Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length.

[sparkey]

  Over many years of enjoying our great hobby I have noticed that the state of wiring in a lot of model boats is to say the least poor, some really wonderful boats let done by the wiring and broken down in the middle of the lake,I have spent many Sunday mornings soldering iron in hand helping other boaters with their wiring,not that I mind I quite enjoy it but would it not be better to sort it out before you get to the lake,if it looks neat and tidy it usually won't let you down so come on guys lets up our game,just a old man having a moan,hope you all have a great sailing weekend with not too much rain,Ray.  

[inertia]

Ray
You're a man after my own heart. How many times I've seen a beautifully-made model with wiring like a rat's entrails; the wrong size battery for the motor used, wire which is too thin (or thick) for the job, choc-block connectors for high-current circuits, wires joined by twisting them together, PVC insulation tape wrapped around such joints - the list goes on. Whenever any observation is made about it the owner trots out some remark like "O, I don't understand electronics" as if that's a sort of badge of honour.
Operating electrically-powered model boats and not having a clue (or a care) about the basics of DC electricity is not cool - it's just lazy, or worse.
There's a link here to the Model Boats website where you'll find an article which covers just about everything you need to know - and there's no 'electronics' involved http://www.modelboats.co.uk/news/article/but-i-don-t-understand-electronics/18054
With suppliers like Component Shop who can sell you practically everything you need in the way of cables, connectors, batteries, chargers, switches and a whole range of model boat electronics then there really is no excuse for those horrible installations Ray mentions.
In my experience as a manufacturer of model electronics most of the problems which arise are the result of poor wiring or flat batteries. Less than half the units sent back for repair actually have anything wrong with them, and of those which do most of the faults are caused by incorrect connection or other abuse by the owner.
Like Ray says, if it looks right then it generally is, and it's much easier to trace a fault if you're not being attacked from all directions by loose wires!
My regime for wiring a boat is straightforward:

• Plan the job and get the right materials together before you start. Don't make do with something which isn't right for the job just because you have it to hand.
• Charge up all batteries before starting any installation.
• Start the job with the main battery and cable it up to the main switch - then test it.
• Fit any fuse and retest.
• Continue adding one unit at a time and testing it, then disconnect the battery and add the next unit. Don't wire everything up all at once and leave testing to the end. If you do the job in stages then if anything does go wrong you'll know that it was the the last step which caused it.

If it was rocket-science then I'd have taken up basket-weaving long ago!
Dave M

[essex2visuvesi]

I always try to go for a smart wiring install, but it always ends up looking like an explosion in a spagetti factory

[U-33]

I was always taught by the late Bernie Wood to keep all wiring short as possible, away from moving parts if possible, clipped together if possible, and generally nice, neat and tidy.


I managed to nearly lose a sub when a loose wire got itself trapped around the air pump and was ripped off, leaving me submerged with no power to the ballast pump, and no way of surfacing. Luckily for me, Bernie always carried in his tool box a length of thin string with either a floating ball or a lead weight attached, depending on what was needed. Two casts later and the boat was unceremoniously  dragged to the surface, and the wire repaired.

Ever since then, I always strive to keep The Great Man's advice in my mind when attempting any wiring in a sub.


Rich

[Plastic - RIP]

This is one of the things that I've never understood - most of the people on here are showing photos of boats that are worth hundreds of pounds, yet if you look inside some of them, the equipment is bodged together with bits of old choc-block and ten tons of spaghetti.

I often see a rough old bit of ply with holes hacked in it to mount servos and motors. I see batteries loose to move around, wiring resting on motor couplings, motors with no suppression caps, loose receivers laying in the bilges and wiring for lights just thrown in.

With all of the ty-wraps, self-adhesive wiring clips, heat-shrink tubing, fibreglass & epoxies and composite boards that are available for pennies from ebay, why do people skimp of these important parts that give reliability?

[Bob K]

For those who are forever pulling off spade terminals at the lakeside:
All too often these end up loose and an endless source of problems, especially when I see them getting re-squished with pliers for the umpteenth time.
With an adequate power/charging switch and freshly recharged batteries of enough capacity they need never need disturbing.
I would recommend the spade terminals from Component Shop that have a sprung detent latch.
http://www.componentshop.co.uk/1-4-spade-terminals.html
Always crimp and solder joints, with colour coded heatshrink sleeves over all exposed connections.

[U-33]

This is the radio box of the little Jelly Bean 4 submersible..got a way to go as yet, I'm waiting on the esc to arrive, then I can finish off tidying and clipping down the stray wires, but it gives you an idea of how I do my wiring.


Rich

[Z750Jay]

Here is one from Shittyelectrical on Facebook - it s a thing of beauty for us electricians

[sparkey]

  Oh such a wonderful sight,have done one or two great installations in M.I.C.C ,conduit, trunking and cable tray,the best one was in the Royal Festival Hall back in the late 60s when it was rewired but has been rewired again since,the hall was built just after the war for the Festival of Britain and a lot of the switchgear,contacters ect. must have pre-war when built, when we removed them they where on there last legs and always breaking down,the down side was we didn't know about asbestos,mercury and all the other nasties that was in the old control gear,luck is I am still around I wonder how many of the other sparky's are,Ray.    

[Plastic - RIP]

Seriously?

This guy has obviously never heard of trunking?  I'd be REALLY miffed if a contractor did that in my house!

[sparkey]

  I think you will find that is an industrial installation or maybe on a ship what ever it shows a great deal of craftmanship and skill,however I have seen a great deal of cowboy installation mainly in domestic houses,usually if the sparky has taken this much trouble on the outside you know the inside will be the same first class,Ray.      

[Plastic - RIP]

I think you will find that is an industrial installation or maybe on a ship what ever it shows a great deal of craftmanship and skill,however I have seen a great deal of cowboy installation mainly in domestic houses,usually if the sparky has taken this much trouble on the outside you know the inside will be the same first class,Ray.    

It's domestic - the floorplan is on the lower left of the picture.

I'd sack a sparky if he did that in an industrial installation!

[GAZOU]

It is the kind of work which we make you do to the school or to the army.
It's useless but that pleases the instructor

[Plastic - RIP]

It is the kind of work which we make you do to the school or to the army.
It's useless but that pleases the instructor

Yeah - they used to make the YTS trainees do that type of thing years ago to practice using clips and grommets but you'd never do it like that for real!

Even the Americans don't do it like that normally!

[Z750Jay]

I think it's for a hotel so it gets the commercial touch!
I wish some of the sparkys in the dockyard would do stuff like that. I get to check new cable runs as part of my job and a lot of the runs are a right snakes nest

[Z750Jay]

But I must admit I would be happier if it was in conduit

[Plastic - RIP]

Looking at the floorplan, I'm pretty sure that it's a domestic installation in a 3-bed single-storey US house - they colour (color) code the wires depending on use.

[sparkey]

I started this thread about model boat wiring and look guy's we have really drifted off course, so can we see some wonderful posts about wiring on your boats,and some photos please,Ray.

[Z750Jay]

Lol, my springer tug started with nice, tidy runs but upgraded to two batts plus tried a few of my strange ideas out ( kind of used the springer as a testbed for other projects) and it got real tight on space so to my shame ended up a bit of a mess. Lessen learnt, don't rush it, do it properly from the start. I did have great intentions once I worked out the working crane thing of making a proper loom but managed to kill it before that happened
Currently building a twin prop modern tug - photos will follow but this one I am taking my time with and doing things properly as I was taught.

[RAAArtyGunner]

It's domestic - the floorplan is on the lower left of the picture.

I'd sack a sparky if he did that in an industrial installation!

Why, because of the labour involved.
 
Look past that point and think how simple it will be to fault find and trace any defects or alter the installation.
 
Recall it being said early on in this thread the aim of wiring was to simplify  fault finding and any repairs.
 
 Square or rectangular ducting with removable covers is acceptable  but round conduit with saddle clips is ugly, I reject them, round conduits, every time.

[Peter Fitness]

I agree with Sparkey's original post concerning shoddy wiring in otherwise well made boats. I went to the trouble of building a pusher tug for use as a rescue vessel at our club lake. On the first day I took it to the lake I made 4 rescues, all of which were due to faulty electrics, and have made dozens of rescues since that day in December 2007. Most of the electrical faults were traced back to poor connections, and a number were due to flat batteries. Nearly all the problems were preventable.


Peter.

[inertia]

This is the radio box of the little Jelly Bean 4 submersible..got a way to go as yet, I'm waiting on the esc to arrive, then I can finish off tidying and clipping down the stray wires, but it gives you an idea of how I do my wiring.
Rich

Uggett
That doesn't look like a 2G4 receiver to me, yet there's no suppressor caps on that noisy little motor. Take three black stars and go stand in the corner.
DM

[dreadnought72]

That doesn't look like a 2G4 receiver to me...

He did say "submersible". I'd take a star back and let him sit in the corner. 

Andy

[inertia]

They're my black stars and I say who gets them - and how many.  Just because it's called a submersible doesn't mean it's going to submerge. After all, model lifeboats don't save lives and model trawlers seldom catch fish etc etc 

Rich is old enough and ugly enough to know better. I suppose he could try pleading poverty but 0.1uF ceramic caps are 5p each if you know where to buy them. In all seriousness suppressor capacitors should be fitted to all brushed motors. Leaving them off is just asking for more problems than you need. If you can't solder a capacitor across a pair of motor terminals then you're in the wrong hobby - try knitting instead.
DM

[Bob K]

A serious question on motor suppressor capacitors: I always fit one across the motor terminals, but have often seen a 2nd and 3rd between each of the terminals and the motor casing.  Not sure why, or what benefit as there is effectively no "ground" on a plastic or wooden boat in water.  Maybe helping to "RF shield" the casing?

Should we fit one or three ?