Model Boat Mayhem - Forum

Mess Deck: General Section => Chit-Chat => Topic started by: BFSMP on December 10, 2015, 08:19:23 AM

Title: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: BFSMP on December 10, 2015, 08:19:23 AM
I despair of those who write narration for television programmes at times.

I was watching a programme this morning on channel 37 about producing high tensile steel cables for suspension bridges when the narrator told us all that each cable has to be perfection at a uniform 5.2mm thick.

"Thick" I ask. Should not this be diameter, seeing as the cable is obviously round in section.

How will our children learn from these programmes when the script is at fault and the narrator hasn't the intelligence to see this and say "Wooah, I'm not reading this, it should read diameter and not thick"

Sadly we will only get worse, and whilst I am on this subject, have a listen to the Yorkshire tea advert. It is full of grammatical mistakes. I despair!

Jim.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: plastic on December 10, 2015, 08:32:30 AM
Drives me nuts too.

Worse is when they are forced to use metric equivalents from US shows and they get the numbers wrong in conversion - but no-one on the production team notices (or cares?).

The ones about food factories are the worst - "We use 1000lbs of xxx per day" becomes "We use 20,000kgs per year". WRONG.  <*<
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: malcolmfrary on December 10, 2015, 08:48:31 AM
OK - just what does "Up to half price" actually mean?  My English and maths teachers would probably say that the new price should actually be less than half the original price but advertiserspeak translates it as "somewhere between half and full price".
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 10, 2015, 08:54:38 AM
'Tiny bit off' doesn't really cut it though.
Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: GAZOU on December 10, 2015, 08:59:39 AM
The problem it is because now people know how to use a computer, an IPAD, an I-Pod, a tablet and a heap of electronic mess but they know nothing of the grammatical rules and have no vocabulary. The journalists have no more general knowledge.

Look at money titles at the television, it is full of faults.

We do not write BIRMINGHAM but B' gham etc.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 10, 2015, 09:08:28 AM
"Nucular" for "nuclear" - we can blame Jimmy Carter for that one;
Starting a sentence with "so" (e.g. most Radio 4 interviews)
Inserting "like" or, worse, "obviously" in places where nothing is being compared and even less is obvious (See above)
"Of" instead of "have" - "I should of known better"
The use of a long "A" sound instead of a totally different vowel - marled (mild); arlands (islands), marls (miles) arrs (hours); I even heard "varlant" (violent) the other day!
"Fewer" instead of "less", and vice versa
Poor syntax which leads to confusion e.g. "He bought the car on Wednesday which was faulty" (in what way was Wednesday faulty?)
No, know; there, their, they're; to, too, two

(and, just for Malcolm,  if you turn a radio up to make it louder, why do you turn a fridge down to make it colder?)

Could be worse......could be Hungarian (apparently the most difficult language in the world to learn).

DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: essex2visuvesi on December 10, 2015, 09:28:38 AM

Could be worse......could be Hungarian (apparently the most difficult language in the world to learn).

DM


Alongside Finnish
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: dougal99 on December 10, 2015, 09:31:10 AM
Read 'Eat shoots and leaves' or should that be 'Eats, shoots and leaves' by Lynn Truss. Language changes and evolves. What was correct yesteryear is incorrect today. When did you last use Thee or Thou?  Like a lot  of things today the speed of change appears to be quickening. I find it irritating in the extreme, especially qualifying superlatives. 'Nearly or quite unique' has me shouting at the TV, but I'm just labelled a pedant.


I'm trying to learn German. Before I started I'd never heard of the Nominative, Accusative, Dative and Genitive cases. What was Grammar school for?  {:-{
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: GAZOU on December 10, 2015, 09:31:55 AM
Why, when we wanted to arrest the computer needed he to rest on starting   %)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 10, 2015, 09:40:47 AM
What was Grammar school for?  {:-{
Is it where she met your Grampa?
(Hozok kabátom...)

DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: dougal99 on December 10, 2015, 09:43:13 AM
Just remembered this. Seen in the USA earlier this year
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Bob K on December 10, 2015, 09:49:21 AM
Has anyone counted the number of times the phrase "For sure" is used, usually without context, in the average F1 broadcast?
Or the percentage of answers to an interviewer's opening question that is almost always "Absolutely".
What really upsets me is the constant misuse of the word "decimate" for anything from slightly damaged to a few injured. 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: mrlownotes on December 10, 2015, 09:55:10 AM
D'o'n't' f'o'r'g'e't' a'b'o'u't' o'u'r' n'a't'i'o'n's' 'i'n'c'o'm'p'e't'e'n'c'e ' 'w'i't'h' t'h'e' h'u'm'b'l'e' a'p'o's't'r'o'p'h'e'
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 10, 2015, 10:13:06 AM
Has anyone counted the number of times the phrase "For sure" is used, usually without context, in the average F1 broadcast?
Or the percentage of answers to an interviewer's opening question that is almost always "Absolutely".
What really upsets me is the constant misuse of the word "decimate" for anything from slightly damaged to a few injured.
For sure, Bobster - obviously you're like absolutely soooo correct there, my friend...... but I'm afraid the 'decimate' thingy is a bit more complicated than that; at least as far as the Oxford English Dictionary is concerned.  If you're short of sleep one night then have a look at this. http://blog.oxforddictionaries.com/2012/09/does-decimate-mean-destroy-one-tenth/ (http://blog.oxforddictionaries.com/2012/09/does-decimate-mean-destroy-one-tenth/)   Your understanding of the word is an etymological fallacy - so there  :P ! It seems that decimate actually means 'to tithe' or tax at one tenth. Its use as a replacement for "completely destroy" is annoying but nevertheless not strictly incorrect, whereas the use of the word 'devastated' (instead of, for example, distraught or distressed) really gets up my nose!

10% tax? How things have changed...
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: mrlownotes on December 10, 2015, 10:19:10 AM
Your understanding of the word is an etymological fallacy

I used to collect moths as a boy but never caught a Fallacy !

.............I'll get my coat............
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Brian60 on December 10, 2015, 10:25:06 AM
Hmmmm...............


I despair of those who write narration for television programmes at times.

I was watching a programme this morning on channel 37 about producing high tensile steel cables for suspension bridges, when the narrator told us all that each cable has to be perfection at a uniform 5.2mm thick.

"Thick" I ask. Should not this be diameter, seeing as the cable is obviously round in section.

How will our children learn from these programmes when the script is at fault and the narrator hasn't the intelligence to see this and say "Wooah, I'm not reading this, it should read diameter and not thick"

Sadly we will only get worse, and whilst I am on this subject, have a listen to the Yorkshire tea advert. It is full of grammatical mistakes. I despair!

Jim.

I was taught that a sentence should have a comma when you need to take a breath. So I added one to your sentence. I was also taught that 'and' should not follow a comma so I highlighted that as well. Lastly although it is used very frequently 'wooah' is one of those slang words that should not be used in correct grammatical pronunciation, 'excuse me' would be more appropriate :-) :-)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Bob K on December 10, 2015, 10:26:15 AM
I had read that Dave, but still hold to the Latin military origin, from long before the OED.
Agreed words do change meaning over time, like "Gay" used to mean happy with no overt sexual innuendo. 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: plastic on December 10, 2015, 10:30:05 AM
I had read that Dave, but still hold to the Latin military origin, from long before the OED.
Agreed words do change meaning over time, like "Gay" used to mean happy with no overt sexual innuendo.

Currently, 'gay' means 'rubbish' or not meeting standards.

"Your car is sooo gay"
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 10, 2015, 10:32:42 AM
I used to collect moths as a boy but never caught a Fallacy !

.............I'll get my coat............
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Jerry C on December 10, 2015, 10:34:15 AM
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone?
Jerry.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 10, 2015, 10:37:52 AM
 8)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 10, 2015, 10:46:16 AM
The Americanism  "excuse me" meaning "I didn't hear" or "I don't understand" is one of my pet hates. I reply "You are excused" or "Why, what did you do ?"   There usually follows a blank look :((   Worst of all is Lock instead of Loch when referring to a Scottish lake. No problem when referring to an Irish Lough , must be a visual thing "ck" is close to "ch" but "gh" has a lot of sounds in Englich... how do you like that then ? ;D  Sorry that would be  Englick . {-)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Martin [Admin] on December 10, 2015, 11:12:30 AM
 
My pet hate is the 'rising terminator'  or   'upward inflection'!   >:-o

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-28708526
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 10, 2015, 11:17:32 AM
Bear with me, I know where you're coming from.   <*< <*< <*< <*< <*<


Ned
Title: Re: Correct use and pronunciation of the English Language
Post by: richald on December 10, 2015, 11:33:07 AM
The word 'gifted' used to apply to say 'a gifted violinist' or 'a gifted artist'.

I read recently about something being 'gifted to the nation' or 'gifted to charity'.

We have at least two perfectly good words in given or donated without mangling our language.
 
I suspect that this misuse has arrived from the good ol' US of A -  :-)) flak expected!
 
I will not say anything about burglarised, solder, aluminium, chair/chairman, buoy
mispronounced 'boo-i' and one or two other words that I can't just bring to mind now.

Richard
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Liverbudgie on December 10, 2015, 11:50:50 AM
When did you last use Thee or Thou? 

These two words are still in common use in parts of west Yorkshire.

LB
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 10, 2015, 11:53:31 AM
Isn't it a bit ironic for the subject of this topic that among the greatest perpetrators of mangled English are posters on internet forums?

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 10, 2015, 12:06:08 PM
I was at the bar of the H&H last week and a hipster-type wandered up and asked "Can I get a Budweiser and a coffee?".
"No, you can't" came the reply. "That's my job, but if you ask me nicely then I could get them for you". Way to go, Ruth baby!
Unfortunately my two lads and their wives have caught this "Can I get...?" habit - where does it come from? Some God-awful American TV program, no doubt.

Martin
I can (almost) forgive Australian and Welsh folk for rising terminators - that's part of their accent, isn't it? (You can't actually replicate it in writing!)

Rich
Presumably you mean 'aloominum' and 'sodder'?

Colin
Amen to that.

DM

Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: TailUK on December 10, 2015, 12:55:11 PM
I'm trying to remember when they dropped the 'H' from "Herbs".
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Perkasaman2 on December 10, 2015, 01:05:08 PM
howay lads funetic jawdi is way betta  an propa  thin inglish man.  :-))
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 10, 2015, 01:19:00 PM
Gonnie no dae that ? :embarrassed:
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tigertiger on December 10, 2015, 01:20:24 PM
I'm trying to remember when they dropped the 'H' from "Herbs".


It is middle English from the old French erbe. So perhaps the questions should be, 'When did they put the 'H' in?'
A bit like an hotel.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 10, 2015, 01:22:39 PM
Has anyone counted the number of times the phrase "For sure" is used, usually without context, in the average F1 broadcast?Or the percentage of answers to an interviewer's opening question that is almost always "Absolutely".What really upsets me is the constant misuse of the word "decimate" for anything from slightly damaged to a few injured.

I 'absolutely' agree Bob - 4 syllables, when 'Yes' has one!
For me the most irritating words used by media are ICON and EPICENTRE.
How can a pop-singer (etc) be described as a religious artifact.
How can a hurricane centre be described as ' The  epicentre or epicentrum is the point on the Earth's surface that is directly above the hypocentre or focus, the point where an earthquake or underground explosion originates'
There are others but words fail me!
Another Bob.  >:-o
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tigertiger on December 10, 2015, 01:39:10 PM
Here is an interesting list of words that are often misused. It includes decimate.
http://justenglish.me/2014/04/14/these-9-words-dont-mean-what-you-think-they-mean/
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: PeachyPM on December 10, 2015, 02:30:22 PM
Now then lad, there's nowt wrong with Yorkshire tea tha knows! %%
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: boneash on December 10, 2015, 03:57:29 PM
IF you like the dry bits from a compost heap!!!
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Fastfaz on December 10, 2015, 04:23:57 PM
     Diesel, Darrel, warrell.
           Famous scouse docker words of expression.
               Cheers.
                      Faz. :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-))
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: davidm1945 on December 10, 2015, 04:37:34 PM
Now then lad, there's nowt wrong with Yorkshire tea tha knows! %%


Well, they do say that you learn something new every day....I never knew that they grew tea in Yorkshire!


Dave.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 10, 2015, 04:49:33 PM
Surely you've heard of the Boston Spa Tea Party {-)
Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: boneash on December 10, 2015, 04:52:45 PM
Ned, they haven't pushed the border that far south have they?

parliamentary border growth I suppose!!
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 10, 2015, 05:31:44 PM
The other day, seeing it on this forum, I had to ask my English born wife what 'M'duck' meant!  %)
Title: Re: Correct use and pronunciation of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 10, 2015, 05:37:11 PM
The word 'gifted' used to apply to say 'a gifted violinist' or 'a gifted artist'.
I read recently about something being 'gifted to the nation' or 'gifted to charity'.
We have at least two perfectly good words in given or donated without mangling our language.
I suspect that this misuse has arrived from the good ol' US of A -  :-)) flak expected!
I will not say anything about burglarised, solder, aluminium, chair/chairman, buoy
mispronounced 'boo-i' and one or two other words that I can't just bring to mind now.Richard

Richard, I think it is mis-pronounced 'boo-e'!  {-)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 10, 2015, 05:38:16 PM
Ned, they haven't pushed the border that far south have they?

parliamentary border growth I suppose!!
[/quote

The Yorkshire border still abuts the Humber afaik.
I did say Boston Spa %)

Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 10, 2015, 06:47:08 PM
The other day, seeing it on this forum, I had to ask my English born wife what 'M'duck' meant!  %)
It's 'ere intit, m'duck http://www.theotaku.com/worlds/ayup/ (http://www.theotaku.com/worlds/ayup/)
Even Angelina Jolie uses the phrase http://www.derbyshiretimes.co.uk/news/grassroots/video-watch-angelina-jolie-say-derbyshire-phrase-ay-up-me-duck-at-hollywood-awards-ceremony-1-6961774 (http://www.derbyshiretimes.co.uk/news/grassroots/video-watch-angelina-jolie-say-derbyshire-phrase-ay-up-me-duck-at-hollywood-awards-ceremony-1-6961774)
I can reveal that use of the phrase is also common in Nottingham.......but then everything in Nottingham is common, according to most folk who live south of Watford.
If yer wonnerlaff ayalook at this bogger http://www.leftlion.co.uk/articles.cfm/title/aah-ter-talk-notts/id/2965 (http://www.leftlion.co.uk/articles.cfm/title/aah-ter-talk-notts/id/2965)
DM (Praahd ter be a Notter)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: jaymac on December 10, 2015, 07:19:35 PM
I would have thought that on a Forum  for Model makers an ''Exact Replica'' would have been  amongst the top ones
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: PeachyPM on December 10, 2015, 07:28:06 PM
IF you like the dry bits from a compost heap!!!
What do strawberry pickers know about tea? %%
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: grendel on December 10, 2015, 08:05:35 PM
its when americans use the word burglarize.......... aaargh.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 10, 2015, 09:56:44 PM
It's 'ere intit, m'duck http://www.theotaku.com/worlds/ayup/ (http://www.theotaku.com/worlds/ayup/)
Even Angelina Jolie uses the phrase http://www.derbyshiretimes.co.uk/news/grassroots/video-watch-angelina-jolie-say-derbyshire-phrase-ay-up-me-duck-at-hollywood-awards-ceremony-1-6961774 (http://www.derbyshiretimes.co.uk/news/grassroots/video-watch-angelina-jolie-say-derbyshire-phrase-ay-up-me-duck-at-hollywood-awards-ceremony-1-6961774)
I can reveal that use of the phrase is also common in Nottingham.......but then everything in Nottingham is common, according to most folk who live south of Watford.
If yer wonnerlaff ayalook at this bogger http://www.leftlion.co.uk/articles.cfm/title/aah-ter-talk-notts/id/2965 (http://www.leftlion.co.uk/articles.cfm/title/aah-ter-talk-notts/id/2965)
DM (Praahd ter be a Notter)

I still wished I hadn't asked her.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on December 10, 2015, 10:29:51 PM
"burglarize" ...............also has connotations of a meat food bun from McDonalds   {-) ...

Some will realise that I have resisted and not yet needed to get my little GREEN book out........Derek
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 10, 2015, 10:39:29 PM

 :o :o :o :o :o :o

C'mon, surely someone is pulling my leg, as there is no such animal as, "Correct use of the English language". %) %) %)

Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 10, 2015, 11:23:59 PM
I still wished I hadn't asked her.
Nemo
That makes two of us. Where are you from originally?

Jack
In Australia?? Unlikely...
There was a bloke over here called Brian Sewell who was the art critic in the London Evening Standard and who spoke as near as you could get to 'The Queen's English', but he died a couple of months ago. Apart from him only Quentin Crisp springs to mind ("I may well be last of England's stately homo's"), along with Jacob Rees-Mogg and Hillary Benn. Oh - and HM The Q, of course!

DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on December 10, 2015, 11:52:09 PM
 :o...........''(may well be last of England's stately homo's"),  [{-) well I am not really sure what that means]. :o.....but you do still have a few of those art auction journalistic type commentators on Antique Auctions and the like.....

Those chaps certainly sound as if they were schooled at Eaton  :embarrassed: and not some Cockney slum in London......

I like that red Daimler SP250 as shown at the start of each episode ........ Derek
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tigertiger on December 11, 2015, 01:20:27 AM
Here's a useless statistic I learned on my linguistics course. Only about 2% of the UK population use the Queen's English (aka received pronunciation), and only about 4% of the English population use it.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 11, 2015, 08:24:14 AM
Derek
The ante-penultimate paragraph includes the quotation. The man himself was a real one-off; "full of the airs and graces of genius but with no talent" as he once said. Think "Englishman in New York" by Sting. That's the bloke. https://latetothetheater.wordpress.com/2010/07/17/stately-homos-of-old-england-entry-the-naked-civil-servant/ (https://latetothetheater.wordpress.com/2010/07/17/stately-homos-of-old-england-entry-the-naked-civil-servant/)
Dave
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: imsinking on December 11, 2015, 12:55:48 PM
There is NO EXCUSE for incorrect use of language when every computer / smart phone has a spell checker, this little ditty from a COMPUTER MAGAZINE proves it . . . .


Eye halve a spelling chequer
It came with my pea sea
It plainly marques four my revue
Miss steaks eye kin knot sea
Eye strike a key and type a word
And weight four it two say
Weather eye am wrong oar write
It shows me strait a weigh
As soon as a mist ache is maid
It nose bee fore two long
And I can put the error rite
Its rare lea ever wrong
Eye have run this mess age threw it
I am shore your pleased two no
Its letter perfect awl the weigh threw
My chequer tolled me sew.


Anon


 %%  AND we might even get a " know come meant " from Martin  O0 


Bill
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: roycv on December 11, 2015, 03:28:18 PM
Hi all, I do not agree that Brian Sewell, was any kind of guide to the pronunciation of English.  I think his affected way of pronouncing Ikea as Aykayer was a joke.
More of an assumed accent, rather than a natural one.

I think the main purpose is to be understood and not to offend or 'put down' the recipient.  Mr. Sewell was rather patronizing, I thought.

I get through a couple of audio books a week and listening to some narrations is pure joy, Tony Britton springs to mind reading Dick Francis books, so lots to choose from.  (Hmmm.  ending a sentance with a preposition eh!).

It is a shame that a few contributers to this forum do not read again  their missives before posting.  There are many finger slips on the key board., mostly decipherable though.

regards Roy
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Fastfaz on December 11, 2015, 03:36:00 PM
     Yo Roy,
          I agree I have said this many thisend thisend times! thet was before I was sent dine.
                    Cheers,
                       Faz. :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-))
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 11, 2015, 03:38:10 PM
Nemo
That makes two of us. Where are you from originally?

Jack
In Australia?? Unlikely...
There was a bloke over here called Brian Sewell who was the art critic in the London Evening Standard and who spoke as near as you could get to 'The Queen's English', but he died a couple of months ago. Apart from him only Quentin Crisp springs to mind ("I may well be last of England's stately homo's"), along with Jacob Rees-Mogg and Hillary Benn. Oh - and HM The Q, of course!
DM

Scotland - where only the very  best English is spoke.  :-))

HMQ!!! She speaks English like a tortured duck! (or should that me m'duck?)

Oh aye - and another one used on here frequently is 'methinks' - where did that monstrosity appear from since it has been out of use for 300 years?


Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 11, 2015, 04:36:25 PM


Oh aye - and another one used on here frequently is 'methinks' - where did that monstrosity appear from since it has been out of use for 300 years?


Like some of the members methinks %% %%


Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: joppyuk1 on December 11, 2015, 07:15:45 PM
For those interested in such things, a very engaging read is "Accomodating Brocolli in the Cemetary, or why can't anybody spell", by Vivian Cook. It includes little gems like the Lord's Prayer in 10th century Saxon, the naming of racehorses, comparisons of UK and US spelling, names in Dr Seuss books, and far more.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 11, 2015, 07:38:18 PM
Scotland - where only the very  best English is spoke.  :-))

HMQ!!! She speaks English like a tortured duck! (or should that me m'duck?)

Oh aye - and another one used on here frequently is 'methinks' - where did that monstrosity appear from since it has been out of use for 300 years?

Getteth me not wrong, me owd duck. I am no champion of RP, in spite of my minor PS education (it seemed like a good idea at the time), so why on earth would the Scots wish to speak the very best English? Nicola S would have your head on a spike for less of an offence.

(My head hurts... probably the Jock Daniels. TFI Friday.)

DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 11, 2015, 07:54:51 PM
Forsoothe , what language do you think the Scots speak , praytell ?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Peter Fitness on December 11, 2015, 09:33:19 PM

I can (almost) forgive Australian and Welsh folk for rising terminators - that's part of their accent, isn't it? (You can't actually replicate it in writing!)
DM


Dave, I, too, deplore the increasingly common use of the rising terminator, but it was never a part of the Australian accent in days gone by. I can't speak for the Welsh, but it seems to me that the rising terminator is more common among younger Australian people, although, at my age, that's just about everyone :-) . There's no doubt that the American butchering of the English language is spreading like a malignant virus, thanks to films and television. It may sound snobbish, but some Aussies speak with an awful accent. I remember during my first trip to the UK I was walking along Oxford Street when I heard a group of Aussie tourists talking to each other. Their accents sounded to me like someone drawing their fingernails down a blackboard. It was probably just the contrast with the prevalent London accents, but the Aussies really stood out.


Don't get me started on journalists and their misuse of English, it's appalling, and becoming worse  <*<


Peter.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: BrianB6 on December 12, 2015, 01:50:41 AM
From 'My Fair Lady'
"Oh why carn't the English teach their children how to speak?" >>:-(

"Americans have not spoken it for years."
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Landlocked on December 12, 2015, 03:20:44 AM

To counter Professor Higgin's lament on our "mis"-use of the English language on the western side of the pond, I offer wisdom of Mark Twain.


“There is no such thing as the Queen’s English. The property has gone into the hands of a joint stock company and we own the bulk of the shares!”
[size=78%]Cheers![/size][/font][/font][/size]


Landlocked/Ken
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Landlocked on December 12, 2015, 06:42:24 PM
Upon reflection, the sub-continent probably has the bulk of the share holders. 
'Eaven 'elp us!


Landlocked
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: JayDee on December 12, 2015, 06:48:21 PM
Hello,

What about "TV Speak", the English spoken on our Tv programs.

Calling our capital city "Landon".

Bus becomes Bas.

Button = Batten.

Running = Ranning.

Under = Ander.

Just listen to the News, there are lots more examples on there !!!.

John.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 12, 2015, 06:58:16 PM
JayDee, you have missed out that famous crimefighter - Laura Norder!

Also the enquiring shop customer from Australia - Emma Chissit.                      {-)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 12, 2015, 07:01:16 PM
Whilst the TV speak is going down well, bring on the hand gestures
Clasp your hands, spread your hands, wring your hands.
What the merry H is that?


Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Fastfaz on December 12, 2015, 07:05:52 PM
     What about Guerilla as in Angela Rippon "Gayrilla" not sure I get that maybe I need to listen to it a thizend times a bit like buck oh sorry that should be double oo "Book" or is it buke.
       The mind boggles.
              Cheers,
                    Faz. :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-))
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 12, 2015, 07:23:49 PM
Whilst the TV speak is going down well, bring on the hand gestures
Clasp your hands, spread your hands, wring your hands.
What the merry H is that?Ned

Ned, that has annoyed me for years now. I call it the 'invisible concertina' that TV news reporters are given when going on assignments. Drives me mad.  >>:-(  Why do they have to emphasise every word with hand movements?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: dodes on December 12, 2015, 08:18:23 PM
You know when I was at school, I was told by my English teacher that the Queen actually speaks a completely different style/language to what is taught at the best schools, also I read a good report on the English language that across England there is at least 20 variations of English used and between the main dialects there are mixtures of. With all the recent immigration there is now !! more types of exotic languages. Myself I speak N.E. Kent.?????????????????????????????????????????????? Traditionally anyone born outside of Kent is referred to as a foreigner.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: roycv on December 12, 2015, 08:47:51 PM
Hi I don't believe the Queen went to school.
Roy
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 12, 2015, 09:07:42 PM
Neither did Prince Charles...he went to Stalag Gordonstoun !
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on December 12, 2015, 09:22:12 PM
Roy....did not QEII go to a motor mechanics school in earlier years?......saw a documentary years back with Lizzie ......'bum' in the air & head & arms in the engine bay of an oldish Land Rover.......

Also beg to differ Arrow5.........as Charlie spent a school year at Timbertop in the Victorian highlands of OZ........mind you, I am not sure if he actually learnt anything  :embarrassed:..... Derek
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: BrianB6 on December 12, 2015, 09:28:56 PM
Didn't he learn to hug trees?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: imsinking on December 12, 2015, 09:32:10 PM
Roy....did not QEII go to a motor mechanics school in earlier years?......saw a documentary years back with Lizzie ......'bum' in the air & head & arms in the engine bay of an oldish Land Rover.......

Also beg to differ Arrow5.........as Charlie spent a school year at Timbertop in the Victorian highlands of OZ........mind you, I am not sure if he actually learnt anything  :embarrassed: ..... Derek


Nonsense 'Chuck' learned how to ground HMS Bronington in the Thames . . . AND run a BAE 146 jet of the Queen's flight off the runway at the Isle of Skye , so THERE ! !
Bill
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Grumpy Dave on December 12, 2015, 09:52:21 PM
Re HMQ mending oldish Landrover,I don't know the picture but since Landrover only started production in 1948 it was probably a Jeep.  Will stand correction innit?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on December 12, 2015, 10:08:13 PM
Dave.....the images of QEII fixing the Land Rover was about this vintage.....she had driven through a ford [creek] in the road......I suspect in a Country Estate .......when I suggested 'oldish Land Rover' ...sorry,  I just meant original style 'Land Rover', not a 'Range  Rover' .... Derek
________________________________________________________

http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwift7vtp9fJAhUKGJQKHROTB3QQFggbMAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fjalopnik.com%2Fqueen-elizabeth-ii-can-drive-stick-and-fix-old-trucks-1675351668&usg=AFQjCNFA6sIUst6AXgzAtJ3E_vMTJ193Sw
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 12, 2015, 10:19:16 PM
Derek, look up Gordonstoun School . Phil the Greek sent the Duke of Rothesay there to toughen him up.  Didn't seem to work somehow. %)   
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: roycv on December 12, 2015, 10:29:01 PM
Hi I have seen film of her in uniform doing mechanical things to cars during the war to encourage us all.  I was just a few years old then!  If I remember correctly the Queen was borne in 1926.
I have no knowledge of her practical skills but from the outdoor life she used to lead I am sure she is most capable.
Definitely the best of the Royals.
Roy
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on December 12, 2015, 10:54:13 PM
So Roy says.....'definitely the best of the Royal'.....well I think one of her Grandsons is shaping up pretty well  :-)).....as the future, future boss.........Derek
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 12, 2015, 11:28:27 PM
Just a goldarned cotton-pickin' minute there, Muskrat!

Hi all, I do not agree that Brian Sewell, was any kind of guide to the pronunciation of English.  I think his affected way of pronouncing Ikea as Aykayer was a joke.

Maybe you could remind us just which language "IKEA" comes from? Swedish, perchance? Not a good example; even on their own TV advertisement it is pronounced "Icky-err"whereas everyone I've heard (apart from BS) uses "Eye-Keeyer".

Fair do's, m'duck.  I'd take issue more with barth, grarse and marles (and your punctuation, but that's for another day).

DM (Nighty-night)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 12, 2015, 11:29:46 PM
 ok2  Quack, quack, quackquack  pond?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 12, 2015, 11:42:16 PM
 :o :o :o

Not really a problem here in Oztralia

as we speaka da oztrailian wit a bita Inglish O0 O0 O0 O0 O0 O0

As for the press, TV announcers and Politicians well, nobody understands them as they all speak a foreign language >>:-( <*< >>:-( <*<
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 13, 2015, 08:40:23 AM
:o :o :o

Not really a problem here in Oztralia
as we speaka da oztrailian wit a bita Inglish O0 O0 O0 O0 O0 O0
As for the press, TV announcers and Politicians well, nobody understands them as they all speak a foreign language >>:-( <*< >>:-( <*<

I heard a very interesting program a while back where an academic gent demonstrated that the Australian "strine" accent comes more or less directly from the way they speak in Suffolk. He did this by starting off a word in a Suffolk accent and then morphing it into Strine. He did this with a number of different words and it was very convincing. Apparently a large proportion of the original convicts who were transported to Oz came from Suffolk, because petty theft of food was very common there and the local magistrates were particularly fond of handing down harsh sentences.

Nemo
Ha-ha.  :D
Oo, stop it.  {-)
Ouch! There goes another rib...  %%

(Och aye)

DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: roycv on December 13, 2015, 10:06:38 AM
Hi Inertia, The IKEA point is that he (Mr. S) was correcting somebody who had used the word pronounced in the more usual way in the UK.  In itself rather pompous but who am i to judge!
Regards Roy
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 13, 2015, 10:18:05 AM
Hi Inertia, The IKEA point is that he (Mr. S) was correcting somebody who had used the word pronounced in the more usual way in the UK.  In itself rather pompous but who am i to judge!
Regards Roy
Then he had no right to do so, not being Swedish himself. 'Pompous' doesn't even come close to describing Mr S. Many have used much harsher words (which were probably far more accurate) but I found his whole manner almost mesmeric.
A real one-off.
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: joppyuk1 on December 13, 2015, 10:44:04 AM
I have a recording from Lincolnshire Heritage, of various items in the local dialect. Playing one day and enjoying the story, when my daughter came in and asked "What language is that then?".
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: grendel on December 13, 2015, 11:03:51 AM
I speak kentish, we have some odd words like Chimley (thing on the roof that lets smoke out)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: roycv on December 13, 2015, 11:28:06 AM
Hi it is not just English I was learning Spanish (mostly gone now) and at a lesson we had some tapes of Spaniards speaking and our teacher (Spanish) did not understand some of what was being said.
regards Roy
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: davidm1945 on December 13, 2015, 12:47:50 PM
I speak kentish, we have some odd words like Chimley (thing on the roof that lets smoke out)


Thass a chimbley roun are way....


All the wife's fambley lives in Thanet - they understand me.


Dave
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Perkasaman2 on December 13, 2015, 01:20:52 PM
Duh yew lot doon sooth not naa thit Bamburah wis the royil capitul of inglan afor lundun eh. Ye lot naa nowt aboot istry man.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Bob K on December 13, 2015, 01:40:19 PM
All hail 19th September.  All our dialect differences evaporate for 24 hours whilst emulating Robert Newton in national linguistic unity. - Speak Like A Pirate Day.
Ideal for lakeside banter, to differentiate us from all those landlubber non-boaters.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC_PR7YWQOc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC_PR7YWQOc)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Perkasaman2 on December 13, 2015, 01:45:50 PM
Come eer Bob lad. Be that you I see afore me.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 13, 2015, 01:47:15 PM
 Sorry I`m not fluent in Somali..cant even spell it %)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: DavieTait on December 13, 2015, 02:29:02 PM
Well we've all seen the "Grammar Nazi" online .... then I saw this on Twitter.... this is REAL  :o :o :o
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CWF_gqiWIAESO-w.jpg)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Perkasaman2 on December 13, 2015, 02:32:19 PM
Robert Newton played the role of 'Long John Silver' in the 1950 Disney film of 'Treasure Island'.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC_PR7YWQOc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC_PR7YWQOc)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 13, 2015, 08:31:43 PM
Ahem. Dialects are not really a mis-use of the so-called English language - are they? Are we no, yet again getting wey aff the subject - Jimmy?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: malcolmfrary on December 13, 2015, 09:08:09 PM
English as a language has been evolving for a thousand years or more.  The fact that it is still evolving mostly indicates that it hasn't died.  Regional and area accents happen - I well remember asking directions in Preston, about 20 miles away, and feeling the need for subtitles.  In different countries it evolves differently, often depending on the national backgrounds of later immigrants.
But evolution apart, I do detest the use of txtspk in a medium where there is usually a perfectly good keyboard available.  That and the occasional total disregard for basic stuff like putting a full stop at the end of a sentence combined with not bothering with a capital to start the next one.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: essex2visuvesi on December 13, 2015, 11:42:05 PM
But then again is "English" not a bastardisation of several other languages?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Martin [Admin] on December 14, 2015, 09:10:34 PM
 
 
https://youtu.be/8Gv0H-vPoDc

Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 14, 2015, 10:18:44 PM
What about 'The vast majority'! Is not a majority just that?    Is this phrase not an example of the worst possible use of the incorrectness of the language we speak? Yet it is in use constantly, particularly in the media,  by those who should know better - and that includes the well-educated.  O0
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 14, 2015, 10:27:04 PM
Well, you could have a small majority so why not a large or even a vast one? The latter implies a very high majority which obviously has more impact than perhaps 51%.

One of the phrases I hate the most is 'going forward' - seem to see or hear it all the time these days.

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 14, 2015, 11:35:48 PM
the worst possible use of the incorrectness of the language we speak

"¿Qué?"
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on December 14, 2015, 11:51:28 PM
 >>:-(...& Colin says......   ''One of the phrases I hate the most is 'going forward"

Must agree Colin......[moving forward or going forward] .....have you ever noticed that when the phrase is used...the speaker always appears to be rambling on about ...

1. intangible ideas...[or and that the speaker is speaking with FORK tongue]
2. that they [themselves] are the only one's with a vision to progress......[onward or in a forward manner]
3. by their implication.....are suggesting the balance of society [that's  %) you & me {I & us...or them & me }] are dimwits and in reverse gear..............

Derek
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Capt Podge on December 15, 2015, 12:14:38 AM
One of the most irritating terms in use today - the word "quintessential" (meaning "typical").
 
Irritating news reader? watch Fiona Bruce, swivelling her head from side to side in just about every other sentence. >>:-(
(perhaps this is to disguise the fact that she is reading from an autocue)
 
Regards,
 
Ray.
 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 15, 2015, 02:25:10 AM
Now the topic is getting interesting as we are nearing the realm of Political correctness.

The outcome shall empower us all. {-) {-) {-) {-)

Yassou, it is all Greek to me, as the majority, be it vast or such, of the English language, comes from the Greek, French and Latin languages. {-) {-) {-).

The topic reminds me of the feminists, etc who will not take their spouses Surname and insist on keeping their maiden surname, <*< <*< or hyphenating their name, not realising it is their fathers name they are fighting to keep, it not their own name. {-) {-) {-) {-)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: grendel on December 15, 2015, 12:18:57 PM
not to forget the Germanic roots and Viking heritage
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: essex2visuvesi on December 15, 2015, 02:17:21 PM
>>:-( ...& Colin says......   ''One of the phrases I hate the most is 'going forward"

Must agree Colin......[moving forward or going forward] .....have you ever noticed that when the phrase is used...the speaker always appears to be rambling on about ...

1. intangible ideas...[or and that the speaker is speaking with FORK tongue]
2. that they [themselves] are the only one's with a vision to progress......[onward or in a forward manner]
3. by their implication.....are suggesting the balance of society [that's  %) you & me {I & us...or them & me }] are dimwits and in reverse gear..............

Derek


4. Trying to cover up their own ineptitude as a "jumping off point" that "we can all learn from"
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Perkasaman2 on December 15, 2015, 04:53:24 PM
"In the next several days".................. AAAAAAGGGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: DavieTait on December 15, 2015, 05:42:40 PM
Try Doric... we've got words from Norway/Sweden/Denmark(those damn pesky Vikings lol ) , Germany , France , Dutch , Jewish (Buba meaning Grandfather is from Hebrew and is a common word up in the Black Isle area ) and quite a lot of local words not found anywhere else ( also means there's the coast or Fisher Doric and the country or Teuchter Doric which have different words for the same thing within a few miles of each other.... )

Then within the different communities there are different words for the same thing yet again ( normally between major harbours like Fraserburgh to Peterhead to Aberdeen all different for various bits and bobs especially around a fishing boat or even the way you name the different sizes of fish... )
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 15, 2015, 06:53:29 PM
the worst possible use of the incorrectness of the language we speak
"¿Qué?"/quote]

I wondered who would notice it! :}  It was DONALD!  :-))
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 15, 2015, 06:56:31 PM
One of the most irritating terms in use today - the word "quintessential" (meaning "typical").
 
Irritating news reader? watch Fiona Bruce, swivelling her head from side to side in just about every other sentence. >>:-(
(perhaps this is to disguise the fact that she is reading from an autocue)
 
Regards,
 
Ray.

I was hoping no-one would mention that awful woman - another concertina-player. Prince Philip certainly put her in her place during her interview.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Capt Podge on December 15, 2015, 07:19:45 PM
Here's another one in regular use: various different, or different varieties.
 
If there are various items in a box, this infers that they are different! >>:-(
 
....and another one: almost exactly the same. It's either almost the same or exactly the same - it cannot be both.
 
Thinking back to schooldays, we were instructed in "the 3 R's" i.e. Reading Writing and Arithmetic, yet only 1 of those begins with the letter R.  %%
 
So much for Education then.
 
Regards,
 
Ray.
 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Peter Fitness on December 15, 2015, 09:07:31 PM
Come on Ray, don't show your ignorance, it's Reading, Riting and Rithmetic {-) {-)


Peter.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: SailorGreg on December 15, 2015, 09:07:52 PM
Well, when I went to school I learnt Reading, Riting and Rithmetic.  ;)

A thread like this is always a hostage to fortune.  If you are going to criticise you need to make sure you are scrupulously correct!  Some of the posts need some gentle editing.  %)

The failing that always disappoints me is the incorrect use of the apostrophe. In particular the abbreviation it's when the writer means its.  Even a magazine like Model Boats is a serial offender.  Why? It's not difficult is it?  "It's a shame when a boat sinks on its maiden voyage."  Get it?  Good.  :-)

Greg
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Peter Fitness on December 15, 2015, 09:21:18 PM
That's one of my pet hates too, Greg, as well as adding an apostrophe to a plural, such as "boat's", "banana's" etc, etc. An apostrophe either indicates a missing letter - "it's" for it is, "where's" for where is, or the possessive - "Bob's boat" or "Paul's car". Simple.


Peter.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: davidm1945 on December 15, 2015, 09:48:39 PM
That's one of my pet hates too, Greg, as well as adding an apostrophe to a plural, such as "boat's", "banana's" etc, etc. An apostrophe either indicates a missing letter - "it's" for it is, "where's" for where is, or the possessive - "Bob's boat" or "Paul's car". Simple.


Peter.

What complicates things is that "its" is the possessive of "it", as in "the car has lost its wheel", so people think "possessive so must have an apostrophe" - the exception that proves the rule.....

A shop sign close to us is "Sallys Flower's" - sigh!

Dave.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 15, 2015, 09:54:01 PM
'Even a magazine like Model Boats is a serial offender.  Why? It's not difficult is it?  "It's a shame when a boat sinks on its maiden voyage."  Get it?  Good.'

You've probably not had the pleasure of editing a model boating magazine then! Whilst it goes without saying that the content is usually excellent and the contributors competent to superb model boat builders, I'm afraid that the quality of the written material can vary enormously. Some is pretty much grammatically perfect but quite a lot can be badly wanting, requiring correction of grammar, spelling, punctuation and even structure. (plus the author might have got his facts wrong!). So you go through the article correcting everything you can find and read it again only to find a batch of typos and things like repeated phrases you have missed. So you edit again. But now you are on the slippery slope, as after about five readings, you see what you expect to see and still miss the odd typos and omitted or incorrectly used apostrophes. By now you are heartily sick of the thing.

If it was The Times then there would be a sub editor to look at it as well but it is Model Boats and there is only you. I have resorted to getting my Wife to proof read the really difficult ones but there is a limit to which you can employ this correction of last resort. (She ALWAYS finds something).

Oh, and did I mention deadlines?

Anyhow, you get it just right and off it goes to the designer. The low res proofs come back and. s*d it, you've missed a couple of mistakes or a photo caption isn't quite right. Designer corrects these and off it goes to the printers, absolutely perfect at last - until you open up the printed copy and.....

If you can do better then fame (but certainly not a fortune) awaits you.

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: davidm1945 on December 15, 2015, 10:08:36 PM
I wrote criticising a self-published book on Kindle because of the large number of spelling, punctuation and grammatical errors in what was a good story.
I thought "I must get this right" or else I shall look a real numpty, so I read and reread it about six times, uploaded it to Amazon, reread it online and... I had written "then then"!  Doh... :embarrassed:

Dave.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 15, 2015, 10:16:58 PM
Your own articles or text are always the worst because you only see what you think you have written. ALWAYS get an independent check on anything important.

Another nightmare I experienced with the Model Boat Specials was when reproducing 'golden oldies' from magazines originally published before some of us were born. You cannot use photocopies due to the different formats in the old days and often poor quality original physical material. So I put them through an optical character recognition program which was generally brilliant but which required an enormous amount of correction to what came out the other end. The things the program did with imperial fractions had to be seen to be believed. It was not just correcting the text but also making sure that the dimensions were in fact also still correct.

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 15, 2015, 10:46:58 PM
Your own articles or text are always the worst because you only see what you think you have written. ALWAYS get an independent check on anything important. :-)) :-))

Colin

Yes in another life, I always had the typist check and correct everything I wrote.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: malcolmfrary on December 16, 2015, 09:27:32 AM
Yes in another life, I always had the typist check and correct everything I wrote.
Who checked what the typist had typed?  In pre word processor days I was bitten a time or two by the efforts of the typing pool that documents had to go through.  Since a minor correction involved retyping the entire thing, you often found extra flips of the singer appeared in later versions.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: davidm1945 on December 16, 2015, 11:42:46 AM
you often found extra flips of the singer appeared in later versions.


Flippin' Tom Jones or flippin' Shirley Bassey....?    I love Spoonerisms!


Dave.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: gingyer on December 16, 2015, 03:25:04 PM
ALWAYS get an independent check on anything important.


Very wise words, reading this thread and Colin's comments reminded me of what happened to my friend who is a teacher last summer. Her colleague went off on stress and she got dumped with the year book to be issued....Simple or so you would think...
It was all 17/18 year olds in their final year and there was a year book committee formed to sort this out it had been proof read by the committee 4 senior pupils and the teacher who was off and then one of the heads re-checked it. The books arrived and as my mate flicked through one of them underneath one of then pictures was
"XYZ club with David, Lorna and some  <*< >>:-( >:-o {:-{  need to find out his name"


She ended up sitting with a black marker and going through all the books deleting the offending caption
 {-) {-)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: SailorGreg on December 16, 2015, 08:59:47 PM

You've probably not had the pleasure of editing a model boating magazine then!

No Colin, I haven't, although I have in a past life had to review some fairly hefty technical bid documents so am under no illusions about the effort and the "word blindness" involved.  One set of documents had to be shredded and reprinted because the word "not" was missing from a fairly important sentence in the executive summary.  That mistake changed the sense of the whole thing.  And yes, I was the one who passed it as fit to print.   :embarrassed:

And I really do enjoy Model Boats (I'm a subscriber)!  :-))

Greg
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 16, 2015, 11:32:52 PM
1. Submit text to magazine.
2. Read the published version.
3. Ask yourself why that punctuation/syntax/grammar/whatever error is there.
4. Check published version against original text.
5. Conclude that it was fine until The Editor got hold of it.
6. Grumble.
7. Receive cheque.......
8. Life isn't so bad, is it?  8)

(Not that anything like that has ever happened to me, of course....)
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 17, 2015, 08:30:09 AM
Thin ice Dave, thin ice!  :o

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 17, 2015, 08:33:23 AM
Thin ice Dave, thin ice!  :o

Colin

I know, I know. The Editor's worm is final.  %)
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Perkasaman2 on December 17, 2015, 12:12:16 PM
It's the last worm that counts before in finally turns.  O0
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 19, 2015, 03:32:03 PM
 %)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 19, 2015, 04:33:39 PM
He is going to say that he "has a raft of measures" :((
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 19, 2015, 04:40:04 PM
He is going to say that he "has a raft of measures" :((


To keep the Company buoyant on the rising tide of inflation.


Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 19, 2015, 04:53:51 PM
Correct, but I didn't want to quote the chancellor of the exchequer or any other government minister >>:-( .
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 19, 2015, 05:23:27 PM
Best not to Quote them Duncan.
You don't want to be accused of
telling untruths on the Forum  %)


Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Captain Flack on December 21, 2015, 11:06:36 AM
I think I'm right in saying that ebooks are scanned in, which probably accounts for the alarming amount of spelling mistakes and unpuncuated pages.  It's probably the spell check doing its thing and guessing the word.
That's probably why I could never get on with predictive text on a mobile phone.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tigertiger on December 21, 2015, 11:32:58 AM
Ebooks that have been ripped are sometimes scanned in pdf format.
For original ebooks thel text is presented as soft copy to the publishers, and then converted to the publishers own publishing software. Then this itself can be copied in some programs.
Other copies can be a frantic typists (plural), paid by the word. In China pirate copies  the Harry Potter series were in the shops within 2 days of launch in the west using this method. They were full of typos, but in China it is race to the bookstore with everyone else trying to copy.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 21, 2015, 11:14:02 PM
Ebooks that have been ripped are sometimes scanned in pdf format.
For original ebooks thel text is presented as soft copy to the publishers, and then converted to the publishers own publishing software. Then this itself can be copied in some programs.
Other copies can be a frantic typists (plural), paid by the word. In China pirate copies  the Harry Potter series were in the shops within 2 days of launch in the west using this method. They were full of typos, but in China it is race to the bookstore with everyone else trying to copy.

Not to mention they use Chinglish in translating {-) {-) %% %%
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tobyker on December 23, 2015, 11:11:55 PM
The usage "Can I get" - a coffee or a bar of chocolate, or whatever appears to be a Scottish one. I'd never heard it before we moved up here.
It gave me great satisfaction to take my snopake down to Sainsbury's the other day to take out an apostrophe in a charity poster "we raise money by various method's".
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 23, 2015, 11:25:00 PM
The usage "Can I get" - a coffee or a bar of chocolate, or whatever appears to be a Scottish one. I'd never heard it before we moved up here.
It gave me great satisfaction to take my snopake down to Sainsbury's the other day to take out an apostrophe in a charity poster "we raise money by various method's".
You're probably right - I can hear it in my mind now (with the emphasis on the "I").  I wonder why it's suddenly become fashionable - if that's the correct word. Could it be the rise of the SNP? If so then let there be another referendum and let the answer be 'yes'. Can I get your support on that?  8)

As regards apostrophes, I would have all abusers of them brought to one place and burned. It just looks wrong, doesn't it?
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Grumpy Dave on December 24, 2015, 12:14:54 PM
I thought ' Can I get ' was from the US. My Sister in Law said it years ago. A Dane we had working with us in Edinburgh said ' Get me a beer ' to a barmaid, who replied 'say please'.  'Why should I say please when I'm paying for it?' ' If you want it you say please' He spent the evening grumbling about it.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 24, 2015, 12:23:16 PM
I hate it when people are rude or offhand for no reason. Just got back from the hospital for a hearing test appointment (Christmas Eve!). The technician was helpful and has offered to upgrade me to the latest model aids, he didn't have to do that. He was really pleased when I thanked him for his help afterwards, obviously a lot of his 'customers' don't. People doing a job do like to be valued, whatever that job but they often don't get the recognition they deserve. It costs nothing.

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: steamboatmodel on December 24, 2015, 09:04:28 PM
I was told as a youth "Politeness is the lubricant that keeps Society going"
Regards,
Gerald.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 24, 2015, 11:07:08 PM
I was told as a youth "Politeness is the lubricant that keeps Society going"
Regards,
Gerald.
These days it's apostrophes....
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Danny on December 25, 2015, 08:59:56 PM
I was told as a youth "Politeness is the lubricant that keeps Society going"
Regards,
Gerald.


I was told that Cod Liver Oil was the lubricant that kept society going.  It certainly did for me!


 %%
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Peter Fitness on December 25, 2015, 09:12:57 PM
Colin, unfortunately many people take the view if someone is being paid to do a job they don't need to be thanked, an attitude I heartily disagree with. As you said, it cost nothing to be polite, or to thank someone, even if they are "only" doing their job.


Peter.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 25, 2015, 10:06:33 PM

 :o :o :o

First impressions really do count

 O0 O0 O0

Because we are adaptable, we Ozzies/Aussies do not have English language problemo. 

Couldt find a place to put an apostrophe  {-) {-) {-)

%% %% %%
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 25, 2015, 11:36:47 PM
Couldt find a place to put an apostrophe  {-) {-) {-)

 %% %% %%

...nor even a letter 'n', it seems...
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 26, 2015, 12:15:16 AM
 
 :o :o :o  ooops
 
Martin what happened to the spell checker  %) %) %)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Grumpy Dave on December 26, 2015, 12:27:16 AM
Ozzie's /Aussie's surely?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tigertiger on December 26, 2015, 03:08:03 AM
Ozzie's /Aussie's surely?


Ozzie's what? An Ozzie's English usage?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 26, 2015, 09:10:12 AM
Ozzie's /Aussie's surely?

According to the Urban Dictionary, the terms Ozzie and Aussie are interchangeable in that either can be used to refer to a native of Australia. Other sources say that an ozzie is a breed of Australian dog. In neither case does the plural form have an apostrophe.
Strangely I can't seem to find an equivalent term for an English person. "Brit" is the most obvious, but that could also include anyone from N. Ireland, Scotland, Wales or the outlying islands.

Martin what happened to the spell checker  (http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/Smileys/Tug/rolleyes1.gif) (http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/Smileys/Tug/rolleyes1.gif) (http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/Smileys/Tug/rolleyes1.gif)

I find that I need to click on the box marked Spell Check for this to work. It's just below the RH end of this text box. Works for me  8)

DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Captain Povey on December 26, 2015, 10:12:00 AM
One of my pet hates is hearing people say 'should of' instead of 'should have'. Graham 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: grendel on December 26, 2015, 11:32:00 AM
Colin, unfortunately many people take the view if someone is being paid to do a job they don't need to be thanked, an attitude I heartily disagree with. As you said, it cost nothing to be polite, or to thank someone, even if they are "only" doing their job.


Peter.
I agree with you Peter, the difference between someone doing an ok job and someone doing a great job, is usually the person who gets the thank you's feels better in themselves and puts in that extra effort to do the great job, by doing the great job, they get more thanks, and continue to do a great job.
By getting the thanks, they do the great job, feel content that they have earned the thanks, and are happier in their job.
where I work, I am in a lower position as a support assistant, I do a great job, and have been recognised by the company as one of the top 5 employees last year, on christmas eve the MD stopped at my desk and congratulated me on my hard work, and thanked me. even though my role is a support assistant, I bring to that role the experience of a full drawing office manager, I support my colleagues, and keep the team morale high - even though my role does not require this, I am doing a job I love in a role with absolutely no responsibility, and am able to give an outstanding level of service, for (to me) no appreciable effort. a little thanks can make the difference between a good employee and a great employee.
Grendel
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tigertiger on December 26, 2015, 01:01:04 PM
Ozzie's /Aussie's surely?
...
Strangely I can't seem to find an equivalent term for an English person....




Pommie?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 26, 2015, 01:22:11 PM
Never heard a Yank or Canuck or Yarpie
calling you English Pommies.
Us Taffs don't call you poms
 either. O0



Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 26, 2015, 02:03:56 PM
Never heard a Yank or Canuck or Yarpie
calling you English Pommies.
Us Taffs don't call you poms
 either. O0
No - I think that term is peculiar to Strine in much the same way that "Les Rosbifs" is to the French.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 26, 2015, 02:09:42 PM
We don't call the Frogs 'Les Roschevals'  %% %% %%


Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Grumpy Dave on December 26, 2015, 03:09:05 PM
Why would we? First we speak English. Secondly ,to the English the custom of eating horseys is not something to joke about.We can joke about eating snails, a bit like winkles and frogs legs.
ergo Frogs.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 26, 2015, 04:25:00 PM
One of my pet hates is hearing people say 'should of' instead of 'should have'. Graham
    That might be from the phonetic  "should`ve "
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on December 26, 2015, 04:28:49 PM


Pommie?

   and Limey
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: sparkey on December 26, 2015, 04:46:56 PM
 >>:-( The one I hate most is gotten when used as past tense for get,why can't they just say "I have got" sounds so much nicer,still what does this grumpy old man know about English grammer,I should stick to mucking about with toy boats,anyway seasons greetings to all my friends on Mayham and may all your boats turn out as you wish......Ray. :-)) :-)) 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: BFSMP on December 26, 2015, 05:17:51 PM
I am absolutely amazed at the discussion this  small gripe of mine has generated.

I was only pointing out two slips of grammar that should have been amended by the production crews, before going out for viewing in general and it has had nearly 4000 views.

I will think twice before posting something controversial in future, as I am sure all your people must have better things to do ( i.e. model making) than keep thinking about this topic.

I dare not mention proof reading of articles, before publication, especially in the tabloid press. Or am I skating on thin ice there.

Jim.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 26, 2015, 05:23:06 PM
Jim,
Why do you think this is called Mayhem?  %% %%


Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: BFSMP on December 26, 2015, 05:27:35 PM
I am beginning to realise, Ned.

Jim
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: sparkey on December 26, 2015, 05:32:34 PM
 ;) Never mind Jim,strange things happen on Mayhem that's part of the fun of it,you start a topic and you never know where it might end up at,I know,I have started a thread and it lasted for ages and went off on several tangents before returning to the original subject,so expect anything on Mayhem,it is as the name implies Mayhem!......Ray. %) 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Norseman on December 26, 2015, 05:40:05 PM
Well at least war never broke out. Seven pages and no blue ink! Anyone might think it was X'mass ... Or should that be 'would' think? I shall fret until advised. Seasons greetings all.


Dave
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 26, 2015, 06:08:19 PM
There are usually at least two typos/misused words in The Times each day so if they can get it wrong I'm not going to lose any sleep over a missing apostrophe in Model Boats....

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: dreadnought72 on December 26, 2015, 06:51:19 PM
Sorry, Colin. It infuriates me.  >>:-(

It's so easy to get this right.

It is = it's - "See my boat? It's sinking!"
It has = it's - "It's sunk."

Posessive 'it', as in "that pond and its high waves" never ever never has the apostrophe. "The pond's high waves" does get the apostrophe.

See how difficult it's? ;-)

Andy


Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 26, 2015, 07:33:11 PM
Andy, I don't know exactly what point you are trying to make but you seem to have missed the ones I made earlier in this topic. I don't need any lessons in elementary grammar, I have been writing for magazines since the 1970s and I do put MY apostrophes in the right place. However, many of the people who submit material for magazines are first and foremost model boaters and their grammar and spelling are not always 100% right. It is the job of the Editor to correct this but practical pressures and the publication process does mean that the occasional typo finds its way into print. If there was unlimited time for proof reading then maybe the number of errors would be less but I would maintain the the accuracy of the text in Model Boats with just one person responsible for the editing process is close to being on a par with that of The Times.  Wrongly used apostrophes can be annoying although I'd bet that much of the readership doesn't even notice them. But don't just pick on apostrophes, what about discreet instead of discrete, principal instead of principle, stationery instead of stationary, astrology instead of astronomy - the list is endless. These all annoy me too - almost as much as nitpickers.

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Norseman on December 26, 2015, 08:47:04 PM
Well at least war never broke out

Sorry, I should have said hasn't. Tricky this English so I think I'll stick to Scouse in future  :D

Dave
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 26, 2015, 08:56:37 PM
Oh yes, one more - hasn't & ain't.  :-)

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Stavros on December 26, 2015, 09:13:31 PM
To Eck with this English Mularky ......Me i'll Stick to Welsh.....Nadolig LLawen I bawb a Blyddyn Newydd Da........Happy xmas and a happy new year
 Oh and do I really care a stuff about spelling and punctuation ...Heck no You all understand me by now

Dave
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 26, 2015, 10:41:56 PM
Once upon a time, if ever a publication, book, paper, etc, contained a grammatical/spelling error it was pulped and republished.

Nowadays, because money is  the criteria, incorrect usage of the language, is being forced on to readers.

Imagine the damage, this is doing to the current generation, who are battling to learn survival skills, let alone be able communicate.

Pommies, are all those from over there and Yanks, are all the other mob from the other side.

We haven't got onto center, color, armor, etc which your cousins insist is correct, it's not even Oztralian.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 26, 2015, 10:50:40 PM
'Nowadays, because money is  the criteria, incorrect usage of the language, is being forced on to readers.'

Maybe not too much of a problem as these days many people just look at the pictures....

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 26, 2015, 11:31:07 PM
I was always of the belief that it was POME  - referring to those who arrived in Australia as Prisoners Of Mother England. Can any Aussie confirm? 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 26, 2015, 11:36:30 PM
You can call it evolving or dying but the English language is changing and not, in my honest opinion, for the better. We should not have let the American settlers continue to use it after they beat us in 1782 or thereabouts. Ironic, then, that the Internet - which is arguably the biggest propagator of the abuse of the English language - was invented by an Englishman who is also a graduate of Oxford University.
It will only improve when that infinite number of monkeys with their infinite number of keyboards all find and adopt a common and correct version of the OED, and the BBC takes 'Eastenders' off-air.

That said, I don't give a stuff how you spell 'whisky' as long as I'm within reach of a bottle.

DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: BFSMP on December 27, 2015, 01:15:36 AM
and the BBC takes 'Eastenders' off-air.

That said, I don't give a stuff how you spell 'whisky' as long as I'm within reach of a bottle.

DM

East enders? What is that?

As for whisky. I'll drink to that. With a nice strong beer!

Jim
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 27, 2015, 03:15:06 AM

Why, we Aussies, all speak Australian and not English.  O0 O0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9QEdUwor9pc

 :-)) :-)) :-))
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on December 27, 2015, 04:09:38 AM
Dear Nemo..... a simple google search will confirm that the term POME had no reference to such criminal folk deported to OZ [or their families and decedents]

"POM = A British person. Also pommy. First recorded in 1912, the term was originally applied to an immigrant from Britain, and was formed by rhyming slang. A British immigrant was called a pommygrant, from the red fruit pomegranate, perhaps referring to the complexion of the new arrivals, which was then abbreviated to pommy and pom. Although some argue otherwise, it is not an acronym of prisoner of mother England"

http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=6&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjehur5kfvJAhWoGqYKHeUSC1AQFgg5MAU&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.nma.gov.au%2Fexhibitions%2Fnation%2Faustralian_english&usg=AFQjCNE-W16Rm8ZV3hJgocady1yj2y6oMg

Another term widely for these free loaders [or later the 10 Pound Poms] was 'WBP'....and this naturally was 'whinging bl**dy poms'...it is also more than apparent, that leopards do not change their spots  {-)

Derek................[proud direct descendent from convict stock on HMS Scarborough if the First Fleet to OZ]
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 27, 2015, 09:59:05 AM
East enders? What is that?

Exactly which planet do you inhabit, Jim? There are a few places remaining - chiefly in Lincolnshire - where they believe that Elvis is still alive but I would have though that 'civilisation' had reached Morecambe Bay by now.

If you are serious then take a brief look at the TV pages on the BBC website or Google its correct title ("Eastenders" - that's one word) and that will give you more than enough information about this tedious and depressing melodrama. It's shown on most nights; indeed, it's been difficult to avoid over the last few days. It is doing for the English language what the iceberg did to the Titanic.

DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: BFSMP on December 27, 2015, 11:19:31 AM
Exactly which planet do you inhabit, Jim? There are a few places remaining - chiefly in Lincolnshire - where they believe that Elvis is still alive but I would have though that 'civilisation' had reached Morecambe Bay by now.

If you are serious then take a brief look at the TV pages on the BBC website or Google its correct title ("Eastenders" - that's one word) and that will give you more than enough information about this tedious and depressing melodrama. It's shown on most nights; indeed, it's been difficult to avoid over the last few days. It is doing for the English language what the iceberg did to the Titanic.

DM

Oh I am well aware of what the programme is DM.

I just cannot believe that intelligent people still put themselves through the purgatory of watching for "pleasure" the most nauseating, miserable, throat slitting programme I ever have had the misfortune to have to endure in a life gone by!

I don't view any of the soap operas on the television  anymore now that I have a choice in viewing material, as I just found them so unbelievable of real life, when I had to and so am rebelling against my years of forced watching. I now find something else to do during that early part of an evening.

I mean when did we last have a murder in our village, never mind one a year especially at Christmas. The only murder that is recurring is when the local chip shop tries to cook a good fish supper.

Even washing dishes or folding my washing and ironing is far far more pleasurable to the misery that a soap, especially Eastenders, brings.

Hence my rather sarcastic comment about Eastenders.

Jim
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Norseman on December 27, 2015, 12:06:50 PM
My wife watches Emmerdale and Coronation street but refuses to watch the misery of Eastenders. One thing that struck me is that with the exception of a chap on CS (trains) nobody seems to have a hobby. To me that seems odder than the number of localised disasters.


My dog loves the soaps as the music usually means a nice walk if it's not raining.



Dave
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 27, 2015, 12:13:08 PM
I just cannot believe that intelligent people still put themselves through the purgatory of watching for "pleasure" the most nauseating, miserable, throat slitting programme I ever have had the misfortune to have to endure in a life gone by!
Jim

Now there's potentially the start of a whole new thread...or a whole new definition of intelligent.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on December 27, 2015, 12:14:22 PM
The hobby is right before your eyes.
Drinking copious amounts of Alcohol
Getting off with you mates Mrs and
murdering people.
My dog could write better storylines.
He is an intelligent Airedale  O0 O0


Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: sparkey on December 27, 2015, 12:20:09 PM
 :-)) Sign up that dog,might save many a man from the suffering we endure from soaps and the like,after all we cant always retire to the shed this time of the year......Ray.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on December 27, 2015, 01:29:58 PM
My son's dog Gus seemed to enjoy listening and watching that Paul O'Grady person and his rescued dogs at Xmas.
Surprisingly, he (Gus!) is an extremely intelligent Weimaraner.  {:-{

Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: BFSMP on December 27, 2015, 01:37:10 PM
Now there's potentially the start of a whole new thread...or a whole new definition of intelligent.

shall I start one.
how far could one go insulting a soap without swearing or getting it closed.

I shall try.

Jim
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Norseman on December 27, 2015, 01:40:07 PM
My Staffie girl's the same but gets over excited. When a dog goes out of shot she runs to the patio doors to see if they've gone outside.

There is much incorrect use of the English language during all this charging about.

Dave
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: davidm1945 on December 27, 2015, 07:01:19 PM
My sons dog Gus seemed to enjoy listening and watching that Paul O'Grady person and his rescued dogs at Xmas.
Surprisingly, he (Gus!) is an extremely intelligent Weimariner.  {:-{

Should that be Weimaraner - or is he the sea-going variety? ;)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on December 27, 2015, 09:22:55 PM
Nemo.....

Certainly not questioning the intelligence of Gus, but did the Vet confirm that he was short sighted & needed the red circled clock at 'dogs view height?"...... as clearly he would need a ladder to climb up to view the blue circled clock

So if this is Gus's clock, is that also his 'sit-up' basket next to the tele? :embarrassed:.......

Derek
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 28, 2015, 12:14:25 AM
 
Derek,
 
Well spotted, also the reflection in the mirror would be confusing, it seems as if the dog is mulling it over????
 
 O0 O0 O0   {-) {-) {-)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: U-33 on December 30, 2015, 12:49:41 PM
Maybe one of you awfully clever chaps could explain to a poor old pensioner like me how something can possibly be 110%? ("Reactor to 110%, number one"...)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on December 30, 2015, 01:28:20 PM
Hullo Rich......I certainly do not qualify as...'one of you awfully clever chaps' ...

However believe there is an explanation for the term you describe.......

If an engine is rated to 1000HP, that is based upon many factors, and one of them simplified is its duty rating

So if the engine is rated at 1000HP at 100% duty....then every mechanical component is designed to perform at its rated output also for a given time period

However due to parameters, if you increased the fuel and oxygen beyond its maximum rated requirement, by increased combustion and over speed you would exceed the original 1000HP output <*<...however at a potential cost of overheat  {-)

I suppose our electrical boffins could offer similar scenarios with amps & current draw exceeding the design  & thereby also with the same result of overheat

Apart from that, I had always assumed that any form of throttle in a nuclear reaction would be to increase cooling, therefore reducing the output power  >>:-(

In conclusion, it would appear OK within the scope of this English language to suggest that an engine could perform at 110%........however I find a fundamental flaw in any suggestion that a human being can perform at any value greater than 100%

So that's my twopence worth from one very poor old pensioner to another ok2  ...... Derek

Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on December 30, 2015, 02:29:41 PM
Sorry to change direction here, but Storm Frank has brought out the poor grammar which is now acceptable on the BBC...
I've just heard a spokesperson for the Dept of the Environment use the word "obviously" THREE times in the same (quite short) sentence - when nothing of what she was describing was at all obvious. It must be contagious, because the interviewer then managed to use that same word twice in her supplementary question.
My point is simple; if something is obvious then surely it doesn't warrant any further discussion... obviously.

Back to 110%: I think this may have started with Jack Nicholson's wonderful performance in "One flew over the cuckoo's nest", when every outrageous promise that he made to that gorgon of a nurse to behave himself was qualified with "a hunnerd an' ten percen'!"

They don't make 'em like that any more.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on December 30, 2015, 02:36:54 PM
Percentages over 100 are handy when scaling up plans!

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: kinmel on December 30, 2015, 10:45:00 PM
Grammar has never been as straight forward as the experts imagine.

In the dark late 1950's, a fellow pupil in my class was sent home with the punishment of writing out one thousand times " The word "and" cannot appear in the same sentence twice".

Next morning the headmaster received a complaint from the parent that the English teacher was an idiot and to prove it, he included a grammatically and logically correct sentence with five consecutive "and"s.

What example did he give ?
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Norseman on December 31, 2015, 12:20:43 AM
No idea but this has twenty eight


In a similar vein, Martin Gardener offered the example: "Wouldn't the sentence 'I want to put a hyphen between the words Fish and And and And and Chips in my Fish-And-Chips sign' have been clearer if quotation marks had been placed before Fish, and between Fish and and, and and and And, and And and and, and and and And, and And and and, and and and Chips, as well as after Chips?"

That's left me a bit discombooberated (Yes I know)  ;D
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tigertiger on December 31, 2015, 07:09:57 AM
How about.


As well as enjoying the sun, sea, and sand Mods and Rockers would go to Brighton for fish and chips, and rock and roll.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: malcolmfrary on January 12, 2016, 08:46:43 AM
Just seen another example poor word choice where the media talks about a recently rebuilt steam locomotive.  They do persist in calling it a "train", when the train is the string of vehicles with an engine added to make it go.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on January 12, 2016, 09:51:39 AM
This one is poor research again by the media. There was/is a train called the Flying Scotsman and a locomotive with the same name but in many other instances they refer to an engine as a train.  My pet hate is "gotten" and of course the ability to say lough but not loch :((
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on January 12, 2016, 11:34:03 AM
 
Not to mention references to the military, whilst in fact they are actually talking about the Air Force or Navy. <*< <*< >>:-( >>:-(
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tigertiger on January 12, 2016, 01:14:07 PM

Not to mention references to the military, whilst in fact they are actually talking about the Air Force or Navy. <*< <*< >>:-( >>:-(


Or even when talking about the Army.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Dixie212 on January 13, 2016, 11:27:53 AM
Or how about my pet hate, starting every conversation with the word SO. This does irritate me, and I have even switched radio/tv channels when it happens.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: tigertiger on January 13, 2016, 02:14:08 PM
So, why is that then? ok2 ;)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Netleyned on January 13, 2016, 02:34:43 PM
So be it :D


Ned
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Arrow5 on January 13, 2016, 03:43:21 PM
Stop that {-)    Anyway..oops :embarrassed:  Local to me is the Cairngorm Funicular Railway. The staff refer to it as the "train" even although the two carriages are separated by almost 2 kilometres of rope, except when they pass each other going in opposite direction !    I suppose because it runs on rails ergo etc etc.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Norseman on January 13, 2016, 05:44:09 PM
The word 'Gobsmacked' has me reaching for my spade with violent intentions, and especially so if the speaker seems otherwise well educated.

Dave
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on January 13, 2016, 05:52:43 PM
Like, I also dislike the current usage  of a word like, like, it's repetitive use, like you know what I mean like?
I am beginning to sound like my grand-daughter now!  %%
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on January 13, 2016, 06:15:50 PM
Like, I also dislike the current usage  of a word like, like, it's repetitive use, like you know what I mean like?
I am beginning to sound like my grand-daughter now!  %%
I think this came from what's called "Valley Girl Speak" - the valley being San Fernando (California). Google it for hours of exasperation and annoyance! It was probably proliferated by some American "sitcom" - "Friends" maybe? I never saw it myself.
My second grand-daughter, who is otherwise quite literate, uses "I'm like..." as a substitute for "I said". She is also afflicted by the Estuarine-English* pronunciation of anything which includes a vowel as if it had a glottal stop instead e.g "thirteen" becomes "fir een". I am in the process of trying to cure her of these afflictions... <*<   
(*See Eastenders).
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on January 13, 2016, 06:28:51 PM
The word 'Gobsmacked' has me reaching for my spade with violent intentions, and especially so if the speaker seems otherwise well educated.

Dave
Dave
Sooner an honest "gobsmacked" than a completely inappropriate and self-conscious "devastated" - surely the most overused word on BBC News? I suppose that comes from the annoying habit of "our correspondent" to ask the victim of whatever-it-is how they 'feel' about whatever has happened to them or to a close relative....or a friend....or someone from the same street...or not...or David Bowie...
I really can't recommend this forum highly enough http://www.brassedoffbritannia.co.uk/ (http://www.brassedoffbritannia.co.uk/)
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on January 13, 2016, 07:04:00 PM
I think this came from what's called "Valley Girl Speak" - the valley being San Fernando (California). Google it for hours of exasperation and annoyance! It was probably proliferated by some American "sitcom" - "Friends" maybe? I never saw it myself.
My second grand-daughter, who is otherwise quite literate, uses "I'm like..." as a substitute for "I said". She is also afflicted by the Estuarine-English* pronunciation of anything which includes a vowel as if it had a glottal stop instead e.g "thirteen" becomes "fir een". I am in the process of trying to cure her of these afflictions... <*<   (*See Eastenders).DM

One of the worst for me is 'munf' for month.  %) %)
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Norseman on January 13, 2016, 08:19:06 PM
One thing I can't seem to stop myself doing is substituting 'me' for 'my' when speaking to friends and family. It doesn't happen when I'm at work or when speaking on the telephone.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on January 14, 2016, 01:33:28 PM
Are you Irish?  :}
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Norseman on January 14, 2016, 05:31:51 PM
Guaranteed Scouse  :}
A smattering of Welsh one one side but I think mainly from an Irish RC Grandmother and a Church of Scotland Grandfather!  Unlikey mix for the 1930's and even 1960's Liverpool had some sectarian problems. I dont see much sign of it now thankfully.

Dave
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: malcolmfrary on January 14, 2016, 06:25:29 PM
"So" can be fairly legitimately used to start a sentence, as long as it is used in moderation.  It's finishing a sentence with ", so....." which is annoying.  Innit.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on January 14, 2016, 07:06:30 PM
One thing I can't seem to stop myself doing is substituting 'me' for 'my' when speaking to friends and family. It doesn't happen when I'm at work or when speaking on the telephone.
It's very common around here to do that, me duck....especially when you're as common as what I is, (intit).
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on January 14, 2016, 07:29:56 PM
My God Dave! Are you saying there are more of you....?  :o

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on January 14, 2016, 09:43:21 PM
OOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on January 14, 2016, 11:12:46 PM
My God Dave! Are you saying there are more of you....?  :o

Colin

729,996 more in 2015 - and that's only in Nottingham. They also speak this way in Derby, Chesterfield, Newark, Grantham etc. As for "My God Dave!" a little more punctuation might have been appropriate. I'm sure I don't need any more encouragement.
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on January 14, 2016, 11:28:17 PM
You know your place Dave, Nottingham isn't it? Lotta m'ducks on the Trent they say.

Colin
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on January 15, 2016, 09:27:09 AM
Colin
I didn't count the population personally but I did forget to mention Mansfield and Retford, where the accent is also markedly "Eass Miggluns". As for ducks, the Trent seems to have many more Canada Geese these days - certainly along the Victoria Embankment just above Trent Bridge.
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: raflaunches on January 15, 2016, 10:18:11 AM
I think that in recent years, in my job in particular, I have noticed all the different accent types slowing merging into one version. In the RAF we are supposed to use the Queen's English to communicate, especially to record technical jobs but the way we say certain words is now virtually identical. I know a young man who comes from Somerset with a thick accent from the same region, in less than a year he speaks with no trace of an accent. This is due to the ground crews using throat mikes and we need to understand each other during aircraft movements, etc.
We use 'proper' English in our records because they are legal documents when they are completed, so when it comes to writing on forums I tend to write 'properly' instead of using modern variations. We only use technical abbreviations at work or TLAs (Three Letter Abbreviations) due to the amount of space to record the information.
I have to thank the RAF for the way I speak and write properly, unless I tell a newcomer where I'm from they can't even guess that I'm from Kettering! :}
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on January 15, 2016, 10:42:41 AM
Coming from north of the border and living for many years in the far south has had it's accentual problems in the past. One exception was when at work I used VHF radio all the time and on occasions the frequency became congested with callers trying to get a word in edgeways to the controller. It was gratifying on many occasions, especially when booking off duty, was to hear the control say 'Go ahead Jock!' over the babble and I leapt to the head of the queue. :-)) 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on January 15, 2016, 10:46:44 AM
I think that in recent years, in my job in particular, I have noticed all the different accent types slowing merging into one version. In the RAF we are supposed to use the Queen's English to communicate, especially to record technical jobs but the way we say certain words is now virtually identical. I know a young man who comes from Somerset with a thick accent from the same region, in less than a year he speaks with no trace of an accent. This is due to the ground crews using throat mikes and we need to understand each other during aircraft movements, etc.
We use 'proper' English in our records because they are legal documents when they are completed, so when it comes to writing on forums I tend to write 'properly' instead of using modern variations. We only use technical abbreviations at work or TLAs (Three Letter Abbreviations) due to the amount of space to record the information.
I have to thank the RAF for the way I speak and write properly, unless I tell a newcomer where I'm from they can't even guess that I'm from Kettering! :}

Nick
This reminds me of the young man who presented himself at the OASC at Biggin Hill for interview. He was first asked "Please say the word 'air'" - this he duly did. "Now say the word 'hair'" - again, done. "And finally the word "'lair'" - done.
"Now to complete the interview I'd like you to say all three words together, one after the other, please:"
"Air-hair-lair!"
"And hair-lair to you, old man! Welcome to the Officer's Club!"

I nearly was that soldier...  <:(
DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on January 15, 2016, 11:55:15 AM
When in the army, I had a pal who regularly took the p*** out of officers by saying 'air-hair-lair Sir' to them each morning.
He also used his regular phrase when dealing with certain officers which went ' Whale oil beef hooked Sir!'  O0

In training, when many of our younger officers were National Service, I recall a gruff old  WW2 veteran Staff Sergeant instructing us to refer to all officers as 'SIR'. He went on ' Of course, they will spell it 'S-i-r' , but I spell it 'C-u-r'!  {-)
 
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on January 15, 2016, 12:15:37 PM
When in the army, I had a pal who regularly took the p*** out of officers by saying 'air-hair-lair Sir' to them each morning.
He also used his regular phrase when dealing with certain officers which went ' Whale oil beef hooked Sir!'  O0

In training, when many of our younger officers were National Service, I recall a gruff old  WW2 veteran Staff Sergeant instructing us to refer to all officers as 'SIR'. He went on ' Of course, they will spell it 'S-i-r' , but I spell it 'C-u-r'!  {-)

Just goes to show how universal the English language is, as that was how it was spelt here in OZ  O0 O0  {-) {-)
Nothing like heritage and traditions being carried on :-)) :-)) :-))
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: steamboatmodel on January 15, 2016, 10:39:41 PM
When in the army, I had a pal who regularly took the p*** out of officers by saying 'air-hair-lair Sir' to them each morning.
He also used his regular phrase when dealing with certain officers which went ' Whale oil beef hooked Sir!'  O0

In training, when many of our younger officers were National Service, I recall a gruff old  WW2 veteran Staff Sergeant instructing us to refer to all officers as 'SIR'. He went on ' Of course, they will spell it 'S-i-r' , but I spell it 'C-u-r'!  {-)
That reminds me of the proper spelling for the current excuse for music. It sounds like they are calling it "RAP", but the proper spelling is "CRAP' with the c being unpronounced and silent.
Regards,
Gerald.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Nemo on January 16, 2016, 04:41:11 PM
Gerald - back in the 50s, when Elvis P.  was a rising rockstar, a cashier in my Company referred to one of his hits as 'Dreamy Eyes' until I told her it was actually 'Treat Me Nice'!  {-)
Ontario - my second home! :-))
Bob.
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Colin Bishop on January 16, 2016, 05:23:52 PM
You mean it's not 'Dead snails in the sunset' then?  %%
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: inertia on January 16, 2016, 05:28:56 PM
PLEASE don't start on mis-heard song lyrics.... there are thousands of them (some of them are even repeatable here!).

Now watch 'em flood in...  :o

DM
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: davidm1945 on January 16, 2016, 06:19:34 PM
PLEASE don't start on mis-heard song lyrics.... there are thousands of them (some of them are even repeatable here!).

Now watch 'em flood in...  :o

DM

I believe they are called "mondegreens".... Google it!

Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: derekwarner on January 16, 2016, 09:48:33 PM
 :-).....'mondegreens'...had never heard of this term.......but just watch & listen to the following  {-) x 30 times...... O0...Derek

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwj2gdfdpq_KAhUBKJQKHX-CBDQQtwIIMTAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D6p6rV3OKcjw&usg=AFQjCNGmKodnPOYk29_ZS8QsgZuBtdCrmQ
Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: Danny on January 16, 2016, 11:21:04 PM
Obviously one of the many but - who remembers the Maxell tape ads?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxELSzay2lc


That was BEFORE I needed hearing aids  %%


Now the (c)rap music is indecipherable.


Casey Rah

Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: malcolmfrary on January 17, 2016, 08:59:00 AM
:-) .....'mondegreens'...had never heard of this term.......but just watch & listen to the following  {-) x 30 times...... O0 ...Derek

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwj2gdfdpq_KAhUBKJQKHX-CBDQQtwIIMTAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D6p6rV3OKcjw&usg=AFQjCNGmKodnPOYk29_ZS8QsgZuBtdCrmQ (https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwj2gdfdpq_KAhUBKJQKHX-CBDQQtwIIMTAD&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D6p6rV3OKcjw&usg=AFQjCNGmKodnPOYk29_ZS8QsgZuBtdCrmQ)
Most were improvements.  Certainly more enjoyable listening.
Terry Wogan used to be very good at creative mis-hearing.  Let us not forget Billy Cotton getting "Sophie Tucker" a bit wrong.

Title: Re: Correct use of the English Language
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on July 16, 2016, 05:53:58 AM

Found the answer so here it is,