Model Boat Mayhem
The Shipyard ( Dry Dock ): Builds & Questions => Navy - Military - Battleships: => Topic started by: red181 on August 31, 2012, 11:45:05 pm
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Well I was undecided if it was interesting enough to do a build blog on here, I seem to be hijacking another thread about this boat, so thought what the hell, give it a go! :-)
Its the 46" Aerokits ply construction boat, this project was started some time ago, so its catch up time, please please contribute with ideas etc. but some aspects have already been done, so its too late if I got it wrong! :D
It will feature a relatively unique twin screw drivetrain, brushless, and if anybody recalls my Huntsman build, I try to get it as accurate as possible, but insane speeds, big contradiction really, but thats me! Now I am certainly no expert builder, infact I CANNOT build from scratch, just refurb, so buckle up, here we go!! %% %%
The boat was rescued summer 2010 from ebay, soundly made, true and square, never run or put in the water, circa late sixties, and sat in a loft ever since. It lived in the south Wales area, difficult to get to, and no postage offered, so for £75 I think it was a steal for this very original old girl
(http://s16.postimage.org/kr8fz1zf5/48_fboat_1_1296_x_972.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/kr8fz1zf5/)
(http://s8.postimage.org/5zozr83ch/48_fboat_2_1296_x_972.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/5zozr83ch/)
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On bringing it home, I stripped out all the junk, and sold the motor on ebay, it had never been run, I didnt know what the motror was, but it fetched £60, so the boat now owed me £15 :-)), it gets better and better though, where do you store a big four foot boat???, well I also dabble with RC helis, and found on a heli website a "damaged parts" sale, I was real lucky to find an ally box, just the right size, reduced from £125 to £15, wanted a couple of repairs to it, but what a steal!! ok2
(http://s10.postimage.org/qj3i2rgfp/hectoperm_1296_x_972.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/qj3i2rgfp/)
The motor was a 12v hectoperm, whatever that is!!
(http://s16.postimage.org/gap9ruzyp/SDC10502.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/gap9ruzyp/)
Huntsman cant resist a camera opportunity, It must have sneaked its back end in when my back was turned, cheeky thing! %%
(http://s9.postimage.org/o3id18xor/SDC10503.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/o3id18xor/)
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So, I forgot to say at the beginning, apologies if you are a member of St Helens Model Boat Club, you have seen this build start some months ago!
After 12 months in the loft, summer 2011 its time to make a start, so off with the paint!, what a terrible job, don't know what it was painted with but it WOULD NOT come off, then when things seems to be at their darkest, my mentor (a very patient fellow member) suggested fairy power spray, yes you read it correctly, Fairy power spray, :o
At this point I would have tried anything, used sanders, scrapers, thinners, nitromors, next was a flame thrower, so sprayed it on, left it for a bit, and gentle scraping, it all fell off ok2, no caustic smell, of chemicals that render the boat unpaintable, flippin great! :-))
(http://s15.postimage.org/n9gtdv32f/SDC10516.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/n9gtdv32f/)
(https://s15.postimg.cc/ucooth8i3/SDC10516.jpg)
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well what about doing a bit old but with modern twist.
the boat sits on the water all nice and calm, then a little siren goes off like fire alarm
then wallop, boat bursts into life with led underwater lights nice sound system kicking out some funky tunes
and little fire fighters pop up and start dancing on the deck ?....
or just get this to look as original as possible and try to get a scale speed going so the boat dont look proper mental
and look silly on the turns. ?
I had one of these during the sixties with a little diesel engine.
my dad used to start it up for me and i would run round the other side of the round pond at kensington gardens to watch it come towards me.
will look forward to seeing this one come to life
phill
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Hi Phill, well.......... wait and see, but it does go mental, and will look very scale, the turns where difficult to cure, but that comes later!
I cant post too fast as I dont want to catch up to "real time" if you know what I mean, this thread will not fade away without an ending, I hate it when that happens, we will all go right to the end, good or bad. It will have lights!, but I have not done them yet, must find the soldering iron!
Paul
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Next bit is horrible, preparing for the paint. With my smaller 36" Fireboat, it suffered after time with delamination, so I decided to fibreglass this boat, I had only done this once before, so was dreading this job.
(http://s15.postimage.org/cazzrkep3/Copy_of_SDC10248.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/cazzrkep3/)
This is for the hull, and a better brand for the deck, which is thinner and easier to apply, I wont need as good a finish on the deck as that will be painted with a none slip finish, as per real boat. The superstructure cabin sides will not need to be fibreglassed, more on that later.
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(http://s7.postimage.org/vwglv1cdj/P1070203.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/vwglv1cdj/)
Before glassing starts, we need to change from single screw to twin screw, never had a twin screw boat before, so this is new territory for me, time to enlist some help! :embarrassed:
Rudders are set, and the single shaft removed, holes are filled with epoxy from the single shaft
(http://s15.postimage.org/5ftjdoodj/P1070199.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/5ftjdoodj/)
Rudders are shop bought, the mounts are custom made from brass, with a "o" ring that seals when the rudder is pulled into place by the captive nut at the top, inside the boat. Links are made from brass, as per photo, and I am using a digital servo for rudder control, as these tend to operate faster, and have more torque, it also has metal gears so should be more resilient. I intend to test a gyro after construction, got one ready from a rc helicopter.
For those that are unfamiliar with these, on a heli, a gyro in simple terms keeps the tail in the direction the operator wants, so compensates for any wind that may cause a deviation, the theory is, if wind is affecting the course of the boat, or some water undulations, the gyro will keep it straight on course. These can be turned on and off with the transmitter whilst the boat is in use, so on a windy day, I will easily be able to see if it is doing any good O0 It may be useless, but I like dabbling with things, and these hulls handle bad at the best of times so anything will help!
(http://s7.postimage.org/52cdf6orr/P1070214_900_x_675.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/52cdf6orr/)
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Hang ona minute
How did you get £60 for that motor ???????
are you sure you got £60 !!!! did you hold a gun to their head or what ha ha ha i do remember it was expensive when i got it but dont remember just how much.
if you know anyone who wants to swap me a brushless motor about 4250 with 800 -1300kv they can have mine.
i hate the bloody thing.
Mine has had less than 2 hours run, its not what i thought it would be when i bought it brand new about 30 years ago.
not sure of the voltage and dont know how to tell, but think its 12 volt, here is a piccy of it
its obviously tooooo slow for anything i want to use, and im looking for a fast motor for my 37 inch planning hull.
yours will be realy good if your huntsman is anything to go by, that is a beauty
phill
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yeah sixty quid! I didnt even know what it was, ebay...... one mans rubbish is anothers treasure!, you just never know :-))
I was reading over the Huntsman thread, remember our conversation about cleaver props? Well another is coming for the Huntsman, everyone I tried wanted to turn the boat over, I have also got two for the Fireboat on order, as all the testing has been done, but dont want to jump to that yet :-X
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Fibre glassing......the secret is, go to a friends house, use his workshop, then all the resin drips on his floor! :}
In all seriousness, on a big boat like this, its a two man job, as the resin goes off quite quick, and the cloth shrinks, pulls, and moves, its a horrible job, but worth doing as the wood is sealed once and for all, but there is a lot of work involved afterwards, sanding finishing etc, but before that, lets sort out the running gear, the interesting bit (feel free to join in, is there anybody there?? ;D)
The motors are brushless, and have 5mm shafts, the reason is, the shafts are to be removed, and the propshaft will go straight into the motors, no couplings, no drive belts, gears etc, the ultimate direct drive, and two of them! O0, it could be a failure (so the mounts have to be designed in a way we can change the setup easily) or could be a success, if so, I patent the idea! ha ha
Getting the shafts out was ok, as the motors we chose had removeable shafts, they are 800kv. The problem was getting the propshaft through the can, it was an interference fit, with a grub screw, any off centre enlarging of the hole would render this task a failure, everything needs to be dead straight and true
(http://s14.postimage.org/3s5yqjyod/SDC10530.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/3s5yqjyod/)
As a precaution, I have drilled and tapped another hole in the can, so two grubscrews hold it in place, I dread to think of the damage if the can spins off, they are outrunners!
A mount was made from brass, which is soldered to the propshaft outertube, it slides on, and withing this is a bearing. An oiler tube is fitted, I dont like grease, first test in the kitchen sink
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eganpxsI3r0
thats on 3 cells instead of 4, which is what it will run on, and not full trhrottle, should be interesting, at this point I wondered about my sanity
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couple of pics
(http://s16.postimage.org/p5iawqm5d/SDC10525.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/p5iawqm5d/)
Motor with original shaft, circlip has to be removed, and there is a grub screw at rear, but it was a very tight fit and quite difficult to remove
(http://s18.postimage.org/osrvgtjed/SDC10529.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/osrvgtjed/)
shaft fitted for water test video
(http://s11.postimage.org/jm3ux8z33/SDC10531.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/jm3ux8z33/)
better shot of the new brass mount, screws are just for location purposes, and on first fitting the oiler nipple was too long, hence washer
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The last picture was the first test fit and was not used in the boat the brass mounts are thicker on the final mount
Peter
the one with the messy floor
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the engines having the shaft inside them is brilliant.
are these bits something i can buy or do they have to be made by wizzards or witches ?
there is no way i can make something like this with a sledgehammer and a pair of pliers and a mig welder !!!!!!
the size of motor would be great for what i want as well.
if i see this boat i might just have to relocate it for a few minutes ha ha ha
its not stealing, just relocating and recycling :D
phill.... :-))
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Interesting refurbe so far bud have you a link to thoas motor's please they look like just the job for my huntsman
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is there anybody there?? ;D)
O0 lurking :}
Dave
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ha ha well done Dave, glad you are there in the background! :-))
I have had several questions about the motors, they are nothing special, cheap chinese, infact the first one was so badly wound it went back for exchange, something you would not normally know about as nobody would be taking the can off and removing the shaft. They came from Giant cod, which is no more unfortunately. There was a bit of science behind the choice , I knew I was going to use M5 shafts, I try and use all the same now, so parts like props etc are interchangeable, and all the boats have bearings, so I dont end up with multiple sizes in a load of boats.
Then the shaft had to be removeable, for the project in hand, they also had to be a reasonable price, incase the project failed. We have done 3 yrs testing and developing with brushless, so had a good idea what kv we needed for this size and weight boat, dont get me wrong, there could be a better alternative, but using personal experience, and the limited info on the net, the choice was
EMP C4240, 800KV, 980WATTS, 3-7 LIPO CELLS, 9-21NIMH
I have used 800 and 880kv before, so knew it was a good balance between torque and revs, I wanted to run each motor on 4 lipo cells, and had these so no further expense, they cost approx £18 each, cheaper than most graupner bb turbo motors! ,
we (well not me!) made the mounts up, they are a work of art, wait till the next bit, it gets better!
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after having serious heat issues in the last overpowered brushless boat :embarrassed: we decided that some sort of water cooling for the motors would be a good idea, at this stage before all the detailed work began.
The fireboat has 3 exhausts, exiting at rear, one is for the V8 that drives the fire monitors, and two are the drive engines. To the annoyance of my partner in crime, I really wanted the exhausts to work, and be used as the exit point for the water cooling, the idea being the water would bubble out and look a bit like real exhausts, with some imagination!
(http://s13.postimage.org/pee354v7n/Rear_of_93.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/pee354v7n/)
look closethey are just above the waterline!
Alloy cooling plates where constructed on a milling machine, drilled and cross drilled (by memory 3mm) to create a "u" profile insde the alloy block, thus creating a water way. With a brushless outrunner, whilst in use the motors tend to be self cooling, to a point, when they stop there is a latent heat build up at the front, so a cooling block between the motor and mount should help.
(http://s9.postimage.org/p8nuz51ln/Copy_of_P1070481.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/p8nuz51ln/)
blocks being cut and drilled
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(http://s10.postimage.org/jphjwf13p/Copy_of_P1070483.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/jphjwf13p/)
cooling blocks ready for finishing, and the redesigned brass mounts, with a couple of spares! (I tend to lose and/or break things!)
(http://s8.postimage.org/t8auycjs1/Copy_of_P1070512.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/t8auycjs1/)
good shot for the spec of the motors. Cooling plates fitted, mount done with redesigned oiler tube, you can see a grub screw at the top of the cooling plate, this is where the "u" was formed, its locktighted in, and the exit/entrance nipples for the cooling tubes, water in, around the plate, being alloy it should dissipate heat ok, then back out to the esc's, which are also water cooled.
Each motor will have its own water pick up, own tubing to the mount, its own esc, own battery packs, then exit through its own exhaust at back, so two seperate systems for the two props :-))
will probaly not post for a few days now, its ready to post, but I am rapidly catching up to real time!
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would you say thease wher about the same :-))
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would you say thease wher about the same
sorry, dont know what you are refering to?
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thank you for the invaluable information RED 181 , we have the smaller version thats currently being converted to brushless too , the first task being a replacment propshaft !
jon
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Hi Jon, good to see you in here! Ive just spotted you over on fireboat site, I was going to post the build there, but thought it would be a bit boring as there are so many fireboat builds there.
I have recently swopped my graupner bb turbo out of my 36" fireboat, with all the motor swopping in the Huntsman, I had a spare T600 Turnigy 880kv, 6mm shaft, ran this on direct drive and 4 lipo cells, it was quite good, that motor was very good in the Huntsman on 6 cells, so there is plenty of scope for it, not really tried any nimhs yet but it should be ok, they come up from time to time on ebay as heli boys upgrade them, keep a look out they are very good motors, in rc heli sections, I knabbed mine for £20 virtually new, :-))
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sorry missed the link :-))
http://www.giantshark.co.uk/a35206-840kv-brushless-outrunner-motor-p-402435.html
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http://www.giantshark.co.uk/xyh4250-800kv-outrunner-p-405282.html
this appears to be ssame spec, same size, how cheap are they!
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Just think you could put ten of them in the hunts for the price of the thing that is in now :embarrassed: :embarrassed: :((
Peter
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you've seen the difference in build quality!, Ill say no more %)
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motors are fitted to the boat, shafts where set up so that we had the right position, using a disc cut from 2mm plastcard, with a flat to rest on the upturned hull. We assumed the biggest diameter would be 55mm, we where then able to see where the prop tube would be inside the boat, as its direct drive no couplings etc, its easy to see where the motors needed to be, and cout the tube to the required length.
At the water end of the tube there are water lubricated glacier bearings, at top end ballrace bearings, then in the motor mount we have another ballrace, maybe a bit over engineered but more is better than less! :-))
(http://s13.postimage.org/wxkki92f7/SDC10287.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/wxkki92f7/)
(http://s15.postimage.org/5cpuybfc7/SDC10324.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/5cpuybfc7/)
A number of bulkheads have been cut away, to ease access and reduce weight, if this works without problems, I will be amazed!
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The cooling water will exit via the exhausts, I am hping it will create some sort of exhaust effect?
(http://s8.postimage.org/7wfsjp7ip/SDC10317.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/7wfsjp7ip/)
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Hullo red181........I have no real knowledge of electrics or fast brushless :o ...but have wondered for a time about the water cooling depicted in many models
The example here shows the water cooling manifold but appears to contact only the output shaft housing of the motor ???
Is it designed so the motor forces/draws air over the rotating [heat] mass toward the cooler [water cooled] aluminium manifold?..... :o or am I missing something? :embarrassed: ....Derek
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when they stop there is a latent heat build up at the front, so a cooling block between the motor and mount should help.
:}
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Hi Derek, thanks for question,
so, there is a water pickup between the prop, and the rudder, two actually, one on each side. The props, and the forward movement of the boat, force water up the pickup (which is brass, but are readily available in plastic) , through silicon tube, I then fitted aluminium tubing, which takes the water up the boat, to another piece of silicon tubing, this connects to a nipple on the cooling alloy block, which sits between the motor and the motor mount.
The cooling blocks are drilled internally, in a fashion that the water flows through a "U" and back out of the mount via another nipple, then with silicon tubing again enters and exits the water cooled esc, then back down another alloy tube to the exit exhausts at rear.
The water is forced around the system by water pressure at the pickups only. If the motor was not an outrunner, ie, the outer can did not spin, I could use either the commonly available cooling coil that goes around the motor can, or a water jacket around the motor,
Hope that helps,
Paul :-))
(http://s16.postimage.org/abuyro0up/P1070512.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/abuyro0up/)
You can see the two nipples on the cooling block, for exit and entrance of the tubes,
(http://s11.postimage.org/4wiz5gs3z/SDC10321.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/4wiz5gs3z/)
water pickups under the boat
(http://s14.postimage.org/c9uk6sk65/SDC10326.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/c9uk6sk65/)
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time to move on to the horrible job of making the boat water tight, and paint :((, I hate this bit,
As mentioned previously, we decided that we need to glass the hull, this will make sure the wood does not rot in the future, as we dont know how old the boat actually is.
(http://s16.postimage.org/6k8j2qr5d/Copy_of_SDC10249.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/6k8j2qr5d/)
This is the cloth to be used, its light, but strong, definitley a two man job, one to do the job, and one to get in the way (me!), the cloth shrinks and moves as the resin is applied, and starts to go off quite quickly, so its a bit of a race agianst time, very messy, but worth the effort.
(http://s10.postimage.org/4p28bjw2d/SDC10268.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/4p28bjw2d/)
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(http://s14.postimage.org/sbhaa8jml/Copy_of_SDC10243.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/sbhaa8jml/)
the hull was a bit of a job, getting the cloth and resin around the shafts and rudder positions, resin applied to the wood, then the cloth over this, then another coat of resin, next is the labourious job of sanding down {:-{
(http://s10.postimage.org/qykqvugwl/Copy_of_SDC10245.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/qykqvugwl/)
(http://s15.postimage.org/fyv6meylj/SDC10255.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/fyv6meylj/)
(http://s10.postimage.org/pidtrg3dh/SDC10256.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/pidtrg3dh/)
so the hull and deck are now glass clothed and resined, dont have to do the cabin sides, I have other plans for them, more later :-))
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(http://s10.postimage.org/9u8hqicth/Copy_of_SDC10252.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/9u8hqicth/)
very long winded job, sanding the glass fibre, ready for first paint, very boring! but worth thre effort :-))
(http://s8.postimage.org/sfwn7gmkx/Copy_of_SDC10251.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/sfwn7gmkx/)
(http://s11.postimage.org/q0rcq41vj/SDC10260.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/q0rcq41vj/)
First paint, at last, I have opted for halfords filler primer, dont know why, I was disappointed last time I used it :((, but will give it another go. The hull is quite nice and flat, but I wanted a primer that will allow some good rubbing down to get rid of any imperfections,
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well my instincts where right, the halfords FILLER primer was rubbish! there wasnt any filler qualities at all, so off to my friend who has a car paint shop, call in afavour, no pics unfortunately, but he did filler primer, and the dusted over with matt black so I could see the imperfections, now I have something decent to work with.
The cabin sides, well if anyone is familiar with these aerokits boats, the cabin windows are never equal and straight, it really bugged me with my smaller 3 foot version, so I have decided to use 2mm plasticard, make new sides, with equal and straight windows, and epoxy these to the original ply sides, this should then make painting very easy as the surfgace will be flat, sound and will not need sealing
Luckily I have access to a milling machine, so making the sides with teh window cut outs is relatively easy once the job has been set out
(http://s7.postimage.org/w7599kjyv/SDC10304.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/w7599kjyv/)
(http://s18.postimage.org/d6507ln2t/SDC10278.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/d6507ln2t/)
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the new windows are now same level, straight and parallel, and same size, on the previous pic from the inside you can see how "out" the original windows where, my version of this boat is the very early one, number 93, before any of the refits. There are some subtle differences, on my version each window has its own "eyebrow", It was difficult making these, using plastcard strip heating with a heat gun and forming around a wooden mould that was made to fit in the window holes, tedious work!
(http://s18.postimage.org/qei65ror9/SDC10277.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/qei65ror9/)
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I had to do the sides in 3 pieces, the rear section was done second, this was quite easy as it was small and narrow, the fron section was harder, as it had quite a difficult shape, and a strange shape to the side window
(http://s7.postimage.org/bc5xv16on/SDC10356.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/bc5xv16on/)
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on to the wheelhouse now, these boats have rather unusal front windows, and on this model they need replacing, again using 2mm plasticard, I am unable to work with wood, I just cant knock a nail in straight!
(http://s14.postimage.org/8p856inxp/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/8p856inxp/)
off with the old, and in with the new. I had to strengthen the frame, it was all a bit flimsy, it was difficult trying to get the shape like the real thing!
(http://s10.postimage.org/mxrtszs6d/Vosper_photograph_moored_at_Portsmouth.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/mxrtszs6d/)
new window sections fitted, and the sides are on,
(http://s8.postimage.org/ij5nmyzup/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/ij5nmyzup/)
(http://s12.postimage.org/cxz81noe1/SDC10318.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/cxz81noe1/)
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the window frames are next, these will bring the definition to the shape of the windows, I want to try and use lexan for the glazing, rather than thin plastic card, if all goes to plan, the boat will be fast, and the front windows need to be sturdy :}, i just cant decide how to do this, without getting paint on the glazing, so, I reckon make the frames, stick them on, paint the boat, then somehow do the glazing from the inside.
This itself might be too weak, the glazing could do with being on the outside, so its more secure, decisions! %%
(http://s14.postimage.org/7g2claje5/SDC10322.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/7g2claje5/)
I have cut the window frames using a milling machine, with a small bit so I get the internal radius neat, I will hand cut the exterior shape, as I can handle the exterior radius on my own!
(http://s10.postimage.org/9mq6u8xgl/SDC10323.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/9mq6u8xgl/)
they turned out quite nice! :-)) (not first attempt I hasten to add!)
(http://s11.postimage.org/qjd0kympr/SDC10335.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/qjd0kympr/)
fitted and primered, ready for paint
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looking very good so far keep up the ood work there bud ime counting the days to sea haw that drive train works out :-))
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it works fine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1FShc3Mvuk&feature=plcp. first runs some weeks
Peter
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thatle do the job then lol goas well need a longer run to see haw silly it gets he he :-))
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it works fine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1FShc3Mvuk&feature=plcp. first runs some weeks
Peter
I think you're going to need a bigger pond !
Richard
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the vid's was the very first runs he did not have enough rudder movement at the time. the lake is a great lake for testing easy in and out of water plus you could Paddle in it to get boat back in an emergency, Paul will fill you in on any runs on a lager lake
Peter
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Oh, I'd love to see you paddle in there Peter - preferably with a daft smile and a big pink candy floss in each hand. {-)
Maybe for the January page of the Mayhem Calendar ...... so much more exclusive than Pirrelli's
Dave
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I always have emergencies!! :} so being able to paddle in, and retrieve on all 4 sides of the lake is a massive advantage! :}
For the peeps that thrive on statistics (me..i love testing!! :embarrassed:) Before I stripped all the running gear out for the paint etc, the boat got a couple of runs on a large lake, with eagle tree data logging and gps installed.
I tried a number of props, all testing was done with 4 lipo cells per motor, unfortunately I never got a calm day, and had nobody to video, but it went really well, and I was very pleased that it was a very efficient setup, certainly compared with my Huntsman that is so amp hungry it heats the lake up %%
(http://s16.postimage.org/hokmlhdg1/session1a.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/hokmlhdg1/)
(http://s8.postimage.org/c57c4aqq9/session1.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/c57c4aqq9/)
here we have screen dumps of an actual run, using X 52.5 props, max speed was 21mph, since then, on the next day, which was a bit calmer, I achieved 22.33 mph, and only 38.29 amps, on X 55mm props. I now have a pair of propshop props that I hope will reduce the amp draw
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Whilst the boat ran well in a straight direction, especially at speed on the plane, cornering was a different matter, off the plane it was nose-diving, the rudders acting as brakes, up to now the rudders are the standard shop bought type with no modifications, and the turning circle was like turning the Queen Elizabeth on the mersey, so so mods where in order
(http://s11.postimage.org/xgc3qi9db/SDC10338.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/xgc3qi9db/)
Gradually taking a bit off the front and back edge, I tried to keep the pivot point the same, it seems to have worked, as it turns far better now, particularly at slow speeds (it hurt typing that statement, I dont like "slow" :D)
Now, remember the exhausts?, functionally they are superb, everything is running nice and cool, the cooling blocks for the motors working perfect, and the ally pipes looking all nice, but... the water exiting the exhausts, even at full speed, is a dribble at best. If I disconnect the cooling system the motors very quickly start to run hot, so its def working, but I am not getting the visual effect I was hoping for, ah well! cant have everything, I suppose everything cool is the better outcome. We even tried putting the water out of the exhausts at a 90 degree angle hoping that would create a sort of spray effect, but no different. I disconnected the pipes from the back of the boat, and hung them over the deck by the motors, suddenly I have a big pressure of water, so I think its just down to the fact the boat is 4 foot long, and the water is travelling too far.
Pity I have no video, as the boat will not run again till its finished :-))
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All running gear now removed, and its back to painting and making things
(http://s15.postimage.org/63sx83sk7/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/63sx83sk7/)
I really wanted a dashboard to resemble the real thing, so decided to make my own. I possess no particular skills here, so for any other looking in, give things a go, sometimes the results are ok!
I looked for ages to find a steering wheel, as this seemed to be the centre piece of the dashboard, could not find one anywhere, so made one from brass rod, heated up and bend around a bit of scrap bar, spokes soft soldered into place, nad the centre boss was turned on a lathe.
(http://s9.postimage.org/jou2yc0ob/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/jou2yc0ob/)
(http://s8.postimage.org/8dbrbou9d/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/8dbrbou9d/)
The dials are cut from a downloaded picture, some plasticard on the top to look like the dial glass, the switches turned on a lathe from some alloy scrap, and the dash stained with ronseaL matt varnish, throttles and compass made from some scraps, when in the boat it will not be that visible, so final detail does not need to be too accurate, quite pleased with result!
(http://s18.postimage.org/y5datwout/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/y5datwout/)
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hull now painted, for some reason the pics look pink! buts its definitely red :}, the black took a while, I used plasticote, sometimes this paint goes on really nice and trouble free, but the black took ages to get right, painted, flatted with 1000 grit, painted again, etc, 5 times!. I decided to lacquer rather than do what I usually do, which is to flat and polish, to try and give the hull a deeper shine, and more resilient finish, so after 3 lacquer coats and flatting between each with 1000 grit, I then polished the final coat, it turned out fine, but very time consuming with a lot of wasted time letting the coats harden for a day or two
(http://s11.postimage.org/73oez6ctb/SDC10352.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/73oez6ctb/)
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The deck and superstructure is painted in BS631 Grey, as per the original Vosper plans. It looks a bit "green" to me, but its done now, I'm not doing it again!
The deck was painted first, before primer, with this
(http://s8.postimage.org/4xfi7rokx/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/4xfi7rokx/)
This "roughcoat" finish will give me the none slip deck finish. After practising on some scrap wood, I arrived at how many light coats produce the right texture, then painted over this with the BS631 Grey, hoping there would be no funny reaction with different paints, so far, it looks very good, hope it stays this way when the boat is in use %)
(http://s17.postimage.org/4nlg8syp7/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/4nlg8syp7/)
(http://s8.postimage.org/bf7lirdpt/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/bf7lirdpt/)
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wheelhouse glazing done, took simply ages, its 2mm lexan, didnt want thin plastricard, I think this boat will get wet at the front, so wanted something more substantial. Some of the fittings are on, its pretty much the bigger stuff I need to make, such as searchlight, monitors, davit etc.
The mast needs to fold down, like the real thing, for storage in that big box, even the hinges for the cabin roof hatches where a problem, I wanted plain strap hinges, couldnt find any anywhere, so had to make some up from plasticard, on the boat painted they look fine, hatches will not be opening so they dont need to be functional.
(http://s10.postimage.org/cggdo47qd/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/cggdo47qd/)
(http://s11.postimage.org/rneg8nhsf/image.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/rneg8nhsf/)
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Im really struggling trying to find anything suitable for the rescue nets that are on the rear cabin roof, the squares in the net need to be approx 1 inch, cant find anything anywhere, anybody got any ideas? :-))
(http://s16.postimage.org/5yxdz6my9/Boatlarge.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/5yxdz6my9/)
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Hi
RE: the net need to be approx 1 inch fishermans keep net or landing net possibly get 2nd hand on the flea bay . most people do with fruit bag or table tennis net.
Frank.
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I have some black knotted netting left over when the pest control were trying to stop birds getting in to some of our buildings.
It's about 3/4 inch mesh but it should do.
Couple of pics hopefully.
If you pm your details I will send you the required amount Just let me know how much 2ft by 2 ft or whatever.
Ned
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that looks superb Ned! Cant tell you how many places I have looked, and the amount of things I have tried, wandering around haberdashery stores isnt really my thing! Table tennis net, good call Frank, didnt think of that one, great when minds come together! If anyone else has any ideas about this boat build please please chip in, especially the bits I have not got to, It would be nice to have a conversation about it,
will PM you Ned, bye the way, thanks for looking in, I was getting very lonely! <:(
Paul
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now that fittings are going on, I bought some time ago a set of white metal fittings, but didnt used them as I thought they wrer a bit heavy, some of the fittings where quite nice, some not so nice
(http://s15.postimage.org/jcrmsx15j/SDC10485.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/jcrmsx15j/)
I started the mast tonight, which will be made from Brass, its a bit of a job, making all the bits, then soldering together without the previous solder job getting hot again and unsoldering itself :embarrassed:
The mast pole will be hollow, so I can run the mast light wires through it, although on the real boat the wires where on the outside, I think it will look neater, and it has to fold down for storage purposes
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Hi Paul,
I popped some netting in the post for you this afternoon.
I think you should have enough,but if not, I have loads more.
Let me know if it is ok for the job.
Ned
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Hi Paul
The mesh that comes around beef and pork joints looks quite good for scramble nets. It should stand up well to getting soaked too.
Plus you get a nice meal O0
Dave
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Need a big joint to supply two 18"x 18" nets.
Plus if they smelt of blood the poor old airmen being picked up would be scrambling darned fast as the sharks smelled the meat {-) {-)
Ned
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{-) - maybe just ask the butcher for some clean net straight off the roll - it must come in huge lengths.
Dave
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Sprouts (The Brussels variety) used to come from the wholesalers in black knotted 3/4" square mesh sacks. These had a waterproof waxey type coating. When the heavier seam was undone it gave a mesh panel of about 24" x 30". More freebies when the Veg markets emptied them.
Regards Ian.
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Hi Ian, long time no speak! the places I have been for this net, now all these great ideas! Anything for a free meal Dave! speaking of which, will see you soon, I think the Manor Farm does a nice dinner! :}
Anyway, the net from Ned arrived today, its superb :-)) :-)), many thanks Ned, I dont even need to colour it, or wash it! even better than expected, I will reimburse you next week.
I'm off to the Midland Model Enfgineering show tomorrow, need to get some brass for the searchlight, milling cutter, as I have broke some more trying to make the mast leg mounts, so the mast will fold down
(http://s11.postimage.org/yiz5bdt9r/front_on_crane.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/yiz5bdt9r/)
some springs (the loco boys have these!) to make the salvage hoses (second plan pic)
(http://s11.postimage.org/6k9ky9h0v/Page3.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/6k9ky9h0v/)
and no doubt some other bits and pieces!
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mast is now made, from brass, its has to fold down like the real boat so it fits in the storage and transportation box (remember the box at the beginning!)
I have used 10ba very small bolts, that need to be cut back now, but a problem will be that I need to remove the rear bolts to fold the mast, and then put the mast back up for use, I think my clumsy fingers will drop them when sailing at the lake, so maybe just use the rear bolts for show, and some sort of pins when the boat is getting used? The front bolts can stay in, as the mast will fold down with these in place, also, after all the work on the mast I dont want it falling off,. so any ideas welcome!! (a conversation would be nice :-) )
The bases for the mast legs were made together, and tapped for the bolts, even though they have nuts, I thought it might prevent them falling off!
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just now needs painting and wiring for the mast head light
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Major delay now, whilst starting to make the searchlight, the lathe jammed, and stripped the gears, I would like to think it wasnt my fault, I was turning very lightly!! :embarrassed:
I always seem to end up working in chaos!! :}
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I always seem to end up working in chaos!
Chaos - a state of Dynamic Instability. Now that sounds much more creative O0
Dave
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did you manage to find springs to make up the hoses on the aft deck ? jon
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Hi Paul
Reply 47 first picture - where did you find a picture of the controls? Have you any more? I have been looking for a while now.
Dave
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Hi Dave,
Peter has it, or if you give me an email address (ring me , PH has my number and email address) I can email it, better that way as you can then zoom in for all the fine detail ;)
Jon, I went to the recent midlands model engineering show, and picked a pair up a pair of springs from a model train parts supplier, my plan is use a wire coathanger inside the spring to retain the shape, and heatshrink over the spring thus giving the right effect for the hoses (not my idea I hasten to add! :D
Paul
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Looking good. runs good :-)) .
Mark
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finally a searchlight! This took a stupid amount of time to do, the lens is cut from some sort of plastic rod I was given ages ago, the nuts are small 10ba, and the bulb will be a 5mm LED and a nice big m5 nut underneath to stop it falling off, dont want to make another one! %%
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better get on with it now there is another 48" Fireboat build, just like buses, nothing for years then two come along, :} :} it will be intereting to see how they both progress with different set ups etc :-))
So, some small bits and pieces are now done, and the biggest scratch built fittings so far are almost finished, the fire monitors, not like the commercially available ones that all these boats have, I wanted the original first version, these are not available to buy, so had to make them.
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I dont intend to lose them in the lake, so a M5 nut will hold them on to the boat!, some finishing is still required, just cant decide on the colour, I doubt the RAF painted them bright red like all the models of this boat (my 36" version also!) I was thinking they are grey, I have asked on the Fireboat website, but no answers yet, any opinions gladly welcome, have a look at the picture...
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Maybe we should have our own "FireBoat" meet next year... :-))
The monitors certainly look the part, and make sure they are well and truly bolted down, big shame to lose them after the work thats gone into them.
Mike
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Maybe we should have our own "FireBoat" meet next year.
Now that might just force me to get my RTTL working at long last.
It came fitted with a blue Chinese esc so maybe it will become a Fireboat on the day %%
Dave
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Hi Mike,
the founder of the fireboat website is also a merseysider, so we have a few of these boats in the North west, and some at Morcambe that hosts the aerokits vintage meets, so we could have a north west get together! :-))
Thats if I ever get finished, its been 18 months in loft from original purchase off ebay, and now 1 yr 3 months getting refurbs, and you are catching me up after only a few weeks! {:-{ :}
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I've also been told that the Southport Model Boat Club, have a "Aero Kits" meeting, I'm sure we will meet at some point.
I'm likely to have the 46" at the Ellesmere Port show, in what ever state I get to by then....possibly exchange ideas then.... %)
Mike
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I must work quicker!!
Anyway, I have been very lucky to talk to a guy who actually piloted number 93, without hesitation he has confirmed the early version of 93 pre any refits, had 3 different versions of fire monitors, the first didnt last long, they were short and painted red, the next are the clam shell design, the ones I am modelling, they were grey! and the final set were the commercially available ones, they were red, so the grey paint came back out!
I have also finally fitted the rescue nets donated by Ned, they were real good, but when fitting they just seemed to be very stiff, and not very realistc. I decided to use some heatshrink to attach the loop securing to the roof (copied from someone else, its a real good idea!), as I was heating the shrink using a heat gun, the netting started to shrink and go soft, so by pure fluke I was able to dust the heatgun over then netting, which made it go all soft and drop, making it look far more realistic :-)) , bit of luck there.
Centre cabin roof now completed, the small padlock was the finishing touch, from modelling timbers :-)
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A very enjoyable build log Paul am enjoying the journey, impressive scratch building and machining skills to boot. Looking forward to the next installment.
Regards, Tony.
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Hi Paul
Them monitors are brilliant.... :-)) :-))
See you soon
Mike
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Just had a little build reread Paul - sometimes its just nice to revisit things.
Dave
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was meddling for a bit tonight Dave, got quite a few bits done, had a few inspirational moments, with things that had been a problem for some time, sometimes it just goes that way! Ive arrived at 2/3rds towards the back now, at the Davit, after that, its the well deck and its finished, decals on, running gear back in, check nothing missed, and it can get wet again . The only real annoying thing is a there is a crack in the paint, on the front cabin roof, it will be real awkward to redo, especially as the weather is too cold, I am currently warming aerosols on the radiators in the house, so I think it will just have to stay, dont think I can face painting again!, I vowed I would not use plasticote again as there always seems to be "blooming" problems, even with same brand primer and laquer, but seeing as I had tons of it in the shed I have kept using it, every paint job on this boat has been done 2 or 3 times over to get a good finish, with very careful prep work, with the exception of the grey paint, this was mixed at a car factors, and was perfect every time, lesson learnt! >:-o
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There is a crack in the paint, on the front cabin roof, it will be real awkward to redo, especially as the weather is too cold, I am currently warming aerosols on the radiators in the house, so I think it will just have to stay, dont think I can face painting again!
Boat hook etc laying over it ... Scuba tank & flippers?
Dave
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yes! I will have to be constructive with some deck clutter.............in a number of places, :embarrassed: amazing how you can polish through paint when flatting it with wet/dry!
Then in my rage, I throw the sanding block at the wall (it does make you feel better doesnt it!), it bounced back and hit the boat, resulting in more deck clutter required, its going to look more like a floating skip that an RAF Commissioned fast and light boat %%
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jerry cans can hide a multitude of sins as can toolboxes etc
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I think we've all been there and done that :(( I've made and placed hatches where they shouldn't be, made up signs and decals as well as the usual ropes and clutter, as my old Pa used to say use ingenuity to "make a feature out of a cock up" and nobody knows!
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Not a lot you can put on the forrard cabin roof Paul.
Can you get away with a rope coil cheesed down.
Not a lot of scuba gear was carried back then Dave 8)
I am sure you will overcome
Ned
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Hi Ned, the nets look great have you seen them, then at Xmas I was up a ladder taking down Xmas lights, and stuffed some into a roof tile to stop a pesky starling getting into the roof, so a double win there, many thanks!
Yep, its probably going to be some old rope, its by the sand anchor right on the joint of a roof section, the burnt paint is in two parts, not telling yet, we can play find the burns when its finished! :} :}
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well the title does say start to finish, I just didnt say when it would finish! Project has been getting some attention, but other things seem to be getting priority, like rebuilding crashed rc helicopters!
Clearview was a triumph, and a failure, I could not get exactly what I wanted, so made my own, in a cobbled up sort of way, I was delighted with the results, then thinking I was using clear set cyno, stuck it on, and guess what, it wasnt clear, so the windscreen is now smudged with cyno, and the clearview has gone cloudy, but at this late part of the build, its not getting another windscreen, it would be too much work, so maybe one when its all finished. Also done some other fittings, the davit took ages to do. The nav, mast and cabin lights are all wired up and fitted, just the rear well deck, tow hook and a few small bits and bobs to do, trouble is I cant remember how all the running gear goes back together, its been that long since I stripped it all out! %%
I used a piece of stock bar in a lathe chuck, and using double sided tape stuck a piece of clear plastic on the end. Using a sharp scriber, I then cut the circle, then turned in the lathe the outer rim, cleaned it all up, used a dressmakers pin for the centre stud, some plastic card for the wiper and stuck it on the windscreen
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The final part, the back end.
I have started planking where the tow hook goes, and will plank the well deck, then use a wash, so its painted grey like the rest of the boat, but the planking is visible, hopefully it will look ok ok2
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Hi Paul,
Glad to see your near the end....just hope I get there to.. :embarrassed:
It certainly looks the part, the mistake with the screen is easy done, and have done this many times on the planes over the years.
Look forward to seeing it in the flesh........ %% %%
all the best
Mike
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Hi Mike, I was at Newsham sunday before last, didnt have a boat with me, met a friend there at the cafe, he was saying there are plans for a jetty, I havent seen fishermen on that lake for sometime, hopefully they have all b***ered off!
Yep, feels like I am finally on the home stretch with this boat :-))
Paul
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Hi Paul,
Not been down at the lake on a Sunday for a while, and only made a brief visit this Wednesday.
Yes we are getting a jetty built, and the area around it is being tarmac hopefully in the near future, Glendale have been given the contract, and are probably waiting for the weather to improve.
As for the anglers, well they are few and far between, but do show up now and then......see how things develop on that front... 8)
Glad to see your on the homeward stretch....I'm still at the starting line... {-)
Drop me a line if you are going up to Newsham, will try and meet up.
all the best
Mike
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I might bring a rod or two Paul.
I might hook up and waterski behind you. O0
Good luck with the final stretch anyway.
Dave
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GOT TO GET THIS FINISHED!! :embarrassed:
Mike is catching me up again with his build of same boat, and its been a bit of a disaster lately. I dropped something on the centre cabin roof and damaged the edge, will have to patch it up as its not getting another made, and whilst admiring my work tonight, I was horrified to see a very strange 1/8 size hole in the side of the hull, which is totally unexplained, nothing inside the boat to suggest I have been working etc, the only explanation I can think of is during the cold weather, as the boat is in the garage, possibly there was a plug of some sort that was painted over, and has fallen out? Thats a real set back, I have no intention of painting the hull again, so the "FIRE" decal will have to be over this hole, and plugged from the inside. If it ever goes up for sale, you have been warned its got a hole in the hull! :}
So the tow hook section is nopw planked, a very slow process, lay a plank, glue it, cut the grey caulking card, glue it, wait till dry, next plank, next caulking strip, and so on. I didnt need to be too fussy at the centre as the tow hook will be here
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Having had experience of the smaller 3 foot version of this model, I know these boats have a tendancy to get water in the rear section, so I will copy what I did on my 3 footer, and make the rear well deck like a bathtub, so if water gets in, it stays out of the hull and away from servo, electrics etc, pull the bathtub out and drain the water away from the boat.
As I cant knock a nail in straight, I dont use wood much, so as with the rest of the build, its plasticard. I find it easy to work with, easy to mark out, cut, glue and its quite cheap. This is 1.5mm. When finished, I will plank on another piece of plastic, or thin ply, and drop it in, it will be easier to do that way (I hope!)
Working in chaos as usual, no wonder things get dropped and damaged :embarrassed:
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once the well deck is finished, its the tow hook, it will be brass, I am looking forward to making that, then wiring the lights which are fitted to the unit that will operate them all, red and green nav, white mast, blue front nav,, all led's, then two in wheel house, and a further 6 for the cabins, all pygmy 12v. I want the cabin and wheelhouse to be a realistic yellowish light instead of bright led's, I tested them all when fitted, I hope they still work as that feels like it was months ago!
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I don't think I will catch you up....but loving the way you've done the rear end.....food for thought there for me....... O0
Great job...Paul :-)) :-)) :-))
all the best Mike
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"you know who" gave me the idea Mike, he was always full of good ideas! one thing is clear, working with the 4 footer is way easier than the 3 footer, I can see things without glasses! :}
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Well it did cross my mind when I looked at the picture....seem to remember it being mentioned in conversations with Peter when he found out I had a 34" FireBoat.....Peter was a clever man full of ideas...and you always ending up thinking..."wish I had thought of that" %)
Glad to see you on the final stretch... :-))
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He was always full of good ideas!
He was also very very good at talking me into things O0
Dave
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The rear deck "bathtub" is now done, and suprisingly fits very well at the first effort! Visible parts are painted, and the planking is underway
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Loving it ...Paul it looks the part....... :-)) :-))
Mike
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been looking forward to this bit for ages, the towhook. I want to make it so it will actually tow, not just stuck on the deck,
(http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/7109/sdc10030fq.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/692/sdc10030fq.jpg/)
I Bought this brass at the midlands engineering show last year for the towhook body, shows how long its been waiting for this moment!
(http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/4981/sdc10033b.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/585/sdc10033b.jpg/)
Body pretty much done, just wants the hook and some detail work, same with the baseplate
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Hi Paul,
Thats some tow hook......impressive....... :-)) :-)) :-)) :-))
Mike
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thanks Mike, spending WAAAAYYYYY too long on this! Its the St Helens model boat club fun day week on sunday, unfortunately I think it clashes with your event? I had hoped it would be finished and running again on that wonderful big lake we have, but I seriously doubt it now!
Bit more done tonight, spend 2 hours!!! doing the handle, %% %%
(http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/8431/sdc10039u.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/109/sdc10039u.jpg/)
Pity events clash when we are close to each other, I would have like to come over to Newsham
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Hi Paul
Shame about the clash...we will get there in the end....... ok2
Mike
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Opps..!! forgot to mention the great work on the hook, looks the part...... O0
Mike
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get the feeling its only us two reading these! Its a bit lonely isnt it :D
more done, another 3 hrs tonight! just on this flippin hook :embarrassed: needs trial fitting and painting, at last.
URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/59/sdc10040e.jpg/](http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/2694/sdc10040e.jpg)[/URL]
URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/194/sdc10041k.jpg/](http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/8766/sdc10041k.jpg)[/URL]
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Nice bit of kit, that hook.
Rest of the boats very nice to.
You in for the job of towing the new QE carriers %)
well done :-))
keep up the excellent work
we are out there lurking, so you are not alone
vnkiwi
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red181......I agree with vnkiwi........but we cannot comment if we cannot see the images.....as below ...Derek
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No pictures must be you aussies haven't paid the power bill yet, as pictures ok over here in the eastern isles :o
cheers :-))
vnkiwi
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todays images are OK.....just the previous ones from May 9th ..... %% .....Derek %)
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Derek,
must be that lightning fast fibre optic, the photos have been you just missed them, and they haven't got back from here yet. %)
happy days :-))
vnkiwi
ps
jeez I do speak some piffle O0
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wierd that phot thing Derek, but thanks for being there, lurking! :-))
If I dont do this build log, I will stop working on it (again!), must press on, I am waiting to do my PCF Vietnam thingy, but have banned myself until this is done, and finished, is a model ever finished I wonder?? %)
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Hi red181........good to see hex headed bolts & nuts....... :-)) most scale like in your machined hook assembly...........too many use socket head cap screws or Phillips heads & really screw the scale concept
Be assured we are watching with interest.........Derek O0
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yeah, they are 10ba, seems only the model train guys have these in abundance, the paint is now out, humbrol polished steel, I like brass, seems a shame to paint it now!, then off to work, which really gets in the way of modelling, {-) got a right telling off last night from the missus after disapperaring for 3 1/2 hours in the shed on a saturday night after being in work all day, the good news is she wont follow me into the workshop incase there are "spiders and flying insects", he he :} :}
Paul
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red181....the bolts below are M2.0..........by chance.....I also find 10BA [which is metric] bolt size open ended spanner a good scale for metric steam flanges ....manufactured for 1/8"or 5/32" OD diameter tubing & used in approx. 1:20 scaling etc ....
ISO M2.0 [as shown below] has the same hex AF size as 10 BA :o ............
One could get all of the charts & tables out to confirm this >>:-( ....but the proof is in the pudding............Derek O0
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get the feeling its only us two reading these! Its a bit lonely isnt it :D
Sorry Paul, I seem to be playing catch up with everything this last month. Nice towing hook :-))
Dave
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One giant step closer to the finish line! :}
(http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/8484/sdc10043h.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/600/sdc10043h.jpg/)
URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/203/sdc10042q.jpg/](http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/8062/sdc10042q.jpg)[/URL]
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Looking good Paul.....how have you chemically blackened the brass?......Derek
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Humbrol metalcote polished steel aerosol, they do a couple of colours, and tin pots also, but the aerosols have a slightly different colour. When dry, you buff up, I painted over white primer, only a dusting to get the steel paint to adhere, so the detail was not lost in a sea of paint, then over rubbed on corners etc to get the brass to show, so it looks a bit weathered, over time, and with use, I suspect the paint will wear and get damaged, which will probably make the towhook look more realistc :-))
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enjoyed doing the salvage hoses, I am lucky to be able to machine the connecting ends, but the hose itself, a streched spring to open up the coils, bent coathanger to keep the shape, and heatshrink to look like the rubber nose :-))
(http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/6227/sdc48.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/22/sdc48.jpg/)
URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/24/sdc49.jpg/](http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/5236/sdc49.jpg)[/URL]
URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/703/sdc50.jpg/](http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/7513/sdc50.jpg)[/URL]
URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/577/sdc51.jpg/](http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/815/sdc51.jpg)[/URL]
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a streched spring to open up the coils, bent coathanger to keep the shape, and heatshrink to look like the rubber nose
That is very clever and looks really good. What a great idea!
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rear deck FINALLY!!!!! done, still undecided about the paint defects on one side of the hull, repaint, a real delay in the proceedings, and possibility of damage to other areas, or leave it, and it may annoy me!!
Well, its our secret ;) whatever I do, if it ever gets sold here on mayhem you all know about the "little blunders" along the way :-))
(http://img819.imageshack.us/img819/715/sdc10105c.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/819/sdc10105c.jpg/)
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Well Paul,
Hope mine looks as good as that....brilliant.... :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-))
Mike
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Knowing Paul I can well imagine it will all be just a blur when he opens the throttle up O0 >>>>>>>>~
Dave
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yeah you are right Dave, fast!
started wiring up the lights, got a fantastic gizzmo from hobbyking for just a few quid, it will operate up to 7 seperate devices, in my case lights, from 1 receiver channel, in a series of flicking the switch, also got a couple of turnigy rc switches from a mayhemer to operate the searchlight, as I was fitting it all tonight, another delay, because I used light plasticard for the roof panels, the flippin lights shine through, and it looks stupid, so now I have to paint in a dark colour the inside of all the roof panels, just time consuming as no doubt it will take 2 or 3 coats to do it properly!, and getting at the underside of the wheelhouse roof will be very awkward, at least the end is in sight, cant wait to get it in the water again ok2
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good job its a fireboat, this wiring is a potential fire hazard :}
(http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/8943/chc4.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/10/chc4.jpg/)
(http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/6246/tjk1.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/694/tjk1.jpg/)
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FINISHED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Well, almost :embarrassed:
Gave it a shake down on sunday morning, all went reasonably well, good news was no explosions, nothing fell off, and it was bone dry inside,
Some work still required before I can say 100% finished. One motor was annoyingly coming on before the other, some recalibration of speed controllers back at home seems to have it cured, although I can tell one motor is slightly better than the other, thats what you get buying cheap chinese stuff I suppose.
When it was tested all those months ago I was using a variety of plastic two blade "x" props both going same direction. I now have real nice propshop counter rotating, and was somehwat disappointed that they seem to be bogging a bit, good news is I can p/x back with propshop who have a great after sales service, they were my choice, I think a little big, however its deceiving running a large scale boat on a big lake. Later this week I will run with data logging onboard and can compare props to see what offers best performance. Run time will always be short with the sort of set up I like, way over scale speed :}
And, so much for building light, it now weighs a ton, with 4 x 5000mah two cell lipos to power it, with the option of running 5 cells per motor.
Video to follow, and hopefully some pics when running, if I can find someone to drive, its a bit bum clenching to say the least! :-))
(http://imageshack.us/a/img196/8770/znho.jpg)
Proof it actually got wet last sunday
(http://imageshack.us/a/img189/6301/a6ac.jpg)
Pretty props!
(http://imageshack.us/a/img843/411/d8lr.jpg)
A lot of milliamps!
(http://imageshack.us/a/img707/3096/v3q7.jpg)
Decals on!
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Little story about the pennants, the info most of us have, and the pics etc I used for this particular representation of an early version of "93" pre any mods or refits.
(http://imageshack.us/a/img560/2851/yeel.jpg)
The boat was pre handover to the RAF, so therefore in most of the available documentation this is why the crew were not wearing RAF uniform, they were actually Vosper crew. So, the RAF insignia was not flown on the flag, it was a bastardised version of the Blue Ensign with a form of Vosper logo, Vosper have verified it would have been something like this, (thanks to Mike at scale flags for producing this lovely silk flag). The blue/white "A" pennant now has a different meaning to that back in 1952, then, the pennant signified "vessel under test and may deviate from true course" or something like that.
(http://imageshack.us/a/img14/9761/w2lv.jpg)
Just a bit of history for anybody interested!, that'S why my boat has different flags ;)
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had two testing sessions, I had TWO eagle tree data loggers on board, one on each motor, it was a good opportunity to see how much the motors differ, I have my own set of Eagle tree data logger, lcd screen readout, gps module and rev counter, and will be selling Peter Henshaws duplicate set so it was an opportunity to test it and make sure it works, it was brand new in sealed bags, but worth taking the iopportunity to use it.
Well, my dilemma about counter rotaing props ended, for now anyway, that picture earlier of beautiful shiney props, one is now at the bottom of Gautby lake in Birkenhead :(( :((
Not concentrating 100%, didnt obviously tighten it up as tight as it was yesterday, and as it was the counter rotator, it fell off
Luckily I already had some data,
Propshop 3 blade cleaver as per pic, 20.83mph with 37amps, so quite efficient, well at least it was {:-{
Graupner two blade 50mm "x" props, same rotation 21.64mph with amp draw of 37.95. Troubel is, over 20mph this hull really is struggling, and you are holding on tight, not like my Huntsman that thrives on bumpy water and speed, this narrow shallow hull does not like speeding over its own wake in a big figure of eight :} , but its not really supposed to be going 21mph is it! %%
I also had a set of 3 blade 40mm cleavers, counter rotating, that had been 4mm, so spent quite a while this mopring turning them to 5mm to fit this boat. Suprisingly, they just dont let the motors spin up, 4400rpm down on the "x" props, but planes much better as its 18.76mph, and quieter.
So there it is, I think the sub 20mph is better, boat looks better, and I was on a very big lake, on a usual sized model boat lake it will probably look way faster, got to find someone to video it now O0
(http://imageshack.us/a/img59/9462/4eg0.jpg)
jumble of wires with data logers x2 and the display screens
(http://imageshack.us/a/img829/5403/jrit.jpg)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img689/1108/oni0.jpg)
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Nice boat Paul O0
I guess the data logger really nails all the info down tight. Must be nice to know rather than guesstimate performance.
Dave
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Well what do you say.....Paul, was a pleasure to see her in the "flesh" at last. Goes like a dream, and certainly looks the....dogs-do-dars :} :} :}
Not the best picture, but you've just got to love the storage box.... ;)
Well done Paul.. :-)) :-)) :-)) ...just means I've got to get cracking the whip.. <*< <*< <*<
(http://i1280.photobucket.com/albums/a493/flying-flees/DSCN1863_zps4360a3bd.jpg) (http://s1280.photobucket.com/user/flying-flees/media/DSCN1863_zps4360a3bd.jpg.html)
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Thanks Mike, good to meet everyone at Liverpool Model Boat club, thank everyone for the warm welcome, pity about the shower of rain just when it was running, and the 3/4 stick performance, that choppy water and having to run same direction props due to losing one of my counter rotators meant handling was a bit difficult at speed, but at least you got the idea what its like, now its time to get yours done, number 94, then we can run as a pair! just like at Calshot in 1952! :}
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Your on.... %% %% %%
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here is a nice video, using 3 camera angles, not the finished article yet, needs some battery weight moving forward, and I am waiting for some props from propshop, but its good fun :-))
http://youtu.be/Ci6HHCZVQ0c (http://youtu.be/Ci6HHCZVQ0c)
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{-) I really like the Hank B Marvin .......E string rattle echo @ 2.54 minutes {-) .....brilliant.....Derek
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here is a nice video, using 3 camera angles, not the finished article yet, needs some battery weight moving forward, and I am waiting for some props from propshop, but its good fun :-))
http://youtu.be/Ci6HHCZVQ0c (http://youtu.be/Ci6HHCZVQ0c)
YouTube tells me that 'the content owner has not made this video available on mobiles'.
I cannot watch it on my Android tablet.
It's not a problem as I can see it on my PC, but just thought I'd mention it as maybe other 'mayhemmers' the might be browsing on Android tablets.
It's a superb model and I am thoroughly enjoying your build log.
Many thanks for sharing your experience.
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Very dramatic and excellent film.
Thank you for showing us
Ken
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:-)) :-))
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That speed is awesome! I think I'll have to get my Grandad to use a similar set up when he gets his kit finished...
I liked the view from the rear, although I did start feeling a bit sea-sick!
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thanks for all the comments, if anybody has any questions that may help their own builds ask away, Im no expert, but my trials and tribulations may help! :-))
Yes the camera's do make you a bit seasick!! Hopefully moving some of the battery weight forward will stop that high speed porpoising, if it throttles back just a bit it goes away, and I think the props are causing some of the problem. Unfortunately the cameras where not quite in the right positions, particulary the front one.
From the rear, its interesting to see how shallow the hull is in the water, inspite of the front being way up on the plane, and I suspect a bit of cavitation when you watch the water, but im getting really picky here! :embarrassed:
The props at the moment are same direction, the setup is for counter rotation, so that might also help. When the boat is running it sounds quite quiet, not the case when onboard, some big resonate chimes going on there :}
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sometime I hate rc modelling :((
Last time this boat was out it was the video, everything was wonderful, cleaned it and put it away. Two days ago I decided to give it a blast, everything all charged up, off to the lake, it was useless, no speed whatsoever <:(
It was quite strange, all the lipos (4) have cell checkers and low volt alarms so I dont over drain them, all showed fully charged, but on the water it was like they were flat. Back home I hooked up the eagle tree data logger with the rev counter and ran it up, both motors were pretty much identical, but both down on revs from all the previous testing.
So, recalibrated the two escs, still no better, tried another esc, tried another tx and rx, checked all wiring, everything was nice and smooth, no binding, could not fault anything. Today I recharged the batteries, although not much had been used, and went back out. Happily I recorded pretty much the same top speed I have had previously, 21.5mph, but very soon a lipo alarm went off, but the voltage was fine, so I suspect one of the batteries is failing. I hope its that, as its an easy fix, but I have to spend money!
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whilst at the lake today, having suspected that I might have a duff battery, I took some spare lipo packs, the two 3 cell 5300mah ones I use in the Huntsman, so for some fun, I tried it on 5 cells per motor instead of 4,
FLIPPIN HECK! :} :}
Had to hold on tight, this hull isnt made for speed, but in windy choppy conditions I recorded a very brief as it was going unstable 24.65mph,
great fun! :-))
Coincidentally I also received today long awaited beautiful 3 blade counter rotating propshop props, but alas, whilst the amp draw was half, the speed was only 18mph, so its back to the drawing board with them {:-{
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Update :}
Thinking all was well, as the last run out in dec was a great success, data logging recording speed in the region of 22mph, The boat was put away. Patting myself on the back, thinking pretty much job completed, wrong :((
Recently got the boat out again, took it for a run, it was awful, after much fiddling and messing, it was diagnosed the low voltage cut out on the speed controllers was coming in after only a minute or so of running, by the time the boat was back to the bank, the batteries where reading high voltage, and the lvc had reset, so I couild not trace the fault. This happened over and over again. Borrowed batteries with similar capacity, things improved, so batteries eliminated, although these lipos are a few years old, and cheap brand, so I know I am living on borrowed time with them. Things started to point to the motors. originally they were bought cheap, as the whole project was a bit experimental. Data logging refitted showed a very high wattage reading, over the motors capacity. I stripped everything down, replaced a couple of noisy bearings, but although it was good, it still was not performing as it should.
After a lot of research regarding the turnigy esc's I am using, it appeared that they sometimes throw a wobbler, and lose settings, particularly the low voltage cut off. Whilst the batteries were not dropping too low, achieving the high speed was a sudden dip ijn voltage, when slowing down the batteries quickly recover, the esc's where thinking the difference in voltage was infact going too low. I fitted another pair of esc's and the problem disappeared :-))
I have now reset all the settings, and lowered the lvc, yesterday the boat performed real nice. I have also received a pair of 47mm 3 blade counter rotating props frok propshop, and have settled for a marginal reduction in speed, but a massive reduction in amp draw, meaning the boat will run abit longer, and the motort5s are running well within tolerances.
Propshop advised having the props turning outwards, and it made sense with this narrow hull, however this caused real bad handling when turning at anything less than 1/3 throttle. I swopped them over to turning inwards, and problem solved, now turns fine at all speeds.
So, I probably will need to consider better motors and batteries in the future, but for now, its fine. Its surprising how much gunge needs cleaning after little use, maybe a characteristic of a faster boat? It does need some tlc though! :embarrassed:
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Lot to be said for a pair of "Racers" O0 {-)
Regards Ian.
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bit of an update, after struggling recently with this boat, I decided to treat it to some new batteries, but wanted to invest in some that I can also use in my Huntsman, this uses 5000mah 3 cell packs (x2).
I used the last of the "secret stash" and bought a pair of turnigy nano tech 5000 mah, so now I have a spare pair for the Huntsman, but will mean running 5 cells per motor instead of 4 cells on the Fireboat. My thinking being on a big lake use these, and on a small lake go back to the 4 cell set up. Esc's have been set up without lvc, and all packs have a low voltage buzzer on them to protect from over discharge. The problem now was the battery box was too small, so had to be modified! Its even heavier now. So on a lonely Sunday morning, on a big lake, I gave it a blast, and am happy to report all went well, no problems at all, but I wonder how long these cheapo motors will last, they are 900watts, and I used all of that, and some! Although I was going to cruise at a fast scale speed, I just could not help myself and opened it up, 25.3mph, now that's fast, silly fast, for this boat, and another 5 mins of fun!
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Thinking of doing this one myself, Beautiful looking boat. Beautiful looking model. Got to admit I havnt had time to read through it all just yet though.
Gave up on my last fast boat project, total failure on the speed front, spent a small fortune on props batteries motors, really lost heart. Dont want to make the same mistake again so wonder if you could summarise on the set up you have at the moment? Motor details/prop details ect.
The other alternative is a tug, the safe sure easy option, but not as nice to look at, nor as emotive. Might be more accepted down the pond though.
Colin
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Hi Colin, its very dependent on the boat, shape of hull, weight etc as to what set up will work, even modelling the same boat it will be different. I doubt you will want to have the same drive line I have, so I would suggest rather than a summary thinking it will work for you in another boat, read the full thread, it might just give you some ideas and I don't want to throw you off track.
My take of "speed" is way over scale speed and to some is far too fast, some love it, some think it was ridiculous spending all that time replicating the boat as accurate as I can, then making it go so fast, but that what I like doing. Anyway, ramble over, When I am on a VERY big lake, I run of 5 cells per motor, 5000mah lipos, 35c discharge, the motors are 850kv (or there about) 47mm 3 blade custom made prop shop props, 60a esc on each motor, shafts have glacier water lubricated bearings at water end, and 2 ballrace bearings at top, with then a ballrace either end of the motor.
It will run happily on a small lake with much less serious batteries etc. On the above set up its 24mph, 15 mins %%
Not many want this sort of performance on a 4 foot heavy ply boat, don't let this put you off! my 3 foot fireboat has one conventionally mounted 880kv motor, runs on 4 5000mah lipo cells, 60a esc, and isn't much slower!
Paul
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Thanks for that. Given me some ball park figures. Still trying to decide what I want to build. Got to be something I am in with a chance of finishing, or her in dorrs will go berserk. She really doesn't get it.
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Cracking build there and an interesting read as regards the trials and tribulations of all things electrical. I hope she gives you no more trouble.
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Brill, thanks for confessing your trials and tribulations, a story well told to us that are so inexperienced
loverly build
happy new year to you all
Jim
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Blew the dust off this afternoon, first time out of the box in two years (I think!) Boat was fine, I had forgotten at speed I had set dual rates and expo on the rudder, turns improved when I remembered, batteries didn't do so well, and these are used regularly in another application, but a high amp draw such as this boat shows they are weak, its only using 1/2 throttle and you can hear the low voltage alarms going off! :((
need a bigger lake next time!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZBC-0EqjuA
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Goes well . . . hope your washing down with clean water afterward & before storing , Hoylake's pool tends to get a lot of salt water in the winter .
Bill
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forgot about that Bill, it started to rain also! I wiped it down, but Ill check again today. I was going to go to Gautby, but strangely it was a lot windier there, and I was in the "kids coming out of school" time zone, so didn't want to get into that :-X
I tested a few batteries, it was easier to do in the boat than in a model plane! looks like I need to buy some, :((
Water looks great with that additive, pity that central box cant be removed now I always thought it spoilt the lake
I see the shelter roof has now gone, shame about that
Paul