Model Boat Mayhem
Mess Deck: General Section => Beginners start here...! => Topic started by: rich.h44 on April 16, 2013, 06:11:54 pm
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hi guys well iv been given this lovely balsa wood boat, iv not a clue what it is, i have a few rc cars so thought i take this on and have tinker to see if i can restore its, the hull looks in good condition but there are a few pieces missing from the cabin, i plan to repaint the hull in black and red the deck varnish and the cabin white,
iv never had a boat before so i dont have a clue what im in such as engine,servo,radio, battery lay out what so ever! (so if anyone has any good links please post the thank you :-)) )
anyway here it is
oh and what kind of boat is it?
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possibly a raf rescue tender,looks like the petrol engine has seen it`s day,and by the way welcome to mbm
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i would suggest swapping out engine for electric. Not many waters like the petrol engines.
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The engine look like an old diesel made by Frog. I agree with using electric motor, but why not jion your local model boat club aswell. You will get lots of help.
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Hi rich.h44
Welcome to the forum, it looks like a cross between a sea plane tender and an ASRL. I'm guessing that its approx 20 to 32 inches long. The hull number was allocated to a 68ft British Power Boat Co Hants and Dorset Air Sea Rescue Launch, other than that it look intact and a bit of tender love could return it to the lake side soon.
Regards
Nick B
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Hi there, it looks similar to this http://www.deansmarine.co.uk/shop/product_info.php/cPath/10_14/products_id/225 If you look at the layout of the superstructure and window positions, you will see what I mean.
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thanks for the warm welcome guys iv been doing a fair bit of reading trying to get my head round things!
it is indeed a frog engine! and i would really love to get it working!(the engine is free and has compression)
can i ask way many waters don't like petrol/diesel engines? i'm just curious
i have a local club (i'm from hull) but i'm unsure when they meet) so i'm going to try find that out
thanks nick that's real helpful were do you find such info? its 35 inch's long that's measuring across the top of the deck if thats any help?
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yes it does look very smiler to that, once ive got some of the cabin together ill get some more pics up to see what you think, it might make thing more accurate
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IC engines are generally mucky noisy little beasts that can leave oily deposits on the water, and frighten wildlife. You would have to find a ic engine friendly lake if you wanted to use it in the boat. You would be far better using an electric motor and electronic speed controller. It looks like the boat may have been either a free runner or only single channel RC as I can't see a throttle on the engine, only a needle valve, unless there is one on the other side. A good supplier of motors speed controllers batteries etc is Component Shop http://www.component-shop.co.uk/ or Cornwall Model Boats http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/ to name but two, have a look at the links section for many more. Good luck, I am sure the collective brains of Mayhem will help you all the way.
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I think you're right PONick it looks a lot like a Range Safety Launch instead of a sea plane tender.
Hi rich.h44, I'm a member of the small craft group which research anything smaller than a destroyer.
They have published a few journals detailing the RAF Marine Craft service, the 2700 series usually indicates a 68ft ASRL. I would guess the model is built to approx 1/24 or 1/16 scale judging by the over all length.
1/24 for the ASRL
1/16 for the RSL
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IC engines are generally mucky noisy little beasts that can leave oily deposits on the water, and frighten wildlife. You would have to find a ic engine friendly lake if you wanted to use it in the boat. You would be far better using an electric motor and electronic speed controller. It looks like the boat may have been either a free runner or only single channel RC as I can't see a throttle on the engine, only a needle valve, unless there is one on the other side. A good supplier of motors speed controllers batteries etc is Component Shop http://www.component-shop.co.uk/ (http://www.component-shop.co.uk/) or Cornwall Model Boats http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/ (http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/) to name but two, have a look at the links section for many more. Good luck, I am sure the collective brains of Mayhem will help you all the way.
thanks for the info ill get a pic of the other side tomorrow, there is a special boating lake near were i take my rc cars and iv noticed a very noisy boat that's been on there a few times! ill have a look at them links aswell thank you, iv not decided what to do motor wise yet iv been trying to avoid converting my cars to brushless and lipo but that may change if i go leccy in the boat,
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Another advantage to using electricity to power your boat is that you will have reverse......
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Nothing wrong with that engine that a little spit, Brasso and C4 wouldn't sort out! %)
(http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=42835.0;attach=122596;image)
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Hi rich.
first of all shame on all you RAF`ers for not getting this one the boy did give you a clue the name is in the motor
so from the "collective brain of the forum" {-) what you have is the "Frog RAF" launch.
Frank.
http://www.vintagemodelworks.co.uk/?page_id=9 (http://www.vintagemodelworks.co.uk/?page_id=9) click the link for the blurb on the model and pixs
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I think you're right PONick it looks a lot like a Range Safety Launch instead of a sea plane tender.
Hi rich.h44, I'm a member of the small craft group which research anything smaller than a destroyer.
They have published a few journals detailing the RAF Marine Craft service, the 2700 series usually indicates a 68ft ASRL. I would guess the model is built to approx 1/24 or 1/16 scale judging by the over all length.
1/24 for the ASRL
1/16 for the RSL
Thanks that's good to know, I know nothing at all of this boat, I was talking about my rc cars when the guy I was working for over herad and asked if I wanted a boat? I replayed Iv never really looked at them but wouldn't mind, he came back and give me this, he said its been sat there for year and it will only be binned so I took it, I explained that I don't know what I'm doing but I would bring it back to show him once it's done
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Nothing wrong with that engine that a little spit, Brasso and C4 wouldn't sort out! %)
(http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=42835.0;attach=122596;image)
A friend of mine who wants to sort it out said to leave it soaking in wd40 for a while?
What is C4
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Hi rich.
first of all shame on all you RAF`ers for not getting this one the boy did give you a clue the name is in the motor
so from the "collective brain of the forum" {-) what you have is the "Frog RAF" launch.
Frank.
http://www.vintagemodelworks.co.uk/?page_id=9 (http://www.vintagemodelworks.co.uk/?page_id=9) click the link for the blurb on the model and pixs
Cheers frank that looks exactly like I hope to get bit more done on it later and hopefully you will see the resemblance!
I just want to say a big thank you to you for your input as I realy didn't have clue what I was doing or were to even look of start!
One more question what kind of paint should I be useing?
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Morning Rich, soak your engine in any penetrating oil, or you could do it the old fashioned way and use parafin, to get all the scale off, use a hush puppy brush, ( a small wire brush with brass bristles, for cleaning suede shoes), but be careful you don't get bits inside the engine. You will have to source some diesel fuel, a mixture of parafin, castor oil, ether and a soupcon of amyl nitrate if memory serves. http://www.modeltechnics.com/diesel.htm
As far as paint goes, you can't go wrong with Humbrol paints, or Halfords spray cans for primer etc.
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Morning Rich, soak your engine in any penetrating oil, or you could do it the old fashioned way and use parafin, to get all the scale off, use a hush puppy brush, ( a small wire brush with brass bristles, for cleaning suede shoes), but be careful you don't get bits inside the engine. You will have to source some diesel fuel, a mixture of parafin, castor oil, ether and a soupcon of amyl nitrate if memory serves. http://www.modeltechnics.com/diesel.htm
As far as paint goes, you can't go wrong with Humbrol paints, or Halfords spray cans for primer etc.
Iv got some paraffin down at the allotment but Iv orderd some wd40 of a mate who makes it so I get it dirt cheep!
There's always a catch not been able to use normal diesel but hey ho, I'm going to try meet some guys from the local club and see if there's any diesels there of so Im going ask if I can buy a small amount of them to try get it running.
Iv been looking at some humberol stuff but I'm unsure how much I need? Iv also got another mate who works at a paint store that makes marine paints so I may have a little word with him
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A friend of mine who wants to sort it out said to leave it soaking in wd40 for a while?
What is C4
C4 = disassembly aid. After disassembly, the parts that cannot be found will need replacing.
Its an elderly watercooled IC. The fact that it turns and has compression means it can probably be started, but can the watercooling bits be trusted? It could be annoying to have it run out, spring a cooling leak, stop, fill and sink. Broken cooling systems sink real ships, too.
Definitely a candidate for electric, though. With modern gear, much easier to operate and you do have reverse, or, as boaties call it, "brakes". Its probably ply, rather than balsa.
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C4 = BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!
I would clean up the engine and sell on, restore the boat and fit electrics, less faff time and you can use it in more places. Lovely looking project you have there. Will be going past you tomorrow night, I am off to my caravan at Easington so go through Hull...so, hello *waves* and see ya... :D
Si:)
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If there are any "Old Fa8ts" in the local club who were brought up using Diesels, far better to entrust them with the rebirth of the Frog 349 BB than trying to force it back into life. If it was run and not cleaned out before "storing" it, the ball bearings will be gummed up and the only way to clean (or in worst case replace) them will be a complete strip down, no, the engine. This requires a knowledge of how it works to avoid kna-- err ruining it. Even turning it over before a thorough cleaning can screw it up.
Regards Ian.
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%% PLEASE don't use parafin if you are stripping the engine as parafin has a lot of water in it and it will rust the bore and bearings,better to
use petrol but be careful of the fire risks.I have an old E.D. sea otter which I have had man and boy for 50 years, I have cleaned it using this
method and she still runs like a dream,you can fuel from Just Engines on the web,Ray {-) {-)
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again thank you all for your input, the engine at the moment is the last of my worries i just want to get the cabin built and compleat then i can consentrate on the paint job, i really want to chuck it in the bath to see if it floats but im to scared in case it leaks. {:-{
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so after looking the abouve picture i can kind of see were things go, i still need to strighten the other side out as its all bent,twisted and snaped so heres what its looking like at the moment, once iv got the side sorted and the front and rear glued togter i can start thinking about putting the floor in i think
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Better to sink in the bath rather than the middle of the pond %)
Ned
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hi rich.
if you see your mate in the paint store get some good quality gloss paint as the wood being pourous will soak it in and put a
hard shell on it. Enamel gloss also if you can get or smooth hammerite. The other types of paint are best for the shiny
plastic surfaces. If you are keen to restore the motor possibly the vintage site I listed would be able to steer you in that
direction. Or google for Frog motor restorations. RE: C4 that was just the boss taking the PI55 as he recons its a bin job {-)
The reason the consensus of opinion is towards the electric motor to-day is the enviromental regulations to water based
animal and plant habitats have now been stringently enforced by many councils so the IC or glow plug sailor is now banned
from many waters and if not is frowned upon by other sailing water users. To days electric motors and batteries have
advanced to such an extent that they are now on a par with the speed of the older fuel powered engines. The electric motor
has many other advantages that have probably been mentioned already.
Frank.
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hi rich.
if you see your mate in the paint store get some good quality gloss paint as the wood being pourous will soak it in and put a
hard shell on it. Enamel gloss also if you can get or smooth hammerite. The other types of paint are best for the shiny
plastic surfaces. If you are keen to restore the motor possibly the vintage site I listed would be able to steer you in that
direction. Or google for Frog motor restorations. RE: C4 that was just the boss taking the PI55 as he recons its a bin job {-)
The reason the consensus of opinion is towards the electric motor to-day is the enviromental regulations to water based
animal and plant habitats have now been stringently enforced by many councils so the IC or glow plug sailor is now banned
from many waters and if not is frowned upon by other sailing water users. To days electric motors and batteries have
advanced to such an extent that they are now on a par with the speed of the older fuel powered engines. The electric motor
has many other advantages that have probably been mentioned already.
Frank.
Thanks again frank been a painter and decorator by trade (I hate glossing) I'm hoping I can get a very nice gloss finish, Iv been thinking on pva'ing the whole bottom half of the hull the act as sealant to stop water getting in as near the front there a strips of wood at the bottom, I don't really want fill or resin it as I like the look of it so I want to try seal it as best possible!
Been on eBay looking at shiny things! Must resist unit boat is compleat an painted!!!!
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Hi rich.
not quite sure what you mean with pav`ing the bottom half of the hull but I think you mean adding another layer of wood as
you think it may not be watertight. What you can do is paint the inside with resin and add tissue matting.
What I have done previously with old woden boats is cut a piece of tissue matting to size to fit the side skins between the
frames and also on hull bottom that way you get a nice neat job. I just apply resin then stipple in the tissue matting I just
do one area at a time between the skins. I use wooden wedges and other scrap bits of wood to tilt the hull to reduce the
amount of resin pooling in the one area. You could I supose use gel coat but for me the fumes are pretty fierce.
frank. :P
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PVA' ing, using PVA as a sealant
Regards Ian
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That's the one, useing pva/wood glue to paint the whole of the outside of the hull as protection before I paint it.
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I not sure which section to post this but is it best to replace the rudder,prop and propeller before or after paint!
Also what size rudder and prop should I use? The ones that are on it seem a bit smal?!
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Best to do all the work first, so you wont be flapping about damaging the nice shiny new paint job...... :-)) :-)) :-))
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Best to do all the work first, so you wont be flapping about damaging the nice shiny new paint job...... :-)) :-)) :-))
I'll crack on with that then I started sanding it down today got most of the paint flat but finding it hard to get the deck nice to varnish it!
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It has probably had fuel ans all sorts soaked into it over the years can you plate over it with 1/64th ply, or plank it with o.5 mm planks.....
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That's the one, useing pva/wood glue to paint the whole of the outside of the hull as protection before I paint it.
Not too sure about using PVA as a sealant - granted it can be useful as a damp resist in buildings, but unless you find some that is actually water PROOF as opposed to water resistant then it might be a worse problem being stored for the future. In use, the paint will inevitably gather a few scratches, and the last thing you want is water finding its way to a soluble layer. Resin and tissue is a much more reliable solution. There are lots of methods and ideas around, it just takes time looking through the various threads on this and other model boat sites to find them. Only trouble is, on a site with 2000 contributors, thats how many different answers are likely to turn up.
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Some of the later types of PVA are waterproof when dry, or the manufacturers would have us believe, perhaps Starlok can give a comment? PVA release agent (For Fibre glass construction) and the PVA bags fishermen use to deposit bait around the hook certainly are soluble. Rather than blathering another layer of whatever on top of the existing, It may be advantageous to rub the hull down completely.
Regards Ian.
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Ok cheers guys, well Iv got the sides of the cabin compleat so time to make the floor of the cabin Iv made my templates when to cut the wood and guess what it's too narrow! Oh well a boring night watching the soaps now :(
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what you need then more ply?
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Yeah,there's a few pieces missing so I'm going to try make it myself I'm good to pop down to the wood shop tomorrow after work!