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Author Topic: Dumas Chris craft Triple  (Read 32949 times)

slewis

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Dumas Chris craft Triple
« on: April 12, 2007, 09:29:58 PM »

OK This is not only my first Build on here but also my first boat build !
So wish me luck and watch what I am doing so I don't screw it up completely  ;D.

Some basic specifications

length  41.5"
beam   10.75"
scale 1/8

This an all wood double planked construction and comes with a very comprehensive instruction book .

This was ordered from the USA about a month ago , ordered NOT to save a few quid in getting it from abroad but simply every single place I contacted over here in the UK said there was NOT a single importer of Dumas kits into this country at the moment. Indeed it took a week for the place in the states to get hold of one.
But it arrived safe and sound this afternoon with only 1 piece broken , which can easily be re-cut on the scroll saw and band saw .

I am reading the instructions through a few times before starting as I always like a clear idea in my mind of what is going to happen 3 steps down the line so I can forward plan .
This kit is NOT aimed at novice builders I am told , in fact I was told this a few times over here and by the supplier in the USA .
So why did I pick it as my first build ?
Easy I like a challenge and I have built many scale RC aircraft (all fly) and some of those were scratch builds . Indeed I have one on hold at the moment as its proving a bit tricky , A 102" wing span Fairey gannet complete with working folding wings !(YES they do work ! )

So anyways its boat time .
Wish me luck and wait for the questions to start !  ;D ;D ;D

A couple of pics to wet your  appetite  :)



Now all I have to do is turn that lot into this  :D :D


More as soon as I finish reading .

Shane
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bradboat

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #1 on: April 12, 2007, 10:11:32 PM »

Hi Shane

Good luck with the build ;)

Please keep us informed as to progress, as I am sure that many like me would love to tackle this model one day

Brad
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slewis

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2007, 10:29:36 PM »

Quote
Please keep us informed as to progress

Oh you will regret saying that !  ;D ;D ;D ;D

When I do online builds of model planes  you might as well be sat in the workshop with me. I take pics of everything and ask questions like they are going out of fashion LOL .
Its nice to have a worldwide back up of more experienced boat builders than ones self .
One thing I ALWAYS bow down to is experience and this forum seems to have a great deal of that  .


LOOK OUT   chaps  ;D ;D
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Peterm

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #3 on: April 13, 2007, 08:53:17 AM »

Shane, I built a Chris Craft `Cobra` very similar to yours.   Took a long time, and much hard  work, but resulted in a beautiful boat.   When I can find the photos, I will post a couple.   Pete M
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roycv

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #4 on: April 13, 2007, 09:09:55 AM »

Hi all, I have a Dumas kit of the Pusher tug American Beauty and also helped a friend with his kit of the Cobra.  Mainly in identifying the parts.  Still unbuilt though!
I have to say that the quality of the wood in these 2 kits + the barges to go with the tug is very poor and I stopped building my American Beauty as I was going to have to discard a lot of the wood superstructure.  The fittings were very low quality and after a long search I found an internet address for Dumas and contacted them, they replaced a lot of them.

Have things improved with the kit you have?

I would very much like to build a speed boat, and Dumas have a great selection, but I have been put off by my experience with American Beauty.

Also Perkins import Dumas kits into the U.K. and I cannot speak too highly of the gratuitous service they gave me in 2001.
regards to all Roy
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anmo

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2007, 09:50:59 AM »

Don't think I've seen a Dumas kit for years, but a friend built one a while ago and had to replace most of the wood, the ply was like reject stuff from a skip outside a packing case company. Same friend also had a PT109 kit from another US company, the wood was just as bad, and he bought it after reading a good kit review in an American magazine. And to think we all complain about the wood that Billings use, their stuff is vastly better than what I've seen from these two US companies.
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anmo

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2007, 09:53:05 AM »


Also Perkins import Dumas kits into the U.K. and I cannot speak too highly of the gratuitous service they gave me in 2001.
regards to all Roy

Dare I suggest that the word you wanted there might have been 'gracious' rather than 'gratuitous' Roy?
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2007, 10:34:46 AM »

Hi Shane,

Buy various grade sandpaper - ranging from Badgers a***  to  babies bum....  ::)

Use a good waterproof glue! ( Recommendations anyone? )

Martin.
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Peterm

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #8 on: April 13, 2007, 01:41:02 PM »

Just goes to show how kits differ.   The wood for my cobra was excellent, although as Martin says, you have to work hard to get the final desired finish.   Pete M
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slewis

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #9 on: April 13, 2007, 07:49:33 PM »

Glues I were planning on using as far as it goes at the moment.


Aliphatic resin (like white wood glue )
which according to the following label IS waterproof after its dried  ::)


This along with the usual assortment of CA both thick and thin and varying epoxies 5 min, 30 min and higher .
I think this should suffice for the time being but if anyone knows differently ..............

Regarding the quality of the wood .
I would say 90% is excellent with only the mahogany ply being found wanting in quality. One of these ply sheets contains the broken section which I am going to have to remake anyway but as its never going to be seen once the deck is fitted I may repair .
Why would they use mahogany ply on a section that is hidden from view and not lite ply ?
One thing that does disappoint is the fact that all the parts are cnc cut and not laser cut as I thought when ordering the model . I hate those squashed edges  >:(

Oh well I fully expect to get started tomorrow afternoon so will update as I go  ;)

Thanks for replies chaps

Shane
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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #10 on: April 13, 2007, 10:11:51 PM »

hi,

I have used that aliphatic glue with good success, but i now use Bostik exterior waterproof wood glue - cheaper if memory is right, and works fine

Ian
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slewis

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #11 on: April 13, 2007, 10:28:41 PM »

A friend suggested using Cascamite  but as it takes 24 hours to go off I think this is going to be out of the question.
I will use aliphatic , CA and epoxy to stick the frame work together in whatever proportion I deem necessary .

Like I have said before I built /build Rc aircraft and the stresses those frames go through are on another scale compared to the stress on a model boat and they all seem to hang together well enough using the glues I stated above.
Obviously  water proofing is not a factor in most plane builds (apart from water planes ) We were more concerned with fuel proofing them from the various noxious chemicals and their waste products from the exhaust .

Thank gawd I no longer have to travel for an hour to enjoy a hobby (was an hour to my flying site)

Just got to build her now  ;)
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FullLeatherJacket

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2007, 11:23:59 PM »

Shane
Lovely boat, and good luck with building it. I've used that exact same aliphatic glue and would recommend it to anyone for woodworking BUT I've had no end of problems with CA glues on resinous wood like mahogany. Whatever you do, check out the strength of CA joints on scrap bits of this wood first. Aliphatic should be waterproofed, but a couple of thinned coats of polyurethane varnish will do the trick provided that you then rough-sand any wood parts which you need to glue afterwards e.g the edges of the frames where the skinning will fit.

FLJ
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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #13 on: April 13, 2007, 11:37:15 PM »

That make of aliphatic resin works very well, quickish grab, and will sand without a hard line, Cascamite is very good and very waterproof but can be very brittle, supper glue is ok, but not with some hardwoods . you have to test to check. I use a polyurethane glue for bits that are susceptible to a lot of wet (picture) but it is horrible to use ,wear gloves or you have it for at least a week to remember you night of modeling  ,, Peter
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roycv

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #14 on: April 14, 2007, 06:04:26 PM »

Hi ANMO, No, I meant 'gratuitous', as in 'freely given', tell you why.

My son was in USA and sent a kit to me for my birthday.  It was the Dumas American Beauty.  The shop sending it were to dispatch it via surface mail relatively cheaply.  They sent it airmail at enormous cost, about the same as a single airfare!  Not only did they cock this up but they SENT THE WRONG KIT. 
After a lot of phone calls they said send it back and we will send correct kit.  This would again cost more than the kit was worth! 

I phoned Perkins and told them what had happened and asked if they had any suggestions.
This is the gratuitous bit!
The lady I spoke to said that she was going to the USA within a few days and would be seeing Dumas at a Model Trade fair and would tell them what had happened..

The upshot of this, all happening either side of the 9 / 11 terrorist event in 2001, was that Dumas supplied a kit for American Beauty and Perkins imported the kit for me and then dispatched it to the nearest model shop to me and I collected it a few weeks later, all for no charge and there was absolutely no obligation on their part to do anything.

I was told to keep the wrongly sent kit as well.

My son had paid by credit card and was refunded the cost of dispatch by Visacard.

Now I had not spent any money with Perkins so you can see that I cannot speak too highly of their gratuitous service.

regards to all Roy
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slewis

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #15 on: April 14, 2007, 09:28:50 PM »

Hi there the build has started at long last !

First off a bit of preperation of the frames and the centre keel.
The parts were removed from the surrounding wood and the edges were lightly sanded to remove any rough edges (lots of  >:( )
They were then marked up carefully and 1/8 sq ply was used to create small strips to support various parts during the build . Definatley a case of measure twice stick once ! I kept mixing up the centre line ,on some of these strips , with a line 1/4" away from cantre to place them ! Still I got there in the end  :)

Frames all prepared ready for fitting .

Next it was onto the centre keel which came in 2 halves and required gluing together to make one keel 1/4" wide . Why on earth they didnt just make it a one piece affair is beyond me .I was tempted to recut it from marine ply but didnt have any to hand in the required thickness so opted to do it as per the book .

centre keel glued together .

While waiting for that lot to go off I started on joining the 2 sheer halves together ,again why 2 pieces when 1 would have been easy enough to cut  :-\

Sheers glued

Then after a couple of hours to allow it all to dry properly I started on fitting the frames into place paying carefull attention to the angles of each one as it was glued into place .
I tacked them into position first with thick CA . FLJ you are correct CA and mahogany dont like playing together
But it did hold while I used the aliphatic around and between the joints .


And this is where I am up to now

All the frames fitted and setting solid overnight . :D

Tommorow I have to fit the Chines which should prove interesting as it involves laminating 3 strips of 1/8 x1/4 x 45" of spruce together down the whole length of the framework . I may ,having thought about it ,glue about 2" together at one end and then glue the rest as I am progressing down the length of it thereby allowing each piece to pull along each other as it is going so removing any unnecesary stress while its being curved .

More soon

Shane
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slewis

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #16 on: April 15, 2007, 05:42:26 PM »

Here we go again.
Main job today was to get the chines completed and in between Ca'ing my fingers a few times I managed to get the 3 strips stuck to each other and epoxied into their respective positions as I worked along the hull



Once this was completed I could actually take her off the building board for the first time and get a look at the shape of her



Next up I have started on the sub planking which is 1/8 ply . As you can see I have had to add a bit of weight to it to keep all the epoxied surfaces together while it dries and am not looking forward to doing the front end as the bends are quite sharp . I am not sure how I am going to tackle that one as yet  so if you have any ideas please shout loudly ! ;D


More as and when I get time in the coming week , working 6 till 6 each day really slows things up a lot  >:(

Shane
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boatmadman

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #17 on: April 15, 2007, 06:52:22 PM »

Hi,

You might think about diagonal planking the sub ply for the sharp curve in the bow.

Ian
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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #18 on: April 15, 2007, 07:19:57 PM »

How are you finding the CA (superglue) holding?
On the Puffer build, I found the ply joints could be easily prised apart, ie. the glue always gave way before the wood..
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bluebird

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #19 on: April 15, 2007, 07:22:35 PM »

hi there Shane

In the plans for your model, how does it tell you to plank the hull at the bow?    Before we add a comment, it would be best to have some idea of how its described in the instructions - because our ways may be different to your plans  ;D

aye
john e
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slewis

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #20 on: April 15, 2007, 07:56:46 PM »

Thanks for replies chaps  ;)
Apologies for the standard of the pictures but I have rushed to get them before the light fails tonight  :(

The first pic is where I have got to at the moment and its the top plank that is giving me grief



The picture doesnt show it that well but the plank goes from almost horizontal at the back to aboout 70/80 degrees at the front and this is quite a twist in a piece of 1/8 ply !

The second pic shows the bow planked and as you can see the rest of the planking is going to be ok its just lengths of strip balsa .

I was considering doing the same for the awkward bit as balsa is a lot easier to twist around and as its in 1/2" wide strips it might be the way to go  .

What do you think ? Is there any reason why its got to be ply ? Or could I cut myself some ply strips on the bandsaw and plank it like the rest ?

Thanks again

Shane .

Ps this is all new to me having never built a boat before !
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slewis

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #21 on: April 15, 2007, 08:01:00 PM »

Martin I forgot to add
I have just about given up on CA I am using it for tacking parts together and then using either aliphatic or epoxy to stick them solid  ;)

Shane
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #22 on: April 15, 2007, 08:16:13 PM »

Though you might be having the same problem with the Superglue, must be the glue used in the ply...
Another good glue is SUPER' PHATIC, a sort of "super" pva glue. Quite quick I've found, very thin so seeps into joints and supfaces very well too.   http://www.deluxematerials.co.uk/system/index.html

Try dampening the wood with a wet cloth to "help"b it bend.

Martin
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slewis

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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #23 on: April 15, 2007, 08:27:59 PM »

Thanks for the link Martin
I will be spending some hard earned there soon  ;)
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Re: Dumas Chris craft Triple
« Reply #24 on: April 15, 2007, 08:32:53 PM »

Shane, just to ensure I understand this right :

We will say, starting at the bow and first frame back from the bow - we will call this number 1 and
when you reach number 5 frame this is where your planking of the bow terminates.   From then on it is sheet plywood to the stern of the boat.   Is there external planking over the top of your first layer of plywood and planks? (possibly mahogany planking?).

If you are finding it difficult to plank with the half inch 1/8" strips of plywood, you may stick the plywood in boiling water for 10 to 15 minutes.  This will soften the plywood and enable you to bend it.

Another alternative is, instead of using 1/2" wide strips by 1/8" try cutting down the width of the plank to 3/16" the narrower plank will allow you to follow the flare of the hull easier and it will also allow the twisting of the planks.

hope this is of some help.

aye
john e
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