Topic: Orion Mouldings (Read 21227 times)

orion mouldings · « **on:** May 06, 2009, 12:12:29 am »

.Anth

I would like to bring to your attention one or two issues which have been...well to say the least nothing short of a medievil witch hunt over the past few years.
For sometime now i have been producing fibreglass model boat hulls decks wheelhouses to every corner of the world.. and try to provide a good service to the model maker which can be managed by every budget,however some people believe me to be a copier of other people's hard work,i would like to take this opportunity and put the record straight once and for all i do not copy other companies production hulls.
I have been accused of copying nearly every commercial hull on the market.. been taken to court... had items removed from ebay ..its all totally wrong i have never been told by ebay to remove any item for any reason.. never been to court or had solicitors letters... claimed by one certain person who seems to gain his strengths sitting behind his keyboard posting on forums such as this one, you know who you are and i would advise you to remove all your libelous statements from these forums as i plan to take legal action against them and you,you have no evidence what so ever of your libelous claims deformation of character is very serious.

When i first started making model boat hulls in fibreglass i new nothing of the potential, let alone the hard work needed to create a production mould for commercial hulls, until i made a plank on frame pattern and mould for the Northumberland Coble.
When i completed that mould hundreds of hours had been spent not many people realize the work needed to produce a production hull it's not just a plank on frame hull and mould.. to do it correctly you need to make your pattern in timber finished to a high standard then the pattern is moulded, from this mould a master is then produeced in fibreglass the master is then finished to professional standards then a production mould can be made from this master copy.. i have masters for all my hulls which i produce.

All i would like to say as a foot note is.. i have never copied commercial hulls, all the hulls on my website are genuine model hulls, patterns made by me and associates some moulds have been bought in and rigorously checked for copyright any moulds which could infringe these copyright laws have been destroyed.

Thank you for taking the time to read this post.

andyn · « **Reply #1 on:** May 06, 2009, 02:36:06 pm »

Quote from: orion mouldings on May 06, 2009, 12:12:29 am

claimed by one certain person who seems to gain his strengths sitting behind his keyboard posting on forums such as this one, you know who you are and i would advise you to remove all your libelous statements from these forums as i plan to take legal action against them and you,you have no evidence what so ever of your libelous claims deformation of character is very serious.

Legally, due to the disclaimers on forums, you do not have a leg to stand on. And if this person is claiming such things, you can appear against the ruling on ebay.

Also, I see no point in producing a model that many other people make. While you may not be copying another persons hard work, you are undercutting their hard work if you sell your hulls for less. Havn't we got enough Huntsmans etc already?

Philipsparker · « **Reply #2 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:23:47 pm »

Am I missing something ? Who are you ?

Is there a website we can go to to see the range of hulls ? Even an eBay shop ? If not, how about an eBay username ?

Phil

SteamboatPhil · « **Reply #3 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:40:08 pm »

Or at least a list of hull designs you do

andyn · « **Reply #4 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:48:29 pm »

Search google for orion mouldings. Some nice hulls but they're nearly all freelance...

Martin (Admin) · « **Reply #5 on:** May 06, 2009, 04:51:19 pm »

http://www.wearboats.com/

Eddy Matthews · « **Reply #6 on:** May 06, 2009, 05:41:21 pm »

Just wanted to add that I've bought a hull off Orion Mouldings, and the chap was a delight to deal with - Very quick to reply to any questions, and he kept me informed of the progress at every step.... The hull is good quality and I would have no hesitation in buying from him again.

I have absolutely no connection with Orion Mouldings, other than as a very happy customer.

Regards
Eddy

SteamboatPhil · « **Reply #7 on:** May 06, 2009, 05:59:29 pm »

Oohhhh some nice hulls there

Oh no thinking again-----------

John C · « **Reply #8 on:** May 06, 2009, 06:55:25 pm »

At last..............thank you Phil!!
This guy Anth has had some really bad press on here, and I for one don't think it was warranted. I don't know what the other guy has to beef about, but I haven't seen any of his work copied or for sale.
I haven't bought direct from Anth (ebay or otherwise) but he does produce hulls for another model boat manufacturer, and has done for a while from whom I have bought stuff.
I also think that Anth shouldn't have needed to go to these lengths, after all this is a cottage industry which should be supported by all involved, for the sake of us who don't have the know how to mould fibreglass our selves.
Unless someone wants to provide proof of wrong doing, which I suspect if there was any would have been done long ago, can this be put to bed now.

John C

andygh · « **Reply #9 on:** May 06, 2009, 09:48:05 pm »

Quote

Legally, due to the disclaimers on forums, you do not have a leg to stand on.

Not true, message boards/forums have been closed down for this kind of thing, they can also be forced to reveal the identity of individual posters which has lead in some cases to libel charges.

On the other hand I have purchased one of Anths' hulls & can recommend it, don't know the guy, never met him, just a happy customer

sentry · « **Reply #10 on:** May 06, 2009, 11:34:40 pm »

I too have spoken to Anth on the phone a few times and have always found him to be a very helpful and nice person to deal with and am waiting for his Holmsider to go on sale. And how can the man be undercutting others hard work if he makes a good product which he sell's at a price he want to surerly it's up to him how cheap he sell's his hard work good luck to the guy i say.
Regards,
Sentry.

portside II · « **Reply #11 on:** May 06, 2009, 11:59:35 pm »

Some realy nice hulls there , big but nice .
daz

keef666 · « **Reply #12 on:** May 07, 2009, 08:30:53 am »

The far east firms do a lot of copying of western items, from t.v's , cars, and toys, which includes model boats, hell they copy off japan, as for boats they get away with it by changing the scale or size, but in the end if theres no market for it they wouldn't do it, i for one am glad theres another mould maker out there, true it takes a lot of man hours to make the mould, but i think some of the firms charge way over the top for some of their hulls, but thats me, or i've i opened another can of worms!

wideawake · « **Reply #13 on:** May 07, 2009, 11:59:55 am »

Quote from: portside II on May 06, 2009, 11:59:35 pm

Some realy nice hulls there , big but nice .
daz

Big IS nice!

Guy - whose fingers are too clumsy for anything less than 1/24 scale

Colin Bishop · « **Reply #14 on:** May 07, 2009, 12:15:47 pm »

But little is exquisite!

DickyD · « **Reply #15 on:** May 07, 2009, 01:03:01 pm »

I knew it, size does matter.

TCC · « **Reply #16 on:** May 07, 2009, 01:44:03 pm »

I know of a professional model maker who uses made-made products to make a hull master, in fact, 100 hrs to him would probably mean 95 unpaid hours!

So Anth, ditch the wood and get with foam* products you can shape quickly with a rasp file or surform... throw in a thin plyframe every so often to work against and when you have the shape (minus a few mm for the final coat of filler) give it a coat of filler a few milli thick and sand it smooth.

When smooth and correct size and shape, bang you hull detail on.

* foam? try the stuff that florists use to fill out plant displays called 'Oasis', or just be inventive.

I don't know about the 'copying' accusations and all mention of wearboats has been removed from mayhem... but I'd think 'the curse of a thousand small minded modellors' be upon the quilty. ;-)

bigH · « **Reply #17 on:** May 07, 2009, 04:15:29 pm »

I have bought a number of hulls from this guy and have been proud to give him full five star ratings on every one of them.
His delivery has always been quick and the goods well wrapped, he has always been ready to answer any questions that I may
have had. I was very suprised to see some of remarks made about him, but I am glad that I took no notice and at my club all
the members have given only praise for the quality of the hulls that I have shown them.
As to the pricing of his goods, it is of NO concern or business of any other person except himself as to what he charges, GET A LIFE
and leave the man to get on with his........
bigH.

das boot · « **Reply #18 on:** May 07, 2009, 07:41:43 pm »

Well said, Big H...I haven't as yet ordered my Victor hull from Anth, but to me he seems a really nice guy, he's always answered every email I've sent him pretty near instantly, his hulls look good to me(well, the Victor sub does)and his prices are excellent I reckon.
And he's offered me a really good deal on my hull when I do get around to ordering it, which these days is a great help to my wallet.

Keep up the good work Anth, ignore all the moans and groans....

Rich

nemesis · « **Reply #19 on:** May 07, 2009, 08:27:35 pm »

If you have the Master Plug you have nothing to worry about because you can produce it in a court
of Law. It does make your detracters look silly if it goes that far. There was a big court case a few
years ago in Germany when a spurious hull maker was sued for ripping other makers work. He was
asked to produce all his work & plugs. He could not & he was DONE.
Cheers Nemesis

andygh · « **Reply #20 on:** May 07, 2009, 08:38:16 pm »

Quote

While you may not be copying another persons hard work, you are undercutting their hard work

What does that mean?

bosun · « **Reply #21 on:** May 07, 2009, 08:57:05 pm »

Hy Guy's
I have been following this thread with interest, over the last few years I have purchased 4 hulls from this gent. The first one I completed as a fishing boat, the hull was so good I bought three more different types for future projects, I had no problems at all. My question is this,,, if someone is going to copy other peoples hulls ect, why on earth would they advertise nationally, and why have a website, and why attend shows for all the modelling world to see that they are copying other peoples hulls, ( ok I know thats 3) it really does'nt make sense to me
I think whoever is saying these things should come forward, put up or shut up, if it is proven, Orion Mouldings go out of business, if not, I think certain people owe the guy an apology.
Bosun

sentry · « **Reply #22 on:** May 07, 2009, 11:44:58 pm »

I hope Anth has made someone look very silly, It takes year's to build up a bussness and only a few wrong words could wreck it, I think Anth has upset someone coz he make's a quality product at a not ripped off price.
Regards,
Sentry.

Malcolm Reade · « **Reply #23 on:** May 08, 2009, 08:45:20 am »

Quote from: nemesis on May 07, 2009, 08:27:35 pm

If you have the Master Plug you have nothing to worry about because you can produce it in a court
of Law. It does make your detracters look silly if it goes that far. There was a big court case a few
years ago in Germany when a spurious hull maker was sued for ripping other makers work. He was
asked to produce all his work & plugs. He could not & he was DONE.
Cheers Nemesis

This doesn't quite stack up...The first thing that a copier would have to do before he could replicate somebody else's work would be to make a new plug from somebody else's hull - it might actually be better quality than the original 'master' plug. It also might be extremely difficult to prove which of the two plugs was the original if both were placed side by side. Either way, both could, (in theory), be produced in court.

Court cases about copying other peoples products in the model industry aren't normally a practicable proposition. Court cases are expensive, win or lose, and because of the low volumes of product involved these costs would soak up the profits of any genuine manufacturer for a long time.

As a manufacturer, we are aware of some traders in the business who use our own fittings as 'masters' to produce cheap and nasty resin or (worse still) really horrible white metal copies from time to time. We generally smile through gritted teeth and look upon it as 'imitation being the sincerest form of flattery'. (The pick-axe handles are sometimes used afterwards

).

Our own moulds are hand made from hard drawn brass, and the truth is that a) most people aren't clever enough to copy them, and b) even if they did manage to copy them, the potential sales volumes are so low these days that it wouldn't be worthwhile.

Nonetheless, copying products must necessarily damage our sales and it is a completely reprehensible way of doing business.

Malc

maninthestreet · « **Reply #24 on:** May 08, 2009, 02:18:25 pm »

Quote

Also, I see no point in producing a model that many other people make. While you may not be copying another persons hard work, you are undercutting their hard work if you sell your hulls for less. Havn't we got enough Huntsmans etc already?

What an absurd comment - does the term 'healthy competition' mean anything to you?

News:

Author Topic: Orion Mouldings (Read 21227 times)

orion mouldings

andyn

Philipsparker

andyn

Eddy Matthews

John C

andygh

sentry

keef666

wideawake

TCC

bigH

das boot

andygh

sentry

Malcolm Reade