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[Fred Ellis]

Hi
I have run across a problem with regards to setting up a mixer.


I have two 545 motors which I have run into two JP speed controls, then into the mixer, then into the receiver, I have also removed one of the red wires from one of the ESC.


The thing is when it is switched on only the rudder works,


I have tried a Action P40 mixer which works in my other boats, also a "W" wing mixer from Mtroniks that I have taken from one of my other boats, and they worked with other makes of ESC.


I can run the JP ESC independent so that I have tank steering, but I do not like this form of steering.


So have I missed out anything.


Any help will be grateful taken


Fred

[malcolmfrary]

JP do a range of ESCs, knowing which is involved here might get an answer from somebody with experience of the right one.
My usual mistake with a mixer is plugging the two input leads of the mixer into the wrong channels on the receiver, thus using the wrong channel to control speed and something unexpected to control the mix.

[Fred Ellis]

Hi


Thank you malcolmfrary all I can say is that it is has 5510135 marine brushed speedcontrol (50a) with reverse on the label and it is blue.


Also I am running it on 12 volts.


Fred

[justboatonic]

According to the Q&A on Wheelspin Models site, these are automatic set up. It also says they are for single motor use. That likely means you cannot run 2 motors through 1 esc but might also mean they wont work via a mixer.

For single motor use just ensure throttle trim is at neutral and end points are at 100%.

[Fred Ellis]

Hi justboatonic
That is very interesting, I would have thought that a mixer would be the same as having them as independent, maybe my next move is get two more ESC  from another company after I have asked if they will work with a mixer.


Fred

[Akira]

Your ESC looks exactly like the unit that came in my Graupner Corvette. No numbers or labels though.I did find that my ESC was different in it's set up. First off, the ESC sets it's neutral when it is first turned on, so it is important to ensure that the transmitter throttle controls are set to neutral as you desire it to be. MY ESC is especially sensitive(I run my corvette with just the trim lever and the speed is perfect). I have also found that the sequence of "powering up" the ESC/s is important and will effect whether they bind into the system. On my current build, I hook up on battery, turn on the BE/VR, then connect the second motor/esc battery. I am not sure why this works this way, but it works.
I would suggested trying to set up your system with just servos, in place of ESC's. This should ensure that the mixer is correctly connected to the receiver.That should tell you if the mixer is working and operating correctly. Then try inserting your ESc/s. First one at a time, then both. (Quick question: do both ESC's share battery power, or are they on separate batteries?)
The mixer should not effect the ESC or it's ability to control the motor, beyond where in it's range it is operating.

[HMS Invisible]

Fred, he just beat me to it.

[Fred Ellis]

Hi
O.K lets see.
Two ESC of which one has had the red wire removed to disable the bec, both esc switches are in the on position as the main pos lead has an on/off switch so that they are switched on at the same time.


I am using a 12 volt sla battery to power both esc.


Transmitter is always switched on first and all gimbals are centralised before esc are switched on.


Mixer is set up as in my other boats that they were removed from in fact I have used the receiver from one of my other boats just to see if that would help.(I have tried two different makes of mixers)


In the end the only thing that always works is the rudder.


This is all set up on the work bench not in the boat


I have also sent off an email to J Perkins to see if they can help


Thanking you all for you advice


Fred


 

[Akira]

Fred, I would try this first. Swap the ESc's for servos. You will need a BE/VR or battery pack for the receiver. if the servos mixer properly. then it is not the mixer. Next, remove both red wires from the ESC's receiver lead and try them with the mixer. Again, you will need a power source for the receiver.

[HMS Invisible]

Fred, that is a valid enough diagnostic but I think the switches re-arm the esc and may not auto-set with your main power switch arrangement.

[RST]

Do the ESC's work in parallel together when just connected with a Y lead?  I'll bet that shop just said "single motor" because it has one pair of bullet connectors for the motor, 95% sure I've seen it used powering 2 but could be wrong.  Do you have a servo tester?  That saves allot of faff these days and they're usually only a fiver or so from UK shops and a spare 4x"AA" battery holder and 4 NiMH batteries always comes in handy to check things without BEC enabled.  I would echo the comment trying with 2 servos on the mixer instead of ESC's if you have a couple spare. I did this a few months ago to check a couple of old mixers to see if they still worked -and to remember what the right connections were!


Rich

[HMS Invisible]

Fred, without information to the contrary, I have doubts these escs arm the motor drive unless they have a battery in excess of a minimum voltage followed by slide switch moving to on.
The bec will work regardless. They also look like the 20% reverse throttle type I see on the JP webshop.
They have no low end control to speak of.

[Fred Ellis]

Hi Every One


I am thinking that in the morning (Sunday) I will start all over again.


The two mixers that I have used are now back in there boats and are working OK,


I will try running them in parallel via a "Y" lead as RST said, if that works I will then replace the esc's for two servos connected to a mixer and see how that goes,


Things to do are make a "Y" lead. dig out some servos and fine that old power pack.


Again thank you for all the good advice that you have giving


Fred

[unbuiltnautilus]

Okay, just to add to the confusion.. I have had issues with these blue controllers before. They seem to be very sensitive to being in the right 'place' on initial start up. If they are not in the speed controls perceived neutral, they wont work. I encountered this a few years ago with a specific brand of 2 channel radio..and I cannot remember which one!
My guess, the mixer is confusing the speed controls, confused speed controls are refusing to work, simple diagnosis I think. Problem is, not sure how easy to fix. I think you will need different speed controls. Don't buy Vipers, they do not get on with mixers. The TIO controls are fine with mixers, Action kit is fine and Quicruns are fine ( you will need the 880 not the 1060 as that doesn't go up to 12v).
Maybe to confirm this try enabling one speed control on one channel, with the trim in different places. First in neutral, then all the way up, then all the way down. I think there is a 50% chance in one of those positions it wont enable. Go on, humour me!!
Alan.

[Fred Ellis]

Morning Alan
As you say this could be or not a simple problem to fix, so far I have done the following.
1; Motors run independent with bec and without bec.
2; Motors run in parallel with bec and without bec.
3; Rudder works independent.
4; Motors do not work when connected to mixer with bec or without bec but rudder does.
5; Swapped out JP for a set of cheap Hong Kong esc all working as should be, only thing is they have a break setting that is non removable so no good,
6; Conclusion a new set of esc.

 Thank you to you all for all the good advice that you have given me with regards to my problem.


Fred

[DaveM]

Fred
This unit combines the function of two ESCs and a mixer, with the added facility that you can choose the degree of mixing (50% or 100%) or even use it for tank-steering, simply by moving a small switch on the circuit board.  Unless you intend to buy Far Eastern ESCs then it's also cheaper than two ESCs plus mixer. https://www.componentshop.co.uk/p94-dual-esc-and-mixer-2-x-20-amps.html
Dave M

[Fred Ellis]

Hi Dave M


Yes I did give that some thought and the last time I was able to get onto the site it was out of stock ( is any one else having trouble get onto the site as I get 505 run out of time) that is why I went to JP for my esc,  I would have used esc from my other boats but as I try and make them a permanent fix I was unable to do that, as for the mixers I had them spare from other boats that I am renovating.


Update on the P94 is now in stock and a order has been placed.

[unbuiltnautilus]

Fred
This unit combines the function of two ESCs and a mixer, with the added facility that you can choose the degree of mixing (50% or 100%) or even use it for tank-steering, simply by moving a small switch on the circuit board.  Unless you intend to buy Far Eastern ESCs then it's also cheaper than two ESCs plus mixer. https://www.componentshop.co.uk/p94-dual-esc-and-mixer-2-x-20-amps.html
Dave M

Was having a play with one of those over the weekend. Someone needed his supply ship wiring sorted out. I was impressed with its functionality. The only issues I had with it, the way the steering servo had been fitted into the model, via the daisy chain set up on the unit, it went to port while the motors mixed to starboard. In the end I simply re-positioned the rudder servo linkages so everything worked together rather than against itself.
The only other issue which just requires some discipline from the operator, is waiting for the Tx/Rx to bind before waggling sticks about! It auto detects the mid-range points on the sticks on start up. With the Planet T5 set it took on average 5 to 7 seconds to bind. you go waggling the sticks about before it has bound, everything gets very angry.
Simple motto then , at the pond edge, don't just go waggling your sticks about willy nilly, stop and think first

[DaveM]

UBN
The time delay is the P94 detecting and setting the neutrals, not the Tx/Rx binding. Trust me - it happens with 40MHz sets as well. You just have to wait until the relays have finished clicking. Ref rudder direction, the easiest fix is to swap over the two sets of wires from the big green terminals to the motors. Both rudder and motors will then be 'in sync'. If they're turning the 'wrong' way wrt the Tx stick then use the servo reverse on the rudder channel. Your last sentence is the most important one.

DM

[unbuiltnautilus]

UBN
The time delay is the P94 detecting and setting the neutrals, not the Tx/Rx binding. Trust me - it happens with 40MHz sets as well. You just have to wait until the relays have finished clicking. Ref rudder direction, the easiest fix is to swap over the two sets of wires from the big green terminals to the motors. Both rudder and motors will then be 'in sync'. If they're turning the 'wrong' way wrt the Tx stick then use the servo reverse on the rudder channel. Your last sentence is the most important one.

DM

That is good to know about the detecting malarky. I did try the swapping of motor wires over, but in a busy environment, with many distractions, and 1.5 metres too much wire in the model ( True, he could now wire up another small model with what I pulled out of that thing..and it still works! ), I may have been having a slow brain day!