Model Boat Mayhem
The Shipyard ( Dry Dock ): Builds & Questions => Yachts and Sail => Topic started by: meatbomber on August 27, 2010, 10:31:19 am
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Hello shipmates :)
i`ve started another square rigger model. his time i felt it`s time to start with a type of build i have not tried and even dreaded before... a planked hull.
i didn`t feel confident enough to start soemthing completely from scratch so i was looking for a suitable static model kit for a conversion. I have for a long time fallen in love with the british Cruizer class Brig sloops, and lookign for a kit of it i not only found a Cruizer by Lotika Ltd but also teh Ship rigged HMS Snake, which shares the same hull and only differs in the rig. Hard decision... i love them both, but the final decision was for Snake as the kit had been recently updated.
When i got teh kit i was very impressed with teh quality and comepleteness of it`s content :)
From Jotika:
"The Snake class were ship rigged sloops. This class was very business like with a flush deck and nine cannons or carronades each side, they were very fast and seaworthy. As originally built Snake had a full ordinance of 32 pounder carronades. Carronades replaced the carriage guns because at close quarters the short range carronades proved devastating to their opponents. Class dimensions were: length 100’; breadth 30’6”; displacement 382 tons with a crew of 121."
The Scale of 1/64 allows for a model that should be well suitable for a RC conversion. a direct scale down of the 382ton displacement gives an estimate displacement of the model of 1,4kg, which should be doable... with 200g of RC, 500g of ballast and 700g for the ship.
The RC side of the ship will be 3 channels, a rudder servo that will be hidden under the small poop deck, and 2 sail winches in the hold.
I´d like to run the headsails and foremast square sail braces of teh forward winch and the main and mizzen braces as well as the spanker sheet from the second winch. Currently i have got 2 GWS single turn winches, which if possible i`d like to stretch with a servo stretcher to several turns... to get more travel, if that doesn`t work (can only be mechanical reason inside but i doubt it) i have to look for other winches or maybe go to servo arms.
now here`s a question for Jimmy james and all the rest of you guys :)
I´d liek to use not onyl braces but maybe also bowlines for the squares, in teh style of jimmies system on Firedragon. Jimmy do you have an idea on how to incorporate that with below deck winches instead of above deck capstans ?
well the answer to this has some time... i`m currently doing the second layer of planking on the hull so until i get to the point of radio installation it will be some more time ;)
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Looking pretty tidy so far - keep up the good work.
Geoff
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stbd side 2nd planking completed.. on to port side
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Phillip
Nice model To make her sail you will need a false keel As for Bowlines the simple way is from the crows foot on the starb'd side (Fore topsail ) through a block lashed to the forestay (Topmast) and back to the outer end of the foreyard on the port side You can also run it down to the port tack of the fore course instead of the yard
Jimmy
(http://s2.postimage.org/MqA8J.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=TsMqA8J)
Not a very good diagram but I did it in a hurry ,,,,,if you want I can do a better one
Freebooter
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(http://s3.postimage.org/mY0Qr.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=PqmY0Qr)
(http://s2.postimage.org/MwriS.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=TsMwriS)
This is the way I rig the crows feet
Jimmy
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got the other side done and also the bullwark inner planking done. Now it`s filling all the gaps with wallnut filler and sanding.
I made some floating test in teh tub to see how accurate my displacement estimates were and it seems i gained about 100g so i have about a total displacement of 1500g :) The hull now at this stage already weights 440g but thank god only teh deck planking to be finished, then pretty much all the structural weight is there. How much the masts and deck furniture are going to weight i don`t know yet..
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Lovely work! But I cannot imagine how you are going to get all the RC gear and winches inside!
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Yea that will be interesting won`t it :D
it`s only 2 winches installed in the hull, one under each hatch and the rudder servo will sit niext to teh tiller under the poop deck. i`m thinking of maybe adding 2 small servos (8g each) for the Jib sheets and the spanker sheet, but that depends on the weight when i have all the structure completed.
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I'm Looking forward to seeing the results
Jimmy
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got some more done with teh hull... she got the main wales and a bit of paint. m also starting to install the coppering
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got some more coppering done. it´s quite an effort, but i hope teh end result is worth it : )
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Looking great!
If this is a success, I can imagine a fleet of 1/64th scale Nelsonian ships would look awesome. O0
Andy
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Very impressed - especially the copper sheet. How is it done and how have you made the sheets - is it real
copper or the stick on copper sheet like the tape you put round plant pots to ward of the slugs.
Geoff
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Thanks guys :)
There is real copper plate that comes with teh kit, 0,15mm thick But i didn`t use the plates from the kit due to weight considerations. Searching for a lighter substitute i finaly found an aluminium foil that is copper coatedand has teh same thickneshe. I tested with 30 plates of both material and found the aluminium foil to be only 30% of the weight ! So instead of 115g of weight only about 35g at the end.
I made a jig with 10 of the original copper plates that i use to print through the nail pattern onto strips of the alu foil. goes pretty well. Afterwards i found self adhesive copper tape of exactly teh right width that would have made installing the plates far quicker and would have spared me the need to cut strips from the sheet at the same width %) but with the CA i use to stick them on now i`m at least sure they are going to stay on.
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Thanks for the explanation.
Geoff
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A picture is worth a Thousand words
Well done Phillip
Jimmy
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I completed the first half of the coppering... on to the next 500 plates...
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Coppering can be a real pain in the neck to do, but when you are finished it looks superb, and when it starts to weather and turn green there is no hull finish like it
I used to copper my hulls years ago but no longer have the patients, but I applaud any one who will do it
Jimmy :-))
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it IS a lot of work i have to say.. but ilike the end result :) coppering finished. pending clean-up of ca spills and where my sticky fingers took teh copper off
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The coppering looks very impressive! I'll have to look out for some of that copper aluminium foil myself, previously I've used real copper tape which is rather expensive and, as you say, heavy.
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Jerry Tod on RCG had a great idea of using aluminium tape (speed tape or instant airplane in aviation) it sticks extremely well, and is light, and after you`re finished you spray it copper... seems to be to me the cheapes and easiest sollution! i`ve got 2 1/24 scale models on the stocks as well that will need coppering and i`m wondering if just making teh plates with no fake nail patterns isn`t already enough
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That's bloomin' gorgeous!
Nicely done mb!
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Great job.
Question, did copper bottoms turn green after a while? Just curious is all.
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They should, but it would be a pretty mottled green i guess
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Did copper bottoms turn green?......The answer is yes...However in the North Atlantic it used to take several months.... in Tropic waters it took less time to turn green
the shade of green depended on the grade of copper and if it was wet or dry...Ive served on 2 vessel (Both large sailing vessels) one of them was freshly coppered and just out of dry dock when I joined the sheets above and just below the water line and most of the plates on the bow had to be replaced, this had to be done every 2 or 3 years as this area gets the most wear and tear, other plates would last 4,5,or 6 years but it was inspected at least once a year..
Jimmy
Freebooter
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Hi Jimmy
Do you have any pictures or tales from these days on the boats?
If you have a few it might be worth another thread. I would certainly be interested in reading about life aboard sailing ships.
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Sorry TT
Any pictures I had are long gone...that was back in the mid 60's in the Caribbean when there used to be a few small square riggers and topsail schooners still in Trade moving cargo and passangers around the islands ... Fond memories...
Freebooter :((
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Hello shipmates. I`m currently dawdeling around getting to start teh deck planked. Does anyone have a good way of doing it without permanently closign teh hatches ;) i`d be obliged for any tip..
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You can plank the hatches separately. You still get the cut line though.
You can then screw the hatch down (visible) or trust in magnets.
I did this on my model. You can see the covered hatch, below/around the wheel housing in the pic.
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Started deck planking.. i painted one side of the planks black to simulate the caulking and now find my decks will need a lot of holystoning before shes presentable to the admiral ;)
Unfortunately the cruiser hull doesn`t have much in the way of deck furniture that is wide enough to have hidden deck hatches, so i`ll just have to live with the cut lines... but then the model is small and a few meters out on the pond they should be prety much invisible.
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Phillip
I just mark the edges of my deck planks with a large black waterproof felt tip marking pen.
Jimmy
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Yea i have read this from a lot of people.. it should be the method of choice and i`ll do that with the next deck :) i`ve finished so far 3/4 of the deck planking and its quite passable now i think
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The deck Looks ok to me ... Did you get the info on reefing?
or shall I re send it .
Jimmy
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Yea i got it thanks a lot :)
Saya Jimmy on your fore bowlines and also on the main bowlines, is there an elastic somewhere ? i`m asking because the tops`travel a shorter radius than say the courses, and you pull on both the same distance.
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Phillip
no elastic needed ,the crows feet are self adjusting and you need the yards braced in a spiral any way
Jimmy
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Ok, as soon as I'm getting started with the masts ill make a mockup to try that all out :)
I've got a bit more done the deck and focs'l as well as poop platforms are finished and the cappingrail is installed. Both platforms van be removed.
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She's looking very good ,Phillip
Jimmy
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got a bit more done today.. the head rails and rest have been installed.
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After a while of inactivity, working mostly on my and my girlfriends helicopter fleet i got a few more things done.
I`ve made up all the deck hatches and gratings, companionway and the capstan. Next will be a few more items on the outside of teh hull, channels and pinrails then i`ll have to setup the assembly line for the carronades :)
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Shes comming on very nicely Phillip
Jimmy
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Thankls Jimmy, but it`s amazing how time consuming some of teh tasks are... i made up the shot garlands that border the gratings yesterday and it kept me busy for pretty much the whole evening... at that rate of build i`ll be pressed to see her maidened before the NEXT winter :D
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You'll manage old son . :-)) O0
Are those Oar ports I see between the gun ports???
Jimmy :-))
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yea, apparently the admirality still required sweep ports to be installed at that time.. at 384 tons of burthen she must have been a beast to row :D makes one wonder where they stowed the sweeps ? They are pretty long and bulky items and the channels don`t offer much space either. Also the boats, as there is no gallows to set them on.. the National Marine Museum has a Crusier Model which is practically the same hull and deck layout and that one has davides on each side of the small poop deck (doesn`t look very good in my oppinion, but fore sure was pretty useful in getting the deck free and enabling boats to be launched quickly
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It is historically accurate --- smaller ships up to large Frigate size often had portable davits to launch the quarter boats but it wasn't until the late 1700's early 1800's that iron davits started to be introduced, the dates are hard to pin down as many masters fitted wooden davits themselves at far earlier dates
Jimmy
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Just popped in to read this thread
Tigertiger saidQuestion, did copper bottoms turn green after a while? Just curious is all.
Here in Bridlington UK there is a old rudder from an 18th century ship that was trawled up in local trawlers nets.
We have lots of ancient wrecks in the waters of Bridlington bay. O0
Its on display at the bottom of the slip to the harbour.
It still has its hinges and the upper one still has its pintle and bushing which I've twiddled speculatively many times! :o
The bottom hinge is broken at the pintle and I'm betting the ship lost it in a storm as a result!
It still has some of its copper sheathing and its a greeny-grey colour these days though I imagine when it was new it would have been all shiny!
Follow this link below to flickr for a really good photo of it
http://www.flickr.com/photos/chairman8/3583768298/#/photos/chairman8/3583768298/in/set-72157608009191915/lightbox/
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Got some more of teh deck fittings and furniture done. All the bits and jeers, as well as the shot garlands. The Pumps are also finished just not in the pic ;)