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Author Topic: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build  (Read 72050 times)

mk1

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #325 on: March 06, 2017, 12:28:55 AM »

Hi Kim in reply to [not sure what Mk1 has up his sleeve] after I had put these pieces on I realized I had read the picture I had wrong  and they were meant to be flush with the back I will alter them in due course. As for the front end of them this was made square and not rounded as I am hoping that it might help catch and push the water around if it does not I can alter it later.

John
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #326 on: March 06, 2017, 09:45:02 AM »

Thanks John,
That explains that - there is a lot going on around the stern of this Class of lifeboat, I am looking forward to making some of those pieces, including the side hull spray rails. I have the metal and my idea of fixing in my head - next the reality - so might progress this alongside the second grille. Trouble is I belong to the Faversham Military Modelling Group and have purchased some six or so models [including where relevant the etched brass upgrade set] over the past six months or so, but due to the Shannon build have not touched one yet and this Saturday is another monthly meeting! Might have to give over Wednesday, Thursday and Friday to some MMG modelling!
Back to the Shannon, it will be good to see how our different approaches to the 'water-scoop' work, mine will just be for the 120A ESCs.
Today or tomorrow I hope to walk to a local 'plastic' sign writing company to get some Perspex off-cuts for my electrics and servos board.
Regards,
Kim
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colin-stevens

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #327 on: March 06, 2017, 05:24:31 PM »

Oh My, really nice machining.
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grumpy old XXX

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #328 on: March 07, 2017, 01:37:47 AM »

Thanks Colin,
All I have to do now is make another one! However, lessons learnt, so hopefully it will be a little quicker. Today [Monday]....
  • I scribed the lines onto the flat of aluminium and used the 'engineers' blue' to accentuate the markings - without getting too much onto me! It's in the vice at the moment whilst I file the curved end - almost finished.
  • I have also milled the underside with a slope while the metal is thick - last time I did this after I had milled the slots and when I put it in the vice on the milling machine it started to bend / curve upwards, due to lack of material and strength!
I also went to the 'plastic signmaker' on the local Business Park and got this month's bargain, seven pieces of Perspex off-cuts [both 4mm and 6mm thicknesses] for 20!! Well pleased. Behind them in the photo you can see my 1 metre 32nd America's Cup 'Alinghi' yacht [based on a Kyosho SeaWind] and my 1/10th Robbe Smaragd 'Solo Round the World' yacht 'Emerald'. Another month and some quick Winter maintenance should see them on the water again!
C.C
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spongie

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #329 on: March 07, 2017, 05:58:46 AM »

Wish we got a bargain like that.


Just paid 200 for 9 perspex windows!!!
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #330 on: March 09, 2017, 12:01:01 AM »

Yesterday saw me in the workshop for a few hours, so........
  • I finished off the hand filing of the semi-circular stern end of grille number two.
  • Then I committed it to the milling machine, hoping this time not to make the same mistakes as last time......
  • once done I hand fettled the circular ends and the 'knife edge' to each bar.
  • It was good to then use a set of numbered transfer punches I bought some eight years ago, three years after completing my workshop! This was their first 'use in anger'. Using a small engineers' vice I put the original grille on top of the second one and clamped them together, then using the no. 47 I lightly tapped the punch into each hole, thus giving me the very same spacing and position of the first grille - 'simples'!
Derek [down-under], thanks for showing me the tricks of the trade with the 'circles' and 'arrows' - you will see I have now put your tuition to good use!

Tomorrow I will sort today's photos and show the completed grille, positioned, but awaiting the fabrication of the two internal fixing brackets.
C.C.
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #331 on: March 09, 2017, 11:21:59 AM »

Yesterday [Wednesday] spent a few more hours in the workshop, fettling, drilling and machining the second water-jet intake grille. It went well, but I still made an error which I will try and correct today.
  • three shots - one shows the grille and tools, then the upper face of the grille with the transfer punch marks and the other the underside.
  • the next the intake end being marked out and hand filed to shape.
  • the next couple show the clearance holes drilled to accept the 2mm cup head bolts - spot the mistake when I forgot this end was tapering and therefore shallower in depth, so I went straight through!! I will mill a circle inset for a small stainless steel washer and glue in place, hoping it will act in the same manner.
  • a shot of the new Port-side grille in place, but awaiting the underside stern end internal fixing brackets. These might get made this afternoon, but the weather is good and maybe, just maybe I should get out and start cutting the grass before it gets too long! That time of year again.
I might make the first one again at a later stage, but at the moment I would rather try them to see whether they let in enough water for the jets to work at 'full' bore. If not the design will have to be modified - so time and effort would have been wasted!

Canterbury Coxswain
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Delboy1958

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #332 on: March 09, 2017, 12:05:07 PM »

Hi Kim
Love those grills top job sir.

Regards

Derek
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #333 on: March 09, 2017, 01:45:52 PM »

Thanks Derek,
It's not a fast build - compared with some - but I'm enjoying the semi-scratch build approach and creating the answers and items :} . Looking forward to making the spray rails, carriage support bulges on the underside of the hull and also getting inside to make the electrical and servo board from Perspex and the aluminium support uprights to which it will be attached. Hope to have done all of this before we jet off to the Dortmund Intermodellbau Show, which in a month's time will be our fourth and final day, when we fly back in the evening! There are seven of us going, all of whom you know.
It's nice to know you are around and watching.
Kim
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colin-stevens

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #334 on: March 09, 2017, 06:13:24 PM »

Fine job sir!!
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grumpy old XXX

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #335 on: March 11, 2017, 10:54:55 AM »

Colin, many thanks for the compliment!
I was speaking to Andy [MbD] the other day regarding my detailing of the Shannon and my intended use of aluminium and he said his Shannon was being detailed at the moment and sent me three photos to put on this Thread. They are 'dry fitted' at the moment and other items are made, but no photos. They have spurred me on to give the aluminium soldering another go again next week - with the new type from CupAlloys!
At the moment I have cleared 'the Bridge' and am about to have two or three days trying out my new airbrushes and the techniques for painting figures - both marine and military. Off to Faversham Military Modelling Group this afternoon!
C.C.
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derekwarner_decoy

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #336 on: March 11, 2017, 11:04:17 AM »

Sorry Kim........if our Lord wanted aluminium to be soldered, I think he would have blended and made the metal from a totally different alloy and with a higher melting point  O0

Derek
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #337 on: March 11, 2017, 11:10:18 AM »

Like it, Derek!!
Still, there's nothing like a challenge - so long as one succeeds!
Best wishes,
Kim
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Charlie

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #338 on: April 06, 2017, 01:37:48 PM »

Hi Kim,
Hope you are well, and enjoying this lovely weather we are having at the moment. It's probably too nice to spend inside your Workshop i guess! Anyhow, i saw this photo on the Workington RNLI Website, of their new Shannon being lifted out of the water, and knew that you (and any other Shannon builders out there) would find this view of the underside quite useful, since it is not often seen in this way.
Looking forward to the next update :-))
Charlie
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #339 on: April 16, 2017, 11:56:10 AM »

Charlie - many thanks for the photo. I agree, a great shot and helpful to see the whole of the stern underside arrangement of the Shannon.
Your thoughts were almost right, I have just come in from cutting the back grass [again!!] and doing some weeding in my small garden, just as well we downsized on the move to Canterbury. However, the past two months have zipped by, mainly due to a number of visits to an elderly relative I have been looking after in Buckinghamshire. Added to which a group of us have just arrived back [last Sunday evening] from the Intermodellbau 2017 Show in Dortmund [Martin from Macs Moudlings; Andy and Debbie from Models by Design and D.K. Figures; Jeff fom the LBES and St. Albans MES; Alan P. from the LBES and Secretary of the MBA-Dover; Alan T. from the LBES West Mids. Section and myself - a right motley crowd!!]. We met up with four other members from MBA-Dover on the first day. Many 'goodies' were purchased for my furtherance of the Shannon Project and will appear here soon. Likewise my coverage of the Show for MMI is being written at this very moment [having chosen my photos from some 280!] and should appear in two months.
I am attaching a few shots of Alan P's [17-09] flying bridge nut and bolt detail - superb! He enjoyed doing the first ten and then realised he had another 140 to go!! Well worth the effort though.
During my sojourns to Buckinghamshire I 'upset' my right shoulder again, so found it painful to cut [saw] and lift my arm. So I put the Shannon 'down' for a while and started a little work on my 1/72nd scale Severn [on another 'thread' here] and also started to use my airbrush techniques on a 1/10th yachtsman, to later progress onto lifeboat men crew [same colour type and almost size]. This will too appear as a new 'thread' over the next few days. But the Shannon will be back on the front burner this week!
Kim [Canterbury Coxswain]
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #340 on: April 18, 2017, 11:04:54 AM »

What I did leave off from 17-09's flying bridge detail was the actual hexagonal white plastic caps that go over the nut head [this one was broken and on the floor, so was not 'filched'!]. On the actual lifeboats these are sometimes inboard and sometimes the reverse way around and outboard - as here. 17-09 ended up using his new Dremel screwdriver with an adjustable speed. Used as a drill / lathe, to turn the fine styrene rod, and then a small 'jig' so that each was cut off at the same length and more importantly at this small size, squarely at 90 degrees.
I posted this here, just to show that at this level of detail, when scratch building, time needs to be spent, but the end product is well worth the effort and time invested.
Nice one 17-09.
Canterbury Coxswain
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TimpdonG

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #341 on: April 21, 2017, 11:37:53 AM »

Good Morning All,


I thought some of you might be interested in my experiences in getting my Shannon control system up and running. The hull is now complete and painted and the drives have been fitted, and tested.


The problems started with the servo drives to the steering nozzles and reverser. The first set of servos I tried [big digital brutes from Hobby King with no mechanical end stops] went haywire when first connected, wrapping the connecting bowden cables to the jet drives in knots. After a lot of head scratching, I concluded that the power drain on the servos was dragging the 5V supply down and causing the control system to crash.


Several rebuilds of the control panel later, I have now sorted out all the problems and everything is working fine, so here is some advice for those of you who have not got around to the electrics yet, in the hope that you will not have all of the problems I did.


I changed the servos to Tower Pro MG958 from Servo Shop - Very high torque, but controllable provided you get the power supplies right.
I changed the 5V supply to the control system from the BECs to separate 5V, 3A voltage regulators powered directly from the main batteries [Big heatsinks in photo of control panels]. The ESC BECs are now not used.
I fitted brass distribution busbars from the 5V supply [6 mm x 0.5 mm] under the control panel, with large reservoir capacitors across the 5V supply.
All servo power supply wiring [Red and brown wires] is now soldered directly to these busbars, with only the yellow control wire connected to the radio system. I strongly recommend that you do not try and power big servos from their usual servo connectors via the radio receiver. You will get trouble !


The control panel photo shows my layout. Most of the wiring is hidden underneath.


The six circuit boards in the middle are all my own design servo scalers, allowing me to calibrate all of the servo positions, rotation directions and rotation angles independently for each servo and ESC.
Also, the maximum rotation rate of the reverser servos is controlled to limit the maximum servo current [about 0.5 s for full operation, as this servo is subject to particularly heavy loads.
The other two small boards are digital control boards for any lighting I decide to fit at deck level [not yet thought about in detail].
The custom radio receiver on the left will eventually be mounted in the superstructure.
ESCs are 85A models from Hobby King.
Motors are Rotor Star 830KV brushless.
Batteries are 5000 mAh 4S LiPo, protected by big Automotive 50A fuses.


I hope this will help some of you. If anybody needs help with electrical or control problems, just ask.


Regards


GeoffG


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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #342 on: April 21, 2017, 01:47:40 PM »

GeoffG,
Very many thanks for sharing this information and your experiences here on this build. I am sure many of us will read this several times [and maybe take you up on your offer of help!!] and having assimilated the information build it into our various ways forward. As to be expected, from yourself, the work inside the hull is exceptionally neat and well laid out. Might there be a chance of a photo of the underside of the board - if and when it ever comes out? The stern area of the water-jets looks very realistic too, seeing as you are using the commercial KMB Jet28 units - once in the water most of this will be either out of sight or hidden by a white foam of spray!
I shall be looking forward to some photos of its first 'sea trials'.
I'm off to the workshop now to try some aluminum soldering..........................
Keep it coming and likewise anyone else who has progressed onto a build - I know how many of you there are out there.
Kim
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TimpdonG

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #343 on: April 22, 2017, 11:27:25 AM »

Kim,


Thanks for the kind words.
As you requested, here is a photograph of the underside of one of the control boards.
The other is a mirror image.


Not as pretty as the top side, I am afraid, but adequate.
Because my radio system is custom designed, the only radio output is a single serial data stream connected to the "Data" busbar.
This is connected to all of the servo scalers, each of which extracts the relevant data for its own servo or ESC, before scaling it for onward control.


GeoffG
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #344 on: April 22, 2017, 06:17:15 PM »

Many thanks GeoffG,
That completes the 'story' so we have the 'obverse' and 'reverse' of your great handiwork. Thanks for your time in doing this. I look forward to 'studying' this in the next few days - questions will follow, as my 'weakness' is electrics.
Kim
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #345 on: April 22, 2017, 09:44:39 PM »


as my 'weakness' is electrics.
Kim


I think that this is in the realm of Electronics rather than electrics...........but either way I am totally baffled by the whole concept of it all.


good luck gents.


Jim.
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #346 on: April 23, 2017, 07:46:35 AM »


I think that this is in the realm of Electronics rather than electrics...........but either way I am totally baffled by the whole concept of it all.


good luck gents.


Jim.

There is no "electronics" without electrickery  :-))
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #347 on: April 29, 2017, 01:55:58 PM »

Hello all.
I do hope I am not intruding here. Amazing electricals, wish I could do this.
I am just interupting to tell you that I had a customer around yesterday to collect his Shannon from me and during our chat he asked me if I had considered supplying any parts from my kit to people building the MbD Shannon.


Getting my kit finished was the priority so I had not really considered it but now they are done I dont see any reason why I shouldnt as long as doing so doesn't hinder my sales. So if you would like to know more please email me and put 'Shannon Parts' in the subject box and I'll get back to you.
Adrian
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Time remains constant - but on the other hand it seems to have flown by at lightning speed!!
As reported in part earlier, on return from the Dortmund Intermodellbau Show there was the gardening, an injured right shoulder, rehearsals for a large Bach concert in the Cathedral, the ongoing welfare of an elderly relative, MMI magazine articles and RNLI Shannon Launch talks and childrens' water safety engagements to arrange - and now we are in May.
I did, however, get into the workshop to 'progress' my aluminium soldering with the new CupAlloy's flux cored solder. Progress is possibly not quite the right word, but experience has increased. I was using aluminium tube and this time a powerful Weller soldering gun. The first try buckled when I went to neaten it in the lathe and I then used the resultant pieces to try again [hence the shorter length of the stanchion], but forgot this was soft solder - not silver solder - when I came to machine the finish on the milling machine! The middle knuckle twisted and I took it off with pliers. I will progress my proposed method with aluminium rod [I can hear Derek from downunder chuckling from here!] when the order arrives and if that does not work I will move forward with the tried and tested silver soldering of brass rails and stanchions and then spray paint with an Alclad aluminium paint.
Just to pick up on a few points above:
Charlie - meant to say - that lovely photo you posted of the underside of the Shannon does show the exact profile of the bilge keels from underneath and along their bottom edge. Great - another challenge for the future. This does not appear on any of my photos or the RNLI plans, so thanks.
Jim - I was right to start with regarding electrics, as I was talkng about me. I have problems just getting the positive, negative, earth and signal wires correct! I leave the electronics to people like my good friend Alan Bond at Forge Electronics [who once said to me - 'I try things out on you first Kim, because if you can understand it anyone can!!], GeoffG, Dave M. and Iain at Component shop, Turnigy and Sol-Expert. I just join the electronics desired with the wires, but not always successfully as a Robbie Roxxy 120Amp ESC in my workshop will testify to. 'Red to red and black to black'  I said three times as I connected the 120 item to my system, then turned on and in a micro second a little brown spot appeared - good bye 120! I looked and there was red to black and black to red - how or why? I just did not concentrate, an expensive lesson that most of us have done at some time in our electrical wiring, or maybe not. However, GeoffG's electronics are incredible.
Kinmel - I agree.

Another Post will follow with some helpful Shannon photos for all.

Kim
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A very good friend sent me these a couple of days ago, gleaned from the Internet. I am Posting them here to help those building their Shannon's, as there is a wealth of information contained in them to help with the understanding of what is 'behind, underneath and attached to what'. As they say on the other side of the 'Pond' - 'Enjoy'.
C.C.
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