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Author Topic: battery help !!!  (Read 4421 times)

Dan2010

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battery help !!!
« on: April 06, 2013, 10:29:23 pm »

hi all, im currently build a mini loyal and im using a MFA385 motor, can anyone tell me the best battery to use. kinda stumped atm, not sure weather to go for lipo or NI-MH, am i right in thinking the lipos are for racing boats ?
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Mad_Mike

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2013, 10:42:19 pm »

you can use either but lipos need a low voltage cut off which most brushed motor esc's do not have. To get an idea of the beneficiaries, if you were to have a 3000mah 7.2v nimh and a 3000mah 7.4v lipo, the lipo would significantly smaller and yet be able to handle much higher work loads than the nimh. The advantages to nimh is they much simpler to charge and less susceptible to user error.
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Dan2010

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2013, 10:45:36 pm »

thanks mad mike, ill look into the lipos :D
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Mad_Mike

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2013, 10:51:10 pm »

the low voltage cut off is important factor as this stops lipos over discharging. I over discharged one the other day i have no idea how it happened but none the less it needed to be disposed of as it was scrap.  You can buy low voltage alarms which plugs onto the balance lead of the lipo battery, this is a sounder which alerts you that to bring the boats in and change the battery. Theres plenty on the net about this lipo stuff.
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essex2visuvesi

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2013, 08:05:51 am »


This is the sort of thing you need, better than relying on the low voltage cutout as its not much fun wading out to rescue ones boat!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/7-4V-11-1V-RC-Lipo-Battery-low-voltage-Alarm-Indicator-NEW-Free-shipping-/221164302333?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item337e6b6ffd


*no connection with seller etc etc... other lipo alarms are available


In my opinion one should always be using something like this when using lipos.  When using larger capacity multi cell packs a couple of quid on an alarm compared to a replacement battery pack is a real no brainer
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inertia

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2013, 10:08:06 am »

While I can't dispute that a LiPo pack is less than half the weight of the corresponding Sub-C NiMH* pack you must also consider that a 385 motor will use barely 700mA of current under load, so a 2500mAH pack will last three hours or so before it needs recharging. A 6-cell NiMH pack will cost you a tenner, while the LiPo is 70% more expensive and requires a special charger plus a low-voltage monitor/alarm. If the weight isn't crucial then I'd go for the NiMH pack in terms of value for money.
Suit yourself.
Dave M
* but barely any different from a 6-cell AA size 2900 mAH NiMH pack
(Prices based on Component Shop's lists, not some silly Chinese flea market).
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grendel

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2013, 11:01:42 am »

the low voltage cut off is important factor as this stops lipos over discharging. I over discharged one the other day i have no idea how it happened but none the less it needed to be disposed of as it was scrap.  You can buy low voltage alarms which plugs onto the balance lead of the lipo battery, this is a sounder which alerts you that to bring the boats in and change the battery. Theres plenty on the net about this lipo stuff.
you can get a 'dead' lipo back up and running, inside the battery is a switch that cuts the circuit if the voltage drops below a certain point, sometimes they can be flashed from a bigger SLA battery to kick the switch back to 'on' it is a risky procedure as that low voltage switch is there to prevent overheating when charged from too low a voltage. you connect the higher voltage battery for just a second or so at a time until it starts charging on its normal charger. I have used this so far on two mobile phones, a laptop battery two canon camera batteries and on a couple of batteries for my handheld computer (hp ipaq).
the way I see it is if it doesnt work you havent lost anything, so far it has worked ok for me in all cases, some batteries have needed 3 or 4 'flashings' to get them restarted.
I used 6v for 3v batteries and 12v for 5v ones.
this is a risky process and you risk (at the extreme) the cells catching fire, so be aware of this and do it somewhere safe (outdoors) and dont hold me responsible as I have warned you.
I would also say dont try this if there is any physical damage to the battery, if it has swollen or has damage then  it is dead, and doing the above will probably cause it to catch fire. but for batteries that have just been over discharged it should work.
Grendel
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barriew

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2013, 11:54:52 am »

Just had my mini-Loyal Mediator on the lake. With a 6 volt NiMh pack it was way over scale speed and too lite, so if you can get a 7.2 volt NiMh in then you will have more than enough power and some extra weight. Not really worth the extra expense of LiPos and over discharge protection in  this case :-))  I only just managed to squeeze the battery in - I may try with a 6 volt AA pack which I have, but I will need ballast low down to stop it rolling on bobbing around.
Barrie
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malcolmfrary

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2013, 04:28:52 pm »

I wonder what the designer used originally?
I can see the advantage of using a light, compact battery in a tender model, because you get the chance to put ballast where its needed, but this was possibly designed with either a small SLA in mind or a 4 or 5 pack of AA or sub-C cells.
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Mad_Mike

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2013, 05:41:44 pm »

you can get a 'dead' lipo back up and running, inside the battery is a switch that cuts the circuit if the voltage drops below a certain point, sometimes they can be flashed from a bigger SLA battery to kick the switch back to 'on' it is a risky procedure as that low voltage switch is there to prevent overheating when charged from too low a voltage. you connect the higher voltage battery for just a second or so at a time until it starts charging on its normal charger. I have used this so far on two mobile phones, a laptop battery two canon camera batteries and on a couple of batteries for my handheld computer (hp ipaq).
the way I see it is if it doesnt work you havent lost anything, so far it has worked ok for me in all cases, some batteries have needed 3 or 4 'flashings' to get them restarted.
I used 6v for 3v batteries and 12v for 5v ones.
this is a risky process and you risk (at the extreme) the cells catching fire, so be aware of this and do it somewhere safe (outdoors) and dont hold me responsible as I have warned you.
I would also say dont try this if there is any physical damage to the battery, if it has swollen or has damage then  it is dead, and doing the above will probably cause it to catch fire. but for batteries that have just been over discharged it should work.
Grendel
The type used in phones and laptops are lithium iron batteries, the ones used in rc are lithium polymer all though lithium iron are occasionally used but usually for things like the tx. The lipo that i had was 3000mah 2s Turnigy Nanotech, inside there was nothing but 2 cells and the wires coming from the cells to a 4mm bullet connector. Weather there is switches in other brands i do not know but of the lipos ive come accross all of them were just cells and the connecting wires. 
I do know of the switches you are talking about though, i have one in one in my 150mah lipo batteries. They are usually found in these really small single cell lipos. 
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-x-3-7V-150mAh-Li-Po-Battery-Syma-S105G-S108G-S107G-RC-Helicopter-Parts-S107-19-/121077957374?pt=UK_ToysGames_RadioControlled_JN&hash=item1c30cf02fe
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Mad_Mike

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2013, 05:48:14 pm »

This is the sort of thing you need, better than relying on the low voltage cutout as its not much fun wading out to rescue ones boat!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/7-4V-11-1V-RC-Lipo-Battery-low-voltage-Alarm-Indicator-NEW-Free-shipping-/221164302333?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item337e6b6ffd


*no connection with seller etc etc... other lipo alarms are available


In my opinion one should always be using something like this when using lipos.  When using larger capacity multi cell packs a couple of quid on an alarm compared to a replacement battery pack is a real no brainer
Most low voltage cut offs built into the esc go into a soft mode, or a recovery mode if you like. Quite a few brands have the option to have either completely cut off or go into soft mode.
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barriew

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Re: battery help !!!
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2013, 06:13:00 pm »

I wonder what the designer used originally?

Three 2 volt Lead Acid batteries.

Barrie
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