Model Boat Mayhem
Mess Deck: General Section => Chit-Chat => Topic started by: captain bligh on April 16, 2025, 08:13:11 am
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It is without doubt the hobby of model boats is struggling and in a decline unfortunately and May's issue of Model Boats clearly shows that. Absolutely no disrespect to the builder one bit but does it warrant 10 pages to a small basic open boat model :(( . Then there are pages of non relating content just to fill the magazine up like WWll DVD box sets to win etc. Don't get me wrong I'm interested in WWll history but not in a magazine that I buy which is meant to be about model boats. I appreciate they have adverts etc to make money but just more & more of them now.
Years ago when I first started I'd read the magazine front to back , back to front about 12 times {-) now I open it flick through it and think oh yeah very good and it gets put away.
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Have you ever contributed an article?
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I haven't personally no and wouldn't know how to if honest or been approached even though I make a few hulls.
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I rest my case.
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Your case being!
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"Put up or shut up" It's difficult to create print with nowt to print. Many of the contributors from the past are long gone and lets face it, Pandora's box and t'internet has destroyed the brain cells of many. It's easy to be a keyboard warrior but takes dedication to bash keys for publication.
Regards Ian.
See you on 25th BB
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His case is that the Editor cannot conjure up material from nowhere. The contents of the magazine are dependent on people willing to put the effort in to make contributions. Bunkerbarge has a monthly article which has been running for many years. As always it is just a relatively few people who are doing the heavy lifting. Writing a descriptive article on a build is not rocket science and only one step up from the build logs that people seem happy to put on forums. The Editor is more than happy to give help and advice on putting an article together, you only have to email her.
The magazine has one editorial office member of staff working on a freelance basis. That is the Editor herself. Everything else, including the page layout, is outsourced.
As far as the May issue is concerned, the magazine changed hands on 27th March and the new owners made 8 extra pages available at short notice which obviously caused difficulties for the issue in preparation which was intended to have the original number of pages. The Editor is not sitting on a pile of unpublished material that can be brought forward at a few days notice, much as she would like to be, so cut her some slack please!
I have done the job myself with the Special Issues some years back plus standing in for Paul Freshney on occasion and believe me there is plenty of work involved in putting together each issue.
Colin
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Mmmm that's strange I thought being a member on here since 2014 it was a friendly group but obviously some aren't!!
I totally understand the people running the magazine can't pluck stuff out of thin air that was mainly my point unfortunately as I quoted the hobby of model boats is struggling which is a shame for all of us agreed ???? So the magazine is obviously struggling to for content.
As for comments of " Put up or Shut up" not quite sure that was called for but there you go. As for the term keyboard warrior that I'm certainly not !!
But we're all entitled to our opinions and if your meaning I'll see you in Blackpool yes no problem happy to chat. But like the other 4/500 people possibly I won't be there on the 25th !! "Put up or shut up" It's difficult to create print with nowt to print. Many of the contributors from the past are long gone and lets face it, Pandora's box and t'internet has destroyed the brain cells of many. It's easy to be a keyboard warrior but takes dedication to bash keys for publication.
Regards Ian.
See you on 25th BB
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Just to throw in my comments the editor can only compile a magazine with the information on hand. Without information been sent for publication the mag can only go one way.
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Like many others I've been reading model boats magazine since it was the model maker back in the 1950s, and I'm getting a huge dose of deja vu. It was a regular thing for someone to write in with comments about the content of the magazine because they didn't approve of whatever the current content or series was. Needless to say they weren't contributers and didn't fully appreciate that with thousands of readers with different preferences there has to be a lot of give and take.
If you feel that some comments are un friendly, consider the negative view you expressed about the effort that others have made when you seem un willing to try, believe me it isn't rocket science and im sure most of us are perfectly capable of doing something worth reading.
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If I've spoken out of term or the like I apologise. I thought I was making a constructive post but obviously not ! I'm merely saying that the hobby as a whole is struggling unfortunately.[size=78%] Next time you go to for example the Blackpool show have a look around I'm 50 and there isn't many under that age which is a great shame. Let's face it we're on here for one reason to enjoy model boats and enjoy seeing what other people have built. Be honest now if you picked up a model boat magazine from 20 years ago and compered to now which would you find more interesting? As someone pointed out the internet has taken over massively and all printed magazines are probably felling the pinch because of that. [/size]
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Not sure that 'struggling' is the right word. Model Boating is certainly in decline and has been for at least 15 years now. Similar with other modelling hobbies such as model railways.
The average age of model boaters is now probably late 60s early 70s. These people grew up when modelmaking was what everyone did as a kid and many of them, like myself, have stuck with it. Only a trickle of people are coming into the traditional model making hobbies because there are just too many more attractive competing options, many of them computer based like games.
Practical skills like woodwork and metalwork are not taught in schools so it is difficult to pick up the fundamentals yourself. Most people under 50 probably don't know how to wire up a plug and you will find members of this forum who don't know the difference between volts and amps. They just want specific instructions on how to wire up a boat to make it go. They have no interest in the underlying physics. But they are probably good at other things that I would find a challenge such as designing CAD programs for 3D printing.
Eventually model boating will regress to a small niche hobby but at the moment we have never had so much choice in what we can buy in terms of radio control, motors, batteries and huge ranges of fittings all of which would have been unimaginable in our younger days when if you wanted something then you had to make it yourself more often than not as commercial offerings were very limited.
No point in getting upset about it as you can't hold back the tide. Just do what you enjoy and get on with it. We only have one boat modelling magazine in the UK now, at one time there were more, so it is worth putting a bit of effort in to keep it going. The current Editor has introduced a 'Reader's Models' section which people seem to enjoy and all you have to do is submit a decent photo and a couple of paragraphs about it - just about anyone can do that.
Colin
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Surely a negative comment is also a contribution. Perhaps if the comments were listened to instead of a Standby to repel Boarders order. Some good might have come out them. Perhaps then the situation would be more promising.
One thing that stands out with the many forums I use or have used is they all have a Heavy mob ready to take on anyone who criticises. Sad to see it on here.
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Surely a negative comment is also a contribution.
Absolutely completely agree. The trick is though to ensure that a negative comment is always put across in a positive and constructive manner for the benefit of the recipient rather than a simple complaint for the benefit of the poster.
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I agree that the May edition has been 'stretched out' and could have benefited from extra content. My original post was intended to explain why in this particular instance, it was necessary to do this. Extra space to fill at short notice with insufficient edited and prepared material to fill the gap. The Editor did not have a great deal of choice. Also bear in mind that the magazine was changing owners and there were all sorts of things going on in the background affecting the personal circumstances and finances of the affected staff of the three magazines. Having your employer taken over by a new one with probably different conditions of employment is likely to cause anxiety at the very least! Hopefully things will settle down before the next edition goes out but there are still a lot of outstanding issues to work through.
The extra 8 pages does of course have implications. More space is great but can sufficient quality material be generated to fill it with quality articles? The Editor has a small group of regular contributors she can rely upon for a nucleus of material and they do it for peanuts in the best interests of the hobby. Over the last ten years or so we have lost many of the people who filled the pages of the magazine at that time and it is becoming more and more difficult to replace them. I have written scores of articles since the early 1980s to support the hobby but I can't produce a new boat build every few issues at my age and rate of building. We really do need more people to step up to the plate and share their experiences rather than just hope that somebody else will do it.
Something that has changed since the 1980s/1990s heyday is that back then modellers were keen to share their builds. There was no internet and so they wrote articles for the magazines. They were just ordinary guys and good modellers but they managed to write excellent articles. It wasn't that difficult. You are not writing a novel with a plot, just describing your build in a logical manner, how you thought about it, how you started, how it went, pitfalls along the way and how it turned out. Just a logical progression. Why people today seem to feel this is beyond them does worry me a bit. Just read the articles you like and take your cue from that.
To get the best out of a hobby you need to put something in as well as taking something out. One big drawback of the internet can be that it encourages people to be (often lazy) consumers rather than contributors. Many people do come on this forum to pick the brains of members rather than to actually learn anything They just want to be told how to fix their particular issue or question and are not interested in actually learning from the experience. Telling them to read this, that or the other to understand their problem is not welcomed - they just want a simple answer and cheerio! This Forum is an immense information resource but so many people do not bother to use it as such, they just come up with the same old questions again and again when a simple search would have told them the answer. Should I grease my tube, why is it leaking, which way should my props rotate, how should I waterproof my hull,why is my motor overheating, can I spray rattlecans over enamel can I use superglue on my plastic hull, I don't understand electronics - enlighten me (well read up on it a bit maybe!) - it just goes on and on.
OK the above is a bit of a light hearted rant but there is a lot of truth in it. Too many people are simply not prepared to put a bit of effort in and want to be spoon fed which is not really good for them!
Bottom line - think about how you can contribute to the hobby by sharing your experiences as well as enjoying your own builds. We all have lessons to learn and pass on for the benefit of others.
Colin
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Practical skills like woodwork and metalwork are not taught in schools so it is difficult to pick up the fundamentals yourself. Most people under 50 probably don't know how to wire up a plug and you will find members of this forum who don't know the difference between volts and amps. They just want specific instructions on how to wire up a boat to make it go. They have no interest in the underlying physics. But they are probably good at other things that I would find a challenge such as designing CAD programs for 3D printing.
Colin
More people than you think know how to wire up a plug. I worked in a school until I retired 8 1/2 years ago and part of the physics/science course involved wiring a plug, probably more for the motor skills as how often are appliances sold without plugs. Also woodwork and metalwork was taught to 1st and second years leading to a Craft and Design course in later years. For the certificate they basically had to design and make what was often a small piece of furniture. The last school I worked at was a new build where they completely fitted out woodworking and metalworking workshops with brand new equipment (2 brand new metalworking lathes)
Jim
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I'd disagree about model railways being in decline. If anything it's going through a bit of a re-birth. Some of the manufacturers aren't doing too well for sure, but others are selling like hot cakes! Admittedly they're the upper end, more detailed and expensive models, but they're selling none the less.
The age grouping is similar to model boaters though, it's an 'older man's' hobby these days, and that may contribute to the new growth in the hobby, that age group having more disposable income than younger ages.
As an example of this there are maybe four 'full-on' magazines for the model railway hobby currently.
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Is it just me or does the paper feel differently in the May issue issue , cover is the same just the pages ?
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Re the last few posts:
Over 20 years ago at a management awayday I demonstrated how to wire a three pin plug and the other attendees looked on in wonder.
Model railways are still very popular and I love them but the general impression online is that they are becoming less popular as the age of those running them increases as with Model Boating.
Modelling generally is a declining hobby and just has to be accepted as such. Enjoy it while, you can.
Colin
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Hi Colin and ye all
Well I pulled my finger out and sent my first article to Model Boats Magazine.
So I am hoping it will be published.
I have started writing up a few more including a new build and another restoration.
Our boating section of the club was down to only five at one point but we have about twenty members to date.
Harry
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Well done Harry, I look forward to reading it. Once you have done one it becomes easier.
Colin
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If model railways are in decline, then it's news to me. Sales of both magazines I work for are up. Show attendance is up. Numbers, and prices of products are up and they seem to be selling. Yes, the age profile is older, but it always has been. I don't remember many strapping 20-somethings at shows when I was younger.
As far as MB is concerned, as has been said, the Editor can only publish what she has been sent, and if the people in the hobby can't be bothered to write, then the mag will look thin. Colin makes a good point about the extra pages. IMHO, there were four pages of the workboat that showed that, but the rest is as good as ever. Yes, the content has changed from the 1960s, but then so has the hobby. MB has to evolve like any other publication.
Moving on to the model boating hobby declining - does anyone have any numbers for this, or is it just the general internet doom and gloom? Yes, there are less shows, but that is because model boaters don't put them on, (railway modellers do) and don't support the ones that exist (I still remember the Coleshill show which was full of boats on the Saturday because putting one on display got you in free, and empty on Sunday as the freeloaders went home) well. There are fewer model shops, but we have the web, and some on this forum boast about how they import everything from China, and don't see the point of shops.
MB is a "use it or lose it" situation. If the hobby is in decline, then a lot of that is down to those in it wanting someone else to do everything for them. It doesn't have to be. Other hobbies are going well, the massive Dortmund show is on at present, and that brings in serious numbers. Key Model World should do well at the end of the month. The ARTF plane market is booming and Tamiya keep rolling out RC car kits, perhaps we can attract people who build those to the hobby. Airfix keep tooling up plastic kits, and there is a thriving aftermarket to support those. Again, how do we get some of those people in our hobby. Featuring plastic kits in MB can't hurt in that respect.
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I personally never knew a magazine relied on the pubic sending stuff in I genuinely didn't know that. Yes I knew people sent stuff in but didn't know they pretty much relied on that alone. As they say every day is a learning day 😁. Out of interest is that how the like of the model railway, scale kits etc magazines survive?
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Pity you did't post this last week Cap'n, I was in Torpoint most of last week and would have enjoyed a face to face conVERsation not coFRONtation. At fifty, Thart nobut a bairn O0 {-) At the time of your conception (and I'm NOT trying to be insultive) all branches of modelling were becoming victims of the Chequebook and "I've got disposable income, what shall I try next?" Up to that point and there will be still a few on this forum who will remember it, if you wanted to fit out an MTB, the 'Tubes' were Paxolin and the guns from dowel, paper tubes and sewing pins. Cast a glance at Vic's "Thorneycroft MTB" plan.
UNFORTUNATELY, forumses like this one will herald the demise of magazines, any questions re 'How do I' when writing to a mag in the past took a minimum of two Issues to get an answer OR go to a LIBRARY to find an answer (Wot's a Library?), Now, you can have a reply from a cretin like me at the speed of light and not have to wait. %)
Regards Ian.
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Yes I would have loved a conversation with you about model boats obviously 😂. Torpoint is still a 3 hour drive for me longer for you I know or would think.
Yes unfortunately the world is changing some for the better some for the worse. I spouse making and selling my few little hulls I'm trying my best to cling on to keep the hobby alive all I can do is try my best 🤷🏻♂️. I watch a lot of OO gauge railway stuff & scale model stuff on YouTube and the following in those hobbies seems massive to ours. I went to Telford scale model show 18 months ago and WOW if you've never been go not boats or many but my god I was blown away by it all exhibitors and traders from all over the world. On driving home I was thinking why can't our hobby of model boats be like that 😟.
I have to say I went to Blackpool in 2018 I think was my first year basically I kept putting it off because of the distance from me but I've been every year since apart from COVID absolutely love the show so friendly 👌🏻👍🏻booked up already for this year 😁.Pity you did't post this last week Cap'n, I was in Torpoint most of last week and would have enjoyed a face to face conVERsation not coFRONtation. At fifty, Thart nobut a bairn O0 {-) At the time of your conception (and I'm NOT trying to be insultive) all branches of modelling were becoming victims of the Chequebook and "I've got disposable income, what shall I try next?" Up to that point and there will be still a few on this forum who will remember it, if you wanted to fit out an MTB, the 'Tubes' were Paxolin and the guns from dowel, paper tubes and sewing pins. Cast a glance at Vic's "Thorneycroft MTB" plan.
UNFORTUNATELY, forumses like this one will herald the demise of magazines, any questions re 'How do I' when writing to a mag in the past took a minimum of two Issues to get an answer OR go to a LIBRARY to find an answer (Wot's a Library?), Now, you can have a reply from a cretin like me at the speed of light and not have to wait. %)
Regards Ian.
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As a contributor to Model Boats there are a few opportunities for writing for the magazine. The last three models I have built were review kits from SLEC and Billing Boats so I got an opportunity to build new kits and have an input into their development. I wrote an article for the editor and I got a model to keep. The only problem is that you can’t take more than a few months to build, test and write if you get a review kit as they need to be published as soon as possible. It’s fun but can be hard work if something goes wrong and does mean that you need to liaise with the editor to keep them notified of your progress.
I have also written about my own models and have even gone back in time with searching through my online cloud for my build photos and made a 2500 word article to act as last minute backup if my commissioned article is delayed for any reason.
As mentioned this month the new owner dropped on the editor the addition of an extra 8-10 pages per edition from now on and I have provided some of these pre-written articles to assist filling these extra pages whilst catchup is done. This month I wrote about the Billing Boats Zeeland tug, the kit was received at Christmas and I completed it in March ready for May edition. Once you get in to the right mind to write in the style of what’s required you can complete and article in less than a week with minor adjustments from the editor. The nice thing is that she will send you a PDF of the article so you can see how the article will be laid out in the actual magazine so you can read it and helps you plan for any future articles. I enjoy it and gives me something to do in the evenings. I already have another pre-agreed article with Lindsey which should appear in the next few months.
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Most hobby magazines are run on shoestring budgets, their circulation will not support anything else. As I mentioned earlier, there is just the Editor on the editorial side, no reporters or anything like that and the Editor also has to do a lot of admin work connected with payments to contributors etc. During Covid, budgets for Model Boats and the other two MTM titles were cut by 40% and this was mostly met by slashing contributor rates which are now peanuts and have not been restored to their original levels which were hardly generous in the first place.
There is therefore no real financial incentive to write articles, the satisfaction comes from sharing your work in print and helping to support the hobby. The articles you see in the magazine are a mixture of items from the regular contributors supplemented by occasional or one off pieces by the readership. Sometimes the Editor will be sent a kit or some other modeling item to review and will pass it on to who they feel is best placed to write the review. In the case of a kit the reviewer can usually keep it but there is a sting in the tail that if it is a working model the reviewer usually has to supply the motor(s), radio and anything else not included in the kit needed to make it work. This frequently adds up to far more than the reviewer is paid for the finished article. I reviewed two of the SLEC Fairey kits and was out of pocket on both but I enjoyed the builds, now have two boats I like and the article fee did at least subsidise the fit out.
The items in the Reader's Models section are not paid for but the owners have the pleasure of seeing their work in the magazine for just a photo and a short description.
When I edited four Special Issues between 2010 and 2015 I was given a very small budget indeed as they were promotional ones with some sort of tie up with W H Smith. On the plus side I had a lot of experienced contributors to commission articles from but they understandably expected the normal page rates which meant that I had to put around half of each issue together myself by writing new articles and recycling classic material from the archives. It was a lot of effort and financially I was working at negligible hourly rates. But I had the time available and a lot of it was fun. Sadly, many of those I commissioned to write articles are no longer with us and their loss is keenly felt which is why we need to encourage new people to send articles in. That way we can recruit more regular contributors to keep the magazine on a strong footing.
Colin
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Well done everybody now time to put this to sleep. Just one final thought without input no mag. :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-))
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before we put this one to bed i've just noticed something. i subcribed via the previous publisher and viewed through pocketmags online. The may issue has not appearred anyone have any ideas on that onecheers phil
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There is a note in the May issue about the sale of the magazine which includes the following:
Please rest assured that regardless of whether you subscribe or purchase copies of the magazine from your local newsagent, plans have already been put in place to ensure a seamless transition. We will of course keep you updated on any minor changes such as revised contract details ensuing from the handover.
There is no specific reference to digital editions. On the contents page the contact for subscriptions is still [email protected] Tel:01507 529529
Colin
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Good point Phil I hadn't noticed that. I currently access the magazine (as well as getting a paper copy) via the Model Boats Magazine forum and then Archive and so I'm no longer getting what I've paid for!
Chris
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Hi Colin and ye all
Well I pulled my finger out and sent my first article to Model Boats Magazine.
So I am hoping it will be published.
I have started writing up a few more including a new build and another restoration.
Our boating section of the club was down to only five at one point but we have about twenty members to date.
Harry
That's a coincidence Harry as I'm doing the same thing! Wrote an article a few weeks ago which I've still got to make some minor tweaks to and then it can be submitted - already got the Ok from the ed. Did some on it last night but must pull my digit out as well! %) Got ideas for at least one or two more after that but being late to the party anyway as regards model boats I won't be able to do it for long!
As regards model boats versus model railways they are like chalk and cheese and there are many and varied reasons why one is far more popular than the other which have been discussed at length before. Model boats are only going one way and as said enjoy the hobby whilst you can.
Chris