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Author Topic: Hello newbie here...  (Read 10963 times)

DickyD

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #25 on: April 06, 2012, 11:20:59 pm »

That is the problem, you might as well be speaking French. I have no idea what these systems are or how they work. Some links for some shops that people buy from here would maybe help. There are no local shops here, the nearest model shop here is on the WWW which is very sad.

If you put your location on your profile we might know where "here" is.
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wartsilaone

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #26 on: April 06, 2012, 11:29:52 pm »

Give him a chance Richard, you were once a newbie too.

minardifans, If you have questions do not hesitate to ask.

Ali
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minardifans

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #27 on: April 06, 2012, 11:31:19 pm »

I am currently based in the port town of Holyhead. Hence the feel to model something local and something that might niot be around for much longer. I was very sad to see the HSS sat there all winter because it was not cost effective to run the poor soul.
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wartsilaone

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #28 on: April 06, 2012, 11:34:04 pm »

You didn't fancy doing the Ulysses then?

Ali
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Stavros

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #29 on: April 06, 2012, 11:34:15 pm »

Correction there are local ish shops to you

Hobby exchange in Greenfield
Hobby corner in Wrexsam
Steve webb Models in Frodsham all within travelling distance to you

I agree nothing on Anglesey at all why not go to some of the shows There is a BIG one in Coalville on the 22nd of April and also you have got the Mayhem event in June,get hold of Model Boat magazine and marine modeller international for more info and also calender of events on here.

Pm me with your tel no if you want as I am only in Bethesda and don't bite
Dave
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DickyD

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #30 on: April 06, 2012, 11:50:36 pm »


Pm me with your tel no if you want as I am only in Bethesda and don't bite
Dave

New wife nicked your teeth Dave ? 
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dodgy geezer

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #31 on: April 07, 2012, 12:48:24 am »

That is the problem, you might as well be speaking French. I have no idea what these systems are or how they work. Some links for some shops that people buy from here would maybe help. There are no local shops here, the nearest model shop here is on the WWW which is very sad.

Let's try a basic introduction - sorry if it's too simple. I will provide prices which are wild guesses, but might give you a bit of a feel for the costs...

You can either buy a 'ready-to-run' boat, which will come with everything (though sometimes you have to buy batteries separately), or make one.

If you make one it's usually a good idea to start with a kit, which provides materials (often a shaped hull) and instructions. It usually won't have a motor or Radio Control set, though it might have the propeller, propshaft and rudder.

If you are not using a kit, you could build from a plan, though this is not considered a good idea for a total novice who may not understand it. If you have a fairly clear idea of what shape you want to make and how to go about it, I would recommend drawing a plan anyway - it helps a lot to see where things will go....

Moving onto the 'bits' to go inside, you will start with a motor (or more than one, perhaps, if you are thinking about multiple props). Let us assume you want an electric motor - by far the most common type used nowadays.

Modern motors are either brushed (traditional) or brushless (powerful, fast, and borrowed from the flying fraternity!). For a ferry, you will probably want a brushed motor. There are all sorts, but you will find a common naming system based on numbers is often used - a 540 or a 700. See here for more info.

 http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/Common/Electrics/How%20Fast.htm

If you need to buy a propellor or rudder, your local shop should provide. If not, here are a couple of well-known reputable model boat websites which sell lots of stuff:

http://www.westbourne-model.co.uk/

http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/

Expect to pay about £20 for a prop, propshaft and rudder, and perhaps £15 for a motor. Ask about matching the right sizes together. You will also need a connector to join the motor to the propshaft...

To control the motor and rudder you will need a radio control. These come as a Transmitter and receiver (called a 'combo' or a Tx/Rx) and then some servos - one for each function you want to control. To control a motor you use a special 'servo' called an Electronic Speed Controller (ESC). There are different sizes of ESC for different motors, and brushless motors need a special type. You can get servos from £2 to £20, and ESCs for about £20-£50. Ask on here for specific advice when you come to buy a motor/esc combination..

Finally, you will want some batteries. You will want them to be rechargeable, so you will need an appropriate charger. There are several different battery types, you will probably want either NiMh or a 'gell cell', which is a lead-acid chemistry like your car, but completely sealed. Lithium Polymer batteries can provide a lot of power in a very light package, but need a special charger, care in handling, and are mainly for fast boats, so you're probably not interested in them. Expect to pay about £20-£30 for some batteries and a charger. You will probably want to run on 6-12v, depending on the motor...

Now let's think about the Radio. First, the frequency. All radio control models used to work on the 27Mhz band. Several spot frequencies were allocated in this band, referred to by a colour code, and radios had to be on 'different colours' if two or more were to be operated together. You achieved this by looking at little flags on other peoples aerials and then plugging in a crystal of a 'different colour' into your Tx and Rx.

Then more frequencies were allocated - 35Mhz for aeroplanes only, and 40Mhz for cars and boats. Again, these are crystal controlled, so you needed a set of crystals with each set.

Finally, the computer Wi-Fi band started to be used for radio control. This is 2.4Ghz, and can be easily recognised by the very short aerial needed. These sets automatically connect to their chosen Rxs, and don't need crystals changing. That's a major advantage, so many people are going to them. They also don't suffer from interference. I would recommend using 2.4Ghz, but you could pick 27Mhz or 40Mhz if you really wanted to...

50 years ago, radio sets used to be very expensive things. The major manufactures, such as Futaba, still cost a lot - say, £150 for a typical combo. For that you get a very nice bit of kit. But recently, Chinese manufacturers have been making dirt-cheap 2.4Ghz sets using the common cheap computer wi-fi electronics parts. These, as I have said, can be bought down to about £20. These combos are often fine, but one problem is that at these prices, things like instruction manuals and quality control are not provided. The very cheap combos are wonderful value for money for someone who knows what he's doing - as a starter you are probably better advised to get advice and buy from a local shop, or the local club. You can get simple systems with only two functions, which are ok for a simple model (motor speed and rudder), but most people seem to end up with the four function systems that the flyers use. A lot of people in your position get a Planet 2.4Ghz 5-function radio at about £50...

Hope this helps a bit. Plan what you want to do, take it in stages, and we are always here to help...
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tt1

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #32 on: April 07, 2012, 01:50:24 am »

Hello minardifans and welcome to the Mayhem - sometimes literally, most of the time friendly and very helpful  O0 (10 out of 10 dg  :-))) stick with it minardifans - you'd be surprised how many will try to help you get there. Keep posting.

                        Regards, Tony.
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Tug Fanatic

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #33 on: April 07, 2012, 08:57:13 am »

Hello miniardifans & welcome.  :-))

I don't know how experienced a modeller you are but the ferry model that you have suggested is not really what I would call a beginners model. The hull shape is complex & you would be designing it yourself with no guarantee as to what it would look like when you have finished. My guess is that you would also want it to go fast - because the real ferry does - which makes the design trickier. It would also need to be twin engined for the catamaran design. This is a lot to take on for a first model.

I know that it is important that both you & your son like the finished model but it would be easier if you could negotiate a model based on a plan or a kit - and preferably one that you have seen completed and talked to someone who has built one about the difficulties. My guess is that for most commercial models that you might choose there will be someone here who has built, or is a clubmate of someone who has built, an example.

I come from model aircraft where beginners all seem to want to learn to fly with a Spitfire. These are never beginners models & guarantee failure. I am concerned that your ferry might fall into the same category. For a first model success is the most important outcome.
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dodgy geezer

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #34 on: April 07, 2012, 12:52:02 pm »

TF speaks wise words. I also started with flying, and it was axiomatic that beginners either wanted to start with a Spitfire, or a 12ft Lancaster with retracts, moving turrets and a functioning bomb bay. Starting with something simpler makes success more likely, and a kit is ideal....

The other thing you need for a boat is a lake. Do you have one readily available? Are there restrictions on its use? That can also drive the kind of boat you are able to build...
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Stavros

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #35 on: April 07, 2012, 02:35:03 pm »

I know for a fact there is a local Club right on his door step it is i the Breakwater park yes essentially it is a fishing pond BUT the club are allowed to sail on it on a sunday.Not had anything to do with this club personally BUT they do exhibit in some of the local shows,There is allways the lads at LLanberis,or even Colwyn Bay so there are waters within 500yds of the Port of Holyhead and beyond.
One thing Holyhead has is a wealth of fantastic modelers who will if contacted help and share their wealth of Knowledge,Les Jones is truly a fantastic modeler and his work is awnsipring,You also Have Derek he sells stuff on ebay as Boatman wales,he lives on the way to the port.As I have stated before contact me and Ill help


Dave
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Mad_Mike

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #36 on: April 07, 2012, 04:16:13 pm »

minardifans, I personally started designing my own boats and still do it now. I cant get a real true to life result of anything (yet) but can make a functioning model. I was advised many years ago that desiging and building my own boat was a bad idea and would do better with a kit, considering i couldnt afford a kit i didnt start building boats till i was an adult, still not being able to afford a kit i designed and scratch built my own. Ive now built 14 boats and only one was a purchased plan. My advice is to draw out your boat first and think about methods of getting the shape. Youl need plenty of coffee or tea or fags or whatever ya habbit is. Start making a small practice model out of cereal box card to see if it works. The bigger the boat you make the larger the components you will need to make it operational and this then puts the build price up. If it was me id build the 90cm boat to keep the build costs down then if it goes TU then you wont have wasted stupid amounts of money and your misus wont be saying told ya so :-))
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Netleyned

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #37 on: April 07, 2012, 04:27:29 pm »

I can endorse Dave's mention of Derek (Boatman Wales)
He sold me the bits and pieces for a springer.
Very good value for money.

Ned
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wartsilaone

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #38 on: April 07, 2012, 06:36:42 pm »

Hi minardifans,

Don't let anyone put you off if you are sure that you can complete your model, I had the same thing when I started.

However we don't want you to make a costly mistake and come away with a bad model boating experience. You will no doubt have many questions so don't be afraid or too proud to ask.

 May I echo what Mad Mike said and suggest building a small version first, this could become your son's model when you build the full size version.

Looking into the design of the HSS, it seems you will have to start thinking about the type of propulsion you are going to use very early on in the build. There are water jet drives available but whatever you choose the drive units will have to be built into the hull as you build it.

Something to think about eh!

Ali 
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minardifans

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #39 on: April 07, 2012, 08:54:21 pm »

I hear what people are saying and I agree, it would be silly to build something so big and get it wrong. I haven't really started anything yet apart from drawings, working out scales etc.

So I have decided to build a basic small boat just to try out my abilities and work out wiring/motors etc. Given that I'm working with plastic I was thinking of trying something rather square and really basic, maybe something like a WW2 D-day landing craft or just a squarish speed boat.

We have loads of old RC cars that still work knocking about so I might butcher one of those for motors/servos/speed controllers just to see how it works, if I can get it to float properly etc.
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minardifans

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #40 on: April 07, 2012, 09:59:08 pm »



dave

Love it, that looks fantastic!  :-)

If you have some plans for it, links to pics of your build etc that would be very informative and much appreciated. What scale did you build it to?
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Stavros

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #41 on: April 07, 2012, 10:34:02 pm »

See Reply 21 it was not built by myself

Pm me

Dave
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andrewh

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #42 on: April 08, 2012, 06:56:09 am »

Minardifans

First the material you are being given is almost certainly foamed PVC.  If you look at a section of the thicker sheet does it look like two skins with something less dense between?
Very suitable for building boats with!  My Thames barge, Kitty is skinned with it because I was given a large amount.  It goes under lots of trade names, one of which is Foamex,

It glues with the right solvent glues, epoxy, PU, cyano, etc and cuts like styrene

If you fancy a landing craft made in sheet material I have an ancient free plan from Model Boats  - which was originally made in sheet aluminium - it might provide some ideas

If you are familiar with r/c cars then you have most of the components and knowledge to make a boat and enjoy it

andrew
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Welsh_Druid

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Re: Hello newbie here...
« Reply #43 on: April 08, 2012, 08:54:26 am »

Love it, that looks fantastic!  :-)

If you have some plans for it, links to pics of your build etc that would be very informative and much appreciated. What scale did you build it to?

http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=22748.msg223965#msg223965

Have a day out one Sunday  and come to the lake at Llanberis. It isn't far from Holyhead, (less distance than some of us travel to sail at Llanberis).

You will be able to see several types of boats and talk to the builders. Much better than just reading descriptions of how to do it.

If you let me know when you are coming I will make sure the HSS is there that day.

Sundays from about 9-30 am

Don B.
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