Model Boat Mayhem

Mess Deck: General Section => Chit-Chat => Topic started by: inertia on May 24, 2016, 11:17:51 pm

Title: Windows 10 !
Post by: inertia on May 24, 2016, 11:17:51 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-36367221 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-36367221)

And you might have thought bankers, fund managers and politicians were the biggest cheats!

DM
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: imsinking on May 24, 2016, 11:51:16 pm
 >>:-(  YES ! ! Unfortunately I did that (the X) and nothing happened , thought no more of it , I'm a night owl so it's normal for me to be at the comp 1 - 2 o clock in the morning , I'd gone out to the kitchen for a brew  came back and WINDOWS 10 was being loaded  :o  you cant stop it . .
OK I'm stuck with it , see what it's like , nothing is where it should be , compared to 7 , I thought it was slower than Win 7, seemed to check every page you went on ( this event happened last Tuesday) I'll see the week out & roll back FORGET IT  >:-o  Thursday morning refused to accept my starting password Tried everything to bypass it , into BIOS , Main setup , nothing worked . . .
Clean instal is called for , my data is on a second SSD drive so once I reload all the apps I'll be away again I WAS WRONG 10 had installed all the backup files on the second drive & wiped out all the data  <:(
I'm hoping the data is in there somewhere,  there's 46 gig of files to check so I'll be sometime , meantime 'old faithful XP' is back in use . . .
Bill . . . <*<
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Liverbudgie on May 25, 2016, 12:14:19 am
Same thing happened to me - not impressed.

LB
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: tigertiger on May 25, 2016, 04:02:38 am
On our Thinkpad service centre here, they are disabling the update settings for Win users not on 10. This may cause problems with security updates, but it is what they are doing to stop Win10 being forced on people.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on May 25, 2016, 04:41:10 am
The story from Oz PC Mag goes, that Microsoft are aiming for some astronomical take up figure for the update and at last count they, Microsoft, were nowhere near it, that is the aimed take up by users of Win 10.

Consequently, Microsoft may extend the time to accept the update but in the meantime, those who haven't done so should wait.

It is also reported that because of the large variety of computer combinations, all PC's are not identical, Win 10 may not work even though the PC has the right specs.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: plastic on May 25, 2016, 07:18:49 am
Windows 10 is competition to Android's data-harvesting sytem - MS realised they were missing out on all the sales of people's information - that is why Win10 is being forced upon you now - there's BIG money in your information.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Brian60 on May 25, 2016, 09:09:13 am
Well I did warn about this sort of thing happening along with hidden inhouse charges for various parts of the system months ago. Without saying so I was accused of scare mongering. I wonder if the parties that did so will jump up and offer an apology -hmmm not a chance! <*<
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Colin Bishop on May 25, 2016, 10:01:18 am
I noticed this the other day when, funnily enough, I wanted to upgrade my Windows 7 laptop. Although W7 was fine the machine was taking forever to start up and I couldn't discover why. Also, as I only use it every 10 days or so, each time I switched on or off there was a50% chance that it would decide to do a 20 minute update at the most inconvenient time. So I thought I would upgrade to W10 now as I would have a chance to roll back if necessary but the upgrade seems to have gone smoothly enough so far. I did take the customise option and switched off all the obvious 'reporting back to Microsoft' features although no doubt there are some hidden ones there too.

I think all these devices now have a mind of their own and seem to do pretty much as they please rather than what you actually want. Being led by the nose seems to apply in most areas of life these days.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: imsinking on May 25, 2016, 10:03:48 am
On our Thinkpad service centre here, they are disabling the update settings for Win users not on 10. This may cause problems with security updates, but it is what they are doing to stop Win10 being forced on people.


There's an app' called NEVER 10 (google it) that will find / erase / block out any Win 10 'updates' I've only just found it  :((  so it's no good to me, but it may help other folk , i've downloaded it just in case . . .
In hindsight I'd noticed the 'update' logo on the shutdown button for a while , when I've shutdown the comp' went off straight away instead of don't switch your computer off etc , so that must have been Win 10 coming aboard .
Bill
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: craggle on May 25, 2016, 10:08:44 am
I did Windows 10 about a year ago now and have loved it ever since. It just works so much better than 7 did and it's exactly the same to look at so everything is easy to use and find.
Never been charged for anything either so happy all the way.  :-)

Craig.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: malcolmfrary on May 25, 2016, 10:28:29 am
Way back, I muttered and cursed at W7 being different to XP after doing the same about XP being different to W98.  At least with W10 it can be configured to be very much like W7, and with my collection of programs, does work better in every respect.  I did take the opportunity to turn off all of the "advantages", so that probably accounts for it working so well.
Having said that, there are people out there who earn their living using programs that will only work on earlier versions of Windows and are not replaceable.  Programs that block off the W10 upgrade offers do have a very valid place, if only to allow such folks to earn a living.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Bob K on May 25, 2016, 11:43:36 am
I intend to keep trying to fend it off until July.  I have full off-line backups of my files for recovery, and expect at worst it could cause me to have to buy a new computer if it goes totally pear shaped.  Either way it's a win-win situation for blooming Microsoft. 

I wish Vauxhall would automatically replace my wife's Zafira in the same way, preferably before it goes up in flames.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Colin Bishop on May 25, 2016, 12:00:45 pm
Bob, if you leave it to the last minute you may find that a lot of other people have done exactly the same and the MS servers will be swamped or something with extra risks of problems. I upgraded my laptop now on the basis that if it doesn't work properly with W10 I can still revert back to W7 which you may not be able to do after the July deadline.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: derekwarner on May 25, 2016, 12:30:23 pm
Like ...''lambs to the slaughter".......is it really necessary to obtain 'for free' this new OS for your computer? this week or next week or next month or next year?................

Bill & Melisa may now be wonderful people........but!.....................{-) Derek
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: kinmel on May 25, 2016, 12:42:24 pm
Like ...''lambs to the slaughter".......is it really necessary to obtain 'for free' this new OS for your computer? this week or next week or next month or next year?................

Bill & Melisa may now be wonderful people........but!..................... {-) Derek

I agree, my earlier version of Windows works just fine and does everything I want.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on May 25, 2016, 12:48:08 pm
Derek,

Have a read of this and if you can follow up WIN 10 in APC Magazine. It used to be called Australian Personal Computer.

https://askleo.com/clearing-windows-10-misconceptions/?awt_l=J72BJ&awt_m=JxsS2g.aY3dfbL

As one commentator on here said it is all to do with making money and also selling computers, that is why WIN 10 won't work with 'old' computers it no longer 'reads' the old chips.

Has to be something wrong when we, Australia, who have the record for embracing new technology aren't flocking to WIN 10.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: plastic on May 25, 2016, 12:50:13 pm
I agree, my earlier version of Windows works just fine and does everything I want.

That looks exactly like the old Atari ST TOS operating system. Brings back good memories of simpler times when computers were really fast with just 4MB of RAM   :}
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: DavieTait on May 25, 2016, 12:51:05 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-36376962 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-36376962)

My Mum had it auto-install last week , aborted it when she had the chance ( auto rolls back to Windows 7 ) then last night all of a sudden her PC starts playing up , screen shaking and not working properly , now it could just be a co-incidence BUT I removed the update that put the Windows 10 install app on my last PC last year and within a week it started to shut itself down for absolutely no reason and I had to replace the PC

I think Microsoft have a bit of code in that update that will try and force you to replace your PC if you refuse the "upgrade" , for me I'm about to rebuild my last Pc , wipe the HD and install Linux and see if that works , if that PC operated normally without the shut downs then that's all the proof I will need that MS deliberately damaged the software on it
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: grendel on May 25, 2016, 01:04:39 pm
I just upgraded my old 2007 laptop- I upgraded it to Lubuntu 14.04 - I also treated it to a SSD hard drive - it now boots up to my user page in 14 seconds from hitting the on button, shuts down in about 5 seconds, and still does all of the work that I ever did on it before - windows 10 - well since it used to be XP, and was slow on that, I would never have thought it worth trying to even go as far as windows 7.
I do have one machine running windows 10, that is only used to watch TV online, and even that had some issues until I stopped trying to view the online websites and downloaded the 'App' for windows 10 for the TV channel. it seems to do everything I want - but the old ubuntu laptop is so much faster.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Colin Bishop on May 25, 2016, 01:28:43 pm
While there are many issues with modern software I don't go along with harking back to 'the good old days' which were often anything but. A bit like yearning for your old outside lavatory at the bottom of the garden.

Performance on a modern PC depends on many things and not just the basic operating system. The machine can be held back by applications constantly 'calling home', malware, and the insidious 'crapware' that most manufacturers stuff their machines with on top of whatever Microsoft has installed. Very often, problems will lie with the multiple drivers which are needed to try and make all the internal and external components work together for at least most of the time.

It is very obvious that some people can have a perfectly good experience with W10 while others really struggle which suggests that the problems lie with the interaction between W10 and the various drivers, peripherals and other variable factors which which it has to co exist. It's a wonder that anything works really.

However I don't believe in extolling the virtues of the old versions. For all its faults, my present setup is a quantum advance on what I used to manage with a decade ago and I only use a fraction of its actual potential.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Martin [Admin] on May 25, 2016, 02:27:28 pm
 
From my point of view;

1. "Free" Windows 10 upgrade ends July 29 ( but I'm guessing they'll extend that due to demand )

2. If you're thinking about upgrading, do so now.
    If you don't like it, you can restore back to Windows 7 but only for a  30 days after install.
    Surprisingly, this does actually work properly! But do give windows 10 a proper chance first.....!

3. 'Clone' your HDD and install windows 10.
    This way you can get a good backup and  "free" Windows 10.
    You can then reinstall you old HDD and continue with windows 7.
    (You're going to have to upgrade one day, may as well get it for 'free'!)

4. Is it worth upgrading..... Hmmmm...
    From Windows 7, probably not, it's Very different!
    From Windows 8, 8.1 definitely.
    On a new laptop /desktop, yes.

5. Is it better than Windows 7? It does appear to be quicker. (I don't like all the background updates that you can't stop!)
Windows 10 won't work on "old" hardware.

 M
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: tigertiger on May 25, 2016, 02:38:14 pm
I think MS are not doing themselves any favours here. Maybe further down the line MS will have proved to have made the correct decision, 'The last version of Windows you will ever need', with seamless updates. Provided it is not as market ready as ME and Vista were.


If they don't prove to be right, what will happen? Well already even non-IT people have migrated to the likes of Linux Ubuntu and Linux Mint. And in China, a lot of the kids are buying Apple products now. Apple products are not as solid and physically robust (almost indestructible ThinkPad, drop an Apple and it will do more than just bruise) as a lot of MS compatibles are, but at least all the bells and whistles work (trackpad anyone?).


My biggest worry for Win10, is that after the honey moon period, they will switch to a subscription model (like office 365) to pay for the updates. Updates that cost money. I know MS have said they won't do this, but can we believe the guys from marketing, given their recent history of shenanigans.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Colin Bishop on May 25, 2016, 02:55:30 pm
I'm not altogether sure that that analogy holds TT. Office 365 is an application, Windows is an operating system. Without an operating system any device is just so much junk. The cost of Windows is built into the cost of initial purchase. It is certainly true that Microsoft have made extra money on the back of releasing new editions of Windows but that is a voluntary purchase and it would be a big jump to move over to a subscription model when there is, as you say, an alternative in using another free operating system which will give all the practical functionality that most people need. If people go down that route then they will not need an initial Windows installation on their device and that would bite into Microsoft's revenues.

It does rather look as if Microsoft are exchanging the revenue they would get from new versions of Windows for the revenue they can raise by harvesting information from the majority of Windows users who will not have turned off the reporting to Microsoft functions. You can bet that devices as delivered will have these enabled by default.

It will be interesting to see how things turn out. At one time IBM had the computer market totally sown up but they are no longer anything like the player that they used to be. The profits lie in the information now, not the hardware and software used to gather and hold it.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: tigertiger on May 25, 2016, 03:15:27 pm
The big issue for changing OS would be for the company systems.
For a large company to retrain all of its staff, to switch to a new OS and associated applications, would be difficult and costly; maybe unworkable.
One big bugaboo for me is that in China, you cannot buy the English language version of Win10, only Chinese. You can only get language packs for Win10 PRO (a USD99 upgrade from the home edition). You can set a user account language to English, but all the background working is Chinese. In Win10 that means only about half of the desktop is in English, as soon as you do anything in the OS it is Chinese.


The other point about apps like MS Office, is that they used to be a one off purchase too, before 365 came along. Most of the machines I work on in China are still running Office 2007, I am mostly using 2010, and have just received a new machine with 2013 on it. I have yet to see any user of 365 in China, or anywhere else for that matter. I am sure they exist, but I will resist buying into 365 until I have too. Again, the Linux (and other) office compatible products are still going to be around. At the moment these office clones are not as powerful, but they are getting there. A few years ago Linux was for geeks. Now the GUI is very intuitive and Windows like.

Don't get me wrong. I like MS Office, and Windows (most of the time). Like most people I am reluctant to have to learn a new OS. What I don't like is some of the things that MS has been doing since uncle Bill (no saint) stood down. Especially with regard to the uptake, or lack of, of Win10 and the subsequent strong arming to get people to switch. On the subject of learning a new OS, the differences between Linux Mint and Win7, are about the same (IMHO) as the differences between Win7 and Win10.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: plastic on May 25, 2016, 03:48:16 pm
Nobody WANTS a pc - historically they had to have one to get online, but MS's home market has been killed by Apple & Android.

I suspect MS is going for a subscription model like i-Tunes where if you don't sign up and pay whatever and whenever they decide, your machine stops working after 30 days - they want regular income rather than lumps of cash when they release a new windows version.

This push to get everyone onto Win10 obviously has an ulterior motive - they are trying to force you to put all your data on the cloud so they have the right to mine your data and sell what they like and I assume they are selling your habits and patterns for marketing purposes.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: NFMike on May 25, 2016, 04:14:10 pm
... market totally sown up
Aargh! Colin, how could you?  :police:


But back on topic, thanks for the heads up. I went and checked our update status and blow me there was W10 trying to get in again (and this even without the little flag thing appearing in the notification area).
I'll be glad when (if) they end the "free" offer - maybe then they'll stop trying to shove W10 into every crevice they can  >:-o
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Stan on May 25, 2016, 04:39:09 pm
Latest on BBC news page Microsoft to offer tab to cancel any prompt to install  Windows Ten.It says along with install button you will also a cancel button they are bowing to complaints from Windows users



Stan
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Liverbudgie on May 25, 2016, 08:18:21 pm
Somewhat off topic, however, I installed 10 on my HP notebook where it worked fine. The problem has arose when I was at college I had to leave quickly so just shut the lid down without shutting the machine down via the button or whatever way you're supposed to do it. When using win 7 I just lifted the lid again and off we went as normal. When I got home this time I opened the lid to re-start and nothing, all I have now is a blank screen with a flashing curser in the top left hand corner. I can't find any reference to this on forums, so anybody with any idea's as to what to do now?

LB
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Colin Bishop on May 25, 2016, 08:41:04 pm
A hard reset might help LB. If there is a power or reset button press it down for several seconds. If the battery is removable, take it out and replace it after a few minutes. There may also be a key combination that will perform a hard reset, the usual one is CTRL/ALT/DEL but there may be others.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Liverbudgie on May 25, 2016, 08:56:53 pm
Thanks Colin, but I've tried all those.....hence being lost.

LB

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: grendel on May 25, 2016, 09:04:47 pm
hard reset, disconnect power - remove battery and hold the power button down for 30 seconds or more, then it should boot from a fresh boot - reloading everything from scratch.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Colin Bishop on May 25, 2016, 09:12:47 pm
LB, there are lots of online references to Windows devices with the problem you describe. Google 'notebook frozen with flashing cursor'. There are various reasons and various solutions some of which entail holding certain keys down as the machine powers up - have you tried these?

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: imsinking on May 26, 2016, 12:01:01 am
Latest on BBC news page Microsoft to offer tab to cancel any prompt to install  Windows Ten.It says along with install button you will also a cancel button they are bowing to complaints from Windows users



Stan
Doesn't help me , it's too late , my gripe is I build my own machines  / I buy legitimate Microsoft OS systems , alright I don't OWN the software I only get a licence to use it / they have NO RIGHT to interfere with my machine with out permission / AND my graphics card has quit & will not function properly, so that's a new one . . .  >>:-(  Any one thought how their going to re instal 10 without a disk ?
Bill
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Liverbudgie on May 26, 2016, 12:07:36 am
With regards to my problem, Thanks for the suggestions and I will give them a try When time permits and report back.

LB
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: kinmel on May 26, 2016, 08:49:00 am
Any one thought how their going to re instal 10 without a disk ?
Bill

Microsoft provide a "Media Creation Tool" which allows you to do a clean install using a DVD, ISO or USB.

If Windows 10 has previously been installed on that hardware it will automatically activate your installation, else you need to input a valid key from Windows 7 etc

https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows10

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: DavieTait on May 26, 2016, 11:18:11 am
The graphics card failure just confirms to me that this is a deliberate act by Microsoft as that's what happened to my Mothers PC last week , it was a RAM access problem that caused my last PC to be bricked by MS after I stopped Win10 installing, confirms its a malicious act to force people to buy a new computer with Win10 on it.

Well stuff that I've sorted the problem on my last PC and will download Linux Ubuntu tonight to set it up see how I get on with that, My sister is getting her man to sort up a Laptop they have for my Mum so once I get everything transferred from her PC to the laptop I'll see if her PC is repairable and if it is put Linux on it
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: imsinking on May 26, 2016, 11:18:21 am
Kinmel , Very nice , if you can get to it . . . I was locked out of my password , nothing would bring it back even have a HIRENs bootable CD , reset everything as it should've been & still got the two fingers .
Bill
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: kinmel on May 26, 2016, 12:39:09 pm
Kinmel , Very nice , if you can get to it . . . I was locked out of my password , nothing would bring it back even have a HIRENs bootable CD , reset everything as it should've been & still got the two fingers .
Bill

http://www.howtogeek.com/222262/how-to-reset-your-forgotten-password-in-windows-10/
Title: Not Windows 10...
Post by: U-33 on May 26, 2016, 07:25:19 pm
My laptop has Windows 8.1 installed...nice, I like it, but : every time I move my finger across the mouse pad, there's a black bar thing that appears out of the side with all sorts of "Apps" on it. It drives me mad!   >>:-(

Please tell me there's a way of stopping it....
Title: Win 10
Post by: Onetenor on May 27, 2016, 02:50:22 am
 If you log onto the Aeromodeller forum you can have an overview done by Mike Woods who will no only sort out any probs with your comp but will block all attempts to install Win !0 I'm going to get him to do mine .There may be a SMALL charge but not much.I tried Win 10 but A it looked odd and B things only half worked. Also since I had it I can't access some of my files .They ask me for a password on some of them and since I  never encrypted them I can't open them
Title: Re: Not Windows 10...
Post by: tigertiger on May 27, 2016, 04:16:39 am
You can go into Control Panel, open up the trackpad dialogue box and change what dragging your finger across it does. You could turn this off.
What I did. I always use an external mouse. There is a setting that if you are using another mouse, the track pad is disabled. If you unplug the external mouse it works again.


The exact menu options are different for different track pads. But if you go into Devices and Printers (usually to the right of the start pop up menu) you can see the name and make of your trackpad. If not you can do it from the control panel.
Once you have the name, you can Google how to disable it.
Title: Re: Win 10
Post by: tigertiger on May 27, 2016, 04:18:13 am
Google
How to stop win10


There are several walk through tutorials on this.

Title: Re: Win 10
Post by: Onetenor on May 27, 2016, 08:56:09 am
 OK! Thank you
Title: Re: Not Windows 10...
Post by: malcolmfrary on May 27, 2016, 09:22:57 am
While wandering through my local Pound Shop I spotted a display of optical mouses.  Turns out that they cost £1.  Amazingly, they work well apart from the minor downside that they are formed from clear plastic and I assume that this is what prevents the PC from being put into sleep mode (varying ambient light kidding it on that it has moved).
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Martin [Admin] on May 27, 2016, 09:55:19 am
 
Couple of good Apps out there to stop Windows 10 installing:

https://www.grc.com/never10.htm

http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Onetenor on May 27, 2016, 11:10:04 am
Latest on BBC news page Microsoft to offer tab to cancel any prompt to install  Windows Ten.It says along with install button you will also a cancel button they are bowing to complaints from Windows users



Stan
     
I'll believe it when I see it
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: DavieTait on May 27, 2016, 11:34:17 am
I think what MS are doing is illegal anyway , under the Misuse of Computer Act anyone who forcefully changes you computer to take information off it to sell is committing an offence in exactly the same way as a hacker does so MS should be up in court for this.

They have no God given right to the data we have on our computers , no right at all to force us to change operating systems so what they are doing is illegal as far as I'm concerned
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Onetenor on May 27, 2016, 11:37:53 am
Hear Hear  I second that
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: plastic on May 27, 2016, 11:45:35 am
I'll bet deep down in your user agreement with MS is a disclaimer that you will have agreed with at some time or other.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Onetenor on May 27, 2016, 11:51:53 am
Most likely
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Bob K on May 27, 2016, 12:00:20 pm
Even with v8.1 they have made it increasingly difficult to save files where you want to file them, MS having long ago decided we are all too stupid to be able to save files within our own choice of folders.  They want all your personal stuff on their 'Cloud' to which MS have full access, and once you have more then a few megabites they will charge you increasing sums to 'upgrade' your storage capacity.  That is where MS see future profits developing from.   No doubt v10 makes it almost impossible to do any independent local filing.

Even my Wife's v7, if you just "save" it reports "file saved" with no hint of where MS have dumped it.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Martin [Admin] on May 27, 2016, 12:18:50 pm

They call all storage, the  Library since Windows 7, in the hope you don't notice wheather it's local or 'cloud'.
I don't do "cloud" storage, not even to a NAS box, always use old school backup drives.

( NB. You can easily deactivate the Libraries and go back to folders - http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/21462/how-to-enable-or-disable-the-libraries-feature-in-windows-7/ (http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/21462/how-to-enable-or-disable-the-libraries-feature-in-windows-7/) )
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Colin Bishop on May 27, 2016, 12:56:55 pm
I've never had any problems in specifying where I want to save my stuff in any versions of Windows, including W10.

I think that if you are going to use a PC then you do need to put a bit of effort into understanding how it works and organises itself. The alternative is of course to accept the inbuilt defaults which a lot of people do but they then give up their control of the beast!

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: grendel on May 27, 2016, 01:00:54 pm
I always save files to my data hard drive, so have to specify where it needs to go.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: U-33 on May 27, 2016, 01:02:23 pm
Same as that, Martin...I save my research material, photos, etc into a new folder in Downloads, and then keep a back up copy in a remote usb drive. That way if my computers crash, have hissy fits, or generally refuse to comply with my wishes, I have all my material on a separate drive. (been there, done that, lost a shedload of hard earned research material)


As for The Cloud...I don't understand it, and therefore I don't use it. If I can't touch it, feel it, or see it...it ain't there.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Bob K on May 27, 2016, 01:09:01 pm

I think that if you are going to use a PC then you do need to put a bit of effort into understanding how it works and organises itself. Colin

In Win 8.1 even "save as" only gives you options in their version of Cloud Library, it usually takes a lot of fiddling stepping back up to Drive "C" before you can start searching down for your own "Home" directory structure.  It is a pain, and designed to be, plus seems to get more awkward with every new release.  Going way back I could set a Home Directory which a Save As always started from. 
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: NFMike on May 27, 2016, 06:51:54 pm

Couple of good Apps out there to stop Windows 10 installing:

https://www.grc.com/never10.htm

http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/

The W10 nag reappeared in one of our PCs yesterday. I ran never10 on it and today the nag has disappeared, so it looks like it takes care of that too which saves a lot of fardling around  :-)
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: TheLongBuild on May 27, 2016, 07:00:10 pm
Been Running W10 since it came out, Other than the emicons issue I have had no others , really can no see what all the problems about.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Stavros on May 27, 2016, 07:05:08 pm
Well said Larry.......I am a complete computer numpty and havnt had a single problem with it except the emicons on this site....If I want them to work Ill use firefox...but to be perfectly onest with you who cares they don't work as far to many are used everywhere


Dave
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: malcolmfrary on May 27, 2016, 09:20:00 pm
A very few people will need to stick with earlier versions because they have rare/custom software that they need for whatever reason that will simply neither load nor run on W10.  Some will have computers that are simply not compatible (like basic netbooks).
W10+chrome test  ;D  .  From a rather basic Toshiba from Argos.


If your data has not got at least two backup copies where you can physically get your hands on it, you didn't really care about it.  Risking being contentious, anybody putting their faith in the cloud for continuous access, reliability and security deserves everything that will happen to them.
When updating to W10 I took care to avoid every one of the "wonderful extras".  Some unavoidable extras yielded to the advice on howtogeeks.  I do keep system clones of my C drive just in case.  Having the sense to have such clones of my previous systems in case I needed to revert has proved useful.  Reloading a system that way is a great deal faster than letting it happen the "official" way.
But perhaps the last word should go to the man himself - http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/business/windows-was-just-a-nasty-trick-all-along-says-gates-20160526109129 - not to be read before the watershed time.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: craggle on May 28, 2016, 09:32:31 am
I use a CAD system called Catia V5 for work and I recently bought a tablet / laptop called a Microsoft surface pro 4. Off course this came with Windows 10 and when I contacted the Catia re-sellers we use, I was told no, Windows 10 won't run it, not supported, don't even try etc....

Well, I'm not one to give up so I had a go and yes, it wasn't easy to get it to work, had to change various folder permissions after installation, run it under compatibility mode, run as administrator etc. but it does now work perfectly!
I'm pretty convinced any software designed for earlier versions of Windows can be made to run if you have the time and know what you are doing.


Craig.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: tigertiger on May 28, 2016, 09:38:02 am
NB I believe MS Surface use Surface OS or Surface Pro OS not Win10, looks the same. And so it will run differently
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: imsinking on May 28, 2016, 10:25:29 am
Been Running W10 since it came out, Other than the emicons issue I have had no others , really can no see what all the problems about.


Your missing the point . . . . WINDOWS 10 IS/WAS BEING PLACED ON MY MACHINE WITHOUT MY PERMISSION . . . which I'm sure has happened to more folk than me . . . I stayed on it to try it & was going to roll back over the weekend . . . I NEVER GOT A CHANCE . . .all the passwords were screwed up, try as I might re entry wasn't possible . . . . I'm getting MAD again . . . . . <*< 
Bill
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Colin Bishop on May 28, 2016, 10:47:50 am
When I upgraded my PC which didn't have a local password the machine defaulted to my Microsoft account password - the online one you set up when you first register a new PC.

My laptop did have a local password and when I did the upgrade earlier this week it did keep the password.

There is a lot about upgrades and passwords if you Google it (not much use if you only have the one machine though!) and it seems that a lot of the problems are to do with the way in which the original copy of Windows was licenced.

I agree, it is all a bit of a shambles really.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: essex2visuvesi on May 28, 2016, 12:17:48 pm
This is why the uptake of Apple machines is on the increase.
For the majority of people who want a machine that "just works" then the Apple OS is ideal.  Granted there are issues when it comes to cost and software availability, but for the last few years their market share is increasing.

Linux and the related OSes are also seeing in increase in take up as well


Before anyone starts the "X os is the best" I'm not saying that everyone should move over, only that there are alternatives for those disillusioned with MS
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: tigertiger on May 28, 2016, 12:51:28 pm
I'm not saying that everyone should move over, only that there are alternatives for those disillusioned with MS


And that number of annoyed or disillusioned people is growing.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: DavieTait on May 28, 2016, 01:16:57 pm
I think this will be remembered as Microsofts "U2" moment ( you know when they put their new album on EVERY single iTunes device on the planet whether you wanted it or not... made a hell of a lot of people HATE U2 and Apple ) or their "Rattners" moment where things started to go downhill very quickly due to public mistrust.

They have played this very very badly and I for one will be going across to Linux Ubuntu on at least one of my old PC's next week to get used to how it works and if its fine I'll be doing that to my main PC as well.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: plastic on May 28, 2016, 01:45:34 pm
This is why the uptake of Apple machines is on the increase.
For the majority of people who want a machine that "just works" then the Apple OS is ideal.  Granted there are issues when it comes to cost and software availability, but for the last few years their market share is increasing.

Linux and the related OSes are also seeing in increase in take up as well


Before anyone starts the "X os is the best" I'm not saying that everyone should move over, only that there are alternatives for those disillusioned with MS

If Apple machines 'just work', why do they need so many tech/repair experts in their shops?
My experience of Apple is it 'only just works' and they break down a lot more often that their hefty price tag should allow. Then you're screwed - practically no help unless you want to open your wallet and assume the position.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: tigertiger on May 28, 2016, 02:21:42 pm
From what I can gather, it is not a software issue, Apple machines are more fragile. Then again, in most cases they are a lot lighter and slimmer than your average laptop, or notebook.


In fairness, smart phones and tablets also break, a lot.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Onetenor on May 28, 2016, 02:31:20 pm
It 's alright for all you clever fellahs but I'm an old duffer and can'' t do clever things on computers
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: roycv on May 28, 2016, 02:39:52 pm
Hi I use a Macbookpro and would not willingly go back to MS.  It has cost a bit to repair (I have a good repair guy in Hatfield) but now I have a fan cooler underneath it, I have no problems.  The graphics card gets very hot, or it used to. 

It is simple and works for me.  I look at a MS laptop and do not know where to start now, apart from how it turns off.
regards Roy
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: tigertiger on May 28, 2016, 04:36:02 pm
Heat might be less of a problem in future. More and more puters are going over to solid state memory SSD. This generates a lot less heat.


One of the problems with all super skinny computers is heat.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: meechingman on May 28, 2016, 10:56:58 pm
My son is an IT pro and with two minutes' googling and two minutes on the computer, we stopped Windows automatic updates and set it to show all available updates instead. We then deleted the Win 10 update from the list and also removed KB3035583 from already installed Windows updates. Problem solved - permanently. After the 'free' Windows 10 period is over (just watch them extend it, though!) we can set things back to automatic updates. In less than fifteen minutes we'd done all the PCs', two laptops and one of the servers, the other's using Linux.


As for Macs, each to their own and I won't re-ignite the 'which is better' feud debate.  :-)


However, I had a half share in a Macbook Pro with my son. No way would we have paid the full whack of £1400+ for it, we got it from a 'fire sale' for a third of that. It looks great, it feels great, but it's broken down twice, including an overheating HDD. Mac OS updates have screwed things up every time they've come out - some of my outboard gear stopped working, awaiting drivers that never appeared - and my son's reinstalled the OS on several occasions. I sold my share and went back to a Windows laptop - a refurbished top end HP Elitebook, It's built like a tank, runs faster than the Macbook and has a bigger screen of similar resolution and quality. The Windows 7 installation was legitimate (that's good for an ebay purchase), it had a 3 month warranty and it came complete with a full-spec docking station. As the station had a DVD drive, I didn't need the one that was in the laptop. So I swapped it out for an SSD and my total outlay was less than £350. I'm sticking with Win 7 and my Mac days are over. Lovely bits of kit, but just not right for me.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on May 28, 2016, 11:11:27 pm
Reply 59

"But perhaps the last word should go to the man himself - http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/business/windows-was-just-a-nasty-trick-all-along-says-gates-20160526109129 - not to be read before the watershed time."

Thank you Malcolm, %%  %%  {-)  {-)
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: meechingman on May 29, 2016, 09:09:09 am
@73
That's our British sense of humour for you! Some of the other Daily Mash stories are even better - and perhaps almost believable.....
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: U-33 on May 29, 2016, 09:14:44 am
Turned my laptop on this morning to find Windows 10 starting to load itself, despite me removing it yesterday ( I did try it, but my laptop didn't like it at all, so I removed it)


I have a real antique laptop which has Linux installed on it...I like Linux, nice and simple to use, and it works...but is it possible to download it and install it onto this laptop (an HP running W8.1) without doing any damage?
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: warspite on May 29, 2016, 01:28:29 pm
You need to remove KB3035583 - this is the installer for win 10, I am trying to find the thread of a web site that allows a program to run in one instance that removes all the bits that removes win 10 installing etc - highly recommended, but you have to try and remember the kb reference number because it will be a important update to trick people into installing the pesky blighter.

If you go to your windows update icon in the start area - then select windows update - look for whats been installed and then scroll down if its been grouped or just look for kb3035583 at the end of the Microsoft update, then uninstall it, I ran the program and it removed any gwx references and then a couple of days ago it installed kb 3035583 as an important update, because I had forgot to switch auto download off - duh.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: NFMike on May 29, 2016, 01:55:21 pm
I've removed KB3035583 from our computers several times, and hidden the update when it immediately adds itself to the list, but this is not a permanent cure, even though it should be. After a few months it reappears in the notification area - presumably MS have some means to force it in.
However, per post #56 earlier the "never10" utility appears to remove it automatically, for how long remains to be seen, so I'd recommend using that over the much more laborious manual method.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: warspite on May 29, 2016, 08:29:42 pm
I agree - it is just that knowing what to look for is as good as well, especially if the pc wont let the program run as intended, after a BBQ I can now look for the link.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: warspite on May 29, 2016, 08:50:30 pm
KB2952664 is another to remove - another that nags you to download GWX.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Saving for later
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on July 20, 2016, 04:57:38 am

What is the verdict/comments on this,

https://askleo.com/saving-free-windows-10-upgrade-later/?awt_l=J72BJ&awt_m=IjMaHHoHF3dfbL

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Bob K on July 20, 2016, 07:06:53 am
Just nine more days until I (hopefully) will no longer be constantly pestered by Microsoft attempts to rebuild my computer.  Why would I want to?  It works fine, but may not do so if I click "Oh, go on then, make my day".
Microsoft say 10 is "better" without any real specifics on how.  They say it may be "faster", but I have no problems with how 8.1 runs.  Lots of conflicting reports on several rival MS browser options, but insufficiently developed to still retain IE10 as one of the main options.  I see absolutely no valid reason to risk messing up my desktop for a bunch of vague hypes that appear to offer nothing for what I use my computer for.   >>:-(
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: warspite on July 20, 2016, 07:50:05 am
I run win 7, had to completely reinstall lately, so its improved its speed and operational abilities, though MS's browser is starting to annoy me with its jerkiness, I think MS are just trying to make people switch, to control the revenues they hope to generate from pay on demand services. so I wont ever be updating to the latest offering, i'll switch to another OS before then.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: craggle on July 20, 2016, 08:11:49 am
Always amazed at the people that won't try new things.
I've installed it on all my computers, had no problems, no charges for anything, They do run faster and all software I use still works fine.
I really like it.


Craig.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Martin [Admin] on July 20, 2016, 11:35:56 am
 
Personally; 
Windows 10 is 100% better than 8 or 8.1
Windows 10 will be very unfamiliar for Windows XP or 7 users  but it is faster.
Windows 10 does a LOT of stuff in the background that you have no or very little control of, updates, 'bloatware', push ads, etc.

I will be cloning my OS drive and updating to 10, just to get the free licence but sticking with Windows 7 for now.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Bob K on July 20, 2016, 01:53:43 pm
Question:  Microsoft says it's "better", and more importantly now so does our Martin.

So, what exactly is "better", or even different from 8.1.  What can it do that I cannot do now.

With 8.1 the worst aspects were [1] making it look and feel like a mobile phone (hated that but managed to get the proper desktop back), and [2] a grim determination by MS to force you to only save in their "cloud" (for which they can charge a lot extra if you do put all you data on it).  It is much more longwinded to save on disk, where I have 3 separate levels of local backup.  ie: Go to Drive C then work my way down folder by folder to my desired home directory.

I have a sneaky suspicion that after the 29th MS may do something to destabilise customer PC's who refuse to change over.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Martin [Admin] on July 20, 2016, 03:21:34 pm
 
Hi Bob,

Windows 8 / 8.1 was always designed around a "touch interface" screen, Microsoft call that one too early!
Windows 10 install checks if you have a touch screen, if not it automatically disables all that stuff.
Also of the 'back office' stuff, control panel, drivers, apps, updates are much more logical in 10 than 8.1.

So:
[1] It's much better now, more 'like' Windows 7
[2] Cloud, OneDrive, OutLook, etc. can all be completely disabled in 10
[3] You can bring up Windows Explorer 'File Explorer' to work same way as normal - like I do! - You can even turn off Libraries!


No, I don't know what going to happen after July 29 either but personally, I do think windows 10 is worth a punt!
Not trying to sell it to you Bob but I've found the Win 10 interface to be everything that 8.1 wasn't!
Anyway, you will have 30 days to roll back to 8.1 afterwards if you hate it.... but do give it a chance for a week.   :-)

Do a data  backup 1st!

M
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: essex2visuvesi on July 20, 2016, 03:50:44 pm


Do a data  backup 1st!

M


2nd and 3rd
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Netleyned on July 20, 2016, 04:36:55 pm
My impression of 10 is that, whereas in the past,
the 'extras' had to be ticked to activate, now it seems
everything is thete and needs ticks to deactivate the
extras.
Otherwise, I am happy up to a point.


Ned
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: malcolmfrary on July 20, 2016, 05:11:07 pm
Mix in with the data back up the sensible idea of cloning the win 7 or 8 operating system disk, where all of your programs live as well (don't they?)  as well as the separate disk with important data files. 
I like that the vast majority of what I have learnt over the years regarding working with Windows still applies to W10, as opposed to the stupidity of W8 and its toytown screen, so virtually no learning curve.  I visited a site called http://www.howtogeek.com/227827/windows-10-is-great-except-for-the-parts-that-are-terrible/ (http://www.howtogeek.com/227827/windows-10-is-great-except-for-the-parts-that-are-terrible/) which, after exploring the site a little, let me get rid of most of the annoyances.  You do have to go several steps further than just ticking a box to eliminate the dumbware, but I found it worth the minor effort.
I still find it a good idea to keep a check on the state of the updates if only to ensure that I can turn off my netbook when I want it to turn off instead of it telling me hat an update is in progress.
I had one program that didn't want to work under W10, but it was not that vital since I found a free alternative.  Obviously, if it was a mission critical program, it would have been a deal breaker, but it wasn't.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: warspite on July 20, 2016, 09:40:37 pm
On a web browser this morning  - after I had posted here, the revenues for win 10 were better than expected was the title of the subject.
Me - I know win 10 is a cash cow, you cannot buy a standalone copy of office anymore it's pay per month (as my son found out), £8 is a bit much for me, businesses would find this a problem if they became cash strapped at any time and then go under. Can you guarantee that the cloud is absolutely secure - I don't think so, if you ran a company where you were a technologically advanced and the US government wanted it - who is to say they don't get through to there friends at MS in the interest of national security, and gone is your interlectual property, just a thought, as for win 10, its going to be the default option in a few years when they disable all the abilities of the old OS's as they take over, you wont be able to use the internet as the browser that is available will be not compatible, especially when they buy out the competition and shut them down or make them more problematic.

The machines are taking over - oh oh a T 1000 has just appeared in the back ya...
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: NFMike on July 20, 2016, 10:49:05 pm
When I first tried W10 about a year ago I found that by the time I'd killed off the flagship MS applications that I had no interest in (Edge, OneDrive, Cortana) I was pretty much left with W7, but with a less pleasant/familiar interface. So what was the point? (I rolled back.)

More recently I wondered about the speed thing, so I cleaned up a W7 laptop we have, but don't use much, by removing all the games and similar software, used CCleaner, made sure it was defragged and then ran a test boot from cold to time until it was (really) ready to use - ie. when all the services and stuff have started and not that half life situation where you can 'use' it, but it's a dog. Result: 2 mins 40 secs.
Then I let W10 install, ran through all the reboots, updates, etc till it was a steady install. Reran the cold boot test: 2 mins 30 secs.
Faster - yes. Worth the bother - no.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: TheLongBuild on July 20, 2016, 11:09:46 pm
Windows 10 is fine...
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Kipper on July 20, 2016, 11:14:59 pm

Me - I know win 10 is a cash cow, you cannot buy a standalone copy of office anymore it's pay per month (as my son found out), £8 is a bit much for me

If you have a 'hard copy' of your old Win.7, you can take MS Office 2007 from there & shoehorn it in, it works perfect in Win.10, I have all my databases & Excel spreadsheets working.  :-))
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: TheLongBuild on July 20, 2016, 11:21:39 pm
Likewise running office 2010, no probs.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Peter Fitness on July 20, 2016, 11:38:47 pm
I finally gave in and updated to W10 from 8.1. The install went well, and I quite like the look of the new OS. However, since upgrading my computer will unexpectedly hang, and the only way to bring it back is by turning it off with the power button, and restarting. I Googled the symptoms and it seems that this is not uncommon. It was recommended that I run MyTurboPC which I did. It removed a lot of rubbish that I wasn't using, but the hanging problem still exists. Has anyone else experienced this?


Peter.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Martin [Admin] on July 20, 2016, 11:39:45 pm
 
How old is the hardware?
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: derekwarner on July 21, 2016, 12:25:14 am
Folks...........I do not intend to enter the debate about Win10, suffice to say both of my machines run Win7 for their foreseeable life :-))

The issue I have is Cloud repositories 8) ....a few years back my ADOBE .pdf to .doc converter yearly software subscription was located on my C drive

This year when providing $25.00 subscription I end up with a Licence that allows me to send .pdf documents to the Cloud & they near instantly return as mirror image documents however in editable .docx text

Now I am sure the Cloud repositories is not really interested in a 5 year Contract Licence between a Not for Profit model Train Society and it's Local Council, however to comply with Council....that is what I had to do....convert it from a .pdf document, to a .docx editable document, add our text of agreement, stamp the document with our Official Co-corporation Seal, sign it....rescan it and convert it back to a .pdf and e-mail it away

Thank goodness we were not talking about the password or access combination to a Bank Account  >>:-(

Derek

MB...the image below is me converting the Council document prior  to adding the text & signatures & stamp......

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: imsinking on July 21, 2016, 11:05:05 am

How old is the hardware?




It doesn't matter Martin , the fact that it's been 'IMPOSED' on everybody is surely the issue ?
It cost me £200 to recover my computer from the mess Win 10 left , lost two years data (you cant 'uninstal' the backup win 7 files 45 GIG of them >>:-(  without the microsoft installer & they make sure you can't get that so it's a drive format .
I was willing to give Win 10 a trial & wind back if I wasn't happy , never got that far. . .  all my passwords were scrambled, I couldn't access the comp'. . . PERIOD (the next day) even with a bootable CD.
 I was tight on drive space & couldn't leave it there . . .
Bill  %%  I'm GETTING MAD AGAIN . . . .
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: kinmel on July 21, 2016, 11:19:26 am
That is why you never start a new O.S. install until you have taken a image of the drive's existing installation.  Windows 7 has the necessary software pre-installed.

Then when it goes wrong, you simply restore from the image and everything is exactly as it was before.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: imsinking on July 21, 2016, 11:33:51 am
That is why you never start a new O.S. install until you have taken a image of the drive's existing installation.  Windows 7 has the necessary software pre-installed.

Then when it goes wrong, you simply restore from the image and everything is exactly as it was before.


NEVER my intention to do Win 10 , I'd been blocking it for weeks, they changed the 'reject' alternative to 'go ahead ' and instal . . without telling anybody.
For all you pro 10er's what are you going to do if you need to do a fresh instal or repair ? NO DISK . . .
 I'd gone out back to make a brew & a 'jimmy' when I came back it was installing Win 10  <:( 
never had a chance to do anything, was wrong footed . . . .
Bill
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: kinmel on July 21, 2016, 11:59:36 am

 what are you going to do if you need to do a fresh instal or repair ? NO DISK . . .
 

Use the Media Creation Tool to make a bootable Win 10 installer as an ISO, or on DVD, or USB stick

https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows10
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: imsinking on July 21, 2016, 12:51:39 pm
Use the Media Creation Tool to make a bootable Win 10 installer as an ISO, or on DVD, or USB stick

https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows10 (https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/software-download/windows10)


All you HAPPY 10'ers make a note !
Bill
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: malcolmfrary on July 21, 2016, 01:26:20 pm
Quote
It doesn't matter Martin , the fact that it's been 'IMPOSED' on everybody is surely the issue ?[/size]It cost me £200 to recover my computer from the mess Win 10 left , lost two years data (you cant 'uninstal' the backup win 7 files 45 GIG of them (http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/Smileys/Tug/tickedoff.gif)>:-(" title="Tickoff" class="smiley" style="vertical-align: bottom; font-family: Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: x-small; line-height: 14px;">  without the microsoft installer & they make sure you can't get that so it's a drive format .I was willing to give Win 10 a trial & wind back if I wasn't happy , never got that far. . .  all my passwords were scrambled, I couldn't access the comp'. . . PERIOD (the next day) even with a bootable CD. I was tight on drive space & couldn't leave it there . . .Bill    I'm GETTING MAD AGAIN . . . .[/size][/font]


NEVER my intention to do Win 10 , I'd been blocking it for weeks, they changed the 'reject' alternative to 'go ahead ' and instal . . without telling anybody.
For all you pro 10er's what are you going to do if you need to do a fresh instal or repair ? NO DISK . . .
 I'd gone out back to make a brew & a 'jimmy' when I came back it was installing Win 10  <:( 
never had a chance to do anything, was wrong footed . . . .
Bill
This is why, for the last several years, I have advocated using PCs sensibly - the top basic requirement is using one of the many system cloning softwares to make a reloadable copy of the system disc ON ANOTHER HARD DRIVE.  That way, no matter what, there is always a way back to the day that the copy was made.  This works for many eventualities including most irretrievable virus problems, a dead hard drive and having the wrong OS. 
Reinstallation on my systems has taken about a half hour (after fitting the new drive or whatever), afterwards the system, settings, and programs are all as they were.  Obviously any recent data stored on the c: drive is lost, but important data should never be stored there.  Ever.  No matter what the software vendors think by putting all of their defaults on there.
If items of any data do not have any physically separate back up copies, then the brutal truth is that they were not really wanted, no matter what the immediate feeling might be just after their loss.  There was an old saying "Don't put all your eggs in one basket".

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Peter Fitness on July 21, 2016, 11:53:58 pm
Martin, my hardware is a 3 year old Sony Vaio laptop with a CORE i7 chip at 2.20 Ghz, 4 GB RAM and a 64 bit OS. According to Microsoft it's capable of supporting W10, but they would say that wouldn't they? %)


Peter.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Colin Bishop on July 22, 2016, 12:14:52 am
My main HP PC had some initial problems with W10 but it does seem to have settled down now. My older Toshiba laptop appears to be perfectly happy with it at the moment and is working better than with W7.

Microsoft are continually moving closer to a rental model where you don't buy the operating system you simply have it on a licence which allows them to do whatever they like with it. (and to you)

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Peter Fitness on July 22, 2016, 12:17:32 am

Microsoft are continually moving closer to a rental model where you don't buy the operating system you simply have it on a licence which allows them to do whatever they like with it. (and to you)

Colin


That sounds scary!


Peter.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: Kipper on July 22, 2016, 12:52:13 am

Microsoft are continually moving closer to a rental model where you don't buy the operating system you simply have it on a licence

Colin

That is already the case, when you purchase a Windows OS disc (I have a Win.7 disc), you are not purchasing the op system, you are only buying the 'license' to use it. If you have bought a Windows O.S. disc, check the small print that came with it.  ;)
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: derekwarner on July 22, 2016, 02:43:07 am
This is quite true Kipper with the Microsoft OS disk.......however you have purchased a licence to use the system for the life of your computer

In January 2015, for my secretary role, I purchased Microsoft Publisher retail disk, installed it on my main machine ....all OK..........tried to install it on my upstairs Ultrabook & the message was  :police: <*< >>:-(........I had exceeded concurrent installations

A little swift talking  :kiss: :kiss: to a MS Representative somewhere in the Sub Continent ....I was required to let her log on to my main machine to check the validity of the Publisher install....she then kindly gave me a code to install Publisher on my upstairs Ultrabook

The fine print is 1 Disk for 1 software program = installation is available for 1 computer only & for the life of the machine

I am sure that Colin is talking about purchasing typically an MS Cloud hosted Office 365 suite of applications, however the purchase is for subscription for 1 year only.............

In Australia in say 2000, a licenced copy of MS Office Pro was approx. $480.00, in 2005 I needed a licenced copy of MS Access 2003 as Access in Office 2005 was not totally backwards compatible with 2003  %%

I understand the QuickBooks suite of accounting software is now by 1 yearly subscription only......

Thank goodness I have retired..................Derek



Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: tigertiger on July 22, 2016, 03:30:06 am
This may have been mentioned somewhere above.


I have just noticed
On my messages to update now, it says that for Win7, you notes Win7 SP1.
If your Win7 does not have Service Pack 1, then that is why some of you may be having problems converting. I think that there are also hardware requirements that might affect older machines.




Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: derekwarner on July 22, 2016, 03:54:08 am
Morning TT.............

When Win7 was upgraded to Win7 SP1....machines post the revision/upgrade were shipped as Win7 SP1

The only way users of Win7 did not automatically receive the SPI upgrade/download would have been if they chose to BAR all recommended MS upgrades

There is a setting in the Win7 OS, where you can choose to view all MS upgrades prior to installation .....you will see they come as distinctly in 2 options

1 = recommended
2 = optional

Derek  ;)
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: malcolmfrary on July 22, 2016, 09:55:03 am
When I "did" my Vista machine it involved getting a download and license for Win 7.  After this was loaded, it spent a lot of time doing updates, including, eventually, SP1.  Shortly after that it wanted to do the W10 update (as was the original intention).  The only problem encountered was the wifi adaptor - it couldn't update over wifi so I used a temporary network cable.  After the update, and running Driver Booster, the entire thing has become boring - it just sits there and works.
Unless somebody else is paying for it or there is a need for some obscure corner of the overly bloated package, I cant see the need for a private individual to use MS Office when Libre Office is free and does the exact same job.  Often better if you look at the mess that MS Office often makes of page formatting.
I do like my elderly Publisher 2002 because by now I am getting used to it.  Replacing it would be painful.
I have avoided all of the cloud based options because I have the deep belief that anybody, or more particularly any business, that relies implicitly on the cloud deserves all the trouble that they will experience when their connection doesn't work.  Look up "BT down" for the last couple of days.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: essex2visuvesi on July 22, 2016, 10:11:47 am
this is a much faster way to get updates if you have multiple Windows machines in a household


http://download.wsusoffline.net/


set it up on a large capacity USB stick or external hard drive
You then run the application which then downloads ALL the updates for the chosen OS (Win XP, Vista, 7, 8, 8.1 & 10 are all supported as well as most versions of MS orofice)


you then connect it to the required PC and run the update program, select you updates and away you go
Quite often it is much faster than running them directly through Windows update.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: derekwarner on July 22, 2016, 10:35:36 am
Well Malcolm........individuals sometimes need to use proprietary software and in multiple locations....the distance is immaterial

MS Access files in V2003 were saved with an .mdb extension.......V2005 files were also saved as .mdb extensions, however V2005 was not 100% backwards compatible with V2003.....we found this when incorporating SAP R3 software & superimposing over SAP R2 operating systems

I do assure that Libre Office does not read MS Access .mdb files and have the facility to perform design revision or query reporting.............

Robustness of software is the critical issue & that is why a number of World Military systems still use & depend on Microsoft XP operating systems

Microsoft does not support the XP operating system for every day customers, but sure does for Uncle Sam..............Derek

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: U-33 on July 22, 2016, 06:09:09 pm
Where's that Martin? I want a word with you, Martin...  >>:-(


I took your advice and installed W10 yesterday (second time...) from then on in, it all went downhill rapidly. Four attempts to boot my laptop up, when it eventually did fire up it was so slow...time to put a brew on whilst waiting for Mayhem to open up. Screen was ever so dark, really needed a torch to read anything...and did I mention it was slow in operation?


Half the programmes were having hissy fits and not playing properly...I lost my favourite game of chess...and did I mention how slow it was?


Just gone back to W8.1...I'd prefer W7, but you can't have everything.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: DavieTait on July 22, 2016, 06:09:49 pm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-36854909 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-36854909)

Looks like Microsoft could be in a lot of trouble on the continent due to the excessive amount of YOUR data they are taking off your PC's
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: U-33 on July 22, 2016, 06:10:46 pm
mutter mutter...  >>:-(
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: imsinking on July 22, 2016, 09:08:43 pm
Every sympathy Rich . . .
We should get some T Shirts printed . . . .
" HAVE YOU BEEN SCREWED BY MICROSOFT LATELY ."
& on the back . . . .
"YOU'VE JUST JOINED THE CLUB."
over half the Win 10 "upgrades" will be successful , what about the rest of us ?
In American parlance. . . we can just SWIVEL ON IT ?
Bill  <*<  (where's me pills . . . )
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Let's be careful out there!
Post by: kinmel on July 22, 2016, 10:22:47 pm
Amongst experts El Reg has a fairly high reputation, here is their take upon a Windows 10 upgrade, warts and all....

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/07/22/time_is_running_out_for_free_windows_10_upgrade_should_you_do_it/
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: tigertiger on July 23, 2016, 08:34:12 am
A good article.
Thanks for posting.  :-))
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on July 23, 2016, 08:56:08 am
The only thing wrong with the "experts" is the fact that in the main they are Microsoft certified (as is my Guru) and it is in their interest's that we all switch/stay with Microsoft. Simply because it keeps them in a job, they are experts capable to handle MS issues.

Much like your new car dealership and specialised tools.

However there are some experts who are prepared to tell it as it is.

Bottom line, most existing computers cannot handle WIN10 and if you are running WIN7 stick with it. At the end of the WIN7 support time, you will need a new PC and it will come with WIN10.

By then, WIN10 will have been fully developed etc etc.

Another criteria is the slow take up of WIN10. Forget the exact figure, but MS estimated they would have X million WIN10 users by the end of the free update. Current take up is nowhere near their target.

Yes, I am staying with WIN7 Pro.

My other PC is still running XP Pro.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Colin Bishop on July 23, 2016, 10:44:29 am
I don't think it is correct to say that most existing computers cannot handle W10, I suspect that the majority do so but obviously those people who experience problems will understandably complain about it. Of course Microsoft have behaved badly by forcing the upgrade in the way they have.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: essex2visuvesi on July 23, 2016, 10:59:37 am
Something from my old Pub days:-
A happy customer tells no-one, an unhappy customer tells 10
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: imsinking on July 23, 2016, 11:20:23 am
I don't think it is correct to say that most existing computers cannot handle W10, I suspect that the majority do so but obviously those people who experience problems will understandably complain about it. Of course Microsoft have behaved badly by forcing the upgrade in the way they have.

Colin


Quite right in everything your saying , I build my own computers , the latest Motherboards /CPU's are well capable of Win 10 . . . BUT if your using older MOBO's / hardware / software, it may  clash / crash somewhere & every computer WILL be different in it's setup , possible conflict there too . . .
Strong rumours that there's a lot of Commercial users that have took a hiding with this 'upgrade' let's hope they have the b@lls and the clout to go after Microsoft & teach them a lesson  :-)) [size=78%].[/size]
Bill
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: warspite on July 23, 2016, 12:45:42 pm
And every one forgets its MS's way to Monopolise the revenues by having you pay yearly/monthly, for what is essentially their software (you only lease it), it also helps the hardware partners as the software will only work on their newer machines - so it means more revenue when the tech needs updating as well. do you think I am cynical.  %)
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Colin Bishop on July 23, 2016, 01:04:42 pm
Well, these people are in business to make money so you can't blame them for trying - they just overstep the mark too much and too often. But tecchies often don't live in the real world. They think that because they are enthusiastic about some 'improvement' you will be too and don't understand when you find it a damn nuisance. It's a bit like nipping into a supermarket for something and continually find that they've changed all the shelves around so you can't go straight to what you came for.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: TheLongBuild on July 23, 2016, 07:33:50 pm
I don't think it is correct to say that most existing computers cannot handle W10, I suspect that the majority do so but obviously those people who experience problems will understandably complain about it. Of course Microsoft have behaved badly by forcing the upgrade in the way they have.

Colin

Agree, I built mine in 2006 so ten years old, running a Pent D Quad core, no probs other than emicon issue has run xp,w7,w8,w8.1 and w10  all fine and Dandy.. 

Struggles more with the fact that VM keep upgrading my speed, on 220 broad band now and had to upgrade the internet thingy in the pC
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: TheLongBuild on July 26, 2016, 03:31:15 pm
For all you W10 Haters, baton down the hatches !!!   The Anniversary Update ios Coming :-)


http://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/technology/windows-10%E2%80%99s-anniversary-update-is-just-what-everyday-users-need/ar-BBuRyXN?li=BBiaL6p&ocid=spartandhp
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: kinmel on July 26, 2016, 04:01:48 pm
For all you W10 Haters, baton down the hatches !!!   The Anniversary Update ios Coming :-)


http://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/technology/windows-10%E2%80%99s-anniversary-update-is-just-what-everyday-users-need/ar-BBuRyXN?li=BBiaL6p&ocid=spartandhp (http://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/technology/windows-10%E2%80%99s-anniversary-update-is-just-what-everyday-users-need/ar-BBuRyXN?li=BBiaL6p&ocid=spartandhp)

Such a great write-up. Pity my desktop PC doesn't have a camera, nor a touch screen and certainly not Cortana reports which reports everything you say back to Microsoft's servers.

Bound to be impartial, after all MSN is one of Microsoft's oldest subsiduaries.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Bob K on July 26, 2016, 06:15:54 pm
For all you W10 Haters, baton down the hatches !!!   The Anniversary Update ios Coming :-)

So for those of us that don't have Windows on a mobile phone or camera + pen enabled lap-pad, is there anything genuinely usable / useful that Windows 10 can do that 8.1 can't?   IMO mobile phones are only useful for phone calls and texting.  The last thing I want is a desktop PC converted into a mobile phone look alike.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: TheLongBuild on July 26, 2016, 06:45:26 pm
   IMO mobile phones are only useful for phone calls and texting. 

Why is there an app to use your phone as a phone ?, how strange..  I mean what about Pokémon !!!
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Bob K on July 26, 2016, 07:23:50 pm
...  I mean what about Pokémon !!!

If Windows 10 has Pokémon Go then I give up, . . .
I am going back to a real abacus and painting cave walls with wode.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: kinmel on July 30, 2016, 10:05:29 pm
The official "Free" Windows 10 upgrade offer finished on 29th July and from now on you will have to pay to upgrade to Windows 10.

However if you use " assistive technologies" to use your computer then the free Windows 10 upgrade is still available on this new site... https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/accessibility/windows10upgrade. It is the standard Windows 10 installation media.

Microsoft doesn't define what assistance you need, nor ask for proof, you just click the confirm button and complete the installation.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: derekwarner on July 30, 2016, 10:39:25 pm
Yes...in OZ, [0700 : 31/7/2016] that little Windows 10 installation Icon that Microsoft planted/attached to the bottom toolbar is has vanished  :-))..... Derek  O0
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: imsinking on July 31, 2016, 08:50:13 am
Yes...in OZ, [0700 : 31/7/2016] that little Windows 10 installation Icon that Microsoft planted/attached to the bottom toolbar is has vanished  :-)) ..... Derek  O0


To quote from the TERMINATOR . . . .
" I'LL BE BACK"
I don't think Microsoft will leave the thousands of potential suckers clients with it already on their machines alone . . .
Bill  >>:-(
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on July 31, 2016, 08:52:41 am
 :o :o :o

Interesting eh what.

After all the hype about verifying genuine windows installations and all the dramas thereto, you can now still get the "free" download.

So what's up doc, not enough suckers have taken the bait????????

Some things up.

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: malcolmfrary on July 31, 2016, 11:16:53 am
The download might be available and free just now, but does it authenticate and register without crossing their palm with silver?
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: kinmel on July 31, 2016, 01:01:58 pm
The download might be available and free just now, but does it authenticate and register without crossing their palm with silver?

Yes, I updated two systems this morning and it was exactly the same experience as before.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: TheLongBuild on July 31, 2016, 04:54:45 pm
W10 in the lead..

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: imsinking on August 01, 2016, 01:09:51 am
Hmmm . . .


Bill  >>:-(
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on August 01, 2016, 04:24:53 am
W10 in the lead..

With those WIN10 figures, no wonder Microsoft is worried.
Looks like Win 10 Bombed out.

What next???
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: imsinking on August 01, 2016, 10:37:10 am
 %%  Didn't think I'd get away with MY INTERPRETATION of Mr Gates . . . {-)
 shows the moderators are on the ball  :police:   
Bill  :-X
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Martin [Admin] on August 01, 2016, 10:42:11 am
%%  Didn't think I'd get away with MY INTERPRETATION of Mr Gates . . . {-)
 shows the moderators are on the ball  :police:   
Bill  :-X

                         :police:    ok2
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: U-33 on August 01, 2016, 11:19:35 am
Well, I've tried twice with W10 on my laptop, and despite assurances from MS that my pc is fine, and will accept W10 without a problem, it's awful.
It slows the pc down so much it's virtually unusable (that's after a few false starts when booting up in the morning), Cortana and I have argued several times, but I think I confused her (it?) by telling her (it?) to go have sex whilst travelling...  %)


I've gone back to W8.1 now, and there I shall stay. (unless I can find a way of downloading W7....)
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Martin [Admin] on August 01, 2016, 11:25:07 am
 
A couple of false starts with my own PC but went on more smoothly than I expected.
My main (administrator)  didn't transfer correctly but this seems to be a common problem.
Created a new Admin account and all sorted now.

I've found my own PC to be Much Faster now!   :-)


Did a 'Tablet' at work, 24 minutes start to finish!

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: derekwarner on August 01, 2016, 11:40:03 am
Evening Rich......I am just watching & reading this O0 and all OK in W7 :-))

However would not like to think of anything to do with a W10 [engine] having a sexual liaison in the back of Cortina which I thought was a 4 cylinder Ford product....

Derek
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on August 01, 2016, 12:24:31 pm

They were also available as a 3.3 litre six O0 O0

WIN7 Pro going fine.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Beware!
Post by: Bob K on August 01, 2016, 01:28:27 pm
Did another 3 independent levels of backup as the 29th approached. 
Just as well.  It seems an unanswered "upgrade" prompt took it as authority to dump Win 10 on me anyway. 
Well, the 3 year old desktop PC still works (gasps of relief) and has even retained my Desktop icons.

I thought at least I may be able to set my Home Directory instead of the dreaded OneDrive cloud nonsense that makes it so difficult to save files where I want them.  Hours of Googling provided tons 'how to' info, but unfortunately must all be based on earlier versions of Win 10 because those menu options do not exist on mine.

OK, so absolutely no advantages whatsoever, or speed improvement.  I will have to replace my printer and Bluetooth devices so not a "free" upgrade.  However MS now get to monitor everything I do and pass it on to advertisers for profit.

Impressed?    NO WAY.   All been downhill since XP
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Grumpy Dave on August 01, 2016, 10:06:18 pm
I loaded W10 a couple of days ago. It was slow. emails were 4+ hrs behind my smartphone. It was slow. I hated it so I reset W7. Now I have to reset all my forum logins. But it's good to have7 back. My 14yr old g'son says 10 is great but says it can be rubbish if you have an old machine running 7, cheeky little s*d just because he has built his own PC. Mine does what I want. Double Grumpy Dave.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Onetenor on August 01, 2016, 10:54:26 pm
So far no probs with 10 this time except it turns comp off if left too long instead of hibernating and I have to reboot
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: derekwarner on August 01, 2016, 11:05:34 pm
Way back......my faithful XP  :kiss: machine died  <:(

Mr Smarty Pants sales manager @ Harvey Norman said no worries this new VISTA is beaut  :-)) for my price budget
Parted with $1499.00...went home & set it up :o
Returned to Harvey Norman 2 days later & told Mr Smarty Pants ....I had a few issues >>:-(

Hewlett Packard  4L = no drivers
QuickBooks Accounting = not compatible....[but I needed to complete the Taxation Office quarterly BAS Report in 3 days]
Telstra Bigpond = no technical support for 4 weeks
Various Technical Packages = not compatible

Mr Smarty Pants didn't believe me until he telephoned Hewlett Packard Australia, Quicken Accounting Sydney & finally Telstra

Walked away with a new XP machine with a price tag of $2149.00 [last of the expensive range] at no extra cost O0

This [buffoonery] by Mr Gates has left an indelible mark on my brain & never to be repeated

Derek

BTW Arty........I thing the Pommie Cortinas were 4 potters only.....probably surplus engines left over from Prefects and Anglias  {-)

Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Peter Fitness on August 01, 2016, 11:16:33 pm
Quite right Derek, the 6 cylinder Cortinas were only built in Australia.


I'm still having problems with W10 causing my computer to freeze unexpectedly. I told my wife that, based on my experience, there was no way she should upgrade her laptop from W7.



Peter.
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: g6swj on August 02, 2016, 07:31:11 am
Interesting that third parties begin to remove support...

Quote
This is a reminder that on August 29, 2016 Dropbox will be ending support for Windows XP, making Windows Vista the minimum supported Windows version

To balance the story if only a little I have been running Windows 10 on a laptop and PC for 7 months and not one glitch - they are both used many hours a day to pay the mortgage (for work) with a range of software from MS Office, web design, graphics software, database management, programming languages etc etc - so there are some good news stories out there...

Regards
Jonathan
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: kinmel on August 02, 2016, 08:26:55 pm
The Anniversary update became available today through Windows update, so I ran check for updates and downloaded it.

All 5 machines here updated without a hitch
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: TheLongBuild on August 02, 2016, 09:01:57 pm
With those WIN10 figures, no wonder Microsoft is worried.
Looks like Win 10 Bombed out.

What next???

28 % is not that bad really with all the other MS combining to 26.6, seems to be a lot of resistance from the W7 at 14.2 %
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Grumpy Dave on August 02, 2016, 10:08:01 pm
Windows 7 probably does everything that most people want and does it with no fuss most of the time.
Title: Re: Windows 10 - Yes or No?
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on August 03, 2016, 06:26:53 am

28 % is not that bad really with all the other MS combining to 26.6, seems to be a lot of resistance from the W7 at 14.2 %  :o :o :o ??????????????????????????????????????

This I think reflects the true statistics for WIN10, over 47% is still WIN7 O0 O0 O0

https://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10&qpcustomd=0

In descending order

WIN7

WIN10

XP

However, at the end of the day you can make statistics say anything.

Title: Re: Windows 10 - Yes or No?
Post by: g6swj on August 03, 2016, 07:45:08 am
"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."

Quote
https://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-share.aspx?qprid=10&qpcustomd=0

I wonder how truly representative these figures are - have a look at how they collect their statistical info.

Any body visited one of these on-demand networks? - I haven't so they aren't counting my suite of PC's in varying guises....

Jonathan

Title: Re: Windows 10 - Yes or No?
Post by: Bob K on August 03, 2016, 12:15:38 pm
Just installed the 'end of 1st year' W10 update.  Took about 1/2 hour.  No major problems.
Again, no real differences from 8.1, or any faster.  Perhaps I may get fewer Norton's Security warnings on both MS Browsers.  Kodak printer 'driver loaded' with W10 update, but still not working.  Called Kodak tech support who kindly took it apart and reinstalled all the printer s/w.  At last, I can print and scan again.

So, just about where I was before the W10 hit me, and the desktop is working.  I will probably dump Cortana as that seems aimed for camera / mic tablets and mobiles.  I may also dump Edge as it is not as versatile as IE11.

Well, it performs the function, although XP was far more user friendly and versatile. 
Title: Re: Windows 10 update - Go for it it!
Post by: Kipper on August 03, 2016, 12:17:10 pm
So far no probs with 10 this time except it turns comp off if left too long instead of hibernating and I have to reboot

You can alter that if you go to 'settings>system>power & sleep', I have mine set to 'never' for screen & sleep, it's not done a switch off on me with those settings.  :-)
Title: Re: Windows 10 - Yes or No?
Post by: craggle on August 03, 2016, 12:51:31 pm
You can ditch Norton now and speed up the machine even more.
Windows 10 has it's own built in anti virus, anti malware, spyware etc. tool called Windows Defender. It's all I have ever used and never had any problems. It will jump into action once other anti virus software is removed.
Best of all it's completely free.

Craig.
Title: Re: Windows 10 - Yes or No?
Post by: Bob K on August 03, 2016, 03:03:13 pm
Sorry, but MS have never been that good at catching the vulnerabilities that they themselves have built in, plus any antivirus will have similar run-time overheads in performance.  I would not recommend Windows Defender as a sole safety net, although better than nothing.

The best independently rated antivirus systems are Symantec (Norton), Bitdefender, and Kaspersky.
Remember nothing is completely 100% so careful online practice is essential.

Also note that these are all antivirus.  You will also need a good anti-malware program too.  eg: Malwarebytes.
Title: Re: Windows 10 - Yes or No?
Post by: Martin [Admin] on August 03, 2016, 04:26:25 pm
 
Anyone know how to delay / extend the 'sign in' screen time?
Title: Re: Windows 10 - Yes or No?
Post by: Jonty on September 07, 2016, 11:35:03 am
  And has anyone worked out how to get rid of the Taskbar from the bottom of the screen? I know all about "Auto-hide", but that only works if you Restart, and then until some app (is that what we are supposed to call software now?) annoys it and it pops up again.
Title: Re: Windows 10 - Yes or No?
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on September 07, 2016, 11:57:38 am
  And has anyone worked out how to get rid of the Taskbar from the bottom of the screen? I know all about "Auto-hide", but that only works if you Restart, and then until some app (is that what we are supposed to call software now?) annoys it and it pops up again.
Recall seeing something, didn't take a  lot of notice because am not using WIN10, that apps and software are not one and the same????
The more knowledgeable can no doubt explain it.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: C-3PO on September 07, 2016, 01:50:50 pm
Quote
To completely hide the taskbar

In order to completely hide the taskbar, we need to go for third-party tools. While there are many tools around, Taskbar Hider is one of the better tools out there for this job.

Taskbar Hider allows you assign a keyboard shortcut to hide or show the taskbar, so that you can hide or unhide the taskbar in a second. While using it, make sure to check the option labelled Load at Windows Startup

C-3PO
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: malcolmfrary on September 07, 2016, 04:04:59 pm
My taskbar (set to auto hide) vanishes until the mouse comes into its area.  If not wanted at that time, a depart and quick return vanishes the taskbar and lets the mouse do what is wanted in that area.


"Apps" used to be application programs limited to smartphones, and some sources define them as self contained programs designed for a specific purpose.  The term has spread out to cover pretty much anything software related, probably for the benefit of those who cannot spell "program".  They are never "self contained", they always use a lot of resources from elsewhere.  For instance, a small spreadsheet to work out scale details could be called an "app", but clicking it just wakes up the spreadsheet module in the office suite which is run through windows which is a handy way of using the computers operating system.  Or a chunk of system in a mainframe computer at some unstated part of the world if it is a computer that runs all of its functions through an internet connection.
It has become a fairly meaningless catch all to help management and marketing to feel that they are effective in a technical world.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Jonty on September 07, 2016, 10:01:11 pm
  Thanks, C-3PO. I'll give it a try. Pity Microsoft can't be bothered to sort it out.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BrianB6 on September 07, 2016, 11:27:14 pm
American spelling again   >>:-(
Programme  O0 in English
Even if the spell checker on here does not like it.  <:(
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Colin Bishop on September 07, 2016, 11:41:35 pm
No Brian, program is correct in a computing context. Programmes are when listening to the Archers!

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: TheLongBuild on September 08, 2016, 12:48:45 am
My Understanding that in the UK " Programme "  is in fact correct for Both , as In Colins example and Computer Software, However it is accepted that in General Computer Talk that the US version " Program is the adopted version.

Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Martin [Admin] on September 08, 2016, 07:33:58 am
No Brian, program is correct in a computing context. Programmes are when listening to the Archers!

Colin

Why the difference?    {:-{
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: TheLongBuild on September 08, 2016, 08:01:35 am
Why is there to, too and two.
it makes sense to me that there is a programme and program as is related to Different things and computer software, Programs were not around when the first word was introduced so makes sense to me to have a new word.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Martin [Admin] on September 08, 2016, 08:26:01 am
 
I was wondering if it's Greek & Latin or French .... or something....
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Colin Bishop on September 08, 2016, 08:30:33 am
Yes, as Larry says, this is a case where using the US spelling makes things clearer. Computer program can only mean  (in the UK at least!) a set of instructions to make a computer work whereas computer programme could mean a roll out of i-Pads in a school or an update of an online banking system.

Language is always evolving, thus the French have adopted 'Le Weekend'. (which some people think covers the rest of the week as well!)

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Colin Bishop on September 08, 2016, 09:17:39 am
Just Amellican Martin, they love getting rid of unnecessary letters.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BrianB6 on September 08, 2016, 10:04:39 am
I agree with Professor Higgins
"The Americans have not spoken English for years"
Nor been able to spell it
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Kipper on September 08, 2016, 10:43:19 am
It's a good job King George didn't put a tax on the English language (like he did on tea), or the Americans would probably be speaking Italian or Russian.  :}
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BarryM on September 24, 2016, 01:44:34 pm
I can't be the only one who found Windows 10 performing a massive update this week lasting half-an-hour and more, that has changed the layout of menus, exchanged left clicks for right and introduced new opportunities for the system to freeze?

Barry M
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: malcolmfrary on September 24, 2016, 02:32:47 pm
The only downside that I have noticed so far has been the unwanted reappearance of OneDrive.  I don't know what other unwanted rubbish M$ have decided to re-inflict.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Netleyned on September 24, 2016, 02:52:53 pm
The one drive pop-up is annoying, can it be killed.
It's also moved the toolbar from bottom to side >>:-(


Ned
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Netleyned on September 24, 2016, 02:55:29 pm
Just Amellican Martin, they love getting rid of unnecessary letters.

Colin


That's why Cafe becomes Diner  %%


Ned
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: HawkEye on September 24, 2016, 08:54:24 pm
Just in case Windoze is missing a few snippets of your private data  Microsoft has the answer -

A new Microsoft patent reveals company’s bigger plans for data acquisition and improved search results. The tech giant is planning to watch everything you do and sync it between different apps to bring you quicker and better search results.

http://wccftech.com/microsoft-just-got-another-reason-to-watch-everything-you-do/

Simple Answer?, I think so, Linux for the last three years, never looked back.

(http://i.cubeupload.com/Nnq1hM.jpg)
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Colin Bishop on September 24, 2016, 09:36:07 pm
My PC has just decided to do the major update too. At the moment i haven't spotted any changes but no doubt they will become apparent in due course.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: malcolmfrary on September 24, 2016, 10:21:11 pm
The one drive pop-up is annoying, can it be killed.
It's also moved the toolbar from bottom to side >>:-(


Ned
I had killed OneDrive - it reappeared after the update.  The update probably took longer because the Seattle S&1theads thought that it was in some way needed.  If I was smoking the same stuff as them, I might think it was a good idea as well.
The moving of the toolbar is likely something else - it should be possible to click on it and drag it to where it belongs (had it happen by accident a long time ago on an XP box)
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: TheLongBuild on September 24, 2016, 10:46:15 pm
Had the update on both laptop and pc, all as it should be...W10 Rocks ..
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on September 25, 2016, 12:13:38 am
Reported in the press,

Some guy was doing a visual presentation with his WIN10 laptop.

When Win10 started to do an update onscreen which took an hour.

All attempts to prevent the update failed. Lecture abandoned.

A not very happy lecturer contacted MS and voiced his displeasure.

Remedy, it is possible to schedule updates at a more convenient time.  %% %%

Good luck
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BarryM on September 25, 2016, 08:33:43 am
In my case - and others? - there was no warning of an update: it just happened.

To access 'shut down/restart' I now need to right-click on the Windows logo instead of left-click as previous. A very minor irritation but what is the point?

BM
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: imsinking on September 25, 2016, 09:14:17 am
 %)   :P  Are we seeing the rise of OMNI CORP ? (Robocop)  O0


Bill
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BarryM on September 25, 2016, 09:39:06 am
Having heard this morning that many postings on twitter are generated by 'bots', I suspect you're right.

B M
PS. The update hasn't given me back the ability to add smileys on this Forum.......
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: TheLongBuild on September 25, 2016, 09:52:06 am
In my case - and others? - there was no warning of an update: it just happened.

To access 'shut down/restart' I now need to right-click on the Windows logo instead of left-click as previous. A very minor irritation but what is the point?

BM
still right click on mine
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Netleyned on September 25, 2016, 10:29:07 am
The taskbar can be moved in settings.
Choose Top, bottom, left or right.
It must have been moved during the update.


Ned
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: warspite on September 25, 2016, 11:21:59 am
The button switching is probably one of the left handed programers getting his own back, or due to a concensus in their office that it is a better way of doing it, or a new fad or just like the supermarkets - 'lets move things about so that people don't get into a routine' attitude. will stick with win 7, at least they can't change things without my permission, omnicorp - who do you think omnicorp is based on - MS <*<
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on September 25, 2016, 12:17:07 pm

Big brother, AKA Win10, is here. O0 O0
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: C-3PO on September 25, 2016, 12:31:53 pm
In Windows 10 you can select (configure) the Primary Mouse Button to either left of right.  Settings >>Devices >.Mouse and trackpad.

So you can change it back to how it used to be...

Normally a clean install would set "primary mouse button" to "left" - would be interested to know if the has switched after an update

Regards
C-3PO



Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BarryM on September 25, 2016, 12:52:45 pm
It's only the action of shutting down that now needs a right-click! Everything else retains its pre-update right or left setting. Thus, changing the primary mouse button would only confuse matters further.

Those whom the gods wish to drive mad they first visit with Microsoft....

Barry M
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: NFMike on September 25, 2016, 01:36:15 pm
It's only the action of shutting down that now needs a right-click!
Our W10 laptop is packed away at present, so not got this update yet to check.
Is this change now a shortcut instead of left clicking, then finding/clicking the Power menu, then clicking the Shutdown/Sleep? In which case it's a good thing surely.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Martin [Admin] on September 25, 2016, 01:36:34 pm
I can't be the only one who found Windows 10 performing a massive update this week lasting half-an-hour and more, that has changed the layout of menus, exchanged left clicks for right and introduced new opportunities for the system to freeze?

Barry M

 It's the Anniversary update - comes down as Feature update:   https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows/features


How to Disable OneDrive Everywhere in Windows and Apps Completely

    Press Win + R keyboard accelerator to open Run dialog box.
    Type GPedit.msc and hit Enter or OK to open Local Group Policy Editor.
    Navigate to Local Computer Policy -> Computer Configuration -> Administrative
    Templates -> Windows Components -> OneDrive.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Martin [Admin] on September 25, 2016, 01:42:37 pm
 
NB: Had my first Win 10 crash last week! I totally destroyed my boot partition.

       Partly my own fault I guess, Win 10 creates 4 (four!) partitions when it installs.... DO NOT MESS AROUND WITH THESE PARTITIONS or their Locations.
       One of them is the System recovery partition.....  and I had deleted mine to get disk space back...   

                         
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: C-3PO on September 25, 2016, 02:53:18 pm
The right/left click mouse switching I think must be Windows 10, version 1607 - mine is only 29% downloaded so I'll await the fun!

Thanks for the heads up...

Regards
C-3PO
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Bob K on September 25, 2016, 03:19:44 pm


How to Disable OneDrive Everywhere in Windows and Apps Completely

    Press Win + R keyboard accelerator to open Run dialog box.
    Type GPedit.msc and hit Enter or OK to open Local Group Policy Editor.


Tried that (I hate OneDrive ) however says "GPedit.msc does not exist". 
Saving files is a real pain when you have to navigate all the way from Drive_C to get to what I have as my home directory.    Must be different versions of Win 10 ?
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Netleyned on September 25, 2016, 03:27:31 pm
Our W10 laptop is packed away at present, so not got this update yet to check.
Is this change now a shortcut instead of left clicking, then finding/clicking the Power menu, then clicking the Shutdown/Sleep? In which case it's a good thing surely.


It is the same procedure as before with a right click to start it >>:-(


Ned
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Bob K on September 25, 2016, 03:41:04 pm
GPedit.msc only exists in the Win 10 Pro and Enterprise editions, but does not exist in the Home Edition.  Apparently Windows says this can only be accessed via the Registry direct - not recommended for home users.

OK, turning off the annoying OneDrive is effectively disabled for home users  >>:-(  <*<
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Kipper on September 25, 2016, 05:13:29 pm
Barry, if you L/click the windows logo, it opens the panel just as it did before, only now it has an extra column, the power button is directly above the Windows logo when this panel opens.

This now means you can use either mouse button to turn the power off.  :-)) (http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y21/deltic13/Power_zpsexpzukyb.jpg)
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BarryM on September 25, 2016, 05:31:30 pm
Kipper - Thank you, you're right and I now have two ways to shut down.  Why is ait all made unnecessarily complex by duplicating everything? My brain cell can only take so much before it wanders off in the direction of a beer.

BM

C-3PO - It is Version 1607
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: grendel on September 25, 2016, 07:31:31 pm
I never let my machine acutivate one drive, and it doesnt even try, actually I think when it offered to help me set it up and create a login I hit cancel.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: malcolmfrary on September 25, 2016, 07:42:45 pm
How to Geeks have a way to kill OneDrive at http://www.howtogeek.com/225973/how-to-disable-onedrive-and-remove-it-from-file-explorer-on-windows-10/ which worked just fine.  Unfortunately the latest update put it back, taking a long time to do it.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Martin [Admin] on September 25, 2016, 08:35:24 pm
 
Beat me to it, I was just going to post that link!
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: TheLongBuild on September 25, 2016, 08:56:51 pm
I have only ever used the left click on the mouse ,  on the windows icon to shut down the PC  since I installed it shortly after it was launched ?.?? Nothing has changed !!
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: U-33 on September 26, 2016, 10:58:43 am
W10 completely stuffed my laptop, but on my nice shiny new Microsoft/Lumina 650 phone it works perfectly. Not the slightest glitch...spot on.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Netleyned on September 26, 2016, 11:37:49 am
I have only ever used the left click on the mouse ,  on the windows icon to shut down the PC  since I installed it shortly after it was launched ?.?? Nothing has changed !!


Yep  :-))
Mine works on left click as well as right.


Ned
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: C-3PO on September 26, 2016, 12:08:43 pm
There appears to be a case of comparing apples with oranges! ( waiting for the crack re Apples ! ) - Unless we are all comparing the same version of W10 there are likely to be differences.

You can type Winver in the search box which displays a pop up box - I think the latest version is Windows 10, version 1607


I am not on the latest version hence not seeing the changes mentioned so cannot relate to them yet....
C-3PO
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Netleyned on September 26, 2016, 12:25:31 pm
My version is 1607.


Ned
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: derekwarner on September 26, 2016, 12:57:25 pm
Goodness this is beginning to sound like the actual life span of the original Magna Carta  %)...[the system of laws of operating]

Did the 1215 version not last for less than a year before it was replaced by a revised 1216 edition from those learned men? {-)

Did any of the common folk ask for this revision? or was it forced upon them by those  <*< in power?

Derek
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: petermun on September 26, 2016, 02:18:47 pm
Derek, I`m old, but not that old, so can`t help you I`m afraid.   Pete
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Bob K on September 26, 2016, 03:00:35 pm
The importance of 1607  (which I appear to be on)

Jan 13th The Bank of Genoa fails after announcement of national bankruptcy in Spain.
Jan 19th San Agustin Church in Manila is officially completed; it is currently the oldest church in the Philippines
Jan 30th Massive flooding in England destroys around 200 square miles of coastline and results in approximately 2,000 casualties
Feb 24th Claudio Monteverdi's opera "Orfeo" premieres in Mantua
Apr 25th Battle at Gibraltar: Dutch fleet beats Spanish/Portuguese fleet
Apr 26th 1st English colony in American lands at Cape Henry, Virginia
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Netleyned on September 26, 2016, 04:46:00 pm
Sounds a bit like last night's 6 o'clock news %%


Ned
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BarryM on October 20, 2016, 09:32:43 am
Before I go outside with a revolver and one bullet, can anyone make a suggestion of where I am going wrong? - No references to my past life, please and keep it clean.
The PC is a 3.30GHz, 4GB, 64 bit, machine that was running Windows 7 before I loaded the free download of Windows 10. All was sweetness and light until instability and erratic operation of Edge crept in. I made all the usual checks for nasties and drew a blank then reset Edge which made no difference. Finally, having backed everything up, I decided to reset Widows 10. The process started OK and then went downhill. Suffice to say it hung-up and then sulked and nothing I could do would achieve a reset.
Going into the Boot process, I selected the option to restore the factory settings and got back a stable Windows 7.  I then downloaded the MS media creation tool and started to reload Windows 10. Downloading was completed, verification followed and then the system moved onto 'Checking for updates'. 10 hours lqater it was still looking for updates. I went thorugh the procedure again and, again, it is still looking for updates. It seems I cannot terminate its search without prejudicing the restore process.
Any suggestions of where I go next? - Referring to the PC, that is?
Barry M
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: g6swj on October 20, 2016, 09:44:52 am
Hi Barry,

I have moved to Firefox as my default browser - like most things has taken time to adjust but I have come to like it's functionality more and more. Recently my Internet Explorer on W10 Build B1607 (Anniversary Edition) has begun to intermittently hang. Tried Edge for a matter on minutes before realising it wasn't for me.

No doubt a red herring but worth a try - disconnect PC  from access to internet, USB drives etc before starting the process - maybe it will then sense it can't get any updates and continue and complete install?

Not sure this makes sense but have a look at https://community.spiceworks.com/topic/1529086-windows-10-upgrade-stuck-at-checking-for-updates-0


Regards
Jonathan
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: imsinking on October 20, 2016, 10:04:28 am
Barry, all I can suggest is you go back in time and DON'T RELOAD WINDOWS 10 , for every 10 successful upgrades to 10 there will be 15 who's suffered a DISASTER . . . .Microsoft had the effrontery to install it without regard , every computer WILL BE DIFFERENT, they can't possibly know wether a machine will be a trouble free installation . . . >>:-( 
Bill 
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: g6swj on October 20, 2016, 10:35:15 am
Barry, all I can suggest is you go back in time and DON'T RELOAD WINDOWS 10 , for every 10 successful upgrades to 10 there will be 15 who's suffered a DISASTER . . . .Microsoft had the effrontery to install it without regard , every computer WILL BE DIFFERENT, they can't possibly know wether a machine will be a trouble free installation . . . >>:-( 
Bill 

60% of Windows 10 upgrades failed in disaster - really? - Is this fact or opinion?



Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Martin [Admin] on October 20, 2016, 11:02:32 am
Hi Barry,

No doubt a red herring but worth a try - disconnect PC  from access to internet, USB drives etc before starting the process - maybe it will then sense it can't get any updates and continue and complete install?

Regards
Jonathan

That is a very good idea!   :-))



Quote

60% of Windows 10 upgrades failed in disaster - really? - Is this fact or opinion?


I'm not a fan of the Win 10 update system, it still needs 'user intervention' in many cases but doesn't always tell you!
If you have fairly good internet, reboot after about an hour of inactivity.
Also, see if you manufacturer is offers a BIOS update for you Desktop / laptop / system board!

M

Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on October 20, 2016, 12:13:24 pm
60% of Windows 10 upgrades failed in disaster - really? - Is this fact or opinion?

What makes you think it I not fact. {:-{ {:-{

As a novice I looked far and wide, read the reviews, and am still with WIN7 Pro. That is fact, based on opinion. O0 O0
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: imsinking on October 20, 2016, 01:08:43 pm
60% of Windows 10 upgrades failed in disaster - really? - Is this fact or opinion?


It's a 100% failure as far as I'm concerned , 2 years of docs & pix lost, I'd been blocking the auto update for months (I didn't know about the 'Never 10' app' 'til later) all my data was on a separate SSD that was nearly full , & I was waiting the arrival of a bigger SSD . . . they changed the permissions pop up . . . . & I wasn't blocking it anymore , it self installed & put the reinstall Win 7 process files on my data SSD (45gb) & wiped out everything . . . . >>:-(   
Even tried to 'upgrade' the fresh install of Win 7 , I had 'never 10' by then , when I want it I'll buy it[size=78%] . . . .[/size]
[/size]

Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Colin Bishop on October 20, 2016, 01:21:33 pm
Where are your backups then? Don't tell me you didn't make any. Hard disks can fail at any time, they don't need help from Microsoft.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: g6swj on October 20, 2016, 01:35:56 pm
What makes you think it I not fact. {:-{ {:-{


RAAArtyGunner

What makes you think the statement (for every 10 ok another 15 fail) is 100% accurate for the state of all W10 upgrades in the world? Where is the evidence to back up such a specifc  statement. I have read many horror stories of failed upgrades - they tend to get the press as the adrenaline runs - not the case with the sucessfull upgrades that get no press.

I simply wanted clarification/evidence to support a very specific statement " for every 10 successful upgrades to 10 there will be 15 who's suffered a DISASTER"

So if the person making the statement had direct experience of these numbers then fair comment (worked in IT with direct experience of large scale upgrade programs/ a large organisation that had several 100's pc's and this 10/15 rate was proven ) - if you had one PC upgrade fail (although really painful) doesn't mean you can stretch things to make it fit your world. So without asking the question seeking clarification I could not digest the info given.

Now several months on from many Mayhem users converting to W10 it would be interesting to see what their current opinions are of W10  -  people who have actually used W10 rather than just read reviews.

So I'll go first - 10 months using W10 everyday for work on desktop and laptop (5-12 hours a day) - only issue experienced is Internet Explorer freezes sometimes  (this however could be due to my snail pace internet connection)

Top likes - power on time - <10 seconds

Regards
Jonathan

Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Kipper on October 20, 2016, 04:20:13 pm
I took the free upgrade from Win 7 pro, have used Win 10 ever since, but must state that Win 10 has thrown more hissy fits in 8 months, than my Win 7 did in its 18 months on my machine.
I also kicked 'Edge' into touch & use Firefox. I still have my 'hard copy' of Win. 7 Pro, so if Win. 10 does get too flaky, or wants to make me use an app other than MY preference, then 10 will be out & 7 reinstated.  :-))
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Bob K on October 20, 2016, 06:50:57 pm
Having followed the WIN10 upgrade thread/s on Mayhem, by a rough indication of successful to iffy upgrade experiences I would say that a ratio of 10 good to 15 dodgy issues seems about right.

For me it is no faster, even starting up.  Some of the new bits like Edge and the reintroduction of the non helpful paperclip are useless additions.  IE is slower, and keeps hanging up for no apparent reason.  Frankly I was expecting better, but it works, sort of.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: kinmel on October 20, 2016, 06:56:47 pm
Win 95, Win 98, Win Millennium, Win 2000, Win XP, Win 7 all had similar problems until they settled down.

Win98 had to wait for Win98SE before that was stable and Win XP was dreadful until SP 1 arrived.

According to MS, Win 10 activations have reached 340,000,000 units, so on the "facts" in this thread over 510million installs have failed !

I don't think so.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BarryM on October 20, 2016, 07:03:49 pm
Ahem, getting back to my original query and the solutions kindly suggested: I tried cutting the internet connection but checking for updates continued and after an hour I gave up. I also tried downloading KB3102810 but was flummoxed to find that although download was confirmed, no 'Run' or 'Save' buttons appeared and a search did not reveal where the download was - if it had in fact happened.  I tried downloading other Win 7 updates and the same thing happened. Is my Win 7 reload as stable and complete as I thought? Is it worth resetting to ex-factory condition again and repeating the whole process? 
When I terminated the Win 10 download attempts, I got the message that tidying up was in progress. Four hours later it was still tidying up..........
My patience and the supply of Doctor Skullsplitter's soothing lotion is getting low.
Regards,
Barry M
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: g6swj on October 20, 2016, 07:13:59 pm
Barry,
Seems like you may have hit an/the issue - if W7 is not accepting updates

Have a look in "control panel / Windows Updates / View update history"

Maybe this will shed some light on the status of updates

http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/24367-windows-update-view-update-history-details.html (http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/24367-windows-update-view-update-history-details.html)


I have just checked for KB3102810 to work you need to install this update first,  install Service Pack 1 for Windows 7  (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/976932)

I think you need to get your W7 updated 100% before you start W10 upgrade

Regards

Jonathan
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BarryM on October 20, 2016, 08:33:09 pm
Jonathon,
Service Pack 1 is not included in the list of downloaded updates. If I go to the MS website I find a) the pages are not loading completely and b) even if I click onto the SP1 link, I'm taken back to the top page. Round and round we go without ever landing on the right spot.
Perhaps the attempts to reload Win 10 have scrambled part of the system?  I'm going to see if I can reset Win 7 again. I may be gone some time.
Cheers,
Barry M
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Colin Bishop on October 20, 2016, 09:29:21 pm
Yes, you do have to install SP1 on W7 before updating to W10. It was in the original publicity when W10 first came out.

Colin
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: imsinking on October 21, 2016, 12:25:49 am
Where are your backups then? Don't tell me you didn't make any. Hard disks can fail at any time, they don't need help from Microsoft.

Colin


Been knocking computers together from secondhand parts since the '90's I've always used a second (or third) hard drive for the data , never had problems recovering after crashes thru my own stupidity or Microsofts , the external hard drives were in the realm of the monied . . .
This computer I'm on now is all brand new with SSD's , ( & a DVD recorder)it's been nearly 2 years trouble free on Win 7 Pro ( I BUY all the O S software I dont use pirate or copies) I know externals are way cheaper now , hard to change a habit , BUT I will convert the small SSD's to externals , enclosures are pocket money on E Bay , as I've said I will probably get Win 10 eventually ( why are there so many upgrades with 10 ? thought it was sorted . . . ) WHEN I'M READY .  >:-o
Bill
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on October 21, 2016, 01:36:22 am
Yes a good point about all the upgrades.

Recall the commentary with XP and all the fixes.

The commentary was, just release the product and repair it as you go, saves money and time by minimising research and development?????
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: BarryM on November 01, 2016, 09:36:33 am

As an update to my #231, my PC is now up and running courtesy of Sprint Computers of Livingston (unpaid plug). They reckoned that Win 7 needs at least 200 updates other than SP1 in order for Win 10 to download successfully.
I now have repair and recovery disks as well as automatic back-up and so, fingers crossed, the PC demons will be kept at bay for a while.
Regards and thanks to all those who offered help.
Barry M
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: roycv on December 09, 2016, 09:48:24 am
Hi all while this thread was on going earlier this year I was feeling smug with my MacBookPro all 17 inches of it.  Unfortunately this laptop has a weakness and overheats.  Already had 2 repairs and last month the lights went out, literally, and so I looked at a replacement.  The cost of a new Apple was ridiculous for my needs and so I went elsewhere.
I now have an HP15 Envy, looks and feels just like my MacBookPro runs on Widows 10 which I am picking up on.
big troubles transferring back up data from disc and went to local Computer company who did a great job for not a lot, and sold me a nice DVD player.
I made the mistake here of reading the instructions and installing the disc driver s/w, which did not work.  I do not know why?
I rang the company expecting to take everything into them, but they had put in remote access s/w.  So the fix happened at home, to get things going I was told to insert a disc and I used the current British Railway Modelling monthly free disc .  Turned out 2 of the guys there were interested in model railways but had not mentioned it before!
All going well just sorting out my filing system.
regards to all,
Roy
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Martin [Admin] on December 09, 2016, 11:40:38 am
 
Seems Santa has arrived early for you this year Roy!   :-))
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Peter Fitness on December 09, 2016, 09:49:04 pm
I am finding W10 quite good, although since upgrading from 8.1 my laptop froze randomly, which was most annoying. I took it to my local computer repair shop and the boys there soon sorted it out for me. The owner suggested to me that the laptop would benefit greatly by replacing the HDD with a SSD (solid state drive), which gives very much faster disc access times and can greatly improve the performance of the computer. Has anyone had any experience with this type of drive? Martin, you're the computer geek %)  what do you know about them? They are dearer per Gb of storage space than HDDs but, unlike HDDs, have no moving parts.


Peter.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 09, 2016, 09:58:49 pm
I have a SSD in my old XP Pro machine and it is visibly faster than conventional HD drives.

For example when running "clean up" and other utility software you can literally see the quickness of the operation being performed.

Also understand that defragging of SSD's is not necessary.

Only reason haven't got a SSD in this Windows 7 Pro machine is, I don't have the disc to reinstall Windows.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: grendel on December 09, 2016, 10:07:32 pm
Raaarty, if you connect the second hard drive temporarily via a usb link, you can clone your existing hard drive to the new ssd one, you then have your old hard drive as the backup. I have a usb hot swap box that I use for this - or get cheap hard drive enclosure of the right type.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: meechingman on December 09, 2016, 10:11:16 pm
Definitely put in an SSD! Benefits? I sold my half share in a rather temperamental MacBook Pro to my son, and spent the money on a refurbished HP Elitebook. Not slim and elegant like the Macbook but performs better! As it came with a 'free' docking station that had a DVD drive, I put in an 250GB SSD to replace the HDD and moved that into the space created by removing the DVD drive.


I now have an even speedier laptop than before, starts up from cold in between 10 and 15 seconds. Things like Photoshop and Lightroom load up in a flash and anything that's drive intensive, like Hauptwerk (a virtual pipe organ that loads all its pipes into RAM before you can play a note) is way, way faster than before.


I was so impressed, I got another drive and put that in as the main drive in this PC, with Win 7 installed (I've already had my say about why I'm not upgrading until software or drivers force me to), leaving the previous HDDs still there, one of them running an entirely separate XP installation with all my music and recording apps on it. When I upgrade again, I'll go SSD all-round.


Any downsides? I've heard reports of them failing. "Avoid Seagate", someone told me - too late, I already had two and, touch wood, have had no issues with either. My son's had a couple of SSDs fail but he 'thrashes' his computers for heavy gaming and photography. The SSDs in our servers (we're really wired up here - son looks after servers for a living!) are all fine too! In any case I back up all my data to an external HDD regularly (as we all do, don't we?) so if the worst were to happen, I'd only lose a day or two's data.


So I'd say "Go for it!"
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: RAAArtyGunner on December 09, 2016, 10:32:39 pm
Raaarty, if you connect the second hard drive temporarily via a usb link, you can clone your existing hard drive to the new ssd one, you then have your old hard drive as the backup. I have a usb hot swap box that I use for this - or get cheap hard drive enclosure of the right type.

Grendel,

Thank you.
Simple, should be able to manage that.
Have a couple of SATA hard drive enclosures I use for backup.  :-)) :-))
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Peter Fitness on December 10, 2016, 09:04:46 pm
Thanks for the info, I think I will go for a SSD. My laptop is over 3 years old but has a Core i7 chip, and my repair man told me with a SSD it would be as good, if not better, than many new machines.


The only HDDs I've ever had fail were Seagates, so I tend to avoid them now. All five of my external HDDs are Western Digital (WD), and I've not yet had any problems.


Peter.
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: Shipmate60 on December 10, 2016, 09:15:59 pm
I have a SSD in mine just for windows.
It boots up in less that 60 secs.


Bob
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: roycv on December 10, 2016, 11:59:28 pm
Further to my reply (236) when I was having my problems with my MacBookPro the guy doing the repairs said they were re-furbishing 15 inch MBP's about 4 /5 years old and were removing the hard drive replacing with 256Gbite SSD and a much bigger RAM. The improvement also reduced the heat inside the laptop.
So there were no moving parts apart from the cooling fans.  However at £850+ I did not think it a viable proposition.  When demonstrated the speed was very fast but I reckoned they were half way through their life at this stage and declined the offer. 
Another factor was the Apple apparent rules of declining to fix or supply spares for laptops over 4 years old.  This is what I was told (in the Apple store) when I had the first breakdown on my laptop which was then 6 years old.
regards Roy
Title: Re: Windows 10 !
Post by: TheLongBuild on January 02, 2017, 09:07:32 pm

The Emoji problem seems to have been sorted as can now use across the forums  :} :} :} :} :} 8) 8) 8) 8) :police: :police: :police: