Model Boat Mayhem
The Shipyard ( Dry Dock ): Builds & Questions => Working Vessels => Topic started by: fastvee on June 26, 2012, 04:58:22 pm
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Hello, my friend asked me to build him the Bremen. I have build many fiberglass fast boats but never a kit. I belive the hull in this kit is frp(I guess it means plastic that is reinforced with glass cloth)
My first question is what kind of glue I should get,gluing the plywood parts to hull and since I dont have the boat here yet I dont know what else then glue is needed to build her.
I understand that "stabilit express" is somehing most graupner kit builders use, but it is expensive and I dont know is there alternatives to it -or can I just use CA and epoxy?
We ordered these items to start:
2xKondensator(gross)Btl2 Graupner 3588
2xSPEED 600 BB TURBO 12 V Graupner 3302
WP BREMEN 9 Graupner
Pattex Stabilit Express 80g Graupner 960.85
(if this is not enough. please le me know)
We plan to use 3s lipos(11.1v) for power, any ideas how much the Amp draw is on these motors on around 12 volts?
(or is lead batteries a batter option to get some weight in)
Any ideas are welcome and I hope to get started soon with the build(the boat is here next week)
-Pate
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ADHESIVES
Adhesives may be in tube form (polystyrene cement) or in liquid form such as Humbrol Liquid Poly or MEK
(methyl ethyl ketone) which is best applied with a brush. The technique is to apply a few drops of the solvent
and the glue will run down the joint by capillary attraction. The following glues are recommended:
Fibreglass to plastic: two-part epoxy (Devcon, Araldite, Speed Epoxy) - 10 min. or 1 hour.
Plastic to plastic: ordinary plastic solvent (Revel, Liquid Poly, Slaters, MEK).
Whitemetal to whitemetal: two-part epoxy (5min.) or thick superglue (Pro-Bond, MFA etc.)
Whitemetal to plastic: two-part epoxy or thick superglue.
Wood to plastic: two-part epoxy, thick superglue or contact adhesive.
Brass to plastic: R/C Modellers craft glue or thick superglue.
Rubber Fendering: contact adhesive (UHU, Bostik).
Window glazing: Weldbond, RC Modeller's Craft Glue or clear contact adhesive (UHU, Bostik
etc
http://www.modelslipway.com/
Hope this helps.
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Thanks for the glue info.
I think I will use stabilit express on critical parts(motor mounts,etc. and epoxy on other bits. Also thinking of giving all the plywood a nice epoxy coating.
Now I need to think what esc I need, would one do or do I need 2..Hmmm....-maybe I´ll get 2 castle sidewinders, castle has never let me down b4 and 2 should be plenty for these motors. -need to think about that a while.
-are there any reliable esc´s out there for boats, 12 volts and not too expensive? (3s lipo that I plan to use is 11.1v ,fully charged 12.6v)
I see that the stall current is 40A on these motors, do I really need to get 80A esc or 2 40A ones, that cant be correct?
(from graupner):
Nominal voltage 12 V
Operating voltage range 4,8-14,4 V
No-load rpm 17200
No-load current drain 1 A
Current drain at max. efficiency 7 A
Current drain when stalled 40 A
Max. efficiency without gearbox 77 %
Length of case, excl. shaft 57 mm
Diameter 37 mm
Free shaft length 8.7 mm
Shaft diameter 3.17 mm
Weight 220 g
-Pate
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Hi Fastvee, got your PM. I built the model when it first came out in the middle of 1995. I built it as a review model for Int. Marine Modelling magazine. I do not have the model any more.
The review was in Int MM Feb / Mar. 1996. So we are talking 17 years ago!
My general thoughts in retrospect are.
I used aluminium tubing instead of wood dowel for the boat stand. This was to get a good solid base.
The hull is plastic and I used bags of lead shot in the hull when on the stand to keep it stable.
I used much the same motors on 12 volts and she went very well. Each motor took 7 amps so it was 14 amps drain altogether. I used a single esp and she responded very well to the rudders.
The esc I used at the time was the 15 amp Electronize with my own simple water cooling plate and the esc ran stone cold, not so the 5 Ahr Ni-cads, they were almost too hot to touch.
Boat ran for about 40 minutes.
The props were 32.5mm diameter, that's all you need.
I used Stablit Express for the wood to plastic glue which is gap filling but there are othes on the market now.
The most crucial glueing is the wood formers to the stern, this must be square.
I mention in my article that the stern cradle is very thin plastic at the corners.
The inwhales that are the top inside deck edge are balsa, I did not like this and suggest beech or similar. You drill through this to support the stanchions.
I did the finishing of the deck on a flat surface prior to sticking down as the ply is quite thin. If you use Halfords metallic paints don't forget the clear finish coat required.
Just general things like put tape around the hull top edge to stop glue from sticking to it when placing the deck.
The stanchions are made up with washers that have to take the angle of the deck. I made my stanchions up on a separate pre-drilled base and soldered them but super glue would do just as well.
Bending wire around the rope boxes. If you first heat the wire to cherry red and cool it. It will then bend very well around the plastic and stay bent (Annealing)
Most of the cut out plastic doors etc benefit from having a scrap ply backing.
I did not like the screw holding the hatch down so constructed a hatch over it to hide it away.
I enjoyed the fire monitor, pity you will not be fitting it. I had it turning via a servo and sharing the water cooling of the esc.
You can switch the lights on and off and It is worth working out a simple power connection via a plug and socket, so that the cabin can be easily removed.
Good luck with the build, she looks very nice on the water and made the front page of the February magazine edition.
regards Roy
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Thanks alot Roy!
That is alot of information there.
15A esc ? -wow, so single (60A cont. ,100A burst) sidewinder esc should be plenty then!
32.5mm props? -the ones that´s included in the kit or something else? -thinking of getting raboesh 3 bladed brass ones later, but for starters I was planning of using the kit props.
I did not even know the boat is that old , 17 years ago! -and you remember all these things... -I cant remember what I had for lunch yesterday!
I am thinking of using faskolor(airbrush, acrylic water based) paints, and spray acrylic 2k clear from rattle can afterwards.
I will think about using that fire monitor, it is cool, but I belive that it needs the extra fittings kit to get that working, and I dont want to pay 150€ for that simple kit.
http://www.hobbypeople.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=96_316&products_id=24908&language=en
Thanks again,
-Pate
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Hi Fastvee, I cheated! I looked out the magazines and did a quick read.
I think the 32.5 mm props came with the kit.
Your batteries will be lighter than the Ni-cads I used, so the boat should go faster.
I don't think that the parts shown amount to 150 Euros! I am sure the fire monitors can be bought as little kits for no more than £15 - £20.
I used Halfords spray paints.
I seem to remember checking the rpm with props in the water and it was about 9000 rpm.
It shows how good the Electronize esc is as it worked at full power all the time.
I think the mast, which hinges, was a bit fiddly with the working lights. I think I mentioned that it would be better cut 1mm oversize and be strengthened.
The Authority that runs these boats paints the decks a metallic grey colour and not as in the instructions.
Good luck you are welcome to email me if you have any queries.
regards Roy
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Thanks again Roy.
I cant wait to get started with the build, but it seems that there is something wrong with the store(hobbydirekt) where I ordered it from. The boat has been in "shipping department" status 3 days now. I just sent the store email to see what is going on.
(usually I get stuff from Germany to Finland in 3-4 days, so this does not look good)
The boat,motors,glue and caps were in stock (now the boat is out of stock) at the time I bought them so no idea why the delay.
The boat was alot cheaper there then other places(229€ there, cornwall,and other places wants 350€ for it).
But I´m not that worried yet, will see if something happens next week, if not then it´s time to ask paypal to the rescue...
-Pate
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I use hobbydireckt regularly and they can be a bit slow to ship at times, but always come through with the goods
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Hi essex2visuvesi , did you get my pm?(3rd one, I asked you about hobbydirekt shipping)
I have ordered 30min clear epoxy(to coat the wood parts) ,thick CA(it may become handy),wires,plugs,shrink tubing,etc small items.
Will order the esc next week, and pick up some clamps to help with the gluing process.
I dont know would the motors need watercooling, if so I will grab some brass tubing and make some cooling coils.
(thinking that 7A per motor cant make them that hot... ? ) It has been so long since I have used brushed motors...
-do you guys know how many hours these motors usually last? -allready thinking of getting some nice brushless outrunners(like I have on my navaho http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=30702.0 )
-but brushed has so nice throttle feel compared to brushless sensorless motors that if they last a while I will use the brushed.
-Pate
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Yes I did sorry.... could have thought I replied... must be one of those erm senior moments. I have only used Hobbydirekt through their ebay shop
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Thanks, and no worries,just glad to hear you have had luck with hobbydirekt, googled a bit and not every1 has been that lucky.
anyways, just got order update from them, "waiting for article " -great... every part was in stock when I placed the order >>:-(
-Will wait a bit and hope everything will be fine, I just want to start with the build so bad cause the build plans have changed: -the friend who asked me to build this backed out
(he just bought a house and asked would I like to have the boat) .
So long story short it is my boat now and cant wait to build it my style.
-Pate
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Just noticed you are in Finalnd as well? where abouts are you? Im about 150Kms north of Tampere
Hobbypeople are pretty good if a little expensive. Quite often it is cheaper to buy from Germany even with the extra postage.
I was quite suprised when I moved here that there are not that many model boaters here considering the amount of water available
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Hi, I live in Helsinki.
My family has a summer cabin in Sipoo(~15km from Helsinki) ,and I keep and drive my boats there.
-Pate
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A esc question for all, are robbe esc´s any good? -I can get new NAVY CONTROL 535 R esc for 40€
- Speed controllers features:
Weight: 62 g
Measures: 65 x 39 x 18.5 mm
Operating voltage: 6 - 17 V
Current: 35 A
and this is what the manufacturer say:
Full forward / reverse control with high resolution, excluding unnecessary brake function. Expanded controller neutral point with pre-programmed non-linear control curve for finer control when manoeuvring. The 1000 Hz pulse frequency avoids motor damage and gives a smooth motor start. Galvanic separation (OPTO) between motor and receiver power circuit prevents interference to the receiving system from brush sparking. The integral ´Rx-Filter´ active interference suppression system shields the receiver from motor interference and suppresses invalid signals. With power-on guard and thermal overload protection. Simple to adjust the speed controller using the ´eps´ easy programming system. With integral water cooling system for long operating times at high load currents. Can also be used without water cooling; maximum continuous current is then reduced to 25 A. Sealed with acrylic lacquer to protect from splash damage.
This should be good, right? -35Amp is enough,without watercooling it is rated 25A, and that should also be enough.
The price is ok, it is close to 80€ retail so if it is good I´ll take it.
The 17v voltage is also good, then I can use up to 4s lipos if needed. (the sidewinder I first was concidering is 12v max)
-Pate
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I have a robbe rookie ESC in my sons white star.... seems to be pretty good
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Thanks!
Also got reply from hobbydirekt to my question about the delay: "Speed 600 will arrive today and everything will be shipped together"
So they must have been out of stock one motor and alls well.
-Atleast I´m hoping O0
-Pate
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Hello fastvee, I will send you scans as soon as I have done them.
regards Roy
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Thanks Roy, I cant wait!
Just also got the waited "shipped" email, hopefully I can start with the build next weekend ;)
-Pate
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HI Fastvee, I have sent you 4 emails with 11 pages of content.
Good luck with the build.
regards Roy
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Roy, thanks alot for your efford.
The articke will be fun to read.
and just got 2 emails from the store, both included tracking number(s) for the boat... -one for GLS and another for DHL...weird.
-Pate
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Just update of the parts ordered:
Castle sidewinder esc with fan(the robbe one I was getting at first was reported not to be great with lipos)
5000mAh 3s lipo
Cooling coils for the motors
2xGundert water pickup for cooling the motors(they are great, used in few of my fe builds)
Silicon cooling tubing
14 and 16awg wires.
I want really long run times so if I can fit 2 lipos in then it will have 10.000mAh capacity. -any idea how large the battery space is on this?
Roy, the article is really handy, more I read the more I learn. -Like you wrote that the motors got hot after running them for a while. Now I know they are going to get hot so they needed cooling. -I now have the cooling components for them.
I hope the hull can accept 2 of these pickup/outlet thingys, and they can be glued to the hull well.(never really liked abs, I have just build fiberglass boats )
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DHL just delivered the boat. -almost as big of a package as my losi 5ive-t is! -so it is massive.
The hull is rather thin, maybe reinforcement with fiberglass is needed for some parts, will see.
As I wrote b4, this is going to be civillian vessel, so no fire monitor this time. -and maybe the crane wont be installed eighter, I need space for the table and seats for aft deck.
Damn the instructions are not in a book type manual with pictures for dummies, but huge sheets of paper, I dont have the space to lay them on... -thank god there is also english instructions, I would never be able to build this without written instructions at language I can understand.(well, I can barely write and read English, but much better then german...)
Anyway....This is going to be a LOONG build. %)
Will start build next sunday, but I have few questions for you smarter people out there:
-Gluing the plywood to abs hull what cleaner is safe to use b4 gluing? -acetone melst abs right? -so that is too strong?. -fast wipes?
Is just washing the hull and scuffing the hull where glue goes enough?
Pate
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If you need any help in translating the instructions, give me a PM... between my wife and I we should be able to get something that makes sense lol
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Thanks!
-just went through the parts and found out that the railings and stanchions are not included in the kit!
-they are in that 150€ fittings set <*< >>:-( -great.
I dont want to pay that much for the railings since That is the only part I need from that set.
Railing is not a priority atm, not even started with the build, but I think there is cheaper sollution to this.
-I have never worked with brass, -other then annealing and bend it for stuffing tubes, looks like I´m going to learn drilling and soldering railings from brass tube soon...
(and do my own look to them, no box art needed here).
-Pate
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Have a look here:-
http://www.modellingtimbers.co.uk/40.html
Also if you look on hobby peoples website they have the billing stanchions
http://www.hobbypeople.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=34_161_218&products_id=16855&zenid=cc32a1408448af4081a97e77d59cd202
I just hop thats not the price for 1! :o
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Thanks, yeah, hobbypeople has strange pricing(or price tagging)... -been at their shop few times, nice tiny rc shop, but their web shop is a bit difficult to follow at times.
Just checked what cornwallmodelboats has and they have many different railings for about a pound a piece, so I may just order from there when it is time to do the rails.
I am thinking of building the boat first and then think what railings are nice fit to the rest of the boat looks.
Yesterday I got the Futaba 3001 servo for steering ,and made the servo mount(not included in kit)
Just got back from the paint shop:
really dark blue(for hull) acrylic paint
Clear varnish for that blue and for wood -also acrylic.
Gray primer (for all the parts that are painted and plywood parts) -also using that for the deck,(or that matte white) not going for that steel deck look, just after that gray(or white) gelcoat look that some boats have. -it will be cleared over also(not if matte white).
Matte white for the cabin ( not sure what paint it is, not acrylic, but it says on the can that it suits most plastics).
Why white on the allready white cabin? -the damn shiny abs toy like look must be covered....
I am still thinking about the antifouling color, white or black, not red cause all the bremen 9´s are that color.
thinking of something like the Finnish aquador boats color chemes.
(http://www.brunswickmarine.fi/aquador-32-cabin?iid=65943&pid=WAVE-Boat-Images.Native-InnerFile-File&r_n_d=43852_&adjust=1&x=478&y=269&from=0)
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Started with the build today.
The instructions are good, but not perfect. So far I had to guesstimate how deep the rudder bushings should go,glued them almost flush with the bottom, just a bit through the hull so the o-rings on the rudder shafts fits nicely.
Will update as something new happens, so far I´m at here:
(http://s8.postimage.org/3x2x2rjdt/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/3x2x2rjdt/)
(http://s10.postimage.org/hgzbvnks5/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/hgzbvnks5/)
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Now finishing the motor mount/bulkhead.
Some reason Graupner wants me to use 2.2x9.5mm self tapping screws to hold the plastic motor mounts on the wood. Great, -if the motor mount wouldn´t be 9mm thick..
So I drilled the mounting holes a bit bigger and use 4x25mm screws now..(and they go through the 10mm wood frame so it is strong now).
I will also glass the whole bulkhead -to widhtstand possible brushless upgrade later . I will countinue the build in few days.
Thats all for today,
-Pate
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Continued with the build today.
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Did the watercooling stuff out of the way, and test fitted the electronics
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Wiring done.
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I will also glass the whole bulkhead -to widhtstand possible brushless upgrade later . I will countinue the build in few days.
Be carefull on ABS hull,s fiberglass gets hot when curing and could ruin your hull.
john
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Be carefull on ABS hull,s fiberglass gets hot when curing and could ruin your hull.
john
John your point being I am intrigued as you have quoted and not commented
Dave
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Hi Stavros, the reason for my post was because a friend of mine decided to fix his battery box
in his styrene hull, using fiberglass resin.
He poured it in to a level that the tray would sit on placed the tray in position and left the boat on its
stand to dry. He came back later to find the hull had a bow in it where it must have got too hot
during curing to sustain the hulls integrity.
He was left with a useless hull which went in the bin.
john
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Be carefull on ABS hull,s fiberglass gets hot when curing and could ruin your hull.
john
good call, but I will only glass the wood parts, not the hull. Curing temp also differs, some use too much hardener and the mixture can start to boil!
And for all not used of glassing abs, here is a tip: the cloth only bonds well enough to widthstand fe use(flips and dunks) if ca is used to attach the cloth to the hull, and then light coat of resin added.
I know fast electric builders use this ca trick on abs race hulls.
Pate
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Hi John yes i fully agree with you in what you have said,when I posted what I did your ans wasnt there thats why I asked
Dave
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Yesterday I got the deck glued on using slow cure epoxy. Sadly not 100% ,but another coat of glue(this time used stabilit) added to the seam. There is slight warping of the deck in some areas, will block sand it a bit but wont use filler, will see how it will turn out.
I filled the anchor hole on hull, will be using another method to hold/use anchor on this boat(at the rear)
I also tested the boat in my tiny test tank(gulf of Finland), watercooling works and no leaks. Speed is lacking of this boat(and it is still just half of a boat, so more weight will slow it even more) , but I guess a bit better props will solve that.
Tomorrow I will sand the deck flush with the hull and then I need to fill the little gabs on the seam that sanding will reveal. -and that takes me to the next question:
-What filler should I use? -wont use any car stuff here, cause the abs will not hold automotive fillers well.(Atleas the styrene(abs sheet) I have used before has never liked fillers)
Thinking of using epoxy or stabilit express to do that job -if the gab is not too big to fill with thin stuff.
And when it is time to do the fenders/other abs parts I guess best way of filling abs seams is... -abs? -thinking of using acetone to melt scrap styrene/abs and use that as a filler?
Any thoughts?
-Pate
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revel plasto works well on plastics... I use it a lot on plastic kits
Easy to find in Finland too
http://www.pienoismallitukku.fi/PublishedService?file=page&pageID=9&itemcode=REV39607
The tamiya stuff is good as well but expensive
If you dont mind waiting for delivery from the UK the squadron white putty is in my opinion by far the best
http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/fillers.html
If you want to try some of the squadron stuff let me know and ill post you a tube (have several :) )
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Hi , that sound just the right stuff, you got pm.
thanks,
-Pate
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Now the deck is sanded flush with the hull and will be painted next weekend.
Just need to fill few spots and it is ready for paint.
The deck is still not 100% straight(one or two "waves" appeared after the glue dried), but it should not look that bad after a gray or white paint.
Will update with pictures tomorrow or friday.
-Pate
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Today I bought 3 meters of 2mm brass tubing.
Here it is after some cutting,bending and soldering.
My first time doing this brass soldering thing, but I´m happy with the end result.
The railings will be painted with chrome air brush stuff soon.
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hi fastfee, for so far i can see is your motor watercooling layout totaly wrong,your intake must be behind (in the wake) of your prop(s) and (as i do it) your outtake(s) above the waterline
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Hi fastvee you have a PM.
Roy
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hi fastfee, for so far i can see is your motor watercooling layout totaly wrong,your intake must be behind (in the wake) of your prop(s) and (as i do it) your outtake(s) above the waterline
I think the pickup/outlet is one of these so only has to be somewhere where there is water movement... water is forced in and also pulled out
(http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/1427_sml.jpg)
I have one fitted to my sons white star and Robbe katja. They are quite effective with very little drag
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Hi, essex2visuvesi is correct.
I have used these for many years and even at slow speed the water flow is good.
No need for propwash pickups etc.
Gundert pickup works well even at slow speeds.
I use 2 of these, one per motor.
-Pate
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Hi fastvee, I learn something every day, not come across Gundert pick ups before. I tend to cut scoops etc from common plastic section.
regards Roy
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another advantage of this style pickup is that they work in both directions
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Got primer, this will be the antifouling color also.
The deck is allready painted gray and cleared.
Notice the water pick up´s
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Sides painted and the whole hull cleared.
after that the hull has been wet sanded 2000grit and wil be polished tomorrow.
Few dust and insect marks are present but that is what happens when painting stuff outdoors...
Still thinking do I paint the rubbing strakes satin black(rubber look), or leave them blue...
-Pate
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Just ordered handed pair of 1315/3 brass propellers from Prop-Shop.(they recomenned these 32mm 3 bladed props for my motors/ use) Great service once again from Lucy and Simon!
(Cant wait to see the props, last 5517/3 stainless ones I got from them for my waverider navaho are so nice....)
-Pate
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Have to be honest Pate and admit re your last photo it is difficult to focus on your model with such a breathtaking backdrop, what a fantastic outlook!!................ fabulous viewpoint. O0 O0 O0
Regards, Tony. :-))
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Thanks Tony, sometimes the point and shooter(lumix fs30) does it´s job correctly,mostly(indoors) not so well.
Just polished the hull a bit, still not perfect (dust/insects/drops of paint ) wont dare to do more, dont want to go through the clear coat.
-Pate
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Charged the 10.000mAh battery {-) and the first 10 minute sea trials are done.
Still unfinished cabin, etc, but not that bad first test.
crappy video if interested http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jutdVdvuHMw
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jutdVdvuHMw)
I covered the motor casings with heat transfer compound and with the watercooling after that 10 min run everything was cold to touch.
Also painted the rubbing strakes satin black, and as the masking tape was pulled off, some of the blue paint was lifted also! -and the gray primer AND the plastic primer... glad it only destroyed 20cmx8mm section under the strake and was able to dab it blue with a tiny brush... (now it looks like scale corrosion, lol)
Was thinking of ditching that huge christmas tree mast and maybe add flybridge or just lower mast for radar and install the running lights on the cabin sides and roof.
Ordered some lights and stuff from cornwall, will see if I got the correct sized stuff, never ordered any scale lights b4 so it is a bit of a trial and error...
-Pate
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Painted the superstructure today, white looked a bit weird on gray/blue/red boat so I tried light gray.
Not 100% perfect, but it will do.
oh, and I painted the railings chrome and cleared two weeks a go(still not glued, waiting for some stainless washers), this thing is going to be finished soon...
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That would look quite good as an RNLI boat :D
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Hi all, been a while since I had time to work with this project. :-X
Got the superstructure painted(again, this time to look like fiberglass), and installed the windows also.
It was a nice day today so I went and tested this thing properly.
Over an hour of cruising around and still the batteries had some juice left in them! -the gas tank is so huge on this thing.(10.000Mah lipo)
The boat is really light cause of the lipos instead of Lead batteries so the top speed and accelleration is more then what the hull can take. -So plenty of engine power here.
Motors were really cool (26deg.c) after a hour long drive so the Gundert pickups works like a charm.
Video of todays cruise.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-EZD_GCodX4
-Pate
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Sails beautifully and in such ideal conditions too. :-))
Ken
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Nice looking boat... so whats next?
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I don't just like your boat but the stunning countryside around your house as well!!
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I don't just like your boat but the stunning countryside around your house as well!!
Come to Finland.... most of it is like that :) I came for a visit back in 2008 and never left
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Sadly that is not my house. I live in a small apartment in Helsinki, although my boating place is nice I admit and only 15 minutes from where I live.
essex2visuvesi,
I dont know yet what is next. I will add little things to this build one day.
For next build I´m thinking of something open top like aero-naut princess ... -but my all time favorite boat is the cap san diego...mmm... -if someone could find a bit smaller version of the cap san diego (graupner premium line) or something close to that I would love to build a freighter some day.
Maybe the graupner sydney star could be done like that but it is not that close...
-Pate
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http://www.dumasproducts.com/index.php?cPath=136_54 (http://www.dumasproducts.com/index.php?cPath=136_54)
some nice kits there, sadly I can't find any of the CC range for sale in the EU :(
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latest video
Tested 2s lipo also and it is enough.3s is overkill...
http://youtu.be/rRgH8akAqH4 (http://youtu.be/rRgH8akAqH4)