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Author Topic: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?  (Read 45915 times)

patrolboat

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #50 on: September 21, 2007, 07:34:11 pm »

i have done scatch build and kits
my models up to now are
graupner rowing boat
a jap hydrafoil kit
a new marcettes le madigan
a areonaughts toben tuga graupner paul denker
a steam picket launch
a scatch built p28 bulit in vietnam era both scatch
a scatch built swift vietnam boat
just building a windermere steam launch 
i have a sixtys cabin cruiser still to be started a winter  project
just built an a s r launch w w 2 whaleback bought hull +top and modified the rest from original plans
a sheltered deck fishing boat scatch biuld
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patrolboat

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #51 on: September 21, 2007, 07:41:07 pm »

i have done scatch build and kits
my models up to now are
graupner rowing boat
a jap hydrafoil kit
a new marcettes le madigan
a areonaughts toben tuga graupner paul denker
a steam picket launch
a scatch built p28 bulit in vietnam era both scatch
a scatch built swift vietnam boat
just building a windermere steam launch 
i have a sixtys cabin cruiser still to be started a winter  project
just built an a s r launch w w 2 whaleback bought hull +top and modified the rest from original plans
a sheltered deck fishing boat scatch biuld
a scatch build pusher tug and barge
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boatmadman

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #52 on: September 21, 2007, 07:49:20 pm »

My builds:
Drifter - scratch
riva - scratch
Pen Duick, Yacht - scratch
hydro - scratch
bluebird k7 - kit
fast electric mono - kit
grand banks schooner - scratch
brave borderer - scratch
waveny lifeboat (the billings one) - kit
banckert - kit
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HMS Indifference

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #53 on: September 21, 2007, 08:24:50 pm »

Scratch build every time. I like to build something that is similiar to a specific boat/ship but not have to be meticulous so the 'critic' can't say, '???? does not have that shape hull/sails that big/is not coloured like that, is bigger than that, etc, etc, etc. A perfect example of this was my last build, a 5 foot plus aircraft carrier that was named HMS Invincible because it looked like it. The 'pain in the a** critic kept saying, 'Invincible is not like this, that, does not have, does have, etc.' After several weeks of this I said to him that it's name was not Invincible it was HMS Indifference, so now I can do what I like with it. Shut him up for sure.

My last 3 builds were:
An adapted pink Barbie plastic boat that had 2 motors mounted on pylons and small propellers, including Barbie in the boat and Ken on skis - a real head turner
An airboat made from a sheet of foam and 600 motor - really fast
HMS Indifference, aircraft carrier with all bells and whistles, music, radar, etc. This is featured here on 'Your Models' and looks brilliant on the canal. I often follow within half a metre to the rear of barges and the kids love it (not to metion the adults)
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djrobbo

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #54 on: September 21, 2007, 08:32:58 pm »

Hi everybody. GREETINGS FROM SUNNY ESSEX ?  Like so many others i started building boats etc, when i was about 13 ,which was in nineteen hundred and frozen to death, and back then it was save up your pocket money to buy a plan from the m.a.p book and go from there. So most of my efforts are scratch built. I also restore and modify old models,although i have just purchased a perkasa kit .   currently building a springer tug from scratch......rebuilding  1/96 hms intrepid....just finished a small puffer from scratch.....other models in the fleet aswell.   Personally i think its all down to personal preferance and skill levels , we may be able to handle the wood side of things but may not have a metal lathe or the skill to use one , so have to buy some bits ready made, dont think it makes much differance really.                              happy boating to everyone .                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                       BOB
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walrus

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #55 on: September 21, 2007, 09:09:58 pm »

I have built 3 kit boats in the past which resulted in good models but no personal satisfaction
I have also built 15 scratch built wooden boats with plank on frame construction in the past 5 years.
They are 10 yachts, a Colchester smack, an MFV, a trailable day launch, a longtail boat and a lakeland steamer.
Now under construction is an open lakeland launch and this time I am making my own steam engine to go in it
This all keeps the grey matter turning round and makes me wonder how I found time to go to WORk

Happy modelling Alan
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bobdoc

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Re: Kit or Scratch building - Why?
« Reply #56 on: September 21, 2007, 09:17:02 pm »

I used solely to scratch build - plank on frame or bread and butter plus "invented and manufactured bits and bobs".

After a couple of decades out to act as a taxi service for children, I now buy kits and scratch build the bits not provided or provided but requiring "modification" - always seems much of the kit remains unused but becomes modifiable parts for future kits. I have a huge "scraps box"!

Common sense would say buy a hull and scratch build from there, but, like on many other threads on this forum, many seem to buy with enthusiastic whim and complete at leisure .. if ever!

It's a hobby - go with the flow ... golfers lose golf balls for ever!

Bob
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portside II

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #57 on: September 21, 2007, 10:03:05 pm »

My last three builds
MMM Nangee the hull as a kit and the rest as i like
Metcalf mouldings Greamsey as a kit from keel to the top of the mast
4 foot cargo/container ship scratch built from photos and RMS ships that come to Goole
yes i like to build from basic kit and then give it my own touch  :) well thats my excuse anyways
daz
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BORIS

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #58 on: September 21, 2007, 10:19:43 pm »

there is one boat i really want ..that is a "modern" offshore oil rig supply vessel...no kit manufacturers up to now have made any...so scratch building is the only option..however i have never attempted to do this..for one ,i would need more tools..workspace and a skill to be able to do it in the first place.
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #59 on: September 21, 2007, 10:29:33 pm »

Via email....


Hiya,
I have done both. The advantage of scratch building is the way you can make
for youself a lot of the kit parts and reduce the cost sometimes. Started
sailing a Thunder Tiger Victoria which I was given this year. I enjoy it so
much better than chugging a tug around the lake that I have just purchased
this week The Thunder Tiger ETNZ Yacht, which I cannot waite to get into the
water and I am building from scratch over the winter a Pond Yacht based on a
Metcalf Mouldings hull,

Bill
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #60 on: September 21, 2007, 10:30:08 pm »

Via email.....

I have done 2 refurb projects. Don't have the experience or time to build from scratch, but very much enjoy getting a boat that is almost ready for the breakers yard, and bringing it back to its former glory! I would very much like to get my hands on an "Orca" Jaws boat as my next project!
Paul
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Captain Povey

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #61 on: September 21, 2007, 10:42:13 pm »

Well I suppose my first attempt was a scratch build at about the age of 12, no money so bits off wood from the shed had to do. No tools also meant it was not very successful so got some cash together and got a hobbies tug kit and a fret saw. It was kits from then on I suppose and included the Santa Maria, Waverider and St Canute until recently when I went in for a bit of refurbishment of a Smit Nederland. I can see the fascination of the true or even semi-scratch build and as tools and and materials are now available it may be time to have another go. Cheers Graham
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gerrybuilt

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #62 on: September 21, 2007, 10:55:14 pm »

I am building the Hachette Bismark. There. I've said it. Seriously tho' folks, this is my first ship model and I don't have the experience to scratch build. I wanted a ship to sail and the Bis. is such an historic ship that I couldn't resist it. Formerly' many years ago, in extreme youth I was an aero modeller. Then when the kids came along I built a railway in 4mm scale. I couldnt cary on withit no spare room for a layout. So the Bis. is my way of getting something built.

Good on all you scratchers ,


Gerry
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #63 on: September 21, 2007, 11:01:03 pm »

Hi Gerry - updating my Bismarck build now - Martin Builds the Bismarck!   :D

Does this count as kit?!?!
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #64 on: September 21, 2007, 11:09:02 pm »

This is what I call scratchbuild - from Jimmy Woods and Alex McFadyen

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Martin (Admin)

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #65 on: September 21, 2007, 11:13:03 pm »

This is what I call scratchbuild - from Jimmy Woods and Alex McFadyen

Seawell - Possibly my favourite model boat ... ever!
Seawell on Model Boat Mayhem
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Ghost in the shell

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #66 on: September 21, 2007, 11:14:18 pm »

"does it count as a kit" yes as long as all the bits arrive!
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Peter Fitness

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #67 on: September 22, 2007, 01:27:52 am »

I generally prefer to scratch build for 3 main reasons. 1) It is usually cheaper. 2) Greater choice of subjects. 3) More satisfaction.
Having said that, I do build from kits as well, although the prices of these are much higher here in Australia due to import duties and carriage costs.
Peter.
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tigertiger

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #68 on: September 22, 2007, 04:01:49 am »

I have built two kits.

Thunder Tiger Victoria sailing yacht. This only took about 20 hours to build. It could have been done much faster, but I was in fear and tripidation as it was my first. But I did feel a bit of a fraud if asked if it was built in a factory (RTR toy) and I said 'no I built it myself'. Well I kinda assembled it, but my Chinese is not good enought to expalin this.

The second kit was a Victor Models Mary J Ward schooner, which was modified. Different sail plan, extended bowsprit and changes in detailing (inc lights). I both enjoyed and endured frustratioin with this. As getting bits in China is pig sometimes. A lot of stuff came from UK.

I am stalling embarking on my first scratch builds from MM plans. I may need to buy a lot of tools. The possibility is that in future I will go back to kits. As was said above, with a kit I get everything I need.

TT
All at sea in China.
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Roger in France

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #69 on: September 22, 2007, 08:08:22 am »

I hope we do not get into the usual row about kit .v. scratch. I do both and they are always a source of fun and challenge....just different.

There is also a variation. What about those of us who take a kit designed as a static model and make it a powered RC job? I have seen some excellent examples on this Forum and elsewhere.

At present I keep picking up and putting down a build I have started and where the sheer smallness of the hull causes acute problems. It is a Hellier model of the QE 2.

Roger in France.
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Captain Anonymous

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #70 on: September 22, 2007, 09:20:40 am »

This is what I call scratchbuild - from Jimmy Woods and Alex McFadyen





You see Colin, Even Jimmy does not build everything, our good friend Gordon does all the photo etching for him, I build 90% of my models, I buy in some of the very small guns , like quad 40,s and Orlicoms, so you have to put it down as , im not a scratch builder. ;D ;D
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RickF

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #71 on: September 22, 2007, 09:32:21 am »

Don't you think this discussion/argument/feud/vendetta/ has gone on long enough? I consider myself a scratch builder, but I've never made a propeller or sterntube in my life. I also buy my radio control equipment RTR - not even in kit form. I also buy in fittings when they are suitable or when I cannot possibly make them myself. A friend with a lathe does any complicated turning jobs for me.

Does this disqualify me? Quite frankly, I don't give a ****! I enjoy model-making and that should be the only criterion.

Rick
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roycv

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #72 on: September 22, 2007, 09:58:55 am »

Hi Bunkerbarge, I completely endorse your comments, I was about to write in similar vein.  It is the final model that counts.  Good and accurate assembly a nice clean paint finish and well observed detail are the real hallmarks of a good model maker.
Scratch-building does not imbue a model with anything special, I have seen some embarrassingly awful models that were scratch built.
I agree with Bryan Y. that if there is no kit for it you have to D.I.Y.
But I can tell you a tale about that.

A friend some 20+ years ago researched a boat, nobody had one, the plans from Maritime Museum were a small fortune and he built his own and I actually have that model and run it myself, having bought it from his estate, after his death at only 44.

The following Christmas It was a free plan in Model Boats magazine.  Now it seems everyone has a Harbour Defence Motor Launch.

So there you are, you have your unique boat and then it gets commercialised.  How do you feel about it?

I had to stop it being thrown on the fire so to speak.  But that in itself gives a clue as to why some want this exclusivity.

Any comments?

regards to all Roy

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Colin Bishop

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #73 on: September 22, 2007, 10:05:37 am »

Quote
You see Colin, Even Jimmy does not build everything, our good friend Gordon does all the photo etching for him, I build 90% of my models, I buy in some of the very small guns , like quad 40,s and Orlicoms, so you have to put it down as , im not a scratch builder.

If you look at my earlier post Captain A, I referred to the traditional definition of scratchbuilding and then said that the definition is more elastic these days. So, yes - I would consider Jimmy to be a scratchbuilder. At the other extreme, if somebody has bought a kit, made it out of the box and then added a few home built items to give it extra "colour" then I wouldn't consider it scratchbuilt. The line between the two is blurred as somebody else has quite rightly said. But as Rick F says, who cares? I prefer to build most of the model like you but I draw the line at anchor chain and propellors and some fittings that I don't have the tools or skills to make. Sometimes I'll make the stern tubes sometimes not depending on the model.

From the comments we have been seeing it would seem that certain people feel the need to go on the defensive if they haven't built everything themselves and that is total nonsense. There are still competitions around that people enter and if you have a competition you have to have rules and definitions to reflect the amount of work put into the model to enable it to be judged. That's why there are different classes - to be able to fairly compare like with like. In the ME Exhibition Jimmy may have lost a few marks for his photo etchings, I don't know, but when you look at the sheer quality of the model there is no question that it deserved its Gold Medal. I know many modellesr who scratchbuild at the highest level and none of them look down their noses at people who build kits or semi kits. They recognise that everyone has their own preferences, skill levels and amount of time available for modelling. It's just all different aspects of the hobby we all share and enjoy.
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Shipmate60

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Re: Kit or Scratch Build - Why?
« Reply #74 on: September 22, 2007, 10:21:36 am »

This survey is interesting as a poll, but is getting boring as to what is scratch building, and some of the prejudices come out.
My opinion is simple.
I couldn't care less, if the builder is happy with his model then so am I.
This is after all a HOBBY.
You remember, for relaxing, having fun and meeting other like minded people.
I have made some good friends and modelling keeps me out of the pub (as I tell the boss)
Just enjoy it.

Bob
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