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[hazegry]

well guys as things keep getting better here my boat yard is getting busy. This is the next project its a  New Zealand torpedo boat from 1884. I am building her in 1:12 scale or dollhouse scale.

Shes going to be 5 feet 3 inches long and 7.4 inches wide.  so shes the largest boat I have ever tackled and my first scratch build.

I went to office max and got the plans blown up it was 9 bucks a sheet so I had them run two of them off for me so I can use one to build on. I also had them run 10 copies of the frames off on card stock to use as templates as they were only 17 cents and I figured it would help me transfer the lines over to my wood.

with her being so big how thick would you guys make the keel and frames?
I am also wondering where to put the stringers in on the hull to keep her in line while I plank the hull.

Oh its my first plank on frame model as well I am just going to go slow and take my time.  I figure since its going to be glassed after it wont hurt to much if I make a mistake here or there and have to correct it. better to learn on this than one of M.A.C.K.s woodies I am saving up for.

I haven't forgotten the Bent and it is still my main focus I am just trying to come up with stuff to work on as I wait for things on the bent to dry or parts to come in. I will switch this to my main focus after it and my Helen are done.

I am open to suggestions if anyone has any advice.

Hers some pics of the plans and frames.

[hazegry]

I guess the frames show me how wide to make the keel so that answers that.

[derekwarner]

hazey..........@ 17 cents per sheet  ...an investment would be

1. photocopy the profile view of the frames onto clear acrylic sheeting & do this twice
2. cut the new clear images down the vertical centreline
3. mirror reverse one 1/2 half & clear tape both halves together
4. then photo copy everything again
5. this then for a few $ provides you with truly symmetrical port & stdb profile outlines of the frames
6. saves a lot of heartache 

7. With respect to the frame spacing.......LOA of 63"= 1600 mm....others may disagree, however I prefer to keep the frame spacing equidistant ...so 1600 mm divided by 12 frames  = 130 mm spacing
8. you will need to remember that the greatest change in angular projection is say the 1/3 of the vessel hull at both the bow & the stern
9. the shell plating in your Thornycroft image depicts approx. 24 plate joints which could be considered as frame spacing.......
10. it is far easier to accurately form a hull profile on a greater number of frames than a lesser number
11. the width of your keel plate is depicted in the frame profile images [between frames 5&6] ...frame width could be 1/2 of the keel plate width?

Before you rush into this......have a look at some of the Build threads here on MBM.........I am sure you could adapt hull planking knowledge from these

12. there are still a host of other considerations.......method of construction?.....frame material?..... plank sizing & material.....plank steaming..... choice of glue?........

Keep us posted with your thoughts......good luck  .....Derek

[hazegry]

neat trick with the acrylic sheet I will do that. The plans do show where to position the frames but I am planing on doubling them. I have studied plank on frame builds so I understand what you are talking about with the first and last 1/3 of the boat. I am going to use a building board and build the hull upside down. for the frames I was going to use door skin but don't mind investing in some good ply for this. Plank size I am not sure about I would like to go as large as possible and I plan on scribing in the panel lines after the hull is fiber glassed. I am going to soak the planks and use a heating iron to help bend them. I plan on using balsa for the planks since I plan to fiberglass the hull. I might use CA for the glue but as I am not in a hurry I might deffer to titebond waterproof carpenters glue. Thanks Derek

[derekwarner]

no tricks hazey .....we all just learn from more experienced members or other model boat builders 

1. stay away from any MDF products ...apart from your building board 
2. ply frame material is best.....you don't need marine grade ply....as you will totally waterproof not only the externals but the internals also
3. balsa is a very soft material ........ a far better option would be cedar planking....steams well, bends well ...relatively easy to sand
4. on this 63" .....long hull....... planks could be cut from 4" wide x 3/8" thick cedar wall panelling and cut them as +1/8" thick
5. not essential....but an oak keel plate [1/2" wide  x 3/4" high?] will add tremendous strength during the build & help to minimise any warping if temporarily screwed down to your building board.....
5. not essential.....but another option for gluing to consider is the one pot polyurethane glue  ......totally waterproof when cured....easy to work with

Keep us posted..........Derek

[hazegry]

Derek I dont know if I can find cedar is strips like that over here or that glue I will have to look for it. Can a moderator move this to the Warships section please?

[Liverbudgie2]

A nice model in all respects.

LB

[John W E]

hi ya Hazengry


as far as materials are concerned for building this hull - I would use 6mm thick Birch ply the 5 ply type.   I would use this for the frames and also the keel. I would also plank it using either Lime wood or Obechi about 5mm wide x about 1.5 mm thick.   If you have a look at the build of HMS Exeter 1939 this hull is roughly about 71 inches long and 7 inches wide and these are the materials I myself used to build this hull.   Your hull lends itself ideally to what is known as diagonal planking.    If you have a look at the masterclass Spashett build you will see how this hull was diagonally planked.   The only thing is though diagonal planking to a newcomer can become a daunting task, due to the fact that you have to taper some of the planks whilst planking the length of the hull.   This is to stop the planks from mis-aligning.;   As far as the amount of stringers to place around the frames is concerned, I would go for 4 stringers per side -1 stringer at deck level and 1 stringer running alongside the keel and the other 2 stringers evenly spaced around the turn of the bilge of the hull. 


Then we move on talking about the representing the plating - on the hull by scratching it on to the fibreglass coating which you are going to apply on the outside.  May I again suggest you have a look at both the Exeter and the Spashett build and you will see I used very thin platicard which was superglued to the hull which represents the plating and you might find this easier to do than trying to scribe lines into the hull.   The other bonus is that its an added extra sealant layer against the moisture penetration.


With regards to glues - I have always used weatherproof PVA glue on all my models made from wood and they have stood me good stead.   None of them have fallen apart quite YET!


Food for thought.

http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,33734.0.html
http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,13888.0.html
Aye


John

[hazegry]

Thanks bluebird those threads taught me allot i need to read them closer. I am on the phone now as my internet just went out at the housr

[hazegry]

well I got the plastic sheets and started drawing out the frames. The sheet I got is thick enough I can use the scrap for windows and what not.

[hazegry]

I think I will go with lime wood for the hull its called bass wood over here and readily available.