Topic: 2.5m drop to launch - suggestions? (Read 15141 times)

RAAArtyGunner · « **Reply #50 on:** February 18, 2017, 01:21:31 am »

Quote from: Big Ada on February 17, 2017, 06:15:34 pm

Umi's plan looks good but you still have to wind the boat up, and that's a lot of weight, I think you may need to gear it for easier winding.

Len.

That is where double blocks come in, they take the weight and effort out of lifting and keep it simple and with a simple ratchet, as when launching a trailer mounted boat, you can pause/stop at any time.
Ye old sailing ship had blocks an tackles etc.

RAAArtyGunner · « **Reply #51 on:** February 18, 2017, 01:37:25 am »

Simple solution to any swing.
Provided the minimal arm length, is equal in length to the drop, thus being at least 45degrees to the bank it will never impact the bank.

It follows that the height needs to be as low as is possible thereby reducing the cantilever effect.

The weight is not that great it is the bulk that has to be overcome, namely a fully rigged vessel.

tigertiger · « **Reply #52 on:** February 18, 2017, 01:54:34 am »

The hand winches are cheap here. About 4 quid for a 600lb model.

There have been some great ideas put forward for the derrick. I am not ruling it out yet, but unless I hit other snags, my thoughts are moving towards the rail option. The derrick would be the simpler option, if the boat was not a sail boat. But because of the height of the model complications are added by the height of the derrick needed.

Regarding the rail solution. The back of the roller housing hitting the hand rail issue can be sorted. It would be easy to attach something to a ladder rung to kick the ladder out from the hand rail. The weight/lateral forces of the assembly/kicker would then be resting on this, instead of on the ladder uprights. These lateral forces would only be small.

I need to check the depth of water, if it is very deep, the aforementioned kicker could also act as a hook for the top of the ladder, and there would need to be another kicker lower down that could be placed against one of the pillars to hold the lower end out and stable.

I will go to the lake today and take pictures, to post. I will also see if I have missed a trick.

Thanks again for all of the input so far.

Lots of good ideas have been discussed, that I am sure will be useful to other members.

tigertiger · « **Reply #53 on:** February 20, 2017, 11:38:35 am »

Ok, I have been back to the lake edge. Still no pictures sorry.
Checked the depth of water, it is over 1m with a concrete side wall.

There is another option. There is a gap next to one of the big rocks, where the smaller rock is only 1m above the edge. There is a barrier made of logs across this gap that can be 'moved' and put back afterwards. I figure I can make some sledge arrangement to slide down the 45 degree plus to the waters edge.
Boat will be in the sledge stern first, the some sort of tie down to hold the boat, and maybe a rope at the bow end of the sledge wrapped round a tree trunk to take the weight, and help haul her back up.
The boat could theoretically be launched and recovered from the sled.

But looking at the pic, this is just as scary, considering the total weight with sled is going to be over 20-25kg.

Martin (Admin) · « **Reply #54 on:** February 20, 2017, 12:04:02 pm »

Hi TT,

How well is it going to sail in such sheltered waters?

Colin Bishop · « **Reply #55 on:** February 20, 2017, 12:20:08 pm »

Well, there will probably be a brief displacement of air to get it started as TT falls in after it.....

Colin

tigertiger · « **Reply #56 on:** February 20, 2017, 01:16:08 pm »

Quote from: Martin [Admin] on February 20, 2017, 12:04:02 pm

Hi TT,
How well is it going to sail in such sheltered waters?

1st pic
No problem, lots of air moving. The only real problem is if it is very windy. Then the wind is not consistent because of the canyoning effects, and there is a long bend in the canal/water. It can change direction by 180* within a meter, literally. Sometimes I sail down one side of the canal with the wind behind me, and then back up the other side with the wind behind me. There is also a tributary canal/branch of the lake that also gets its own wind pattern. On a windy day squalls can come from any of 3 sides in rapid succession.

2nd pic
From the opposite bank

tigertiger · « **Reply #57 on:** February 20, 2017, 01:24:48 pm »

Quote from: Colin Bishop on February 15, 2017, 04:57:41 pm

So what happens if the boat sails off and gets stuck somewhere else and cannot be brought back to the launching site?

Colin

To answer your earlier question Colin.
If it gets stuck on our side, I can ask one of the home owners for access to their gardens.
If it gets stuck on the other side, I would probably lose it. The culture here is finders keepers, and there is no legal equivalent of 'theft by finding'. My only chance would be if I drive 3km to the tourist park gate, park, pay to get in, walk back across the park to the water, and hopefully the boat is still there.
I did get stuck on the fence at the far end of the water last week. I sat there for what seemed like an age waiting for the wind to change to blow the boat off the fence. Unfortunately it was not windy that day, so wind was mostly from the wrong direction.

stringer · « **Reply #58 on:** February 20, 2017, 01:46:45 pm »

Where is this lake tiger, I would like to google it
Geoff

tigertiger · « **Reply #59 on:** February 20, 2017, 01:55:58 pm »

Here is the lat long from Google Earth

tigertiger · « **Reply #60 on:** February 20, 2017, 02:06:56 pm »

The pic shows the location. The clean water to the right, is also part of the tourist park and inaccessible.
The huge lake to the west and south is walled, mostly a 2m wall. I have cycled down every tributary and bank on the east side of the big part of the lake, and there are no slipways. Also there is a fetch of over 20km making a huge swell. You can also see the blue green algae coloring the lake. The west side of the lake is nearly all government, or farmers fields. There is a 1m wall to the north of the arrow, but access by car is difficult, and the water is polluted.

There are a few reservoirs around the city, but these are strictly off limits as they are for drinking water.

JayDee · « **Reply #61 on:** February 20, 2017, 04:11:38 pm »

Hello,

As you probably know I have two rather large yachts.
I have launched them from two wheeled trolleys, by running the trolley over the edge of the lake and letting the boats sail away.
Very few problems with most of the lakes here.
But, launching your boats Stern first into the water may cause trouble.
Because of the angle of the boat to the water, the boat may not float until the water reaches the base of the mast,
Which could cause problems with water entering the Hull of the boat.

Also, retrieving the boat will be tricky, the bowsprit will touch the lifting device first - - the boat will stop, when you start to lift it, it will want to go backwards - - not UP !!.
If you make this device, it will need to be tested in a location that is very safe and level !.
I am very thankful that I don't need one.
Wishing you all the Best !!!!.

John.

tigertiger · « **Reply #62 on:** February 21, 2017, 02:42:49 am »

Hi John,
I hear what you are saying about stern first. I fully agree, it could get a bit hairy, I hadn't considered the points you made, but the plan is a little different. The boat would not be launched from the bank as such. The plan would be to lower the boat, cradle, and all to the concrete edge. Then spin them around beam to the wall. Lower the lot into the water, or from a horizontal position slide cradle off the wall the last 1" or so into the water. Finally, float the boat out of the cradle. Recovery would be the reverse.
The cradle would be closed at the rear, so stop the boat slipping out stern first, and I would need some kind of tie down to stop the bow from tipping upwards out of the cradle when at a steep angle upwards, and maybe some kind of removable bar at the stem, to stop the boat slipping forwards (unlikely but anything is possible if things go wrong).

I am lucky though. Unlike your magnificent Bluenose, there is no long drop keel no my model.

stringer · « **Reply #63 on:** February 22, 2017, 12:02:11 pm »

Tiger
I have looked on Google Earth at your lake, and there are lots of places where there are steps down to the lake edge, are you unable to get to these locations
Geoff S

tigertiger · « **Reply #64 on:** February 22, 2017, 03:49:19 pm »

If you can show me where, I can look.

stringer · « **Reply #65 on:** February 22, 2017, 07:34:41 pm »

hi Tiger
have marked up the photo from google earth, I used the co-ordinates you gave me, and you will need to use google earth to open the picture icon where indicated.
regards Geoff S

tigertiger · « **Reply #66 on:** February 23, 2017, 12:29:37 pm »

Hi Geoff
If I could access it, that would be ideal. Unfortunately, everything on the right had side of the water is part of a theme park. I think entrance is about GBP 10, and they would not let me bring my boat in. All of the small enclosed water, as opposed to the big lake, is in private grounds, including the water I sail on.
The only easy option would have been from the park, a bit further south at the big lake, but with a prevailing southerly wind, all of the algae builds up on the N end of the lake (our end), and the 20km fetch makes for some sea like waves. Even when it is calm and not in full algal bloom there is the problem of the barbed wire fence. The park is really the only bit of lake wall that is low enough to provide access to water. The park was redeveloped 2 years ago. Before that it was a sea wall.

stringer · « **Reply #67 on:** February 24, 2017, 12:57:40 pm »

Hi Tiger
Sorry if I raised your hopes, but we tried
Geoff S

tigertiger · « **Reply #68 on:** February 24, 2017, 04:41:48 pm »

No probs, thanks for trying.

bfgstew · « **Reply #69 on:** February 24, 2017, 05:28:29 pm »

Hi TT, I dont know if this idea would work, but I hate seeing people struggle. Just excuse the simple drawings but the idea is there??????

bfgstew · « **Reply #70 on:** February 24, 2017, 05:30:17 pm »

Didnt know dimension of weight of your boat but a bit of ballsst on one side of truck would suffice, just hope you can weld/fabricate.....

JayDee · « **Reply #71 on:** February 25, 2017, 04:37:24 pm »

Tiger,

How far would you have to travel, to a place where you could launch your boat from the bank of a lake, in a normal fashion?.
After launching your boat at this place, would you be able to retrieve the boat safely if anything should go wrong with it?.

I have travelled to Fleetwood Lake - - round trip 100 miles, Southport lake, round trip 45 miles, Birkenhead Lake, round trip 30 miles, great sailing venues, with great peace of mind!!.
There are lots of other places to sail around where I live - - but the peace of mind would suffer greatly!.

I really think you are chancing loosing your boat sailing at the lake you propose.
A small tree branch floating in the water will cause the boat to stop dead, lots of small things in the water could do the same, not to mention faults within the boat its self !.

Please have a look further afield, there must be other places.

Very Best Regards,
John.

tigertiger · « **Reply #72 on:** February 26, 2017, 12:43:22 am »

Hi Big Stew
Great design.

BTW the boat will be about 17-20kg and there are a couple of steps that have to be climbed up to the platform.

tigertiger · « **Reply #73 on:** February 26, 2017, 01:05:43 am »

Hi John
I know I am taking a risk sailing there. I already sail two smaller models on that water. I am prepared to take the risk, as it means I can sail every day after work to unwind.

The nearest water that I know that is suitable is about 1 hrs drive. Not far compared to your Fleetwood journey. but I would be going to sail on a small piece of water, on my own

. I know of no other model boaters. When I am back in UK I drive to meet people, and boat. The two go together.

MikeK · « **Reply #74 on:** February 26, 2017, 07:46:31 am »

Tiger, as a thought, furthering JayDees misgivings. It might be worth cobbling together some small, powered, rescue craft to take with you or have handy at home.

Mike

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Author Topic: 2.5m drop to launch - suggestions? (Read 15141 times)