Topic: boat stops (Read 1279 times)

regiment · « **on:** June 24, 2012, 04:54:33 PM »

twice i have taken my boat to the lake and twice it has stopped after one hour got it home switched it on and away the motor went could not stop it with my fingers battery is sla 6 v 4.5 amp motor 540 esc montronic 15 nothing gets hot so it is either a good answer from members or a good clout from me with a hammer thanks

malcolmfrary · « **Reply #1 on:** June 24, 2012, 04:58:55 PM »

This is when your voltmeter comes in handy to check immediately the problem happens, and then again when you get it home.

Martin (Admin) · « **Reply #2 on:** June 24, 2012, 05:07:50 PM »

Does it work when get back to the lakeside?

tugs62 · « **Reply #3 on:** June 24, 2012, 05:11:14 PM »

ive been having the same problem been told to drop a prop size

Stavros · « **Reply #4 on:** June 24, 2012, 05:36:40 PM »

Your ESC can not cope with the current you are drawing it is cutting out as it is getting to hot,seems to me you are drawing over 15 amps,Been there had the tee shirt etc,I PERSONALLY think you have been lucky he esc has not caught fire as that make usually does

Dave

bluebird · « **Reply #5 on:** June 24, 2012, 06:01:25 PM »

Hi regiment
What type of radio equipment are you you using in the model ?and are you using a B E C in your setup ?.
I have had a similar fault in one of my models in the past and it was due to a duff battery in amongst the 4.8 battery pack which was supplying the RX in the boat
aye
john

regiment · « **Reply #6 on:** June 24, 2012, 06:12:27 PM »

after a 5 minutes walk home put it on the bench all works nothing gets hot cannot change prop easy.. motor and esc brought from howes explained it was for a remodelled rtr tug

regiment · « **Reply #7 on:** June 24, 2012, 06:15:53 PM »

running the esc off the main battery 2 channel futuba new batteries in tx

regiment · « **Reply #8 on:** June 24, 2012, 06:51:22 PM »

not up on electris how can i draw 15 amps from 6 v a 4.5 amp battery and why did the 10 amp fuse not blow and as soon as i took the boat out of the water i checked it and esc battery and motor were all cold

787eng · « **Reply #9 on:** June 24, 2012, 07:13:52 PM »

It could be that the voltage has dropped sufficiently on the main 6V battery where the voltage regulator in the ESC (BEC) is dropping out due to insufficient difference between the input and output of the regulator.

A quick and dirty way if you don't have a voltmeter to hand to measure the 4.8~5V feed to the recever is to remove the red wire of the ESC and connect a temporary external battery in place to power the receiver, if you are still sailing after 2 hours you know what the problem is!

For all my 6V installations I just connect the receiver directly to the battery via a Silicon diode (6V - 0.7V = 5.3V)....

Mark

malcolmfrary · « **Reply #10 on:** June 24, 2012, 11:08:03 PM »

Quote

how can i draw 15 amps from 6 v a 4.5 amp battery

Very easily. It isnt a 4.5 amp battery. Its a 4.5AH battery. Thats a measure of the power it should hold, not the maximum current it can deliver. A healthy one can probably deliver over 100A into the right load, but only for a few seconds, which is why fuses are a good idea. An unhealthy one can have its voltage drop suddenly, possibly bringing the system to a stop. After some time recovering, like the drift to the pool side and the trip home, it might well power the system again.

The ESC probably has a thermal protection circuit built in which should shut it down when it gets too warm. If there was a particular internal fault, it might well incinerate itself like Stavros suggests, but for the fuse.
It is important to measure the battery voltage as soon as possible after the event to start figuring out logically what is wrong. At the moment, it could be a duff battery, or a dud ESC, or a faulty RX or a TX thats has gone sulky, or a dud connection on or in any of the bits of wire joining any of them.

Does the rudder continue working?

shipmate60 · « **Reply #11 on:** June 24, 2012, 11:24:48 PM »

A 540 motor seems a bit high revving for a tug.

Bob

malcolmfrary · « **Reply #12 on:** June 24, 2012, 11:36:44 PM »

Quote from: shipmate60 on June 24, 2012, 11:24:48 PM

A 540 motor seems a bit high revving for a tug.

Bob

If its got a tug sized prop on it, it won't be high revving. It will pull plenty of current and warm up the insides of the ESC, itself, and any weak spots in the wiring, but again, it might not be a 540. It could just as easily be a 545, and we don't know what voltage motor it is.

unbuiltnautilus · « **Reply #13 on:** June 25, 2012, 10:11:30 AM »

People seem to think there is only one type of '540' motor, looking at the above posts. If you had one of the high amp 'Tamiya' type RS540 motors fitted in your tug, you could expect a total run time of no more than 15 minutes, followed by everything in the model being mighty hot. You state a run time of an hour before everything stops, I think you have a lightly wound 'low drain' 540 type motor. This would provide a run time of between one and two hours depending on the prop size. I think, as stated above, that your battery has dropped below a level that has resulted in the speed controllers BEC tripping out. When you then take the model home, the battery recovers just enough to start working again. Remember that you are now operating out of the water and the current drain will be a lot less than it was in the water. You will probably find that after about ten minutes of running, the BEC would trip out again as your voltage dropped.
For the record, I have not come across a decent 'low drain' 545 motor yet, despite much searching. Unless anyone knows otherwise?

regiment · « **Reply #14 on:** June 25, 2012, 10:34:11 AM »

rang howes models today thay recommended motor and esc are told them problem said esc and motor ok for tug problem could be battery or the rx tx cable the receiver is below water line receiver is will chaneg it and try again

regiment · « **Reply #15 on:** June 25, 2012, 11:17:49 AM »

my friend has just rang told me the battery was only showing THREE VOLTS when he tested it straight from the water i was not there when he done it so battery DUD ??

ACTion · « **Reply #16 on:** June 25, 2012, 11:30:01 AM »

Quote from: unbuiltnautilus on June 25, 2012, 10:11:30 AM

For the record, I have not come across a decent 'low drain' 545 motor yet, despite much searching. Unless anyone knows otherwise?

Prior to taking over ACTion I used to get some very nice low-drain 545s from Sussex Model Centre but they are no longer available. We now supply genuine Mabuchi 555 motors which we import ourselves; IMHO these are much better for a tug than any model-store 540, irrespective of what's inside the can.
Gordon
Trust the advice from Unbuilt above - the battery is flat either because it is dead or because the motor draws a lot of current. 4.5AH isn't a lot of capacity for a main drive battery. Changing the receiver will be about as useful a solution as changing your socks. Ref advice from the supplier, I had a customer who had been sold two Speed 700BB Turbo 8.4v motors by another very reputable model boat shop, having them recommended as "ideal" for a tug on 12v (no load RPM at that voltage around 20K)! At the end of the day it depends who you speak to and what he has on the shelf. I have stopped recommending that particular retailer to our customers now.
DM

regiment · « **Reply #17 on:** June 25, 2012, 11:43:22 AM »

right dave what do i do new battery or new motor or a paddle gordon

unbuiltnautilus · « **Reply #18 on:** June 25, 2012, 11:54:01 AM »

Charge it back up, go back down the lake and enjoy an hours sailing. Dont leave the gel cell in a flattened state when you get home, charge it back up, and maybe buy a second battery, their only about a tenner

malcolmfrary · « **Reply #19 on:** June 25, 2012, 01:14:40 PM »

If the battery is running an hour, it probably isn't too unhealthy, but going down to 3 volts is not good for its future prospects. As the voltage drops, there should be a noticeable drop in performance - if there isn't, it probably means that one cell is a bit weaker than the rest. In cases like that, when it becomes fully discharged, it tries to reverse charge off its mates, and you get a very sudden 2 volt drop and a big reduction in the battery's ability to supply current. 3 volts is the area where RXs stop working.
Careful recharge until the light on the charger goes out, run it half an hour, careful recharge and repeat the cycle. Should bring the battery back to as full a charge state as it will be able to take. Having another (charged) battery does no harm at all. Having numbered sticky labels on them helps you remember where you are up to with them, as well.

ACTion · « **Reply #20 on:** June 25, 2012, 01:40:07 PM »

Quote from: regiment on June 25, 2012, 11:43:22 AM

right dave what do i do new battery or new motor or a paddle gordon

Like Unbuilt and Doc Frary say, start with the cheapest option i.e. recharge the one you have. You might also try some different props to see which gives the longest running time. Next up, buy a spare battery (£5.75) and keep that charged with you when you go sailing. Last would be a motor transplant (£9).
Leave the paddle until you're up the appropriate creek

DM

regiment · « **Reply #21 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:01:59 PM »

thanks to all who repliiad will go for another battery first where from.. maplins here in truro want £16 for one gordon.. ps then down to the boat yard for a paddle

DickyD · « **Reply #22 on:** June 25, 2012, 03:13:54 PM »

6V 5Ah Sealed Lead-Acid Battery £6.50 each plus cheap p&p and excellent service.

http://www.component-shop.co.uk/html/lead-acid.html

malcolmfrary · « **Reply #23 on:** June 25, 2012, 04:27:45 PM »

Yes, it looks like Maplin are trying to price themselves out of selling something useful again.
Lots of alternatives, though, that's what google is for.
First hit for "SLA battery" was http://www.batterymasters.co.uk/SLAsearch.aspx?volts=6&amps=4.5&lens=0&widths=0&hgts=0
so component shop looks good.
A quick check at http://www.howesmodels.co.uk/RadioControl/viewProducts.php?SubCatID=140 is interesting as well.

You makes your choice, you pays your money.

ACTion · « **Reply #24 on:** June 25, 2012, 05:02:00 PM »

Quote from: malcolmfrary on June 25, 2012, 04:27:45 PM

You makes your choice, you pays your money.

But first you have to make your money............

DM

malcolmfrary · « **Reply #25 on:** June 25, 2012, 06:23:09 PM »

Quote from: ACTion on June 25, 2012, 05:02:00 PM

But first you have to make your money............
DM

Making big money is considered a good idea. Just don't make it too big. And let the ink dry.

bluebird · « **Reply #26 on:** June 25, 2012, 06:47:58 PM »

Hi ya Regiment

Have you checked that your battery charger is charging your batteries properly? Just a thought.

If you go to Component shop you can get a new battery & charger for a similar price to what you would pay for one battery at Maplins shop.

Next question

when you say you have been sailing for an hour - is that the model sailing round the lake for an actual hour - non stop or the total time you spend down the lake with your model. Cos spending an hour on the lake sailing your model - continuously - I think there is something wrong. Because you will be the only modeller that I know who doesnt sail a model for about 5-10 minutes and then stop - standing talking for next 30-35 mins whilst the model drifts off merrily away and out of sight.

The only time I have known anyone to spend longer than 5 mins actually sailing a model is during a competition.

John
aye
john

Tug---Kenny · « **Reply #27 on:** June 25, 2012, 08:09:52 PM »

How true John ... ooh how true.

None of my boats have ever sailed for more than 29 minutes.

ken

DickyD · « **Reply #28 on:** June 25, 2012, 08:40:50 PM »

Quote from: Tug---Kenny on June 25, 2012, 08:09:52 PM

How true John ... ooh how true.

None of my boats have ever sailed for more than 29 minutes.

ken

Is this because you sink them Ken ?

pompebled · « **Reply #29 on:** June 25, 2012, 08:57:15 PM »

Quote from: bluebird on June 25, 2012, 06:47:58 PM

Because you will be the only modeller that I know who doesn't sail a model for about 5-10 minutes and then stop - standing talking for next 30-35 mins whilst the model drifts off merrily away and out of sight. The only time I have known anyone to spend longer than 5 mins actually sailing a model is during a competition.
John aye john

Hi John,

I must be the (or one of those) exception(s), who use their models for actually running them 90% of the time.
The main cause for that is the lack of a lake to run my boats on; I live in Sneek, with miles and miles of canals, a lot of them with footpaths alongside, so I can take my boats for a stroll circumventing our town, which takes about an hour, depending on how long the remaining 10% of standing around, and talking to spectators takes...

When I fancy a long walk, I carry my boat from one shippable section to the next, which will take me about three hours of running the boat.
By that time I'm more worn out than my boat, which can run up to four hours continuously full throttle on a 8000mAh Lipo.

Regards, Jan.

Stavros · « **Reply #30 on:** June 25, 2012, 09:04:24 PM »

Quote from: DickyD on June 25, 2012, 08:40:50 PM

Quote from: Tug---Kenny on June 25, 2012, 08:09:52 PM
How true John ... ooh how true.

None of my boats have ever sailed for more than 29 minutes.

ken

Is this because you sink them Ken ?

I like that Richard

Dave

Tug---Kenny · « **Reply #31 on:** June 25, 2012, 09:12:54 PM »

Well, I asked for that one.

cheers

ken

Bob K · « **Reply #32 on:** June 25, 2012, 09:51:23 PM »

When I go sailing at my local club I usually spend most of my time there sailing my boat/s around. Out of 2 hours that is about 1 hr 45 mins at least with props turning. Yes, I do like to chat with other members, but with one eye on the boat and the other on the anti collision radar. I therefore require at least 2 to 3 hours running capacity hence my prediliction for nice big lead acid batteries.

regiment · « **Reply #33 on:** June 26, 2012, 03:16:45 PM »

i cannot chat to other modelers as i an the only one there at the moment so it me the boat and the swans

regiment · « **Reply #34 on:** June 26, 2012, 03:22:42 PM »

for got to say cannot fix a smaller prop a funny fitting so have used a stanley knife and made it smaller no shakes or viberations in the dogs bath tomorrow it will go

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Author Topic: boat stops (Read 1279 times)

ACTion

ACTion

ACTion