Model Boat Mayhem
The Shipyard ( Dry Dock ): Builds & Questions => Yachts and Sail => Topic started by: offshore1987 on April 03, 2012, 03:56:44 pm
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Hi sailers ok2 Once again i have joined your horried dark art of gettin in the way of everyone else :-))
Just ordered a Micro Magic from Howes ( hope its ok to add the name ) When she turns up will do an opening thing and review pics and all
Thanks to Martin and Stan on the forum for sendin me the write up in MMI, you guys got me to make the phone call and order one :-)
Thanks
Daniel
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Did you get one at the special offer price Daniel ?
I was sorely tempted as they are a bargain, but
I am in negotiations to do a deal on a Fiesta and
SWIMBO won't take kindly to another two yachts :(( :((
Ned
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Umm not sure if it was on offer, price was £199.99, have always wanted a magic but really didnt want to build one myself, just because i really hate working with that type of thin plastic, dont trust myself not to mess it up :-))
Probs going to rip the tx and rx out and put my spektrum 2.4g in her, and change it to a rod on the rudder over the i think stock string
All the best
Daniel :-)) p.s cant wait %%
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have you seen the group running the micro magics at the lake on a saturday morning ? i think the mod with the rudder linkage is a good idea , ive seen a couple of the cord ones break . i dont sail with them as my own sailing models are of scale type , so im still alongside the warroir
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something helpfull may be on this site :-)) http://www.magicmicro.org/news.php
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Thanks tony23 am a member of that site :-))
triumphjon, i use to see them when going to and from work on a sat, but never went down to say hi, then i saw that they released a rtr magic and was keen to get something that people race and with them racing/sailing on wens evenin and sat mornings seemed the perfect choice. Have got a few other yachts one larger at a meter long and a mid sized but dont really use them much with the larger one bottomin out in the lake
They do have a facebook page think its "portsmouth micro magic" Just like the idear of being able to sail it as normal then meet up for a race or two in the week :)
All the best
Daniel
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i know the larger yachts have an issue with druaght in the lake , thankfully im not having that problem ,lthough the semi submerged seaweed does prove a problem ! i often notice you pale blue tugs in & out with the container vessels .
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Hampton Court Club started racing Micro Magics last year and it's been a great success there going to hold a MM Championship later this year.
http://www.hamptoncourt-myc.org.uk/mmopen.htm
http://www.hamptoncourt-myc.org.uk/mmuknor.htm
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we race them at hembc lincoln about 14 or15 great fun pictures can be seen on the hembc website slug
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Jon i dont work for the blue tugs anymore left them last year, could you not put on a smaller lengh keel with a larger bulb to sail on conoe lake?
Thanks tony that made a good read seeing what you guys do :-))
Thanks to slug loved the picys some very nice lookin colour designs going on at your club
Update, i missed there post man yesturday so its being sent out today, and should recive it tomorrow then buld it ready to sail tomorrow evening ekk %%
All the best
Daniel
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on a differ ent tact bought a marblehead of e bay only 12 inch keel we have a shallow lake at the edge well pleased on your rtr are you going to keep both sail sevoes most sail on one they are great fun we sail in all weathers slug
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Hi Slug, yeah will be keepin it as it comes to start with, the guys down here that sail them said it would be fine to start with then maybe if i get abit better will take out the jib servo
was hoping it would turn up today to give me a sail this evenin to try and see what its like before trying to sail it with others :embarrassed: but i guess thats my first exeuse for tomorrow :-)) I shouldnt of left it so late before ordering it silly me
Jon i think KK is going to take his sub down there tomorrow at 1830 so if you fancy it come along for a chat? Would be good to meet somemore people from the forum
All the best
Daniel
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i managed to get to the lake at about ten to seven , four micros out on the lake then down to three and a gent with several youngish children with a yacht made by his grandfather , might see if i can get my fishing sailer into my car & go down on saturday morning ( the mast has seized into the socket through the decking , its a wooden mast with a brass tube socket ! so has possibly swelled up ? )
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Oh man i missed you, we had to leave because my Duck had hurt its self, n spent most of yest evening nursing it <:( but its seems better ( ish ) now
Funnily enough, I didn't realise that I new Clive the guy that runs the magic racing, he had the green model, I didn't take mine because I hadn't the time to finish it off, but i did get to finish it last night, shes now ready for the water :-)) Might pop down there later to try it not sure yet, but will be there tomorrow morning :-)
OK, the model turned up 'woop woop', it came as the pic shows, the Graupner Box its self is very nice and i was shocked to see how well they had packed the boat in the box ( Well done Graupner ) The Yacht its self is from what i can see VERY well made, i was a little unsure with people saying that kits some times didn't line up on the stern, but the RTR isn't that bad at all, they have filled any gaps ( one shows a tiny bit ) but they have painted over it nicely and the rest of the model is painted very well.
I have pulled out the stock TX and RX both of these do seem a bit 'old hat' but nevertheless are rather nice in their own little ways, with Micro Magic rtr written on the TX
Cant get over how well it was all boxed from Graupner, the keel was inclosed in foam, the sails packed very well and laid flat, the Tx was well packed in foam, the yacht its self had no room to moved about or get knocked, and the mast was also well packed :-)) The best bit was that the ""foam"" wasn't the normal kind that breaks up and put mess everywhere, so was nice to handle
The rigging of the yacht was some what tricky, now I've rigged a full size yachts and so on sailed my self a fair bit, ( I have my own yacht & worked with full size boats, mostly yachts), but for the love of God I had to read & re-read the instructions, this thing was more tricky to rig in my opinion than a full size Sunfast 44 :o But once she is rigged its a very nice little boat
Even from new the rudder servo doesn't seem to happy making a few noises but will see how it holds up. The sails are really nice, i know some people say they are heaver than the mk1 sails but they seem spot on to me
I have tried it in the bath last night to see if it was water tight, pushed the bow under and the port/star and stern with no leaks at all, not to sure about the hatch but it does seem a very tight fit, it took about 5 mins to get it off for the first time ( didn't want to force it off to start will because its thin plastic ) but sure enough, it popped off when tapping it. One thing that was odd was the rudder arm was in the yacht from the factory, I couldn't find it in the box got a little worried they had forgot to put it in, then found it fully rigged in the boat, with the main halyard and port/star lines wrapped around it
The boat stand is very nice and just popped together with ease. I haven't glued it or anything because its such a lovely fit with nice touches like ""racing MICRO MAGIC"" on it on both sides
Unlike with the kit you can not move the keel about, it has one fixed position and that's that. I think the guy from Graupner drilled the hole a little too far forward and hes dragged the drill bit back to make the keel fit, has a really small crack in it, but it's hardly noticeable
Not really sure what else to say about the model, anything you would like to know just ask.
Verdict is a Great little boat out of the boat, I couldn't of built the hull as well as Graupner has done :-))
Sea trails later on today or tomorrow morning
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4058905.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4058907.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4058911.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4058912.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4058915.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4058916.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4058917.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4058918.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4058919.jpg)
How she came, will take some more in a bit of what shes like fully rigged.
All the best
Daniel
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(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4068945.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4068947.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4068948.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4068951.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4068952.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4068953.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4068954.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4068955.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4068956.jpg)
Hopefully some sailing pics and how she sails soon :-)
All the best
Daniel
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A nice lot of Trophies in the cabinet young man, what were these won for?.
Len, ( nosey old git )
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Hi Len, we use to do C class offshore powerboat racing, most are from that :-)
All the best
Daniel
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Nice to meet you today Jon :-))
The Micro Magic out of the box sailed very very well, 5 people turned up with magics ink me, and wasnt always last, which was shocking because the others all had ( home built racers ) with the RTR being the heavyist and with lots of greese on the hull it wasnt perfectly slik through the water. Sails were very good, tweaked set up alittle at one point but again kept up with the racing home made sails and mk1s sails ( to a point my sailing was laking at times, bit rusty ) Best news of all was the yacht didnt leak one bit, was well chuffed with this because 2 of the other boats had leaked
To sum up the RTR Micro Magic, i would say if you want a yacht and something small that can go in the car fully riged then the Magic is the perfect choice, it sails so very well and its great with all the kit right outa the box
One happy chapy :}
Daniel
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good to meet you too dan , hopefully i can bring my scale motor sail cruiser along on wednesday evening & join in ! jon
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That will be awesome Jon :-)) Hopefully the weather wont be to bad
Daniel
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have you started shaving any weight yet ? i could see a little would be saved in changing the rudder linkage , clives boat only uses single sided arms on both the servo & the tiller arm , could you replace the grase around the keel box with a smear of silicone ? i know it would mean leaving the keel attached , then its the extra servo , remove and attactch both sails to the standard sail servo . i might even have to save some money & buy one of my own ! jon
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Jon you should get one mate!!
I will change the rudder later on, but not sure if it will save any weight because the line is changed for wire rod and conectors. Will clean up the greese, was thinkin about gluing the keel in but not sure yet, i think with the greese cleaned up so its not everywhere lol and the bottom polished it should help alot, but even then the edge of the stickers on the hull drag alittle, but i dont wanna go to into it by taking them off
Triming the yacht should not be a problem because the battery pack i used can be moved back alittle bit so it should get the bow upto just lipin the water. Going to leave the 3rd servo in for now, probs will just not use it or take the wire outa the rx, looks a total pain to try and remove. Same thing with the shrouds just going to leave them on, am use to having them there :-)
I guess with the rudder arm we could use carbon fiber rod that would save a alittle bit, But im not sure making them bang on the weight limit is a good thing, the lake it normaly never totally calm
Would you get the kit Jon or a rtr?
Daniel
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Have you looked at rcyachts.org ?
Cant post a link as I'm on my phone
Good site for MM's
Ned
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Have you looked at rcyachts.org ?
Cant post a link as I'm on my phone
Good site for MM's
Ned
Hi Ned yes have that one book marked thanks though :-)) They sure do have some nice stuff on there
Jon me n the gf went down to the lake earlyer, no yachts on the water, just a fire boat thing and KK with his sub
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went past the lake earlier there was one of the yellow / black square riggers plus a few " grey jobbies " didnt stop to look as i wanted to make a start in getting my triumph ready for the mot ,ive been undersealing this afternoon , yuk !
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Know the feelin we used shalts on the landy
I got an email from the guys/club saying the next race is wens at 5pm :-))
Daniel
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hoping to get there , but im collecting some more bits for the car wednesday , and i need to sort the rear brakes out , got my gf enlisted to bleed the new wheel cylinders with me , if i wasnt on the first floor of a block of flats id probably have used the compressor and sprayed the underside , but this time it was brushed on , the only downside to needing to sort the car means less time to sort the sailing boat out for wednesday . but as with most hobbies mygf & i need the car more than sitting at the lakeside !
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Fair does :-) motors should always come first
Will be down there on sat too
Daniel
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yes ive only owned this one for 6 months so its still a bit of unknown quantity yet , the last triumph had been with me for around three years , and was almost completly rebuilt in that time inc a conversion from auto to manual o/d in a weekend !
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Hi Hi update from today windy sail, about half an inch deep of salty water in the hull, all over the batterys :(( lucky the RX was on the keel box and under the deck, hmm totally sealing it for next time O0 its got in im guessin through the hatch or and the line outlets, she need abit more weight in the stern to stop her stuffin down wind
Daniel
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Just weighed her and shes 850g with out the battery pack and 963.8g with the battery pack :-))
All the best
Daniel
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not suprising you got a little water inboard , even mine was being blown flat ! all sailing vessels ive ever used ive placed my receiver inside of a balloon , it seems to help keep the wet stuff at bay , but doesnt affect the signal ! i did notice that clive is running his rx on AAA dry cells although i didnt like the battery box or its connections , being the type found on a pp3 battery , and the wires twisted together to plug into the rx ( no switch as apparently it weighs too much ! ) jon
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I think im going to stick with the 4 aa's atm, component shop sells some good batterys though might get one in the next few weeks. Will have to put some weight in the stern though because i cant move my battery back anymore because of its size. Have changed a line or two as well so the jib sits lower
Next time maybe sat im going to turn it all on before leaving and seal the yacht at home, cant afford to be trashin electric atm <:(
I guess clive is abit faster because his boat is uber light but then again he does sail very good, mines probs going to be topin over 1000g on sat %% Me dad saw clive today and he said clive was down at the lake trimin and settin his yacht up again lol so will probs be even faster on sat
Oh and you so left at the right time on wens! after you left it poored down none stop and me Tx was soaked, water dripin outa it and everything lol so from now on dry sailing only pmsl :-))
Got say though i do like the wooden boat, just looks right on the water
Daniel
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do you have any silicone grease you can put around the hatch ? where is the outlet for the jib line ? i seem to think its just a hole in the fore deck , which could be the source of the leak ? ?
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Yeah its just a raised hole, but i think most of the water probs did come in the hatch because when i kept takin it outa the water and tippin it, water was runnin outa the lip of the hatch. Have got some greese but will probs use electrical tape, should help it abit. later on today will bath test is again and see whats what havnt got around to it yet
The main problem with the water was from submarining the damn thing %% so a trim job should be sure to help, even its its something i can remove in lighter winds, iv already found something in my sailin draw that should help
Daniel
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is there a seal around the hatch as it sits currently ? what about a bead of silicon sealer around the hatch ? . dont know if im going to get to the lke in the morning , mot prep on the triumph is causing problems
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Yeah their is a seal around the hatch, i did a bath test earlyer sealed the hatch and the line holes, dunked the yacht compleatly for 20 seconds and it leaked uber bad, tryed over and over to find the leak and it was the mast boot, you can just blow into the hull through it!! Someone that built it hasnt used anoth glue me thinks lol, so have just packed the whole thing with greese to seal it and also redid the keel box because the two and linked some how, so part from the line wholes it shouldnt leak because im going to tape the yacht up before i leave for the lake :-))
Later on i might put gromets on the jib and main line, then she should be good for some bad weather. Have also put together some easy weight ajusters, just two fishing weights hung off the back stay lol easy but should work
Daniel
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how did it go on saturday morning ? im hoping to be sailing again on wednesday eve
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The mast area leak has been fixed by packing it with greese now, alittle bif of water got in through the jib sheet hole but only alittle bit, i covered the hatch over with tape so that was ok :-)) Still had problems with the bow submarining, it was uber windy down there so only stayed for about 40 mins then come home
Jon its sayin on the bbc that wens is thunder and rain all day, so im going to be giving it a miss this wens
Im probs going to be orderin a new keel and bulb to try and trim it abit better, though i have tryed a 4 aaa pack in the stern and that does look better in the bath, need to order a new pack as well then she might be a better boat ( hopefully lol ) Its a nice yacht in light winds i love it to bits but in anything over 10mph its a submarine, though 10 MPH in a tiny yacht like this is abit over the top imo
Daniel
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ive been buying my battery packs from the component shop , i tend to run on 6 volt packs as i find it helps the sail arm servo , the big boat i was running last week has a 6 v 2200 mah aa sized pack , which gives me around 3=4 hour sail times !
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That shops really good been using them for years now, get most of my battery stuff from them and its always been good and turned up on time :-))
I think im going to order a 4 x aaa pack to start with, from what the other guys were saying the lighter the boat the better which makes sense, the shape of the hull on the MMs dosnt like being weighty when tacking
From what chris said the rules are that you can have the front of the bulb 25mm away from the front the keel thats the min distance, i had alook at mine earlyer and its 38mms between the two :o that may be why mine is stupidly nose heavy
I do love this MM of mine and its a great starting point, but if i keep up with it later on or next year i will probs order one from Pure Magic and have one propley built by a pro and all upto the best racing spec ( but thats along way off atm ) trying to sort this out is a must atm
Just gota pray for very light winds and i might have a better chance :-)) will probs pop down there on wens to have a look n watch the racing if its dry
Daniel
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if lightness is what you need have you considered a 2cell lipo and BEC?
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i did look at the weather forcast , its not favourable , maybe well be lucky enough to have a window to sail in ! ive managed to get my 36 " motor sailer modified from its swing rig & into a conventional jib & boom set up , the motor is fitted into the hull , but the esc has gone for repair . so at least it should be useable as sail only , the fishing smack i used last week is also being reassembled following the new joint to the upper mailsail jib ? the weight has broken two plywood joins in the last 6 months so ive remade one in brass , i will see how it lasts ? the steering problem has been traced to some corrosion on the stock , which has been making a tight spot , need to repack with automotive grease instaed of the silicon grease ive been using ( although i might try to get a little marine grease instead ) . if its too blowy maybe well have to use the fairey motor boats instead ?
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if lightness is what you need have you considered a 2cell lipo and BEC?
Thanks essex i have thought about that but i wouldnt trust using lipos in the boat, because of the water leaking problems i have at the moment. The main problem is that who ever built the boat, hasnt really given anything thought to how shes trimed. Shes fine in light winds but it anything blowy its a pain down wind, but thats my fault for gettin a rts model.
I cant add to much weight but at the same time i need weight in the stern so its a pain but never the less i have order 2/3c 4.8v battery pack, its something like 80 grams and puts out way more than the 4aaa pack, plus it weighs alot less than the 4aa batterys i was using, and has saved some grams as well :-))
Will see how she sits in the water tomorrow when the battery turns up :-) Jon its great that uv sorted the other yacht, will try and pop down to see it
Daniel
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lets hope its dry ? hopefully the boat will behave better than it did when it was fitted with the swing rig !
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Updates
Battery finally tuned up today... and is 92 grams!! somehow from the website to my door its grown buy 10 grams hmm %%
Changed the jib sheet line hole, hopefully it will work and not snap off but only time will tell. Have moved the keel to its back position and its helped alot with the trim of the boat, it should come from graupner like this in my opinion!
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4209275.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4209277.jpg)
All the best
Daniel
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at least the jib sheet line looks higher from the deck , i have a half roll of thin plastic tubing that would possibly make liners ? suprised to see clive and co running in that rain wednesday , hopefully it will be better in the morning !
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its just under an inch high :-))
yeah i was abit shocked to see them down there lol ( nuts springs to mind ) im not sure if i will be going down there, seems far to windy n wet, if its dry i might just go down n say hi n leave the yacht at home for a nicer day :-)
Daniel
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if your going you just as well put the yacht in the car , at least if its dry you can test this weeks mods ! still not tried my smaller yacht , i did run my huntsman wednesday but its not as quick as id have hoped for .
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Whats she running on 6v or 12v?
Daniel
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i ran wednesday on a 11.1 v lipo , 14.4 nimh is better but ive only got 1500 mah packs ( 2x 7.2 volts ) so it doesnt last very long ! the debate is weather to save the pounds and change it to brushless which is how my spear has been set up , then keep the old nimh packs to run my bigger sailing boats instead ,
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Whats the C rating on the lipo?
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the lipo packs are marked as 11.1 volt 2200mah 35c . work well in both my spear & brother-in-laws crash tender , think ive just made the wrong motor choice in the huntsman . did you get to the lake this morning ? ( i was welding another stainless steel tray for alan in the model shop ) i met up with the gent with the boat with black sails this afternoon , hes scratch building a smaller hull of around the same size as a micro magic !
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No didnt go down the lake this morning, staying in bed with the gf seemed a better idear lol then was working on the truck all afternoon it finally has working brakes woop woop lol
35c is a good discharge rate, i know now that there at 60c packs n some even more %%
might pop down the lake tomorrow, not sure if we are going offroading yet or not hmm
:-))
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ive not stayed in bed in the mornings in a very long time ! brakes not so good on the truck , most of my previous triumphs & my old work van had the brakes uprated slightly by using stainless steel braided hoses , silicone brake fluid ( doesnt boil so no fade ) then ive changed the front pads to either ferodo ds11 or more commonally ebc green stuff . the current 1500 doesnt get driven anywhere near as hard so remains as it was made ( hasnt been over 50 mph since ive had it )
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its got new calipers all round, new vented disks, new pads, bearings, hoses. Then the vac pump broke lol so just fitted a new one
the bearings and pads get changed every 200/300 miles as they just get used so fast offroading. Gota sort the ujays out on the propshafts front and back soon. Tighten the rear diff as its gettings slopy maybe the front as well %% its nearly a full time job looking after an offroaded defender
but for the things we love we will do anything for :-)
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have you tried using the ebc brake pads , green is fast road , yellow being light track use while the red is full blown competition . hving used the green ones they are very good at bringing my old big six pot triumphs to a stop !
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have tryed a few diffrent ones, but they are all rated for offroad use, as soon as you get sand in the calipers or fine grit it just wastes the pads, luckly they are not that much to replace the whole set and only takes 10 mins inc taking the wheels off to replace :-) even with the new pads fitted and the new pump its already stoping much much better than before
Seems windy tomorrow n rain in the afternoon hmm
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Keel parts n clear hatch cover turned up today. Once again great service from cornwall models :-)
Will be alot better to see in the yacht between races without fafin about removing the hatch :-))
Daniel
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hopefully the foul weather will give us a decent window for wednesday evening
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Wouldnt bet onit lol but you never know :-)) I think i will wait till sat
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who knows what the weather will do ? however i could well be sailing my own micro very soon , having had a good couple of weeks worth of mornings fabricating and welding some stainless steel trays , ive just ordered myself a carbon fibre version micro magic ! !
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HAHA awesome jon!!!
Welcome to the people with small yachts club lol
I asked on the fb club page, not sure if your on it? But they said they might be going down there even in this wind and rain :o From my house it looks like its the worst angle for the wind on the lake
Last night i poped the new spacer in and sealed the keel in with alittle marine sealant and the mast boot bit, so hopefully she will none leaky. Not sure if you have but the clear hatch cover is a really nice fit, plus in bad weather might be worth gettin one to see inside the boat
You going to build her as per the instructions or fit the single rudder arm? N dude uv got nice red sails i want some :((
Daniel
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FYI the carbon fibre version is the heavyweight at 910 grams as against the rtr racing of 850 grams.
Ned
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the rtr dosnt come out the box at 850g's
Dan
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http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/info_1_G2014_200.html
According to the above it does or should do.
Ned
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nobody else turned out this evening , the maiden sail of my own 36 " yacht didnt go too well !
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big thanks to dan , my yacht that decided it liked the look of the bottom is now sitting upside down in our bath tub , with its radio removed and stripped rinsed and is now draining !
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No probs Jon happy to help :-))
Daniel
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the good news is the receiver has survived its dunk , ( it was inside of a rubber balloon ) the rudder servo is also now operational , however the sail arm servo hasnt survived quite so well ,
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Have you taken the top off the sail servo and treated it to some hairdrier treatment it has worked for me in the past.
Ned
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tops been off along with the bottom , & rinsed in fresh water since around 2330 yesterday !
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Oh well, Howes do a decent cheapo :D :D
Ned
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Least 2 outa the 3 are ok :-))
Couldnt of left it out there all night i wouldnt of been able to get to sleep :embarrassed:
Jon you ordering your MM from howes? Could order it the same time as the servo :} they still have it on there for £125
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rinse it out with WD40 anything is worth a try :-))
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the good news is that the sail servo has also revived , i managed to lift the pcb slightly & spray some wd40 into the gap , it has then been standing all afternoon with the gap downwards over a tray , it was tested at around 1800 hrs , & found to be fully functional ! the only casualty has beeen the battery pack which is now nbg ! the hull / deck has been checked & ive found a 2" gap at the leading end of the aft hatch flange , its now being rebonded , a new hatch seal will be custom formed on both hatches . As for my micro magic ive ordered it through our local shop along with a hitec hs65mg feather servo ( 12.47 grammes ) and a planet R4MsJ 2.4 GHZ 4 ch rx . ive already got a few hitec hs 300 servos that i can use for the sail arm . jon
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Glad you got the servo working and ace one on orderin the magic, she should be ready for next wens then? Hopefully a brake in the weather by then
You know you said about that fishing boat, my dads got the contract to bring it up with divers ( rubin ) think we are going to do it early next week if the weather is ok. He said there is a vid on youtube or something of it sinking
Daniel
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good to see the fishing boat brought back up , how much notice do you get of when its going to happen ? ive not got a delivery date for my magic yet , it was ordered on wednesday from graupner , it will also depend on how long it takes to get the new rx & rudder servo which were only ordered yesterday . due to the locations of the rxs in my powered boats ( the huntsman 31 its in the w/c / shower cubicle & behind a door ) im unable to remove them easily . anyhow at only £15 its almost as cheap as it used to be to buy crystals !
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Should only take upto 3 days to get it from graupner because westbourne models said it only takes that long when i ask about the magic from there :-))
Not sure on the fishing boat, just when the weathers right
Dan
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it was rumored to possibly be here by the end of this week , im not in a major rush as im trying to make progress with my water jet driven dory model . the submarining sail boat is almost repaired , just need to make the replacement hatch seals , which i think will do in silicone sealant , with some cling film on the hatch to prevent the two halves bonding together while it sets . it might even make it saturday morning , providing its not as windy as it was wednesday ! jon
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well dan , ive been into the shop this afternoon with a batch of finished stainless steel trays for alans ohio biuld , & come home with a carbon effect micro magic kit !
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Folk singing at the Railway
Bartering at the Model shop
Smocks are still in style in
Fratton :
Ned
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AWESOME NEWS woop woop :-))
You going down there tomorrow then? I think i will dependin on the weather, but i might have other plans hmm
Dan
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i was hoping to have the submarinning yacht going by the morning , micro will take a little while as im now waiting on the rudder servo & new rx for it !
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You going to put the 2 degre of lift on the bulb?
Dan
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ive not read all of the instructions , or the mods yet , but intend to do the required mods to it before it gets wet rather than try to change things afterwards ! dont think i shall bother to cover the keel bulb , which will save a few grammes , along with using a rod to control the rudder and cutting away the extra two arms !
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Dont think it will save any thing by puttin a rod on the steering, it will just make it sharper and quicker to turn, i tryed clives n it was uber twitchy on the steering.
I think alot of people that build them also put the jib line hole thing upside down so that its raised from the deck, one ends domed and the other is a tube
Some people dont put the wooden braces in either but i dont see much point in leaving it out :o
Do you have fb? Might be worth joining the club page thing if you do, and the MM uk site?
Dan
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ive joined the mm site , i do have fb but not managed to find the club page yet .
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Portsmouth Micro Magic's (radio controlled boat racing) copy n paste that should work :-))
Dan
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thanks dan , ive now found it following your link , and joined the group . its looking a little damp out this morning , but at least the high winds have relaxed a bit , might even be able to sail in an upright position today ?
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i had a carbon mm ,the hatch is not a good fit due to the extra thickness of the plastic used,1.5 against standard 1mm .speaking to someone at coalville show ,he left the sealing ring out fits ok no leaks if it does leak a little vasiline can be used .alot heavier than the racing ones not so good in light winds,very smart though,good luck slug
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i take it the mods that are carried out to the standard racing magic are just as useful on the carbon magic ? ive been to the local club who recomend moving the keel bulb back on the fin and with a very slight upwards rake , im also planning to increase the height of the sheet line guides to help prevent water ingress
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Should deffo do the mods, we need every bit of help we can get with the heavyer boats, saying that though, everyone raves about the MK1 keel and MK1 rudder, but i dont think im going to change mine
The other thing that puttin the rod arm on the steerin helps, is that with the stock pull pull lines when the servo arm moves it changes the angle and puts stress on the servo ( tray ) bends it alittle, because the lines are at an angle from the tubes when in full turn
Did you go down? Looked outa the window at 9 n saw rain so went back to sleep
Dan
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carbon m m was left standard i use a racing one now ,built as standard,. sail in all weathers, no water ingress. not the best person on the sticks but enjoy every minute i sail it ,cant beat the others but great fun!!!
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whats the difference between the mk1 & mk2 keel & rudder ? i may alter the position of the rudder servo so i get a straight line between the servo horn & tiller arm . looking through my box of servos ive got both a standard and mini futaba servos which matchthe recomendation from graupner . yes i went down this morning without a boat ( couldnt be bothered to drop the top mast from the wooden boat ) & thte one i sank wednesday i found some damage to the rudder stock so need to make a new one later . not many yachts today just 3
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The diffrence is that the MK1 keel is fater so its better for not slipin sideways, and the MK1 rudder is also fater so it tacks better in light winds ( so they say ) But with the MK1 keel you cant move it about, faward and aft its in one fixed place, the only thing you can do is move the bulb about but they all use MK1 keel with an MK2 bulb. I think the MK2 keel is good anoth tbh, and the MK2 rudder works in light winds
Im not suprised their wasnt many yachts with the weather, summer will be here soon which will be better than standin in the rain lol
Dan
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is there any way of telling which one is supplied in which kit ? the kit has now ventured out of the box , ive started assembly , . . . . . and made up the stand ! {-)
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The kit is a MK2 boat so will come with the MK2 keel and rudder. MK1 is the non racing boat and the MK2 is the racing model
Dan
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so do you think i ought to get a mk 1 rudder & keel ?
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Upto you mate, im going to probs stick with the MK2 keel and rudder, i wont ever move the keel again now though its in the aft position
Probs best to ask on the mm site, but iv read most people change but only change because everyone else has lol
Dan
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mk 2 keel fin looks to be longer , , clive has said the bulb needs to be 25 mm from front tip to fin . the bulb itself needs work as its got a flat nose , also advised against fitting the plastic bulb cover it adds weight & drag !
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The max weight is 420g and the min keel weight is 380g from what iv read on the rules, dont make the bulb to pointy or it will course more drag
I think later on if i ever did get another bulb to put on the other keel iv got, i will make it bang on 380g for light winds. In the boating world in lighter airs you move the weight faward to help with the boats drag through the water ( gets the stern up abit ) which helps with the drag
polishin the hull and deck, keel, bulb, rudder helps alot, if you polish the deck it will help the water run off which helps keep the weight down in raining or ruf weather ( seems silly but even alittle bit of water on the deck adds a good bit of weight )
Then do you wanna keep the stock mast, or put on a pro mast %% With all the mods all you are left with in the end is the hull and deck from the kit lol hmm
Dan
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looks as if some of the mk1 keels and rudders arent currently available , so i might as well biuld up with the mk2 parts from the kit . the buld needs to be tidied up , its currently got a stub nose area . how far out did you fit the pipe on the jib sheet line to stop water going into the hull ?
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Can get on here now %% sometimes this site is random
Pure magic has the MK1 keel in stock but not the rudder. I think my tube is about 3/4 of an inch high, i made it nice and high so i could trim it down if needed, much easyer than re fittin another one
Dan
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ive had trouble getting on here this afternoon too , however ive been on the fb page instead , im going to look at making a new radio tray in 2mm plasticard so we can keep the rx & battery pack up away from any water that may get inside ? ive got some thin walled 1.8mm id plastic tube , providing the sheet lines will pass through i will make my extension from that , clives extension is only 5mm high , think i will aim a little higher than that .
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Do you mean your going to leave the wood out? Im sure i read somewhere in the rules you have to use the wood to be able to race it. Might be worth asking on the MM site about it just incase :-))
Dan
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i was going to substitute the plywood servo mount for a plasticard tray to mount both servos and the battery / rx ,
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How does the carbon tray look? because the RTR has a diffrent tray for the steering servo ( thats why its a pain to get the battery in and out of the stern becuase theres a servo in the way %%
Dan
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dan , i think the internal trays are the same for all models , mine has the laminations of plywood for both servos to sit into , i was going to try replacing the two sections with a peice of plasticard , will possibly use something a bit thinner , remove the section the third servo sits on , but extend the tray aft to sit the battery pack onto . my other two sail boats have the battery on a section of velcro . and away from the bilge ! dont think these anyhing stopping me from bringing the rudder servo forwards to give greater movement for the battery pack ? its easier to make these sort of mods now before the deck gets glued down ! !
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Not sure then i thought that there was two diffrent trays, for the diffrent models, that pure magic place sells one thats got the sail servo and rudder servo on one tray, and the MK1s come with that type stock
Dan
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i looked on pure magics site but couldnt find any upgrade servo tray , he had a black one shown for £15 but its the same shape as the one supplied in my kit ! ive got some 4mm clear perspex which im going to try making up a tray from sometime today . im thinking of moving the rudder servo up just behind the sail servo , which will allow the battery pack to be moved further aft , should it be needed . jon
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Its not to much a pain to get the battery well aft even upto the rudder stock, but its fittin a fat pack between the sail servo and rudder servo and turnin the battery to put it aft thats the pain, but with the smaller packs they fit ok, aa packs are the pain
How far have you got? Wens looks to be ok atm on the weather front hmm
Dan
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wednesdays forcast is looking hopeful . as for progress its nowhere near floating yet . ive fitted the keel box & bow strengthener . along with the rudder post lower support being bonded in place . however i have started to make a replacement servo tray from 4mm thick clear perspex , im going to move the rudder servo forward to just aft of the sail arm , & use a solid rod to operate the rudder . i can then have a battery pack on a velcro strip to aid moving it for balence . jon
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Weather sure does look good for wens :-))
Well all week looks good now, if you get it done thurs or friday let me know n i will come down to the lake or something :-))
Dan
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must admit ive not been rushing the build , ive had a tension headache most of the day which means i dont tend to get very much done !
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Dont miss the good weather though lol we only get a week every 2 months lol :-))
I put some sealent on the inside of the hatch earlyer hoping that it will be waterproof hmm though least with the clear hatch you can see in the boat, makes it alot easyer
Daniel
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my instruction booklet shows the hatch seal fitted to the hatch not the deck . ? i can always use either my big wooden scale sailer or the smaller motor sail cruiser ( its been rebuilt since it capsized last week ) failing that the fairery spear might have to come to play ? ? jon
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Can do budy, im going fishing on one of the days at the end of the week either thurs or friday ( hopefully ) but the other day am happy to come out n play, i dont think im going to get time to go down to the duck lake tomorrow because taking my Gf to her grandads cremation ( she didnt wanna go but now does )
I havnt fitted the foam/rubber seal thing, iv just put sealent on the deck lip and on the hatch so the two press together and hopefully seal, the foam/rubber thing is a pain to seal propley and people normaly greese it so it seals but then its messy to touch
Daniel
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will see how the build goes , who knows it might even be sailable for the weekend ! its not as though ive got to wait on good weather to paint the model , & i shall probably only fit the window masks , but leave the other stickers off the boat . jon
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Id leave the others off too, they will only add to drag through the water ( might even take mine off later on in the year when they start to come off ) was thinkin of respraying the boat at some point
Daniel
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im going to build as i would any other model sail boat , if it fails to conform to the national rules , i no longer give a flying stuff , getting the simplest information on build regs isnt happening , its like asking to join the model flying clubs , they are all so far up each other they dont want to have newcommers to the hobby .
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Thought you had a few answers on the mm site.
Offshore
Paint adds weight,, the decals add drag when heeled.
Ned
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nothing conclusive ned , its like a great closed shop , that dosent want anybody else to know what is being modded on vessels to improve them within the class rule . it would be good if i could get to see the class build rule , the links ive been sent open blank pages !
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Thought you had a few answers on the mm site.
Offshore
Paint adds weight,, the decals add drag when heeled.
Ned
The rtr is already painted from the factory Ned ( hull, deck, keel, bulb, rudder ) Just going to rub it all down and respray it bright orange :-)) every race boat we have ever had has been bright orange
Dan
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Dude iv just seen your message :o how did you get the yacht stuck again??
That lakes proper unlucky for you!
Dan
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it didnt respond to the rudder quickly enough , the motor isnt connected yet , so couldnt reverse out of the obstruction ! dont thinkits the lake as much as that boat likes it there ? water level was above wellies , so as you can imagine i got a tad wet tonight . hopefully the boat will behave itself tommorrow evening
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BBC weather is saying rain around 7pm coming from the north so it might be raining tomorrow, i was thinkin of popin down there about 1ish or that other lake
Dan
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according to the forcast on the pc weve a 20 % chance of rain , i was planning to go down at around five ish , think ive ruffled a few fethers on the national magic forum
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how so?
I will be down there in the even to, but want to use it at lunch time too, will probs go down to duck lake for a walk
Dan
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think i need the auxillary motor sorted before i venture to duck lake , im also building a 2ft dory hull with the small graupner water jet drive system fitted , which may be useful to recover models which get amongst the weeds ? little more progress with my magic last night , ive started fitting some of the wood under the deck , the aft deck beam is being remade deeper , to include a deeper slot for the battery pack to slide under the cockpit . well pleased as the perspex is much longer than the original plywood radio tray but is still lighter ! if im lucky it might be ready for sea trials at the weekend ! ! ( it will probably rain & blow gales for weeks preventing me from trying it out ) jon
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It does seem that normaly on the days they sail the magics the weather is normaly always worse! lol the days before and after are normaly better
Theres not much weed in duck lack is any, its just the reeds around the edge, but it is a fair sized bit of water so theres no need for anyone to put marks near the reeds, just its fresh water which is a massive bonus
Dan
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we will have to go over when the magic is finished ! progress has been a little slow , the deck will be glued onto the hull tonight , everything above deck level to sort . jon
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Sounds a plan
Dan
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we have a small update ;- the deck has just been glued to the hull , progressing slowly , you never know it might be operable for wednesday evening ! !
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carbon magic has got wet ! with a few minor teethinng problems , a small section where the glue hadnt sealed the at the transom allowed it to slowly back fill the hull , which after an hour ( drained several times ) caused the sail servo to go slow , & a mistake when tieing a bowsie left the jib flapping at the top luff , with these sorted i may finally not be the last past the finishing marker ?
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As I'm getting a little to rickety for sailing my 1 metre these days, especially in competition and having moved to a new club where there's a few MMs about for pleasure sailing, rather than competition, I've taken the plunge and bought myself a Carbon Edition Micro Magic kit. ( It was a pretty cheap one from that auction site :embarrassed:) ... This is to be a boat for a bit of gentle sailing, unless I get the bug with these of course. O0
So, I've done my research and read around about the Carbon edition and some of the problems with the skin thickness and aft end, so if anyone has any advice on building it, my ears are wide open %%... I've just started putting a few bits together and learning where everything fits but I'd love to hear from other builders of the Carbon and standard MM as to pitfalls to avoid, otherwise I know I'll fall in all of them. :((
Advice on making good the transom before I get there and how people overcame that would be specially well received as it looks a potential source of problems, if only cosmetic..... so, all advice gratefully received !
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carbon magic has got wet ! with a few minor teethinng problems , a small section where the glue hadnt sealed the at the transom allowed it to slowly back fill the hull , which after an hour ( drained several times ) caused the sail servo to go slow , & a mistake when tieing a bowsie left the jib flapping at the top luff , with these sorted i may finally not be the last past the finishing marker ?
I see that you're up and running with yours whereas I'm just starting... I've started my own thread so as not to disrupt this one but if you have any advice on building the Carbon version do shout out on http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=37744.msg377429;topicseen#msg377429 (http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=37744.msg377429;topicseen#msg377429) Cheers it would be much appreciated. :-))
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What are you overall impressions of the kit straight out of the box?
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Your more than welcome to join the two threads together or we could have a micro magic thread for all to post in?
Dan
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What are you overall impressions of the kit straight out of the box?
My first impression is that that it's a quality piece of kit ! The hull is beautifully moulded, no flaws and the fittings seem first class, well made and thought out. Having done some 1 metre racing I'm used to looking at yacht fittings and these are nice, if a bit smaller than those I'm used to. :-)
There's a comprehensive building book, plan, parts list etc etc. in fact it looks like it's going to be fun to build. I've tried my hand at sailing a couple of the other members MMs, which convinced me to get my own, the handling characteristics seemed very sophisticated for a boat of this size, with the added advantage that you can pop it on the seat of the car !. Lugging all the paraphernalia associated with 1 metres was wearing me out. :-)
Anyway I'm starting, very slowly, to assemble some of the parts while reading as much as I can on other people's efforts. There are a couple of obvious difficult procedures, like joining the hull to the deck, that's worrying me a bit but I'll do a few dry runs to try everything before I commit myself.
Any advice on the difficult bits, much appreciated ! :D
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Cheers Dan, it may be a good idea to have one thread for Micro Magics and keep the knowledge base all in one place as you've already put some very interesting information on, which I may be able to add a bit to as I fight with this build. :embarrassed: ...... I'll confer with Martin :-))
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The first and obvious problem, as I've read elsewhere, is the additional thickness of the carbon edition ABS parts when it comes to assembly. The keel fin and spacing pieces have taken a bit of work with a file and glass paper to take off enough, so that the fin slides in and out of the keel- box smoothly and goes high enough in it for the fixing bolt to come through the deck.
Not a worry in itself but I'm grateful to have read elsewhere about these factors as I don't then feel it's my fault for building it wrong ! {-) Anyway, the fin box is made and installed and takes the fin OK as is the servo mount and bow reinforcement, and that's where I'm up to to date.... :D I'm just about to read what the next steps are and where I'm likely to mess up !
Oh and I'm building this without the extra servo to start with, I'm used to sailing my one metre without a jib trim servo and have always managed to get the jib to set when goosewinged with a little judicious wiggle of the sticks, ;D hopefully I'll find the same with this boat as everyone seems happy to sail without it and the weight saved will be handy..... Onwards and upwards!
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s253/Artistmike/magic-one.jpg)
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the third servo isnt allowed for racing in the uk anyhow ! i too have recently built a carbon magic , following advise from both our local club members and the micro magic forum ive made one or two changes , firstly change the sheet outhaul tube for one thats about 10 - 15 mm long , it helps prevent water ingress when the boat is trying hard at submerging the bow ! the keel bulb is recomended to be 25mm from the leading edge of the fin , i managed to elongate the slot in the bulb , i also sail with the fin as far aft as possible , im not using shroud lines , they arent needed , as for the rudder ive changed the cord for a single 2mm metal rod linkage , ive seen a couple of breakages using the cord . to be a little different my servos are now placed midships , with my 4 aa cell rx pack as far under the well deck as i can get them . after just a few weeks im now managing to keep pace with the local fleet
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it shouldnt be a fight mike , mine went together well , and is enjoyable to sail now !
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the third servo isnt allowed for racing in the uk anyhow ! i too have recently built a carbon magic , following advise from both our local club members and the micro magic forum ive made one or two changes , firstly change the sheet outhaul tube for one thats about 10 - 15 mm long , it helps prevent water ingress when the boat is trying hard at submerging the bow ! the keel bulb is recomended to be 25mm from the leading edge of the fin , i managed to elongate the slot in the bulb , i also sail with the fin as far aft as possible , im not using shroud lines , they arent needed , as for the rudder ive changed the cord for a single 2mm metal rod linkage , ive seen a couple of breakages using the cord . to be a little different my servos are now placed midships , with my 4 aa cell rx pack as far under the well deck as i can get them . after just a few weeks im now managing to keep pace with the local fleet
Cheers for that ! when you say with the fin as far aft as possible, I presume that you just use the forward spacer then to push the fin back? ... Oh, and yes I was going to use a metal ruder linkage, in fact I've got the pieces knocking around somewhere already in the bits box. ... Thanks for the help, I'm not intending to race but I'd like to feel it were performing up to scratch when I have a cruise around the lake.. O0
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Oh and by the way, which glue did you use to bond the hull and deck together? the UHU Acrylit seems a tad fast to get everything organised, before everything sets solid ..............
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Both Micro Magic topics merged.... might need a whole board soon!
Who else is thinking of buying one?
PS. Can someone gather all the Micro magic sites links together into one post please? :-)
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mike i used thick cyno to bond the two halves together , before bonding , i put masking tape over both the hull sides and deck to avoid glue on the carbon surface , yes fin has just the wide spacer at the front ,
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mike i used thick cyno to bond the two halves together , before bonding , i put masking tape over both the hull sides and deck to avoid glue on the carbon surface , yes fin has just the wide spacer at the front ,
Excellent, many thanks for that, that's a good idea about the masking tape too !
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You might want to cut the front bit of wood that the 3rd servo screws into, i did this when i took the 3rd servo out because the line looked like it was going to snag it at somepoint ( it can be removed and trimed later on though after uv built the model )
Like john has said raise the jib sheet inlet hole or she will fill up with water, the other thing that really helps me is the clear hatch because you can see the inside of the boat and make sure its all fine without having to remove the hatch time and time again
For the jib sheet hole i just drilled the stock inlet and glued in a bit of rc antener tube :)
Dan
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another slight mod i forgot about is instead of tying the jib line to the radio plate ive put a small fishing type clip on the end of the line & clip this to the radio plate , this allows me to remove the sail arm from the servo & unclip the jib line to fully remove the radio tray if required , as opposed to untying everything !
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You might want to cut the front bit of wood that the 3rd servo screws into, i did this when i took the 3rd servo out because the line looked like it was going to snag it at somepoint ( it can be removed and trimed later on though after uv built the model )
Like john has said raise the jib sheet inlet hole or she will fill up with water, the other thing that really helps me is the clear hatch because you can see the inside of the boat and make sure its all fine without having to remove the hatch time and time again
For the jib sheet hole i just drilled the stock inlet and glued in a bit of rc antener tube :)
Dan
Thanks ! As a matter of interest, where did you get your clear hatch cover as that sounds like a very useful mod.... I'm also thinking of putting a waterproof external switch in to save opening up more times than absolutely necessary.
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another slight mod i forgot about is instead of tying the jib line to the radio plate ive put a small fishing type clip on the end of the line & clip this to the radio plate , this allows me to remove the sail arm from the servo & unclip the jib line to fully remove the radio tray if required , as opposed to untying everything !
I was going to make everything as removable as possible so that's a handy idea, I may well have forgotten that one. !
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The clear hatch come from cornwall models, they normaly get it to your door the very next day :-)
With a normal battery pack you will get with ease 5 plus hours of play with out changin anything, forgot to turn mine off one evening after sailing and found it beepin a few days later lol
And yip you would have to use the front spacer to push the keel aft, it really does make a massive diffrence
Dan
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The clear hatch come from cornwall models, they normaly get it to your door the very next day :-)
With a normal battery pack you will get with ease 5 plus hours of play with out changin anything, forgot to turn mine off one evening after sailing and found it beepin a few days later lol
And yip you would have to use the front spacer to push the keel aft, it really does make a massive diffrence
Dan
Thanks Dan .... as a matter of interest, what battery pack are you using, I've a 6.0v pack I use for my 1 meter but it's a bit chunky for the Micro I think, I'm not keen on Lippos, so what should I be looking at?
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Alot of the top boys are using either lipos ( which i also dont like in boats ) or 4 x AAA packs as they weigh very little, in mine iv got a bit of a chunky 4.8v 2/3 cell pack, it gives out some good punch, its abit of a over kill but wanted abit more weight in the stern
normaly 9 times out 10 the best way to go would be the 4 x AAA pack :-))
Dan
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Yes I think I'll do that Dan, at least until I learn a bit more about sailing these boats. From the little I've tried with other people's, they seem a lot of fun.... O0
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the carbon edition is a little thicker than the standard one,i had trouble with the hatch sealing as the thickness of the plastic made it proud above the deck.some have put in a thinner seal,never did solve mine,great fun,take them anywhere slug tony
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Was the same with the rtr hatch had to sand it back alot to make it fit then got the clear which fits perfect outa the packet
Dan
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Martin ....
As requested, these are the main Micro Magic sites that I look at but no doubt others will know a few too so come on chaps, post away.... O0
http://ukmicromagic.com/ (http://ukmicromagic.com/) UK Micro Magic Class Association
http://www.int.magicmicro.org/news.php (http://www.int.magicmicro.org/news.php) Micro Magic International
http://www.rcyachts.org.uk/ (http://www.rcyachts.org.uk/) Mike Weston's Micro Magic site Boats, Spares, parts etc. etc.
http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/graupner-yacht-spares.html (http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/graupner-yacht-spares.html) Cornwall Model Boats Micro Magic parts
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9L7ehe3Kfw&feature=relmfu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9L7ehe3Kfw&feature=relmfu) Very useful build tips
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dont think its that bad a fit , just the retaining clips could do with being longer to push the hatch onto the seal !
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Well, today I bit the bullet and joined the deck to the hull on my Carbon Micro Magic and thanks to a couple of tips from the chaps here it went very well indeed, though I did use a different method of gluing most of the deck. I'm putting this in here just in case anyone else wants to try the method when it comes to doing this somewhat nasty job. It was my first time with ABS so I was a bit nervous about it. %%...
I took a very slow route to do everything and it seems to have paid off, procedure was as follows, after I covered the aft end transom areas adjacent to where they are to be joined together, with masking tape to avoid glue marks on the boat.
1. ... Initially I glued in the rudder post to the bottom of the hull with UHU acrylit which makes it easy to locate the aft end when gluing. left that to set
2. ... Next using the UHU Acrylit I joined the hull and deck at the King Plank and top of the fin box only.... left that to set with rubber bands holding everything in place....
3. ... When that was dry I lifted up the aft end of the deck gently, put some UHU Acrylit around the rudder tube, where it is to join the deck, then put a fairly thick and slow cyanoacrylate glue just around the transom area and then positioned it all correctly and then held that area together till it had glued. The rest of this area being protected by the masking tape so no marks on the carbon effect. ... had a cuppa..... :embarrassed:
4 . .. When dry .. went round the Deck/Hull join and at every couple of inches tacked them together using a fine brush and tiny amounts of EMA Plastic Weld at the join. put rubber bands around the lot and let it set again ... more tea.. :embarrassed:
5. ... Now that every thing was just about solid, it was a simple matter to just go round the whole hull/deck join with the small brush and EMA Plastic Weld, letting the capillary action complete the final weld around the whole of the hull.. replaced the elastic bands and had a large Malt Whisky. ;D
Even taking into account the whisky, I now seem to have a completely joined hull and deck and without any nasty glue marks on the nice carbon effect, now that I've removed the masking tape. Thanks for all the advice chaps, working out this method took a bit of time but enabled me to take every step slowly, thus enabling a nice clean job. I know there are numerous ways to do it, as attested by some great boats out there, but this way worked for me.... I like slow...... :D
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What are peoples servo recommendations for Micro magics sheet and rudder? can they take two standard servos?
Dave
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normal size for the sail lines, and a micro for the rudder :-) You could fit two normal sized ones but its massively over kill for the rudder
Dan
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my own boat has a standard sized 3kg/cm servo for sail control , and a " new power " xl-161-hm micro servo 3kg/cm metal gear servo for the rudder , which is keeping the weight down a little !
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As it's a totally new venture, for now I've gone with a Graupner Micro C261 for the steering and a normal one for the sail servo. I'll see how performance goes and perhaps adapt later .. I'm used to rotary sail winches in my 1 metre yacht so I'm not sure yet as to how much oomph I need for the Micro till I get sailing.... :D
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Which is the best boat to get the RTR,racing or carbon racing? i'll only be doing a bit of club racing as i don't want to be spending a fortune.
Dave
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Same here Dave! O0
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Depends on how quickly you would like to get on the water :-)) rtr can be the same day, and it still gives you scope to change and make it faster
The build your own is good also as you can build it how you want from the off, or you could spend alittle more and get a pro boat built and set up
Tbh im happy with the rtr now but its cost a fair chunk of change and time to get it how id like, nearly every bit has been takin off and moded or redone from the factory ( but it did get me on the water the very next day )
Daniel :-)
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value for money the RTR is the one to buy the Carbon Version (kit) is slightly heavier than the others although not sure why but they are that's why you won't see the professionals racing them! :-))
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guess the carbon edition has more pigment in it so it weighs more than a plain white hull? I'll see what i can get cheap :-)) and go for that. I have the brakes to fix on the car first >>:-( then off to Egypt for a week :}. so a couple more weeks and another payday and i'm in the market for one.
Just as a side note i noticed whilst reading on the net. that there is a Mk1 and Mk2 set of foils 1 being the better but no longer available that seems a little unfair to other sailers surely if an item isn't available to everyone it shouldn't be allowed? you don't have that in any other class.
Dave
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I bought the Carbon version on price, and the fact that I'm not going in for any serious racing with this boat. ... At club level especially, it's far more to do with the capability of the guy wiggling the sticks than any perceived advantage of the latest bit of high tech gear or 10grm saving on weight here and there, I've found that out on 1 meters .. :-) ...Mind you, I've also seen that apply at championship level too ! {-)
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ref weight ! the carbon mouldings are slightly thicker than those used for the plain white model hence the few grammes in extra weight . as for the advantages of using a mark 1 keel & rudder on a mk2 hull neither offshore or myself have noticed any advantage , our models are both fitted with mk2 keels & rudder and we are still competetive with the local members of the club with mk1 keels etc !
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ref weight ! the carbon mouldings are slightly thicker than those used for the plain white model hence the few grammes in extra weight .
The one thing with the Carbon version is the little bit of extra care needed in assembling the hull/deck to avoid marking the attractive "carbon" look, especially at the stern. Your idea with the masking tape was a life saver and it enabled me to make a really nice job of it. ! :-))
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The only time that mk1 stuff would help is when its no wind, like the other night Jon, but then again we didnt do bad :-))
for price howes models were doing the rtr for something like £170, and even if you dont use the stock rc tx rx you can reuse them in other models, and with the rtr you get the 3rd servo which once taken out gives you a spare rudder servo :-)
Dan
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even in the no / little wind dan we werent that far behind chris with his hybrid boat ! jon
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90% of racing these yachts are down to doing the right tac at the right time, or least seems to be, the other 10% seems to be down to the yacht its self, weight dosnt really matter, the best thing would be to change the sails to something after market
The other night sometimes up wind chris was pullin away a tiny bit ( with his nice sails ) yet down wind i was gettin all the gap back and abit more, probley mainly because the sails on mine fill out abit better down wind because they are not 100% crisp like chris's, plus the fact that his and my boat are about 100grams diffrence
really do think most of the time its about being in the right place at the right time :-)) to which i wonder if chris dosnt do so well when clives not there because chris cant follow someone else? So he dosnt make perfect calls so much?
Dan
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take a look at http://www.freewebs.com/peterbsmicromagic/ seems interesting slug
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unfortunately Dan you are so wrong weight on a boat like this is the most critical thing there is, to build a competitive sailing boat the hull should be as light as possible and the weight as low as possible like around the fin box nobody in the racing scene use the all carbon version it's just too heavy for serous racing and nearly everything else inside the boat is also junked for more reliable gear. If your going to win races the boat needs speed not the right tac if your mate is faster up wind it's because his rig is tuned better than yours so is pointing higher and if your boats have 100 grams difference in them that's like ones got a brick in it the other doesn't.
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Can the Carbon hull be sprayed / painted?
NB. Found this Very instructive! - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwk8DTptrwY
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unfortunately Dan you are so wrong weight on a boat like this is the most critical thing there is, to build a competitive sailing boat the hull should be as light as possible and the weight as low as possible like around the fin box nobody in the racing scene use the all carbon version it's just too heavy for serous racing and nearly everything else inside the boat is also junked for more reliable gear. If your going to win races the boat needs speed not the right tac if your mate is faster up wind it's because his rig is tuned better than yours so is pointing higher and if your boats have 100 grams difference in them that's like ones got a brick in it the other doesn't.
So how come a month ago the winning boat in london was a rtr magic {-) out of 40 odd race boats, it was over weight from the proper 860gram race boats
Weight in these boats dosnt make any diffrence, sailing it propley how ever does, at are local lake, we have a few totally diffrent magics, a carbon, rtr and two totally racing machines, bang on the 860 gram limit with every mod and set of new sails going, yet from race to race nearly all the boats swop places.
the carbon and the rtr both are ment to be slower boats because of the weight, carbon from the hull and deck and the rtr with its painted hull and deck and tunes of glue, yet up against a full on racing 860 gram boat with new pro sails, we still have miffed them by beating them up wind and down wind....
Saving weight dosnt mean a winning boat at all, the only place you would want to save weight is up on the rig, not alot of point making the hull super light if you have a heavy rig
Dan
P.s yes Martin it can be painted :-))
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very well put dan , even though our boats are supposedly too heavy to be competeive ,
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In my opinion if you want to race seriously go for IOM or similar rather than a MM which in my mind is a fun club race boat that is in it's standard form relatively cheap and competitive with each other (My opinion)
As far as i understand weight is critical when sailing but not so much the amount but position, yes the lower down the stiffer the boat better for higher wind but shifting it back helps when running hence when dinghy sailing the helm position constantly changes with the points of sail. On a model this obviously can't shift on the move but if you have weight e.g. battery to far back you will sail the run better than a boat with all the weight central. Plus as the MM has a slightly raked bow technically the heavier boat has more waterline length therefore capable of higher speed.
I think as with all sailing that if you put a standard RTR MM in the hands of a skilled model sailer and tactician he will win against a less talented helm with all the expensive stick on bits. Making a boat light does not equal winning knowledge skill and practice does.
If i get a carbon kit i'll paint it :o!! as i'm not keen on the finish plus i will need to get rid of that gloss finish to help break the surface tension ok2 (shark skin technology)
Dave
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I think as with all sailing that if you put a standard RTR MM in the hands of a skilled model sailer and tactician he will win against a less talented helm with all the expensive stick on bits. Making a boat light does not equal winning knowledge skill and practice does.
Dave
I agree wholeheartedly, in fact in the IOM championships there have been instances where boats at 1lb heavier than others have won and even at the size of 1metres, an extra 1lb is a fair percentage ! ... You really just can't beat time on the water for making a skipper/boat partnership a winning one .....
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With you on that one
The magic is so small and fat that it has its own problems with every type of wind going, lights winds you want the weight faward to get the stern higher to reduced drag, lots of wind would have you move the weight to the stern to rise the bow, and so on
If you can keep the weight in the keel and hull and make the rig lighter you will keep the boat at a better sailing angle and not dump so much wind out of the sails, i think over in the Anything rules Ger, they use heavyer keel weights
Another thing that would make a diffrence in the real world is the bulb its self, having it pointing in anything other than perfect has alot of drag, to high on the front and in heavy gusts it just lifts the bow and dumps the wind outa the sails, to low and it just sinks the boat. This changes again with the light of the rig
If you can get your boat, from A to B in the short'st distance at an ok pace then you should win the race
Im sure Jon will agree that the best races we have done have been very small courses with a good few marks, it keeps it tight and close with lots of boats all over the place, and it makes all the boats on a par in that a lucky boat cant run 100 yards being in a better bit of wind, if you keep all the boats close they all have to use the same wind. On are lake each part can have wind going N, S, E, W lol or a full on 360 at times %%
As a fun boat that can be played with and chucked in the car i duno if it can be beat
Dan
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Well, the boat is finished and having just done a rough weighing I'm pleased to say that it's at about 885 to 890grm, though I'll get a more accurate weighing done at the club. I'm surprised that it's not appearing to be too much over the class weight. I've not done anything special as yet, just left off servo number three three and trimmed the servo plate accordingly as well as fitting rod steering and trimming all servo horns etc. The steering servo is the Graupner 261 at 10grm and the battery pack a 6V 5xAAA pack from Mike Weston which weighs in at 60grm.
At that I'm more than happy that I won't be at any real disadvantage at all at club level and I've not even looked for weight savings yet of which I'm sure there are some. I won't either till I've had it on the water to see how she sails first....
It's a great looking boat though and I'm really pleased how well it went together, less daunting than I was thinking it might be. Can't wait to get sailing now ! %%
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Awesome news :-))
Picks on the water then :P
Dan
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Just a few photographs to show what she looks like on dry land before she's launched, just in case anything goes wrong and I never see her again. {-) The sheeting arrangement is temporary until I see how she performs on the water, after which I can make any necessary adjustments. I'm just sorting out the electrics after which, weather permitting, I hope to get a sail on Sunday... :D
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s253/Artistmike/magic-two.jpg)
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s253/Artistmike/magic-three.jpg)
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s253/Artistmike/magic-four.jpg)
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I've ordered one.....
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Well done that man ! :D Well have our own Mayhem fleet at this rate ! ...I've certainly not regretted it at all, it's a seriously nicely engineered boat and I can't wait for sailing trials, hopefully on Sunday ! :}
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looking good , i see you fitted the bulb shroud , most people leave that bit off as it creates drag , ive also omited the two side shroud lines on mine , and not put any of the stickers on either ! just wish it wouldnt leak water through the hatch
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looking good , i see you fitted the bulb shroud , most people leave that bit off as it creates drag ,
No I didn't fit the bulb covers, I just made sure that I sanded the lead and filled it well before I painted it, to give as smooth an outline as possible so as not to introduce drag..... Not having had her in the water yet I don't know how much of a problem the hatch will be, have you tried using Silicon Grease to help waterproof it?
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Apparently, my kit is on hold as Graupner has sent out the latest batches of kits without the keel bulb!
...... easy mistake I guess. %%
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Yes well, they do tend to fall over a lot without them ! {-)
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having the black bulb i thought you had fitted the cover boot ! ive sprayed my fin , bulb and rudder in red , every time ive been sailing i smear silicon grease around the hatch , but it still leaks ! think the problem lis in the hatch clips not pulling the hatch down very well
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every time ive been sailing i smear silicon grease around the hatch , but it still leaks ! think the problem lis in the hatch clips not pulling the hatch down very well
I'm surprised that there's enough water coming over the deck to get past the hatch cover and silicon grease, I suppose you've checked that it's not coming in anywhere else ? ...... Maybe you need to get a B Rig for the sort of weather that's driving her under like that... I'm hoping to get mine out tomorrow so I'll let you know how it goes and whether I ship much of the stuff.... :((
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artistmike we are all on tenderhooks,please report later.i am going mm sailing this afternoon,we have between 10-15 mm sailing great fun. i had a carbon one but sold it and bought a racing one.still cant win,keep trying.my son in law has a standard mm the other week he won a race.slug
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artistmike we are all on tenderhooks,please report later.i am going mm sailing this afternoon,we have between 10-15 mm sailing great fun. i had a carbon one but sold it and bought a racing one.still cant win,keep trying.my son in law has a standard mm the other week he won a race.slug
Well if the worst comes to the worst I'll just put a hatch patch on, the same type that I use on my 1Meter . Slug, as I've said, I still believe most success in sailing is down to the experience and abilities of the skipper, rather than the boat, given that in essence there's not that much real difference between all the versions of the MM. .... Race practice makes more winners than the latest boat gizmo ever will, so like anything that you want to be good at it's practice, practice and then more practice. Me? I'm, just going to poodle about on the lake in mine, I've had enough of racing with the IOMs so I've become a cruiser rather than a racer now and if it's too windy or wet, I won't go out... {-).
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as a one make class it should be a fun form of racing without the political hassles of other classes ! i also have other yachts , none of which are within class race sizes as im only interested in sailing for fun ,
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as a one make class it should be a fun form of racing without the political hassles of other classes ! i also have other yachts , none of which are within class race sizes as im only interested in sailing for fun ,
Me too ! :D ... In fact I have been building a One Meter out of wood, purely to sail for fun, as I know it won't be competitive. It should be fun to sail though when I get round to bothering to finish it ! :embarrassed:
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s253/Artistmike/100_1012.jpg)
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s253/Artistmike/100_1110.jpg)
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.... and I'm still wondering whether to convert this antique one to R/C {:-{
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s253/Artistmike/appleyacht2.jpg)
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that looks very good , my biggest sail boat is a 1920s pond yacht that i bought very cheaply then converted to radio control
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do I see some gauge 1 track there!
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do I see some gauge 1 track there!
It's G Scale... part of the East Appledore Light Railway ... :embarrassed:
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s253/Artistmike/ealrgulf2.jpg)
(http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s253/Artistmike/ealr73.jpg)
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I had the Carbon MM out today, only light winds so it was perfect for a bit of practice and for trying out various sail settings. As the winds weren't anything much it wasn't really a test of how waterproof the hatch either, was even though I tried to get the deck awash. .... Happily it was dry as a bone after sailing but I do need a windier day to give it a real test. There weren't any other boats there either to compare performance but she handled very nicely so I'm ready for something a bit more lumpy next time. :D
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we are hoping to go this evening , after the pedelos get put away !
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Artistmike that looks ace and great idear about the main haly line puller :-))
Bit random about sendin the boats out without bulbs Martin nice one for buyin one though, theirs a good few on here now
Dan
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Just a quick one: I know the MM isn't a scale model of any particular vessel, but if it was, roughly what scale would you put it at?
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Think it is based on a single handed round the world yacht, not sure of the make or name of the real one, but its roughly based on it
The real ones gota be around the 10 meter mark if not alittle bigger
Dan
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It's looks and hull shape owe a lot to the 1/4 tonners like these, which should give you an idea of size and therefore scale. :-) ... http://www.sailinganarchy.com/article.php?get=1715 (http://www.sailinganarchy.com/article.php?get=1715)
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Hi
I'm just building a carbon micro magic and need help to show me how to set up the lines for a
one servo set up, if someone could do a drawing that would be great, I can follow it easier, the plan only shows set up [size=78%]with two servos, this is my first go at sailing.[/size]
Alan :-)
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Actually it's very easy indeed, instead of tying off the jib sheeting line to the trim servo, leave that servo out and just attach the jib sheet to the piece of ply that the small servo goes on. Simples! :-)
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:-)) some great ideas 4r my mm
author=offshore1987 link=topic=36335.msg366513#msg366513 date=1334943469]
Updates
Battery finally tuned up today... and is 92 grams!! somehow from the website to my door its grown buy 10 grams hmm %%
Changed the jib sheet line hole, hopefully it will work and not snap off but only time will tell. Have moved the keel to its back position and its helped alot with the trim of the boat, it should come from graupner like this in my opinion!
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4209275.jpg)
(http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc127/offshore1987/Micro%20Magic%20Yacht/P4209277.jpg)
All the best
Daniel