Model Boat Mayhem

Technical, Techniques, Hints, and Tips => The "Black Arts!" ( Electrics & Electronics ) => Topic started by: FullLeatherJacket on June 01, 2009, 03:04:37 PM

Title: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 01, 2009, 03:04:37 PM
(http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u136/131251milbs/RTFM.jpg)

RTFM..............

(and this week's hair-shirt goes to................?????)

FLJ
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: regiment on June 01, 2009, 03:12:54 PM
from a thicky on eletrics what is it
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: warspite on June 01, 2009, 03:19:30 PM
TUG speed controller ? mid range amperage

linked to something like a sound generator ?
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 01, 2009, 03:45:42 PM
"It blew a fuse every time I connected it up to the battery"
Look again............there may  be a prize involved.
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Proteus on June 01, 2009, 04:05:53 PM
you mean the pos and neg the wrong way around on the battery side

Proteus
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Peterm on June 01, 2009, 05:26:06 PM
I am probably making an idiot of myself, but why is the motor marked as 10A and not the fuse?   Pete M
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 01, 2009, 06:24:40 PM
I am probably making an idiot of myself, but why is the motor marked as 10A and not the fuse?   Pete M

Because it's a 10A load, Pete. It just happens  to be a motor. The accompanying text explains fuses, but I didn't show that bit here.

Now who's the idiot who can't turn a diagram round so it is in the same plane as the esc DOH my head hurts
Stav

I'll introduce you one day, maybe?

FLJ
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: hollowhornbear on June 01, 2009, 06:51:04 PM
surely one terminal block should be power in the other power out, or am i stupid  %%
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 01, 2009, 07:43:01 PM
Just compare the diagram to the photo and spot the difference - 't ain't rocket science (or maybe it is..................).
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: John W E on June 01, 2009, 08:18:31 PM
could this be an inverting subject then?
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 01, 2009, 08:32:51 PM
could this be an inverting subject then?
I'll let you know, Bloobs. Opinions are somewhat polarised at present................ ok2
FLJ
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: DickyD on June 01, 2009, 09:21:58 PM
Is the diagram of the underneath and you've used it to wire everything up the other way up ?
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Stavros on June 01, 2009, 09:39:20 PM
(http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u136/131251milbs/RTFM.jpg)

RTFM..............

(and this week's hair-shirt goes to................?????)

FLJ

This is how it should have been

(http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo295/broomsrck/untitledjk.jpg)
(http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo295/broomsrck/untitledmbn.jpg)

Now spot where the red and black wires are on the esc and compare to the diagram which now has been turned around thus enabling whoever to wire it up correctly,and stop FLJ going Greyer than he is !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Stav


Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: andyn on June 01, 2009, 09:44:57 PM
Wired the load into the battery?

Tell us when someone gets it...
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Stavros on June 01, 2009, 09:47:46 PM
Andy study the diagram CAREFULLY just look at diagram and then look at where the red and black are fitted to on the esc spotted something yet,if not then stick to your petrol engines ;)


Stav



Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: andyn on June 01, 2009, 09:52:05 PM
I noticed that before the second post here but it was said before I posted and FLJ ignored that...
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: OMK on June 01, 2009, 10:08:10 PM
Oh, I see... The red wire goes to the red wire near the wire near the black one, and the other one goes to the one near the red wire located near the other red wire nearest the black one. Consequently, any electromotive force is not going backwards like it should and the black one isn't going forwards, so if the red one and the other red one were inversely connected as per the sketch, means that the black wire nearest the red wire would have to carry more Joules than the wire near the regulator. No wonder the fuse keeps popping because the very first black wire has a knot in it, thereby creating a high impedence turboelectroluminescent foldback loop in the back EMF circuitry. In effect, it means  that the motor will essentially counteract any locally-induced nano-picopharads being imposed upon the red terminal, and that other red wire is there to help the flow of electrons reaching the red wire near the red wire next to the black one. In turn, the heat generated from the fuse at the point of rupture will alter the 93.7 millisecond pulse from the quasi-pseudo random access rombomblistic generator... which is good, because all you need then is connect delta-star configuration at the point of potential energy. Then, in order to allow to fuse to pop at its HRC rating, you would have to wrap the fuse in a length of aluminium foil. Sainsburys sell ten-metre rolls of foil for 0.30p and would serve as a perfect ohmic quasi-doubler when induced with sufficient juice form the black return wire.

Easy-peasy!
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Stavros on June 01, 2009, 10:10:05 PM
PMK go to the top of the class O0 O0 O0


Oh we dont use kitchen foil down here we use 6inch Nails



Stav
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: malcolmfrary on June 01, 2009, 10:32:19 PM
PMK go to the top of the class O0 O0 O0


Oh we dont use kitchen foil down here we use 6inch Nails



Stav
Agreed. 6 inch nails are much more reliable than kitchen foil.
And PMK left out the the transperambulation of pseudo-cosmic anti-matter, but if he will insist on kitchen foil, this is understandable.
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: OMK on June 01, 2009, 10:43:29 PM
Bummer - I clean-clear forgot about the pseudo-cosmic anti-matter inversed-phased dilithium x-tals.
B&Q should have them... along with the formahydride resin-dipped, 6-inch fool-proof nails.


(Sorry, FLJ. I'm done).
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 01, 2009, 11:12:14 PM
Stavros and AndyN both win the carrot. I only hung back a bit to see what else came up. Most illuminating............. 8)

(Note to PMK - why not just put away Stallspeed's latest book and stick to The House at Pooh Corner? Less pain in the brain, m' dear).

FLJ                           



and, no......I won't tell you who it was!
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: andyn on June 01, 2009, 11:17:52 PM
When can I collect this carrot? We have no food in this house...
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 01, 2009, 11:27:38 PM
When can I collect this carrot? We have no food in this house...

"For a hamburger today you may pay me Tuesday..............."
Discuss (600 words)
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: BarryM on June 02, 2009, 08:40:12 AM
It's an electronic carrot held in stasis in hyperspace within a black hole. You will need to reach Warp Factor 10 in order to reach it. I believe FLJ can supply the necessary components (in kit form) to achieve this but the cost of assembly may be rather high.
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: andrewh on June 02, 2009, 10:17:05 AM
Barry,

Its worse that that! 
The E-carrot achieves such a proportion of C that you cannot specify its location AND velocity.  So FLJ can never know where it stock is once it is assembled and tested.  The perils of success :}

RTFM is short for Read The Fine Manual, isn't it?  Do you sell a lot to Spain and Mehico?

andrew
as serious as the next man
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: BarryM on June 02, 2009, 10:53:15 AM
Given that FLJ only supplies the assembly manual written in Alpha Centaurean and assembling the starship requires an acreage the size of Basingstoke, I imagine he will have emptied his Swiss bank account and retired to his tax haven before Andyn expires from carrot deprivation.

Mind you, submitting a planning application to demolish Basingstoke and build a starship assembly dock does have its good points.  %)
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Martin [Admin] on June 02, 2009, 11:08:32 AM
One's only a diagram???
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 02, 2009, 11:25:34 AM
I'm encouraged to see that this thread has descended into the chaos I had forseen............. %) The Emperor will be well pleased with this day's work.

Martin
Well spotted! Have a Gold Star to stick on your "Who's a Very Clever Boy?" chart (Free with this week's edition of 'Carrot Strangling for Beginners' Part 1b).

Is Basingstoke in Switzerland, then? And, if not, why  not?

FLJ

Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: DickyD on June 02, 2009, 11:58:45 AM
This has got to be the first topic by you boffins that I have ever understood :-))
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 02, 2009, 12:20:26 PM
This has got to be the first topic by you boffins that I have ever understood :-))

Aaaaaaaargh! Back to base sharpish, boys - the Feds have twigged the plot!!
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: The long Build on June 02, 2009, 01:12:00 PM
It's an electronic carrot held in stasis in hyperspace within a black hole. You will need to reach Warp Factor 10 in order to reach it. I believe FLJ can supply the necessary components (in kit form) to achieve this but the cost of assembly may be rather high.

warp factor  10 !! why go so slow when you can use the   Infinite Improbability Drive , thus be every where at the same time.. :}

However this should be used carefuly as

"An earlier attempt at using the improbability drive, Starship Titanic,  In theory, the infinite improbability drive would make it infinitely improbable that anything would go wrong. It was not successful, however, ending in a "Spontaneous Massive Existence Failure." This was because, in these earlier times when the nature of improbability was less well understood, it was not appreciated that any event that is infinitely improbable will, by definition, occur almost immediately." %%

Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: BarryM on June 02, 2009, 01:32:01 PM
Hang on, before I put my order into Daddy Bigbucks FLJ, what frequency do a Starship's dilithium crystals operate on?

Barry M

PS Basingstoke is not in Switzerland because the Swiss are neutrals. It's something in the water.  O0
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Martin [Admin] on June 02, 2009, 01:46:56 PM
Should be something like this?
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: malcolmfrary on June 02, 2009, 01:52:53 PM
Quote
PS Basingstoke is not in Switzerland because the Swiss are neutrals. It's something in the water. 
I thought it was because they have Toblerone, cuckoo clocks and the best manicured fighting forces in history, and they had to draw a line somewhere.
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Martin [Admin] on June 02, 2009, 01:54:48 PM
BTW FLJ, Just reading back on my Condor 20/2 build, can you tell us a little something about solder
used these days and how it differs from the old multicore lead solder I know and love?
http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=5996.0
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: andyn on June 02, 2009, 02:07:28 PM
No worries people, I found the carrot...

(http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll184/andyn_01/DSCN3645-1.jpg)
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 02, 2009, 02:17:26 PM
Martin (thank gawd for a sensible question...)

We industrial types are now required By Law to use only lead-free solder, unless it's for repairing a unit which was made with the "old" stuff or for various esoteric purposes like medical research equipment. No doubt the Dept of Silly Rules has a comprehensive and incomprehensible list of permissible uses. The old stuff has a small lead content which allows a lower temperature to be used - typically 270C - while the Pb-Free stuff has none (hence the epithet "lead-free"). It's harder when cool but requires more heat to melt it - I use 300C - and eats away at soldering iron tips a lot faster. I much prefer to use the old stuff because IMHO it gives a neater joint and is easier to work with, but we daren't use it for commercial purposes on pain of Very Nasty Euro-Things happening to us.
 
Our starship kits are four hundred thousand standard Galactic Credits and include ready-scrooned and fottered dilithium crystals. They are best assembled with beef dripping but some users advocate lime marmalade instead, especially on Wednesdays. Just follow the easy-to-follow wiring diagram, not forgetting to take the third left after the lights in Harpenden.

I am reliably informed that lead-free Toblerone is only available in Basingstoke to practising human beings..... Proof of postcode may be required, too.

Darth Vaguer
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: dreadnought72 on June 02, 2009, 02:45:19 PM
No worries people, I found the carrot...

(http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll184/andyn_01/DSCN3645-1.jpg)

Sorry Andy - but I've seen The Matrix. There is no carrot. There is only yourself.  %%

Andy
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: BarryM on June 02, 2009, 02:53:27 PM
It's nae guid, Cap'n, that carrot canna take it any longer; it's about to explode and blow us all across the known Universe and Basingstoke. Beam me up, the noo!!!

Scotty McScott

(Dilithium crystal polisher and fluent in Hollywood Scots)
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Martin [Admin] on June 02, 2009, 02:59:00 PM
...... I think the unexpected good weather is getting to some people...!  %%
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: andyn on June 02, 2009, 03:01:26 PM
...... I think the unexpected good weather is getting to some people...!  %%

Must be the heat...
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Circlip on June 02, 2009, 04:03:48 PM
So if someone had a few reels of the "Old Stuff" would their fortunes be made to be able to retire in semi - poverty as opposed to abject poverty???  :embarrassed:

  Regards  Ian
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: barriew on June 02, 2009, 04:24:40 PM
So if someone had a few reels of the "Old Stuff" would their fortunes be made to be able to retire in semi - poverty as opposed to abject poverty???  :embarrassed:

  Regards  Ian

No - because you can only sell it to us oldies, and we have no money either {-)

Barrie
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Circlip on June 02, 2009, 04:29:31 PM
OH  Bum  :((
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: andrewh on June 02, 2009, 05:03:18 PM
The old stuff is still readily available from a supplier who advertises in one of the comics - FLJ was very precise about what he said about lead-free solder.  I will see if i can find the web site

I find the new and improved A) needs 400deg C or more at the iron
B) has more surface tension or is less fluid than the old stuff - so it makes unsightly blobbles rather than wetting and flowing

andrew

Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Bill D203 on June 02, 2009, 07:18:12 PM
As an Electrical engineer and part time Sound engineer I have had no probs with the new type solder. I am nearing the end of my second roll and every joint has been fine. We will all get the hang of the new stuff just the same as we got used to not having leaded petrol at the pumps.
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: red181 on June 02, 2009, 07:28:41 PM
did Proteus not answer the question right at the beginning, pray tell FLJ, if that was the correct answer, what prize will he get???? and why have subsequent "same" answers been awarded the gold star!, dont tell me? Its an mmb motor! or one of those "p" action controller thingys that are all the rage right now:}

Did the person who asked for the help realise he was going to be the victim of this thread? >>:-(
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: OMK on June 02, 2009, 07:37:38 PM
"We will all get the hang of the new stuff just the same as we got used to not having leaded petrol at the pumps.".

Good point. But the main difference 'tween unleaded fuel and unleaded solder is that unleaded fuel is, without argument, better for the environment, whereas unleaded solder wil never be as good as as the leaded variety. Electrical engineers such as yourself, and the one-man-band play-at-home types are hardly having any detrimental effect upon the enviro'.
Speaking on a personal level I know I shall have a damn good cry when mine is all gone.
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Bill D203 on June 02, 2009, 07:53:59 PM
"We will all get the hang of the new stuff just the same as we got used to not having leaded petrol at the pumps.".

Good point. But the main difference 'tween unleaded fuel and unleaded solder is that unleaded fuel is, without argument, better for the environment, whereas unleaded solder Will never be as good as as the leaded variety. Electrical engineers such as yourself, and the one-man-band play-at-home types are hardly having any detrimental effect upon the enviro'.
Speaking on a personal level I know I shall have a damn good cry when mine is all gone.
You will be fine. The change over is not as bad as most make it out to be. Clean the tip of the Iron and you can't go far wrong. Yes us small time users are not causing a global problem but manufactures of solder have a bigger customer base to worry about.
I think they worry that folks that use it are going to chew it and get leaded !!!
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 02, 2009, 08:10:02 PM
did Proteus not answer the question right at the beginning, pray tell FLJ
Yep
if that was the correct answer, what prize will he get????
A carrot
and why have subsequent "same" answers been awarded the gold star!
They're my  stars and I'll give them to who I like, so there.....
dont tell me? Its an mmb motor! or one of those "p" action controller thingys that are all the rage right now:}
OK - I won't tell you.
Did the person who asked for the help realise he was going to be the victim of this thread? >>:-(
Probably not - we don't usually consult our legal representatives before we converse, but he has a keenly developed sense of fun and can recognise a leg-pull when he sees one.

It's just a bit of fun, sir; nothing more.

FLJ
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: OMK on June 02, 2009, 08:15:42 PM
"You will be fine.".

Thanks!
In all honesty, I have used the leaded sort and, much to my surprise, really isn't as bad as I had expected. Stiil not as good as leaded, but it is useable. I guess my main gripe would be the speed in which it eats away the iron's tip - no matter how much you moisten/clean them. At nearly 5.00 per shot, iron tips aren't so cheap nowadays.

Thanks for the encouraging advice.


By the by, do you reckon anyone of us might be elligible for one of FLJ's hair shirts by now?
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Marks Model Bits on June 02, 2009, 08:19:48 PM
I'll have a couple of pints of whatever Dave is on..................  Is it Ye Olde Stonk Knobbler again Dave??  :P :P :P :P %% %% %%


Mark.
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: OMK on June 02, 2009, 08:24:16 PM
"It's just a bit of fun, sir; nothing more."

Ain't it a bitch when you have to justify something so obviously obvious.
Make 'em wear that hair shirt on a scorching-hot day, maybe?  %)

Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: Timo2 on June 02, 2009, 08:51:20 PM
Did the person who asked for the help realise he was going to be the victim of this thread? >>:-(
Probably not - we don't usually consult our legal representatives before we converse, but he has a keenly developed sense of fun and can recognise a leg-pull when he sees one.

FLJ
[/quote]

This Poor person must  <:(  will be trying to hide or he will come all guns firing  <*<

Timo2
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: BarryM on June 02, 2009, 10:53:24 PM
did Proteus not answer the question right at the beginning, pray tell FLJ
Yep
if that was the correct answer, what prize will he get????
A carrot
and why have subsequent "same" answers been awarded the gold star!
They're my  stars and I'll give them to who I like, so there.....
dont tell me? Its an mmb motor! or one of those "p" action controller thingys that are all the rage right now:}
OK - I won't tell you.
Did the person who asked for the help realise he was going to be the victim of this thread? >>:-(
Probably not - we don't usually consult our legal representatives before we converse, but he has a keenly developed sense of fun and can recognise a leg-pull when he sees one.

It's just a bit of fun, sir; nothing more.

FLJ


So who won the Toblerone then?
Title: Re: If all else fails...........
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on June 02, 2009, 11:10:12 PM
Timo2
I couldn't have put it better myself, sir!

BarryM
I did, but it was my  Toblerone to start with..................... ;D

FLJ