Model Boat Mayhem - Forum

Dry Dock / Shipyard: Builds & Questions => Steam => Topic started by: Mark T on December 26, 2017, 01:51:33 PM

Title: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 26, 2017, 01:51:33 PM
Hi All


Well after a bit of a break its time to start my second build log  :-))   This time its going to be a steam powered tug and I should say up front that this is my first foray into steam and also my first attempt at a double planked build.  If you did see my last build you will know that I'm a pretty slow builder due to time constraints at home but I will do my best to keep it up to date.  So..........whats in the box?


The kit seems very well thought out and comes with a very impressive set of accessories.  At first glance there are lots of well made brass parts and what looks like a very good anchor winch which I believe with a bit of fettling could be made to work with a small motor.  There is also all of the rigging, a 55mm cast brass propeller and a substantial towing hook too.


The laser cut parts seem cleanly cut and the plywood looks like its good quality.  The planking is limewood and there is 135 strips that are 1.5x7x930mm in size. It does have a prop shaft included and 4 large 1:1 scale drawings to help with the build.  The rest of the instructions are 4 A4 pages of poorly translated from Italian written instructions so I'll see how I get on with those.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1989.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1991.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1993.jpg)


The Steam plant is suppled by Pendle Steam Boilers and is a 3.5" boiler with a matched separator and 3" gas tank


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1990.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1962.jpg)


The Engine is a TVR1ABB which is a little beauty to build


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1979.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1977.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1978.jpg)


Which will also drive a boiler feed pump which was made for me by my mate Oohyah/F  (George) from this forum  ok2


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1936.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/26/IMG_1937.jpg)


The plan from the off is to build the hull around the steam plant and its going to be a very very tight fit with many issues to overcome. The plant will be fully enclosed and hopefully I will solve them all with a lot of help.


Wish me luck - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: SailorGreg on December 26, 2017, 01:59:57 PM
Good luck!  :-))


Nice to see another steam build, and another of George's fine little pumps being brought into service. I will follow with interest.  O0


Greg
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: david48 on December 26, 2017, 04:07:55 PM

seasons greetings  Mark
I can not see any Brasso   or Duraglit or are you Solvol Autosol man in the new kit. good luck and enjoy .
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: steamboatmodel on December 26, 2017, 04:08:32 PM

Hi Mark,
It looks like it will be an interesting build. Just make sure that at all stages of the build you can still remove the steam plant for service it, preferably on a single mount. One model I built you had to remove all the components individually which made it very difficult.
Regards,
Gerald.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: xrad on December 26, 2017, 04:20:38 PM
Very nice bits for your tug! The TVR is not a very powerful engine, and is not really made for higher pressures (above 30 psi).  Just wondering if it has enough power to run both the pump and prop shaft. Have you tested the water pump on shaft against boiler pressure?  maybe needs reduction gearing?
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 26, 2017, 05:15:02 PM
Hi Greg - Cheers mate


Hi David - Seasons greetings mate and lovely to hear from you.  I must be honest nothing it going to be polished on this one its all going to be a matt finish  :-)  (Even if the pump looks a bit shiney in the picture  %% )


Hi Gerald - Its already on a one piece mount but I have just not posted that far ahead yet.  I'm a very slow builder so I've been working on it for a while before I started this log otherwise it would have been far too boring and slow to follow.  Your piece of advise though has seen me make some good decisions with this build which have in turn caused some real problems that had to be overcome.  Especially trying to get everything under decks but also still be accessible and serviceable.


Hi xrad - Always good to hear from you.  The engine turns the pump very easily on both air and steam with as little pressure as 10 - 15PSI.  I have found with the TVR that the correct valve timing makes such a difference to the performance of the engine and I have spent many hours experimenting with this and I'm sure that there is still room from improvement.  Also good lapping between the valve slides and the cylinders makes quite a difference too.  Having said all of that I have not had it with a propeller on as well - but if I try and stop the engine with my fingers - well the engine wins every time.  I must be honest this is my first steam engine and I have been surprised just how much power this little plant has so I can only imagine what other makes must have.  Its purpose is purely for my sailing enjoyment and not for any tug pulling competitions so I hope that its ok for the job at hand.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: rhavrane on December 26, 2017, 09:32:22 PM
Bonjour Mark,
Very good choice, several of my friends have done or recreated this kit, with a TVR1A exactly.
Jean-Pierre : Original kit - 1 m (video in English ok2 ) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrKd4jzpl30
Guy : 1,20 m and same steam machine : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1B6etQ30b8 => 27 kilos !

Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Footski on December 26, 2017, 10:52:47 PM
T beautiful tug model this one. I look forward to seeing it come together.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on December 26, 2017, 11:18:18 PM
 O0  Fantastic Mark! I'm subscribed to this baby  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Capt Podge on December 26, 2017, 11:32:49 PM
Having followed your Fairmount Alpine build, I feel sure this one will be very interesting to follow, so I'm in as well - good luck Mark.

Regards,

Ray.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: tizdaz on December 26, 2017, 11:40:48 PM
Nice choice! I love the look of this Tug, my next build will either be this or the Imara, but thats' a long way off as i'm barely half way on my current build!


Will be following this, g/luck! :)




Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 27, 2017, 03:33:52 PM
Thanks all  :-))  its going to be a very long build as there is so much to do and thanks Raphael for the links they are very nice boats.  It is a very pretty tug when completed correctly so I'll give it a good go.  Ok lets start


The keel is assembled from 3 parts as was my last build so I can only imagine that this is a standard amongst model boats.  It was held down on a flat board to keep it straight and was placed on cling film to stop the glue from bonding the whole thing to the board.  The wood is 1/4 ply and seems to be of a very good quality. Its 890mm long.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/27/IMG_1994.jpg)


Next was to make a keel board to keep it nice and straight during the first part of the build.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/27/IMG_1995.jpg)


Then I simply popped the bulkheads out of the plywood and dry assembled the hull to get an idea of size.  The fit of the bulkheads was very good and required no sanding what so ever they just simply slotted together.  The horizontal decks are not part of the finished boat.  They are supplied in the kit to keep the bulkheads in the correct line whilst the planking in being done.  Once the planking is complete they are removed and disposed of.  A great idea from the manufacturer which will make things a lot easier.  Well I hope it does  %%


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/27/IMG_1998.jpg)


Now here's a couple of pictures that give an idea of just how much modification this kit will need to get a steam plant in.  The parts are obviously just balancing to get a feel for how things need to be; however all of the parts are above the bulwarks let alone below decks.  The engine output shaft is approximately 45 - 50mm higher than the boats propshaft and a pulley system will be no good on this build.  All of the plant needs to be right at the bottom of the boat or it will just wallow around the pond or capsize.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/27/IMG_1997.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2017/12/27/IMG_1996.jpg)


Its plain to see that nothing fits at this stage but its nothing a bit of thought won't sort out - or a big mallet  {-)


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on December 27, 2017, 08:27:58 PM
Mark, your work bench is far to neat and tidy and breaks the rules for posting pictures of your build. You know this will not last........ %%


Joking aside, this has all the ingredients for another classic build and will follow with interest.


Stewart
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on December 27, 2017, 10:29:17 PM
Agreed Stewart  {-)  almost like an operating theatre  %%


Mine has just been tidied
(https://photos.smugmug.com/Portgarth-volume-6/i-qmp2H8v/0/0c361f33/X2/1E290324-084F-4C59-A3C3-5C4A61F024A9-X2.jpg)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: steamboatmodel on December 27, 2017, 11:00:04 PM

Mark, May I suggest that you do a tracing of all the wood parts, that way if any get damaged you can make a replacement. another reason is if you want to make another model in a different size you can. I built one model that was slightly too small for the boiler and engine I had so I installed an electric motor, and built another 25% larger, Unfortunately both sold when times were tight.
Gerald.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on December 27, 2017, 11:16:33 PM
I f I may give some advise ,I would lay out the keel with the running gear approx where it will fit and then mark the keel and cut out that section ,mark the center line on your board then place your frames and keel inverted as it will be quite difficult to remove the keel section after planking.
I realize it is a kit model but they present a challenge to be steam powered but well worth the extra time ( my attachment is of my current build Joffre steam tug.
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 28, 2017, 09:58:09 AM
Hi Stewart and Andy you have obviously never met my wife  {-)   Honestly she will put up with all of my building including painting in the house; on the condition that I clean up afterwards.  I did used to have everything out as you do but soon discovered that everything then gets covered in dust and takes forever to clean afterwards.  So now its all in draws and only takes 5 mins with a hoover.  Happy wife = happy life  %%


Hi Gerald that is very good advice and I was going to do exactly that.  Fortunately when I opened the box the plans come with a set of 1:1 tracings of all of the wooden parts i was most impressed!


Hi John thanks very much for the photo of your build it looks great.  The plan for my boat is to fit the steam plant and all of the running gear and iron out any problems whilst its still a skeleton.  Once I've done all of that I will do exactly the same as you - well hopefully anyway.  The plans advise that the first 4 planks should be fitted to the bulwarks on both sides to keep the whole thing straight before commencing on any other planks.  The plans are quite specific about this and having looked, it would seem that they work together with the false decks.  I'm a long way off of that yet and I'm sure that I will have lots of questions before I attempt fitting planks.


Mark




Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Martin [Admin] on December 28, 2017, 10:26:42 AM
 
..... something not right about a clean, organised work bench....  <:(
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 28, 2017, 10:47:23 AM

..... something not right about a clean, organised work bench....  <:(


 {-) {-)  I'm am being guided / instructed / told  by a higher power  {-) {-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on December 28, 2017, 10:51:23 AM
Poor old Mark.......be damned if you do and damned if you don't......ha ha ha.


I have a cunning plan Mark. Take a picture of your workbench all untidy and full of clutter, then get it printed on a roll of wallpaper. Roll the wallpaper out to take pictures, that will keep Mayhemers happy and your missus...... :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 28, 2017, 11:28:52 AM
Stewart thats not a bad idea - maybe gets the kids to do a photoshop for me  :embarrassed:
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on December 28, 2017, 04:38:38 PM
Hi Mark,


Just seen your post. Really looking forward to following your build.


Cheers


Ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: xrad on December 29, 2017, 02:23:34 PM
Hi Mark!  Sounds like you have the TVR timing as well as possible. Agree w/you: Timing set is not forgiving on this engine. The window for correct timing is very small. 


Can't wait to see your build and her in the water!
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: steam up on December 31, 2017, 03:51:20 PM
The Hackworth timing is very unforgiving but once sorted this little engine will provide more than enough power. Look forward to more progress updates
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 31, 2017, 05:43:01 PM
You are right lads; I ended up using a magnified lamp to see the slides closely so that I could get the timing as good as possible.  Even now the engine runs slightly faster in one direction that the other but I'm quite happy with the way its running.  I ran the engine in for about 3 hours on air and it seems to have no problems with the steam  :-))   I can see though a time and not to far away when everything has settled in and it will need re-timing but the more you do it the better you get at it!


I'll get an update on the build at the end of the week.  Unfortunately I cannot upload anymore photos into the mayhem image photo site as I've reached my limit for the week  {:-{   Its because I've been uploading the build photos of my last build since the photo bucket issue.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: rhavrane on December 31, 2017, 10:59:37 PM
Bonjour Mark,
The club "Hippocampe" bought a dozen of TVR1A (examples in the videos shared) and these specialists waisted a lot of time to find the appropriate timing of this sensitive machine. And I do not know any steam machine running perfectly exactly onboth sides, this is why I buy my propellers after my steam tests. You have done a good job, let's go on following your adventure  :-)) [size=78%]  [/size]
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on December 31, 2017, 11:02:34 PM
If Martin can allow it you can use whatever my allowance is as I donít use it
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 06, 2018, 04:32:45 PM
Ok I'm up posting again as Martin has upped the amount of pictures you can upload to the MBM image server due to my excessive use of it  :embarrassed:  - thanks Martin  :-))


Right its time to start cutting to make room for the steam plant.  After much measuring and quite frankly trembling at the thought of cutting up such a nice kit, I simply decided to get the plant as low as it would possibly go.  The picture below kind of shows how much I wanted to remove from the keel and bulkheads.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2004.jpg)


Now deciding this caused me quite an issue due to the construction of the kit.  Removing this much material completely removed the bulkhead locating slots from the keel and also meant that if I cut the bulkheads without altering them first they would simply fall in half  {:-{
So to the keel first; I used the very bottom of the bulkheads as my datum and marked out what needed to be removed.  I extended the locating slot downwards and then it was onto the bandsaw to remove the and lower the keel


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2005.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2006.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2011.jpg)


Now the bulkheads; I temporarily filled the pre-cut slots to hold the two parts together.  This did not have to be a master piece of carpentry and once the bulkheads were glued in their use would be very limited.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2007.jpg)


And then I glued spruce to each bulkhead to act as both a strengthener and also the main point of contact with the keel.  I wanted them to be strong due to the amount of bashing they would probably get whilst making the steam plant fit.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2014.jpg)


Which were then cut to the shapes that I had calculated (guessed) earlier


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2018.jpg)


I was really please with the first trial fit which has really opened up the hull.  This is only the first cut as there are many more to make but its a start.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2017.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2016.jpg)


Everything is below decks now and I've got a nice straight alignment between the motor and the propshaft.  I've had to move the separator to just above the propshaft as this is the only place it can fit and still give me access through the openings in the deck.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2022.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2021.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2020.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2019.jpg)


I also apologise in advance for my ultra clean workbench  {-)   I'll get some more pictures up later - Mark  :-) [size=78%]  [/size]
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on January 06, 2018, 06:14:34 PM
Awesome work Mark........ :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 06, 2018, 06:24:00 PM
Thanks Stewart  :-)


Having had a bit of a play at putting all of the components in the hull it became apparent that I needed to widen the bulkhead in front of the motor to get access to the coupling and I also had to shorten the keel where the propshaft is positioned.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2032.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2034.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2051.jpg)


This meant that I could not use the supplied propshaft which to be honest wasn't the best quality anyway so I substituted it for a stainless steel shorter one.  Now as this propshaft is well below the water line and very short too, I decided to silver solder a grease tube to it and also fit a grease cup as well.  I have to thank Cupalloys for their help with this as they supplied me a really good flux for soldering brass to stainless.  I'm hoping that having a well greased propshaft will minimise the amount of water that gets in that way.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2041.jpg)


Next I glued the outer propshaft supports together and sanded them into shape.  This part was then simply glued onto the keel.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2044.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2050.jpg)


These are the fillets that fit on the bow to allow the planking to be fitted.  One has been chamfered and the other is how they are supplied.  After chamfering both they were clamped and glued in place on the bow


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2047.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2049.jpg)


And similar pieces being clamped and glued to support the planking near the propshaft


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2048.jpg)


Next was to clamp and glue a former onto one of the bulkheads.  This former is purely to help construction and is removed once the planking is complete


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2043.jpg)


And finally for today the stern former was fitted.  This piece cause me some real problems as the instructions / drawings are so vague and contradictory here.  In the end I fitted it where I thought best so I hope that its correct.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/06/IMG_2042.jpg)


For now thats pretty much all of the modifications that I can do to the hull without putting the steam plant together and then into the hull.  So thats up next.


Cheers for looking - Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on January 06, 2018, 07:35:10 PM
Hi Mark,


Following with great interest, lovely work. is it your intention to do as much work with respect to the necessary support frames/beams etc that the steam plant requires at an early stage & before any planking?


ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 06, 2018, 08:54:57 PM
Hi Ian


Yes the steam plant will be fully working and complete with all RC and wiring before any planking is done.  I learnt this lesson from my last build to be honest.  I have found that its far easier to do it at this stage rather than later and saves knocking the finished surfaces about.  The problem that I have found though with doing things this way is just how vulnerable and flimsy the boat is without any planking.  I'm just trying to be as careful as possible but it doesn't always work.  I have already caught one of the bulkhead ribs with my sleeve and snapped it clean off.  After much swearing and a cup of coffee I repaired it  :-)   The downside though is the actual building of the boat starts much later.


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on January 06, 2018, 11:06:53 PM
Lovely work as usual there (precision)  :-)  re catching ribs, Have you considered pinning a plank uppermost on each side?


As a temporary measure.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: steamboatmodel on January 07, 2018, 03:48:05 PM

Hi Mark,
A nice job on the prop shaft. You may want to use oil in it instead of grease, especially if you are running in cool water. I have had Grease filled prop shafts create so much drag that the motor stalled .
Regards,
Gerald.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 07, 2018, 06:17:59 PM
Andy a great idea and I really wish I had done that  - One for the future for me


Hi Gerald I've heard of the grease stalling the propshaft before so I think I'll give it a try and if I get any problems I think your suggestion of using oil would be a sensible alternative.  I can only think that some type of hydraulic lock would be the cause of grease causing that much drag.  I'll do some tests and see if I get the same problem
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on January 07, 2018, 06:25:42 PM
You know you want one  :-)


https://maccmodels.co.uk/reilang-oil-cans/200ml-double-pump-aluminium-reilang-oil-can.html
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on January 07, 2018, 06:29:07 PM
My thoughts are that grease just languishes and holds any swarf from wear whilst oil continually very slowly drains away and is refreshed.




MMM recommended thick oil and I agree with that.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: SteamboatPhil on January 07, 2018, 09:49:14 PM
I use hypo 90 gear oil on my shafts and lub box on my steam plants, I have been doing this for 40 odd years and have had no problems. A few chums did try grease......not with any success. :((
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on January 07, 2018, 09:50:47 PM
Like it  :-))  I never thought of gear oil, better than my old 20/50  cheers  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: derekwarner on January 07, 2018, 10:26:54 PM
Rather than carry a shop full of petroleum products you could try

a light green sewing machine oil ISO VG 10.........engine bearing & the like  O0
a dark green steam oil ISO VG 460.....displacement lubricator

The latter would also be a suitable stern tube lubricant  :-))

Derek
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 13, 2018, 10:16:33 AM
Hi All


Some pictures of the start of the steam plant build.  I wanted to place the engine and motor onto a base so that it can easily be removed for maintenance and also catch the mess that will drip from the plant when its running.  The other issue I have is that the whole plant has to be fitted through the openings in the deck and accessible for use.  I started by making a frame from 8mm brass angle that fitted into the hull and then cut a plate from 1mm brass for the base.  Its a bit shiney  %%



(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2059.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2060.jpg)


I then had a trial fit just to see how things fitted together with the prop shaft and coupling and I was really pleased with the results.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2061.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2062.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2063.jpg)


I then finished off the base by running a silicone bead between the frame and the base and then bolted the two parts together with some 3mm stainless steel bolts with some very nice round head nuts.  The four slightly larger holes are for mounting the plant into the hull.  They align with holes on the bulkheads that I have tapped out to 4mm and will have stainless steel studs glued into them at a later point.  I'm just using bolts to hold it in for now.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2067.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2068.jpg)


Now very fortunately for me the mounting plate sat lower in the hull than I expected which will be good for stability but I also discovered that the motor was now 3mm too low for straight prop shaft alignment.  So I made a little plate to raise both the motor and boiler feed pump.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2069.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2070.jpg)


I've now got good alignment - In fact the plate is so low that the highlighted bolt had to be turned around the other way as the nut will be in the way of the planking!  Fortunately it simply turned around without fouling the engine - more luck than judgment


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2071.jpg)


I'll get some more pictures up later but this build is so enjoyable and really makes me scratch my head at times with the problems the conversion is throwing up.


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on January 13, 2018, 02:12:12 PM
I do look forward to your updates Mark. Really is going to be a beauty. Keep up the fantastic work. :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on January 13, 2018, 02:13:58 PM
Why do we drool over steam and brass  O0  Lovely Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 13, 2018, 04:45:27 PM
Thanks lads - honestly I'm loving doing this build.  Ok another update  :-)


Now that the base for the boiler and motor is on its way I needed to mount the gas tank and the oil separator.  Now luckily the gas tank comes fitted with some very nice feet which are tapped out should you want to bolt it to something.  I however need to remove the gas tank for filling as I don't want to blow my boat up with lost gas falling to the bottom of the hull  %%   The feet are large enough to stand the tank up on its own so I made a base which simply allows the feet to locate and then the stability of it will come from the attached pipework.  It is a simple base which has a 1mm brass top just to accommodate any wear of putting the tank in and out.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2079.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2080.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2083.jpg)


Next the separator needed to be mounted in the only position available in the hull and that is just above the prop shaft.  This was quite tricky as I needed it to allow me access to the prop/motor coupling; line up with a deck opening and be as low as possible to keep stability of the hull.  So I made a little shelf for it to fit on and epoxied some 3mm stainless steel bolts in as once the deck is on there will be no way of getting under the shelf to insert them.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2084.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2085.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2086.jpg)


After the shelf was built I started on the pipework now that the main components were installed.  Firstly the boiler feed pump to the clack valve which goes through a bypass valve.  I have since fitted an isolation valve too.  The boiler is now also bolted to its base using 2BA cap head bolts.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_20875625413fc804d41f.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_20880088f200d7eadec6.jpg)


Then I piped in the throttle which is a Microcosm product along with the lubricator to the motor inlet.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2096.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2098.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2099.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2097.jpg)


And then it was the motor outlet to the separator.  Now I know that the pipework layout may seem a bit random but that's because I have to fit it around deck rafters and other parts that have not yet been fitted.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2102.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2103.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2104.jpg)


Finally for today the separator exhaust was made.  This pipe has an isolation valve fitted as when this valve is closed and the outlet on the separator opened; the waste flows out of the separator outlet which can then be collected and disposed of safely.  This pipe will eventually go up the funnel to get rid of the used steam.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/13/IMG_2107.jpg)


Thanks for looking again - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: steamboatmodel on January 13, 2018, 06:16:32 PM

It is looking good Mark.
Are you going to insolate the Boiler and pipe works?
Gerald.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 13, 2018, 06:31:50 PM
Hi Gerald


Yes all of the hot pipework will be insulated and the boiler is going to be clad in ceramic first followed by walnut to make it look good and also  try and make it more efficient


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: derekwarner on January 13, 2018, 10:58:16 PM
Excellent  :-)) sharp, square, up, down & straight...as all tube work should be  O0 on a model steam plant Mark  .......

From this and other WEB postings, it is clear that the overall quality of the Pendle product is apparent, however the installation of an isolation valve in the discharge port of the de-oiler body [depending on other porting arrangement's] creates the potential to pressurise the vessel.....so some may say that this can only be exhaust pressure, so yes.....but this can see stalled engine pressure which is boiler relief valve pressure

Placing an additional isolation valve [globe or needle] in the exhaust line off the engine will create exhaust back pressure relative to the pressure drop across the valve. In most model steam plants, the exhaust line is the largest diameter possible with the minimal number of fitting restrictions as possible

I must also be missing something :o in the planned evacuation of waste oily water from the de-oiler if ported as per the last image

Derek
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: rhavrane on January 14, 2018, 12:08:11 AM
Bonjour Mark,
Sorry if it seams rough but I would like to give you my opinion. Your piping, in and out has too many angles.
The exhaust one with 180į just after the cylinder will create an against pressure wich will seriously affect engine performance. Perhaps could you return the screwed pipe and shorthen this part ?
Is is said that 90į looses 30 % of power, of course it is wrong, but 4 times the in piping will ruin benefits of reeating the steam. Perhaps could you save several milimeters to go down directly from the chemny to the RC valve ? Detail, it would be  better if the oiler would be installed before the RC valve, one of my boats is installed like yours and the RC valve becomes difficult to operate with the heat.
You have nospare room, it is a challenge but you can yet think about it, when the boat is finished, it will be too late ok2
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Jerry C on January 14, 2018, 05:43:17 AM
Looking really nice. In view of two previous comments consider turning exhaust manifold through 180į and go straight into separator tank without the 180į bend. I wouldnít bother ďdryingĒ the steam before putting it in the engine as the TVR doesnít like it. Instead I would heat up the cold water from the feed pump before the clack valve. Putting cold water into the boiler in my experience slaughters your boiler pressure. No need to throttle exhaust from separator to empty same, the pressure across the tank will suffice to force condensate out of tank.
Lovely work,
Jerry.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 14, 2018, 09:44:25 AM
Hi All


Thanks for the comments and I'll do my best to answer them.


Derek - I think that you are right about the globe valve in the separator exhaust pipe causing a small restriction but its there for a purpose.  When the engine is running the plan is to close this valve and deliberately pressurise the separator vessel.  The outlet globe valve is then opened on the vessel which blows the contents out which will be sent down a flexible/removable pipe for collection and disposal.  When its empty just simply reverse the process.  You are also correct about the quality of the Pendle products.  I have fired the boiler and it give out more power/pressure than a TVR motor could ever use which in a way should (I hope) negate some of the restrictions that I have placed on the overall plant.


Raphael and Jerry - You are both right there are too many bends for optimal performance but let me tell you what I tried before taking this route.  I tried turning the motor exhaust manifold around but after many attempts I could not successfully join it to the separator.  The pipe bend was simply too tight.  I thought about moving the motor back but then this causes me similar issues at the inlet end.  I wanted to have the lubricator before the throttle but again I just could not get the pipework to fit.  I still want to do this though so I may change the lubricator to a different type so that I can achieve this as I'm sure that I will have issues with the throttle sticking otherwise.  I really like the idea of heating the boiler feed water  :-))  I'm going to put some thought into this.


The good news is this boat will hit the water before the deck is installed so that any problems can be ironed out.  Its quite difficult when posting this build to get across the limitations that are placed on me with regard to pipe routes etc.  As the whole thing is under decks I've had to find compromise after compromise buts its fun finding the solutions  :-)


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Bernhard on January 14, 2018, 11:34:15 AM
 :-))  ,,,looking great,,
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on January 14, 2018, 11:59:29 AM
hi Mark does the boiler have extra support besides the bolts in the centre ? it is usual to have the boiler supported by a cradle n both ends also the piping appears to be brass or is it the camera flash .I hope that I don,t appear to be pickish but I do have a few years experience with model steam and some things just jump out so keep up the excellent work as I am in a similar situation with my Joffre build
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 14, 2018, 12:37:43 PM
Thanks Bernhard  :-)


Hi John the boiler was made with built in feet that have a 2BA thread in them.  They are very substantial and Nigel at Pendle Steam told me that they are very difficult from an engineering point of view to get right.  It really is absolutely solid on the base.  Also you are spot on regarding the pipework.  Its all brass and pleasure to work with as long as its kept annealed properly  :-))


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: rhavrane on January 14, 2018, 01:00:31 PM
Bonjour Mark,
You are the one who builds, you know what is possible or not so I fully understand your answer. Next time, choose a larger boat  ;)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 14, 2018, 01:06:12 PM

 {-)  You are so right there Raphael this really is a shoe horn job but its getting there  :-))

Moving onto the gas tank I have started with fitting a gas shut off valve should anything go wrong.  This part was supplied by Jerry at Clevedon Steam who I have found to give great service and back up on what he sells.  I would really recommend this supplier.  I did modify the mount that comes supplied so that it bolted directly to the servo and I also altered the stainless steel servo mount as the locating holes will not be accessible once the deck is fitted.  I re-drilled these so that they will be.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/14/IMG_2108.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/14/IMG_2109.jpg)


It was then I realised that I had placed the gas tank mount too far forward and that the gas tank outlet valve would just about foul on the deck opening above.  There was nothing for it but to remove it  >>:-(

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/14/IMG_2110.jpg)


And then make another which was about 10mm further towards the stern and also repair the damage to the keel.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/14/IMG_2111.jpg)


With the gas tank now in its correct position I connected the gas pipework through a forrest regulator.  It certainly was tricky piping this part as not only are some of the bends awkward they have to be accessible to fit once the deck is in place.  The pipework does keep the tank very stable which was something that I was hoping for.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/14/IMG_2112.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/14/IMG_2114.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/14/IMG_2115.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/14/IMG_2116.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/14/IMG_2117.jpg)


I'll get another update next week - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: derekwarner on January 14, 2018, 11:10:37 PM
Morning Mark.....after viewing your gas tubing %) I suspect you may have had a previous life in miniature instrumentation installation  ok2 

Even with my modified 1/8" tube Du-Bro bender, [with one aluminium handle unscrewed] I cannot achieve 2 stage compound bends as you show, and the bend set lengths is governed by the set of the bender.....I am sure a number of members would be interested in the bending tools you are using

Have you chosen an alternate tube material for the gas lines?

We also see the pilot signal for the gas regulator is steam @ ~~ 140 degrees C and accept that this will condense to ~~100 degrees C, however an alternate pilot of water from the lower boiler is available @ ~~ 80 degrees C...or a little friendlier on the Neoprene diaphragm in the regulator

Derek

PS...I think we will just have to wait & see what will be removable....and what fixed <*<
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 15, 2018, 09:34:49 AM
Hi Derek I use the same pipe benders as you and sometimes a spring. To get a close set in the pipe you have to bend it slightly out of alignment. Then when itís out of the tool make sure itís still annealed and then manipulate it straight by hand. If you need to make two bends very close to each other you must not let the tool drag the pipe in. You need to hold the pipe as well as the tool to make sure that it goes around the former correctly. 


The pipe that Iíve used is 1/8 brass and it bends easily enough. Another thing I always do is measure the pipe through itís centres rather than the edges if that makes sense. As for the regulator itís installed as per the manufacturers instructions and thatís all I know about it really. Iíve yet to see if it actually works


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 19, 2018, 04:14:32 PM
Hi All here's the next update; firstly the bad news I've just realised that I've incorrectly piped up the gas regulator.  The burner and tank connections are the wrong way around so I will have to rectify that sooner rather than later.  I've ordered some more 1/8th brass pipe to sort it out.  It won't take  long but that will teach me to read the instructions properly  :embarrassed:


Now onto the hot pipe insulation as I've been thinking about this for quite a while.  I have never been a fan of wrapping the pipe in string as to get a good finish it seems to me that it takes a lot of effort.  Many coats of plaster, followed by lots of sanding and then at the end its brittle and cracks easily.  I have seen some really lovely well executed examples of this technique but time is the one thing that I don't have lots of so I wanted to find a simple and quick solution.


After having spoken to a couple of experienced steam modellers about my idea to use silicone pipe I decided to give it a go.  I thought of silicone as its a good insulator and does not absorb water like string can.  So I did a bit of digging and discovered that silicone comes in different cure types for different applications.  It just so happens that platinum cured silicone comes in various diameters in white and does not degrade or discolour over time.


So here's what I did.  Firstly cut the silicone pipe down its entire length and then wrap it around the pipe.  Then glue it back together with a glue called Silpoxy which sets in about 15 minutes.  I found that its easiest to do a short piece of the insulation at a time and hold it in place with tie wraps.  Then simply work along the pipe and once the glue is set just trim the ends.  Anyway enough waffling from me have a look at the pictures as they tell the story better.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/19/IMG_2140.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/19/IMG_2142.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/19/IMG_2167.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/19/IMG_2166.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/19/IMG_2143.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/19/IMG_2118.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/19/IMG_2119.jpg)


I'm really pleased with the results and its does insulate very nicely.  Its very quick and easy but the down side is that the Silpoxy is very expensive for what it is.  Its £10 plus £10 postage for some reason  {:-{   However the time saved and durability is probably worth the cost.


Thanks for looking and later in the weekend I'll post how I modified the motor so that it could be reversed via a servo.  Well my take on it anyway.


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: ooyah/2 on January 19, 2018, 04:26:12 PM
Hi Mark,


What an excellent way to insulate the pipes and it looks good as well, what do you use to clean the Silicone after having dirty greasy fingers all over it.,
or do you need to have clean fingers to start with ?


Your pics explain a lot.


George.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 19, 2018, 04:33:19 PM
Hi ya George


I have found that white spirit works well but the best cleaner by far is good old fairy liquid.  It brings it up like new  ok2   One thing I forgot to mention was to remove as much excess glue before it sets.  Its difficult to remove once its gone off and takes a sharp scalpel to remove in it.


Mark




Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on January 19, 2018, 06:13:34 PM
Just picking my jaw off the floor Mark.
That is a seriously lovely piece of work.
I was wondering how you were going to insulate the pipes and your solution is fantastic.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 19, 2018, 09:08:24 PM
Thanks Stuart but to be honest I don't think that this is a new idea and I'm certain that its been tried before.  But before I tried it I ran it by some members of our forum to see if they thought that it would be possible.  They thought that it would be so I just delved a little deeper and I got the encouragement that I needed to really give it a go.  Luckily it worked out - and I can't emphasise the word luckily enough.  The supplier of the silicone also proved to be a very good source of information and was extremely helpful  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: derekwarner on January 19, 2018, 10:56:30 PM
Goodness, not only is the tubing bent with great layout & accuracy, now this alternate insulation appears so tidy with apparent ease and speed of application....10/10 Mark  :-))

Derek
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 20, 2018, 04:55:32 PM
Thanks Derek this build really is a work in progress and is changing all of the time mainly based on feedback from this forum.  I'm still trying to move the lubricator in front of the throttle but I'll keep you updated.


Onto the motor - I've seen quite a few different examples of converting the hackworth gear so that it can be moved by a servo and I've always thought that simple = good.


I stripped the motor down and drilled out and tapped the hackworth mechanism so that it would accept a 3mm stainless steel stud and then screwed a snap link onto the back.  I also needed to turn the detent bar around to allow for a smooth operation and I drilled and tapped a 2mm hole to fit a bolt which acts as a stop.  I read on this forum somewhere that if the actuating arm moves too low it may possibly bend the valve spindles.  I don't know if this is correct but I did it anyway.  I then simply moved the whole mechanism to one side so that it slid easily up and down the smooth side of the detent bar.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2128.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2129.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2130.jpg)


Now I can sum this first effort up in one word - FAIL!!!  Unfortunately when I went to put the cylinders back on the 3mm stud was in the way so moving it all to one side simply will not work.  I found the solution but modifying another snap link which allowed me to centralise everything again.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2137.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2138.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2139.jpg)


I'm glad to say this solution works very nicely  :-))   Its easy to do and sturdy; if I was doing it again I think that I would use 2mm studding as that would be ample.


Next was a modification to the hull to get the new mechanism in with the little bit of clearance too.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2150.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2152.jpg)


Which was then connected to a operating servo; I made the servo arm a little longer as the throw on the hackworth gear is long.  It all seems to work very nicely and I'm hoping that by keeping it simple I won't have too many issues once its on the water.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2153.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2154.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2155.jpg)


Next was to fit a servo for the throttle.  I have used some really nice stainless steel servo mounts that are available from Clevedon Steam.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2123.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2124.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2125.jpg)


And finally the boat so far with all of the hot pipework insulated including the motor manifolds.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/20/IMG_2156.jpg)


The next job is to modify the funnel so that it fits the model and also run the exhaust up it.


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on January 20, 2018, 05:17:43 PM
Think this deserves a place in the masterclasses Mark........ O0 O0 O0 O0 O0
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 20, 2018, 07:45:37 PM
Hang on mate lets not get ahead of ourselves as theres not a plank on it yet.  It might end up like a Chinese junk that floats like a U boat   %%   Albeit a steam powered U boat / junk hybrid  {-)   Thanks for the nice comments though  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on January 20, 2018, 09:53:19 PM
Great job Mark have you worked out what ballast she may need, need room for that too
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 20, 2018, 10:35:29 PM
Hi John


I think that it will need very little ballast which is a concern.  If my guesstimates are correct I believe that it will need about 0.75kg of ballast.  The steam plant has been getting heavier as its gone along and this is due to my lack of experience between what I thought I required and what actually is required.  I honestly don't know but I'll find out soon enough.  Raphael summed it it by saying that maybe I should have built a bigger boat.  I do think that I will be okay - but only just.


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on January 20, 2018, 10:51:52 PM
Not to worry too much as these tugs sat very low in the water so as long as you can drain the decks quick enough all should be ok as I have seen quite a few similar tug models that do not look the part sitting too high in the water and bobbing around.
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 20, 2018, 10:56:02 PM
Thanks John I really do hope so and I agree with you tugs sit very low in the water.  Its one of those things I've made my calculations and I hope that I'm right...............if not its going electric  {-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: rhavrane on January 20, 2018, 11:08:10 PM
Bonjour Mark,I agree with John, this type of boat can be low on the water so, like on my last tug you can use lead sheets at bilge cut to the dimensions you wish to make a ballast : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVfY9GM4RXQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BVfY9GM4RXQ)
Example : The tug JAN, even without superstructure, is very low without a problem : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbvYKKf8tJE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbvYKKf8tJE)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 21, 2018, 02:37:28 PM
Hi Raphael thanks for the links they are interesting  :-))   The Jan tug as you say is very low but it looks good for being so low.  I think that John is right the decks will need good drainage.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on January 21, 2018, 10:35:40 PM
Great looking tug JAN Raphael and it can be seen that cavitation would occur if she was higher in the water ,I use lead shot in  flexible bags also divers belts can be picked up reasonably cheap at markets ,etc ,keep up the good work Mark .
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on January 21, 2018, 11:02:01 PM
Hi Mark here is a link that shows an nice example of your build https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_D7PTCHRh8
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 27, 2018, 06:57:07 PM
Thanks for the link John they really are a very nice boat when finished - mines a long way off  :embarrassed:


Moving on with the build its funnel time!  The funnel that came with the Pendle boiler was a bit too short for the model and I needed to extend it by 190mm.  Now knowing nothing about whether this would affect the boiler performance I asked both George and Nigel at Pendle Steam if this would cause me any issues.  The advice was simple - it will be fine but when you light the boiler keep the gas as low as possible so that the flame drops back to the burner - as its got a long way to go  %%


I ordered some 28mm copper pipe and cut and bent it to suit the model.  Have you ever tried bending 28mm pipe with a spring!!!  Its difficult especially when my blow torch would not anneal it properly.  Anyway I made the exhaust pipe for the motor and ran it up the funnel.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2161.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2160.jpg)


Which now looks like this on the boiler


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2162.jpg)


I then completed the exhaust pipework to complete the circuit and insulated the pipework with silicone as before.  Here's a few pictures of how it all came out.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2170.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2169.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2171.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2172.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2174.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2175.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/27/IMG_2159.jpg)


Thanks for looking  - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on January 27, 2018, 06:59:32 PM
The best boat porn on the web  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 28, 2018, 05:44:50 PM
The best boat porn on the web  :-))


 {-) {-)


Okay next up is to mount the rudder servo which needs to go here after the hatched area had been removed


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2186.jpg)


Once the piece had been removed it left the structure very vulnerable so I wanted to make a box for the servo which filled the space exactly. So after a bit of cutting, clamping and gluing I made the box


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2182.jpg)


Which needed a slot to allow the wiring to fit in nicely


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2184.jpg)


Which then looked like this


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2185.jpg)


I then clamped and glued the box into it place


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2187.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2188.jpg)


Which gave me a nice snug fit and put even more strength into the structure


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2189.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2190.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2193.jpg)


And then finally I bored out the rudder tube hole to see how it all lined up.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2191.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/01/28/IMG_2192.jpg)


Thats it for now - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: derekwarner on January 28, 2018, 09:25:17 PM
Mark.........the gas tank appears to have taken on a distinctly flattish top  %) surface...is this an illusion?......... Derek
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 29, 2018, 02:57:05 AM
Hi Derek itís just the photo as itís still round  O0
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on January 30, 2018, 10:45:38 AM
Hi Mark,


Still following your most interesting build and please keep the photos of how the boiler room & engine room are being configured coming, very informative indeed!  I suspect it's something you have mentioned before; do you intend to conduct tests of the assembly under steam before the planking?


Clearly understand the importance & need for the tray to catch the all of drips etc., but have you considered or see the benefit in adding a small thimble size sump to the tray to aid removal of the water/oil mixture, say with a suitable syringe?


Ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 30, 2018, 10:57:31 AM
Hi Ian yes Iím hoping to get it fully working before any planking is done. I know that I canít iron out every problem but if I can do for 90% Iíll be happy. I hadnít thought about a sump - Iíll think about that one thanks for the idea  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 03, 2018, 11:48:59 AM
A bit of an update this time to fit the steam whistle.  Now as easy as it sounds to quickly fit a whistle its not quite as simple on this build.  As its an enclosed steam plant, to run a whistle up through the superstructure was just not going to work.  There is not the space available on the deck and it would also complicate putting the superstructure onto the hull when I'm sailing.  A solution was found after a call to Clevedon Steam as Jerry supplies a whistle kit that fits inside the funnel.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2195.jpg)


Now as its inside the funnel I didn't want it simply rattling around so firstly I made a support for both the whistle and the engine exhaust.  Its just some copper tube silver soldered to a stainless steel stud.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2198.jpg)


I then cut a slot in the funnel to allow the steam pipe to go through which I also found supports the whistle quite well.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2201.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2202.jpg)


And then fitted the top mount that I had made earlier.  It made the whistle very secure indeed


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2200.jpg)


Next was to fit the valve that controls the whistle and I had to have a 90 degree elbow made by Jerry to get it to fit.  He did a lovely job for me.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2220.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2221.jpg)


Which was then fitted to the boiler and the pipework connected up to the whistle through a straight connector so that the funnel can easily be removed.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2222.jpg)


And finally I fitted the servo to work the whistle.  The reason for the springs on the control rod is because the valve must have a positive shut  off to close fully.  I'm using the springs to keep pressure on the valve and remove it from the servo gears.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2247.jpg)


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: steamboatmodel on February 03, 2018, 03:40:58 PM

We used to call springs set up like that "servo savers". You could buy the complete set in one package. I really like the look of that whistle
Gerald..

Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 03, 2018, 05:01:55 PM
Hi Gerald yes I used to use these on my cars before transmitters were adjustable but I think it will work well in this application too.


Just a quick update I drilled the holes for the servo wires so that they trail back to where the receiver is going to live.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2255-1.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/03/IMG_2257-1.jpg)


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: rhavrane on February 03, 2018, 07:58:41 PM
Bonjour Mark,
Great ! Your boat is almost finished... Oups, I have forgotten a detail... A hull  {-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 03, 2018, 09:01:11 PM
Hi Raphael; yes you are right it certainly won't float  {-)   I've got to be honest I'm really looking forward to getting the hull built and seeing it come to life  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on February 03, 2018, 09:25:35 PM
Shame you can't make it from clear plastic Mark.......show off all the great detail...... :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 03, 2018, 09:38:23 PM
Shame you can't make it from clear plastic Mark.......show off all the great detail...... :-))


Thanks Stewart; I wonder if anyone has ever done that?  I bet it would look amazing  :-))   Something for the skilled vac moulders on here to think about.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on February 03, 2018, 10:11:00 PM
The steam launch my father left me is superb above and below deck, some of it you cannot see, shame really.
Clear vac formed hull could be the way to go....... %%
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on February 03, 2018, 10:20:22 PM
Take some very well framed shots of all that won't be seen later and make a series of poster sized prints  :-))   8)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 04, 2018, 02:38:33 PM
Take some very well framed shots of all that won't be seen later and make a series of poster sized prints  :-))   8)


Actually that a really good idea thanks Andy  :-))


Ok onto lagging the boiler and I nicked this method from someone on this forum after having read a few older posts.  So its not my idea I'm just copying someone else - well why reinvent the wheel eh!


Firstly the boiler needed stripping down and the first layer of insulation was marked and cut out.  I have used 1mm of ceramic paper which apparently is used in kilns somewhere and is good for 1250 degree centigrade.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_1731.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_1732.jpg)


Which was then wrapped around the boiler and held in place with very thin double sided sellotape.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_1733.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_1735.jpg)


I next used wood stain in the areas that may be seen after the wood cladding has been fitted.  I think that seeing the white ceramic would look quite bad and this is a simple solution and used before by other builders.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_1737.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_1738.jpg)


I then started the cladding using 3mm x 9mm walnut wood which is really nice to work with


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2258.jpg)


And the angles were planed using my little Veritas plane with is lovely to use.  It works just like the full size version and gives great results.  I did guess the angle though.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2261.jpg)


I will have to update this a bit later as I'm having a few problems uploading photos but thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 04, 2018, 04:05:35 PM
Hooray we're back in business now that Martin has sorted out the photo server - thanks Martin  :-))


So I carried on planing the planks and gluing them in place around the boiler


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2262.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2263.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2264.jpg)


Which was then sanded down to make it look a bit smarter


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2265.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2266.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2267.jpg)


Next was to make the brass bands that wrap around the boiler.  Again I nicked Jerry C's idea of how to make them as I thought that his method look very nice.  I started by making some T bolts which have a slider one side a a 2mm thread in the other.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2268.jpg)


I then silver soldered some tube onto the end of the band


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2270.jpg)


And then using a dremel with a cutting disk I cut a slot into the tube that was wide enough to allow the 2mm bolt to slide through


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2273.jpg)


I did this a both ends of the band and then had a trial fit to see if they were the right length.  Please excuse that swarf hanging off and the rough wood but this was just a test fit


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2271.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2272.jpg)


I was quite happy with the fit so first thing was to clean up the ends of the bands so that they looked a little nicer


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2278.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2276.jpg)


And lastly I gave the walnut 4 coats of matt varnish and the boiler ended up like this  :-))


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/04/IMG_2282.jpg)


I'm really happy with the way its turned out  :}   These Pendle boilers are just fantastic  :-))


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on February 04, 2018, 04:07:58 PM
Outstanding! clearly this is oozing personal satisfaction  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on February 04, 2018, 04:38:08 PM
Mark,


You have managed to improve on what was already a very nice boiler!


Ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Captain fizz on February 04, 2018, 04:43:28 PM
Very nice work Mark, it is the detail that is so satisfying :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: rhavrane on February 04, 2018, 06:24:59 PM
Bonjour Mark,
Sorry, but you make a little mistake says one of my friends. In a closed hull, especially in a working boat the boiler should be covered by a skin of painted steel sheet. Wood is for open launches  ok2
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Jerry C on February 05, 2018, 12:29:54 AM
Your soldered bands look neater than my rivets. All a beautiful job.
Following from afar.
Jerry.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 05, 2018, 10:48:17 AM
Thanks for the nice comments  ok2


Jerry Iím glad that I did solder the ends as I made them just a little too long. It was a simple matter of just cutting off one end and re-soldering a new piece making them 5mm shorter  :embarrassed:
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Jerry C on February 05, 2018, 11:04:05 AM
Us Black Country guys got to stick together. Me ex Wednesfield.
Bostin  ayit  ar👌🏿
Jerry.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 05, 2018, 11:08:48 AM
Us Black Country guys got to stick together. Me ex Wednesfield.
Bostin  ayit  ar👌🏿
Jerry.


According to my neighbours Iím an Honary Black Country man as Iíve lived there for 28 year but Iím originally from the smoke 👍
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 10, 2018, 01:18:12 PM
Hi All


So now the boiler is finished it was time to put the whole thing back together which looks like this


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/10/IMG_2289.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/10/IMG_2288.jpg)


And next I started making a few modifications - starting with the throttle / lubricator set up.  This was due to the feed back from this forum and I wanted it to be right, so I changed the set up to one supplied by Clevedon Steam that allowed the lubricator to be in front of the throttle.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/10/IMG_2302.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/10/IMG_2301.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/10/IMG_2311.jpg)


This set up works really nicely so it was worth doing.  The next modification was to the whistle in the funnel.  Unfortunately I discovered that when the whistle was sounded, sometimes it blew the burner out.  So to sort this out I decided to blow the steam out of the side of the funnel rather than inside it.  To do this I simply drilled and tapped two 3mm holes and tuned the whistle around. I also made a hole for the outlet.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/10/IMG_2304.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/10/IMG_2305.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/10/IMG_2308.jpg)


But I guess most importantly heres a video of the steam plant up and running  O0   You will have to excuse my wittering on it  :embarrassed:


https://youtu.be/kfNlVzpBM74


So tomorrow I'm going to try and make another modification.  I have noticed that I am getting a bit too much back pressure in the separator and I want to reduce this.  I know that the problem is the motor exhaust so I'm going to try and re-route it and also make it out of a larger diameter tube.  I'll let you know how I get on.


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 11, 2018, 02:01:07 PM
Well I said that I would update you


Disaster


After hours of trying different pipe bends etc I have managed to ruin the motor exhaust manifold  >>:-(   My fault entirely and I've realised that to join the motor to the separator the way that I need too I will have to use a flexible coupling.  Its not something that I wanted to do but I just cannot have the back pressure the way that it is.


I've emailed Graham Industries to see if they can supply me a replacement manifold but I've heard that they are not very good at answering them. So if anyone knows a supplier that may have an exhaust manifold please let me know.


On the positive side - thanks for the messages on youtube regarding the steam plant running  :-))


Oh well its only a minor set back but it may take time to get a replacement part.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on February 11, 2018, 03:37:46 PM
Hi Mark,


I have been following your build with keen interest as my next step when I complete the "Marcher" build to assemble a steam plant & install it in a suitable hull. Very sorry to lean that  the exhaust manifold is damaged. If spares are difficult to obtain are you able to repair it or make a replacement?


If you are stuck I would be happy to have go at making a replacement at no cost just byway of helping a fellow modeller.


Cheers


Ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 11, 2018, 03:46:27 PM
Hi Ian


Wow - see this is why I love this forum because help is always out there.  Ian I think that I will be okay but I cannot thank you enough for the offer.  Graham Industries has sold so many of these engines that I'm certain that I can get a replacement but I also know that it will take a while.


I was silver soldering very - very close to the fittings and I knew that I was taking a risk.  Some times you get away with it and other times .......well it just falls apart while your looking at it  {-)   I've had my fair share of luck so I cannot complain.  I'll let you know how I get on but thank you very much again  :-)   I'm looking forward though to seeing that lovely Marcher engine power one of your boats  :-))


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: T33cno on February 11, 2018, 04:12:51 PM
Could just watch that video all day  O0
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on February 11, 2018, 07:11:04 PM
Hi Mark,


I have been watching your latest video & a thought has just struck me. In order to reduce the number of bends from the exhaust manifold would it help if the manifold was simply turned around so the outlet was pointing the other way towards the separator?


Let me know if you still require any assistance.


Ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: ooyah/2 on February 11, 2018, 09:42:41 PM
Bonjour Mark,
Sorry, but you make a little mistake says one of my friends. In a closed hull, especially in a working boat the boiler should be covered by a skin of painted steel sheet. Wood is for open launches  ok2


Raphael,


I think that you are the one who has made a mistake, as when viewing several of your Y-Tube Video's there are at least 3- St Tugs with timber clad boilers which I assume are all yours.
It surely doesn't matter what the builders preference is in Lagging his boiler, in this case he has made an Excellent finish of the timber lagging.


George..
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on February 11, 2018, 10:51:05 PM
Hi Mark I would advise using a lower melting  silver solder like plumbers use and a pinpoint torch the solder will not melt due to the lower temp exhaust.

Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: steamboatmodel on February 11, 2018, 11:57:53 PM

One of the silver bearing solders like Stay-Brite might work it is 5%silver.
Gerald.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: rhavrane on February 12, 2018, 08:32:17 PM
Bonjour George,
You are absolutely right, most of my closed boats have wooden boilers (bought like this), this is why I have been informed that I was wrong. And I fully agree with you, it does not matter  ok2
It is very difficult to find videos of real boilers, here examples of what I found : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0RO7OckmWE or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-ImwmHejDc or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJLkOGUH2Pc show that boilers are not like our ones.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: steamboatmodel on February 12, 2018, 10:36:20 PM

Those boilers looked exactly like the ones I tended while working as a Boiler Operator, except ours had electric ignition.
Gerald.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 17, 2018, 05:35:34 PM
Hi All


Firstly thanks for the comments and the suggestions they are very helpful.  I've ordered a new manifold which will take about 2 - 3 weeks to arrive so I can't get too much done before then.


Ian you are right about turning the manifold around and this is exactly what I was trying to do, but its all so close together its very difficult which is why I did not go this route in the first place.  I would have achieved it though if I would have used a flexible pipe to connect the manifold to the separator which is the way I'm going to go now.


I have had a go at the other end of the exhaust pipe though which runs from the separator to the funnel.  I decided to use 3/16 tube for the exhaust which I guess is the equivalent in steam terms of a young lad putting a big bore exhaust on his Vauxhall Corsa  {-)


Using this larger tube caused me a few issues - firstly its really hard to manipulate without it collapsing even with the correct size benders.  Secondly I could not fit the tube through the funnel using fittings as the 3/16 fittings are huge.  So I resorted to simply running a nice straight pipe up the funnel with a nice swept bend on the bottom.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/17/IMG_2313.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/17/IMG_2314.jpg)


I then made the pipe from the separator using a much larger valve straight out the top of the separator.  This was then connected to the funnel by a flexible pipe.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/17/IMG_2315.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/17/IMG_2316.jpg)


Now its not as pretty as before  {:-{  but it will work much better than the last version especially when the engine exhaust manifold is a straight connection to the separator.  I think that I need to make a support for the long tube but as always I welcome your comments on what I hope is an improvement.  I think its a case of function over form.  I'll get another update when the manifold arrives and then I can get on with building the hull which is my favourite job  O0


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: rhavrane on February 18, 2018, 08:17:24 PM
Bonjour Mark,
My friend Emmanuel is liking challenges as you, he installed his TVR1A steam plant in a small and narrow boat  ok2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCzolavGB5I
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on February 18, 2018, 09:18:21 PM
Hi Mark you could bend the pipes neatly at both ends and connect them with silicon tube hidden under the decking just a thought

Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 25, 2018, 02:22:13 PM
Well I've still had no joy getting a replacement manifold and I thinks its going to take time to get one.  So this weekend I spent far too many hours straightening the manifold and re-opening the outlet on the front cylinder.  Its actually come out ok but the front cylinder outlet is still slightly to small but its the best that I can do and also the flanges are now about 1/2 the thickness that they were before.  I also have some very painfully singed fingers as I had to keep re-heating the piece to get it to do anything but I'll get over it  {-)


Having said that it has allowed me to finish the pipework for the exhaust and if push comes to shove I can use this manifold but I'm still going to perceiver and try and get a replacement.  I would like to thank everyone for their input as the exhaust pipe is now half if its original length and has increased in diameter from 5/32 to 3/16 and the back pressure has all but gone.


A few pictures of the finished pipe work and underneath the short piece of silicone tube is brass tube that is only about 2mm apart so its a very good joint


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/25/IMG_2319.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/25/IMG_2320.jpg)


And I've also made the pipe support for the exhaust and put a bend on the end as suggested by John which actually works really nicely


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/25/IMG_2321.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/25/IMG_2322.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/02/25/IMG_2323.jpg)


So that's it for the steam plant as it works very nicely and so does the RC gear.  Its now going to be fully stripped out and I can start building the actual boat so its back to the woodwork for me.  Now I'm a slow builder so please don't expect weekly updates but I will make sure that the entire build is on here as it progresses until it hits the water.


This has been my first live steam build and I can't thank everyone enough who has given me advice and encouragement.  I do have to say a special thank you to my friend George (Ooyah) who has answered my almost daily emails about technical problems that I just did not understand.  I learnt a lot and I just cannot thank him enough  :-))   Also Nigel at Pendle Steam who backs up his products like no one I've ever dealt with before.  I'll be getting my next boiler from him too.  Anyway enough of my rambling lets get on a build a boat  %%
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on February 25, 2018, 11:28:44 PM
Hi Mark great job ,also may need some reinforcing at the bottom of the frames and or top bracing before planking
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on February 26, 2018, 11:54:09 AM
Hi Mark,


Tremendous work, the whole plant looks a delight. Trust you have taken lots of photos. Once dismantled, it would helpful to see some photos of the plant laid out on the bench.


Cheers


Ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on March 04, 2018, 02:22:29 PM
Thanks for the comments  :-))


A little update today - Firstly I've removed all of the steam plant to get on with building the hull.  It looks so empty now and you just can't believe the amount of work thats already gone into this build looking at it now  {-)   It needed a good clean as it was covered in oil from being flung from the engine crankshaft and I've enlarged the holes in the bulkheads for the wiring.  They were 8mm but they are now 10mm as the servo connectors just fitted through and by the time its got two coats of resin on they probably would not fit so it was a precautionary job.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2328.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2329.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2327.jpg)


Next was to put the false decks back in to support the frames whilst the planking is carried out.  And this is where I discovered some problems that needed sorting out.  Where the bullheads have been left with no support for quite a few months and also had a lot of heat around them from the boiler testing they had moved.  Two of them quite considerably and they no longer fitted correctly in the false decks.  To solve this I used heat from a hot air gun and clamps to pull everything straight.  I did have to completely remove one of the ribs and re-set it.  I guess this is really par for the course as I've altered the kit extensively and its been bashed around too.  The false decks are removed after planking as discarded and the instructions suggest that they are nailed in but I used screws instead.  I also strengthen the whole structure by gluing in some extra supports.  It took me two full days to get the hull perfectly straight and aligned  :o


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2330.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2331.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2332.jpg)


And then a great moment for me - I removed the hull from the building board where its been for months as now its time to sand the bulkheads into shape for the planks to fit snuggly.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2333.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2334.jpg)


Now I know a lot of builders hate this part of the build but for me this is what its all about.  I learnt from my last build that taking your time and getting this part absolutely spot on makes the rest of the build so much easier.  So I did a quick survey using a straight edge to see how all of the frames lined up and immediately found two low spots which would cause the planks to have spring in them.  I simply marked the low points - surprise, surprise one the low points was the frame that I had to re-set


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2335.jpg)


And then simply glued and clamped some slivers of wood onto the low points to build them up.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2336.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/04/IMG_2337.jpg)


There will be lots more of this kind of repair to be carried out to get the hull perfect, but these two areas were so obvious it seemed the natural place to start - and thats it for now.


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: tghsmith on March 04, 2018, 03:56:10 PM
looking great..you are very very correct ,time spent faring the frames is time well spent.. I've given the frame edges a coat of paint to sand away during the sanding process.. sanding using flexible wood strips with grades of sand paper attatched..high and low spot show up show up quickly..
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on March 04, 2018, 05:21:53 PM
Thank you and thats the word I was looking for "Faring".  Yes it takes me quite a long time to get the faring right and I like to start at the keel and work my way down the frames.  The last time I used many strips of wood just like planks to see if there were any discrepancies between the frames until I got it just about right and I'm going to do the same this time too.  I really enjoy building the hull even though it can take a very long time to get it right.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on March 04, 2018, 05:26:06 PM
Oh I forgot to say that I've ordered some 1/4 x 1/8 brass rectangular bar from Maidstone Engineering to bond and screw to the keel for protection too.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on March 11, 2018, 03:12:30 PM
Another update from me - I wasn't sure whether or not to post this as I'm unsure how much detail people are interested in.  Let me know if its too much and I'll wait until more progress is made before posting again.


Firstly now that I'm building the hull I've been studying the plans that came with the kit.  To my dismay although they are marked 1:1 the plans supplied are not to scale.  Its not possible to take measurements from the drawings which is a real shame so instead I'm having to guess.  I don't think that it would take much for the manufacturer to get something as fundamental as this correct.  I think that I personally will be okay but someone just starting out in boat building would struggle as the written instructions are at best vague too.  This is definitely a kit for someone with experience (Says the fella who's only built one boat before  {-) )


Anyway I have been working away faring the frames and I'm finding lots of low spots that need building up.  Its a simple process of just gluing some extra wood on to the frame and then sanding back.  I would personally like to thank they various coffee suppliers in the UK for the wood that they have supplied me free of charge in the form of coffee stirrers.  They are perfect for the job but they must be clamped very tight as some of these repairs to the frames are just slivers really.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/11/IMG_2339.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/11/IMG_2338.jpg)


And once sanded look like you have done nothing at all.  But this slow process pulls everything straight and makes sure that the planks when fitted are not sprung and fit snuggly against the frames


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/11/IMG_2340.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/11/IMG_2341.jpg)


Then its just a case of faring the frames little by little until its just about right.  Here's a picture of one side of the stern roughed out and the other side un-touched.  I say roughed out as its no where near the finished article yet.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/11/IMG_2342.jpg)


Here's another example of a low point.  Both sides of the stern are now roughed out but the centre of the keel is about 0.5mm low.  Its really tempting to just carry on sanding but that would change the shape of the frames so they needed building up.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/11/IMG_2343.jpg)


And once sanded it looks like it should and brings the keel up level and straight.  This will stop a dip in the planks at the stern and make the planking easier in the long run (I hope)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/11/IMG_2344.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/11/IMG_2345.jpg)


So loads more to do as I've only just started really but I hope this is not too much detail


Thanks - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: pendlesteam on March 11, 2018, 09:04:12 PM
Fantastic work Mark - If I could only work with wood!! I would like a big, open top launch to fit one of my boilers and show off all I can, but alas I build boats like you probably build boilers. Keep the updates coming.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: jpdenver on March 12, 2018, 02:04:47 AM
Mark,

I am late to this build, but as I am just beginning my latest attempt,
I will be watching how an experienced builder does the various tasks, before I attempt them.

I will be posting my meager attempt as I go.

Please keep up the level of detail. You will not bore any one here, and
it will help all of us less experienced builders.

Regards,
Jim Pope
Denver, Colorado
USA
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on March 12, 2018, 11:47:18 AM
Hi Mark, Please keep the posts coming.


Regards the actual scale of the plans; the photo-copying process corrupts and alters  the true scale by a small %. Therefore a photo-copy of a photo-copy can be 'out' by a fair amount. I believe the error is one of enlargement. On some plans I have seen a datum line line, say 100mm long printed on the plan that allows the plan (or sections of it) to be photo-copied at the correct scale by altering the printer settings accordingly. Which is handy if you need to produce templates  or take measurements directly off the plan etc.
Are you able mark a known dimension on the plan byway of creating a datum and photo-copy that section or sections. It is then a matter of trial & error with the printer settings until you get the datum coming out at the right length. Just a thought.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on March 12, 2018, 02:18:11 PM
Thanks for the replies Iíll keep the detail coming until it gets too much for you all  %%  or me  :embarrassed:


Nigel - Could be my next build but I am sooooo slow you probably be waiting for years!


Jim - Iíve seen your build and that is one lovely boat your going to build so Iíll be following


Ian - I think your spot on there. Fortunately the part I wanted to measure was the bearding line at the stern as the planking runs off of the frames and ends up flat along the keel. Iím just going to do it by eye and as long as both sides are symmetrical it will be okay. I think a less confident builder would struggle a bit but could sort it out with s bit of help and advice


tghsmith - I meant to say that your idea of using paint on the frames to help fare  them is brilliant. Iíve actually been using the burn marks from the lazer cutting for roughing out which I guess is the same thing


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: steamboatmodel on March 12, 2018, 02:27:35 PM

Hi Mark,
Keep on with the details. My first attempt at a plank on frame was a Dumas kit, which assumed you were a Danish Shipwright. That is a neat tip about the stir sticks (would have to buy some, over here the coffee shops all use plastic ones). With the burn marks from lasers I found you had to sand them off to get the glues to stick.
Gerald.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on March 18, 2018, 03:07:40 PM
Hi Gerald you are spot on there mate; I learned that lesson the hard way with my last build so now all of the burnt edges are sanded clean.


I've not much to update this week as the faring process is a slow one for me to get to a point where I'm happy with it.  I'm sure that you could get equally good results without going to the hassle that I do but thats just me.  Any way I thought that I would post a few pictures of my technique of getting this right.


Firstly its difficult to see where you are sanding as matching one frame to another involves so many different angles.  I get around this by marking the frame with pencil to see where I am sanding.  The far edge is my guide and requires no sanding as otherwise I would loose the shape of the frame and therefore change the shape of the hull.  This marking is done time and time again.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/18/IMG_2347.jpg)


Once I've taken quite a lot of the excess material off I then only mark the highest point on the frame; again using pencil.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/18/IMG_2349.jpg)


And then keep making and sanding until I get a clean sweep on the frame.  At this point the frame is just about right.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/18/IMG_2350.jpg)


This process is laborious and time consuming - Its the sort of thing whereby I have to do a couple of hours work and walk away for a while.  It works for me and will make the planking a whole lot easier in the long run and something that I believe is worth spending as much time as necessary to complete.


I've got it wrong a couple of times which has involved bring the frame back up using my favourite coffee shop stirrers.  I have also found that CA is not good for this job it just doesn't seem to give the quality fixing of aliphatic resin.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/18/IMG_2351.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/18/IMG_2352.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/18/IMG_2353.jpg)


And finally this is how I check to see if the frames are correct.  I use a 3mm diameter plastic rod and lay it across the frames.  I prefer this to using planks as its got a very small contact area and shows up the smallest of errors in my work.  This little rod has become my nemesis  {-)
Ignore the strengthening on the frames its the light coloured frames that matter.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/18/IMG_2354.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/18/IMG_2355.jpg)


And thats it for now.  I've got lots of sanding and repairing to do but I am enjoying it which for any hobby is the most important thing.


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: tghsmith on March 18, 2018, 04:05:02 PM
time spent fairing the frames will all be returned during the planking and hull finishing,, looking great..
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on March 18, 2018, 05:17:02 PM
Hi Mark,


Lovely work. As you say, the the most important aspect is enjoying and gaining pleasure from the build process.


Cheers


Ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Rmay on March 19, 2018, 02:52:09 PM
Mark I am enjoying your build thread. I'll be starting the same kit next month when I get back from a family vacation. I have to say I've learned more in your thread than anything the booklet has taught me so far. My version will be "slightly" less complicated with an electric motor instead of steam. Right now, Iím only in the planning stages trying to rectify the ladder (Google image from another build) going to the 2nd deck?? I do not want to take away too away much from the charm of the design, but there are a few items still to be sorted out Ė at least in my head! Thanks for posting and as far as Iím concerned please be a descriptive as you want. I for one do not tire from the detailed explanation.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on March 25, 2018, 12:44:19 PM
Hi Rmay - good luck with your build  :-))   Your electric build should cause you less issues than I have as I've really had to knock the hull around to get the steam plant to fit.


A small update which doesn't look much but there have been plenty of Mark hours put into this.


First up I marked out the bearding line and cut the rabbet on the keel for the planks to sit in.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/25/IMG_2366.jpg)


Unfortunately I discovered that I had been a bit too heavy handed when I faired the first two frames at the bow.  This meant that I had to build them back up again with some wood and then reshape them to the correct level.  This is very tricky as its all done by eye and took me several attempts to get it right.  Now I know it doesn't look exactly amazing but I now know that its right.  I have also finished fairing the one side of the hull.  In this photo you can also see the finished repair on the 3rd frame back.  Honestly these low points are literally slivers of wood and nothing else.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/25/IMG_2367.jpg)


I've also marked out the stern and skeg to where the planking goes too.  This has really caused me to think about how the planking must be done.  Ok I'll try my best to explain.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/25/IMG_2368.jpg)


This is a double planked hull and the planks on the skeg sit on top of the skeg and are proud of the surface. Now if I put both layers of planking on top of the skeg it will not look right as it will be too thick and stand too proud of the surface.
So I only want the second layer of planking to stand proud - So the first layer needs to stop 1.5mm short of the finished line and also be rebated into the keel so that they sit flush.  So my next jobs are to repeat the same jobs on the other side of the hull and then rebate the bearding line at the stern so some careful chisel work is needed to get this right.  I'll get some pictures up to explain this better when I've done it.


Here's a couple of pictures showing the transitions between the frames on the finished side.  Goodness this takes ages but is worth it.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/25/IMG_2369.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/03/25/IMG_2370.jpg)


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on March 25, 2018, 01:43:10 PM
Hi Mark fine job you are doing ,If I may suggest filling the stern section with balsa as the planks may be too narrow and as I assume it will be painted should look ok
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on March 25, 2018, 02:14:57 PM
Hi John that's a lovely hull that you are building there with some really twisted planks too that look nice and straight.  Thats a difficult thing to get right and your looks perfect  :-))


I have thought about putting balsa into the stern - but wait for it - famous last words here.............I'm going to try and plank it first as I see this as a real challenge.  Lets hope I win  {-)   If not its balsa all the way  ;)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on April 02, 2018, 02:46:52 PM
Hi All


I hope that this photo explains better what I was trying to say with regards to the keel and skeg.  I have now chiseled out a tapered rebate so that the first layer of planks sit flush against the keel on the skeg.  The second layer of planks will sit on top of the first layer and therefore stand proud on the skeg.  The first layer is 1.5mm inside the final finished line too so that the second layer sits where it should.  If that sounds complicated you should try working it out with limited instructions  {-)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/02/IMG_2374.jpg)


This was done on both sides and I'm quite pleased with the transitions between the frames.  I've lost count of the hours of work that have gone into getting this right.  The other thing that I became aware of is as i was cutting the rabbets on both sides the keel strength lessens and becomes quite vulnerable to snapping off.  I just treated it very easily to save any damage.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/02/IMG_2375.jpg)


Then it was a good clean up to get rid of any dust and I also used white spirit to get it spotless ready for the planking.  The hull was put back onto the building board to make sure everything was straight and level.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/02/IMG_2378.jpg)


Now this is where I have had to stop due to the way the first plank is installed.  The picture below shows where the very first plank is laid following the line of the top of the bulwarks.  To fit this plank it must be bent and twisted through both planes which ironically goes against planking in general by not being able to let the plank lay naturally.  I can see why its has to be done this way and because its the top plank the curve should reduce as it comes lower down the hull.  Anyway I've tried and tried and I've realised that this plank is not going on without being nailed to I've ordered a tool for the job.  The plan is to fit three planks on the bulwarks to add some strength and keep the whole thing straight, and then turn it over and start at the garboard plank against the keel.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/02/IMG_2377.jpg)


I hope that all makes sense?


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on April 08, 2018, 12:03:25 PM
I've managed to get a bit more done but not much due to having man flu  :((


Now this first plank has caused me a few more issues than it should have to be honest.  Firstly the picture on the plans which shows where the first plank goes is really just a "This is roughly where it needs to go" picture and is just a representation.  The builder has to make their own decisions and I have had to try to get the best possible position mainly by eye.  Anyway as per usual it has taken up lots of hours and in the end I just stopped over thinking it and put it on.


The other problem was that I found that the stern wanted to twist when the planks where installed due to the twist in the planks applying pressure to the frames.  I cured this first by making a temporary support at the stern which looking at the pictures is a bit over the top  %%


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/08/IMG_2381.jpg)


Then the first plank went on and I've tried to keep a nice clean sweep in its lines as the plan suggests. I gave it a bit of a soak in some warm water but this lime wood is very flexible without getting it wet.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/08/IMG_2382.jpg)


And it was extremely satisfying to see that all of the effort that when into cutting the rabbet has paid off. A nice clean joint on the bow with the plank.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/08/IMG_2385.jpg)


And then for the other side - I've used a mixture of brass push pins. map pins and clamps to hold them in place.  The brass pins have been left slightly proud as they are all coming out once the aliphatic resin has set


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/08/IMG_2386.jpg)


It doesn't really look much, but this is quite a mile stone for me in this build.  Its also one that has really made me think about how to get the best result from the planking.  I just hope that I've got it about right.


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on April 08, 2018, 02:38:42 PM
Hi Mark usually the first plank is the garboard plank which is the one next the keel then continue with exact pairs on each side. O0
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on April 08, 2018, 03:17:28 PM
Hi John - yep I fully agree but the plans on the kit say that this is the first plank to be laid (well in Italian).  My plan is to put 2 more planks below this first one on each side to give the hull stability and then turn it over and make the garboard plank.  That way I can then come off of the keel straight with the following planks as a said in my previous post.


I'm sure that the reason for this is due to the way the frames are supported by the false decks that are supplied with the kit.  I guess that normally the basic framework would be fixed to a board upside down to keep it all straight.  Therefore the garboard plank would be the place to start and build from there.  Bear in mind that this is my first POF build so I do need to follow the instructions up to a certain point.

Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on April 09, 2018, 02:35:47 AM
Hi Mark I really hope that you don't find my comments derogatory ,but as a scratch builder and thrown at least one crooked hull in the bin ,lesson learned ,and without the help and advise from fellow Mayhemers I doubt I would still be building model steam boats.
I am not into kit models but it can be seen on your plans that some planks will be pencil point thin at bow and stern ,will the model be painted or glass fibre?
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on April 09, 2018, 03:10:31 AM
Hi Mark you may find this link helpful http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,60453.msg637179.html#msg637179

John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on April 15, 2018, 01:51:15 PM
Hi John all comments are welcome on this thread as everyone has a different point of view, and I like the way fellow Mayhemer's care about each others builds.


The hull is to be double planked and then it will get a coat of resin and cloth and be spray painted as I've had nice results doing it this way before.  Ignore the picture on the plans as its just a rendering and is not really representative of the model as I've discovered going along.  I shouldn't get many thinly tapered planks as I'm going to use drop planks and stealers.  Getting around the propshaft is going to be tricky though.


Anyway I've planked the bulwarks and they have come out quite nicely.  This is quite important as the bulwark supports are all removed once the deck is in place so it needs to hold its shape on its own.  I have had a little but of clinkering on the bow due to laterally bending of the planks but nothing thats bad and its only slight. I shouldn't get anymore as further planking doesn't need to be bent that way. The hull is also nice and straight so here's a few Pictures.


The planks are fitting very nicely into the rabbet on the stem


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/15/IMG_2389.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/15/IMG_2390.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/15/IMG_2391.jpg)


The planks cut to length at the stern


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/15/IMG_2392.jpg)


Looking from the inside


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/15/IMG_2393.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/15/IMG_2394.jpg)


And above at the bow stem


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/04/15/IMG_2395.jpg)


They are glued using aliphatic resin as I like to glue the planks together along their entire length which seems to remove any springiness that can occur.  So far so good and the next stage is to turn the hull upside down and make the garboard strake. Then I'll start planking from the keel upwards


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on April 15, 2018, 03:04:48 PM
Thanks Mark all looking good ,here is another link that may be helpful http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=152945
cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on April 16, 2018, 09:06:02 AM
Hi Mark, lovely work. What's the design / configuration of those clamps with the knurled barrels?


Ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: tghsmith on April 16, 2018, 10:32:27 AM
https://www.micromark.com/Planking-Clamps-10   I'm sure there are other sources..
https://www.hobbytools.com.au/hull-planking-clamp-set-3-16-and-larger/
I've seen some made from thick aluminum channel with a thumb screw that clamps from the frame side..
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on April 16, 2018, 12:54:40 PM
Thanks Ian and yes they are Micromark clamps. They are good but could quite easily be made to save a bit of money
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on May 12, 2018, 05:10:17 PM
Hi All


Sorry its been a while but I've been busy at work and I also came across a problem that just completely stopped me in my tracks due to lack of experience.  More of that later but here's what I've been up too including many mistakes!


Firstly I completed the bulwarks which needed a 1/2 stealer dropping in. There is quite a change of angle as the planking goes downwards and no plank can be bent to accommodate this so a full plank was required below.  This is the first stealer that I have ever made and was quite pleased with the fit


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2416.jpg)


Which immediately showed me that I had not shaped the stern correctly at all


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2417.jpg)


So to cure this I steamed the stern piece so that I could see the correct shape.  I marked this out and reshaped the stern which also meant that I also had to reshape the very rear frames too.  In hindsight this was foolish of me not to do this in the first place - oh well we live and learn  O0


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2418.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2419.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2421.jpg)


Rather than loose a whole plank I removed just half of the old plank and then clamped a new piece in place


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2422.jpg)


And the results were far better which was pleasing - Another benefit of using a stealer at this point was it removed the lateral bending of the plank too.  This was not planned it was just pure fluke but hey I'll take it  {-)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2425.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2423.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2424.jpg)


Next to make was the garboard plank, and I started this by making a paper template.  I had to go and buy a flexible edge - I've not used one of these in years  :embarrassed:   I pinned the paper in place and then put the next plank along onto the frames to mark out its shape


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2396.jpg)


I then joined up the dots so to speak


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2398.jpg)


And I ended up with a template that looked like this


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2400.jpg)


Which was then transferred to the wooden plank which was then soaked for a couple of hours and clamped in place to dry on the hull


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2401.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2402.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2405.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2406.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2407.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2404.jpg)


I ended up with a nice fitting plank once it was dry.  This lime wood also holds it shape nice too  :-))


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2408.jpg)


Unfortunately I then came to a grinding halt  <:(   I realised that after I had made the garboard plank I had nothing to reference it too.  By this I mean that I did not know if it was too far up the bow stem and was it too wide at the stern?  It dawned on me that there's more to planking than just banging a few planks onto the hull and hoping for the best.  This must be so obvious to most of you but I thought that I could just kind of work it out as I went along - wrong!!!!!


I'm glad to say that I have managed to sort out my problems but I've been typing for so long with this post I'll get some more up later and let you know how I got out of this self made hole.


Thanks for reading - Mark  :-)

Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: dreadnought72 on May 12, 2018, 06:29:42 PM
Hi Mark,


All looking great so far. There's a well-known risk of running the garboard planks too high up the bow - as it's so easy to do - but (of course) it causes big problems later. My penny would say:


Keep it up: I'm loving this.  :-))


Andy
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on May 13, 2018, 08:31:36 AM
Hi Andy  - Thanks and I have to agree with all of your comments and advice  :-))


Now this is where I discovered that the planking was not going to be as straight forward as I had hoped.  I put a few full width planks onto the hull and the results can be seen below.  The planks rise very quickly at the bow and start to overlap.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2414.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2415.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2413.jpg)


I did some looking on the internet at other builds of this boat and I couldn't find any that had all of the planking running from stem to stern? I guess that because this model is painted the planking can be done in just about any way as long as you get the shape of the hull correct.  However I see the building as a learning process and I want to see if this hull can be planking with all planks running from stem to stern.


So totally lost with what to do, for the last few weeks I've been reading books and articles on hull planking.  Now this it would seem is a very subjective topic and there are so many different methods that I became even more confused  {:-{   Many builders it would seem calculate the best fitting width of plank for their hulls and then go and make them. Well mines a kit with 7mm planks so they need to fit one way or another.  In the end I just simplified what I think all of the information was saying.


1. Let the planks lay as naturally as possible
2. Plan the planking run so that as few stealers and drop planks are used as possible
3. Break the hull build down into manageable widths by using temporary battens
4. Use these battens to work out the tapers of the planks
5. Whether I like it or not nearly all of the planks will need to be correctly tapered to fit


Now as my planks are 7mm wide I decided to plan my planking based on sections of three planks at a time.  I bought some thin strips for the battens and marked out the bands at midships and then let the battens follow the hull.  I think that I've had some success but I'll let you all be the judge of that by your comments  :-)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2433.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2434.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2436.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2437.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2432.jpg)


I've placed 4 battens down from the bulwarks and 3 battens up from the keel.  This leaves me a gap of 34mm between the two sections that will need filling with about 5 plank widths.  I think that this is just about the best I can do and I'll soon find out when the planking starts.  I'm going to mark the hull and remove the battens and somehow transfer the marks to the other side as a guide.  I'm not quite sure how I'm going to achieve this yet so if anyone has any ideas I would welcome them.  I can also see that getting around the propshaft is going to be a nightmare but I'll do it one way or another.


My favourite photo of the build so far is this one  O0  I like the way the battens swoop up the stern


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/05/12/IMG_2439.jpg)


Sorry for the war and peace update with so little progress in terms of actual building.  But this has been quite an education for me so I thought it best to share - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: dreadnought72 on May 13, 2018, 12:56:31 PM
Hi Mark,


Quote
5. Whether I like it or not nearly all of the planks will need to be correctly tapered to fit

Looks very much like it. As it's a kit, question #1 would be: do you have enough planking material to taper each plank?

The battening process is always a good one - it's used on (full size) clinker dinghies all the time. I've seen builds of those where literally weeks have passed, with the builders tweaking batten positions fractions of an inch at a time to ensure that the plank runs are fair and visually attractive. Of course, in this instance, for a carvel-built hull where the eventual planks will be invisible under paint you don't need to be quite that cautious, but I'd agree the goal is a good one: full-length planks, running naturally, will always make for a stronger hull.

As for transferring batten positions from one side to another:

A divider's handy for checking batten marks, too - one point set on the keel/frame corner, the other set at the batten mark.

Apologies if this is all obvious!

Andy
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on May 13, 2018, 03:29:28 PM
Hi Andy


Would you believe it; this is a typical kit that does not supply enough planks to finish the job for the average builder.  You only need to make a few mistakes and you will run out - oh well thank goodness for Cornwall Model Boats who have a nice stock of strip wood  :-))


Having now marked out my planking runs (well on one side) I actually think that 7mm planks are far too wide for this build.  The hull changes shape and direction often and I think that 5mm planks would be more suitable.  So my second planking may be done in 5mm which actually would make fewer overlaps in the gaps of the first layer.  I guess its just something else to think about over the next few months.


Thanks for the advice regarding marking out the other side of the hull.  Funnily enough I will do this on the second planking but having thought things through I'm just making two of each plank for the first layer.  Its going to be a bit quicker even if it doesn't turn out completely symmetrical and I'll see just how good my marking out is - or should I say isn't  {-)


Today I've had a go at making the first 3 planks below the bulwarks which I've had to make a drop plank to stop them crowding on the bow or becoming splinters at the end.  Its turned out ok and I enjoyed working out all of the measurements so that the joins occurred on the frame rather than being in the middle of nowhere, and that no plank is tapered more than 50% of its original width.  Its another first for me and my budding carpentry skills  {-)  Hopefully I'll have a bit more of an update in a couple of weeks


Mark  :-) [size=78%] [/size]



Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on June 03, 2018, 09:56:06 AM
Hi All


A bit of an update on my planking efforts which I'm having to fit in around quite a lot of family time at the moment - well the sun is out and you have to make the most of it  ok2   Ok I made the first section of three planks below the bulwarks which as I said before needed a drop plank fitting in the bow as the tapers on the planks were turning the ends into splinters.  I think it came out quite nicely as this is the first time I've made one of these joints before.

(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2458.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2457.jpg)


And some pictures of the side and stern


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2459.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2461.jpg)


Then I made the next three plank section which I found a little easier as my plank tapering skills are starting to improve purely out of repetition.  The nice thing is I only have to measure and make one plank accurately as I can then use this as a template for the next five.  I would be lost without my little Veritas plane as its great to get the shape just right without all of the dust that sanding them would bring.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2472.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2473.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2476.jpg)


You can see all of my calculations on the wall board for each bulkhead to work out the plank tapers.  I thought that this would be a pain to do but actually I've found it to be a great system that so far seems to be working


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2474.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2475.jpg)


Just a few pictures of where the hull is at the moment without any pins or clamps


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2477.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2478.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2479.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/03/IMG_2480.jpg)


I could really speed the whole planking process up if I changed glues from aliphatic resin to cyano but I've decided at this stage not too.  I like the way the resin gives me lots of time to move things into their correct position and if I do get it wrong - sorry I meant when I get it wrong again it simply comes apart.  Its slow but enjoyable  :-))


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: ooyah/2 on June 08, 2018, 09:24:24 PM
Mark,
Great workmanship and the skeleton is beginning to take shape.  I know it's a bit difficult to combine your day job and also to spend time with wife and family especially as it's so warm in the workshop.
I shall keep on looking at progress even if it takes some time.


George.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on June 08, 2018, 11:33:03 PM
Very nice work Mark...... :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on June 09, 2018, 08:18:37 PM
Thanks lads - I've made some progress but this weekend I've been stripping and rebuilding my sons motorbike engine as he managed to run it dry of oil  <*<   Its working now as Dad has worked his magic and brought it back to life after changing the crankshaft bearings.  Needless to say he's learnt his lesson but the boat has had to wait  {:-{
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on June 11, 2018, 11:31:54 PM
Nice work Mark love these old tugs lots of characterCheersJohn
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Bernhard on June 12, 2018, 07:21:57 AM
 :-)) Tip-Top looking real good
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Footski on June 12, 2018, 07:42:34 AM
Planking going very well indeed so far. Keep it up and the hull is going to be beautiful.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on June 17, 2018, 06:35:22 PM
Thanks very much for the nice comments I really appreciate it  :-))   I've now completed the first four sections that I marked out with the battens and its surprisingly gone to plan.  I can now start to see the shape of the hull - here are the pictures


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/17/IMG_2494.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/17/IMG_2495.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/17/IMG_2496.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/17/IMG_2497.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/17/IMG_2498.jpg)


Funnily enough its doesn't look a lot but to get the plank tapers right takes quite a lot of work.  Now for the really difficult bit - Its time to turn the hull upside down and work from the keel upwards.  I'll get some more pictures up when I can hopefully next weekend.


Thanks Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on July 21, 2018, 10:10:44 AM
Hi All


Sorry for the lack of posting but I've done a bit more so time for another update on my build  :-))


Firstly it was time to start the planking from the keel which involved making the garboard plank which is quite twisty.  I made the garboard plank and the next two that follow too, and then gave them a good soak and clamped them into place.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2499.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2501.jpg)


Once they were dry they looked like this once they were taken off


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2503.jpg)


They were then glued on and I also extended them to the bow stem.  You will notice that I made these planks in two halves this is because trying to shape them, bend them and also make them fit into the rabbet at both ends proved impossible for me.  Hence the two halves which made the job much easier.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2509.jpg)


The run of the planks meant that they left a gap which was filled with a half stealer plank


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2510.jpg)


And a few pictures of the one side completed


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2511.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2512.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2513.jpg)


Then it was onto the other side - if in doubt use a powerful clamp  {-)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2514.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2515.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2516.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2548.jpg)


Next I moved onto trying to plank around the propshaft tube.  I knew that this was going to be particularly difficult, and the builds that I have seen tend to make this out of lots of small pieces of wood and quite a lot of filler.  I now understand why this would be the favoured method but this is my take on the problem.


These photos are just general measuring and marking out


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2549.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2550.jpg)


I then cut around the propshaft tube and glued the planks into place.  A little easier said than done


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2551.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2552.jpg)


I then finished the planking by making a half stealer to fit around the bottom of the propshaft tube and also made the next plank too.


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2553.jpg)


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2554.jpg)


Its by no means perfect but for a first attempt and also first layer of planking I'll take this result quite happily


(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/07/21/IMG_2555.jpg)


The next stage is to plank around the propshaft on the other side and then try and progress the planking up and down.  I'll post some more when this has been done.


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: IanJ on July 21, 2018, 04:25:11 PM
Mark,


Magnificent! You should be very pleased.


Ian
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on July 21, 2018, 04:56:57 PM
Have been patiently waiting for your latest efforts Mark, and not dissapointed. Very nice workmanship.


Stewart
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on July 21, 2018, 07:11:17 PM
Hi Ian and Stewart  :-)


Thanks for the comments; the build is coming along ok albeit very slowly.  I'm noticing now that my woodworking skills are starting to improve a bit but they are no where near where I would like to be.  Practice and time will hopefully improve things.


I keep on thinking about things I could have done better - for example I still get dent marks in the wood even when I try and protect the planks from the clamps.  My cutting up to a line leaves quite a lot to be desired but I'll keep at it.  I also now wished that I had scarf jointed the planks where they butt together like BB does.  Maybe on the next layer of planking I'll give it a go as I've never tried it before.


I am however really enjoying the challenge  :-))


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: dreadnought72 on July 22, 2018, 12:03:09 PM
Scarfs:


For scarfing model boat planking, you'd probably be best making a u-shaped form (aluminium, brass?) with an eight-to-one slope on the vertical sides. Insert plank, hold it steady, and run a blade down the form to accurately cut the scarf. Repeat for plank#2, the other way up! I suspect it would be easiest to glue the scarf up, off the boat.


Clamp crushing: I always used a sacrificial scrap of ply over the plank to distribute the load. Light crushing can be repaired by a gentle, localised, soak of water: a damp ball of cotton wool works well.


Your planking so far is lovely: a real shame to cover it up!  :-))


Andy
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on July 22, 2018, 03:16:05 PM
Hi Andy


Thats is brilliant help regarding scarf joints - thank you  :-))


I've seen them but never actually made one and I was wondering if there was a ratio that worked for model boat planking.  I am going to give it a go and I'll make a template as you have suggested as I've got some brass that I can use.  I'll wait until I'm happy with the results until they make it onto the build itself.


Clamp crushing - what a nightmare  >>:-( Just when you think its all protected from the jaws, you remove the clamps in the morning to discover dents.  I'll try as you have suggested and see if I can get some of them out.


Now its funny what you have said about covering up the planking; because I was thinking about really trying to get the second layer spot on and then using clear varnish instead of paint.  I can't help but feel as though I'm getting ahead of myself saying this but I think I'd like to give it a go.  The perfect scenario for me would be to use a very dark wood to mark the water line but this brings up lots of problems for me. 


Firstly the second planking would be in exactly two halves obviously above and below this line and I'm not sure how the planking would work out.  I would have to look into this and see if its possible to run full length planks this way.  To be honest I've not even worked out how I'm going to clamp the first layer of planks to the second layer as there are some really awkward bends that I will need to get together.


Secondly the keel is made of ply which doesn't look good when varnished so it would need a layer of veneer.  Once again this is something that I have never tried and it would be a very very tricky shape to get around and also look good.


Lots of food for thought and you can see why my builds take forever  {-)   I'm learning as I go


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on October 28, 2018, 04:44:57 PM
Hi Mark, I have discovered your thread only today. Any progress?

You did a wonderful job on the steam plant and on the hull, I really like it. All the planking reminds me of building my tug, which is much smaller though. I used full length planks as well, except on the bottom of the hull, where I resorted to diagonal planking. This was I was able to get everything covered nicely, while minimising the need to shape the ends in difficult shapes.
Anyway, with your beautiful planking, I suggest you keep the wood visible, it would be a shame to cover it with paint.  I did this on my tug too and didn't regret it, although it is not necessarily prototypical. --> http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,11688.0.html
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 28, 2018, 05:45:33 PM
Hi KNO3 thanks for the link to your build its simply amazing what a lovely job  :-))


I've had a much needed break from building, which has resulted in some really nice family and general chilling time.  I love boat building but quite often feel the need to step away for a while whilst I recharge my batteries and do something completely different.


Having said that I started building again this weekend and loved every minute of it.  I have been popping in and out of the forum just to see what others have been doing but not really contributing.


Well thats about to change as I'm back in building mode and I'll have some decent updates on this build quite soon  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on October 28, 2018, 06:27:17 PM
Well, it's good to hear you're back in business! I completely understand the need to take breaks. I work on my steam engines very only every now and then, when I feel like it. After all it is a hobby and it should be fun, not degenerate into work :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 24, 2018, 03:21:24 PM
Hi All


Well after quite a long and much needed break, I've been back on the Anteo and the enjoyment has returned  :-)   Its funny really now that I'm back building I really have missed it.  So where was I on the build.......Oh yes I had just finished planking around the prop tube on one side and needed to do the other side.


Well what a fool I was; never ever stop building at such an awkward point.  For the life of me, even after looking back at my pictures I couldn't remember exactly how I did it  >>:-(   A hard lesson was learnt here as I needed the sides to be absolutely identical, so a job that should have been a bit difficult turned into one that was extremely difficult.  I got it sorted in the end and its near identical enough for me.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2605.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2606.jpg)


Next I started moving forward towards the bow and I used the marks that I had previously put on the frames as a guide.  Its funny as I have noticed that I do not sand any planks at all any more.  I use my little plane which is quick and makes less mess.  It wasn't an intentional change it just seems to have happened but it works very well for me


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2609.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2607.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2608.jpg)


Do you think I use enough clamps  %%   I've actually found that I'm using less glue on tighter fitting joints now, and its been nice using my home made clamps too


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2610.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2635.jpg)

(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2633.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2634.jpg)


Now that I've got this far I decided to concentrate on the starboard side as I'm not worried about distorting the hull anymore.  Its nice and straight and nearly complete.  So moving down the starboard side I like to put the planks in in groups of three.  I'm sorry about the dark pictures I'm not sure what I did wrong taking these pictures


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2645.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2646.jpg)


So its been loads of plank tapering and fitting and I've been loving it.  I'll get some more pictures up tomorrow of where I'm up too.


Thanks for looking and sorry its been so long being updated - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: SteamboatPhil on November 24, 2018, 10:01:50 PM
That really is a nice piece of planking, keep up the good work, I will of course keep following you build thread  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Jerry C on November 24, 2018, 11:21:32 PM
Nice work Mark, proper job. Will be heading back your way again in May. Reverse of 2018 cruise so in Dudley area late May early June probably. Must meet up this time.
Jerry.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 25, 2018, 09:41:35 AM
Hi Phil and Jerry its nice to hear from you both and thanks for the comments; and yes Jerry lets meet up next year  :-))


Ok so there are only two planks left to install on the starboard side to close the hull up on that side.  To work out the width of the planks I use proportional dividers; in fact I use these quite a lot now as it saves having to do so many calculations on my white board.  I've not used ticker tape here to allow for the curve of the frame as its almost a straight line between the planks.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2648.jpg)


I then put all of the measurements onto a plank and cut it to shape.  Here's a really good technique that I learnt from the web to put a lateral bend into a plank.  Simply use three clamps on a board to set the bend and then heat it up.  Once cooled down it maintains the lateral bend which allows the planks to sit flat on the frames which stops any clinkering.  I wish that I had known this when I had started my planking and its saves spilling the plank too  :-))


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2649.jpg)


To get the final plank shape which obviously needs to be a very close fit, I used masking tape.  Simply stretch it over the gap and use your finger nail to mark the lines onto the tape.  The place the tape onto the plank and there you have it - the perfect shape that just needs a little fettling to fit properly.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2650.jpg)


I then used pins to hold this last plank in place


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2653.jpg)


If you look closely at the brass clamp you can see that I had to use a half stealer to close the gap in the stern


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2652.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2654.jpg)


Ans then for the first time really you can see the correct shape of the hull.  Its a bit rough looking as it needs sanding and some filling but its not too bad.  I very pleased the way the planking has fitted in the rabbet at the stern.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2662.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2660.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2658.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2661.jpg)


A few more pictures


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2664.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2663.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/11/24/IMG_2659.jpg)


Thats it for now I need to close up the port side next which will take a little while.  I think its coming out ok so far and I'm pretty much learning as I'm going along - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Martin [Admin] on November 25, 2018, 11:03:47 AM
 
Looking Good Mark!

 Not tried that heating method!   :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on December 02, 2018, 09:47:33 AM
Very nice planking work, congratulations! Being so beautiful, I wouldn't paint the hull, I'd just clearcoat it with epoxy to have the planking visible.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Baldrick on December 02, 2018, 11:02:19 AM



   Very nice work Mike . Planking a hull is a real challenge especially to get it as good. But as KNO3 says what are your thoughts about finishing ?  OK fibreglass and epoxy over the whole of the interior to waterproof the hull but externally ? 
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 02, 2018, 12:34:52 PM
Hi lads thanks for the comments  :-))   I have got some ideas but Im not sure if I'm capable of doing what I would like to do.  This is only the first layer of planks so I've used this layer to learn and practice as much as I can for the final layer.


I've got some nice pieces of boxwood, pear and mahogany and I would like to cut some planks from these and then use all three woods on the hull. 
I'm thinking about using the light boxwood to mark out the water line and then use pear below this and mahogany above.  Now this is what I would like to do but I've never done it before so I'm not sure how it will pan out or even if its possible for me personally to do.  My thinking is that I'll give it a good go and if it doesn't look right I'll just paint the hull rather than using a clear coat to display the wood.  I'm sure I'll need loads of help and advice but hey I know where to come for that  :-)


Martin - this technique of bending laterally works really well and I would recommend it to anyone to give it a go.  Here's a bit of a better explanation of how its done.


Here is how the plank naturally wants to lie when placed on the hull.  You can see that it runs away from the planks above at the stem.  It can be forced into place but if you do this it will not sit flat on the bulkheads and cause clinkering.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/02/IMG_2670.jpg)


So what I do is mark the beginning of where I want the bend to start and also mark roughly where the middle of the bend will be.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/02/IMG_2671.jpg)


I then use these marks to clamp the plank to a board and put a bend in it just roughly to what I think it should be.  I really need to make myself a decent jig for this but I've been to lazy so far to make one  %%


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/02/IMG_2672.jpg)


Apply some heat - I use a heat gun simply because I've got one but I've also used my wife's hairdryer and that worked just as well


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/02/IMG_2673.jpg)


After its cooled try it for a fit on the hull and repeat as necessary until you get the desired bend.  Here's the plank after a couple of goes on the hull and you can see how now it naturally lays up to the planks above


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/02/IMG_2674.jpg)


Then do the same towards the stern and you end up with a plank which looks something like this.  The only other way to achieve this as far as I know would be to spile it which takes a lot longer and wastes a lot of timber too.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/02/IMG_2675.jpg)


Then fit and glue it, and you get a nice plank like this one which follows the shape of the hull and is a tight fit on the plank above it.  More importantly though is there are no built up stresses in the wood - its laying exactly the way it wants too.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/02/IMG_2676.jpg)


I have to stress that this is not my idea; I've simply robbed, stolen, pinched sorry borrowed someone else's expertise.  Well why reinvent the wheel!  Anyway I hope this helps someone.


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on December 02, 2018, 05:16:39 PM
Tut tut Mark, I can see a spek of dust on your cutting mat, you are getting untidy mate!


Only kidding......this is some quality build, cannot wait to see how the next layer comes out. Fingers crossed you don't have to paint her.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Geoff on December 03, 2018, 01:39:33 PM
I have been watching the planking operation with interest - it seems to be beautifully done and is a credit to you. In the thread you mentioned varnishing the final finish to show off the planking. An alternative would be to use epoxy resin as its much tougher than varnish and will give a very strong finish. If you want stronger you can cover it with finishing fibreglass tissue. The thinner the better as when wet with resin it goes completley transparent and shws every grain of the wood and after a couple of coats of resing any firbeglass gain is totally invisible. It makes for a very strong and completley waterproof hull.


Cheers and and keep up the good progress.


Geoff
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 03, 2018, 04:36:21 PM
Hi Stewart thanks mate and yes Iíve started getting a bit messy  :embarrassed:  however my wife will soon put me back on the straight and narrow if I keep it up  {-)


Hi Geoff thanks for comments and suggestion. I used fibreglass cloth and resin on my last build to get a nice surface to paint on. I never thought about using it again but I think your suggestion would probably be a better way to do the finish. The nice thing about using epoxy is that once itís dry I could use a fine scotch pad to get a Matt finish too  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 16, 2018, 06:10:07 PM
Hi everyone


Just a quick update  - At last  - yes at last I have placed the final planks on the other side of the hull (thanks god for that i hear you all say)  {-)   So now I have a complete hull albeit not water tight


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/16/IMG_2689.jpg)


Its not quite symmetrical but I'm quite pleased seeing as I only marked out one side of the hull and basically winged the other side


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/16/IMG_2692.jpg)


So I've started on the forecastle which shouldn't take long but boy is it clinkered simply because of the very tight radiuses  - but it'll be okay


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/16/IMG_2688.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/16/IMG_2691.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/12/16/IMG_2693.jpg)


So now its just a case of finishing the forecastle and getting down to some serious filling and sanding to get the shape that I want.  Its not too far off but in places I've done a really shoddy job but this is my first attempt at this. 


I'm off on my holidays tomorrow and will be in Egypt over Xmas and will be back on the 29th December to start again.  So I'd like to wish everyone on MBM a very merry xmas and also like to think everyone for there help and support.  I really couldn't do my builds without the help that I get here.  Speak to you all later in December :)


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Taranis on December 16, 2018, 06:15:10 PM
Looking very smart Mark I'm sure it will be perfection and nothing less even if it means doing bits again. I get frustrated with mistakes but get a doubling of satisfaction when I correct anything.
You need scale crewman in shot for a sense of scale and frivolity  :-))


Pictures are excellent thank you
(http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2018/06/17/IMG_2495.jpg)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 16, 2018, 06:21:15 PM
Ta Andy - I've got another layer of planks to go yet - honestly I can't wait  {-)   Mind you I'm planning on cutting these planks myself so I hope it works out.  As always I'll post the pictures complete with disasters too!!!
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Taranis on December 16, 2018, 06:23:53 PM
Ta Andy - I've got another layer of planks to go yet - honestly I can't wait  {-)   Mind you I'm planning on cutting these planks myself so I hope it works out.  As always I'll post the pictures complete with disasters too!!!
Sure you know that the second layer must be so much easier once you've contoured the first layer. So much pleasure ahead  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 16, 2018, 06:30:36 PM
Sure you know that the second layer must be so much easier once you've contoured the first layer. So much pleasure ahead  :-)


You'd like to think so but I've gone with the whole idea of using the planks as a finish rather than painting, so the second layer will not follow the lines of the first layer.  I'm hoping to use different woods as if i were painting it - famous last words but I'm going to give it a go.  I'll know if its going to work when I start marking out the second planking.  I'm going to need quite a lot of help so be ready for questions and advice :)  If all else fails I know I'm good with filler and an airbrush  %%
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Taranis on December 16, 2018, 06:32:22 PM
I think you'll make easy work of it when you get going
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 04, 2019, 03:45:17 PM
Hi All


Well I've managed to get some more work done on the Anteo.  Firstly I have finished the forecastle planking which funnily enough really caused me some problems.  I thought that it would be really easy using such short lengths but it wasn't.  The shape looks a bit strange and thats because once all of the planking is finished it has to be sculpted into shape so quite a lot if it will be removed.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2706.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2708.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2707.jpg)


So thats the first layer of planking done and I've a few observations about doing this type of model now.  There really are not enough bulkheads to get the perfect shape with the first layer of planking.  They are way too far apart and if this were a static model I would recommend using filler blocks between them to get a decent shape before planking.  As its an RC model you can't really to this - so if I were doing it again I would add extra bulkheads and then remove them after the planking was complete.


So next I've started just giving the planks an initial knock back with some pretty course sand paper on a block.  I've discovered lots of depressions which will require filling but I don't see this as a problem.  Its just time consuming but I need to get the hull perfect before the second layer of planking.  Here's what the Anteo looks like now after having the worst sanded down.  I'm honestly quite pleased with the way its coming along.  I can really see the shape of the hull now.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2709.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2710-1.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2711.jpg)


I've also been cutting some planks ready for the second layer.  Even if I wasn't trying to leave a natural finish on this model there is no way I would use the suppled planking wood for the second layer.  Its not very good quality lime wood and its so grainy which makes it very difficult to sand without it picking up on the surface  {:-{   I'll use it for stirring epoxy instead  {-)


These planks have been cut from boxwood which is a very close grained yellow wood and its lovely to work with - well cut on a table saw anyway!  They are 1150mm long, 1.6mm thick and 13mm wide but I think the finished width will be 6mm.  I'll know better once I've marked the final planking out.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2699.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2700.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2701.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/04/IMG_2702.jpg)


So this weekend I've got lots of filling and sanding to do which will please Lorraine no end.  She doesn't mind the dust as I always clean up, its the smell of the filler she doesn't like  %%   I'll keep you posted


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Tug Hercules Fireman on January 04, 2019, 11:58:08 PM
 
In Your post at 03:45:17 PM today, can you tell me about Your little sander with what appears to be a vacuum attachment?
 Looks like a great, smaller sander; I have not seen that one before.
 What is the make / model of it?
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 05, 2019, 09:56:33 AM
Hi - These sanding blocks are great  :-))   They are 125mm x 75mm and as you say they connect into a vacuum cleaner to remove all of the dust as you go. 


You can use either sanding sheets with holes in or Abranets.  I'm using Abranets and they work very well indeed.  You also need to buy the hose which connects it to your vacuum but its not expensive and its quite long too. 


I've sanded one side of my hull and there's no dust to speak of in my room where I work.  In fact even my clothes were still relatively clean whereas I would usually be covered in dust.  Here's a link to the tool


https://www.axminster.co.uk/mirka-sanding-blocks-with-extraction-ax851921
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 06, 2019, 03:49:51 PM
Well I'm a pretty happy boat builder today.  I've rough sanded all of the hull down now and the results were very good.  I used a 300mm long block as much as possible to get nice flat sides and also get the shape nice an even on both sides.


I've also filled and completed one side ready for the next stage and it didn't need much filler at all really.  I was very surprised as I thought that it would need loads.  Here's a few pictures which to be honest look like most of the other pictures I posted before but I was too pleased not to put something on the forum.  I apologise for my great mood but you've got to take it why you can as it may change when I fill the other side  {-)   Its so tempting just to give it a coat of epoxy and cloth and give it a coat of paint but I'll restrain myself  :police: .  Here's the pictures that look like all the others!


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/06/IMG_2719.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/06/IMG_2723.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/06/IMG_2722.jpg)


Just the other side to fill and sand now then its into unchartered territory for me  :-))  - Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Jerry C on January 06, 2019, 10:12:27 PM
Looks terrific Mark. When I completed the clinker hull of SL Wear I ďvarnishedĒ the hull inside with epoxy resin. All the joints were good as it was glued construction but I was shocked at the amount of seepage actually through the wood grain (mahogany). Not withstanding after only one thin coat it has remained tight as a drum. The epoxy that leaked to the outside was easily rubbed down before Yacht varnish applied and doesnít show through at all.
Jerry.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 13, 2019, 12:53:02 PM
Thanks Jerry  :-))   Like you I will be giving this hull several coats of epoxy inside and out!


Now I've been an extremely lucky bloke this week as I went a bit mad with the sanding of the hull.  Both sides are now completely sanded to shape but I was unhappy with the hull at the end of the garboard strake at the stern.  Its shape just wasn't right and I realised that once the second planking was on it would look even worse.  If I didn't get it right at this stage it would be part of the boat forever.  Sooooo I sanded it to within an inch of its life to get the right shape and the pictures below.........yes that is the bulkhead just poking through  <:(   How the planks stayed in place is beyond me but I'm glad they did, I guess we all need a bit of luck every now and again.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/13/IMG_2730.jpg)


Now here was my second problem with doing this.  This area is going to get a lot of pressure applied when the second planking goes on so I needed to strengthen it from the inside before I went any further.  Unfortunately the hull had two false decks installed holding the correct shape of the boat.  I cannot remove these until the second planking is finished.  So I took a deep breath and a very large hole saw and just went for it.  I cut an access hole so that I could pour some epoxy resin down onto the keel to support, stabilise and strengthen the planks.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/13/IMG_2729.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/13/IMG_2728.jpg)


Once the holes were cut I put just a little epoxy into place..........only to discover that my resin had gone off and would not set  >>:-( <*<


It took about 4 hours to carefully remove the useless epoxy using a scriber, forceps, cotton buds and lots of isopropyl alcohol.  I then bought some new resin which I'm glad to say has set and has done the job.  Its these things that really take time and just extend the build.  Anyway now thats done the next jobs are to cut another rabbet in the keel and stem for the second planking, and then to mark out the planking itself.  I'll keep you posted


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 26, 2019, 04:54:16 PM
Hi All


Some more progress but also a bit of disappointment.  I've discovered that I cannot plank the hull using 3 types of wood all based around the water line.  I'll be using two types of wood now but I'll try and explain why with the pictures later.  Firstly I've cut the rabbet in the keel and stem for the second planking and also marked out the frames.  Here's a top tip - if you are double planking mark the frames as you go; I didn't and it takes ages to find them after and mark them out correctly


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2738.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2739.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2740.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2741.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2742.jpg)


I then marked out the waterline.  This line is based around the deck being level so I cut two identical blocks and glued them to the false deck.  Thinking back I should have done this at the beginning of the build as it would have made positioning the hull much easier.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2744.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2745.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2746.jpg)


Then I marked the waterline using my home made tool  %%   I did this in the kitchen which annoyed my wife so a bunch of flowers was in order!!  I must say the plans with this kit are shockingly bad and as the plans are not to scale I used the top of the skeg as a datum for marking the waterline........in other words I had to make a best guess


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2747.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2748.jpg)


Next I needed to know how the bulwarks were shaped and how the brass cladding was fitted so that I could get a line marked for the change of type of wood.  Again there are no clear instructions to its just a case of spending loads of time fitting and re-fitting until you think it looks about right.  All of the wood above the brass is sculpted away once its fitted permanently and that then gives you the true shape of the bow.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2749.jpg)


Now I hope I explain this okay - the next few pictures are a bit vague but I'll do my best.  After marking the line all the way along the hull below the brass,  I next marked another line 13mm below this one.  This is because just below the brass cladding sits an 8mm rubber bumper which allows 5mm of wood to show below that.  The part that I was interested in was the gap between this lower line and the water line as this is where my planks will sit.  Unfortunately this area at its narrowest point was 16mm and 55mm at its widest.  This meant the planks in this area vary from 4mm at their narrowest to 11mm at their widest.  This would just look bad so that put an end to that idea  {:-{


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2750.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2751.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2752.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/26/IMG_2753.jpg)


I hope this makes sense to you- basically the planks would flair to much at the bow and stern and look awful even if I could do it? 


So moving on - I'm now going to plank the bulwarks using light coloured boxwood.  The hull below the bulwarks will now be all mahogany as this is the wood that I've got most of.  Then I'll just paint a waterline on once I've given it a coat of epoxy.  I'll save the lovely pear wood I've got for the superstructure  :-))


So the next job is to mark out the planking runs so that I know how each plank will fit before making them.  By the way the red pen I'm using is archival ink and doesn't bleed too much into the wood grain.  You can get them on Amazon for £3


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: SailorGreg on January 26, 2019, 06:14:27 PM
That hull looks lovely - and perfectly symmetrical as far as I can see. Well done.  :-)) :-)) :-))

Greg
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Taranis on January 26, 2019, 06:15:59 PM
Yes very splendid  :-))  great pictures
BTW Mark adblue about 80p at the pump
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on January 27, 2019, 01:37:41 PM
Thanks Andy and Greg  :-))


This morning I've marked out the planking runs which is a really enjoyable job  :-)   I've decided to use 6mm wide planks rather than the 7mm I used on the first layer.  My reasoning for this is because the 7mm planks struggled with some of the twists and turns so narrower planks will hopefully alleviate some of these problems.


I started at the widest frame and marked it every 30mm so I'm marking bands of 5 planks.  I then just loosely laid some vinyl lining tape across each line as I did before.  Here's a picture of the rough layout.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/27/IMG_2754.jpg)


I then spent a few hours coming and going; looking at the hull and moving the tape into positions that I was happy with.  The main purpose of this is to try and get even bands, so that the planks look good and reduce the need for stealers and drop planks.  This was a lot easier this time working on a solid base rather then just the frames that I had before.


I'm happy with the results and I've marked each frame to record the positions.  If its right I'll end up with a 9mm wide garboard plank which is just about spot on!


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/27/IMG_2756.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/01/27/IMG_2755.jpg)


Next weekend I'll mark out the individual planks and then transfer everything to the other side


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-))


BTW - George sorry I missed your call; I've left you a message mate and I'll call you next week  :-))   



Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on January 27, 2019, 05:34:27 PM
Good progress. Planking a hull can get frustrating at times, but you decision to use narrower planks should make things easier. I would use even narrower ones, like 4-5 mm, as I did on my tug and it worked all right.
The easiest would be to use very narrow strips, like 2-3 mm, if you are ok with the look.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 03, 2019, 03:00:26 PM
Hi KN03 - Thanks for the comments and your right it can be frustrating at times; but I've found that planning planking correctly saves many hours of time and waste when the wood actually goes on.  I've gone for 6mm planks hopefully as a balance between looks and ease of fitting but time will tell I guess.


A bit of an update - as planned I've transferred the planking lines to the other side and lined it out with tape.  I didn't do this on the first layer of planking which did cause me some issues so lesson learnt.  Honestly you could spend days trying to get this right but at some point you just have to accept its not going to get any better or precise



(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/03/IMG_2759.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/03/IMG_2760.jpg)


I then permanently marked these lines out and then lined out the bulwarks in the same way


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/03/IMG_2761.jpg)


Which after all of that gave me a grid on which to build each band of planking


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/03/IMG_2762.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/03/IMG_2763.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/03/IMG_2764.jpg)


I then divided each section into 5 - Each section carries 5 planks which at its widest point will be 6mm.  Except for the bulwarks I'm making them slightly wider.  I made a note of the width as I went along to save time later.  So now I know the width of each plank along its length - well hopefully


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/03/IMG_2765.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/03/IMG_2766.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/03/IMG_2767.jpg)


So thats the marking out complete so next up will be milling the planks and the actual planking - here's hoping its all ok!


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 17, 2019, 06:28:12 PM
Hi All


Ok I've started the second layer of planking and about time too!!  First though I needed to make the planks so I started with some nice box wood and mahogany.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/17/IMG_2769.jpg)


I milled these planks down into 1.5mm thick planks.  Being 13mm wide this really tested my table saw bit it coped...sort of.  I got lots of burning on the mahogany but it should sand out ok.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/17/IMG_2771.jpg)


I then took the light coloured box wood and milled it to the 7mm wide planks that I needed


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/17/IMG_2773.jpg)


Now starting the planking I though that it would be best to start with possibly the hardest part.  Getting around the stern by laterally bending the planks.  I made a jig and soaked the wood over night and then just went for it with a hot air gun.  I would say that for every bend that went as it should I had 3 attempts that split along the grain.  Extremely time consuming but it went ok in the end.  Well as good as I could get it anyway


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/17/IMG_2774.jpg)


After making the plank it was time for gluing and clamping


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/17/IMG_2775.jpg)


Then I did the same with the second plank and cut the ends to length.  The result was really nice with good tight joints between them


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/17/IMG_2776.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/02/17/IMG_2777.jpg)


I wasn't sure whether I could actually do this so I'm pleased with the results.  Now I need to replicate this on the other side.


Thanks for looking  - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Taranis on February 17, 2019, 06:49:10 PM
Amazing quality
You really have made a rod for your own back  O0
Must be really satisfying and I hope it all goes to plan  :-)) 
Great pictures
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on February 17, 2019, 07:42:21 PM
Your bent planks look great. I didn't know you could bend them so much flat.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: derekwarner on February 18, 2019, 05:16:02 AM
Yes Mark.......this was probably 1/2 of the more difficult planks to bend & install  :-))


I remember you conducted your own trials of adhesives for wooden planking, however wonder if a small number of bronze planking nails would not assist here for the long term?


The other question is the radial cutting marking on the face of the planks..............it is so realistic & would be a pity to hide it by sanding


Watching on as you progress


Derek
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on February 18, 2019, 07:11:10 AM
Your bent planks look great. I didn't know you could bend them so much flat.


I had no idea either until I tried it. If it hadnít worked plan B was to use short prices around the stern so Iím glad it did work.


Thanks for the comments everyone - Derek I take you point about using nails. The trouble with nailing is that they have to be removed as otherwise they cause issues when sanding. They also leave small holes which are difficult to disguise. The plan is to use finishing epoxy over the planks to obtain a durable finish which will also really help bonding the planks together


Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: JimG on February 18, 2019, 12:03:40 PM




Thanks for the comments everyone - Derek I take you point about using nails. The trouble with nailing is that they have to be removed as otherwise they cause issues when sanding. They also leave small holes which are difficult to disguise. The plan is to use finishing epoxy over the planks to obtain a durable finish which will also really help bonding the planks together


Mark
use a nail punch to push the heads below the surface of the planks, sanding will not be a problem. When finishing use a mix of epoxy and wood dust to fill the holes to represent the wood plugs used to cover the fixings in full size. This makes it a feature of the hull.
Jim
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on March 03, 2019, 02:13:36 PM
Thanks to all for the comments and advice its much appreciated  :-))


Ok I've moved on a bit - Firstly I finished the other side which took quite a bit lot longer than the first side.  Its because I was trying to mirror image it.  The results were ok though


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2778.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2779.jpg)


Then I fitted the stern bulwark which I had previously made sure that it was the correct shape.  And guess what it didn't fit  {-)   I have no idea how this happened so I had to fettle it again before gluing in position.  It really fought me all the way and even now the deck will be 3mm longer than it should - Oh well  %%


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2780.jpg)


Now here's where I decided to deviate from the plans again.  The plans show that the stern should be planked with short vertical pieces of wood as the picture below shows.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2792.jpg)


Now because this joint will be visible when the boat is finished I though that the transition would look awful.  So I decided to wrap the stern at least for one plank to try and get a better finished look.  This proved to be much harder than I originally thought and i wouldn't advise anyone to try this.  You'll end up with no hair  {-)   Anyway after loads of soaking, heat and clamps


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2782.jpg)


I ended up with two plank layers but to go any further would have sent me over the edge - I just hope its all worth it in the end.  Here's the roughed out pictures - it needs much more shaping and a little sawdust filler.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2784.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2783.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2785.jpg)


I then changed to vertical planks as these will not be seen as they will be clad in brass.  Sorry I forgot to take any pictures in their rough state but here they are after a quick sand to rough the shape


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2786.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2787.jpg)


And this is what they look like wet, so hopefully this is a representation of what they will look like after a coat of epoxy


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2788.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2789.jpg)


Finally I cut and glued in the vertical planks on the port side this morning so they are drying as I type.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2790.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/03/03/IMG_2791.jpg)


And that's it for now.  I hope your enjoying this build as much as I am and that I'm not going to in-depth.  Next jobs will be to shape the rest of the stern and then plank the bulwarks and the forecastle which I'm hoping will be a fairly easy job.


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Taranis on March 03, 2019, 02:19:35 PM
Enjoying very much. :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on April 07, 2019, 05:04:10 PM
Hi All


Well I've managed to get some more done on the Anteo.  Having planked the stern I started on the main planks up to the gunwales and on the forecastle.  Its been nice working with home cut planks and its been a case of pretty much the same.  Cut planks and then bend them so suit the shape of the hull


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2815.jpg)


And here's a quick tip that I was given that makes gluing a bit easier.  Place a line of PVA on the plank


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2816.jpg)


Then get a bolt and drag it through the glue for the full length of the plank.  It removes all of the excess glue and leaves a uniform coat that doesn't blow out everywhere


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2817.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2818.jpg)


Placing the four planks up the the gunwales I had to make one of the planks wider just like I had too on the first layer.  I did this in the same way by making a half stealer in a pre-curved plank


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2810.jpg)


Which was then glued and clamped into place and the results were ok - I do tend to over clamp but thats just me


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2811.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2812.jpg)


The finished planks in their raw state which is just glued wood without any sanding


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2813.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2814.jpg)


I'll pop some more progress up a bit later on this evening -  Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on April 07, 2019, 06:33:26 PM
Onto the forecastle - I needed 12 identical tapered planks so rather than cut and plane by hand I cheated.  First I cut the blanks on the table saw using the guide on the sled to make sure they were all the same length


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2837.jpg)


I then set up a taper gauge to the required angle and cut the tapers


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2839.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2840.jpg)


And then back onto the sled to cut them to length to get identical planks. It only took about 20 minutes to get this done.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2841.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2842.jpg)


I didn't take any pictures of bending or fitting the planks as there's loads of pictures like that - so here's what they all look like after gluing them on


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2843.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2844.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2845.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2846.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/04/07/IMG_2847.jpg)


So thats the boxwood planking finished - well it will be after its been sanded down.  Its a shame that 80% of it will be hidden by brass cladding but I think its coming on ok.


So now I need to cut the mahogany planks to size and start planking down towards the keel.  I think I'll plank the entire hull before sanding but I'll see how it goes


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)


Oh on a side note - I've actually learnt how to sharpen my chisels correctly with a small micro bevel on the tip.  They literally fall through the wood - Oh and skin - I've never had so many little cuts in my hands since doing them.  So now I need to learn how to handle them properly  {-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on April 27, 2019, 07:43:41 AM
Beautiful work! Where did you get that taper gauge from? Looks like a very useful tool.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on April 27, 2019, 08:48:35 AM
Thanks KN03  :-))   I am now working my way through the second layer of mahogany planks. I've not posted anything as its slow going and all of the pictures will look similar so I'll wait until I get a lot done before I post again.


The taper gauge is an accessory that you can buy for the small table saw.  You can purchase them at most table saw suppliers but if you look on youtube there are a few videos on how to easily make them.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on April 27, 2019, 10:21:22 AM
What model table saw do you use?
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on April 27, 2019, 03:38:55 PM
Its a Jim Bynes table saw it really is a fantastic bit of kit.  Here's a link


http://www.byrnesmodelmachines.com/tablesaw5.html
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on May 02, 2019, 08:07:05 PM
Thank you!
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on May 06, 2019, 06:21:18 PM
Hi All


A bit of an update as I've been busy getting on with the mahogany planking.  I've been using the magnets as clamps which are doing a great job as well as the screw clamps I made last year.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2852.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2853.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2854.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2855.jpg)


First section finished


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2856.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2857.jpg)


A few pre-bent and shaped planks waiting to go on


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2860.jpg)


Second section finished


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2861.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2862.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2863.jpg)


Which was then repeated on the other side


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2889.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2890.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2891.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/06/IMG_2892.jpg)


So far so good - its no mirror image not by any stretch of the imagination but its looking ok.  I've made quite a few mistakes but managed to pull it straight as I've gone on.  I'm learning on the job but thats ok with me.


The next stage is to start planking at the keel and start working downwards.  I need to cut some more planks on the table saw first but I'll keep you updated as I go along


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on May 06, 2019, 08:57:18 PM
Looks great so far.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: derekwarner on May 07, 2019, 12:04:42 AM
Yes, very tidy indeed Mark :-))


Are you using your taper attachment for the table saw to achieve the 5.0 > 4.75 and 4.5 > 3.5 mm plank width reductions then of hand sanding or using a hand plane to achieve the total uniform taper in each plank?


Have you completed a hull weight check recently?


Derek
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on May 07, 2019, 08:23:49 AM
Hi both thanks for the comments  :-))


Derek I use a plane to cut the tapers by simply transferring the measurements from the hull to the plank. Itís really simple and Iím getting quicker at it too. The tapers are quite long and beyond what the table saw can do. It would also take ages to set up. Itís great for short repetitive jobs but the hand plane is better for long planks.


I havenít weighed the hull but itís not really getting that much heavier with the second planking. It is getting much stronger though.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on May 11, 2019, 04:48:21 PM
I've been getting on making the garboard planks which I've been worrying about for a while.  The reason being I had to guess and modify the first layer of planking to try and get the the second layer correct.  In all of this time was unsure of whether it would actually work out ok. 


Here's my problem - the diagram shows that the planks do not sit flush around the skeg.  They do in fact sit proud by what I guess is the thickness of the plank.  The written instructions give no idea what so ever on the correct placing so for me its a total guess.  The picture below show what I mean.  I have circled the planks which seem to be proud which then become flush as they move up towards the rudder tube.  This causes a real problem from the transition from the keel to the skeg which is why I rebated the fist layer of planking


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/11/IMG_E2900.jpg)


The garboard plank is a difficult plank to make as it needs to twist through 90 degrees and allow all of the following planks to lay parallel to the keel.  So first off I made some patterns for the bow and stern as i didn't want to waste too much mahogany with errors


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/11/IMG_2898.jpg)


I then transferred these patterns onto the mahogany planks that I had cut extra wide to try and make the job a little easier which were then planed and sanded to shape


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/11/IMG_2895.jpg)


Now I've never had to bend mahogany before so I gave it a good long soak (8 hours) in water and then clamped it into place in the rabbet.  This wood is beautiful to use and extremely pliable when wet - it just needs to dry overnight in situ so that I can glue it in the morning


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/11/IMG_2897.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/11/IMG_2896.jpg)


And here's the transition out of the keel to make the plank stand proud.  I'm so pleased the way its turned out and with a little sanding it should look a bit better too


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/05/11/IMG_2899.jpg)


Its one of those things that I kind of planned months ago, unsure as to whether it would work but it seems to be ok. The other side is soaking in the bath as I type so the both of them should be glued on and good to go by tomorrow evening.  This has been a really good building day for me and I'm really chuffed with the results so far


Cheers - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Jerry C on May 11, 2019, 05:51:57 PM
Hi Mark, good job. My view is that on a 1:1 scale the garboard plank is the only one on the side to be parallel throughout its length with the exception of the ends. Ideally the second layer would also have a rebate into the Skegness/keel but as this is a model and I assume you will put a fine glass mat and epoxy overall it really doesnít matter in this case if you just sand the ends flush.
Jerry.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on May 11, 2019, 06:31:56 PM
Hi ya Jerry - you are right this is probably the only parallel plank.  On a full size ship its also the widest and thickest plank apparently which is why I made it wider (well that my excuse anyway).  I have cut a rebate on the keel so they are sitting very nicely in it except for where they sit proud on the skeg.  It took some thinking about as I had to but a step into the plank to get it to look right.  I just want to get it as close to the original as possible so I'm going to leave them proud as thats why I've gone to all of this trouble.  I don't think its been a hard job as such just time consuming to get them to sit right as they will have a big impact on how the following planks lay.  It will get a good coat of epoxy and cloth so that'll make it water tight as my joints leave something to be desired. 


I've been watching Angelicas Adventures so be sure to let me know when you get to the black country  :-))   The beers on me (well the first one anyway)  Have a safe trip  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Jerry C on May 11, 2019, 06:39:50 PM
Currently we ďon holibobsĒ on brother in laws wide beam on Leeds& Liverpool Canal for ten days cruise. Then back to our boat and heading down to the Midlands canals. Weíll probably have 2 or 3 chances to meet up.
Jerry.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on June 01, 2019, 11:08:54 AM
HELP!!!

Hi Everyone I really need some help as things are not going too well at the moment.  I've been fitting the planks around the keel and skeg and as careful as I've been, I have damaged finish on the plywood on the keel >>:-(


Now as I was planning on having a clear coat finish this is not a good thing as the light coloured wood on the next layer down really stands out.  I've made things worse in my attempt to repair this problem by trying to glue in saw dust using carpenters glue.  This failed and actually made the situation worse as now it needs a bit of filler.  I did think about using CA for this process but CA and clear coats don't go well together at all.


So can you help?  I think I'm resigned to painting the skeg and keel and then clear coating the rest of the hull.  I'm ok with this but I really would like some opinions before I do anything else.  I'm reluctant to try and repair the ply any further due to the damage that i have already done.


So what do you think??  And what would be a good colour if you think painting is the way forward.  Pics below - cheers Mark


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/06/01/IMG_2923.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/06/01/IMG_2924.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/06/01/IMG_2925.jpg)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: derekwarner on June 01, 2019, 11:53:59 AM
Just a question first Mark, how did you originally intend to seal and coat the plywood keel timber [from bow to stern] in the first place?


Being the lowermost wooden section, it is most prone to mechanical damage......[especially around the bow area]


I am sure it has been mentioned and covered, but what type a adhesive glue are you using for this 2nd planking layer?


Prosperity polyester wood fillers are available in many differing tone/hue's to match the original timber......many are actually waterproof


May be a thought to gently scrape & remove that  :o sawdust & glue spread

Derek
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on June 01, 2019, 02:56:47 PM
Hi Derek - The whole hull is going to be covered in epoxy and cloth and polished to a matt clear finish so its going to show every little defect thats for sure.


The planks are all glued on using aliphatic resin so they are going no where it really is very strong stuff.


Its a shame that this has happened in this particular place as your eye is automatically drawn to this area so it needs to be right.  Would you believe that the pictures show the damage to the plywood with the sawdust and glue experiment already removed.


I did think about using a wood filler but the chances of me getting an exact match are pretty much zero which is why its such a concern for me.


I'm thinking about doing this after the planking is finished


1.  Give the hull an initial coating of finishing resin to seal the wood
2.  Air brush as near a colour that I can get over the keel and skeg using Valeo acrylic paint
3.  Resin and cloth over the paint to seal it and carry on as normal


I think that this may work but I'm a bit unsure so all thoughts on this are extremely welcome


The keel and skeg are going to have a strip of 1/16 thick brass running the full length to give it some extra protection



Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: bfgstew on June 02, 2019, 01:53:02 PM
Methinks you are over thinking worst case scenario Mark. With the brass strip and a deft touch up with a coat of paint the only person that would know there was a slight error would be you.
You are doing a fantastic job on this, so don't beat yourself up over it.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on June 02, 2019, 02:24:31 PM
Methinks you are over thinking worst case scenario Mark. With the brass strip and a deft touch up with a coat of paint the only person that would know there was a slight error would be you.
You are doing a fantastic job on this, so don't beat yourself up over it.


Hi mate - Thanks for the reply I really appreciate it - funnily enough your not the only person who's said thats its not that bad.  I've decided to definitely paint the keel as its only a thin strip and like you say once the brass is on you'll only see the sides of it anyway.  I also think the skeg may look better painted as it will hide the laminations of the ply in the holes and on the far edge too.  My mistake was not making the keel out of solid wood when I had the chance.  Oh well you live and learn  %%


So the issue is what colour to do it?  Should I go for a mahogany dark brown so that is blends in.....or go for a lighter hay/brown to try and match the lighter boxwood up top?  Although I can build things I'm not very creative when it comes to choosing colours and I want to try and get this right when the time comes.


I think I'll use a simple water based acrylic and then epoxy over the top of the colour.  I guess I could do this with the water line too.  Any input on the colour would be really helpful  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on June 03, 2019, 05:50:30 PM
It really is up to your preference. I would paint all the wood below the waterline and clearcoat above the waterline. Black or dark red are fine, or anything you like.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on July 07, 2019, 12:41:44 PM
Hi All


I've not posted on this build in a while but the planking is going ok albeit very slowly but I'm getting there.  To have a bit of a break from it I decided to make a rudder out of the same mahogany, as the supplied plywood one just would not look right.  This boat has a HUGE rudder  {-)


So first off I cut up some pieces of mahogany well over size and thickness and used loads of glue to join them together


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/07/07/IMG_2942.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/07/07/IMG_2943.jpg)


Once dry I sanded them down and squared it off and ended up with what looks like the top of a dining table fit for a dolls house!


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/07/07/IMG_2950.jpg)


Then using the original rudder I marked out its shape and then simply cut and sanded it until I was happy with the results


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/07/07/IMG_2951.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/07/07/IMG_2952.jpg)


I think that this wood I'm using must be quite old as its as hard as stone and difficult to sand down.  The rudder post is 4mm diameter so to get it in the middle and make the sanding of the groove in the rudder easier I used a table saw to rough out the shape.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/07/07/IMG_2954.jpg)


I'm really pleased with the results as I've never done this sort of thing before.  I'll update the hull progress soon once I've got something worthwhile to post


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on July 10, 2019, 06:47:52 PM
Looks very nice.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: seamanpeter on October 14, 2019, 11:19:09 AM
Wow, as not seen more numbers here I presume you are still building it.
Looks great but a lot of work to be honest.
Not that I don't like those kind of tugs but this takes to much time for me and beside I'm not finished with my built yet.
Following this Mark and wish you the patient to do it,
Peter
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 14, 2019, 05:53:04 PM
Hi Peter yes you certainly need a lot of patience on a boat like this. Iím actually making some good progress and Iíll update this build in a couple of weeks  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 22, 2019, 05:26:47 PM
Hi All


Sorry about the lack of updates, but its coming along now so at last I can bring you up to date of where I'm at.


So when I left this I had just glued a rudder together that needed finishing.  I tapered the rudder using a plane and just finished it off with sandpaper.  I like using a plane now as I make less dust in the house and its much quicker too.  I also mounted it onto the spindle using stainless steel screws.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2959.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2958.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2960.jpg)


It just needs coating with cloth and epoxy and its finished - its one BIG rudder though  %%


Now rather than go through a boring plank by plank explanation here's some pictures of each section being completed.  To say it was hard to plank around the prop tube would be an understatement for me.  It literally took days of making templates to get to right.  I made it more difficult for myself as I had no spare mahogany should I get it wrong so I'd rather throw away cardboard than wood.  Its not perfect but its the best I can do at the moment.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2970.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2971.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2969.jpg)


Planking further down around the skeg - I did manage to get the transition from the planks being proud to being flush quite well.  I really did have quite a lot of luck at this stage - but hey I'll take it!


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2993.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2994.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2992.jpg)


You can never have enough different types of clamps


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_3005.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_2995.jpg)


Moving down to the next section


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_3011.jpg)


This was a real moment for me when the two sides of planking met - and quite symmetrically too


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_3013.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_3014.jpg)


And finally for today I was struggling to get a protective brass strip for the keel that was long enough in one piece.  I found this company


http://www.metalsmith.co.uk/metals-materials.htm#Brass


Its run by a really nice guy called Barry and I would recommend him to anyone wanting metal.  He supplied this 4ft long x 1/4 wide x 1/16 think piece of brass for £4.60 - yep you read that right £4.60.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/22/IMG_3015.jpg)


I'll get some more up tomorrow  :-))


And as always thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Capt Podge on October 22, 2019, 05:37:49 PM
That's a really professional looking job you're doing there Mark - shouldn't be much of a problem with the need for stealers either - great job so far  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 22, 2019, 07:42:28 PM
Thanks Ray - You are absolutely right, I only used one stealer straight off of the garboard plank and one in the bulwarks.  I think I could have lost the one in the bulwarks by making a wide plank but would have probably caused me a few problems down the line.  I don't think that these photos capture what a labour of love this turned into for me - but I enjoyed it so much  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 23, 2019, 04:55:31 PM
Ok so next update!


I've carried on with the planking and have got to the point where there is only one band left to do.  Unfortunately I lost the herring bone pattern at the stern as when I was trimming one plank I accidentally cut the one above it  >>:-(   Oh well you live and learn I guess and it doesn't look too bad.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3038.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3039.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3041.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3042.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3043.jpg)


Sorry its not the most exciting update and looks just like all of the others but this is the process that I've followed  {-)


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 24, 2019, 09:05:00 AM
Making the stand - well I needed a break from the hull  O0


On my last build I made no real effort to make a decent stand so I decided to try a bit harder this time.  I found an old wooden Ikea drawer that we no longer use and this is what its made from.


First I cut the profiles of the frames of where I wanted the stand to sit on the hull


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3017.jpg)


And then cut the rough shape of how I wanted them to look


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3018.jpg)


Next I sanded them to the finished shape but thought that the side arms were probably a bit thin to hold whats going to be quite a heavy boat.  I had some 5mm aluminium rod knocking around so I used this to give them some extra support and strength.  I then notched out the frames and the centre piece to make a simple lap joint for getting a good strong glued joint.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3021.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3022.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3023.jpg)


Finally I gave it two good coats of Rustoleum matt spray varnish which I must say seems like a really good product.  It also got a layer of 3mm thick felt and some feet on the bottom too.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3031.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3033.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3034.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/24/IMG_3032.jpg)


Finally here's the finished stand doing its job


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3036.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3037.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/23/IMG_3035.jpg)


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: david48 on October 24, 2019, 09:20:42 AM

Good morning Mark
As is the norm things are looking very good ,not doing any boat work at the moment ,still have my head in books for the full ham licence ,at 71 trying to do the maths is very hard ,never could understand why you had to add ,times divide and multiply the alphabet .On a plus I caught my first salmon Tuesday past .
David
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Capt Podge on October 24, 2019, 10:50:16 AM
The stand you've made is very much in keeping with the hull itself Mark, beautiful yet functional. I like it  :-))
Taking a break from the tedium of planking has paid dividends in your case  O0


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 24, 2019, 12:27:42 PM
Hi David great to hear from you and I'm glad your persevering with your HAM.  You said it was going to be difficult but I'm sure you'll do it and congrats on the Salmon too  :-))




Hi Ray - Thanks for the comments and your right I really needed a break.  Its amazing what you can build out of an old drawer.  I'll do my best to get some more up tomorrow. 
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on October 25, 2019, 09:10:06 AM
Looks great Mark like the brass strip as it will also strengthen the skeg and rudder area . :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 25, 2019, 10:52:25 AM
Looks great Mark like the brass strip as it will also strengthen the skeg and rudder area . :-))


Yea I was given the idea by Oohyah/2 as he told me how the skeg broke on his Cervia tug and how he rebuilt it using brass strip.  Hopefully it will also stop some of the scrapes on the keel too.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 25, 2019, 11:17:43 AM
So its finally done  :-))


I really have learnt the lesson of measure twice and cut once doing this job.  The last planks are definitely the hardest to do


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3044.jpg)


One side completely finished


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3047.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3045.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3048.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3049.jpg)


And then the other side


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3057.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3059.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3058.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3060.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3062.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3061.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3063.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3066.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3064.jpg)


So thats it! the hull is now fully planked  :-))   It looks a bit rough to say the least as its not yet been sanded smooth and into shape.  I've got a few jobs to do on the hull before I start sanding but then I can get it finished.


Thanks for hanging on in there on this - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 25, 2019, 08:01:51 PM
I've managed to get some more done today.  First up was drilling the hole for the rudder post through the planking.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3067.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3068.jpg)


Which I did 1/16 to far away from the skeg AAAAAAHHHHHHHH  <*<


So I had to cut and modify the rudder pivot using a bit of brass that I had knocking around.  It didn't take long and I soldered it all together so the mistake was rectified.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3077.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3078.jpg)


Which then allowed me to trial fit the rudder to make sure that all was ok.  This rudder is massive!


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3071.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3070.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3072.jpg)


Lastly I fitted the brass strip that runs the whole length of the keel.  When I refit this I'll epoxy and clamp it into place to make it really secure.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3073.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3074.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3075.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/25/IMG_3076.jpg)


So next up I can strip the brass back off and get the hull sanded to see what it really is going to look like.  I'm looking forward to this bit!


Cheers Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Capt Podge on October 25, 2019, 09:07:07 PM
I don't think you're the first one to make a mistake while drilling the hull for the rudder Mark and you won't be the last one either. That was a good recovery though  :-)) .


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 26, 2019, 10:30:35 AM
Thanks Ray I managed to pull that one off ok.  I had to pre-drill the hole many months ago from above and thought that it was right.  Its so easy just to be the tiniest bit out.  The sanding is going well and the whole thing looks so different - in fact it looks really nice
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Capt Podge on October 26, 2019, 12:01:59 PM
Thanks Mark, looking forward to seeing the photos.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: seamanpeter on October 26, 2019, 09:02:56 PM
Mark, my hood is in the air, respect you did a good job!
Can be proud on your self.
Now the difficult part though to get all machinery in place and working!
May the Lord give you the strength and a clear brain to have it all done!
Good luck young man with the "second" fase.
looking forward to the rest of it.
Mine is not going that fast due to several reasons, mainly the weather plays a big roll in it and slows me down.
Anyway, did some works to it though.
Like you, never give up and if I'm fed-up with my study and need a break I do some works to it, relaxed me in a sense.
Talk to you later.
Peter

Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 26, 2019, 09:38:21 PM
Hi Peter believe it or not I think I'm 2 1/2 years into this build as I can only do it part time.  Luckily all of my steam plant and servos etc (machinery) has already been done and tested.  I did see your build and its looking great  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 27, 2019, 02:29:12 PM
Hi All


The sanding is done  %%   That Honduras mahogany was like sanding steel and the dust is so fine I'm glad I used some extraction in the house.  Here's the pictures


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3080.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3081.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3083.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3082.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3084.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3086.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3085.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3087.jpg)


I have to say I'm pretty chuffed the way this has turned out.  I think there are 140-ish individually tapered planks that had to be made but it was worth it.  I think it safe to say that I'm getting good at this planking malarky now due to all of the practice I've had  {-)


Here's a few pictures of its first coat of finishing resin.  I've used Bucks Composites finishing resin and I'm glad that I did.  Its mixed by a weight ratio of 100g of resin to 48g of hardener.  It was dead easy to do and its really runny which makes putting it on nice and easy.  I found using Z-poxy that I needed to thin it a bit but not this stuff.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3088.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3090.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3089.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/10/27/IMG_3091.jpg)


So the next jobs are


1.  Airbrush the skeg and the keel to hide all of the damage that I did doing the planking
2.  Airbrush on the waterline
3.  Two more coats of finishing resin using 49g cloth
4.  Start fitting the brass plating around the bulwarks - there's a few hundred brass nails that need to be put in!
5.  Trim the forecastle down to the brass plating


So plenty to be getting on with


Cheers - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: dreadnought72 on October 27, 2019, 04:54:40 PM
 :-)) That looks terrific! You've made a cracking job with the woodwork, there.


Andy
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Capt Podge on October 27, 2019, 05:09:37 PM
She looked nice before the resin went on but, oh boy, what a transformation - absolutely gorgeous - great work Mark  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: ooyah/2 on October 27, 2019, 05:20:44 PM
Hi Mark,


What a super job, all worth the effort.


George.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Jerry C on October 27, 2019, 05:44:35 PM
Please tell me youíre not going to paint it.
Jerry.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 27, 2019, 06:45:57 PM

Andy, Ray and George - Thanks for the comments  :-))   I got there in the end even if it took forever.  Still loads to do but I feel that I've broken the back of it now. Watch this space!

Please tell me youíre not going to paint it. Jerry.



Hi Jerry - no mate its staying clear coated.  The only things that will be painted will be the skeg and the keel.  I did quite a lot of damage when planking the hull and it just doesn't look right how it is.  So I've mixed a colour which is similar to how it is now.  It should tidy the plywood up quite nicely and I'll also be painting a water line and thats it.  Once the brass is on it will get a matt clear coat to take off the shine off. 


Then at last I can get the motor back in and have a play  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: southsteyne2 on October 27, 2019, 10:54:17 PM
Looks fantastic Mark now the real fun begins so take your time doing a great job btw still working on the Joffre will post soon
Cheers
John
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Jerry C on October 27, 2019, 10:57:45 PM
I love the way mahogany in the raw turns to an exquisite red when varnished. The epoxy coat is necessary first because thin mahogany is very porous due to the short irregular grain. I coated the inside of Wear on the inside and the epoxy went through to the outside in many places and I donít just mean the joints. On completion I sanded it off and put several coats of yacht varnish outside and deck and of course youíve seen the result after seven years. Every year I remove everything from inside, spray with detergent, give it a good scrub with a stiff paint brush and hose it out. Comes out like new.
Jerry.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 28, 2019, 05:21:29 PM
Hi John thanks very much and Iím looking forward to an update on your build too. Itís amazing how long these builds can take


Hi Jerry I can certainly vouch for the solid build of your boat.  Your right about the mahogany most of the resin just got absorbed as I rollered it on.


Iím back to work now after my week off and it was a shock to the system when my alarm went off at 0200!
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: B.B on October 28, 2019, 11:29:10 PM
Hi  Mark T , just tuned into your build,what an eye opener brilliant , well done  :-)) .
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on October 29, 2019, 03:48:10 PM
Thanks Brian thatís very nice of you to say  :-)   Itís been slow going due to time constraints as I work away from home all week.  Iím getting there slowly.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: SteamboatPhil on October 29, 2019, 07:37:25 PM
As George has said, it is a really nice job
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Footski on October 30, 2019, 07:23:43 AM
When I read that the Hull was not to be painted I was very disappointed. I like things to look real......I then went and looked at the latest photos of the hull.......wow.....have I changed my mind. What a thing of beauty you are creating. Superb.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 02, 2019, 09:33:19 AM
Thanks Phil and Footski  :-))


Time to tidy up the damage to the keel and skeg.  Its a shame that I didn't decide to go with the bare planking at the beginning of this build as I would have swapped the plywood keel for something like pear wood.  Oh well you live and learn.


So I took some 400 grit carbide paper to the hull to knock it back ready for the next coat of epoxy  :o


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/02/IMG_3104.jpg)


Then I did my usual mega masking up job.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/02/IMG_3105.jpg)


Then the bit I like doing most  - laying on the paint  O0   I have used Vallejo acrylic paint which I must say is a great product to use.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/02/IMG_3107.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/02/IMG_3108.jpg)


I'm pleased with the results and its hidden all of the marks that I managed to put into it.  Its also hidden the ply lines very well too


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/02/IMG_3109.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/02/IMG_3110.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/02/IMG_3111.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/02/IMG_3112.jpg)


Next job later on today will be marking out and painting the waterline.  I've got some aged white paint for this so that it doesn't look to clean and bright.  I'll get some more pictures up tomorrow with a bit of luck


Thanks for looking - Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: dreadnought72 on November 02, 2019, 12:08:36 PM
I'd spend many a happy hour just staring at that!  :-))  Superb work.


Andy
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on November 02, 2019, 03:25:12 PM
Congratulations, the planked hull looks superb!
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 02, 2019, 03:43:42 PM
Thanks Andy and KNO3  :-))


Well I've made a school boy error - I started lining off the water line - oh and promptly ran out of lining tape  >>:-(


What a fool I am as I usually have spares of this sort of thing.  Oh well I've ordered some more and I'll carry on next weekend.  Now where's that cold beer  %%
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 09, 2019, 11:13:57 AM
Hi All


Ok so the lining tape turned up this week so I've done some more work on the hull.


Firstly I made a simple tool for marking out the water line and then lined it out with tape


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/09/IMG_3113.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/09/IMG_3115.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/09/IMG_3114.jpg)


Then I masked it all up and put on some aged white so that it doesn't look to stark


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/09/IMG_3143.jpg)


I think its turned out quite nice


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/09/IMG_3144.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/09/IMG_3145.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/09/IMG_3146.jpg)


I've also been ageing the brass using vinegar and salt as I don't want it to look new and shiny.  This has turned out ok too I think but it has turned the solder black


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/09/IMG_3148.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/09/IMG_3147.jpg)


So now I need to let this paint fully cure so I'm not doing anything now until next weekend.  Then I'm going to start covering the hull with epoxy and cloth which is not everyone's favourite job.


Cheers - Mark
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Capt Podge on November 09, 2019, 11:43:41 AM
Looking good Mark. It must have taken a long time to do all that masking up :o


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 09, 2019, 01:58:33 PM
When I was doing it Ray I remembered the last water line that I sprayed on my Alpine.  I thought then it was a lot of effort for one white line and it was again this time too  O0 {-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 17, 2019, 01:43:59 PM
Just a quick update


I've started the job that no one likes  {-)   Glass cloth and resin!


The first side went ok but it did take a bit of time.  Its a tricky shape to do in one hit but I could think of any other way of doing it.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/17/IMG_3153.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/17/IMG_3155.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/17/IMG_3154.jpg)


And one side of the rudder is done too


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/17/IMG_3156.jpg)


So far so good and next weekend I'll do the other side - Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Capt Podge on November 17, 2019, 10:14:19 PM
Mark, if the other side goes as well as this one she's going to be a real beauty.
Great workmanship  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 18, 2019, 05:38:05 PM
Thanks Ray the new resin that Iím using made things easier as it has a pot life of 45 minutes and is very thin too. It does take 48 hours to fully cure though but it dries with no stickiness at all
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on November 18, 2019, 05:56:05 PM
It's strange but I can't see any pictures in this thread although I'm logged in.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 18, 2019, 06:06:19 PM
Thatís strange because I can see them. Try logging out and then back in again that might work
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: SailorGreg on November 19, 2019, 12:34:58 PM
All piccies visible here, I'm happy to say.  And what a splendid job you have made of that hull Mark, a real display piece.  Perhaps I missed it, but what is the resin that impresses you so much?
Edit - just found it on the previous page - Bucks Composites finishing resin.

Greg
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 19, 2019, 12:41:58 PM
Hi Greg itís a company called Bucks Composites. I have never used their products before and have found their finishing resin to be very good so far
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 24, 2019, 12:38:11 PM
I've done a bit more on the tug so here's some pictures


Firstly I removed all of the excess cloth from one side.  I've got a couple of air bumps and I'll have to touch up the keel a bit but nothing that can't be done


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/24/IMG_3161.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/24/IMG_3162.jpg)


Then I cut the cloth for the other side and the rudder


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/24/IMG_3163.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/24/IMG_3164.jpg)


And then applied the resin which again went ok


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/24/IMG_3166.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/11/24/IMG_3165.jpg)


So I've got to be patient now and let this side dry for 48 hours.  Then I'll get down to sanding out and imperfections and hopefully get the final coat of resin on - Cheers Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Martin [Admin] on November 24, 2019, 04:58:50 PM
 
 :o :o :o :o   :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on November 24, 2019, 07:05:33 PM

 :o :o :o :o   :-))



Cheers Boss  :-))
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on December 07, 2019, 03:33:08 PM
Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 08, 2019, 01:42:15 PM
Keep up the good work!


Thanks mate  :-)


I've been a bit delayed on the build because after I had tidied up the excess cloth I really wasn't entirely happy with the result.  The way that I had applied it removed too many sharp edges and hid too much of the detail that I had gone to a lot of effort to include.


So last weekend I spent a lot of time sanding the detail back into the hull which took ages and it also involved a full respray of the keel.  Anyway its done now so upwards and onwards.  After sanding it all flat I installed the rudder post with some 5 minute epoxy


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3173.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3174.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3172.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3175.jpg)


Next I fitted the rudder to the spindle with epoxy and screws and gave it a final coat of finishing resin


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3176.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3177.jpg)


And then gave the hull what I hope is the final coat of finishing resin too


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3178.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3180.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3181.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/08/IMG_3179.jpg)


So its looking nice now but I need to give it a week to dry properly.  I'll know then if it needs another coat or not once I've knocked it back a bit with a scotch bright pad.  The final finish will be a matt coat varnish so all of the shine will be gone but theres loads to do before then.


Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Capt Podge on December 08, 2019, 01:54:16 PM
Good recovery Mark - looks superb and I'm sure the finishing coat will be just as good - lovely job  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 15, 2019, 02:12:07 PM
Hi All


Well I'm glad to say that after knocking the resin back the finish is lovely  :-)   Its going to look even better once its had a couple of coats of matt varnish but there are a few things to do before that happens.  Somehow I've messed my photos up a bit in the order that I took them so bear with me if things look a bit topsy turvy  %%


I refitted the brass strip in the keel using the screws and 5 minute epoxy and also permanently fitted the rudder.  I'm my own worst critic but I think the results are just so nice and I'm glad that I took my time.  I hope you think the same and like the patina on the brass.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3197.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3198.jpg)


And then just utter disaster - I dropped it.  Yep you read that right I dropped the hull straight onto the stern.  At first i thought that I had got away with it but unfortunately I didn't.  The stern and the stern bulwarks were cracked  {:-{   So the only thing I could think of was to sand it back and reapply some finishing resin which I pushed into the cracks after pulling them slightly wider apart.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3196.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3195.jpg)


Luckily for me when the boat is finished none of this will be visible as its hidden underneath brass plating and the rubber bumper.  I'll reinforce from the inside at a later date.  That will teach me to be clumsy.


So onto the next job - the brass plating that runs around the full bulwarks.  There are 32 plates that need to be fitted and 100's of 0.5mm nails that hold them.  I love the instructions with this kit - they simply say fit the brass plates and thats it  {-)   No measurements or nothing!  So I spent a while just trying different positions until the looked about right.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3189.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3192.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3191.jpg)


And then I drew around the plates so that I know each ones position ready for gluing in place


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3193.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3194.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3202.jpg)


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3201.jpg)


I think I'm going to use 15 minute epoxy to attach these plates as I think this will give me enough time to put them in the right place and get cleaned up too.  The only thing is they are way to shiny so I need to age them a bit.  I cleaned all of the plates with cellulose thinners just in case they had some sort of coating on them.  Next I put them in a sealed container with some vinegar and salt and I'll see what they look like next weekend.  Hopefully the shine will be gone.


(https://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/images/2019/12/15/IMG_3200.jpg)


Thats it for now - cheer Mark  :-)
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: KNO3 on December 15, 2019, 03:26:26 PM
Sorry to hear about the hull getting damaged. It doesn't look that bad though. It should look very nice with all that brass covering it.
Title: Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
Post by: Mark T on December 15, 2019, 04:26:47 PM
Sorry to hear about the hull getting damaged. It doesn't look that bad though. It should look very nice with all that brass covering it.


Yea its just one of those things I guess.  You can either just accept that its happened and move on or throw your teddies out of the pram  {-)   It was dropped from quite a height so I have realised just how strong it is as my other boat would have probably snapped in half.  Onwards and upwards  :-))