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Author Topic: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel  (Read 28994 times)

Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #25 on: September 09, 2016, 03:09:22 PM »

Jumping forward somewhat, I have begun to make up the daughter craft slipway and hanger, this is because once assembled all of this will need to be epoxied into place to make sure no water can get into the hull from the stern. This will have working hangar doors that slide open and closed, so I am working on that system as I build, the mechanics are easy, but I have opted for micro linear stepper motors to ensure they open and close the same distance EVERY time!

Next up will be to fit the prop shafts, the rudders make the drives for the tunnel thrusters and then they can be epoxied into place as well.

So still a lot of work to do before I can get the hull primered......

Capt Podge

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #26 on: September 09, 2016, 09:52:43 PM »

I think I understand what you're getting at ref the hangar door for the daughter craft slipway - I'm guessing, by the photos, that the door itself will be between the inner bulkhead and the middle one with the 2 "legs" ?

Regards,

Ray.
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Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #27 on: September 10, 2016, 07:20:59 AM »

That's correct Ray. None of it shown here is finished yet, that's why it looks haphazard. Its a sort of model in a model when its complete. When the doors are in and the electronics are attached, it will need to be bonded in permanently to make it all watertight at the back end.

Capt Podge

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #28 on: September 10, 2016, 09:57:19 PM »

Nice one. Forward planning seems to be the key - especially with such a complicated model. :-))

Regards,

Ray.
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ballastanksian

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #29 on: September 11, 2016, 05:57:28 PM »

I like the idea of the sandwich bulkhead Brian. With plenty of resin to keep the insides dry, it should all be snug and water tight even with the doors open. I take it that a rolling system will be built onto the slope once the bay has been epoxied in?
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Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #30 on: September 11, 2016, 07:53:59 PM »

I like the idea of the sandwich bulkhead Brian. With plenty of resin to keep the insides dry, it should all be snug and water tight even with the doors open. I take it that a rolling system will be built onto the slope once the bay has been epoxied in?

Yes indeed sir, I am scouring the cheap chinese shops for matchbox size cars for the wheels - I need 48 of them :} the trick is going to be how to motorise them all :o

Capt Podge

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #31 on: September 12, 2016, 09:47:48 PM »

Yes indeed sir, I am scouring the cheap chinese shops for matchbox size cars for the wheels - I need 48 of them :} the trick is going to be how to motorise them all :o

Motorise just one set, pulley the remainder, one axle to the next set etc... - just a thought Brian, I've not tried anything like that myself. %)

Regards,

Ray.
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ballastanksian

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #32 on: September 12, 2016, 09:52:22 PM »

Hm. How about a length of studding acting on a small cog on each as a worm drive? Mind you, if you could get loads of those toy cars with the inertia mechanism then the axles the back wheels come on have the small cog on them already. With some modification moving the cog and perhaps using new axles then this would remove having to source so many separate parts. Back in the day these toys were as common as grass, they may still be?

I saw Ray's suggestion after I posted and think his idea might be easier!
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Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #33 on: September 13, 2016, 07:56:43 AM »

Here's the difficulty, they are set as groups of 4 wheels on a pivoting body, so in reality they not only revolve but also the whole unit pivots to match the shape of the daughtercraft hull.

Now I don't have to model this part in (the pivot) I could set them to the shape, in fact further thought, only the first couple actually would need to revolve (the lower ones) to help pull the daughterboat up the ramp.

hama

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #34 on: September 13, 2016, 11:44:24 AM »

They look like LEGO-wheels!
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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #35 on: September 13, 2016, 08:16:51 PM »

Snap! The hubs and mounts are even the same sort of grey that LEGO use!! In that case, pop onto the Lego website and see if you can order some wheel and block sets mind you, using the website is an ordeal:O(

The following codes may give you the mechanisms you need:

15mm x 6mm tyre code 87414 18 pence each.

Bearing element code 6157 18 pence each

Center with technic cross splined shaft (!!!!!) code 4624 8 pence each. These used as hubs for the drive wheels means you can use cross splined shafts and gears etc to drive them. Infact, if you use technic lego components, you can make the whole system.

Pick a brick sees to have one single non disclosed item out of its hundreds of brick designs in their store so do not know how they expect potential customers to buy bits from them  >>:-(

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Capt Podge

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #36 on: September 13, 2016, 11:16:51 PM »

Thanks for putting up that photo Brian, your dilemma can now be appreciated more readily.

Ian's idea sounds feasible  O0

Also, notice the water in the well ? I'm guessing some of that would come from the hull of the daughter boat itself - lots of other detail in that photo as well - nice one. :-))

Regards,

Ray.
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Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #37 on: September 14, 2016, 12:08:52 PM »

I like the idea of the lego wheels Ian, but they are too large, scaled down these wheels are only 6-7mm in diameter, 13inch in real life smaller than a standard car wheel, that's why I have been looking to matchbox size cars to rob them of their wheels.

Always happy to add a photo if it helps explain stuff Ray ;)

Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #38 on: September 20, 2016, 03:18:16 PM »

OK I've been bumbling along because I'm at a stage where I can't add part D because its waiting for part F and part A if you see what I mean.

So I have built the doors for the stern hangar out of plasticard but can't go any further because they are waiting part D ( linear stepper motors) The ramp can't go in because it is waiting for part F (the stern tunnel thrusters) and they can't be finished because I haven't got the parts to build them yet. See what I mean  %%

So the doors were built along with a couple of watertight doors for the inside and two oval access hatches. The doors are near enough a copy of the real ones, I have had to alter the angle of the sliding mechanism to take into account the limited space inside.

Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #39 on: September 20, 2016, 03:20:27 PM »

So this is the story so far...

watertight doors in place and the sliding stern doors primered and held in place for now until I can permanently attach them with the stepper motors.

Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #40 on: October 04, 2016, 10:43:03 AM »

OK time for a very short update as I have just got back from the UK.

Before we returned I received in the post some grilles. These are actually marketed to the 1/35th scale modeller as drainage grilles of airfield dioramas. However they are just perfect as covers for the water intakes which on the real ship are for engine cooling, but here I will use them as the water pickup for the fire fighting monitors.

Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #41 on: October 04, 2016, 11:07:57 AM »

So here are some of the electronic goodies I returned with, aside that is from normal building materials like plasticard and rod, the two prop shafts, some propellors etc etc.

I'll work around clockwise from top left.

1. This I have shown before, this is a lighting circuit bought from a builder in Germany, it should have gone in the POSH Venture, but I held it back for this model. It allows the simulation of real lighting via led's, ie, fluorescent tubes, metal halide and sodium. So you can have a flickering light as though a fluoro tube was failing, the flare of a sodium light and then the slow dim and finally out of metal halide types.

2 Two linear stepper motors and next to them their drivers, these are to open and close the stern hangar doors.

3 Motor shield for the arduino, this is to connect various low consumption motors to the Arduino's, less than 1 amp draw on each motor.

4 Seen before, this is an Arduino Uno, this will carry out all on board functions like operating the hangar doors, lowering the fast rescue rib, radar etc etc.

5 Obviously a 4 relay board to connect to the Uno for higher power demands

6 Across the bottom and seen previously, the 5 brushless motors to drive the tunnel and azimuth thrusters along with micro computer fans to help circulate air around them.

7 Eight relay board same as the one above

8 Arduino Mega, this will be doing all the motor control work of the brushless motors.

9 In the centre, most of these electronics are needed to allow this unit to function, this is the Inertial Movement Unit. It detects yaw, sway, forward, backward and up down movement from a set point. This is the heart of the dynamic positioning system I hope to get working, and the Arduino Mega is the brain that interprets the data it sends and turns them into motor signals for the brushless motors to keep the boat 'on station'

 What I haven't shown here are the 5 esc's for the brushless motors and also the main drive units. I'm undecided whether to go full brushless for everything or use the brushed motors I had already bought - time will tell :}

So that is all for now. Hopefully I'll have the prop shaft in and the tunnel thrusters built for the next update, if so the hull will also be in paint!

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #42 on: October 04, 2016, 06:51:01 PM »

Looking good, nice to see another such nice project being brought to the maximum by using Arduino, to me, if done properly, it makes the boat so much more alive.

I'll be following this one.

Greetings Josse
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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #43 on: October 04, 2016, 08:15:13 PM »

Like Josses' model, this looks to be an opus project. The sliding doors look good though I am worried about using plastic for large moving parts because if the plastic is not glued properly any sticking of the slide or nudge from another model could break bits off.

A friend of mine is building a 1:48th scale LST and it has plastic front doors. These look excellent and he has really got the angles and shapes right, but I am not sure it would survive a collision especially a few years down the line when the glue and plastic gets brittle. I would fabricate out of brass with soldered joints. Then like the real thing it will be stronger. I respect that it might warp if hit, but a brass fabrication should be stronger.

Call me a worry wart! The rear compartment already shows great promise.
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Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #44 on: October 05, 2016, 10:16:18 AM »

Cheers Josse I have been watching your developments on various forums for a number of years.

Ian I see your concerns, but the doors are inset by 20mm so no problem of being 'rammed' I made them originally in 2mm ply but then I couldn't add the formwork that is on view due to the overall thickness. I had considered brass sheet and profiles but weight came into the occasion, the stepper motors are only rated to 5 grams so would never move a brass door.

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #45 on: October 05, 2016, 10:19:41 AM »

Nice bit of engineering Brain, then you need to make tough decisions.
I'm having some of my own as well currently, I'll show them in my own build log.

Greetings Josse
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Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #46 on: October 21, 2016, 04:53:30 PM »

Procrastination is the name of the game, but needs must and this week I have finally stopped fiddling with everything else and knuckled down to actually making the tunnel thrusters, mainly because I can't do anymore to the hull until they are fitted!

So you saw the photo etch grilles last time, these are them fitted into the hull as water intakes. On the inside I have 'glassed in a collector plate and take off tube for connecting up the fi fi pumps. I have also added the bilge keels, made from some 5mm ply cut to shape then attached from the inside with screws and epoxied to the outside, then a fine coat of car body filler to flair them in - still need final shaping which will be done during prep for paint.

Also at this stage I have added the rubber 'bumpers' to each side, made from drive belt, I ordered a 1.2 metre length from ebay, imagine my surprise when I received what appeared to be a car fan belt! Again this was cut to length and epoxied to the hull, then 3mm strips of plasticard were used to surround them to give the appearance of the steel sleeve they slide into, this was superglued to the rubber strip, lots of searching the internet I couldn't find a better glue to stick rubber to plastic!

Brian60

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #47 on: October 21, 2016, 05:04:47 PM »

I finished the stern loading dock for the daughterboat. This has caused some problems for me, over the course of 10 days I changed the wheel axles and then the carriers a total of four times. The supplied axles were too thin, so used brass pins cut down to size, but then they wouldn't stay in the carriers even using superglue. So ended up making a axle by gluing two wheels on each pin and then allowing the axle to freewheel in the carriers. Then I had to remake those as the original sizing of 5mm was just too wide, I re-made them in 3mm U section. What I haven't been able to accomplish is to make the pivot end to end. This was because the supports became too weak I felt they would break off in use.

I also had to rethink the retrieval of the daughterboat, as the finished bogeys were really fragile and of course space limited I couldn't  add the belt drive I thought would work. However I have another method in mind and will follow up at a later date.

So these photo's are of the finished ramp on the bench and roughly in place in the hull, it has its first coat of paint, to be finished when the hull is up for painting. It can't be glassed in just yet as I still need to add the tunnel thrusters underneath it and of course the rudders to each side of it.

So this week see's me at the bench making tunnel thrusters, I already have mk I and mk II ready for consignment to the parts bin, ready for mk III :}

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #48 on: October 21, 2016, 10:20:04 PM »

It's great to see you are making progress Brian. Obviously, the access to the daughter boat dock will be limited, I just hope you don't forget any part(s) before the ship goes together.
Will the dock be illuminated on the completed model?...it's just a thought :-)

Regards,

Ray.
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ballastanksian

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Re: Stril Barents- a Multi role vessel
« Reply #49 on: October 22, 2016, 12:59:24 PM »

That is a lot of model cars without wheels! Pop them on Ebay for wargamers as they are always looking for old car models to make barricades and distopian scenes with.
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