Model Boat Mayhem

The Shipyard ( Dry Dock ): Builds & Questions => Yachts and Sail => Topic started by: Charlie on March 30, 2009, 03:39:14 pm

Title: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Charlie on March 30, 2009, 03:39:14 pm
Can anyone advise the name and manufacturer of the ARTR Yacht, the Volvo round the world racer, that is in this months MM mag? It looks quite good and i fancy getting one.

Cheers,

Charlie
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: MikeK on March 30, 2009, 04:04:55 pm
Hi, the kit box data at the end of the article is as follows :
Manufacturer/Supplier CML Distribution
Length 950mm
Height 1550mm
Weight 3050g
Sail Area 4100 cm2
Cost £169.99 (indicative price, please check current price) plus p&p UK £8

Hope this helps

Mike
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Charlie on March 30, 2009, 04:23:02 pm
Thanks Mike  :-))
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on March 30, 2009, 05:45:38 pm
That does look pretty darn smart, doesn't it?

Mind you, those dagger board thingies that they lower on the leeward side (I think......) don't look clever sticking up above the deck. And they don't operate on the model, so they are both in the up position all the time.

Wish I understood the theory of them, but  if they work I expect we'll start seeing them on IOMs soon, until they get banned of course.  ok2
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Tester on March 30, 2009, 06:33:03 pm
The dagger boards are used when the keel is canted out to windward to reduce the leeway as the keel gets effectively shorter. On some of the proto Mini Transat boats, they have one canting dagger board just to make things complicated.
So not really much use unless you have a canting keel.

The boats look quite nice from a sports boat point of view, be interesting to see how they sail.

Richard


Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: MikeK on March 31, 2009, 08:19:12 am
Looks nice, it certainly will give the fish a fright with all those bright orange appendages bearing down on them !  :}

Mike
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on March 31, 2009, 09:22:53 am
Richard,

Thanks for that, I see what they're meant to do now.

On the pics you've posted, is that first one a model? It's got no crew and the sails, mast and booms etc look model scale, but the water looks 'full size'. Perhaps it's a BIG model!  :-)

And I'm assuming that the second pair show the CML boat, and one pic shows the dagger board down. The MMI article seems to intimate that they don't actually work, but it looks as if they do.
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Tester on March 31, 2009, 10:03:22 am
Both the pics are from the CML site, I think a bit of "artistic license" in the first one with the sea background.

I haven't seen the MMI article so wouldn't mind a scan if possible or I'll go and have a look in the local newsagent and see if I can find a copy

Richard
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Tester on April 04, 2009, 06:17:54 pm
Managed to find a copy of MMI and read the review today.
Sounds like it could be a nice boat but I'm not too sure why the reviewer kept referring to the dagger boards as stabilisers and then going on to give a completely wrong description of what they are and why they're used. He also spoke about water ballast which was applicable to the last type of boat not the one represented here.

Richard
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on July 13, 2009, 10:59:47 pm
In a sort of 'what goes around, comes around' thingie I bought the actual Model Boats review model of this Volvo Open 70 while I was at the Weymouth Festival this weekend, urged on by my wife no less! She got very enthusiastic about the orange/black colour scheme and reckons it looks really good.

I didn't have a chance to sail the model at Weymouth but after a bit of fettling at home took her down to my local lake here this morning and had about 20 mins on the water before more water started to fall on us from above! Piccies below and as you can see the extra daggerboards weren't installed on the model. Looking at the 2nd pic perhaps I should have used some.....  :-)

She sails pretty well but the mainsail needs some adjustment to make it work well, it's far too loose footed at present, but I'm working on it.
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: portside II on July 13, 2009, 11:07:07 pm
are they supposed to lean over like that ?  :o .
daz
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on July 14, 2009, 08:03:27 am
are they supposed to lean over like that ?  :o .
daz

Daz,

Only when your mate (who's a died in the wool powerboat skipper) is at the helm and asks 'What do I do now?' as he hauls the main sheet in, while under the impression he's 'throttling back'........  {-)
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: tigertiger on July 14, 2009, 12:50:49 pm
She looks to be a little under balasted, like most ARTRs
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: portside II on July 14, 2009, 06:25:04 pm
thats what i thought  as there dont seem to be much wind disturbance on the water .
daz
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on July 16, 2009, 05:32:05 pm
The ballast weight is about the same mass as the ETNZ yacht, but the fin is quite a bit shorter, perhaps 2-3". All that helps to miss the shallows in my local lake, but doesn't keep the boat all that upright in the squalls, which are legion with the wind from some directions, as it was that day.

I'm going to re-rig the mainsail and adjust the Tx, as the winch servo is very sensitive as supplied, then see if that improves things.
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: portside II on July 16, 2009, 05:47:11 pm
would it not help to increase the weight of the bulb , not that i know anything about yachts  :-)) .
daz
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on July 16, 2009, 10:46:47 pm
Probably, but that's SERIOUS engineering. Or it would be for me anyway, so that would be my last desperate step.  :-)
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: portside II on July 17, 2009, 12:37:38 am
See i told you i dont know anything about yachts :-))
daz
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Jumper on August 01, 2009, 06:54:23 pm
Hi kitS

Did you get any problem with the yacht shipping water through the underwater ports where the dagger boards go through?

Yours aye

Jumper
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on August 01, 2009, 08:38:29 pm
Jumper,

No, not at all.

The dagger board access holes are plain slots that go clean through the hull and out the bottom with no access to the interior, so the water can't go anywhere apart from into the slot. I suspect that will be causing some un-needed drag and I may fill the bottom of the slots with filler later on. Anything for that last 0.000001 knot.   ok2
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Jumper on August 02, 2009, 01:06:09 pm
Mmmmmm

Must be going blind in my old age - Just looked at my one again and I now see that the slots go all the way through the hull.

Next question, where is all the wet stuff coming from? - will float test it in the bath.

Aye

Jumper
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: tigertiger on August 02, 2009, 01:35:28 pm
The most common places for water to get in, that I can think of, are:


No.1 - Through the hatch. This happens when the deck is awash, either heeled over or on choppy water.

No. 2 - Through the keel tube or rudder tube, if they are not glued fully home. Sometimes the glue cracks. This could also apply to the fin slots, where the joind at deckand hull with this model.

No. 3 -Minute cracks in the hull around the keel slot in the bottom of the hull. These can be repaired fairly easily.

I am sure there are others.
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on August 02, 2009, 01:43:05 pm
Jumper,

I'd go with Tigertiger's first suggestion.

The hatches are not sealed that well, and when it heels a LOT, as it does, you can't avoid splash events. I was thinking of using the old 'grease and rubber' technique to re-seal the hatches, but that'll have to wait till after I've taken the 'Black Yacht' on holiday first.

With a BIG bilge pump!  ok2
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Jumper on August 02, 2009, 02:50:12 pm
Hi Kit,

Going to go with TT - float tested the hull and we have a watertight compartment - always a blessing - so must be the goffers coming over the deck.

Will do some remedial on the hatch combings see if I can improve it.

See you in Lydney - where you sail the beggar?

Aye

Jumper
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: tigertiger on August 07, 2009, 02:39:43 am
***Topic tidied up***
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on August 15, 2009, 02:19:05 am
Today I made a few mods to the Volvo, added a transom plug so I can drain the bilges after sailing and installed a new eyelet on the clew of the mainsail. The eyelet is about 3/4" forward of the existing one and about 1/4" liower, this means I can haul the foot of the sail tighter and minimise the flapping that it exhibited beforehand. My theory is that the mainsail just stopped working under some conditions, slowing the boat and allowing the jib to take charge.

It seems to have worked anyway, the boat is easier to control in gusty winds and it's downwind performance is much improved. What it won't do is turn through the wind very well when tacking. Quite often I found the boat in irons when sailing this evening, odd when it has TWO rudders.

The drain plug worked a treat, good thing too considering the amount of water that drained out of it!
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Robert Davies on August 19, 2009, 12:54:05 am
Quite often I found the boat in irons when sailing this evening, odd when it has TWO rudders.

Water doesn't scale down....

I suspect - but can't prove - that the water flow from one rudder is possibly 'stalling' the water flow from the other rudder, and vice versa. So in effect I'm suggesting that instead of two sharp rudders slicing through the water, it amounts to pulling one very wide and blunt one with little or no no directional presence. This effect will only generate (probably) at certain angles of attack of the rudder.

Or I could be talking bilge....

-Rob

ps Nice looking boat, but that main sail doesn't look terribly effective as you've surmised.
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on August 19, 2009, 10:20:03 am
Rob,

I like the theory, you could well be right about the 'wide blunt rudder' business.

I must admit my technique when tacking is to just heave the stick over as far as it will go in an effort to turn the boat through the wind as fast as possible. Perhaps a litttle more finesse is called for and I ought to ease the helm over, which may alleviate the 'stalled rudder' syndrome? I'll try that next time.

In the meanwhile I'm changing the Rx to 40Mhz as there's a couple of kids who 'drive' (the word being used in its WIDEST possible sense...) some buggies in the park where I sail, and they hadn't a clue what I was talking about when I asked them what frequency they were on. As it turned out one of their sets was on blue, and the Volvo is on green, a tad too close for my liking, thus the change to 40 Mhz.
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Tester on August 19, 2009, 12:19:42 pm
One thing which might explain the sluggish turns is the vertical angle of the rudders. On big boats with two rudders they are optimized with the angle of heel to get the blade down into the water, thus the windward rudder can be almost out of the water and has little effect.

If your rudders are vertical to the hull you may get the symptoms you describe.
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on August 19, 2009, 03:28:51 pm
Yes, they surely are vertical. An interesting thought that, and I've found a few photos on the Net that show canted rudders as you describe.

Quite how I'd modify the Volvo though I'm not sure. The rudder shafts were presumably bonded to the lower hull before the deck moulding was added, as their centre lines are outboard of the small access hatch but about 0.5" and they'd be the devil to get at, although not impossible hopefully. I'll think about that mod when I get back from holiday.
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: Channel on August 26, 2010, 09:40:46 pm
Can the mast/sail be taken down easily for transporting?

Thanks
Chris
Title: Re: What is that ARTR Yacht in this months MM?
Post by: KitS on August 27, 2010, 09:53:06 am
Chris,

Can the mast/sail be taken down easily for transporting?

Depends what you mean by 'easily'......

You need to loosen and un-hook the shrouds, jib fore-stay and the main backstays, which isn't too difficult, but you lose any adjustments you've made to tune the boat of course. The biggest pain is casting off the jib and main sheets, which are attached half way along the respective booms by winding them around cleats. It's not difficult actually un-doing them, or putting them back on again, but getting the main adjusted to the winch, and relative to the jib setting again means re-tuning the whole boat.

After doing that the first time I've left it masted and sailed as it will go in my car OK fully rigged. I have an old model Zafira and it fits between the front and back seats, angled back so the masthead clears the roof. I've also carried it laid it on its side on top of the luggage bay blind and other luggage, with the middle seats pushed all the way forward. It travelled all the way to the Isle of Man like that without any problems, with the bulb up against the back of the middle seats.