Model Boat Mayhem

Mess Deck: General Section => Chit-Chat => Topic started by: regiment on August 18, 2010, 02:41:05 pm

Title: cold weather payment
Post by: regiment on August 18, 2010, 02:41:05 pm
goverment is thinking of cutting cold weather payments  but why is is being paid to people who are 60 and still working  i thought it was for retired  people only my mate owns a caravan site not 65 and he gets it told the dhss did not want it got to have it your right gives it away to a charity now
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: gingyer on August 18, 2010, 02:56:19 pm
According to the radio ex-pats living in austalia and Spain are
Getting the payments also  >>:-( >>:-(

Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Circlip on August 18, 2010, 03:00:40 pm
Yep, cos they paid into the "System" while here :-))

  Good screw from Civil (?) Servants, "You give us a pound and when you retire, we give you back 2 1/2 p ??" Pension.

  Much cheaper than giving EVERY new born £250 and increasing it by the same amount TWICE by the time they're 18.

  Regards  Ian
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: tugmad on August 18, 2010, 03:28:01 pm
well what about all those who have not paid into the system,they get more than those that have paid all their life, it makes me mad >>:-( >>:-( <*< <*<
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Circlip on August 18, 2010, 04:07:48 pm
One of the "Advantages" of having had an Empire.  ;)

  Regards  Ian.
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: regiment on August 18, 2010, 04:24:16 pm
i have to pay for my glasses and dentist why.. because i get a RAF pension also my ss pension should have been a scroungier then i would have got them free
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: sweeper on August 18, 2010, 05:12:42 pm
Perhaps someone could provide an answer to this aspect of winter fuel payments.

Why do residents in care homes (who have no fuel bills) get the allowance?
I know it happens because my late Mother used to receive it - much to her amusement.
Just thinking of the large numbers of such residents, the outlay must be sizeable.
Nice little Christmas bonus for them though, and the powers that be claim they are trying to save money?
 
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Made it to 80 (25p Richer now) on August 18, 2010, 05:31:12 pm
Sweeper i think you will find that the winter fuel payment is per house-hold so if one person in the house-hold is over 60 then the payment is £250 if there are two or more persons in the house-hold the payment is still £250 it therefor follows that care homes etc only get one payment of £250 i could be wrong and I am sure that the barrack room lawyers here will soon put me right
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: gingyer on August 18, 2010, 05:51:52 pm
when you look at the amount of money that is being paid out by the government
they keep saying that they need to cut the amount of money being spent

easiest way put somebody with a brain cell into the treasury.

Circlip is right about the £250 payment when a child is born....I think it was to encourage kids to save their money by having a bank account a £5 does the same :-))
I never knew about the money for 18 year olds the majority have 2 legs let them stand on them!
there is a scary amount of kids these day know exactly what they a "due" from the government before the leave school into the real world.
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Colin Bishop on August 18, 2010, 05:54:00 pm
The principle behind every household with a qualifying person (usually over 60) getting the payment is that it is cheaper to do this than to introduce means testing. Whether this is true I don't know.

Quote from Citizens Advice Bureau:

If you live in a care home, you get a reduced rate of Winter Fuel Payment. In 2009/10, this is £125 or £200 if you are 80 or over. However, if you live in a care home and get Pension Credit, income-based Jobseeker’s Allowance or income-related Employment and Support Allowance (ESA), you will not get a Winter Fuel Payment at all.

Incidentally, I also have a free bus pass but I virtually never use it, and then only for non essential journeys on half empty buses which are already scheduled so it isn't actually costing the taxpayer anything.

Colin
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: dodgy geezer on August 18, 2010, 06:28:51 pm
Joined-up government.....

One department decides to cut winter fuel payments to the elderly to save money

Another department is busy raising the price of fuel in order to cut 'carbon emissions' in line with EU mandates

And I suspect a third group have just cut staffing for the mortuaries by 50%

This is one way to lower the population. Roll on another winter like the last.....   
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: funtimefrankie on August 18, 2010, 06:44:42 pm
The ConDems will be wanting to cut the Old Age Pension, next, if they think you have a private pension
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Bryan Young on August 18, 2010, 06:50:58 pm
This "winter fuel payment" really is a can of worms, isn't it. Come on now. Everyone of whatever political allegiance must agree that leaving "elderly" people to freeze in their own homes is not a good idea. But where do you put the dividing line between "deserving" and "not deserving"? Methinks that it would be an expensive nightmare to administrate, and so the present system is probably the cheapest option. Having said that, a friend of mine (expat English) who lives in Barcelona is also grateful for it. His house like most of those in warmer climes are built to be cool in summer....but can be bloody freezing in winter. I also don't really think that "fraud" plays much of a part here, unlike some other aspects of "benefits". If it ain't broke then don't try to fix it. BY.
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Bryan Young on August 18, 2010, 06:53:01 pm
This "winter fuel payment" really is a can of worms, isn't it. Come on now. Everyone of whatever political allegiance must agree that leaving "elderly" people to freeze in their own homes is not a good idea. But where do you put the dividing line between "deserving" and "not deserving"? Methinks that it would be an expensive nightmare to administrate, and so the present system is probably the cheapest option. Having said that, a friend of mine (expat English) who lives in Barcelona is also grateful for it. His house like most of those in warmer climes are built to be cool in summer....but can be bloody freezing in winter. I also don't really think that "fraud" plays much of a part here, unlike some other aspects of "benefits". If it ain't broke then don't try to fix it. BY.
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: DickyD on August 18, 2010, 07:08:39 pm
Got you the first time Bryan and I agree with you, pay it to everyone and save on the administration.

I would also like to say thanks for mine. :-))
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Bee on August 18, 2010, 09:10:39 pm
Last time this came up I suggested it should take account of the relative weather in different areas. It is after all for heating and it does not take many brain cells to know that Scotland and the north are colder than the south east and Parliament. Phase one could adjust based on mean temperatures by county. Then with a little further data processing it can be further refined by post code, to take into account that a hill farm in Yorkshire is rather cooler than a seaside town in Kent using the ordnance survey data to understand altitude, aspect etc. There are lots of websites that tell you insolation and windspeed by location so the information is already there.


Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Colin Bishop on August 18, 2010, 09:44:55 pm
Then you just need somebody to write a few million letters with the appropriate amounts...
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: dodgy geezer on August 18, 2010, 09:56:48 pm
Then you just need somebody to write a few million letters with the appropriate amounts...

Don't knock it!  Bee has just created a whole new government department - the Department of Weather! Staffed with 3000 civil servants and costing 2p in the pound on income tax.....
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: malcolmfrary on August 18, 2010, 10:44:08 pm
Quote
i get a RAF pension also my ss pension
Didn't know you could be in both.........
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: funtimefrankie on August 19, 2010, 07:15:19 am
"Cold weather payment " and "winter fuel payment" are two different things
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Colin Bishop on August 19, 2010, 09:17:32 am
Very good point! The diescussion has been about Winter Fuel Payments so the topic needs to be renamed.
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: regiment on August 19, 2010, 09:51:30 am
yes 22 years service raf pension then at age 65 state pension
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Patternmaker on August 19, 2010, 10:10:25 am
Very good point! The diescussion has been about Winter Fuel Payments so the topic needs to be renamed.

I started the topic of WINTER FUEL PAYMENTS in February this year with 41 replies
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: sweeper on August 19, 2010, 12:26:26 pm
Younger at 70,

You may well be correct with the figures for households but the payment for people in care homes is made direct to their personal bank accounts.
This, I can assure you of as I handled my Mothers affairs until her demise.
Unless, a nice line of thought, she was selected from the list of residents to receive the amount on their behalf! Talk about winning the lottery.

I don't begrudge the elderly their various payments, I'm cracking on a bit myself! But there are genuine needy cases and some fantastic wastes in this system. Why should I worry, it's only our tax money that's being P**d up against the wall.

 
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: DickyD on August 19, 2010, 01:13:32 pm

I don't begrudge the elderly their various payments, I'm cracking on a bit myself! But there are genuine needy cases and some fantastic wastes in this system. Why should I worry, it's only our tax money that's being P**d up against the wall.

 
Mr Sweeper I am 62 years old and receive various payments including the winter fuel payment and I would like to say I dont p**s it up the wall and I AM NOT ELDERLY. >>:-( >>:-(
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Circlip on August 19, 2010, 02:27:49 pm
Quote
Didn't know you could be in both.........

  Politically incorrect Malcolm, but nevertheless very droll.

 Just to throw a leveller into the winter fuel allowance, although I keep geting letters from the Social about my right to claim this, my partner already gets this so if I put my own claim in, I could get the full amount as a separate (Fiddle) payment. Practically though, it would split the full payment into two so there is no advantage to do this, whichever of us keels over first, the other is still going to get the same amount.

 
Quote
Scotland and the north are colder
  Not the bit that faces the Gulf Stream in Scotland.

  Regards  Ian
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: malcolmfrary on August 19, 2010, 04:10:54 pm
Quote
Quote
Didn't know you could be in both.........

  Politically incorrect Malcolm, but nevertheless very droll.
A mate of mine did ask when the "D" was to be removed from "DSS".  He got a frosty look back across the counter.
That was before some politically correct wazzack, eager to shine amongst his peers, suggested that "Departments" should become "Agencies".  I dread to think what that cost in replacement stationery.
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: wbeedie on August 19, 2010, 05:22:01 pm
 
    Not the bit that faces the Gulf Stream in Scotland.

  Regards  Ian
Wish thaey told that to the weather man and the weather this year CWPs were made 12 between Dec and Mar this year due to the weatther being colder ,in fact the coldest I had seen it in 30 years living on the Isle of Skye which is supposedly warmed by the Gulf stream in fact January and February the temps were lucky to be above -9 through the days and dropping to minus 18 at night ,we have our own external thermometer as part of our ground source heating and checked it everyday ,the worst thing about CWPs is the distances involved for the measuring stations our closest one is 25 miles away and by all accounts that is closer than a lot all over the UK ,where people should have been made payments but where the temps were recorded being higher , and a wee foot note its supposed to be more of the same this winter also
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: sweeper on August 19, 2010, 05:45:49 pm
OK Dicky D,

The implication that I put forward as to wasting our tax was not, as you have taken it, by the end user but rather by our Lords and Masters who waste our cash while sitting in Westminster and/ or Whitehall.

I'm sorry if you feel that you have been slighted or offended by the post. If it's any consolation to you, I too receive the fuel allowance, I have my bus pass and thankfully I get my state pension.
And may I add, I'm a few years older than you. 
 O0
Title: Re: cold weather payment
Post by: Bryan Young on August 19, 2010, 05:59:39 pm
Mr Sweeper I am 62 years old and receive various payments including the winter fuel payment and I would like to say I dont p**s it up the wall and I AM NOT ELDERLY. >>:-( >>:-(
Calm down Dicky! No-one but no-one admits to themselves that they are either "elderly" or just plain "old". In my "younger" days all these "clubs for the over 50s" seemed to proliferate. During the 1950s, being 50 yrs old was considered to be "old" and therefore in need of some sort of enclave that they could all toddle off to, have a cup of tea and so on. I guess there is something of a historical mind-set going on here. Most people of my generation (me, born in 1940) wouldn't be at all enthused by being told by "caring" offspring to" just toddle off and have a cup of tea with your nice friends".
But let's face the facts. I agree that at age 62 you are not "old", but you are a person "of a certain age" (a modern euphamism for "elderly").
But when you get to age 70, little old ladies try to help you understand the complexities of pushing a button on either a petrol pump or a pedestrian crossing. This happens even when the 70 year old has the physique and hair of a 25 year old. Or does my mirror tell lies?  BY.