Model Boat Mayhem

The Shipyard ( Dry Dock ): Builds & Questions => Pleasure boats, Sports, Race, Power and Leisure Boats: => Topic started by: Capt Podge on October 13, 2017, 11:13:56 pm

Title: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 13, 2017, 11:13:56 pm
Whilst wondering what to build next - I've got quite a lot of plans stored away - got a call from a relative who has had this Fairey Huntsman withering away in the loft for X number of years. The upshot of this is that, rather than allow it to disappear altogether, he asked if I could take it off his hands, otherwise it would be taken to the tip.

Well, being one of those people who hates to see things get thrown away, I agreed to "have a go" at restoring it.

The boat measures 34" so I think it must be a Huntsman 31 model. Whoever built it originally fitted it out with an IC engine but that was removed before my in-law got it.

I knew, as soon as I saw it, I was in for some serious reworking.
In this 1st photo the boat looks ok but, once the lid came off, I cringed at the thought of stripping this hull down...in fact, the upperwork more or less crumbled away - the wood was spongy with dampness. I can only assume that a lack of drying out after sailing contributed to this?

However, with the hull being fibreglass, the boat is still salvageable...

photo 1: the boat as received
photo 2: what was left inside
photo 3: the deck ripped off and various components removed
photo 4, 5, 6 & 7: some of the "gunge" to be dealt with...
photo 8: a start made - it has taken 4 workshop sessions just to get this far and, oh boy, my finger ends are stinging!


Well, any progress is better than no progress.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: canabus on October 14, 2017, 08:43:49 am
Hi Capt Podge

I am into the same boat!!!
In your case replacing the frame would be the way to go and making frame 1 to the bow a sealed area.
Mine had the combing for the whole cabin to fit down onto, but, none at the bow and stern.
I add these to slow water off the deck.
As with yours I removed the IC motor and remounted a brushless motor, also filled in the exhaust outlet.
The cabin on mine is a bit of a pigs ear at present(working on that), the windows are all to be replaced.
At present I am veneering the deck.
If you require help I have some good info and plans that will help you out.

Canabus
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 14, 2017, 12:10:28 pm
If you require help I have some good info and plans that will help you out.

Canabus

Thank you Canabus, that is good news - I don't have the plans for this boat, I'm just winging it for now, although I've picked out a number of photographs of the real thing for guidance.
My intention is to install twin props and rudders and will attempt to keep the angle of the shafts as narrow as possible. I've got a couple of brushed 540 motors to install when I get to that stage.

I managed to save a few bits of the cabin and will use these as templates to make up a new one. If all goes well, I'm going to attempt to make the cabin as a plug to make a fibreglass mould.
I have never tried making anything in fibreglass so it will be a new experience for me.

Hope to get a bit more done this coming week.
Also, I'll be keeping an eye on your build and hopefully picking up some tips along the way.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: canabus on October 14, 2017, 01:47:02 pm
Hi Capt Podge
If you email me I can help with plans.

Canabus
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: canabus on October 14, 2017, 01:53:26 pm
Hi Capt Podge

A link to my Build!!
http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,58525.0.html (http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,58525.0.html)
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: nemesis on October 14, 2017, 04:29:02 pm
Hi Ray, you can work miracles with resin and glassfibre, got a gallon in the shed plus gel if you need it. bill
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Davo on October 14, 2017, 07:09:08 pm
A true Salvage Team job you have there. Back in the 1970s I did make the small Huntsman for a friend powered by around about a 3.5cc glow engine. It handled superbly due I think to the deep V hull.
The fibre glass version you have seems to have a relatively flat bottom to the transom (photo angle perhaps?) so possibly someone may have made their own design based on the Huntsman.
Picture below from another build on the Forum.
David
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 14, 2017, 10:17:29 pm
Hi Capt Podge
If ewe email me I can help with plans.

Canabus

Hi Canabus - PM sent. :-)

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 14, 2017, 10:18:51 pm
Hi Ray, you can work miracles with resin and glassfibre, got a gallon in the shed plus gel if you need it. bill

Thank you Bill - probably see you at the lake tomorrow ?

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 14, 2017, 10:23:00 pm
A true Salvage Team job you have there. Back in the 1970s I did make the small Huntsman for a friend powered by around about a 3.5cc glow engine. It handled superbly due I think to the deep V hull.
The fibre glass version you have seems to have a relatively flat bottom to the transom (photo angle perhaps?) so possibly someone may have made their own design based on the Huntsman.
Picture below from another build on the Forum.
David

Hi David, my hull is definitely shallow compared to the one in your photo - just read the build log by Canabus, looks like we're both working the same hull anyway, so that will be useful. :-)

Regards,

Ray.


Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 20, 2017, 08:07:21 pm
Just a little update on hull preparation - there's really precious little to show for the amount of time and effort spent over the last week however, I know the effort will be worth it in the end - anyway, managed to remove the 2 bulkheads, the motor bed and the prop-tube...
the last photo shows a horrible gaping hole where the prop-tube was finally twisted free of the hull - this hole will be filled later with P40, along with the other smaller holes where running gear was removed.

Note: Finger ends are too sore to do anymore rubbing down tonight, hope to get a little more done over the next few days.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Davo on October 20, 2017, 08:28:17 pm
The hull looks a better V section in these photos. Should have a good boat eventually. When fitting the prop shaft you can just use masking tape as 'shuttering' around the tube externally and lay up gel and glass mat on the inside. same for any holes. The fibre glass will not stick to the sticky side of the tape. This will leave minimal external filling required. Beware the damp weather as it may send the gel off during curing if outside.
David
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 20, 2017, 08:45:51 pm
Beware the damp weather as it may send the gel off during curing if outside.
David

Yes, and there's plenty of that about. >:-o

Prop wise, I'm leaning toward twin tubes as opposed to single, but the final decision has yet to be made.
Whichever way I go I will be using brushed motors, initially at least - see how they perform.

...oh, and thanks for the glassing info. :-))

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Davo on October 20, 2017, 09:06:37 pm
I think people have found that with deep V hulls, such as the Huntsman range, one prop will end up in the air, or severely cavitating at least, when turning. You would also need contra rotating props. I think keeping a single propeller as far back from the transom, as angles/prop dia will allow, would be useful. And perhaps a shortish (vertically) rudder to help reduce sideways lift when turning. I am sure others on here have some tried and tested set ups.
Most accept rudders as supplied as being the finished item but, if brass, they are easily cut about and modified. A leading edge forward of the stem is maybe not always needed. Perhaps a good topic for an article on rudder design by those who know. I have some laminated in ply and sanded to a nice rudder profile. Not sure it makes much difference but they look nice on display!
The multi prop boats for air sea rescue and fast MTBs etc all had relatively flat transom hard chine hulls built for planing and not displacement running. And I guess in the real world boats would not heel as much as out model counterparts do.
Looks like some busy evenings ahead!
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on October 20, 2017, 09:13:45 pm
The rudder is quite a distance from the rear isn't it. Does this have any effect on how the boat turns i.e. make it more twitchy?

Most boats and plans I've seen tend to have the rudder close to the stern. 

I'm interested in this because I've been working/setting out how much room is required for the positioning of the motor, couplings and prop shaft. Obviously having the rudder right at the stern  gives more space and allows the angle of the prop shaft to be as low as possible.


Edit: I see from the posts made as I was writing that the intention is to possibly change the number and/or position of the prop shaft anyway. From my workings out the prop shaft and motor takes up quite a bit of room to maintain a low angle and so by default means the rudder and prop will be very near the stern. I've been thinking about what affect the position of the rudder has on the boat turning, particularly at higher speeds.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 20, 2017, 09:26:33 pm
For me, it'll be a case of trial and error. My initial thought was to have shallow angle twin props and twin rudders set as near to the stern as possible. Having never built this type of model it will be interesting to say the least.
What I'm not looking for is something that will compete with modern fast electrics - just a bit of planing while running a leisure craft.

All input is welcome and hopefully a successful outcome sometime in the months ahead. As usual, I'm in no hurry...

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Davo on October 20, 2017, 09:48:33 pm
I have been digging through a book called High-Speed Small Craft by Peter Ducane which deals with the science behind the design of real MTBs etc. In one section is says the rudder can be near the rear of a hull but needs to be under it; ie not externally mounted on the transom. Rudders on the transom needing anti-cavitation plates. In all cases the prop is fairly close to the rudder. The idea I guess is to turn the thrust of the propeller whilst it is not too turbulent. Too far away from the prop and the water is less 'clean' leading to less effective rudder control.  The leading edge of the rudder That part in front of the rudder stem) partially helps take the load off the servo but there is a ratio of thrust being allowed straight out for forward speed, and a percentage being used to turn the boat. The book also advocates a deeper rudder to induce heel for turning; so reducing the depth could be seen as a way of reducing heel when turning.
However, in all areas of modelling, science does not always conveniently scale down and trial and error is the order of the day.
The Peter Du Cane story is an interesting one. In the 1920s he took on and beat the American power boats with their multiple engines using quite small but well designed boats. Designs that he would later develop into the ASR boats and MTBs. To halt his winning streak the Americans kept changing rules(!)
David
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 20, 2017, 09:58:38 pm
That would make a very interesting read David, thanks for pointing it out.

I'll pop into our local library to see if they can get one - looking on Amazon, it is a very expensive book. :o

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Davo on October 20, 2017, 10:16:56 pm
I paid 15 for mine about 20 years ago. The section on rudders is interesting. In plan the profile is not as an aeroplane wing but has its widest section in the centre. Interestingly the trailing edge can be bluff (flat).
Putting High Speed Boat Rudder Design in Google and selecting images throws up some info.
I have often noted people using two connecting rods between the servo and rudder horn; sometimes in models that clearly do not need it. Unless they work in a true rhombus fashion the result is not good; and I have seen some like that. I always use a ball joint connection rather than just crank a rod through a hole.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on October 20, 2017, 10:23:39 pm
David and Ray.

Interesting stuff and puts my mind at rest. Funnily enough I was concerned how close the prop is going to be to the rudder and thought that further away would be better.

Forgot to say, I'm about to start building a Swordsman at 33" so a similar sized boat. The Aerokits plans I've based my design on show a 35mm (at the top) x 45mm deep which is what I'm going to use.

As said, too deep a rudder can cause problems with the stern lifting on turns.

All good stuff, Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Davo on October 20, 2017, 10:36:05 pm
I got my references a little confused above. It was Hubert Scott-Paine who also developed high speed boats in circa 1914 progressing on to Miss England I and Miss Britain III in the 1920s. This becoming the first single engine boat to reach 100mph. And eventually founding the British Power Boat Company that developed the high speed rescue launches. See Fast Boat and Flying Boats, another interesting read.
I shall certainly be looking a bit closer at my rudders from now on.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on November 03, 2017, 09:27:43 pm
It's been a couple of weeks now and a little progress has been made.

Attention was turned to the outside of the hull and all paint has been removed, the holes blanked off on the inside, with a light gauze, P40 applied to both inner and outer and rubbed down smooth.
Waited for the obligatory 24hrs then placed the hull in the bath, weighted down almost to the top of the hull, for water tight integrity checks.
Found 4 pinhole leaks on the planing strakes so these were given the P40 treatment and retested - all dry now.

Photo 1: Shows some chipping to the hull edge and, what looks like red tape, is actually paint. So, that added to the rubbing down, as well as all the white and the blue.
Photo 2: Just to show the paint removal in progress. I did the whole hull in intervals, working on another couple of builds in between, to give the tender finger ends a break.
Photo 3: That's all the blue and red paint removed - just the white to tackle after that.
Photo 4: Finally, all paint removed.
No photos taken of the gauze/P40 treatment - this will show in subsequent photographs.

more to follow...


Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on November 03, 2017, 09:45:13 pm
...Now, attention turned to starting on prop installation.

Started by drilling / reaming the holes and messing about looking for the best angle to set the tubes to give the shallowest possible angle but, at the same time, ensuring there would be clearance for the UJ's and the props themselves.

The first attempt, using masking tape and an angled piece of wood, was quite useless so I found a piece of scrap 2mm plasticard, drilled to the required angle and a couple of angled guides to rest the tubes on.

Once satisfied with the alignments, the tubes were epoxied into position. Hope to get a bit more done soon. :embarrassed:

Photo 1 & 2: The first attempt.
Photo 3,4 & 5: Much better.
Photo 6 & 7: They're in and epoxied.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on November 10, 2017, 10:15:32 pm
Continued to install running gear.

Made an athwartship bulkhead for the 2 motors, angled so as to align the motors to the propshafts/huco couplings.
Once satisfied with the fit, the support was epoxied into place and will be further treated with p40 for security.

Rudder tubes next...the holes were drilled for 3.75mm OD brass tube and, tubes 5cm long, made.
Unfortunately, on doing another check I realised I had somehow managed to drill the hole for the Port rudder tube 3mm nearer the stern than that of the Stbd one. Now needed to P40 fill the hole and re-do it !
I knew I should have used a jig but thought I could just "eyeball" it. :embarrassed:

Harking back to a comment made a while ago (I think it was Bob K) with regard to varifocal lenses - unless you are looking right at the centre of an object, the lenses distort the angles and therefore can throw you off by quite a margin. Even looking directly at a tea cup - looking at the centre of the cup from above, the cup is perfectly round. Move the cup slightly to one side and it appears egg shaped. :o

...but I digress.

Well, the hole was redrilled after very careful measuring (3 times) and now the supports for the rudder tubes have been made and set in place.

The next task was to make a stand so that the hull could be held perfectly still before attempting to line the rudder tubes up.

So, made a pair of cradles with 11mm ply and stretchers from 15mm dowling rod. This was then lined with soft draft excluder...this stand won't be painted - it's just for building on.

Next, the rudder tubes were fitted and tacked in place. The rudder shafts were then cut to size and a flat filed on each for the tiller arm screws to land on.
Then the arms were made and soldered up, on an old knitting needle of the appropriate size and secured in the vice then test fitted to their shafts - so far, so good.
Flats were then filed on the lower portion of the shafts to accept the 2 halves of the blades.
The blades were fashioned from plasticard.

Before going any further with the build, decided to fit the servo. So, a cut out was made to accept the servo and a platform fixed in place.
All the electrics were then temporarily rigged for confidence check - all working ok.

Once again, removed all non-fixed items, taped off rudder and prop tubes then cut away a portion of the motor mount bulkhead (for later cockpit rebuild).
Rudder posts have now been epoxied in.

A card template was then made and transferred onto 4mm ply to make the rear bulkhead. Cut out rough then sanded to final shape. Same for for'd bulkhead, with an additional cut out to accommodate the battery.

Finally for now, the running gear was rigged again and tested, both on the bench and in the test tank (bath tub) and all is working normal - thank goodness.
Almost forgot to mention - the propshafts and rudder shafts were greased BEFORE going in the water. %)

A few photographs....

Photo 1: Getting things lined up.
Photo 2: Component parts for tiller fabrication.
Photo 3: Rudder manufacture under way.
Photo 4: Servo rigged ready for testing.
Photo 5 & 6: Electricals temporarily rigged. (note the rx in bag to avoid dust contamination)
Photo 7: Lining up the rudders prior to tightening down.
Photo 8 & 9: Electricals tidied up and rigged.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on November 11, 2017, 12:07:00 am
Progressing well now.

As with the rudder etc. it's interesting for me as I picked up a MFA Spearfish kit with a fibreglass hull that I intend replacing the plastic superstructure in timber.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on November 11, 2017, 12:16:20 am
Thanks Chris, I'm just glad the paint and gunge removal is complete now, the running gear is ok and now can concentrate on sorting the deck out.

Good luck with your build - hope you enjoy it  :-))

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: T888 on November 11, 2017, 04:48:22 am
Hi Ray,
Enjoying your renovation work. :-))
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on November 11, 2017, 09:40:54 am
Thanks Chris, I'm just glad the paint and gunge removal is complete now, the running gear is ok and now can concentrate on sorting the deck out.

Good luck with your build - hope you enjoy it  :-))

Regards,

Ray.


Thanks Ray - probably be next year before I start that though as I want to crack on with the Swordsman.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 01, 2017, 11:01:23 pm
Time for another update.

To give the deck some extra width, to glue down on, supports were fitted to the inner edge of the hull.
The last portion to be tackled was the flare in the bow area. To tackle this, a sort of plinth was glued in and then layered with P38 until just proud of the hull.
This was then sanded level.
The hull was then inverted onto a sheet of 3mm ply and drawn around to rough out a sub deck, which will be planked later on in the build.

During the above, a lot of dust had accumulated, in and around the running gear, so this was all removed and stored away until needed.
The hull inner was then given a couple of coats of white paint, just to make things look a bit neater.
The sub deck was then trimmed to fit and epoxied in place.

While the glue was setting a start was made on the superstructure. First, some of the bits I'd managed to save from the original were taped together, to get some idea of the shapes and dimensions.
So, the 2 sides and the front and back were roughed out with 3mm ply and taped together. This gave me the oblong but now I needed to get the longitudinal curves in the sides.
To this end, a framework was made as a sort of former, followed by some cambered beams for the deckheads.

Finally, a topsheet was fitted and trimmed. I had originally fitted the windscreen and rear screen in recesses but then realised this would make it very difficult to make a mould from, especially as this will be my first attempt at producing anything in GRP.
I could have sanded away the recesses but this would have then shortened the overall length of the superstructure and so I opted to fill the recesses instead - false recesses can be fitted later, using plastruct or similar.

Window frames were drawn, as "best guess", onto cereal packet card. These will be glued in place and, hopefully, will reproduce on the mould, to give an indication of where to cut the windows out.

Anyway, the structure has been given a few coats of sanding sealer and is now feeling smooth enough to take a couple of coats of primer.
Unfortunately, my spraying has to be done outside, so now I'll have to wait for the warmer weather to return.

Still, this gives me some spare time to get on with a couple of other builds.

The photos.

Photo 1: Applying deck supports
Photo 2: As above
Photo 3: Getting the parts to come together (trimming here & there)
Photo 4: Fitting the lower frame
Photo 5: Upper frame work in progress
Photo 6: Filling and sanding
Photo 7: It's pretty smooth now.

Afraid that's it for now...

Regards,

Ray.

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Seaspray on December 02, 2017, 08:17:49 am
Hi Ray

Will look good when finish. I like the twin motors set up
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on December 02, 2017, 10:54:05 am
Coming along well Ray.


What glue did you use for fixing the timbers to the fibreglass hull?


Painting at this time of year does throw up problems doesn't it.


Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 08, 2017, 09:07:05 pm
Hi Ray

Will look good when finish. I like the twin motors set up

Hello Seaspray - like most of my models, it should look ok from a reasonable distance.

I'm using twin motors / rudders because I think this will give a more stable performance - especially on turns - time will tell...

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 08, 2017, 09:12:00 pm
Coming along well Ray.

What glue did you use for fixing the timbers to the fibreglass hull?

Chris

Thanks Chris.
The athwart bulkheads were glued in with epoxy resin then plastered with P40.
The supports around the hull edges I used just epoxy resin - the 5min version - mixing only enough to glue each section at a time.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 08, 2017, 09:14:21 pm
Hi Ray,
Enjoying your renovation work. :-))

Hello Dave, thank you for looking in on this one - it'll be a few months before any more gets done to it - towards springtime anyway...

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on December 08, 2017, 11:38:38 pm
Thanks Chris.
The athwart bulkheads were glued in with epoxy resin then plastered with P40.
The supports around the hull edges I used just epoxy resin - the 5min version - mixing only enough to glue each section at a time.

Regards,

Ray.


Thanks Ray
I've got a Fairey Spearfish kit with a fibreglass hull to which I'm going to fit a timber deck and superstructure as per the first full size Spearfish that look so much better than the all fibreglass. The plastic superstructure in the kit is a bit naff anyway.

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: triumphjon on December 09, 2017, 09:56:31 pm
the hull and grp deck is fine Chris , however my first spear ive built from deck up in timber , its also got twin shafts and 1000 kv brushless motors , ive got a second spear/ spearfish under construction that im intending to use the cabin as far back as the wheelhouse , it was originally going to be on a single shaft but i may well put twins shafts/ rudders as per full size
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on December 09, 2017, 10:31:40 pm
I tend to think, rightly or wrongly, that all plastic/GRP boats (as in hull and superstructure) of this type look too much like ready to run boats.


I had no  intention of geting one as the intention was just to build all timber boats but one came along so it was rude not to!


Current builds, my first two, are going to be single motors but must have a go at twin motors at some time.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: triumphjon on December 10, 2017, 06:10:00 pm
ive got a pair of aerokits swordsman 33 , which because they were already built when i got them have single shafts , however those which have the grp hulls will with exception of the sword all use twin shafts , im currently using the ballraced shafts from prestwich models the 5mm stainless shafts , but have the threaed ends turned down to m4  as its easier to buy commercial 3 bladed handed props ! torque roll with both shafts spinning in the same direction gets interesting when at full speed ! the white spear in my photo is a grp hull / deck access is the forward cabin roof , removable rear cabin section and floors
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 05, 2019, 07:43:19 pm
As has often been said on this Forum - "where does the time go", well, it's been best part of 16 months since this thread was last updated and at last I have managed to get back into this build.

So here goes...

First of all, the superstructure plug has been given a couple of coats of grey primer, rubbed down with wet 'n dry to highlight the anomalies - and boy, were there some - so, out came the Upol filler, which was almost trowelled on, then left to harden off.
Three sanding sessions later, it was ready for more primer. Once that was dry it was again rubbed down and is about as smooth as I can get it.
Now, the superstructure is once again stowed away until I get the stuff I need for making the mould.

Next, it was back to the hull for finishing off (hopefully)

More filler applied where needed then made ready for the primer.
Again, 2 coats were applied then left alone for a full 24hrs.
One more rub down then the upper portion of the hull was masked off for the lower hull paint job - I've used Halfords "Ford Riviera Blue" for this...

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 05, 2019, 08:05:09 pm
Well, that worked out ok so, waited a week then sprayed the upper hull with "Vauxhall Summit White" - some minor overspray this time, which was touched in once dry and hardened off.

Next came the decals - these were made up on the laptop and a test print, on my inkjet printer, produced a good result. (at least on normal copier paper) so now it was time to commit the decals to purpose made decal paper. This was allowed to dry for the full 24 hrs then sprayed with matt lacquer and left to dry as per instructions.
FAILURE !
The paint (ink) came off as soon as the decal was applied to the hull >>:-( <:(

The only thing I could think of was that I hadn't given enough coverage with the lacquer or, the lacquer itself was 'naff >>:-(

Anyway, I had another go and SUCCESS this time!
Got the Port side of the hull done - nae bother - Stbd side was a different story - I managed to get the name on OK but managed to rip the dolphin in half (curse of the shaky hand again) so, I'll need to make some more decals...

...and that's where I'm up to now, so here's a few more photo's to scrutinize - have fun

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 05, 2019, 08:12:18 pm
Sorry, forgot to mention, I binned the matt lacquer and used a fresh rattle can from Halfords, which gives a positive result.
When I get the Stbd side decals done the whole hull will get couple of coats of lacquer as well. O0 :-))

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: T888 on April 05, 2019, 09:04:53 pm
Nice paint job Ray  :-))
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 06, 2019, 09:42:44 am
Good to see you back on the build Ray.

Where does the time go? My builds are taking me much longer than expected!

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: imsinking on April 06, 2019, 12:11:45 pm
Very nice paint job , how did you mask across the spray rails for the bottom colour ? I've got to repaint my old Swordsman and masking this off is putting me off doing the job , the straight parts are no problem with masking tape , crossing the spray rails at the bows is proving difficult . . . .
Bill
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 06, 2019, 01:26:32 pm
Thank you for the compliments everyone, much appreciated  :-)


Bill, I used tamiya 6mm masking tape, making sure to push the tape right into the crevice. Also, because the tape changes direction when going over the "crest", I snip the tape at an angle, place the next piece and so on. It's a bit fiddly but worth the effort.


Hope this makes sense  :embarrassed:


Regards
Ray

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: imsinking on April 06, 2019, 03:30:02 pm
Yes, it does make sense I've tried it in trial runs , made a complete bog of it , I wondered if you'd tried liquid mask of some sort , if need be I could always do it the way the 'proper' owners do & follow the main chine right up to the front (ugly)
Bill
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 26, 2019, 11:50:58 pm
Just a minor update for now...

The stbd decals have now been completed, looks ok so, another pair of dolphins have been applied to the transom, just to take the bareness from that area.
The hull has now been moved indoors to wait for suitable weather for spraying - this will also give the decals time to dry off completely.

In the meantime I've made a close inspection of the "plug" for the saloon etc.. and decided to scrap it. >:-o
There is a difference in the curvature of both sides, which would throw everything out of kilter so, I'm going to revert to building this in plasticard and go on from there.

Just a couple of photos of the decals for now...

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 27, 2019, 09:30:18 am
Making good progress on the hull Ray.

Just wondering why you prefer building the superstructure in plasticard (and why you were going to originally build it in fibreglass) rather than ply? After all that's how the kit was built. Also I'm biased because I only have experience in building in timber!

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 27, 2019, 10:01:46 am
Hi Chris, my idea of making the top in fibreglass was just to try my hand at grp as I've never tried it before.
When I spotted my error on the plug I sat and thought about the cost of the materials, to create a mould that would only be used once, just didn't make sense.
I've used plasticard on previous builds and found it easier to work with. I'll be using the 2mm for this one.
I would still like to have a go at making something in grp at some point but, it would have to be something I would want to make a number of copies of.


Anyway, we'll see how it goes with the plasticard for now...


Thank you for looking in Chris - all comments /observations welcome  :-))


Regards
Ray

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: JimG on April 27, 2019, 01:28:55 pm
For one off grp parts you can laminate the glass onto the surface of the plug. (A styrofoam plug is commonly used) After surface finishing the plug can be removed, either by breaking it up or using solvent.This method does involve more work in finishing to get a smooth surface but doesn't need so much materials as making a female mould would. If you are using polyester the plug needs to be protected by covering with a tape and possibly paint as polyester will dissolve the foam.
Jim
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 27, 2019, 01:35:01 pm
I never even thought of that Jim! - thank you for pointing that out.
Definitely one for my hints and tips notebook  O0


Regards
Ray

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 27, 2019, 02:39:22 pm
Hi Ray, I thought you must be an experienced plasticard user.

Never used any yet but will have to when I get to the stage where I'm making window frames etc.

Will be following your build of the superstructure with interest.

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 25, 2019, 10:32:16 am
I'm back on it once again...

Since the last update, the hull has been given a couple of coats of lacquer and hardened off.
I then moved on to making templates for the for'd section of the cockpit, and another for the after (passenger) section.

Couple of photos then more to follow...
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 25, 2019, 10:53:48 am
Happy with the templates so the for'd bulkhead was made, from 2mm plasticard, followed by 2 side supports for the floor c/w L brackets for the floor to rest on. The bulkhead, floor and riser were then welded together and are removable for access to the motors.
Then the rear floor was made in a similar manner but with a strip hooking over the for'd riser, thus giving a removable section for access to the propshaft couplings - I hope the photos will show what I mean... %)

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 25, 2019, 11:10:08 am
During the spraying of the hull I'd forgotten about the rudders, so these have now been primed, top coated, lacquered and refitted.

Now for the above deck structure.
Templates were made for the sides, 2 ends and an all around coaming. also, 4 x bulkheads with the slight camber, for the roof, built in.

A few more photos...
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 25, 2019, 11:39:48 am
The templates were then dismantled and transferred to 2mm plasticard. At this point I made a note to remember to do the window cut-outs before assembly - it would be a nightmare to cut them accurately once the structure was put together :o

First to be tackled was the coaming which will be 10mm above and 10mm below the deck line.
Next came the bulkheads (currently dry fitted) to keep the coamings pressed up against the deck edges.
The aftermost bulkhead has now been welded in place, along with triangular braces - the rest of the bulkheads will remain dry fitted until the sides are ready.
I was about to weld the remainder of the bulkheads in when I suddenly thought "hang on, are these bulkheads going to line up ok with the window apertures?"

Decided at this point to do a mock-up with the window frames I had salvaged from the original structure.
Fortunately, I had just enough wiggle room so that the bulkhead sides will be hidden behind the window uprights - phew!
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 25, 2019, 11:53:05 am
To bring this up to date, the port side of the structure has been made and the window apertures cut using the tried and tested chain-drilling method, filed to final shape, checked against the bulkheads for alignment and the finished article used as a template for the stbd side.

Hope to get a little bit more done this week :-))

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: imsinking on June 26, 2019, 09:14:31 am
All good so far , are you going to plank the cabin roof or try and do it in one sheet ?
With being compound curves the roof is a S O B to do without distorting the sides , specially over the window apertures . . .
Bill
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 26, 2019, 09:35:20 am
To be honest I hadn't even considered planking the roof area - I think it'll be hard enough to plank the deck as I've never attempted that on any of my models before. I know it's going to be difficult enough to get the roof to conform to the shape required.
Anyway, we'll see what we can do.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on June 26, 2019, 01:05:11 pm
 Hi Ray
Coming on nicely. I'm currently working on some drawings for a 1:12 Huntsman 31 which I'm going to begin building soon and I'm going to timber plank the roofs. I'd not done it before but it came out great on the Fairey River Cruiser I'm currently building which is similar in having fore and aft cabins. Have also done it on a Huntsman 28.
Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 26, 2019, 02:36:12 pm
Hi Chris, that's a neat looking job you're doing there.
Hope you will put some photos up when you get going with the 1/12 huntsman, it'll be a good one to see coming together  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on June 26, 2019, 03:01:02 pm
Thanks Ray

Will do. Mine will be slightly smaller than your Huntsman 31 at 31" as opposed to yours at 34".

During my builds there's been a few stages where I've been a bit nervous e.g. sanding the keels and stringers to profiles and fitting the hull skins but they went fine but there is one stage that really fills me with trepidation and that's planking the deck which I'm going to do on a Swordsman. It's going to be a time consuming process! 

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 26, 2019, 03:10:38 pm
Good to hear I'm not the only nervous modeller  {-) :embarrassed:
For the deck planking I'm going to have a few practice runs on scrap wood before committing to the model. Same goes for the staining / varnishing  :-))
Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on July 29, 2019, 11:03:41 am
A little bit more done...

Both sides of the structure have now been made and the bulkheads welded into position.
To keep the sides tight up against the coaming I fitted some Evergreen plastic U channel all round the outside of the coaming. This serves two purposes 1. It holds the side pieces up tight to the coamings. 2. It prevents the coaming from being pushed too far down into the deck opening.
Prior to welding the sides into place I've taken templates of the window apertures for when the time comes to make the window frames.
Incidentally, the U channel is 3.2mm, the sides are 2mm so, once I'm happy with the whole structure, the channel will be trimmed up to the sides.

Another update to follow...
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on July 29, 2019, 11:15:10 am
Bringing the log up to date...

The front and rear screen sections were transferred onto plastic, from the templates, to achieve the basic forms then the window apertures drawn free-hand for the windscreen openings.
These were then chain drilled, cut away and filed down to the lines and once again used as templates for the window frames.
So, the front and rear are now fitted with just some minor filling/filing to be done, then I can move onto the top.

one more photo for now...

Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on July 30, 2019, 11:10:29 am

Looking good Ray, well up to your usual standard, there's something very satisfying about restoring an old boat back to looking new better than building a new kit IMO, great job mate.


Joe.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on July 30, 2019, 11:25:48 am
Thanks for that Joe.
I'm undecided as yet on how to fit the top - whether to attempt to fit it in one sheet (then cut into it for the cockpit) or fit it in sections, filling the joints as we go🤔.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on July 30, 2019, 01:06:44 pm
Yeah I guess it depends on the finish of the deck, if it's to be varnished or painted, I tend to go for a one piece deck where possible and fit the cockpit in to an opening, unnecessary joints can develop hairline cracks with time, on my Deva the cockpit comes off with the cabin to gain more access to internals just a thought. Ps just noticed you meant the roof not the deck jet another senior moment, just ignore me Ray  %%
Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on July 30, 2019, 01:38:49 pm
another senior moment, just ignore me Ray  %%
Joe


 {-) {-) {-)

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: imsinking on July 31, 2019, 09:36:19 am
Whatever you do for the cabin top KEEP IT LIGHT , with the cut back bows on the 31 hull if it's too heavy forward it tends to plunge into waves unless it's planing, I think that's were I went wrong with my huntress the cabin roof is way too thick, I've moved everything I can to the mid or aft positions (and no, weight in the back doesn't bring the bows up)
Bill
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on July 31, 2019, 10:12:48 am
Thanks for the info Bill. I was looking at it last night and I think the way forward is to put the top on in sections. It is going to be made with 2mm plastic so it should be light enough. I'm also looking at fitting some bits of balsa to the bulkheads and the sides which will give me a bigger gluing surface. I was going to try and fit the top in one broad strip but decided that would be too much stress on the glued joints.
Anyway, we'll see how it goes.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 24, 2019, 06:13:38 pm
Almost 3 months since the last update - unbelievable...

Anyway, finally knuckled down and got on with the top. A full sheet fitting was attempted but was never going to work so I opted for fitting in sections.
Also, decided to glue balsa strips to each bulkhead to provide larger gluing surfaces.
The first 2 sections of roof went on ok using Aliphatic on the balsa and cyano on the plastic where it meets the sides. These were left for a full day to harden off. Unfortunately when I released the clamps on the front edge, the joint parted where the Aliphatic and cyano met, so obviously the 2 glues don't like each other {:-{
The third section proved awkward to clamp but we got there in the end.
So, that just left the rear saloon to cover.
One section was giving me a hard time, the part just aft of the cockpit - I spent 5 evening sessions trying to get it glued on, using a number of different glues, and then it suddenly dawned on me - one of the basic 'rules' when applying adhesives - give the glue something to grip!  i.e. roughen the surface. I had been trying to glue the piece, shiny side down, without first abrading the surface - no wonder it wouldn't stick :embarrassed: what a numpty....

Well, we got there eventually, the excess was removed,  the joints were filled and smoothed off, then attention turned to the cockpit.
Using templates, the bottom, sides and ends were made in 1.5mm plastic, a bit of filling / filing done and it was ready to receive primer.
So, the coamings were taped off and the whole item given 3 coats of filler/primer, followed by 2 coats of grey primer.

...and that's as far as I've gotten to.

Now that the weather is changing I think I should turn my attention to the deck planking.

Photo 1 Making a start on the top sections.
Photo 2 clamps a-plenty and not very pretty.
Photo 3&4 Filler / primer applied.
Photo 5&6 Grey primer applied.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on October 25, 2019, 10:16:05 am

Well you managed that Ok Ray, compound curves can be a *****, looks good, keep it coming mate.


Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on October 25, 2019, 10:29:04 am
Cheers Joe, yeah I must admit it was a right pain to get the sections to glue securely, which was an absolute necessity in order to get the edges trimmed and filed down.
Still, that's out of the way now, so today I hope to do some trial work for the deck planking.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on November 16, 2019, 09:51:41 pm
Just ordered the wood for the deck planking.
I'm still undecided as to which type to use so I've sent for maple and lime wood strips, both types at 1x5mm.
Update sometime next week after trials carried out.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 30, 2019, 08:20:15 pm
Here we are - 33 days later - and not much done at all :((

Having never attempted deck planking I decided to have a go, initially, using some "sticks"
So, a couple of test pieces were made out of cheap plant-sticks and some lolly-sticks.

First, the plant sticks - these were cut to size and permanent ink marker used to represent the caulking.

I'll put a bit more up when I get back from walking the dog....
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Mark T on December 30, 2019, 08:28:33 pm
Hi Ray - I have found that although pens are marked as permanent ink they tend to bleed into the wood.  Have a look at archival ink pens as they bleed a lot less and you can get them with a chisel tip which makes life easier too.  The build looks great mate and good luck with the deck  :-))
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 30, 2019, 08:56:08 pm
Cheers for the nice comments Mark and especially those archival pens info - I'll chase that up in the next few days. O0

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 30, 2019, 09:10:21 pm
...also made a test run with the lolly sticks - they look ok but, unfortunately, they're way over scale.

So, went back to the plant sticks and started to apply some wood dye - it's supposed to be teak satin but looks far, far too dark.

...more to follow...
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 30, 2019, 09:15:45 pm
It was at this point I had decided to order a bunch of Maple and Lime strips from Cornwall Model Boats.
Despite the 1mm thickness of the strips they arrived in good order, no damage and very well packaged...thank you CMB. :-))

...more to follow...
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Mark T on December 30, 2019, 09:20:17 pm
Ray here's the sort of pen I was thinking of, you can use the side of the brush/tip


https://www.londongraphics.co.uk/pigma-archival-brush-pen
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 30, 2019, 09:23:10 pm
Now all 4 samples were made up and treated in identical manner - sanded, wiped, stained (new tin of Walnut Woodstain) x 3 coats and 2 x final coats of clear exterior varnish.
The following photos show the results...

...more to follow...
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 30, 2019, 09:43:49 pm
Ray here's the sort of pen I was thinking of, you can use the side of the brush/tip


https://www.londongraphics.co.uk/pigma-archival-brush-pen

Brilliant, cheers Mark :-))

Looking at my test pieces in daylight, the Lime seems to be the better of the options. Maple is ok but not as smooth as the Lime.

Today was just warm enough to get a little outdoor spray painting done so managed to get 2 x coats of Vauxhall Summit White applied, consistent with the upper hull colour.
Still needs at least another 2 coats, then the front, back and sides will be done in Ford Riviera Blue to match the lower hull.
Colour coordinated I think would be the term to use.

Anyway, that's where we stand up to date...

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on December 30, 2019, 09:52:56 pm
forgot to add these... %)
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on February 19, 2020, 08:35:52 pm
Just my luck - I was going to blow the cobwebs off the boat this evening but SWMBO hasn't been well today so I've had to take over the domestic duties - hopefully, she'll be back on her feet tomorrow.  {:-{
Update to come in the next couple of days...


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 02, 2020, 04:43:55 pm
We're back again!

Swmbo's illness lasted for a full week, then I got it and re-infected her, then back and forth we went for the next 4 weeks :o
We're both ok now so it's time to get back to modelling...

The workshop will be warmed through and tidied up this evening, ready to get crackin'.
I'll put an update on here once I have something to show on the build.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: SteamboatPhil on April 02, 2020, 07:13:41 pm
Glad you are both over the illness looking forward to the next update  :-))
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 02, 2020, 07:23:54 pm
Cheers Phil, no real notion of what it was, just some sort of winter cold I guess. Definitely no high temperature involved - thankfully  :-) .


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 02, 2020, 08:14:43 pm

Glad you are both well again Ray,  me and the wife both had a bad cold just after new years eve that lasted a couple of weeks, been ok since then, only go out now for a walk and food shop, plenty of time for hobbies though, so get cracking on that Huntsman mate.   :-))


Joe.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 02, 2020, 08:48:48 pm
Cheers Joe, appreciate the reply.


I just got back in the workshop after the clap for the essential workers, NHS and others  :-))


Hoping to get a little bit done before bedtime...


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: T888 on April 02, 2020, 08:56:50 pm
Ray,
Good to hear you both fighting fit again  :-))
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 02, 2020, 09:04:11 pm
Ray,
Good to hear you both fighting fit again  :-))


That's why I'm in the workshop - to avoid fighting  {-)


Just kidding Dave - really appreciate your reply  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 02, 2020, 09:11:56 pm

Hi Ray, it dose feel strange clapping at the front door, but life is so strange at the moment, thank goodness I can go to my workshop and feel normal for a while,


stay well Joe.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 03, 2020, 11:33:51 pm
Just a little update:-
For the hardwood part on the foredeck and the deck edges I'm using mahogany. I bought a couple of sheets, I had intended to lay it in 2 longitudinal pieces but these sheets I have aren't wide enough so a centre piece was also required.

So, the 2 sheets were laid on the bench and the hull inverted and drawn around. Then, dots were placed 5mm in from the outer lines, to give a 5mm strip all along the deck edges.
The bulk of the 'waste' was then cut away but leaving plenty wood either side of the drawn lines for the inevitable adjustments to be made when final trimming takes place.

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 03, 2020, 11:47:25 pm
Took advantage of the fine weather earlier today and got another 2 coats sprayed on the saloons.
Then, I noticed I'd dropped a clanger - when I bought the paint I found what I needed straight away i.e. Vauxhall Summit White, thought it would be a good idea to buy a second tin as a spare. What I failed to notice was that the 2nd tin was in fact Vauxhall Glacier White - no prizes for guessing which one I used :embarrassed:
Now I'll have to wait until it hardens off to get the correct paint applied >:-o

Back to the decking then:-

The outer strips have been sanded down - now just need to get rid of the pencil lines and a little final trimming. In the meantime, the centre piece for the foredeck has been trimmed and glued into place - here's a couple of photo's before that was done...

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 03, 2020, 11:49:34 pm
Hope to get a bit more done tomorrow  %)

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 08, 2020, 11:41:10 am

Having followed your log I doubt that is anything you could learn from me, but I was most impressed with your decals/ transfers so maybe you can teach me, I've done Tee shirt transfers before but that requires a lot of heat to iron them on not good for a boat hull methinks, I guess it's special paper but is it special ink as well, are they water slid applied, I'd like to do some decals on my Huntsman, they make your hull look very professional.


Joe.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 08, 2020, 12:00:54 pm
Hi ya Joe, I'll dig out the details later this afternoon and post on here.
I printed them off on my ink-jet printer but I believe it is easier to do if you have access to a laser-jet. That's because ink has to be oversprayed with a good covering of lacquer to seal it, whereas laser printing doesn't.
My first attempt failed due to not being sufficiently sealed.
I'll get back with the other details later today  :-))


Regards,
Ray,
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 08, 2020, 12:51:51 pm
Found the details but the company I used - homecrafts.co.uk - has shut up shop >>:-(
So I'm afraid it's going to have to be a search using 'water slide decal paper' or similar wording.
Sorry about that Joe.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 08, 2020, 01:27:35 pm
Something I'm going to have to master at some point though a little way off at the moment.

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 08, 2020, 02:01:45 pm

Thanks for that Ray, I've made a note of the company, like Chris It will be some time before I need them, but I think I've got an idea how it works now, print on water slide paper cover with lacquer the water separates the lacquer/ink from the paper slide on to the model am I close Ray?  anyway I'll do a bit of research for paper etc. it would be good to do a bit of practicing.


Thanks  Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 08, 2020, 05:10:38 pm
Hi Joe - will be good to see another build. I would have built one of the smaller Precedent kits but they are 1:11 and I'm building my "fleet" at 1:12 so I'm scratch building. Only 3" I know but it would be longer than my Swordsman 33, can't be having that!

I do have one of the big 1:8 models though, which I bought off EBay. My first boat when getting into the hobby about 3 years ago.

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 08, 2020, 06:10:24 pm
Joe & Chris, one thing I did notice, when handling the decals - they were quite delicate compared to the ones you will have used when building Airfix models as a youngster however, the technique of immersion in water, slide decal from backing, apply decal to hull (or wherever needed) smooth out to remove any air bubbles, leave to dry.
Don't forget to apply a couple of coats of lacquer when that area of the model is finished.


Regards,
Ray.


Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 08, 2020, 07:29:50 pm

Thanks for the heads up Ray, I've done a bit of research and have ordered some ink jet clear paper and crystal clear lacquer, so I'll be able to have a go at it.


Regards Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 08, 2020, 07:42:45 pm
Good on yer Joe, let's know how you get on  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 10, 2020, 06:43:30 pm
Well, finally got the Port and Stbd deck edging glued on, with final trimming still to be completed once the deck planking is on.


more to follow...
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 10, 2020, 06:47:41 pm
Top of saloon masked off, sides, front and rear sprayed with Ford Riviera Blue, to match lower hull colour.
There's a bit of overspray crept under the masking tape - this will be put right when the paint has fully hardened off.

more to follow...
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 10, 2020, 06:51:42 pm
Bit of patching done on the after mahogany - again, this is something else to be fettled o/c planking.

Here's a few more photos...


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 11, 2020, 10:35:52 am

Crickey Ray looks like your actually gonna finish it.  %% %)   only joking mate, interesting rebuild Ray, if mine turns out like that I won't be complaining, I was wondering whether to have single shaft/rudder or twin shafts/rudders looking at yours I'm leaning towards twin, not that I'm looking for lightning speed, just more in keeping with the real boat, and I'll probably go for open shafts and P brackets.


Regards  Joe.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 11, 2020, 11:10:07 am
Cheers Joe - yeah, the twin setup is okay for me, I'm not looking to break any records with the boat.
A couple of times I've considered fitting P brackets but not certain about it. The full size boat definitely has them though.


Now ready to start planking - never done this before so just need to get motivated and hopefully get it done soon.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 11, 2020, 11:33:45 am

Yeah I've been thinking ahead and when I get to the deck planking I plan on making a sub deck out of 1mm ply fitted dry to each side and fit and glue the planking to these sub decks off the boat so I can let the planks over hang and finish the edges when the decking's done and then fit to boat, dose all that make sense, well that's the plan anyway.


Joe.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 11, 2020, 11:42:06 am
Well, that sounds like a good plan Joe, should work out ok  :-)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 11, 2020, 01:05:58 pm
Hi Guys

I'd definitely fit a P bracket Ray. As well as looking good it provides support to the prop tube when it sticks out as far as that. I'm fitting them to all my builds.

With my Swordsman build I've fitted a thin sub-deck like you're talking about Joe as my intention was to plank the deck. However I'm going to get the planking laser etched onto ply as I'm going to do with the Huntsman Sport. I'll see how it goes. If it doesn't work out I'll return to Plan A and plank it.


Chris



Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 11, 2020, 01:30:24 pm

I'd definitely fit a P bracket Ray.

Chris


Thanks Chris, I'll attempt that after the planking 👍🏻


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 11, 2020, 02:35:30 pm
Joe

If you do go for twin props and rudders it's worth bearing in mind that with the full size boats they are not positioned at the mid-point between the keel and chine but a bit closer to the keel. Obviously with a deep vee hull this is to minimise one prop coming out of the water on tight fast turns.

I haven't done a twin motor set-up yet but I'd like to on one of my future builds.

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 11, 2020, 03:38:24 pm

Thanks for the tip Chris, I've seen some photos of the real thing and can get an idea from them the rudders are actually quite close to the transom, I done a few twin prop fitting on warships but of course they don't roll into the turn like deep vees.


sorry Ray I'll start my own log soon honest  :embarrassed:


Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 11, 2020, 03:44:27 pm

sorry Ray I'll start my own log soon honest  :embarrassed:


Joe


 {-) {-) {-)
No problem Joe and of course, I'll be looking in when you do  :-))
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 14, 2020, 10:55:57 pm
I've made a tentative start on the deck planking but, before I commit any further, I'd like to show a few photos for any feed back please...

Bear in mind, these few planks have not been stuck down yet. Also, when planking is complete and sanded down, it will be stained and varnished.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 15, 2020, 12:30:46 am
Hi Ray - not easy I know, but now that you have produced the deck edging and bow detail it's crying out for curved planking.

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 15, 2020, 12:51:21 am
Thank you for your input Chris. I really appreciate your reply. The thought of curving the planking did occur to me when reviewing the photos and I know that it wouldn't be too difficult, due to the pliability of the lime wood.
I'll certainly have a crack at it in the next workshop session and compare the results before committing to the glue - talking of which - I'm still undecided as to which type of glue to use. Any ideas on that front would also be most welcome.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 15, 2020, 10:24:01 am
Visually, curved planking looks much better as it follows the line of the hull and as you say that is how the full-sized boats are.

There has been a number of posts on here over the years but I can't remember what glues were used. I think I'd use aliphatic resin. Takes longer to dry/set but I had to buy some more recently, this time from Deluxe Materials and it certainly grabs quicker than the previous stuff I had.

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 15, 2020, 10:48:12 am
Thanks again Chris, I'll try that on some scrap first and go from there  :-)) .


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 15, 2020, 12:39:47 pm

Yeah have to agree with Chris defo curved planking (says him with it all to come)   {:-{   and defo Alphatic glue, Delux Materials probably the best one IMO. yes in all the years I worked in the boat building industry I don't recall ever seeing a straight planked deck.


Joe.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Mark T on April 15, 2020, 12:58:01 pm
Looking great Ray  :-))   I agree with the other lads and definitely use aliphatic resin.  If you put a thin layer down with a brush and then move the plank backwards and forwards slightly when installing you will see that the glue grabs hold of the plank.  Saves using clamps and weights!
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 15, 2020, 08:18:26 pm
Chris, Joe and Mark, thanks for all your replies - so, curved planking it is  :-))
I've already got aliphatic wood glue, so that's a bonus...


Does anyone know what the maximum plank length should be and would there be any advantage in starting at the stern, working up towards the forward detail?


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Mark T on April 15, 2020, 09:05:33 pm
Hi Ray


OK this is purely my own opinion so take it with a pinch of salt - I think that as long as the king plank (the one that runs straight up the middle) is straight then everything else follows.  You can just set the pattern to something that you like - or I guess that a plank would be no longer than 6 - 8 feet so I guess you could scale that up if you wanted.


For me as long as its symmetrical side to side thats good enough for me - oh and still hard to achieve but you'll do it no problem


Mark
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 15, 2020, 09:18:38 pm
Cheers Mark, I'll have a dry run first and see how it's going to pan out.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 15, 2020, 11:01:29 pm

Hi Ray when I worked at Camper & Nicholson yachts I didn't actually work on deck planking that was always done by shipwrights but the teak planks were only around 2 1/2" wide but were 3 to 4 metres long it's easier to bend a long narrow length plus it keeps the number of joints to a minimum and as Mark said they started at the king plank.


Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 15, 2020, 11:19:18 pm
Ok Joe, thanks for the info.
What I'm failing to understand is how you develop the curve from what would be a straight plank alongside the king plank and gradually radiating out to the deck edge.
I'll have another look at it after (hopefully) a good restful sleep  %) .


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: SailorGreg on April 16, 2020, 08:24:39 am
Actually you start at the edge of the hull - that defines the plank's curve - and work towards the centreline.  This means the last few pieces are long thin triangles and need some careful fitting. If you look at Reply 21 of my J class build (https://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,58937.0.html) there are pictures of the process.


Happy building


Greg
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 16, 2020, 09:36:07 am
Greg, just finished reading your yacht build and it's just what I needed. Actually, just before I left the workshop I took a full length of lime strip and pushed it up against the deck edging and thought, surely that must be the way to go.
I'll do a dry run later this evening to get a bit of confidence and take it from there.
By the way, I must admit I've never read a full yacht build before, - your J-class is a beauty. Thank you for the link :-))


Regards,
Ray.

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 16, 2020, 11:09:40 am

Just to clarify the boats I worked on were Yachts and fundamentally differ at the bow to the Huntsman 31 with it's large round bow and to make things even harder the heart shaped detail of the capping that the planking abuts to, that is why I plan on using a .8 ply sub deck dry fitted to the boat and planked off the boat I thought it might be easier to fit the long slithers that Greg mentioned glued in place and trimmed when set, any way here's a couple of pics for inspiration.


Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 16, 2020, 11:36:31 am
Ahh, brilliant. Thanks for sharing those pics Joe. All three with different planking applied.
Dry run this evening but I'm leaning towards the style of the one in the 1st photo.


Your idea of planking off the hull sounds like a very good idea.
Wish I'd thought of that...Still, onwards we go  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on April 16, 2020, 12:51:38 pm
Planking off the boat will work if the deck is flat, but if cambered it won't  unless you can replicate the camber in the sub-deck which will be pretty much impossible!

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 16, 2020, 01:00:19 pm

Mine will only have a slight camber, so I can but try it, long way off though.


Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 20, 2020, 11:51:50 pm
Update...

Following 4 aborted attempts at laying down planking over a couple of evening sessions, I've finally managed to make a start.
These first 2 photographs were taken last night - very little to see but at least it's a start...

...more to follow
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 20, 2020, 11:58:07 pm
The yellow-ish colour of the inboard plank (stbd side) in the above photos is due to the wood still being wet...

Managed to get just a little more done this evening...in between domestic duties, walking the dog, evening meal and Skype with family.

Just 2 photos to show how slow this is going.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Mark T on April 21, 2020, 07:22:39 am
A really nice start on the deck.  The two tone wood is going to look lovely  :-))
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 21, 2020, 10:39:26 am

I see your setting the bar high for me Ray, Thanks for that Mate  <*<


Joe.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: T888 on April 21, 2020, 11:03:06 am
Nice work Ray  :-))
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 21, 2020, 11:06:10 am
Thanks for the encouragement Mark, I just hope I can do this justice when it comes to the scraping, staining and varnishing  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 21, 2020, 11:16:10 am
 {-) {-)


Joe, the bar may look high, but you're only seeing the images - I'm seeing the mess from grubby fingers etc
Also, the amount of efforts that were reduced to scrap when trying to get the shapes right - crazy  %%


Still, any progress is better than none  :-)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 21, 2020, 11:21:24 am
Thanks Dave, to quote a well used phrase -... "this is going to be a steep learning curve".


Still, I'm sure it will all turn out ok  %)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on April 21, 2020, 12:37:57 pm

Yeah I think bending deck planking is one of those things that doesn't scale down from the real thing that well, the plank may be scale size but the grain isn't just my opinion, we had a steamer at Camper&Nicholsons about 2 foot square and 20 feet long the teak planks were steamed over night and the shipwrights would dry fit 4 to 5 planks each side and clamp them over night next day when dried out some they were bonded down with Epethane (epoxy) then the cycle would start again.
Looking good though Ray.


Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 21, 2020, 01:14:59 pm
Hey Joe, thanks for the insight to the full size operation - very interesting actually - as for bending the lime strips on mine, I just boil a kettle of water, transfer to an old tin coffee pot and leave the plank to soak for about 20 mins.
It still takes some effort to get the bends to conform to shape so, where necessary, I'm pinning in place and leaving to dry completely. Then it's just a case of marking the edges and ends, to represent the caulking and finally gluing in place and again holding with the pins.
It's slow going but should come out ok  :}
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: SailorGreg on April 21, 2020, 01:28:18 pm
Don't worry about the decking being a little messy at this stage.  As long as you focus on getting the joints tight it will all look lovely once you've finished, sanded or scraped the whole thing down and got some finish on it.  That warm glow of satisfaction awaits you in the future!  :-)) :-))

Greg
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 21, 2020, 01:59:07 pm
Thanks for your input Greg. It's rather hard to visualise a beautiful finish at this stage but I know that, with time and patience we should end up with at least a decent looking model.
Some of the finishes we see on here and at model displays are really lovely to see.
Here's hoping all goes well  :-)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: NigelTailyour on April 22, 2020, 05:03:19 pm
By coincidence, I too am trying to make a deck on a very old Huntsman 31 found unused locally.
But I am a complete novice. So I am asking if you could let me know the type of wood and the side that I buy.
I have look in the online shops and the choice is too overwhelming! I have already bought the wrong thing and I hope to send it back.
Can anyone let me know the size and type of wood to use?
Many thanks
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Mark T on April 22, 2020, 05:23:51 pm
Don't worry about the decking being a little messy at this stage.  As long as you focus on getting the joints tight it will all look lovely once you've finished, sanded or scraped the whole thing down and got some finish on it.  That warm glow of satisfaction awaits you in the future!  :-)) :-))

Greg


This is great advice  O0   Just take your time and when you do sand or scrape it back you will very happy with your work  ok2
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on April 22, 2020, 09:59:44 pm


So I am asking if you could let me know the type of wood and the side that I buy.



Hi there Nigel, my deck is just a piece of old scrap plywood that I had lying around, can't even remember where I picked it up!
Anyway, it is 3mm thickness, measured about 900 x 300mm before trimming to fit. The ply is certainly not marine grade! - more like the kind builders use for stud walls. If I were just starting again I would probably go for birch faced ply.
Whatever you use, be sure to give it a few coats of sanding sealer, sanding down between coats.
You may also want to check out RadioJoe's build here : https://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,64796.0.html


You will find others as you browse around.


Oh, and welcome to the crazy world of model boat mayhem  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on May 20, 2020, 09:39:57 pm
Well, finally got the deck planking on - it's a bit of a mess but, following up on comments/suggestions, it should all clean up nicely %)
hope so anyway...

so here's a couple of progress shots, followed by the completion of planking ones.

Have fun, but stay safe everyone.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on May 20, 2020, 10:44:37 pm

Well done Ray I know darn well that wasn't easy, you have my admiration for sticking with it.  :-))




Joe.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on May 20, 2020, 11:04:38 pm
Cheers Joe, your moral support is most welcome.
Next time I do any deck planking I'm going to try and come up with some sort of plank 'puller' to try and avoid using pins.  ok2


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Mark T on May 30, 2020, 06:42:47 pm
I don't know how I missed this post but I did - Ray I think its come out great and bending wood like that so thats its symmetrical is very tricky.  Top job mate whens the next update?
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on May 30, 2020, 07:01:05 pm
Hi ya Mark, thank you for the compliments.
I've literally just finished scraping the Port side deck planking - looks reasonable to me - further update and a couple of photos probably tomorrow.


 :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on May 31, 2020, 05:58:27 pm
Here we are to date:-

Just 4 photos, giving an indication of the task....

Hope to get the Stbd side scraped off in the next day or two, then it'll be a good clean up, followed by staining (walnut) and varnishing.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on May 31, 2020, 06:10:49 pm

Very nice Ray, there is a subtle difference on the port side in the photos anyway, but, and this is in no way a criticism do you not think Walnut is a bit too dark, the deck looks ok as is , maybe a sealer.




Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on May 31, 2020, 08:16:45 pm
All comments are welcome Joe.
I actually thought along those lines last night. I think it may be prudent to carry out another couple of test pieces, this time with the mahogany incorporated so as to make a comparison. Got to get the remainder of the stbd side scraped back first though - it's tedious but no doubt worth it in the end.  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on May 31, 2020, 08:52:36 pm
Hi Ray

I agree with Joe. The colour as is stands is similar to most full sized boats and the contrast with mahogany always looks good .

Out of interest what's the reason for scraping rather than sanding?

Chris
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on May 31, 2020, 09:17:48 pm
Hi ya Chris, initially I thought the deck should be a deep, dark colour with a good covering of varnish but, on reflection and having Joe and yourself onboard, my thoughts are now changing. Plus, of course, the wooden decks on these boats would naturally fade to a sort of yellow / white.
My thanks to you both for your input and this will also help save me a bit of time.


I tried sanding the deck at first but I found that it was sort of dragging the stains into the wood grain so I switched to scraping with a Stanley knife blade. It is a bit tedious but gives a cleaner finish.
I just wonder if I've perhaps been using too rough a grit of sandpaper?


Still, I'm nearly finished now so I'll crack on with the scraping then give it a good clean up.  :-))


Regards,
Ray.


Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on June 01, 2020, 08:52:09 am

Your efforts will be rewarded Ray, the reason I say Walnut would be a bit on the dark side is just about all ships/boats have Teak decking that is left untreated and weathers to a light grey colour, Teak is used mainly because it doesn't rot and doesn't need a treatment of any kind, Though I do remember a boat owner at Camper & Nicholson insisting on using Teak oil on his deck a practice he soon stopped when he found the deck got very slippery when wet, I'm not suggesting we leave our decks untreated though, being very thin wood it will require a sealer, I would suggest a thinned clear Mat polyurethane that's what I'll use on mine always assuming I manage to bend them darn "planks"  %%


Joe
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 01, 2020, 09:11:01 am
Hiya Joe, yeah, I was just wondering what to seal the deck with.
I did think about maybe just 2 or 3 coats of ronseal satin varnish - but would that be good enough and would it need renewing every couple of years?


... think I'll take your suggestion on.  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: ChrisF on June 01, 2020, 10:22:44 am

I've used International Schooner tung oil varnish on the deck of my Huntsman 28. I know it's not correct, but I wanted one model with a high gloss finish, so put several thick coats on. That's on birch ply and gives a lovely mellow honey colour.


I put a thin coat on the laser etched planking on another model and that looks about right. The shine can be taken off using fine wet and dry etc. I've got to use it on my other models as it's quite a big tin!

Chris

Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on June 29, 2020, 06:27:33 pm
Just checking you are OK Ray, been nearly a month since we heard from you.  :o


Joe




Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: Capt Podge on June 30, 2020, 09:40:41 pm
Hi Joe, this is my first visit to the workshop since the 1st of June. I managed to get 4 coats of varnish applied to the deck, after which I seemed to have no real urge to continue - must have been the thought of making all those window frames - however, I'm back now and I'll try to get on with it.
I'll be making some deck planking for the cockpit tonight and put a few pictures up tomorrow.
Oh, and thank you for your concern mate. I'm still in good health.  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Another Huntsman rebuild
Post by: radiojoe on June 30, 2020, 10:31:07 pm
Hi Ray, you go at your own pace mate, just pleased to hear you are ok in this uncertain time.   :-))


Joe.