for 100% is video which mobile phone's don't do all that well. A photo and a phone call to the police is the best way to deal with idiots like these. NEVER try to do anything to them as you WILL be the one in dock getting charged as they'll claim to have been attacked by you for no reason. NEVER allow your dog(s) to go for them either as you'll have your dog destroyed and again you'll be the "bad guy". Maybe the best RC model would be a Greek oared galley with "Greek Fire" flame thrower on the bow ( existed too nice flame thrower !! historically accurate lol )

Davie

[Younger at 70]

Davie  I am not sure but if a dog attacks and is under control i.e. comes back when called or is only in-effect making a citizens arrest ( we are talking about a dog that has been properly trained here ) there shouldn't be a problem leastways thats what my local police station told me. All the above apart the very fact the dogs are there usually stops the problem before it starts plus of course the wife would frighten anybody 
                                                                                           Cheers
                                                                                                BobB
                                   

[Colin Bishop]

But if the police do bother to turn up within 24 hours you'll probably just get a £60 fine and two points on your licence for breaking the speed limit on the pond. Seems to be the way things work these days.

[bigH]

Seeing how much debate this string has aroused I think that the following advice that I was given by my nephew, ( Police Inspector ) should help.     Get your club representative to speak to the council or park owner with regards warden or parkee patrols, speak to the local police HQ Senior officer or PACT group to see if a staggered visit to the area could be arranged ( Community Police Officers )   As to photos, regardless of proof these are always useful in ID and as to placement of persons, if poss; always switch on the date and time stamp and always deliver the photos to the appropiate authorities ASAP .  Get your members to canvass thier local councillors , talk to, and invite your local paper to see how the club use of the water benefits ALL who visiit and use the area.    The biggest help you can give these lawbreakers is to do nothing, Despite the media 'Bad News' attitude HELP IS THERE.      Lets take back our lives and do something about it......  BigH

[boatmadman]

Well said Big H.

I went to see the film Outlaw the other day, about people 'taking back their lives' and doing something about it - a bit more extreme than this issue though! lol

Maybe we need a branch of outlaw mayhemmers? 

Ian

[slewis]

I apologise . I was under the impression that digital images were not permissible in cort due to the ease with which they can be manipulated.
After reading through this thread I have done a bit of googling on the subject and I was wrong !
Sorry chaps

Shane

[Barthez]

As  a serving officer I would like to add I have used camera photos and photos taken on digital cameras by victims, for prosecution files with no problems at all. if you have the equipment take capture the image. I have never had the authenticity of an image questioned.  If an arrest was made on the evidence of cctv or a camera photo it would probably come down to an ID parade anyway (done on DVD now)
Bart

[tigertiger]

As  a serving officer I would like to add I have used camera photos and photos taken on digital cameras by victims, for prosecution files with no problems at all. if you have the equipment take capture the image. I have never had the authenticity of an image questioned.  If an arrest was made on the evidence of cctv or a camera photo it would probably come down to an ID parade anyway (done on DVD now)
Bart

I was talking to one of the guys at ACPO about this about 3 years ago, with regards to CCTV images.
At that time, digital images could not be used a primary evidence. The primary evidence would usually be something else. But faced with the video (secondary evidence) it is had for a defense lawyer to attack the primary evidence. And supects faced with the video of themselves in the act normally fess up.

[Bartapuss]

You say the guys were in their late 20's, no doubt they'll be down to the lake again but this time with little his chav brat in tow to sail his radio toy boat, because now it'll be Cool.

When said brat has had a little time to start enjoying his toy and chav dad is now cooing how proud he is of his son, run the toy over with your huge model sending it to the bottom, chav brat will intantly burst into tears.

Then you can scream " how do you 'blinking!' like it!!!"

or you could simply pull out your jammie and pop a cap in his "bottom"!

[sinjon]

What is the position with insurance, it never occurred to me that I would need cover for malicious damage, numerous ways you can damage the boat yourself, that's hard luck or carelessness, I'm sure my insurance is for third party only.

[Ghost in the shell]

I suppose the most tempting answer would be to equip your warship with live ammunition...

fancy taking the workings of my gas powered bb gun pistol? lol

[Colin Bishop]

This looks like the answer!

[Doc]

Pointy,
You did the right thing.  Not the most satisfying, but the 'smart' one.  Is carrying a large sword allowed where you live?  Not many people want to mess with some idiot that carries a sword.
 - 'Doc

[portside II]

the last person to wave a sword about around here was shot by the police  and that was in an area not as public as a park .
Possibly a rifle with scope and scilencer as we dont want to atract too much attention "stum" (sound of a shot from a silencer).