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Author Topic: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?  (Read 36958 times)

Martin (Admin)

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Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« on: September 21, 2007, 02:32:20 pm »


OK let have a straw pole:

Do you ( in general ) Scratch or Kit build & why?

And what were your most recent builds, rebuids, restorations, repairs etc?


( I suppose there are other types of model boat building not
correctly covered by those generalizations so tell us what you do?! )
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HS93 (RIP)

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2007, 02:39:38 pm »

I have done both BUT the kits are built the way I want to build them, so are very heavily modded,But are bought knowing that is what is going to happen .If I had to just do one it would be SCRATCH.  Last builds RAF Crash Tender    HS Tug  Steam tug Perseverance (fiberglass hulls scratch rest)

Peter
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DickyD

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2007, 02:49:16 pm »

My PM asked what were my last 3 builds. Why only 2 votes ? :-\
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gribeauval

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2007, 02:49:36 pm »

If you look at my last posting in the lifeboats section you may guess that I mainly scratchbuild but have been known to kit build on occasions.  

Current build:   1/3rd Scale Mersey (scratch build)

Current build: Graupner 9m Germnan Lifeboat (Kit build)

Last build: 1/12th 37' Oakley (scratch build)

Last Build 1/12th  47' Tyne Class lifeboat with working boathouse and slipway (scratch build)

On many occasions I will use commercial parts but also enjoy solving the problems of producing the fittings I need from totally unrelated items e.g Mersey exhausts from pipe fittings and ashtrays.

To me the enjoyment of model boat building are the technical challenges I set myself. Once a boat does what I intended it to do I loose interest in the thing and dispose of it( I either sell them or destroy them) ready for a new challenge. I am not a great 'lets sail the boat' person, a couple of times is enough for me to get bored.
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Gunslinger

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2007, 02:55:29 pm »

Have done both in my time but in general I prefer to build from a kit and then add my own touches. To be absolutely fair, the usual reason why I "do my own thing" is where I just "know" that the way the kit designer has done is wrong and I can improve on it.  :angel: Last scratch build was a Perkasa, one just finished was Trent Lifeboat (HEAVILY modded) and next project is steam launch (Lake Windemere style) which I'm going to fit out with some fairly exotic woods (Deck and Wheelhouse, etc), this mainly so that I can mount it in the front room and admire it  ::). Fat chance of being allowed to do that but I can always dream.
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cbr900

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2007, 03:01:25 pm »

Last three builds are as follows:

1 Rebuild of Seabex One

2 Scratch build Riva Aquarama

3 Kit build Amsterdam since Modified to what I wanted.

I agree with Richard you should be able to select more than two items as I have just done four......... ;D


Roy
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Ghost in the shell

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2007, 03:06:57 pm »

sydney star and najade,  both kits,

modified to suit my personal tastes and sailing requirements
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dougal99

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2007, 03:09:28 pm »

Of the 9 boats I have built to date (in this millennium when I took up the hobby again) 6 have been scratch from commercial plans, 1 using a heavily modded commercial hull and built from an A5 line drawing plus 2 Kits. So I suppose I prefer scratch building as it give me more scope to do my thing. I started my first kit several years ago and wanting to make a good job of it I have taken my time, building other boats in the meantime. This I think was a mistake as I have lost continuity, and have made several mistakes during the construction process which have taken extra time correct.

Having said all that, I think kits can give you a good chance of building a good looking model (at my skill level) without too much research and problem solving.

Must get back to my long kit build...  ???

My last 3 builds were a scratch yacht (Wee Nip), Sea Queen kit and a freighter based on the Brockley Combe using a commercial hull.

Doug
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chingdevil

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2007, 03:17:04 pm »

I have scratch built two springer tugs plus I am scratch building a 1:24th pusher tug and I am working on a Mountfleet Sealight puffer, which I am modifying. The next one I want to build, will also be scratch built. I get more enjoyment from the scratch building than from the Mountfleet kit, due to the problems I had with it.

Brian
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White Ensign

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2007, 03:21:37 pm »

Just done one kit- the Mohawk by Deans. Never again!  :o
Scratchbuilt: HMS Lord Nelson, HMS Velox, HMS P49 (all foresaid scale 1:100), CMB 103MT scale 1:24, wooden Sailyacht scale 1:30
In progress: Russian G-5 Torpedoboat (scratch) scale 1:20

Why I prefer scratch? The reason may make you laugh. When I started boating I don`t have had the money to buy a kit or the fittings. And so I have learned it to make it all on my own. Once tasted blood I never stopped as then I was not very satisfied with either scale or appearance of ready bought items. And the boats I wanted to do, there had been no hulls available. It was ever my intention not be any mainstream, I ever wanted to make somtehing different or not seen before.
So scratch is the only answer!  ::)

Jörg
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Doc

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2007, 03:28:25 pm »

I would rather build from a kit, then modify that kit if I feel like it.  Why?  'Cuz I'm lazy!  'They' have already gone to the trouble of finding all that stuff and usually tell me how it should be assembled.  Could I have done all that?  In most cases, I think so, but at a huge amount of more effort (remember that lazy part).  Also depends on my 'mind-set' at the time.  If 'they' have gone to all that trouble, why should I make it seem so unnecessary?  I'm such a 'caring' person, you know (good excuse, huh!).
 - 'Doc
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Captain Anonymous

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2007, 03:30:17 pm »

My last 10 builds have been scratch built,

these are the last 3 builds.

1/96 scale USS NORTH CAROLINA

1/96 scale HMS IRON DUKE.

1/72 scale USS MOFFETT  DD362
 
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Now building USCGC DUANE 1/72 SCALE.

Many years ago I built a bugsia 3 , went to a show and there was 7 at the same show, so for me it was building my own, and
have what I wanted not what they had in the shop at the time, and one could spread the money out over a period, not in one lump.
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gingyer

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2007, 03:39:47 pm »

The majority of my builds are from GRP hulls then either purchase or build the fittings.
the way I choose a project is to look about for an unusual type or something that catches my imagination
then start to do a bit of research and see who does what in the way of parts.

At the moment I have in various stages of construction or completed;

1/72nd HMS Iron Duke (Type23 frigate) (GRP Hull)
1/48th USS Jaccard (WW2 Destroyer Escort) (GRP hull)
1/48th Gato submarine (GRP Hull)
1/72nd Type 12 frigate (GRP Hulll)
Andrea Gail  (Billings Kit)
1/96th HMS Warspite (scratch)

plus around 5 that I did not build so will not list
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KitS

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2007, 03:45:58 pm »

With my name I ought to build kits mainly but...........  ;D

Last complete model was a vacform MiniMumm, but there's a lot more work in it than a kit.

Previously I've done a semi-scale Offshore Class 2 outboard racer on an Astec Fibreglass hull (no idea what it was called, I bought it so long ago even Alan can't remember it.........)

And the one before that WAS a kit, a Lesro Atlantic 21.

In build now is a push tug based on an MMM Gerhard hull, SS Atlantic Conveyor using Metcalf Mouldings hull and George Turner's K3 Bluebird. Most of these will be long build items, at least until April when I retire. (193 days to go......  ;) )
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Kit

Bunkerbarge

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #14 on: September 21, 2007, 03:59:19 pm »

I think it is with this categorising that we sometimes get a bit too wrapped up in pre-judging.  There are some people who put far more time into a kit than some do into a scratchbuilt ship so I think each and every model should be looked at on it's own merits.

I think the attitude of "If you use purchased fittings then it is not scratchbuilt" is too elitist for me and getting away from what we are supposed to be doing, which is simply enjoying building a model from whatever materials suits our own individual tastes to achieve the enjoyment we want.  

How far do you take the scratchbuilt principle?  If it is propelled by a purchased, off the shelf, motor does it cease to be scratchbuilt?  Does any scratchbuilder make thier own motors?  Why should using bought fittings then not make it a scratchbuild?

My current builds are the Ben Ain steamer, which would be classified as a modified kit, a rowing boat, which is a combination of a bought hull with the mechanics made by myself and recently a Revel U-Boat converted for R/C use.  Not what you would call a prolific builder but when this has to be squeezed into a leave schedule you very quickly run out of time.  The Ben Ain has three years in her so far and I reckon at least another two to go and I certainly do on average a couple of hours each day when I am on leave but that isn't a lot really.  

I also have a couple of Kingston Hulls and a pile of engines and boilers that are going to be steam launches one day, one with a variable pitch propeller, and I have ambitions on an Engles Sub one day.

Then of course I am always modifying, uprating, repairing, experimenting etc. the existing fleet which always seems to take up a bit of time as well!
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Guy Bagley

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #15 on: September 21, 2007, 04:00:53 pm »

 i have done  both scratch and kit builds over the years......
but i suppose my  general preference is to build from a GRP hull and then scratch build the rest !- the benefits are you rarely get another model similar at a show !

my latest 3 builds are

thames police boat, built on a kingston mouldings hull-
a windermere open launch built on a kingston mouldings hull
and a 1:24 clyde puffer built on a GRP hull bought at a modellers sale

also under way is the refit of the biber from colin Stevens and refit of my 15 yr old 1:12th arun lifeboat ( scratchbuilt)

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Tug Man

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #16 on: September 21, 2007, 04:09:22 pm »

My first boat was a scratch build and I prefer to build that way. Unfortunately I do not have any local hobby shops and that has changed the way I now build. I build kits now and modify them to my liking.
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malcolmfrary

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2007, 04:13:06 pm »

I've done both, at least in RC I started with scratch because, like Jörg, I was strapped for cash at the time, and later I started modifying kits after the kids started leaving home, and I spotted kits that I liked, and I was too lazy to scratch build.
Any scratch build has to have limits as to whether it really is scratch or not - how many scratch builders make their own handrail stanchions, make their own prop shafts, wind their own motors, make their own magnets etc? ???  Does buying a GRP hull and plan, then buying a bucket full of fittings to plant on it count as scratch?  It can be a fuzzy line, but where does one start and the other end? :-\
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pompebled

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2007, 04:21:58 pm »

Like most boaters here, I do both.

The scratch builds are more a long term project, as I am in no hurry to get them finished (and lack of time of course)

The GRP hulls I build are mostly fast electrics and when things go wrong, I build/assemble up to two three boats a season.

Recent builds:

- A-1 Purple Light refit; from a RTR to a mono 1 racer.

- Scratchbuilt bottom half for a RC-duck, as a prop in an open air play.

- Thunder Tiger Voyager sailyacht, a rather modified kit build.

- Italian M.A.S. a 110cm stepped (MTB) hull, scratch, stretching over a decade now.

Regards, Jan.
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shark bait

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2007, 04:25:49 pm »

would like to learn my craft by following instructions first and modifiying as i grow in confidence. ideally i would love to scratch build in the future.

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toesupwa

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #20 on: September 21, 2007, 04:28:38 pm »

I think there is more sattisfaction scrathch building.. you can stand back and say "I built that"..

Besides, there are not the kits out there that i want to build... and the 'full' kits that are interesting are FAR too expensive..

Current build: Angels Gate tug in her wartime colours.

Last Build 1: A Springer in an American Navy pusher style

Last Build 2: A Springer based on a Voith Tug ('Scout') based out of San Pedro (LA) Harbour
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Faraday's Cage

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #21 on: September 21, 2007, 04:31:38 pm »

At the end of the day it all boils down to whatever you personally prefer.

Like most, I've built both and had satisfaction from completing both. I find scratch built models more time consuming and probably more demanding of my capabilities.

If I had to decide which, then I'd have to go for kit built but with modification to get things working on the model.
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IainM

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #22 on: September 21, 2007, 04:38:19 pm »

Like many others I have done both scratch and scratch build on a commercial hull.
Most of my recent builds have been based on a job lot of GRP hulls dating from the early 1980's (just shows how fast my building is  ;D)

I guess tha main reason for scratch building in either case is a combination of cost and the challenge of making something from the ground up that looks acceptable plus an interest in historical research.

My last three builds have been:
Fully scratch built plank on frame Royal Barge (1938 vintage plans) 1:16
GRP hull scratch Vosper ASRL 1:32
GRP Brave Class FPB 1:35
 ..... and I've just started a GRP Lady Wooes tug

I confess I've never tried a full kit build although have been tempted on many occasions.  Maybe one day .......

IainM
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #23 on: September 21, 2007, 04:47:46 pm »

Hi Dicky,
It's just a straw pole for generalization down the pub hence why I asked about our last builds.

Martin.
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madrob

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #24 on: September 21, 2007, 04:58:10 pm »

Many moons ago i built a kit, wasnt what i expected, was a lot of money and nothing seemed to fit where it was supposed to, dam thing wouldnt even sit on water level without a hell of a lot of grinding of the grp hull.(the grp was nearly half a inch thick one side, like tissue paper on other)
Then i built 2 scratchbuilds from plans, prinz eugen and a crash tender, both burnt by my ex when i walked out. I think i got more of a sence of achievment with the scratchbuilds.
I would consider buying another kit if i was a bit richer  ;D

currently scratchbuilding HMS fife a county class destroyer before she was molested by exocet.
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