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[red181]

I agree with Mortimer, its 30 mins for me, so no big deal,  I enjoyed the show, as I could get to the models and traders easily, and maybe that itself is a problem as numbers where noticeably down.


If I were a trader, and had travelled some distance, with poss overnight accommodation, expense of fuel and giving up a weekend, I feel sorry for them working on such tight profit margins with maybe low sales.


I asked about a night sail, nobody replied so assumed its wasn't on, don't know if it happened or not?


 Don't miss the tea bar upstairs on the way to some of the club displays if you intend to go Sunday, I missed this as there were no signs, and ended up at the expensive burger van (the show organisers did well to get this in lieu of the closed boat museum)


Well done organisers, but the museum being closed for refurbishment might have affected the general public numbers. Its a great show, in possible the best venue for model boats, if you are considering going, its only £3.50 so by far the cheapest, support the show, or it might disappear

[davidjt]

in response to mortimore, there were some trucks on display in the conference centre, but sadley when I got there at 10.00 am, there were no signs to tell you they were there so I nearly missed them. but after talking to a gentleman  who took me on the lift to view the models  on top floor.  the clubs decided to put some signs  up for there self, I enjoyed it my self  got some things I wanted from traders. also I find that a lot of the traders are now going into retirement and selling there business  our closeing down barrys lettering , Metcalf mouldings, the list goes on. those that survive do more trade on the internet with less overheads. so don't bother with shows that's the way life is today.


david

[Bowwave]

Hi All    Just to say a huge big thank you  to the organisers , Museum staff and  to all I met during my  visit  for your support and encouragement  as this was one of my first outings  since  my hospitalisation .  Just   to stop and chat { which I like doing]   did me the power of  good   perhaps more than any medication  and I even had time to  do some camera work .   I can now  list Ellesmere Port show and all of the shows  as  positively therapeutic . For me it was it was much more than a visit to a show it was  just  wonderful being there .
Dave Wooley aka Bowwave   

[BFSMP]

Hi All    Just to say a huge big thank you  to the organisers , Museum staff and  to all I met during my  visit  for your support and encouragement  as this was one of my first outings  since  my hospitalisation .  Just   to stop and chat { which I like doing]   did me the power of  good   perhaps more than any medication  and I even had time to  do some camera work .   I can now  list Ellesmere Port show and all of the shows  as  positively therapeutic . For me it was it was much more than a visit to a show it was  just  wonderful being there .
Dave Wooley aka Bowwave

I do believe that model boats is a great therapy, Mr Wooley, and from reading the posts on here seems to have been a great show.
Well done to all involved.


Jim.

[big_bri]

it was a five hour drive down and four back up again for me and my son, would I do it again? of coarse I would.
I bought a few of bits and pieces from the traders, looked on at the fabulous workmanship of my fellow modellers and also met up with some really good friends, for my son and I, it was a great day out and we look forward to many many more.

Well done guys

[Mortimer]

Interesting points and clear to see that there are many benefits of the shows from promoting the hobby to providing a forum of open discussion to old and new modellers alike as well as catching up face to face with friends.  The fact remains though that numbers continue to decline and the traders and organisers margins are being squeezed to the point whereby they may soon have to question the value of attending and organising shows. 

If we remain apathetic and refuse to recognise the facts that these shows may soon prove to be not worthwhile putting on we will all loose out.  I genuinely believe we need to do something to stop the decline in numbers and, if we don't, I believe we will soon see the end of them.  It is easy to slide back into the attitude that "That's the way it is nowadays" but I really don't think many of us want it to become a purely internet based hobby.  If I was a trader nowadays I think I would have already stopped doing shows so I have a huge respect for the ones that continue to do them but there have to be limits and, as has been said, the ones that retire are not being replaced.

I hope I am wrong but if we remain blinkered to what is going on year by year and continue to ignore the decline and do nothing I suspect that shows will slowly cease to happen.

[Colin Bishop]

I'm afraid that the ongoing decline in the number of model boaters is a fact and wishing it were otherwise is not going to alter that. The average age of purchasers of the model boating magazines is now late 60s. Many people who were formerly keen model boaters have either fallen off the perch or have literally scaled down their modelling activities. They are not being replaced by younger people or by those returning to the hobby in retirement in the same numbers as those dropping out at the older end. Those youngsters who are not wrapped up in gaming or virtual reality hobbies will find flying drones rather more exciting than building or running boats especially as waters suitable for model boating are becoming fewer in number. And who can blame them?

The older you get the less inclined you are to undertake long drives on today's clogged motorways and so the footfall at shows will continue to decline whether we like it or not. The club scene is in better shape, especially North of Watford and it has been suggested that traders at club events is a way forward in the future although this does mean you will not get the same concentration of traders as you would at the current established shows.

There are a lot of activities which have fallen by the wayside as time marches on, there is no reason to suppose that model boating in the form we have been used to will not be one of them.

Colin

[timbo]

Been my self today, noticeable reduction in clubs and visitors, weather didn't help, on the upside there were some bargains in the basement, picked up a decent transmitter/receiver, there was also a full Aziz kit going for £150.

[march show]

hi all just got home still drying out lol. I just want to thank all involved with putting on this show, and all who took the time to support it from the Runcorn lads and my clubs lads well old fellas now lo,l to the museum staff that are in between a rock and a b*stard like me moaning at them, and I did a lot of it. As a few of you have said numbers are down, club wise we had the same as last year 1 extra and one lost, which we may or may not get back. if I had my way I would put more in but we don't have the manpower to do all this now never mind if I add more to my list. I will be having a meeting with the museum to see what can be improved, but things that are out of our control will have to wait like the cafe. They got the refit money and had to use it there and then and the rear loading area is down for re surfacing so that's a massive plus. the fact remains 2 of us now run the show and the rest of the club average age the wrong side of 75, along with the invaluable Runcorn lads set it up.
anyhows hope those that took the time to support had a good time I know even tho its a lot to take on each year it has been a pleasure to hopefully give the hobby a place to restock and catch up with old friends

Steve epmbc 

[Kim]

I get a little bored of the doomed opinion…

We have History, we have technology, we have many traders and manufacturers and if we do it right we have a great future.
Where we fail sometimes is embracing the new and passing on our passion… only today I witnessed a potential sub 25 year old’s enthusiasm and enquiry to join a club being given second place to finishing a cigarette…

Now I’m  aware I could be seen as bias but my excitement for this hobby has been with me since I can remember, what I don’t remember is a time to be more excited about our hobby, access to the excitement, accuracy and economy of cutting edge technology has never been better..

If we think the hobby is dead then we should have a re think and recognise that the younger generation can give hope and that our own views are what might be holding things back.

I see the magazines have not given much space to the new and probably more appealing technology that this hobby has and can benefit from.

I see a dead end until we all recognise the future of the hobbies possibilities, embrace them and pass on.

Roll on Coalville Show

[Colin Bishop]

I hear what you say Kim and I don't mean to be negative - just realistic. The reality is that the popularity of model boating is just a shadow of what it was in the 1970s and 1980s. I don't suppose for one moment that the hobby will disappear and those participating will indeed embrace modern technology as they have always done as exemplified by the application of Arduino to the operation of warship gun turrets. But the problem is basically one of dwindling numbers to support both the trade and shows and I don't see that situation changing anytime soon if ever.

The magazines can only publish what people are prepared to write. They don't employ staff writers and if the exponents of the new technologies are not willing to share their knowledge by submitting articles then these new developments will not appear in print!

To take up a hobby, people have to be interested in it and motivated. When I was a youngster modelling was what just about all boys did as a hobby and there was a model shop in every town. These days the younger generation have other and, to them, more exciting options to explore and that is what they do. Some will always be attracted by modelmaking but it is no longer a mainstream hobby in the way it once was. Now it is all about downsizing and the best ways to manage this. One option being explored is widening the scope of model boat shows to embrace other areas of model making which is fine by me if it enables those shows to continue.

Colin

[Kim]

Colin in no way was my comment meant to be personal towards you.

The magazines can only publish what people are prepared to write. They don't employ staff writers and if the exponents of the new technologies are not willing to share their knowledge by submitting articles then these new developments will not appear in print!


Colin

Phone numbers on my website ... if you want to chat
Regards
Kim

[jarvo]

To the organisers, thank you!!! without your efforts it would not happen.  Colin, your last line, i think you are right, Stavros, got the Blackpool show back on its feet by sharing the show space with the trucks and tanks, this has to be the way to go, as you say we are getting old and there is only a trickle of new blood coming in.


Possibly for  Ellesmere, a tank and truck area for demos outside might be a chance to open with the Canal trust. Footfall means money to them as well.


The big traders are with the drones and aircraft, there is a lot of interaction with equipment, radio's, servos etc. we aren't dead, we just need an update to modern thinking. Stop looking down, look forwards!!!


Once again, thanks to the organising team, especially the poor s..ds in the carpark who were still cheerful if wet as i left, with out you we have nothing


Mark

[Colin Bishop]

Kim, I didn't for one moment take your comments personally. I was just giving my own views on the subject. In my position I do see some facts and figures that are not generally available and I think we do need to adapt to a situation where model boater numbers are declining and are likely to continue to do so for a while yet.

When I attend shows I often feel that I am one of the younger ones there and I turn 69 next month! Many of the modellers I grew up with have effectively retired from the hobby now or are no longer with us. Back in the 70s & 80s I used to drive all over the country to regattas and shows but that no longer appeals the way it used to. Been there, done that and more interested in seeing the world while I still can these days.

Colin

[Kim]

Colin,
I can remember when one club could full a substantial hall with static model boats, a pool. Coloring in books for kids to buy, featuring the models they had seen , postcards of the models with histories on the reverse, badges etc for sale to boost club funds.


that was in the early eighties. (Model Steamer Club, Glasgow ...if anyone is interested)




As for current shows, i see in many of the shows a lack of use of advertising and spark to catch interest, not all can be blamed on cash.


Obviously there are shows bucking the trend !


Ellmesmere were obviously affected by the temporary closure of the venue but power to the guys that did step up and make it happen!
Shows what can be achieved even when not all things are in your favour! An inspiration to all!


Regards,
Kim

[red181]

very interesting thread, to hear different opinions, as the forum is meant to be, sorry its sort of been hijacked.


On 19th march, at haydock (same venue as our boat show) I will be attending the LMA (Large Model Association) one day static show, its planes. It will be interesting to compare the attendance, and average age. The problem is (having sons myself) some of the kids don't want to build, they want to just turn up and play, thats why the plane boys have such a great market in artf  (almost ready to fly) models. These are either foamie, or balsa etc, and require very little work. To the kids they are exciting, fast, and ready to go. Our ready to sail boats can look sometimes like toys, and don't catch the imagination and excitement of the kids. I stood with a friend in the traders hall, and we spent time chatting about the average age. I felt young at 54. The problem is as wee get older, and retirement age creeps in, in most cases the disposable income drops quickly, also, all the older guys (I say this with admiration) are talented carpenters, electricians, engineers etc, where is the replacement talent coming from who can buy a sheet of ply, and craft it into a model scale boat?


A model train, car, tank, truck and a plane all look great sitting on a table at a show, but a boat on the other hand always looks far better on the water. Ellesmere is the only show I know of that has all day sailing, with our poor weather we are not able to show off the models to their best, which is a shame

[Kim]

very interesting thread, to hear different opinions, as the forum is meant to be, sorry its sort of been hijacked.

 I felt young at 54. The problem is as wee get older, and retirement age creeps in, in most cases the disposable income drops quickly, also, all the older guys (I say this with admiration) are talented carpenters, electricians, engineers etc, where is the replacement talent coming from who can buy a sheet of ply, and craft it into a model scale boat?  

No disrespect to what has gone before, I can make a plug plank on frame, bread and butter etc.... , thanks to my Dad, but i'd almost always now cad draw and cnc machine it.

That's pretty much my previous point, there are far more interesting ways of making a model boat nowadays. Perhaps we are slipping behind modern teaching in some of our views lol
Regards,
Kim

[mike_victoriabc]

We'd like to see photos if possible - another site perhaps?
Bit far to go bur perhaps one day. My wife's father was light keeper at Hilbre Lighthouse in late 40's.

[davidjt]

here is a few more photos I took on Saturday. still say it was a good show
may there be many more to come.


david

[Mortimer]

The points raised all seem to support what I originally said.  What I am suggesting though is rather than sit back and fall into the trap of a self congratulatory stance we look objectively at what the trends have been over the last few years and be a bit more proactive in preparing ourselves for it.  I don't buy into this "Well that's the way it is nowadays", it only is if we are complacent and allow it to be.

We have had some very good suggestions over the last few posts but we need to look into them seriously and act on them to prevent shows such as this ceasing to exist.  We all know the situation without referring to numbers and it is very plain to see that the time and expense that traders and clubs are putting into these events are not making it worth thier while attending.  Consequently they will stop doing so and everyone will loose out.

As has been mentioned it might be worthwhile to look outside our hobby with the obvious starting points being trucks, cars, tanks and aircraft etc.  New building techniques such as CAD etc, can we get hold of someone who can do demonstrations on a stand?  What about approaching a 3D printer manufacturer or owner and trying to get them to do demonstrations?  As regards attracting the youngsters what about buying a handfull of cheap plastic 'toy' RC boats and allocate them a play area on the water somewhere?

I am convinced that in this forum are the ideas that can be collected and incorporated to help breathe a fresh life into these shows and help to ensure thier future rather than sit back and quote that this is they way things are nowadays and watch them slip away.  I realise we are never going to get back to the glory days of the 70's and the 80's but that doesn't justify sitting back and watching the numbers slowly decline and claiming that we couldn't do anything about it. I'm not comparing with that far back, that really isn't relevent, I'm looking at the last 10 to 15 years.

Just to be sure this is not seen as being negative I am not saying that it wasn't a good show, but I am saying that the trends are there for us all to see and we should react to them.  I'm sure it  would be interesting to see how many trade stands, clubs and public there were in attendance 10 years ago.

[yewgarth]

Anyway... a bit of good news if anyone's interested, the Bring and Buy broke all records! Thanks to Ray for his help and Yorky for providing the coffee

[Colin Bishop]

I am all for anything that will improve matters but it's not essentially about supporting shows but boosting the hobby really. The idea of providing boats for youngsters to use on pools at shows is one that has been used on a number of occasions and has certainly been quite popular. The trouble is that, having kindled the spark of interest, what next? The obvious one is to direct the person to their local club, if there is one and if it does cater for young people. Not always the case these days.

Sorry to go back to the 70s and 80s but in those days model boating was a significant hobby area with a good national infrastructure. Many, if not most clubs were affiliated to the MPBA which represented the hobby nationally, organised regional and national championships for the various branches, Scale, Fast Electrics, Hydros etc. and sent teams to represent the UK at international events such as Naviga. The hobby was largely run by people of working age, often young and with bags of enthusiasm and energy. So a youngster would have the support and opportunity to participate in the hobby at various levels and even represent their country if they were really keen and had the ability. All this infrastructure has pretty much disappeared now and I don't see it coming back.

I took a break from the hobby during the 1990s to pursue other interests including owning a small full sized boat. When I left, numbers were on a bit of a downward slope but the basic structure of the hobby was still in place. Ten years later when I began to get involved again the situation was almost unrecognisable. On the scale side, which has always had the big numbers, interest in competitions had practically collapsed and it seemed that boaters were content to sail around in circles at their local clubs rather than tackle the interesting and challenging steering courses which were a feature of the MPBA competitions. That did remove a lot of the interest for me on the sailing side although I still enjoy building.

These days it is hard to escape the impression that the hobby is now largely populated by grandads, albeit that many of them are the older versions of the keen youngsters of the 70s etc. Me for example! That essential middle level age group needed to sustain the vitality of the hobby is a shadow of its former self - and of course they are the ones with the kids!

Colin

[carlmt]

Just a quick response from me..........

Linkspan Models would most certainly have been at this show had it not been for the deadline of getting our next kit prototype ready for the Dortmund show.  I have always wanted to attend the Ellesmere Port show and it is not a case of attendance being on the basis of 'making it pay'.  For us, it is primarily getting out there and showing what we are doing.

Our kits try and embrace the modern methods in that the kit is designed on CAD, the superstructures are all cut on a laser cutter and the fittings are 95% printed 3D items. 

I hope that the shows continue as this is the main way that kit manufacturers (especially) can get their wares in front of those that might be interested for close scrutiny.  A picture on a website just doesn't substitute for seeing the model in the flesh (so to speak).  Fine for bits and bobs like batteries etc.

[adamD98]

Morning all,


 Just to add that me, my better half and my Dad attended again this year, and although we cannot argue that numbers have indeed dwindled we still enjoyed it despite the poor weather conditions.


 I cannot personally speak for yesteryear, I am 30 and if I am not mistaken I am quite possibly one of the youngest who enjoys this hobby (I know of one or two others who are the same age or a tad younger). I would very much like to see more people my age and younger come into the hobby, but the attraction of games consoles and drones etc. as has been mentioned is something which seems to appeal more unfortunately.


 I might not have the experience behind me and I might not attend every meeting and event going (Work and family comes first) but I would hate to see shows like this completely disappear into the history books. So, I am prepared to take on suggestions from more experienced modellers and enthusiasts such as yourselves (I didn't say older, except for saying I didn't say older  ) as to what I can do as a younger modeller to bring these things back into the spotlight.


 Thank you Steve and to all of the folks who put on a great weekend, despite the set backs and challenges presented. We will always endeavour to attend this one. 

[BFSMP]

The points raised all seem to support what I originally said.  What I am suggesting though is rather than sit back and fall into the trap of a self congratulatory stance we look objectively at what the trends have been over the last few years and be a bit more proactive in preparing ourselves for it.  I don't buy into this "Well that's the way it is nowadays", it only is if we are complacent and allow it to be.

We have had some very good suggestions over the last few posts but we need to look into them seriously and act on them to prevent shows such as this ceasing to exist.  We all know the situation without referring to numbers and it is very plain to see that the time and expense that traders and clubs are putting into these events are not making it worth thier while attending.  Consequently they will stop doing so and everyone will loose out.

As has been mentioned it might be worthwhile to look outside our hobby with the obvious starting points being trucks, cars, tanks and aircraft etc.  New building techniques such as CAD etc, can we get hold of someone who can do demonstrations on a stand?  What about approaching a 3D printer manufacturer or owner and trying to get them to do demonstrations?  As regards attracting the youngsters what about buying a handfull of cheap plastic 'toy' RC boats and allocate them a play area on the water somewhere?

I am convinced that in this forum are the ideas that can be collected and incorporated to help breathe a fresh life into these shows and help to ensure thier future rather than sit back and quote that this is they way things are nowadays and watch them slip away.  I realise we are never going to get back to the glory days of the 70's and the 80's but that doesn't justify sitting back and watching the numbers slowly decline and claiming that we couldn't do anything about it. I'm not comparing with that far back, that really isn't relevent, I'm looking at the last 10 to 15 years.

Just to be sure this is not seen as being negative I am not saying that it wasn't a good show, but I am saying that the trends are there for us all to see and we should react to them.  I'm sure it  would be interesting to see how many trade stands, clubs and public there were in attendance 10 years ago.

I seem to remember reading all this rhetoric doom and gloom after the Blackpool show, and other shows last year.


do we have to go through the same old same old, every time a show comes and goes.


this forum is fast being filled with posts on whinging.


Mortimer, if you feel so strongly about this, then attach yourself to one of the clubs associated with a show and give your time and input, and I am sure that they would greet you with open arms, but I for one am a little fed up with doom and gloom on here.


Jim.