Model Boat Mayhem
Mess Deck: General Section => Chit-Chat => Topic started by: Martin (Admin) on September 23, 2015, 05:39:13 pm
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Volkswagen chief executive resigns: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34340997
.....I wonder what took him so long?!!
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Looking forward to the next five years of nuisance phone calls....." Have you been mis-sold a Volkswagen?"
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Or a Seat,Skoda,Audi
Did they do a diesel Lamborghini?
%% %% %%
Ned
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As I understand it the software for engine management when it detected a test unit connected to it changed the parameters of the engine to give a lower carbon emission figure.
You are going to get caught sooner or later!
regards Roy
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Or a Seat,Skoda,Audi
Did they do a diesel Lamborghini?
%% %% %%
Ned
Diesel Lamborghini agricultural tractors. The company also make luxury sports cars.
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Volkswagen chief executive resigns: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34340997
.....I wonder what took him so long?!!
He couldn't get his car started because of all the "muck" that was being thrown his way.
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>>:-( So VW have been found out fiddling the emissions figures,clever software that can tell whether the car is on the road or on a rolling road on test, giving a lower figure for the latter,this could bankrupt VW with all the damage claims as all the lawyers are circling around like Vultures and soon all the adds will be on your telly like the PPI scandal,is this just the tip of the iceberg? have all the car companies been doing this?could this be the end of many famous car makes?whatever the outcome this story is going to run and run.If you have one of these cars it will be recalled and the software altered which means the performance will be a lot poorer and you will use a lot more fuel to keep the car emissions correct,if I a betting man I would put my money on that they are not the only ones and that governments will cover a lot of this up to protect these important industries and the jobs involved,having had many new cars I have never been able to get anywhere near the fuel figures they claim no matter how careful I drive so this just another of their false information their pump out to the public,anyone have any other views on this story.....Ray >>:-(
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I agree with you Ray,
If VAG are guilty then it follows that their competitors were doing something similar to level the playingfield.
Ned
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This is a very complex issue, not necessarily centred on the transport industry for an answer >>:-(
Should we ask all commuters to walk?....would we then need to ask them to pass a minimal or acceptable level of a GAS emission's test from bodily functions {-) to permit them to walk on the road?
If a walking commuter was found to be passing an unacceptable level of CO2 or C3 O4...during their jolly walk to work.......who would :police: this?.... %)........
Go VW :-))...you have my vote...Derek
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It seems like the car industry may have had a little help. http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/sep/24/uk-france-and-germany-lobbied-for-flawed-car-emissions-tests-documents-reveal (http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/sep/24/uk-france-and-germany-lobbied-for-flawed-car-emissions-tests-documents-reveal)
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I just wonder now if they will replace all the Audi's that have particulate filter problems in other words the exhaust gets blocked with the so called soot remover that will block up ad cause the car to go into limp mode and can happen so easily.
Dave
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The question that has not been answered is, how did they find out, suspect there was an informant.
They had been getting away with it for some time.
Windows 10???????
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I think that the real root of the problem is that these tests are done in a lab rather than out on a road. It shouldn't be beyond the wit of man to contrive a "standard" section of real road (i.e, no gradient, same surface and camber etc) on which all cars can be tested at a number of different road speeds. There are already portable gas analysers out there which can be connected to the exhaust of a moving car; I watched a video of one on the BBC News website just yesterday. As for other manufacturers cheating in the same way, I would be frankly amazed if they weren't all at it to some degree; it's too tempting.
I stopped buying diesels only because I wanted a particular model of car and the local dealer had an ex-demo one at a very good price - but it was a petrol-engined model. These days I only do a fraction of the mileage I used to do when at work, so the fuel consumption isn't that important. As for emissions, I have a problem when comparing those of a 2-litre diesel car with a forty-foot articulated HGV. Incidentally, both my car and Elizabeth's are supposed to do a combined MPG of over 50, yet neither of us can get more than 36.
You're daft if you believe a car salesman's blarney, so why have any more faith in the car manufacturer? Capitalism has made cynics of us all.
Dave M
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I would have thought that once the "fix" has been uploaded, that fuel consumption would go down... preceded by a bigger drop in performance!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-34324772
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A huge proportion of your mpg figures come directly from the way you drive and where you live - I live on a hill so almost all my cold-starts are driving up a long incline.
My car has a computer that displays all sorts of stuff including trip mpg.
I normally get around 28mpg but on a run, it can be 48mpg - when my wife borrows the car, it drops to 25mpg and 40mpg doing the same journeys.
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A bit more info on how VW were found out, in this article http://www.msn.com/en-ca/money/topstories/exclusive-vw-recall-letters-in-april-warned-of-an-emissions-glitch/ar-AAeHRd5?li=AA54rW&ocid=mailsignoutmd (http://www.msn.com/en-ca/money/topstories/exclusive-vw-recall-letters-in-april-warned-of-an-emissions-glitch/ar-AAeHRd5?li=AA54rW&ocid=mailsignoutmd)
Excerpt
The company didn’t explain that it was taking the action in hopes of satisfying government regulators, who were growing increasingly skeptical about the reason for discrepancies between laboratory emissions test results and real world pollution from Volkswagen’s diesel cars.
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A huge proportion of your mpg figures come directly from the way you drive and where you live - I live on a hill so almost all my cold-starts are driving up a long incline.
My car has a computer that displays all sorts of stuff including trip mpg.
I normally get around 28mpg but on a run, it can be 48mpg - when my wife borrows the car, it drops to 25mpg and 40mpg doing the same journeys.
Which? Magazine has been on the case of differences between real world figures and manufacturers figures for a while. It was reported that the VW Golf had one of the biggest discrepancies.
Concerns over true pollution levels have also spread to fuel consumption, with the consumer group Which? having long reported discrepancies between official miles per gallon test figures and their own results, with the VW Golf being the second-worst offender in their research. http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/sep/24/vw-scandal-car-giant-faces-uk-legal-claims (http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/sep/24/vw-scandal-car-giant-faces-uk-legal-claims)
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My car does less than 20Mpg, Uses 1L of 2 stroke oil per 1000 or so miles but I love it :)
Emissions are suprisingly lower than my nissan X-Trail
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What you got Gary - a Wartburg {-) %% {-) %%
Barrie
PS I had one of these once.
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Must have a Rotor :-)) :-)) :-))
Ned
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My car does less than 20Mpg, Uses 1L of 2 stroke oil per 1000 or so miles but I love it :)
Emissions are suprisingly lower than my nissan X-Trail
barrie , I was wondering also ?
(http://atomictoasters.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/403812_3959750465548_1501281325_n.jpg)
One of these Gary ?
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:-)) The two stroke SAABs used to sound great........Ray. :-))
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What you got Gary - a Wartburg {-) %% {-) %%
Barrie
PS I had one of these once.
My Grandad did too..... Quite sought after in Finland as they make great clubman rally cars
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Had a Saab 88 back in the 60's
Ned
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One of my old workmates spent a fortune over 8 years fully restoring a Saab 2-stroke like that , then got married and the new missus had him sell it....... he was gutted !!!!
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Must have a Rotor :-)) :-)) :-))
Ned
Correct, modified to inject 2 stroke oil into the combustion cycle rather than sump oil. Cleaner burn and also means you can use fully synthetic in the engine
http://www.fairpoint.net/~res12/html/omp_adapter.html (http://www.fairpoint.net/~res12/html/omp_adapter.html)
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He must be driving a Monotracer... :-))
(http://bilder.t-online.de/b/57/36/32/24/id_57363224/920/tid_da/hier-legt-sich-ein-peraves-monotracer-in-die-kurve-das-elektromobil-bietet-sportwagen-aehnliche-leistung-unter-einer-segelflugzeugkuppel-.jpg)
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Possibly an nsu ro80 but probably an rx8 ?
(http://www.carstyling.ru/resources/classic/1967–77_NSU_Ro_80_Twin-Rotor_Wankel_Engine.jpg)
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RX8 is correct :)
Tho I do have another engine and box to fit in a Triumph Spitfire %%
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It's nothing new, its happened for years in one form or another.
My Suzuki Hayabusa ( Guinness Records, fastest ever road bike) had similar mapped into its ecu. Between 4900 rpm and 5100rpm the ecu automatically leaned out the fuel/air mixture to conform with mot regulations which are read on a bike at a steady 5000rpm. Outside of that range normal service was resumed and missile like acceleration new no bounds.
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When I started driving the ecu was my right foot
or wrist depending on the number of road wheels.
The mode of transport was also maintainable with
a decent set of tools a bulb on a bit of wire and if
you were posh a torque wrench.
Ooh nearly forgot the strobe light. :D
Ned
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Ned,
and if you weren't so well of a fag paper.
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Had my Grandads feeler gauges :-))
Ned
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Other than the press & the eco warriors.. Does anyone really care ?. They may not be as low emissions as thought but they are still a lot lower than 10 years ago I would imagine..
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Diesel is " THE FUEL OF SATAN " I've endured the stink of it for 50+years in the Engineering industry, if it could be suddenly banned I'd be made up , unfortunately it's part of the 'Cracker Plant' process & cant be side stepped as the various vapours are drawn off at different levels in the tower and distilled . . .
What's worse now is "BIO DIESEL" That's made from anything that can be broken down , used chip / curry / fish cooking oils and rapeseed oils , if you think Diesels bad wait 'til you get a lungful of this stuff %% ,quite a few of the Heavy Hauliers are using BioDiesel now , one of our Hauliers was BANNED from backing his wagons into the loading bays , :police: not only was the 'aroma' appalling everything seemed to get an oily sheen on it O0
Have you noticed the price of a litre of Diesel is now LOWER than Unleaded ? and LPG is slowly going up? HMM . . .
Bill
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>:-o I care because I am not getting what it says on the tin,I live in West London and the air quality is pretty poor at times and this is killing a lot of people in big cities,the car manufacturers are saving a fortune by tweeking the engine management units and not spending the money on R&D which will make engines cleaner which I think we all want,the I.C,engine must be getting to the end of of its development and now it is the time for the electric car to take over,when I was a kid we had trams,trolly buses, the railways,coop, UD all used electric motors for loyal deliveries, perhaps we should return to using electric transport......Ray. >:-o
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Many motorists are more than happy to remove their diesel particulate filter to improve performance and stop those annoying warning lights. They don't care that this means that all the crud is just blown out of the exhaust instead, only that they hope that removal of the DPF will not be noticed at the next MOT inspection.
Diesels have simply got too complicated with all the bolted on sensors and emissions gadgets, all of which cost an arm and a leg to replace when they go wrong. I have switched back to petrol now. Electric cars will not become practical unles there is a breakthrough in battery technology to give them a range of at least 300 miles on a charge.
Colin
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This is a great debate and one which many a good point has already been mentioned, one of which really intrests me........ Electric cars, bikes etc..... Colin, I half agree with you, I understand that people want electric cars that do decent distances on a single charge but it's not a breakthrough in battery technology that is preventing this happening it's the opposite!
Battery technology is being improved upon all the time. Imagine this, you buy a state of the art electric car, it does 300 km per charge and cost you 15000 pounds to buy. One year later technology has increased that range to 500 km but the new battery is incompatible with your present system, your 12 month old car would be almost worthless as everyone knows that another 12 months down the line there will be a new battery and better range. SO, what needs to be done is some sort of agreement on the battery size or size and shape throughout the industry so that any new technology can be fitted into any old car regardless of make.
When horses got replaced by internal combustion people must have laughed ha but we're do you buy this petrol stuff from? But even with the advances in technology it's still the same petrol you put into a Ferrari as you put into a ford pop!..... Ok give or take but you know what I'm saying. If I buy an electric car today that does 100 km on its present set up I want to know that the same car will be still usable in 10 or 20 years with its latest battery update. It may not be as good as a future car with the same battery (like comparing MPG on an Escort Mk1 with a modern day focus but at least they both run on modern fuels)
If manufacturers can't agree between themselves about battery specs then they will all end up with different size and shape batteries none of which will be transferable and all of which will be soon outdated. Unless you can afford to lose so much money who is going to do it?
I would love to buy a new electric car tomorrow but come 12months when the new batteries double the range and I can't sell mine for even half the price, or after 3 years it would be like being stuck with a 3 year old Ford Focus that does 8 mpg when the new one does 70.
So what do we think, battery size and shape agreements throughout the industry, or guaranteed buy back price on used vehicles by vendors?
Not a rant just a criticism of how things are being handled by manufacturers with modern technology. U2
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Colin in no means am I having a pop at what you have said BUT ......Our Audi recently had a particulate filter problem at 70000 miles...had a quote off audi to replace said exhaust piece £1480 and they wanted it for 2 days ........So we had the filter removed and a total remap of the Ecu cost £400 Done in Half a day........Joke is not only the company I used and Audi would have had to remove the said exhaust and replace it.
MMMMM odd isnt it the last 2 Mot emmisions were compared to the one carried out yesterday and the Emissions are LOWER than the previous 2 ad an actual power increase of 28 BHP and the MPG has actually gone up by 6MPG.
The thing is by removing the DPF the engine is now running far more efficient and so will not be giving so much pollutions into the atmosphere.
The std Mot test to check if a DPF is fitted is purely visual they can not fail it if the box has bee rewelded up...ad as long as it passes the stationary test of reving up to 2500rpm and not going higher without dipping the clutch the it is a Pass..........
I must admit I was rather sceptical about this process till I had it done but it works
Biggest thing this weekend that made me chuckle was whilst working doing a road closure was when a chap stopped me and asked where the nearest Audi dealer was as he has this .....in his own words..I got bleep bleep bleep particulate filter thingy or something up on my dash and I got NO POWER....... So being the kind person I am told him what to do .....drive at 2k constant down the road on his way home to Manchester and it would clear.
Thing is this particular Audi was only 6 days old and had covered 1500 miles....WOULDT like to be the salesman in his local dealership o Monday morning as he was taking it back for his money back !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This to me really summed up the old PARTICULATE FILTER SAGA
Dave
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Stavros, my brother told me the same thing, drive at constant Revs for 10 mins and something heats up and 'burns' the filter clean. I don't know where all the burnt bits go but it works, I set my cruise control on the way to work and clear it. I have been told that if you change the revs the 10 minute timer resets and you have to start again? You can hear it start on some cars apparently but who knows, owners, garage mechanics, lying manufacturers?...........
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Constant RPM for 10 minutes {-).......in a laboratory?...or in a lavatory? :embarrassed:
I could get my new $15.00 Chinese quartz strain gauge hooked up to a few linkages & pulleys then add 1/2 a house brick as the mass applied in the fulcrum to the vehicles accelerator.......
Could also use my new $12.00 Chinese digital laser tachometer to monitor the preceding's :o..........& just to make sure my testing was valid.....I could monitor the engine temperature with my new $13.00 Chinese digital laser pyrometer ........ :kiss:....
We have a beautiful new [mega expensive] multi franchise motor vehicle sales showroom in Wollongong....yes VW, Audi, Jaguar, Skoda, Ford & Land Rover
I could get all of my test gear in the back of my 2006 [petrol] Mitsubishi Lancer VRX wagon & set up a $10.00 signage offering "cut price 10 minute constant RPM test runs" .....just around the corner from the car shop.......might be a real $$$$$$ spinner......Derek %)
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Thing is with these DPF's if they get above 40% full of soot they will not clear.....another way of cleaing them up is to remove the DPF ad immerse it in a bath of brick cleaner and it will remove the soot but it is only a temp cure it will block up time ad time again........when I asked the Audi Garage how much GTEE they would give ie Milage...NONE was the ans.....Marvelous you spend £1400 and no gtee of how long it would last.....£400 was a no brainer no more hassle
Dave
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I can certainly understand why people have their DPFs removed, it is way cheaper as Dave says and it does work. However it does make emissions worse overall because there is no filter for the soot despite the engine running more efficiently. Also there was a recent report in one of the papers that the authorities are well aware of the practice and that the MOT is likely to be tightened up in the next year or so to check the level of particulate emissions as well as for NO2.
The main reason that the filter doesn't clear or 'regenerate' is that the engine doesn't get hot enough if the car is mainly used for shortish runs,. It needs a blast down the motorway for 20 minutes or so at least once a week to keep the DPF clear and not everyone does that. The DPF is an engineering 'kludge' and it is the customer who is literally paying the price.
Colin
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Is there any advantage to having a diesel if all you do is short runs?
DM
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None really as the engine never fully warms up and you don't see the mpg benefit until it does. It just costs a lot more to buy and is likely to land you with expensive bills. Diesels are most suited to those who rack up motorway mileage. If you do under 10k per year then a petrol is a no brainer.
Colin
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No advantage at all Dave....joke is ours didnt do short journies ok yes some days it does fair comment but on the whole it does dual carrigeway and motor way miles as well......the fact of the matter is simple really as Colin has put it ....these so called soot filters are a sheer money making racket to keep the greenies happy.
But does it......all it does is to cause more problems..Why...simple really....you now need specialist chemicals to clean the exhausts up so the metal can be recycled .....more enviromental issues.
Borris Johnson with his darned immision free zones etc have a lot to ans for....next thing we will be back to a horse and cart.....Oh NO we cant as the green idiots would soon be up in arms about all the horse dung......so we would need a horse particulate filter and lord above if one happened to block up !!!!!!!!
Dave..........where is my protective suit in case the last statement arrives lol
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Horses that pull tourist carriages are usually fitted with both nose and backside bags but at least the contents of the latter can be productively used as fertiliser - very organic!
DPFs are poor engineering solutions. Eventually we will have either electric or hydrogen and the cars will drive themselves! The idea of standard battery sizes is a very good one although you would probably need several standard sizes to fit different vehicle sizes.
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Thanks, chaps. Looks like my having to buy a petrol Verso instead of the 2.2 diesel which I really wanted was a lucky break. I doubt if either of us will be looking for another car - certainly not in the immediate future - but as/when/if we do there's little chance it would be a diesel and no chance it would be a VW. I've always been told they're unhappy about going past filling stations!
DM
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Ah ha Colin fair comment BUT I this day of HSE madness I can soon see a Major flaw as some spotty nose do gooder will get up on his or her High horse....excuse the pun and turn around and say that Horse manure is a Hazadours waste material and needs a specialist to dispose of the manure as it is Hazardous to the person handling it and to the enviroment.
The WORLD Is going MAD.
Yet again the topic of Batt powered cars...MMMM lets see....more electricity will need to be produced to charge said vehicle..MORE pollution due to the fact of the power stations having to work harder....more eviromental Issuse.
When the batts on the car end their life...more specialst de pollution will be required...More effect on the environment
Thing is Colin I agree...Heck thats a first !!!!!! Something has to be done,...Biggest joke of all this is a friend of mine works in a main dealer who have these dual cars....Petrol and electric and the biggest complaint of the owners is the rate of degrigation of the tyres....far less Miles /tyre compared to a std petrol or even diesel due to the sheer weight of the car......Hence why they have a short duration......a NO win situation...FIX one problem and low and behold another surfaces.
Hydrogen cars and gas powered same scenario really...whe it goes wrong in come the specialists to get rid of the contaminated parts...more effect on up above....a no win knock on effect
Dave
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I organised an electric car motor show last year - it was very interesting.
Some dealers were very helpful and supplied cars and staff to demo (BMW, Renault, Mitsubishi & Nissan) - some dealers just supplied cars (Vauxhall/GM) - some dealers couldn't be bothered (most notably VW) even though they had electric demonstrators at their dealership - other dealers were interested but had no demonstrators (Toyota - they only have customer's cars) and other manufacturers wanted to attend but their only demonstrators were elswhere (Tesla)
Other's advertised electric cars but admitted they cannot sell them (Audi)
Most interesting was Citroen & Honda who denied they made electric cars!
I've done a lot of research into the tech and it seems that most of the scare stories are false (old wive's tails) just like when catalytic converters were introduced.
Most of the advances in the last few years are from the software looking after the braking/charging/power delivery - not the battery capacity.
Also, there is a trick that can rejuvinate the batteries back to 95% capacity when their performance starts to drop off after about 8 years driving. This will be part of the dealer service protocol.
The electric cars with the range-extenders (BMW i3 & Chevy Volt) have unlimited range - they just switch to petrol or diesel when the battery is used up which recharges the battery on the move - the fossil fuel motor is not normally connected to the wheels (although the Volt has a very complicated system that can allow the engine to connect to the wheels).
The Hybrids just drop back to fossil fuels when their batteries run down.
For 90% of drivers, an electric car would be more than adequate.
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I organised an electric car motor show last year - it was very interesting.
Some dealers were very helpful and supplied cars and staff to demo (BMW, Renault, Mitsubishi & Nissan) - some dealers just supplied cars (Vauxhall/GM) - some dealers couldn't be bothered (most notably VW) even though they had electric demonstrators at their dealership - other dealers were interested but had no demonstrators (Toyota - they only have customer's cars) and other manufacturers wanted to attend but their only demonstrators were elswhere (Tesla)
Other's advertised electric cars but admitted they cannot sell them (Audi)
Most interesting was Citroen & Honda who denied they made electric cars!
I've done a lot of research into the tech and it seems that most of the scare stories are false (old wive's tails) just like when catalytic converters were introduced.
Most of the advances in the last few years are from the software looking after the braking/charging/power delivery - not the battery capacity.
Also, there is a trick that can rejuvinate the batteries back to 95% capacity when their performance starts to drop off after about 8 years driving. This will be part of the dealer service protocol.
The electric cars with the range-extenders (BMW i3 & Chevy Volt) have unlimited range - they just switch to petrol or diesel when the battery is used up which recharges the battery on the move - the fossil fuel motor is not normally connected to the wheels (although the Volt has a very complicated system that can allow the engine to connect to the wheels).
The Hybrids just drop back to fossil fuels when their batteries run down.
For 90% of drivers, an electric car would be more than adequate.
Isn't the VX Ampera another that can charge on the go? (uses the same tech as the Volt)
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The Ampera is a re-badged Chevy Volt - very odd to drive - the engine periodically starts & stops and runs at constant revs charging the battery while you drive and change speed and start & stop - I suppose you get used to it. Nice car.
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:-)) I agree with plastic,I drove a volt for a week round London last year and was very impressed with it,so easy to drive,comfortable and the performance was really good,I found it less stressful because it was so easy to drive and park,this is the way to go and I think the car manufacturers know it that is why they are investing so money in this technology,so I think the days of the I.C. engine are numbered and the world moves on,don't get me wrong I like old technology I have 2 steam boats and a I.C. boat which I love but I would not to drive round London in a steam car,the only criticism of the car I had was it was too quiet and people walked in front of the car a lot because they didn't hear it coming, so you use the horn a lot more.........Ray. :-))
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:-)) I agree with plastic,I drove a volt for a week round London last year and was very impressed with it,so easy to drive,comfortable and the performance was really good,I found it less stressful because it was so easy to drive and park,this is the way to go and I think the car manufacturers know it that is why they are investing so money in this technology,so I think the days of the I.C. engine are numbered and the world moves on,don't get me wrong I like old technology I have 2 steam boats and a I.C. boat which I love but I would not to drive round London in a steam car,the only criticism of the car I had was it was too quiet and people walked in front of the car a lot because they didn't hear it coming, so you use the horn a lot more.........Ray. :-))
The only thing I didn't like about the Volt was the weird centre console - a bit like a microwave control panel. Other than that, it's brilliant. (£23k on the road)
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Hi steam cars are very good on emissions at the aft end, shame about the chimney!
Roy
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Saw this. Couldn't resist.Volkswagen have announced a new diesel car offering lowest-ever emissions.
Regulators have queried the use of the petrol car towing it.
Batteries have never, and quite probably never will be, a dense enough form of energy storage to give adequate range for use on a daily basis unless the only journeys are going to be a fairly short commute. Then there are the problems of recharge time and life expectancy of the actual battery.
Hybrids are only a sort of answer. You have to lug around a heavy battery and effectively a portable generator and its fuel supply which is unlikely to ever be as efficient as a mains supply. It can't be as efficient as a purely fuel installation because of the extra weight being hauled, even if it is easier to drive and the electric drive doesn't pollute in the right circumstances. Once the treasury has figured out how to tax the energy supplied from charging points, external charging will stop being a cheap option.
Perhaps the idea of "standard" battery packs that can be changed rapidly at "re-energising" stations might catch on if the industry ever gets trusted enough to let us swap our existing battery for another part way through a journey in exchange for perfectly good money. Unfortunately, the commercial world is populated by box tickers whose only concern is how to put ticks in boxes, not providing a service that will allow a box to be ticked. The powers that be at the top have never known the difference, and, as long as they get their obscene rewards for ticking boxes and a big golden handshake when caught out, they will never see the need.
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Hi steam cars are very good on emissions at the aft end, shame about the chimney!
Roy
My uncle has a huge Stanley Steamer - late model - VERY fast & powerful. Al Capone's favourite car until petrol cars came of age.
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Hi Plastic can he be persuaded to come to our exhibition? Hope to see you there this weekend?
Roy
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Saw this. Couldn't resist.Batteries have never, and quite probably never will be, a dense enough form of energy storage to give adequate range for use on a daily basis unless the only journeys are going to be a fairly short commute. Then there are the problems of recharge time and life expectancy of the actual battery.
Hybrids are only a sort of answer. You have to lug around a heavy battery and effectively a portable generator and its fuel supply which is unlikely to ever be as efficient as a mains supply. It can't be as efficient as a purely fuel installation because of the extra weight being hauled, even if it is easier to drive and the electric drive doesn't pollute in the right circumstances. Once the treasury has figured out how to tax the energy supplied from charging points, external charging will stop being a cheap option.
Perhaps the idea of "standard" battery packs that can be changed rapidly at "re-energising" stations might catch on if the industry ever gets trusted enough to let us swap our existing battery for another part way through a journey in exchange for perfectly good money. Unfortunately, the commercial world is populated by box tickers whose only concern is how to put ticks in boxes, not providing a service that will allow a box to be ticked. The powers that be at the top have never known the difference, and, as long as they get their obscene rewards for ticking boxes and a big golden handshake when caught out, they will never see the need.
You're a bit out of date.
Look at Flow-Cell batteries - works the same as a fuel-cell but you just need 2 tanks of electrolytes that can be drained & refilled in a couple of minutes. The drained electrolytes can be revesed back using locally generated electricity (solar or wind) and then re-used again.
There's info here:
http://www.gizmag.com/900-hp-supercar-flow-battery/31091/pictures (http://www.gizmag.com/900-hp-supercar-flow-battery/31091/pictures)
http://aetherforce.com/electric-car-powered-by-salt-water-920-hp-373-milestank/
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Hi Plastic can he be persuaded to come to our exhibition? Hope to see you there this weekend?
Roy
Sorry Roy - he's in Manchester and the boiler is being refurbed at the moment. I'll be coming along. :-))
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I wonder how long it will be before HMRC realise that they have been gypped out of squillions in company car tax? Will they look to the manufacturer or the owner?
It's significant that this was uncovered by the Americans; EU agencies are far too much in the pocket of big business. That's the main reason cars are so complicated, so heavy, and so expensive.
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Yes, it's a real can of worms isn't it but the owners will have acted in good faith when buying the cars so I think the manufacturers will have to take the hit. Could take years to resolve though, especially if other manufacturers have been doing the same. It almost defies belief that those responsible at VW thought they could get away with it.
Colin
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If you have bought a diesel fuelled car in the past 10
Years phone 0123 9876 543 to be awarded compensation
and a new petrol car.
Diesels are NOT us :D :D :D
Ned
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Just seen the new used car company :-
webuyanycar_exceptvw.com
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I wonder how long it will be before HMRC realise that they have been gypped out of squillions in company car tax? Will they look to the manufacturer or the owner?
It's significant that this was uncovered by the Americans; EU agencies are far too much in the pocket of big business. That's the main reason cars are so complicated, so heavy, and so expensive.
HMRC don't even know or care what the difference between diesel and petrol is.
The "department" comprises of a Grade 3 Secretary who wants either a Knighthood or a CBE before he retires; an Assistant Secretary who wants to be a Grade 3 Secretary; a Senior Executive Officer who would like to be an Asst Sec if he knew what the salary scale was, but is a little wary of the job description and the possibility of having to move from Harpenden; a Higher Executive Officer who hates the SEO and spends most of his time in the pub; an Executive Officer whose wife is expecting their third child and who just wants to get out of London, and an Assistant Officer (Pay Maximum about £22K) who actually runs the whole Department from her i-Phone while cheating on her husband.
None of these people have ever heard of VAT or Excise Duty.
None of them owns or drives a Volkswagen diesel car.
Some of these people have lunch with CEOs and agree that £6B of fraudulently-witheld tax isn't really payable.........................
Been there. Retired exactly nine years ago next Wednesday.
Do I miss it? Have a guess.
DM
(See above for my opinion of capitalism - Marx had much the same idea. It just took too long for him to see it happen)
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You're a bit out of date.
Look at Flow-Cell batteries - works the same as a fuel-cell but you just need 2 tanks of electrolytes that can be drained & refilled in a couple of minutes. The drained electrolytes can be revesed back using locally generated electricity (solar or wind) and then re-used again.
There's info here:
http://www.gizmag.com/900-hp-supercar-flow-battery/31091/pictures (http://www.gizmag.com/900-hp-supercar-flow-battery/31091/pictures)
http://aetherforce.com/electric-car-powered-by-salt-water-920-hp-373-milestank/ (http://aetherforce.com/electric-car-powered-by-salt-water-920-hp-373-milestank/)
Not that much out of date - flow cells are OK for large static applications, but are very much at the early development stage for automobile use. Reversing the electrolytes is the equivalent of recharging, times will certainly be long as effectively energy is being transferred. The electrolytes can be renewed by replacement, probably quite rapidly, but like any alternative fuel, infrastructure is needed to provide enough places where this can happen during a journey.
Down at the bottom of - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flow_battery - there is a pro/con section worth reading as an antidote to enthusiastic press releases by budding developers looking for investors.
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It was Irish Dave who reminded me yesterday of Karl Marx's remark about capitalism eating itself, while we enjoyed a few pints and yet again set the world to rights. I later went looking for this quotation and stumbled across this. http://saintlaika.com/2011/08/12/capitalism-will-eat-itself/ (http://saintlaika.com/2011/08/12/capitalism-will-eat-itself/) It isn't in the least bit political but it certainly gets close to the heart of what's wrong with the world today, as illustrated by the avarice and deceit which has prompted VW's downfall.
Worth a read, chaps.
DM
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An interesting piece. Just demonstrates that almost anything carried to extremes is ultimately destructive and that there is no limit to the extent of individual human greed.
Colin
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And haven't Vauxhall binned the Ampera because they couldn't sell any? I thought that it was the best solution - a petrol engine running at its most efficient speed/load to charge the batteries. However, just like the sensible motorcycles I used to buy, nobody did.
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V W on GEORGES St have cleaned off all their V W ,sign of the times ,somethings afoot and the big garage in the dingle has had his emission testing machine re aligned .makes y,think , diesel cheaper ,o yes .
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(http://i802.photobucket.com/albums/yy307/m4rky-photos/IMG_2191_zpsrd97mrkc.jpg) (http://s802.photobucket.com/user/m4rky-photos/media/IMG_2191_zpsrd97mrkc.jpg.html)
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%% {-)
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Here's HMS Invincible and HMS Inflexible at the Falklands burning VW coal....
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/9JnAAVbcFMG-EeVG1FFjtnmqlm5UJ87FLfalrhyMIzQ4Ws-qoqJIgxqieOl4O8SR4mLU9em3LuCtogo=w1122-h763)
Andy
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Hmmm. So good they burned it twice?
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More details emerging known for long time <*< <*< <*<
http://www.drive.com.au/motor-news/vw-emission-scandal-five-new-developments-20150928-gjw7bg.html
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It's now known that only five million of the eleven million were Volkswagen-branded cars. The remainder is comprised of 2.1m Audis, 1.2m Skodas, 700,000 Seats, and 1.8m light commercial vehicles. What a mess
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;) A mate of mine works for a well know legal firm,he was telling me that the PPR claims are now drying up and that this is like money from heaven for them,he says should keep them going for a few years,lets hope VW have deep pockets.....Ray. ;)
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It's an ill wind that blows nobody any good. %) There is huge competition between the motor manufacturers and all of the emissions technology will be jealously guarded with patents and copyright. This may explain VAG's expediency in using the software cheat.
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Never mind the emissions issue, has anyone actually achieved the manufacturers published MPG fuel figures? The published figures from any manufacturer are surely recorded by the same methods as the emissions.
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I puzzle as to what tells the 'brain' to go into 'TEST' mode so that it can change the mixture, injection time, whatever.
Maybe having the sniffer pipe rammed up the exhaust
having the front and back wheels doing different speeds, on the brake test
having the engine running with the bonnet open
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The tests are done on a rolling road so only two wheels are rotating and the steering wheel isn't moving.
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The test I was referring to is our MOT test,not the tests proving what tax band they are claiming , which is the one I imagine you mean Colin.
If the figures are false for the emission how come the cars are passing the MOT, or is that flawed too?
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I see what you mean, I think you are right in surmising that the tests are different but it will be interesting to see how this pans out. I don't think that MOT tests are standardised across countries in the same way as the original manufacturer emission tests. In the UK MOTs the emissions are not checked under load as far as I am aware. No doubt someone can enlighten us further.
Colin
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According to someone who is a U.S. auto industry expert (and shall not be named here), it is alleged :police: that VW used an engine control system to determine if the engine was bring tested, and, if so, started a special program designed to make the engine emissions-compliant. Then, after the testing, the program would return to the 'usual' settings.
So, an engine destined for the U.S. market engine would test 'clean', but would revert to a higher-mileage (and less 'clean' setting) when not being tested. <*<
Given that it's a software issue, it's possible that VW used different programs for different types of testing in various jurisdictions.
Tom
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from what I heard on the radio this morning, the ECU monitors the power steering and if it receives no input for a set period of time it goes into naughty mode
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This is how VW came unstuck.
http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/business/world-business/how-many-deaths-did-volkswagens-deception-cause-in-us-20150928-gjwyhl.html
There is talk about VW dumping cars in Oz as our emissions laws are lax, almost not existant.
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Probably the best explanation of how they did it.
Archer, the former managing director of the UK’s Low Carbon Vehicle Partnership and non-executive director for the government’s Renewable Fuels Agency, said the scandal could spread into petrol cars and CO2 levels. “It is probably not limited to diesel and not limited to emissions,” he added.
The devices are thought to work by injecting more urea – an exhaust fluid – into the car when it is being tested. This limits nitrogen oxide emissions. The car detects it is being tested because devices such as the anti-collision systems have to be turned off when it is in the laboratory. The extra urea is not injected into the car when it is on the road because it would quickly run out.
Archer claims European tests are more open to abuse because they are conducted before the car goes into mass production and by companies that have been paid by the carmakers. These testing companies have been verified by regulators in each country, such as the Vehicle Certification Agency, but in the US the tests are conducted by an independent body.
http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/sep/21/volkswagen-emissions-scandal-sends-shares-in-global-carmakers-reeling
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In the US, the testing stations don't typically use the sensor in the tailpipe method anymore.
When you pull into the testing station, a technician plugs a computer interface cable
into a socket under the dash. Like your computer sensing a USB, or Thumb drive, the car
probably senses that an interface cable has been connected, and reacts to that connection,
and goes into testing mode by lowering the fuel air mixture ratios to burn cleaner.
Or inject the DEF fluid into the exhaust.
I kind of wonder how often people have to refill their DEF reservoirs...
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{:-{ It looks like Ford and Fiat may also be involved,VW have to recall 11.2 million cars at a cost of 4.2 billion pounds and claims could cost £3000 each work that out x 11.2 million cars and we are not talking loose change,the amount of money involved could bankrupt big companies like VW and change the car industries for ever and this just on diesel cars as they are are saying the petrol ones have also been doctored,if I owned a car dealership I would be a little bit worried about my future as no one knows where all this will end.......Ray {:-{
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After gone deeper into investigation the culprit was found.
It is the dog of the night watchman
An examination proved that it had fleas which jumped everywhere
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Just a thought here chaps, as these vehicles have been proven to have higher emitions than claimed, this could be fraud on the part of the driver!!!!! they are paying road tax at a lower level so are getting a cheaper tax band than the car is capable of achieving. What now???? Back taxes as well as possible criminal action!!!!
Mark
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Umi
A lot of people have disconected their DEF systems, this is ok? till the vehicle comes up for its MOT it is an instant fail because it is non compliant. The fuid in the EU is called Adblu, and is about £5 per liter, Mercs have a replacement tank about £100 to fit. My Truck uses about 1 liter per 100 khm all adding to the cost
Mark
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I kind of wonder how often people have to refill their DEF reservoirs...
As the main constituent is apparently Urea it may be possible to refine your own... %)
However I am now even more confused. My understanding is that the fluid is intended to combine with the NOX emitted to make it safe. A DPF is what it's name says, a filter for particulates which are composed of soot from unburnt fuel and not a gas as is NOX.
Many cars don't have the fluid tank. For example the Mazda 3 does but the Mazda 6 doesn't. Can anyone actually explain the relevant processes as opposed to guessing?
Motorists themselves will not be liable as they bought their vehicles in good faith based on the assurances of the manufacturer. They may however suffer if the cars are remapped to reduce emissions with the result the power and MPG are reduced.
Colin
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This AA article is a good basic primer:
http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/fuels-and-environment/diesel-particulate-filters.html (http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/fuels-and-environment/diesel-particulate-filters.html)
I tend to conclude that these Filters are a good money spinner for the dealerships.
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Yes, that does give a useful rundown but it doesn't mention NOX levels which seems to be causing the most concern. The fluid appears to be used to burn off the soot. The Mazda 6 and other cars inject fuel into the cylinder on the exhaust stroke as an alternative method of combustion. So what is it that reduces the NOX gas emission?
Also interesting to see that removal of your DPF could invalidate your insurance, I doubt if many people have considered that.
Colin
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I would have thought it obvious that the motor insurers
would not insure a vehicle that is illegal to use on the road.
Ned
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I would have thought it obvious that the motor insurers
would not insure a vehicle that is illegal to use on the road.
Quite right, but it appears that many people are simply crossing their fingers and ignoring the problem as removing the DPF costs maybe £200-£300 while replacement is upwards of a grand. A lot of people don't bother with holiday insurance either on the basis that 'it won't happen to me' but it does happen to some and that could indeed be you!
Colin
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Quite right, but it appears that many people are simply crossing their fingers and ignoring the problem as removing the DPF costs maybe £200-£300 while replacement is upwards of a grand. A lot of people don't bother with holiday insurance either on the basis that 'it won't happen to me' but it does happen to some and that could indeed be you!
Colin
It's the same as running a petrol car with a Decat Pipe..... Illegal. IF you get caught
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And you are most likely to get caught if the car is in an accident and found to be unroadworthy - just when you need to call on your insurance!
Colin
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And you are most likely to get caught if the car is in an accident and found to be unroadworthy - just when you need to call on your insurance!
Colin
Exactly!
Insurance companies will look for any excuse not to pay..... but that's for another thread
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Here's a decent graphic showing a typical SCR process.
Best as I can understandS it... %%
Selective Catalytic Reduction (SCR)
CAC - charged air cooler (intercooler)
DPF - diesel particiulate filter
DEF - diesel exhaust fluid (urea)
Catalyst - catalytic converter
(http://cars.typepad.com/.a/6a00d83451b3c669e201127943519928a4-800wi)
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Urea?? This must be the first example in history of taking the p*** actually involving injecting the stuff. All very confusing for a bear of little brain............... %)
DM
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That is a very useful diagram Umi.
Dave, just think of the opportunities here - you could act as a beer converter to produce the stuff. Only problem is that instead of Catalytic you might end up being Paralytic!
Catheters - don't go there!
Colin
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They were saying on the radio this morning that it may cost £4 - 6 Billion for VW to fix the problem.... but they made nearly £8 Billion profit (after Tax) last year alone!
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HI Colin
Adblu is not urea it is a chemical like urea, it works like a scouring pad removing the particles at high temperature.
Broke my new truck before Christmas when one of the sensors failed in the exhaust system, £6000 to replace the DPF, Turbo and the front half of the exhaust system. Only done 3000km.
Dont let your DPF get blocked!!!! costly
Mark
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May be a good time for a long term investor to buy some VAG shares?????? O0...considering they are now about EURO 60 each compared to EURO 110 two weeks ago >:-o
Human nature being what it is {-)......will all will be forgiven in years to come?
That mate of mine........[OZ lifeguard in London] retired at the same time as me....he had $500K AUD in his BHP Billiton shares six months ago......today they are worth $225K AUD......& he acknowledges he may be pushing up daffodil's by the time the return to the earlier value.... Derek
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Sorry to hear that Mark, it must have been a real downer. DPFs on cars are expensive, especially if the turbo goes as well. Amazing that a truck costs that much though! I had a diesel Mazda 6 for three years two cars back and had no problems at all but when I came to replace it I concluded that diesels were simply becoming too complicated, too expensive to buy and too expensive to repair out of warranty so I bought a naturally aspirated (no turbo) petrol instead. Not an option if you need a truck though! My new 2 litre 6 is giving 45mpg which is not far short of diesel territory in general driving.
Colin
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This must be in the Top Ten of corporate fraud of all time?!
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Hi Colin
All covered under warranty thank god!!!! £130,000 pound truck 3 weeks old, the tecnition told me he was going on the training course in january to learn how to fix them, (he got a quick learning curve)
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Far be it for me to defend any auto maker but after nearly sixty years in the auto industry I feel I can speak with some knowledge of what goes on in the business of maintaining & the repair of many different company's cars. One Japanese company I worked for had massive brake failures at low temperature( -20/-22c) This vehicle was never recalled. The customer was mailed a voucher for two new wiper blades free, when he/she came into pick up the wiper blades we knew that that car had a defective brake Master cylinder & we asked the customer to wait for half an hour while we fixed a small problem, NEVER mentioning the brakes. Same company when they had to meet new emission standards their cars just would never run right when new from the factory. However the company in question sent us new jets & they fixed the problem. Of course the cars no longer met the emission standards, that is just the tip of the iceberg of what went on. In defence of the companies emissions were handed down by politicians most times with very short lead times who had no idea what it took to get cars to meet those standards. A case in point was MGBs, up to the middle of 1974 the engines produced 95HP @ the flywheel. At the end of 1974 that HP was reduced to 64 HP( North America,it was still O/K for the U/K to emit as before) at the flywheel to meet the American regulations. Can you imagine trying to sell a customer that wanted to trade in his earlier model built before the the end of 1974 owning a post 1974 model. I can understand manufactures' trying to get around the standards short term until the engineers & scientists could catch up but I can't understand a company with a reputation like VW doing what they did. Years ago Ford with their Pintos & Bobcats had a fault that when hit from the rear the cars caught fire & because of the impact you could not open the doors & people burned to death. Top brass made a decision that accident claims would cost less than a recall (about $6.30 per car to fix) They estimated claims would not exceed more than $120 million dollars total, the first single claim was for $128 million. Then we had all the tire failures here in North America that killed dozens of people.No companies should be allowed to do their own monitoring, it has been proven time after time. Mick B.
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VW testing? %)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhH_AstBQRE
{-)
-
VW testing? %)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhH_AstBQRE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhH_AstBQRE)
{-)
And that is how you clear your DPF {-)
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VW testing? %)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhH_AstBQRE
{-)
Mammy, How I love ya, how I love ya, mammy O0 %% %% %%
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VW testing? %)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhH_AstBQRE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhH_AstBQRE)
{-)
And another Białoruskie Miechaniki testing VW for emissions.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4vHeSe5jAs
:-))
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And another Białoruskie Miechaniki testing VW for emissions.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4vHeSe5jAs
:-))
Another gem.
At least they are consistent O0 O0 %% %%
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can't understand why it would be illegal to remove the dpf, if the emmissions still fall withing the prescribed limits, how can it be illegal, the ecu changing the settings during test may not change it by much as the limits are quite far ranging depending upon the age/condition of the engine i.e. if looked after the difference between 'on test' and real world cannot be that much.and the dpf is to remove particulates, but not all cars have these systems unless they are german or their partners - yes?
as for a game changer for the industry and this brand suffering, nah, their government will fine them tell them to put out a software patch upload it for pennies and reduce the cost, people will still have the need to drive a car and any chance they get they will still want a german brand as most are richard craniums when driving as these are quick off the mark etc, top of the list is the BMW idiots and next is the audi a3 boy/girl racers etc etc etc (the views expressed here are not aimed at those BMW, VW incarnates that do drive responsibly :} )
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(http://i532.photobucket.com/albums/ee322/Essex2Visuvesi/FB_IMG_1443294408838.jpg) (http://s532.photobucket.com/user/Essex2Visuvesi/media/FB_IMG_1443294408838.jpg.html)
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Reminds me of living in Cumbria and the way the locals did a right turn. One flash of the indicator, if you were lucky, and go. If you complained they just said,'But everyone knows I turn right here'.
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Think VAG have hacked into BMWs systems and are fitting the same software to Audis
Ned
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My boss has a 3ltr monticarlo Audi A6, nice motor, he drives within the specified speed limits and indicates as per prescribed law - thing is, he gets to the speed limit very quickly and can lose me if i am following, and I was known to have a driving style that was well known in the company as being a bit risky - must be my age i've mellowed considerably %) , now i get audi a3 drivers and those who just got to get everywhere in the least time giving me dirty looks for driving at the speed limit - exactly (we have those speed indicator signs all over the place and trying to hit the magic 30 is my target).
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A lot of people seem to forget that the speed limit is exactly that.... a speed limit, being the maximum speed one is allowed to drive in good conditions for that stretch of road. IT IS NOT the speed at which you MUST drive
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thats good, cause i rarely get over it, hense the reason for the bad looks from the racers O0
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can't understand why it would be illegal to remove the dpf, if the emmissions still fall withing the prescribed limits, how can it be illegal,
If you have modified the car, without telling your insurance company, your insurance could be invalid. Driving without valid insurance is illegal.
Text size now fixed, Thanks Derek
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ok2...I think TT was trying to convey..........[couldn't quite copy the first few words] >>:-(
'have modified the car, without telling your insurance company, your insurance could be invalid. Driving without valid insurance is illegal'.................Derek
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Also, if you have removed a piece of original equipment or it isn't working then the car will not pass its MOT and will thus become unroadworthy.
I think you will find that the reason that a car with DPF removed still passes the emissions test is because you have simply converted it into a pre DPF vehicle and there are still many of those on the road so the test has to be set at a level that will allow them to pass.
Colin
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Colin and Warspite
It comes under the consruction and use regulations, if its fitted it must remain in a working condition
Mark
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Whoo Hoo Choo choo
-
Ha ha ha :}
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Had a call today asking if I had been mis sold a ppi, I said no and they replied ok what about a vw?
-
Mis sold a PPI?
NO!
OK what about a VW?
At least it will keep the PPI guys in work for another year or 2
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Our local VW dealer has just had flyers delivered by Royal Mail
Offering cash back deals on new VW's %)
Ned
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Anyone that's bought a VW recently must be fuming.
.... don't worry, VW will have another Defeat Fumes option available soon.
-
Don't Worry
VW Very Worried :embarrassed:
Ned
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%).....in OZ, our WV Group Australia have recalled or withdrawn from the sales offices all of the new diesel engined vehicles with the dodgy fuel computer
These vehicles will be the first group of vehicles to get the new computer system installed and then returned to the distributors to make them saleable
Current owners of said 'newish' offending vehicles will commence the recall for conversion under warranty in January/February 2016....yes 4 months away
Owners of vehicles outside of warranty are probably considering making an appointment with their Bank Manager >>:-( for an overdraft on their home loan to pay for the conversion...............although this all depends if enough owners get together with a Class Action against VGA <*< & challenge their inaction in the High Court......
Now remembering, owners of VW vehicles in the USA that suffered faulty transmissions had their vehicles repaired under warranty as WV America admitted liability.....however WV Australia did not follow the same path for the same fault and our owners finally found themselves in the High Court O0 .....Derek
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If it isn't compulsory, (which apparently in the UK it isn't), why would you want to have your car converted so that it uses more fuel and has a poorer performance? Earlier models of diesels without the latest emission gadgets will still remain legal to drive for the forseeable future despite their higher emission levels. I only ask because it is common practice to remove crudded up DPF filters at the moment which motorists are clearly happy to do if it avoids them having to fork out the eye watering costs of a replacement filter.
I previously had a Mondeo diesel without a DPF and found myself rather embarrassed by the cloud of soot that appeared in the rear view mirror whenever I put my foot down. My second diesel, a Mazda 6 with the same size engine had a DPF and was around 5mpg worse in terms of fuel consumption demonstrating how these gadgets do strangle performance. My present car is a petrol Mazda 6 which returns just under 2mpg less than the previous diesel version in day to day driving.
It seems that the manufacturers simply cannot meet the current regs with the present generation of diesels, hence the VW cheats and no doubt others as well. In the meantime petrols seem to have been more amenable to improvements.
Colin
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So Colin asks....
"If it isn't compulsory, (which apparently in the UK it isn't), why would you want to have your car converted so that it uses more fuel?"
Well if VW diesel engines currently comply with UK and or Australian regulations, why are the vehicles being converted under warranty?...there is more than meets the eye here >>:-(
I suppose the second hand value of the vehicle may determine or sway any need to convert, and secondly any Government retrospectively applied regulations <*< may also be a factor... Derek
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This is the latest info from VW UK:
http://www.volkswagen.co.uk/owners/dieselinfo
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So Colin asks....
"If it isn't compulsory, (which apparently in the UK it isn't), why would you want to have your car converted so that it uses more fuel?"
Well if VW diesel engines currently comply with UK and or Australian regulations, why are the vehicles being converted under warranty?...there is more than meets the eye here >>:-(
I suppose the second hand value of the vehicle may determine or sway any need to convert, and secondly any Government retrospectively applied regulations <*< may also be a factor... Derek
Or said another way, they, the authorities might be on track to find out what else VW and co, have been up to.
Lawyers are rubbing there hands in glee. Class action coming up O0 O0 O0
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Obviously VW will get hammered by the regulators but at this stage it is not at all clear to what extent VW owners have/or will suffer personal loss as a result of this fiasco.
It will take a long time for all the ramifications to become clear and these may well differ from country to country depending on their legal frameworks. I suspect that the EU will do their very best to try and sweep the whole thing under the carpet as much as possible due to the employment and economic effects of flattening VW. Politicians tend to be pragmatic in these situations especially here as nobody has (specifically) died!
Colin
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>:-o Watching one of the American TV stations this morning,a spokesman for the senate health committee was saying that they are worried about the amount of pollution these Diesel cars cause and the health effects on their citizens,well mr spokesman you don't seems to be over concerned about the 32,000 people killed by gun crime in America,am I being cynical in thinking that VW is a foreign company and that most guns are made by American manufacturers and lot of money is involved,typical of the double standards that all politicians apply when the interests of their backers are at risk. >:-o
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So Colin asks....
"If it isn't compulsory, (which apparently in the UK it isn't), why would you want to have your car converted so that it uses more fuel?"
Well if VW diesel engines currently comply with UK and or Australian regulations, why are the vehicles being converted under warranty?...there is more than meets the eye here >>:-(
I suppose the second hand value of the vehicle may determine or sway any need to convert, and secondly any Government retrospectively applied regulations <*< may also be a factor... Derek
Here is number two stay tuned for more
http://www.theage.com.au/business/retail/vw-scandal-regulators-investigate-second-emissions-software-program-20151009-gk58ym.html
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atching one of the American TV stations this morning,a spokesman for the senate health committee was saying that they are worried about the amount of pollution these Diesel cars cause and the health effects on their citizens
Diesel cars are almost unheard of in the USA compared with petrols, most of which seem to have huge engines and the vehicle of choice appears to be the pickup truck.
Colin
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I think that in the good ole You Ess of Hay pick ups are classed differently than cars and have different safety and emission regulations. May even have different tax levels too.
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The pickups are REALLY cheap to buy and their spec is huge too - leather, 6-seater crew-cab, 4x4 air con - electric everything.
A couple of years ago, there was a GM stand at the end of the Test Track ride at EPCOT - the truck there was huge - V8, massive wheels, massive crew-cab (3 seats across, huge bed on the back - about 20' long in total - $18,000.
I'd buy it! :-))
Their 'gas-guzzlers' don't guzzle - I had a 4.6 litre Lincoln Town Car (limo) that averaged 30mpg (US gallon). The 305bhp Impala I had last year did 34mpg.
My 2.2 GM Eurobox only does 28mpg (UK)
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My 2.2 GM Eurobox only does 28mpg (UK)
Must be the way you drive! %% My 2.0 petrol is currently doing over 45mpg.
Colin
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I take it you're not doing many short runs. You won't get 45mpg from a 2.0l petrol round town no matter how light your right foot is.
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Can't drive this hard - if you try to corner 'briskly' you slide around the leather seats!
If I drive very gently watching the computer - no matter how hard I try, 28.6 is the very best it will do on my normal around-town driving.
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I take it you're not doing many short runs. You won't get 45mpg from a 2.0l petrol round town no matter how light your right foot is.
No, I don't live in town. My driving is a mix of twisty country B roads (lots of acceleration/deceleration), one mile shopping trips to the village and maybe 40 miles on a dual carriageway with a 50/60 mph limit once a week - so quite a mixture really. Car is the new Mazda 6 with a very high compression ratio, normal aspiration with no turbo 165ps. Normally carries two up plus a heavy spare wheel.
Colin
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I dare say it's using direct injection, which allows very high compression ratios through the use of stratified charge, preventing detonation. All the same these engines have to resort to using a more conventional air fuel ratio when power is called upon e.g. pulling away.
I find economy halves on my car when driven on short journeys compared with longer runs, the only real solution is lighter smaller cars. All the engine technology in the world can only ring a few more percent from otto cycle. The inescapable truth is that most of the energy gets shoved straight out of the exhaust pipe.
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>:-o Watching one of the American TV stations this morning,a spokesman for the senate health committee was saying that they are worried about the amount of pollution these Diesel cars cause and the health effects on their citizens,well mr spokesman you don't seems to be over concerned about the 32,000 people killed by gun crime in America,am I being cynical in thinking that VW is a foreign company and that most guns are made by American manufacturers and lot of money is involved,typical of the double standards that all politicians apply when the interests of their backers are at risk. >:-o
You are actually expecting something logical from a U.S. politician a year from a Presidential election? {-)
If the U.S. had a multi-party system, it would be splintered into so many small parties that the nation would be even more ungovernable than it is now! >>:-(
Oh, and my 'source' has hinted that cheating might have been going on ever since U.S. emissions rules were invented. <*<
Tom
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The latest report on the V A G scandal:
http://www.carbuyer.co.uk/news/150583/vw-emissions-scandal-ea-189-diesel-engine-fix