Model Boat Mayhem

Mess Deck: General Section => Other Hobbies and Interests => Topic started by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 03:07:25 pm

Title: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 03:07:25 pm
Here is my next attempt at a bodyshell, I was looking for something a bit different, think this might qualify. My intention was to make up this papercraft hornet, then measure it all and make a balsa version that would take my rotors. Having made the papercraft version, apart from attaching its wings, I decided to weigh it..... 62g without wings. Very respectable, but that's about 8 or 9 of my 1/32 x 4 x 18 inch balsa sheets. I might be able to build to same kind of weight, and with strength built where I need it to be. Needs strong enough legs to land on. Could manage with 2 strong legs and have its posterior as the 3rd point of contact or go for 4 strong legs with a dangly wavy pair in the middle. I also fancied clear plastic sheet wings to vibrate in the airstream. I will look and see if I have some suitable plastic. I don't know whether it's worth adding the weight of a balsa load bearing structure to the paper model, which would be hard to do now its all glued together or just incorporate it from the start as I draw my plans for the balsa model.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 08, 2020, 03:16:41 pm
Well, that's something different!
The body shape suggests it's a wasp :-)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 03:44:59 pm
I have to give some credit to RST and his paper boat,  it got me thinking of looking in papercraft for a cobra helicopter pattern to get ideas from. I don't know when I got sidetracked, but  I spent a while looking for a decent looking wasp one with no joy, then spotted this giant asian hornet one. For some reason the pdf files wouldn't open on my old laptop so I took screenshots on my phone and spliced them together in photo shop and scaled them up to size you see. Traced all parts off the screen and transferred to 180gsm paper by flipping tracing paper over and going back over all the lines. Here is a photo with the paper wings taped on.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 03:49:38 pm
There is more than enough room in its thorax (leggy wingy bit) to take the rotors, control board and the battery. I may just make a balsa reinforced one of these and use paper stingy bit and head. Never built a hornet before. Lol. The legs will be a bit of a task.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 08, 2020, 04:10:08 pm
That's a helluva challenge you're taking on Andy - wish you well with it.  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 04:19:22 pm
Cheers Ray, I managed the Seaknight and Jetranger, they were good training for attempting this beastie! I noticed the photo shows a gap I ended up with at the front upper left corner of the thorax bit, right where I would be thinking of putting the rotor arms. Perfect. However, making this out of balsa will be a challenge, here is the pattern for the paper one, which although fiddly, actually went together really well. It is my first go at papercraft, and I made it big. I am quite happy with the result. It weighs 72g with paper wings and no structure. I can still add about 130g to it and it will still fly. A good test for my balsa skills to try and get even one section of it out of balsa.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 06:24:13 pm
A bit more thought on how I am going to proceed, in paper, the stingy pod at the back is 40 g, assuming I can match this with a balsa version, it will be 40g extending way back of the rotors compared to the head up front, which in paper is 7g and close to the centre. I will probably put my 40g battery in the head, or close. This should be enough to avoid the tailslide tendency of the jetranger. I will obviously build as light as I can, but it has to be strong enough to survive some 'heavy landings' as I like to call them. I am going to have a go at painting the paper hornet, only I am going to do it more of a wasp yellow colour scheme, the real giant hornet is a kind of plain reddish brown and black. I have fair bit of yellow leftover from jetranger that will do my balsa version. Painting the paper one will spur me on to work on the balsa one.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Umi_Ryuzuki on February 08, 2020, 07:35:34 pm
Paper modeling is not easy...  %)
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 09:00:33 pm
A bit of yellow. My jetranger paint is gloss enamel, the paper model is painted with poster paint. Dries much faster.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 08, 2020, 09:07:00 pm
The more I see of this, the more I'm liking it - not something I could have a go at though - hands are too shaky for delicate work - good to follow your progress though.  O0


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 10:01:18 pm
Some black makes a difference, still got to do the legs obviously. The small white patches on the thorax are for wing attachment.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 11:22:15 pm
I noticed that there is nothing in the photos to show its size yet, so here it is, a 17 1/2 inch giant Asian hornet disguised as a wasp. Thickest part of its body is the fat end of the stingy bit at  6 1/2 inches wide. I may modify bits of it to make it more wasp like, like a longer pointier abdomen and a pointier face but I dont know yet. I would probably be starting with the sting end so that I can overlap my skins to look like the plates of the real one. Anyone got wasp 3 views? And I don't mean the westland helicopter. I have even thought about making the end of the tail as a balanced bit that hung on a hook inside the fixed body so it could swing about a certain amount like a nodding dog type affair. I can limit its movement so it doesn't flail about or drop off. It's just an idea but I need to keep going over all the ideas to see if and how I am going to use them. The undercarriage will be hardest to do I think, it has to be spindly, strong and light. A real set would be awesome but they don't come in this size. Lol. I have a few grams extra to play with this time, jetranger landing gear was 30g, that was two lengths of knitting needle, and 2 bits of marshmallow stick, I expect the hornet landing gear to be heavier than that. If I don't want it crumpling on landing anyway. I have a pointed end off of one of the knitting needles, this will probably be the sting, and will be used for landing on, along with the two front legs. It probably only weighs a few grams, leaving the rest of the estimated 30g for making the front legs. The 2 pairs of rear legs can be lightweight as they won't be load bearing. I am getting into this project now, we have a storm happening here just now, so seems like right time to be drawing my plans up. Or some of them at least. Just realised it will be difficult to have its rear end nodding and be strong enough to land on. Ah well, less complex doing it fixed. And lighter.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 08, 2020, 11:43:58 pm
Hi Andy, been thinking about the legs - have you considered the strands from a metal whisk? they are usually strong and springy which should be good for landing on... Oh, and the stingy end is simply known as the Abdomen  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 08, 2020, 11:56:01 pm
That might work, but metal is heavy, so will keep that idea till I see what weight I can have. I already wrote about doing a more pointy abdomen to make it more wasp like. I was thinking about the landing gear and weirdly thought about using crab legs......
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 09, 2020, 01:47:08 pm
Still not painted the legs. It's fairly pale painted with poster paint but shows me what I can expect when I paint balsa version with gloss enamels. I am probably going to pointify the abdomen, this will add a couple of inches to the overall length, I was also going to make the head a bit better, the paper version is basically flat with curved back edges. I really want the head to be more 3d, hopefully with enough room to take my battery and help balance the weight of its abdomen. If I can find another pair of knitting needles, I will probably use them for the front legs. They proved to be pretty strong on the jetranger. I haven't drawn any plans yet but I am working out how things are going to go together. Should be an interesting build. I took a note of how much the paper version's sub-assemblies weighed before I glued them together.Head 7g Legs 15g Body 40g Wings 10g Total 72g   It will be interesting to see how much the balsa version weighs, the paper version is just too flimsy to take flight and landing loads, even reinforced with balsa. And painting it with poster paint soggied it up in places where it dried to nice undulating shape.  I don't know what shape its legs will be after painting. All helpful though, I was considering a balsa reinforced paper version, but not now, it has to be balsa. The paper version has dried now and stiffened up a bit, enough to get measurements from. I might try a paper abdomen extension to see how it looks. Hopefully get some drawing done later.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 09, 2020, 05:02:58 pm
Oooh he doesn't like the jetranger! Or being taped to a box for measuring. And said dimensions jotted down ready to be used when I draw my plan.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 09, 2020, 05:12:25 pm
It's looking meaner with every new update  :o
You're getting nearer to the starting line for the balsa job now Andy...


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 09, 2020, 05:34:21 pm
Some drawing and hunting through my scraps boxes for suitable balsa for formers. I have already ordered a batch of 1/32 balsa for skinning. I have some 18 inch sheets leftover after building jetranger. I need to keep 2 sheets of it for my jetranger dummy rotor blades.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 09, 2020, 05:39:26 pm
Because I am going to be fitting the quad pods in an x formation rather than sticking straight out sideways, as in jetranger and seaknight, I have to move motors out further to save downwash hitting body. I have correct size carbon square section in stock so not a problem.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 10, 2020, 03:13:28 pm
Thought I would put on a couple of photos of the real beastie. Not as scary colour scheme as a wasp. It sure is a mean beast, I watched a couple of videos on them, one video shows the hornet getting the better of a praying mantis, another shows the mantis winning. I also read a guy got stung and said it was like a hot nail being driven into his leg. Maybe our wee wasps aren't so bad after all, at least they don't get to that size.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 10, 2020, 05:32:43 pm
Think I may have just found some menacing wobbly antenna(e?) And recycled some old stained fuel tubing at the same time, I knew it would come in handy some day. I sold all my engines years ago and bought electric setups with the money, thinking electric would be safer for my children to use......but they haven't any interest in it. Ah well.I hope to get pencil to paper and get a plan happening. I will probably have to    check what balsa I have in my scraps boxes as I draw it. I only have 3 spare 1/32 x 18 x 4 inch sheets and a 12 x 4 inch bit of hard 3/16. And about 10 scraps boxes. Having built well over 100 planes, and kept all the scraps, I have a few kg of scraps! All weird shapes though. I have built a few planes entirely from my scraps boxes but prefer nice new wood. I did a small tug once where I built the Hull up in layers of crazy paving style scraps, once it was sanded and painted it looked pretty good, some of the glue lines showed up but looked like plating.Anyway, hope to get drawing later, wife bought me a nice A2 pad, so I have no excuse. I usually draw on tracing paper so I can check sizes of parts easily from plan to side or front views. I am still deciding whether to do a hornet or a wasp head on it. Wasp head is a bit more pointy. I am definitely extending the abdomen as in my sketch, it's going to be best solution, it was almost at the ground anyway. Also uses up pointy end of one of the knitting needles I made the jetranger landing gear from. I need to hunt for another two now for the front legs on what I am now calling my "xxxxx" giant hornet wasp.The second photo is what I am aiming for/using as a guide, its the only view I have of this particular one. I might do the head slightly larger for effect and also to balance the weight of the abdomen and it would make it easier to get my battery in there, the perfect outcome would be that I get my overall weight low enough to use my 2500mah battery.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 10, 2020, 11:04:20 pm
Made a start on the plan, head is going to be difficult to replicate while still keeping it light, though I probably will need to balance the tail weight, depends how heavy the abdomen ends up
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 12, 2020, 06:28:51 pm
I have been working on my jet ranger recently  but I have been thinking about my Japanese hornet wasp, I have even cut new 5mm square carbon motor pod arms to 200 mm. I have been looking at my drawing, still not that sure on the dimensions and proportions, I want to try extending the thorax forward a bit while keeping the front rotors where I had planned, adding structure forward of the balance point. Also the head, front legs and wings will be forward a bit too. I think the head looks too small in my drawing, anyone else think I should make it bigger?
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 19, 2020, 09:59:35 pm
I have been thinking about the hornet, although I modified it from the original papercraft plan/model, I am still not happy enough with my plan of it to start making it yet. The picture above the plan is what I am aiming for, maybe a bit ambitious but if I get halfway between the paper version and that photo, I will be well happy. I have sourced my front landing gear/legs. A small selection of knitting needles in various thicknesses. Perfect. I am impressed with how well the ones on my jetranger have handled heavier landings. Anyway, I am hoping to redraw my plans soon and try to get the shape a bit better. I was thinking of some kind of thin foam tubing to thicken up the front (knitting needle) legs, and also use that for back legs. Just waving about. I actually dont like wasps, dont really know why I picked this as a project but I am determined to have a nice shiny giant hornet (wasp) in my flying collection. One of the things I wanted to do when I redraw my plans is to make it slightly bigger, it is a bit smaller than I wanted really, when I did the card model, I scaled it to fit biggest paper I had. It let me see a 3d version tho. Another 3 to 4 inches would probably be a decent increase, while the structure I was planning should remain much the same........ Overengineered. Lol. My structures could be much lighter, but they have to stand up to sanding, sheeting and handling.... Then usually some kind of heavy landings for whatever reason, usually pilot error.
 I have attached a diagram of a wasp I found while researching.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 19, 2020, 10:19:24 pm
 {-) {-) {-)


I particularly like the label for the 'dagger'.


Hope your idea takes off (and lands) %) ...


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 19, 2020, 11:27:47 pm
Thanks, I hope to get something built soon. Its definately going to be different from anything I have done so far, closest would possibly be my pteranodon.
 Yes the wasp diagram....... I had actually forgotten about that bit when I posted it.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 22, 2020, 04:34:57 pm
I managed a test flight with my paper craft version slung under a quadcopter with an elastic band. It flew well, quite menacing looking. It will spur me on to do my balsa version.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 22, 2020, 04:44:49 pm
I'll bet it will look quite scary coming at you from a distance  :o


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 24, 2020, 08:49:30 pm
Couldnt resist it, quick build rc hornet wasp test flight. It ended up getting torn a bit. The head definitely needs improved a lot for my balsa version
Video here.  https://youtu.be/EGg8D6K3-qI
I am tempted to copy the legs for my balsa version
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 25, 2020, 02:25:39 pm
I now have 2 versions of abdomen, I think the shorter one looks better, so probably going to go for that one. Still lots of drawing and working out to do, I hope to get into some cutting and glueing soon.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 25, 2020, 02:37:34 pm
Definitely the shorter one Andy  O0


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 25, 2020, 05:53:40 pm
Cheers, the other one looks a bit deformed.  I have no idea how I am going to make the head, might end up as a big foam lump carved to shape. I would like to keep it all balsa
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: RST on February 25, 2020, 06:00:08 pm
How about something carved in plasticine then paper mache moulding made from that? You could make it really thin and light with some careful experimentation. Not wood I guess though.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 25, 2020, 06:20:17 pm
I did think about paper mache, but wasnt sure if it would come off whatever I make the mould from, I thought about clay but would be hard to dig it out without damage, I would want to use thinned down evostic waterproof glue for laying up. I am going to start with the body first so got plenty time to work it out. I can try a vacuum moulded one, got to be easier than my jetranger cockpit.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 25, 2020, 06:33:03 pm
The fact that a wasps head appears to be separate plates might make it easier to produce a moulding, I can use small parts from all the failed attempts I am anticipating. This might be the way to do the paper mache and still get it off, just do small sections at a time, only thing is, I need to sculpt a half decent looking head out of clay. Ah well, I am up for a challenge.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: RST on February 25, 2020, 08:29:57 pm
I did think about paper mache, but wasnt sure if it would come off whatever I make the mould from, I thought about clay but would be hard to dig it out without damage, I would want to use thinned down evostic waterproof glue for laying up. I am going to start with the body first so got plenty time to work it out. I can try a vacuum moulded one, got to be easier than my jetranger cockpit.


Good point. I was forgetting a few things. Brown shiny parcel tape is in an excellent repellant of adhesives. I use it all the time. But you might need quite small squares of it on that. You could always do the trick of carve from PS block then use very light roving as grp to mould and pour in nail varnish stripper (acetone) to get rid of the insides after. Messy but guys in US use it often. Perhaps they have less to worry about disposal afterwards though!  I put sludge like that in the oil bin at the tip though I don't think you're supposed to.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 25, 2020, 11:17:28 pm
Funnily enough I had thought of epoxy over foam core and melt it out as you say, my main concern would be weight. I am still tending towards either paper mache as you suggested or maybe just a foam head but I didnt really like the finish on seaknight foam bits, dont think they look as good as balsa bits, definately not shiny enough for insect bits. I need to build a balsa box in the head to take my battery so I will do that first and get to the outside once I see what options I have. Hoping to get some of my 2 layers of 1/32 balsa ply made up and get my abdomen formers drawn up ready for cutting out once the 'ply' is dry. I am going for circular formers, for ease, I dont know if wasps are circular in cross section or flattened, I am going for circular anyway, and definately the shorter version. I have a nice plastic knitting needle for the sting. Bit lighter than alloy as well. I am looking forward to this project. I still have more helis to do as well, I am tempted to go for skycrane next, I ended up scaling it to same scale as seaknight on photoshop the other night. Only a night or two of tracing and I, could be drawing on my structure, definately easier on non animal subjects. I wont really know how it will look but I am going to try and replicate the plates on abdomen by overlapping my top and bottom skins as, in my reference (target?) photo above. I think this will help with realism.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 27, 2020, 01:36:37 pm
Yeehah, finally started on my (balsa) wood wasp/hornet. Formers marked out with quick balsa compass, marked at former sizes. Thats all the abdomen formers made, I will be building from the sting end, adding a former, stringers and sheeting before moving on to the next segment. Not weighed anything yet. Might manage some lightening holes in my 3/16 (hard) sting mount. It has to stay strong though, its taking half the landing loads by itself.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 27, 2020, 05:25:31 pm
Sting holder ready for sheeting, managed to cut half a gram off it with some holes. Dont want to weaken it too much. I will see how my overlapping scales/skins look quite soon.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 28, 2020, 12:06:29 am
A wee bit done so far, think the scale effect will look good, top halves of this section will let me see how the scales are going to look at the segment join, if you know what I mean. The reason for tape on my finger is because my tx aerial cutters work on skin/flesh and close to the bone. I was holding balsa behind the bit I was cutting but it came through that as well and into my finger. Tougher bit next time.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 28, 2020, 12:39:03 pm
Getting on with it now, I stopped where I did because I havent worked out finally how I am going to join onto the thorax yet. Actually looking better than I hoped.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 28, 2020, 12:51:24 pm
That's quite a practical approach to your project Andy and so far, so good (apart from the injury), your updates are always appreciated  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 28, 2020, 06:47:11 pm
Thanks, it's good to see interest in my projects, this one has been quite liberating as the parts dont need to be exact both sides and tolerances dont need to be spot on, having said that, I do try to build as precisely as I can. I More building photos, and a last look inside, I have decided how I am  going to do the join to the thorax, I think this is going to be a highly stressed area, its only 34 mm at its narrowest. I added some bracing before I closed it up. Weight is just on 40g, unpainted. I also managed to get a coat of paint on it. Probably need another 2 to cover up my pen lines. On the paper craft model, the thorax and abdomen added up to 40 for both, I am over that figure with just the balsa abdomen. The papercraft one isnt built to take flight loads though, this one should be, hopefully.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on February 28, 2020, 07:07:05 pm
As with the boats, the layers of paint make such a difference.
Just had another look at the paper version trials video - helps to appreciate the effort going into this project.  :-))
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 28, 2020, 11:38:56 pm
The paper version was a teaser, I know mine will definately be better, and a bit longer build. Most of the time in this project has been working out how to build the various bits. I have decided to have the head built around the battery box which is sited as far forward as it can go, I need this to balance me abdomen. I am pleased with my results, even for just one coat of paint, its YELLOW. I will get another coat on soon, I dont know which black pattern to add, there are so many variations including cg ones. It is definately going to be a wasp, its having enough modifications from the papercraft hornet for me to call it that. The thorax is my next bit, the battery box will form an integral part of it, also the rotor tubes and 6 legs, 2 load bearing at front, 4 fake. I have it in mind to try wings too, weight permitting but not essential. All these bits need to be quite strong. So I am imagining the thorax, by itself may come in about 30g,unpainted. A lot of thicker balsa bracing is needed in here. Pretty sure I can hit my weight target, still loads to make. Used about 8-10g of superglue so far. More weight but necessary.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 28, 2020, 11:48:45 pm
I love these quadcopters, I have so many more ideas for stuff to get airborne, I am thinking a few models ahead while I am still working on one. Well 3 actually but I count detailing as extras to work away at when I get the urge or find a suitable part. I am still tempted towards the sky crane as I still have suitable lengths of balsa in my stock. Also, as I built one before but never had the success I had hoped, a decent flying one would be good. I did find a papercraft pattern for an apache though, and it wasnt even on my list. Nice amount of flat bits as well.
 I recently bought more of these quadcopters, bit more expensive this time, but they come with a camera which can be switched off and on from transmitter, pretty good quality as well. You get a 2gb card and reader as well. These ones, V333, come with headless mode. These were £20 each, incredible value. I saw bare replacement bodyshells for £24! As all my quads can be used with the same transmitter, I have a few extra I should try and sell, them, some other bits and some standard bodyshells. I like the fact I can set myself a challenge of getting whatever I want flying, then seeing it work, pretty much guaranteed if you keep it light enough. I have a star trek enterprise planned at some point too. Lol.
Ooh nearly forgot, I have to build a harrier at some point as well. Lol
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 29, 2020, 05:44:43 pm
I have decided to use the centreframe of the quad, with all the bottom mouldings snipped off and sanded flat. This was superglued to a hard piece of 1/16, which weighed 4g! This is a critical part, bracing it all up with balsa would probably have weighed the same. Anyway, this platform give me something to build from. My thorax has started. I am trying to do a more realistic shape than the near circular tube of the paper hornet, I have it narrowing in towards the bottom, a sort of rounded off triangle with my motor plate at the top. I intend to stitch and glue my front legs to a hardpoint in the bottom, I have to keep it strong but the weight is piling on already. The abdomen is finished, so no access for lightening, I think I got the formers right, enough strength for handling and flying but still pretty light. 8 g of superglue (20% of total weight) seems a lot but I used what I had to to make sure it was all well attached.. Motor plate is 16 odd grams, still to have the sides planed and sanded to former profiles. It should be a gram lighter after that but still quite a heavy bit. I love these quadcopters, I have so many more ideas for stuff to get airborne, I am thinking a few models ahead while I am still working on one. Well 3 actually but I count detailing as extras to work away at when I get the urge or find a suitable part. I am still tempted towards the sky crane as I still have suitable lengths of balsa in my stock. Also, as I built one before but never had the success I had hoped, a decent flying one would be good. I did find a papercraft pattern for an apache though, and it wasnt even on my list. Nice amount of flat bits as well.
 I recently bought more of these quadcopters, bit more expensive this time, but they come with a camera which can be switched off and on from transmitter, pretty good quality as well. You get a 2gb card and reader as well. These ones, V333, come with headless mode. These were £20 each, incredible value. I saw bare replacement bodyshells for £24! As all my quads can be used with the same transmitter, I have a few extra I should try and sell, them, some other bits and some standard bodyshells. I like the fact I can set myself a challenge of getting whatever I want flying, then seeing it work, pretty much guaranteed if you keep it light enough. I have a star trek enterprise planned at some point too. Lol.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on February 29, 2020, 06:09:19 pm
Good progress on the thorax, its got quite a bit in it, I am making all the sub assemblies before I start construction. I have cut out the two main formers but still to notch them for stringers. I may add some lightening holes to try and offset the weight of the sturdy structure. I was wondering how I can manage a hatch to access the control board for plugging in motors etc. I think I may have the answer, more later. Battery replacement will involve pulling its head off the battery housing. I will probably hold head to body with a small magnet to stop it vibrating off. One more former to make, then some holes for the front legs and their stitching, then I will take some photos as I build it all up. Its looking good.
Istill have to work out what to do to front legs to thicken them up a bit, 10 mm foam tube with a 2 mm hole up the middle would be perfect, anybody know a source?
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 01, 2020, 06:27:54 pm
Getting on with the thorax now, still to work out my hatch arrangements, I need to keep access to feed motor wires through and plug into board.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 01, 2020, 10:56:51 pm
I have sheeted as much as I can at the moment, but will need to fit the rotor pods before I can glue the sheeting over the open areas. I have to extend the motor wires a few inches as I am using longer carbon motor tubes to keep props away from body. I have cut the tubes to size so I just need to extend the wires and thread them through and solder them back on. Maybe manage that later.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 01, 2020, 10:59:32 pm
This is the easy bit, the head is certainly going to be my biggest challenge. Still got legs to do as well.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 02, 2020, 11:57:50 am
Legs from knitting needles, anchored in place with superglue and balsa dust. I hope this is up to the job. My other option was epoxy. Superglue and balsa dust is pretty rock hard though. I will still need to treat it gently to avoid ripping it out with a heavy landing. I have just test flown it with excellent results, I can adjust the balance by moving the battery back or forward, its still slightly tail heavy but I still have the head to add to the front.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 02, 2020, 12:04:53 pm
Legs are 16 odd grams, about half what the jetranger skids are. They seem to take landings ok. Other photo shows my balsa and superglue undercarriage mounting 'lump', I dont think the legs can fall out now, lol.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 03, 2020, 10:00:06 am
Did my drawings for the head. This is my third go at the side view. I thought my original one was too small, so I had scaled it up, I thought it was ok till now, a quick sketch of front view showed it was going to look a bit big so I shrunk it to about halfway and drew both views. The more I look at wasps in close up, the weirder they look. And a lot more complex shaped than anything I have done so far. And pretty hairy as well. I wont be reproducing these hairs, unless the dog brushes against it when the paint is drying. I still have no idea how I am going to tackle the head construction, I would use foam but I dont have big enough bits to do it in even a few parts. I will draw on the battery box and start working outward from that. I may end up just having to do loads of separate bits, whether foam or maybe suitable bits of plastic packaging, thats asking a lot of my plastic collection though, its such a complex set of shapes, I wondered about cutting a table tennis ball to try and get an eye but I dont think its big enough or right shape, the wasp eyes appear oval. Anyway, I will see what I come up with. Still wondering about a clay version to mould off but it would be difficult. With foam, I can cut the side profile and then the front, ending up close with some rounding and shaping to do.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 04, 2020, 12:18:40 pm
Painted the thorax yellow while I am deciding what to do about making the head. The thorax will be mostly black but it has some bright yellow markings, I will paint round these areas when I do the black. I still need to find something to use for the remaining 4 legs. I can't afford the weight of four more knitting needles so they will have to be light.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 04, 2020, 03:47:38 pm
I am going to have a go at a foam head, I can always come up with something  else later. Only one problem, my foam blank is nearly 50g!  Carving the outside will take it down to probably around 40, but still pretty heavy. I might manage to lose some by hollowing it out but I dont want to leave it too thin and fragile.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 04, 2020, 04:46:15 pm
I cut the hole through the foam head for the battery box, but now I have tried it on the rest of the wasp, I think it looks quite big, it will appear a bit smaller once it is carved but it may still look too big for the body. Anybody have an opinion on this?
It would obviously be lighter if I make it smaller. Just dont want it looking too small.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 04, 2020, 05:00:17 pm
I might take a cm off all round to start with and see if that looks better proportioned.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 04, 2020, 05:02:02 pm
Andy, I think you've got the length of the head about right. Are you able to draw the shape of the head onto it? Using the photos / diagrams for reference would suggest there's quite a bit of material to be removed. Your first picture on this thread would appear to be quite accurate as far as the head is concerned.


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 04, 2020, 05:55:51 pm
The original one I drew on my plan looked a bit small as a drawing but as a 3d shape it might look ok. The yellow bit of foam is destined to be added to it to thicken it up a bit. Its not critical that the head is to proper scale, the rest of the body isnt that accurate anyway. It just needs to be fairly close. Going for the dimensions of the original drawing should take a cm or maybe 2 off all round. In the photo above, the head is at the front of the battery box with a space behind it which my yellow foam bit will go in.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 04, 2020, 07:06:47 pm
I haven't taken a lot off it but it looks better, its close to the original drawing so I will try this size. I have glued the yellow foam on now and started carving. Glad I have made a start on it at last. Its down to 36g now (before carving) so thats a decent bit of weight off it to start with. I may have to paint it with pva once its carved to give it a tougher skin.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 04, 2020, 07:22:38 pm
Aye Andy, that's looking better already.  O0


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 04, 2020, 07:30:18 pm
Cheers muchly, I just need to carve away at it carefully, making sure I dont ruin it. Will see how it goes. It fits well onto the battery box so thats a decent start.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 04, 2020, 09:10:50 pm
A bit more carving, still a long way to go though
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 05, 2020, 10:49:18 pm
I have done a bit more carving on the head, it's getting closer to the shape I want, I had to cut a centimetre off the front of the battery box so I could glue a blanking piece of foam in the head to fill the battery box hole. The battery box was only 3mm behind the front of the head, not enough to allow for my carving. I will put photos on once I finish my carving.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 06, 2020, 09:41:21 am
More carving, I think its pretty close now, its quite hard to visualise it when its all the same colour. I will give it a sand and see how it looks after that. Looks close enough for me though, a nice yellow base coat and go from there.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 06, 2020, 12:15:05 pm
That looks good Andy, the shape is coming along nicely now  :-)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 06, 2020, 12:49:00 pm
I used copydex to join the foam bits of the head, this is good but leaves unsandable bobbles which I pulled off, only trouble is that it pulls some out from between the layers of foam, so it leaves small gaps. I have filled these with lightweight filler so I need to let this dry before I can give it a final sand and get painting. I have had this filler for years and it is really good stuff. I just noticed at the bottom of the tub that it is beeline professional. Should be ok for wasps too tho! Quite happy with how the head has turned out, good enough for my semi scale model. This is the biggest scaled model I have made, being about 20 to 30 times full size. I have built a full size sea eagle before, 8 foot span, along with a full size jackdaw and a 22 inch pteranodon. The eagle had strange drag flaps on the ailerons which made the handling terrible, my first flight was nerve wracking, with unintentional barrel rolls and a fair bit of plummeting involved. These drag flaps were removed which improved the handling instantly. Anyway, I hope to get the wasp head finish sanded and a coat of yellow on it later.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 06, 2020, 03:36:16 pm
First coat of yellow on the head.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 06, 2020, 07:51:45 pm
Was hoping to get another coat of yellow on but its pretty cold here so its taking ages to dry. I have weighed the head, with first coat of paint... just over 28g. Not bad, lost 20 g since I cut the foam blanks out. I did lose 10 by going for smaller head, which looks better. The other 10 has been from carving it to shape, basically a slightly flattened ball with some evil looking wood crunching jaws stuck on the bottom, I have actually heard wasps chewing on my wooden shed... while I was sitting in my metal shed about 15 feet away, its probably equivalent to us chewing up a 4x4 fencepost. I have  had many wasps nests over the years,  I got most of them when they were small because I was in the sheds frequently. Cheap electric bb M4 takes care of them pretty quick. Then some running, well not so much running these days, but as fast as I can manage, I dont like wasps.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 06, 2020, 07:57:09 pm
Short test flight video here.     https://youtu.be/W0t2RdbQTr8 (https://youtu.be/W0t2RdbQTr8)
Turn your volume down tho! She's loud. Lol
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 06, 2020, 08:10:18 pm
That's a really good effort, despite the noise, and it's gonna look great when it's all painted up and 'buzzing' around outside. The noise will give it a "menace approaching" sound as well  :o
Well, you're definitely getting there now Andy  O0


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: derekwarner on March 06, 2020, 09:10:15 pm
I reckon the answer is a Yellow Wasp specie O0 ....brilliant Andy...PS......the dog doesn't appear too upset & they have excellent hearing.......


Derek


PS....back in image ...306


....we see an empty 330ml glass [assumed Beer] bottle....could this have  been an imported type of beer with a Mexican/Spanish name?


Shall I just say Totoya type beer?  {-)


Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 06, 2020, 10:15:57 pm
Its actually a giant whisky bottle with a slot in the neck for loose change. Its about 18 inches high.
I am actually a bit scared to paint the black bits, dont want to mess it up. There are a few 'colour schemes' I like, the smooth, sharply defined c.g. picture I put on earlier in the post, and natures version, which features hairs and lumps and bumps. The cg one does look good, but I could only find that one view of it.
I still have at least the legs and another overall coat of yellow to finish before I have to paint black bits to finish it.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 07, 2020, 02:01:16 pm
317g including battery, flyable but unfinished. I still have another coat of yellow at least, then 2 coats of black pattern and maybe some gloss varnish if its still not shiny. It still needs 4 back legs and shrouds for front leg wires.
 I am well happy it is only 317g, that is 98g lighter than the seaknight, hence the super twitchy nature of my test flight.
 I have one of these quads in standard form with the foam body on that I keep just for exercising the dog, she loves it, it has bite sized chunks superglued back into place all round the edge. She only chases that, and only outside, so I can still fly indoors when the wife is out. The dog is pretty smart, knows when you say no. She also leaves her quad alone if I land it, just drops flat and watches for first sign of it lifting again.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 07, 2020, 04:05:36 pm
The second coat put another 6g on it, I am going to give it one more coat of yellow and that will have to do it, that will be about 18g of yellow paint, then close to that for the black? And I still have my legs to make, well, it's legs. I am going to do them from light selection of scraps. Rear 4 legs are getting copper wire joiners, which I instantly cut 2.5g off. Weight saving! There is going to be a lot of carving and sanding to do, and more paint. I may not have enough weight margin left for wings, its a wait and see. I want to make wings, even if they are just for display. Set in the aggressive pose that wasps have.
 I am enjoying this project, even if it is a bit weird, as I hate wasps, quite a few challenges to overcome, but I am working my way through them with results I am liking. Painting the black on is a big challenge, my fullsize eagle took ages before I decided how to do it's paint scheme, I think I did not bad. I studied eagle photos for about 3 months before I worked up the courage to start. I hope to be a bit quicker on this one😁 I have been studying wasps for about a month now, they still look freaky, but amazing creatures.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 07, 2020, 04:08:01 pm
Top section of each leg now cut out, rear 4 are 2 layers 1/4 and fronts are 3/16 with 1/8 spacer cut to fit either side of leg wire, I have still to draw next sections of legs, will do that once these bits are finished, I need to allow for some movement, especially on the front ones, I can set the rear ones so they dont touch the ground, but I would like some flexibility. Centre pair will be same size as front pair but out to sides and swept back a bit. Rear legs will be slightly longer and more swept back. Quite pleased I found a solution I am happy with, they have the potential to look really good. Weight is unkown quantity, I have the option of hollowing the legs, leaving solid bits at each end for copper wires. The legs are a very prominent feature of the real beasties, so I should get them as close as I can. I wasnt impressed when the wife suggested big pipe cleaners that are sold for kids crafts!
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 08, 2020, 03:03:18 pm
Results of last nights efforts and a bit this morning, I have cut all my leg sections out, the hollow ones are for landing legs, top 2 sections of each front leg are glued on now, still to do a bit of carving but the front leg shrouds weigh 11g for the pair... not bad. There are another 4 legs to finish carving, then sanding, I expect weight to be up by about 30-35g, as the copper wire joints are 5+ g, I have some sections carved but a good few bits still to do, nothing has been sanded yet. 6 legs, 18 sections, 72 bits of balsa, all from my scraps boxes. Sanding will make all the difference, they have only had the edges sliced off with a scalpel and they look not bad already. Glad I went for this method, I am quite impressed by the extra effect it gives, it wasnt difficult, just time consuming and required a steady hand for carving, having to direct my cuts carefully to avoid slicing too much off, or pulling into the grain and lopping any spikes or hooks off. Need to give my old wrists a rest for a while now tho, was a long time of constant carving, after a long time of sawing and hunting my scraps boxes. I want to get the right centre leg carved, so I can see a full side done, then that will leave just 2 to do.😁 Yeehah.
 Sanding should be bit easier. Just loads of it, and fiddly too.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 08, 2020, 11:37:38 pm
A lot of carving and sanding later and I have all the leg bits carved, and all but 4 sections sanded, they are glued to the front legs, so will be a bit more difficult to sand, once they are done I can get some yellow paint on them. I have the copper joiners in but not finally glued yet. The top sections at the body are all glued in.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 08, 2020, 11:44:55 pm
This is getting better and better with each of your updates - great effort  O0


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 09, 2020, 12:34:09 pm
First coat of paint on the legs.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 09, 2020, 03:41:33 pm
Painting the legs has made them stand out well. A few days effort has given a reasonable set of legs, better than pipe cleaners or goose quills would have been. 42g for all the balsa legs, about 2g per section, before paint. Bit more than I had planned but still ok. It's still under jetranger weight, but still got fair bit of black paint to go on. I did think about hollowing them but it would have been weaker and taken longer than the carving, my wrists and fingers have had enough, they will do, its a fair bit of weight low down which should help with stability. I am well happy with how its turning out, I have been worrying about the painting, so easy to mess it up at this stage, first impression of a wasp is that its got stripes, yes, basically, but a lot more complex pattern than that. I could just paint stripes, but don't think that would be doing full justice to what I have ended up with.
 I have not glued on the lower sections of the rear legs, this is so I can get better access for painting and also to save the legs getting damaged. I have cut the 'teeth' on the mandibles, not exactly as the real one, but its foam, so shapes have to be simplified. The hooks on the feet of real ones are much thinner than I have done, I could have done them thinner but I had bits break off during sanding. A 1/64 ply core would help this but heavy compared to balsa.
 I need to keep reminding myself not to glue the legs on yet, I have glued stuff prematurely in the past, my viper speedboat, I forgot to drill the hole for the throttle cable while I had all the bulkheads separate, big mistake as they were too close to get in straight for drilling by the time I remembered !  Not as tidy as I had hoped but worked fine.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 09, 2020, 08:32:19 pm
The wasp is approaching completion, I will have to start painting it with the black  at some point, I still have another coat of yellow to go on legs and a set of antennae, again, my first idea of using rubber tubing is going to look terrible, so I am going to make the weird looking devices from balsa with copper joiners. I still want to make the wings but not had a good look at my clear plastic collection yet, think all my clear sheets got used for moulding car bodies. My weight limit is approaching fast, I might not manage to fly with wings, I suppose it would vibrate along the ground angry looking tho. Lol.
 I keep getting an image of me, in the summer, sitting across from  the shops and buzzing it round the windows of the co-op and around the bins. 😁
 I must say the more of it that I do, the more it keeps catching my eye, I can imagine it moving, might just be paint fumes.... Lol. Like the seaknight, I would have liked extra features on this, moving jaws, moving head, even a twitching leg would be good(motor running a bobbin pulling clear thread onto a leg) . I have capability of a switched 3v supply from the quad, but no idea what load it could take. The weight of motor, gearing and mechanism to move something is going to put me beyond my max weight. Moving jaws would be good😁
  I imagine the rear 4 legs at least will move a bit in the downwash when flying, and my future antenae too hopefully.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 10, 2020, 12:36:33 pm
I was wondering how I could draw lines to follow on the head, pencil wasnt leaving a mark on the paint without gouging it, I was worried felt pen wouldnt come off the yellow if I made a mistake. I have stretched an opened up latex glove over the head, taped on with masking tape, this way I can sketch onto it with a felt pen then I will indent the foam slightly along the edges of the eyes and maybe indent face plates as well. I dont know if marking black patterning through the glove with a pin would just cause a tear, getting the eyes on will be a good base to work from, especially if I do the plates too, I was also going to make a start on painting the black on the underside of the abdomen, dont know whether to draw the markings on first or just go for it without guide lines. My reason for choosing there was to keep black paint away from my yellow leg painting session later on. And also some practice on a less visible bit. Lol. Papercraft giant asian hornet went in the fire tonight, served its purpose and was taking up space. It gave me good inspiration to build my balsa wasp, thank you papercraft. I may do a similar thing when I do my bell cobra. Its good for getting general shapes right. And showing you where improvements can be made.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 10, 2020, 12:38:20 pm
It ended up obvious why I didnt want to draw straight onto the head, a few adjustments and it was already looking quite messy. I used the rounded end of a steel ruler to 'roll' it along the eye and panel lines, once I had done that, I tried the pin for pattern edges, no problem at all, well happy how that worked out, bit different on each side, but there you go, hand made. Lol. The marking pinholes can be painted over if not right, the eye and plate edges are set in foam now, so to speak. I revived some black gloss earlier which had a tough skin on top of gel-ified paint, white spirit and a lot of stirring has revived it, I have painted a test bit so I know its going to set and not stay tacky. If it works ok, black painting should start tomorrow, hopefully. Looking forward to it now I have marked up the head. I have also carved (dug out carefully with a scalpel tip) and painted a hint of its inner jaws. You can just notice this in the photo, adds a contrast to show up mandible 'teeth', the tips of these will get painted a bit blending from bright yellow to a dark reddish brown to nearly black. If I can manage it, these are the sort of bits I worried about getting a decent result without ruining it. Happy so far with it, I am a bit obsessed with weights of my projects, but thats good, if I want them to work. I could lose some weight off the head, its a fair chunk of foam, but it does hold the battery in snuggly and just slides on with a decent grip. Removing any foam through the battery hole will just create bits for the battery box to catch on. I could sheet over the hollowing access holes but its adding what I would be taking out. If the wasp ends up vastly head heavy I may do it but its looking like the legs might have the weight slightly rearward the now.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 10, 2020, 05:08:50 pm
Having lined out the head, I decided to faintly draw the thorax markings, then I thought I may as well do the abdomen, I have done it fairly close to pictures I have from different angles which looks like same one, or type?  I havent managed to do a second yellow coat on legs yet, so dont want to paint any black yet. When I am painting legs, I think I should put a 3rd coat on the bits that are staying yellow, to try and gloss them up a bit. Bits that are to be black will be getting at least 2 more coats (of black) so they should be fairly shiny. I made a start on my antennae, I will make ones for the wasp later. Lol. Same idea as legs with copper joiners. The antenna join to the head was worrying me a bit, they are quite long and the place they are going is foam and only a few mm from the battery box cutout. I bored my antenna base at such an angle to miss the box cutout and glued a reasonable length of kebab stick to anchor well into the foam. This works well and doesnt seem to need any glue. 3g for antennae, including copper joiners and kebab stick sections. I hope to paint the yellow bits tonight, takes a while to dry in my shed if I dont have the fire on. Maybe manage a start on black tomorrow sometime if its dried fully.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 10, 2020, 07:29:54 pm
A bit more detailing on antennae, think that will do them, I used edge of my scalpel handle. They looked a bit bare before. Glad I did them, extra detail always helps, they are not going to wave in the wind, I tried shaking the head with them in it, no movement at all. I can pose them to some degree, same as my 4 rear legs. As long as they cant swivel round and catch a prop. Hoping to get a long enough chance later to paint the last yellow on.
 From being worried about painting the black on, now that I have got my patterns drawn on, I cant wait, I think that will just leave the wings to do, I am going on a plastic sheeting search just now. 😁 I have thin carbon so they dont need to be self supporting if thin stuff is all I have, if any.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 10, 2020, 11:13:43 pm
Anyone remember the film  Quatermass and the pit? This view of the wasp reminded me of the creatures in that.
 Thats the last yellow done, head had a complete coat, the rest of the markings staying yellow got another coat. Hoping it dries nice overnight.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 11, 2020, 04:42:05 pm
Yellow has dried nicely, time to work up the courage to start painting on some black. I am looking forward to it but still worried in case I mess it up, even covering up my pen lines with the yellow hasnt had much effect after 3 coats, black mistakes are going to be hard to get rid of, so carefully does it. I imagine its going to look awesome with the markings on, it looks quite scary already in plain yellow. I did find some wing plastic, but I weighed it and worked out I will need about 25-30g of it. Plus glue and carbon. Its a bit heavier than I imagined. I thought about cutting out the sections between the 'veins', this would save a fair bit but kind of defeats the purpose. I will see what other ideas I can come up with. If its really thin material then I need a full support structure to stop it falling about near the props. Its not critical that it has wings, just another detail I would like to add. I will see what my scales say I have left after painting.
 I have now painted some of the black pattern onto the abdomen, really stands out now. I will post a photo or two when I at least finish the abdomen, or should I wait till its all done?
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 11, 2020, 04:49:08 pm
Still looking well yellow so it was onto painting the thorax, looking a bit more colour balanced now. Just the head and it will be 95% finished apart from detailing.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 11, 2020, 04:55:47 pm
And finally the head, still got some work to do on detailing bits but nearly finished.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 11, 2020, 05:25:50 pm
What a fantastic paint job that is!
... Andy, you've nailed it - it could not be mistaken for anything other than a wasp - hope you get to fly it soon  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 11, 2020, 06:21:23 pm
I am well happy with how it has turned out, one scary looking beast to be sure, I think I have caught its main features apart from wings obviously. It is certainly an eye catching paint scheme, amazing creatures, it still looks as if it moves. Lol. Been a lot of paint fumes today........ I will need to wait till its dry before I try a fly. I am interested to see what its weight is at just now, with only some detail painting left to do. I need to differentiate between the eye, and the surrounding black patterning. A better detailed eye? I am still thinking on that one. Slightly different black on the patterning.... I may go for that to start with. There are also 3 simple eyes on the top of their head that I want to add. I still cant believe that I have a 2 foot wasp in my shed. And I'm not worried, Lol. I dont know if it should be called a Quasp? Anyway, I was going to name this particular one Jasper.
  Thanks to Captain Podge for your encouragement, hope you like the finished result. Well nearly, got some leg detailing to do as well. I can work away at that stuff.
 Cant wait to fly it!
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 11, 2020, 06:52:38 pm
I am adding this photo to show that I haven't just made up this colour scheme, it is based on a real one.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 11, 2020, 11:13:26 pm
I might need to make a box for it.... it keeps watching me. It just keeps catching my eye, thinking its a real one, but really close up. Lol.
 I tried a bit of  reddish brown on the front leg, not as good as I thought so I wiped most of it off and now it looks a bit closer to what I was thinking. I still have a few bits to do, I would like to get the eyes closer to the real ones, just dont know how I would manage that, short of glueing on a couple of thousand tiny clear beads. Anyway, I think it captures the essence of mean quite well, I have deviated from the real one in a lot of places but it still looks ok.
 Its still tacky so no weight test or flying yet. My re-juvenated black gloss looks ok considering it looked like chewed jelly to start with.
 I had another funny thought..... For transporting it on my bike, I was going to tie a length of string between its front legs and carry it on my back like a rucksack........... Lol. I wonder if anyone would shout a warning?
 I meant to mention the length of the wasp, it's 22 1/4 inches head to tail with another 5 1/4 of antennae. Almost same as seaknight.
 I am not so sure about the brown on its legs, real ones have brownish bits but mine looks a lot like it stepped in something and thats not the effect I am going for. Lol
 I am impressed by how (relatively) close I could get the shapes by using aircraft type structures, especially the abdomen, I could have gone more complex on the thorax and got it closer but I think its good enough for me. The head can be improved on, few details I can add. Still thinking about wings too.
 
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 11, 2020, 11:32:25 pm
I was just thinking how well the quad motors and props blend in now there is some black on it. Not very noticeable.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 11, 2020, 11:33:08 pm
Hi Andy, regarding the eyes, would it be possible to place some very fine lace/net over the eyes, followed by a thin layer of black paint, to achieve the sort of dimpled look? - just a thought  %)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 12, 2020, 01:36:53 pm
 
Hi Ray, I was thinking along those lines at one point, finding something suitable has been the challenge there. I even thought of dimpling the eyes with head of a pin or something, but that would be a long job. I will see if the difference is enough when I paint its 'forehead' with some matt black, it may be enough, if I remove the shine, then have my 3 small glossy 'eyes' as a contrast. Still to find items for them. 6mm bb ball snipped in half should do for either the single bigger one, or if it looks too small, I will use them for 2 smaller eyes and find something slighty bigger for the bigger single eye. Still a few things I can add to it, no rush tho, I can plod away at the detailing when I get the urge or I find suitable materials.
 The black is still tacky, so no test flight, I have my stove on today so it should help dry the paint, hope to manage a flight later.
 I weighed the wasp, think the scales are wrong tho, it is showing nearly same weight as before fitting legs and painting? Time for a new battery I think. Will sort that and get it weighed prpoerly later.
 I am thinking forward to my next project, I did think about doing the wasp as a modular construction, it has a plug on head, a plug on abdomen would have been a bit weak for landing stresses. The reason for thinking modular was that for instance, a dragonfly head and abdomen could have been used on the wasp thorax/power unit. I still fancy doing a dragonfly, most likely with a metallic paint scheme. Will add it to my list........
 I have to decide what my next subject will be. Heli, insect, or something else.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 12, 2020, 03:47:01 pm
My mechanical scales are showing 400g for the wasp, the digital ones said 330?! I havent found another battery yet, but thats miles out. 400 is really close to my limit,  no chance of lifting wings as well at that weight. Ah well, wingless wasp it will need to be.
I fitted the simple eyes, 2 bb balls and the top off a disney pen. Sorted. Just to wait till glue is dry then a coat of black gloss on them, more waiting and then try some matt black around them and the forehead area.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 12, 2020, 09:11:27 pm
The 3 wee eyes are painted gloss black now, they look pretty good, once the gloss is dry I will see how matt black looks on the surrounding area. Should be enough difference to show up the eyes well.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 13, 2020, 11:50:18 am
Matt black does make a noticeable difference. The 3rd photo shows white led poking out of its neck, which I can switch off from the transmitter but it comes back on flashing when the battery gets low.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 13, 2020, 12:00:35 pm
Looking at my own photos, I noticed on top of its head, how prominent part of the seam looks. Now its matt, I am going to have a go at filling this. Theres a few bits on it that I would like to improve on. I painted it with a fairly large brush and intended to go round neatening the edges. Some black bits dont even cover my pencilled pattern lines as I stopped short to allow for painting later. Thecthing is, usually stuff like that is obviois but because the colour scheme is so striking, I dont even notice any bits till you get really close.
Anyway, there was a huge wasp at my bins today
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 13, 2020, 12:14:55 pm
Had a flight with the wasp in the living room as it was quite breezy by the time I got to flying. It handles fine, probably most stable out of the 3, its pretty well balanced, glad I put the battery as far forward as it would go. I do get some things right. A full power climb at one point shows its not got a huge amount of power left
 Wasp flight video here
 https://youtu.be/lKvbR6HSZtE
 
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 13, 2020, 12:18:28 pm
In my last photos, resizing the photos has made all the moss around look technicolour? The original photos show it all normal colours? Strange, wondered if the wasps colouring affected the process?
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 13, 2020, 12:21:55 pm
That looks flippin' brilliant!
Great effect having it sitting on the bin... I like the idea of calling it a Quasp by the way  :-))


Regards,
Ray.

Edit: just watched the video - looks nicely balanced
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 13, 2020, 05:07:31 pm
Thanks Ray, much appreciated, wife regards it as just another one of my 'things'. Lol. She has seen a few.......
 I also thought Wasp-copter could work too😁
 I was hoping to fly it outside but its a bit windy and I just crashed jetranger half hour ago. Lol. These photos show that the dog was not too keen, but the cat was showing an interest.
 And a couple of bright sunlight pics. It sure stands out. It joins the other animal rc projects I have built, rc duck decoy(only one I dont have a photo of), shark fin (2 versions), full size eagle and jackdaw, pteranodon( it was piggy back on the quad, it wasnt built in, it was built with intention of going on it, though. DH108 swallow? Lol.
 I have been meaning to mention that these quads have a feature that I do not want to use, its ok to use on my dogcopter, but for the seaknight, jetranger and wasp, I want to stay well away from the 'flip' button, I am pretty sure this wouldnt end good, seaknight would probably lose the two rotor masts during the maneuver, through the props probably, small bits of magnets hold the masts on. The jetranger tailboom would slow the flip, losing loads of height in the process. Wasp leg drag? Dunno, it might do it better than the other 2. I may work up to trying it one day but for now, I am happy to just fly about trying to look realistic.
 Well happy with all 3 of them, the jetranger was still suffering from tailslide, resulting in a reverse into the ground from 4 feet up, broke off the skid tip again. Thats the only damage. Popped the hatch off, its only held by paint fit! Need to fix it properly soon. The fin also knocked off, it is held by a magnet and two locating pegs, works perfectly. It was breezy and I was turning downwind of myself, definitely doesn't help.
 The quadcopters for these 3 projects cost me 36 quid, ( I bought 5 for £60) and I can properly exercise my dog while having fun as well (and one for spares) ! Amazing value.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 13, 2020, 10:17:41 pm
Had to do it, them, even if it cant fly with them on..... Wings, I need to make wings, I did find a piece of clear plastic, plenty big enough for 4 wings, 2 main, 2 smaller, but they will be slightly bigger all round than the paper wings underneath (from the papercraft hornet) I have holes in my thorax ready for these. I need to make wing joint nodules or whatever you would call them, these can hold the rear edge of the clear wing level, as I will only have a 1mm carbon rod into the thorax. Pretty sure the wings will put me over the weight limit, probably by a good bit, we will see. Wish I had decent scales.!
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 14, 2020, 05:10:03 pm
More work on wings, a bit more visible with the 'veins'?  Carbon rods for rear wings from a dead, cheap helicopter from brother in law. (15 years ago, lol, knew it would come in handy! Still 2 left on it as well) The wings have a kind of reddish brown on them (same colour as my 'trodden in summat nasty' attempt on the legs). I did the black bits first to see, then once they were dry, I went over the brown areas with thinned paint. Looks not bad, I could have done them all a bit neater but the general effect seems to finish off its look nicely. The wings were flopping about in the wind, only front pair fitted at this pointo. I have now made up my wing nodule/anchor points. They have to be painted yellow first then black areas. After that I can decide final angles for the wings, bore holes and that will be the wings pretty much done. I have made slots at each wing plug in hole, to allow the clear plastic to slot in and prevent rotation. I have cut an upwards and a downwards angled slot on each. I dont know if this will make any difference or not, but I have provision for changing the angles anyway.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 14, 2020, 06:19:15 pm
The nodules I have made could be a bit more lifelike, mine are a bit oversized and shaped to hold my wings. Think they will blend in better once they are painted. I am glad I made the wings, really finishes it off, even just sitting in my shed. Outside they stand out better. Will definitely be trying a test flight when they are properly fitted and if the wind stops.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 15, 2020, 12:34:16 pm
Wings are 11 odd grams per side, so 22 and 2 approx for wing mount nodules is 24g, pretty heavy, dont know if she can lift it captain. I may have a way out though...... the head weighs 32g !  Note the bare balsa bulkhead, I intend to build a sleeve for the battery box, attached to this bulkhead, which in turn will be glued, or taped, to the back of its head, suitably hollowed with my hole cutters/ foam nibblers and measured with my seaknight foam thickness gauge. It depends how much the box and bulkhead weigh, it might be more than the foam I can take out?.... Dont think so tho, I reckon I can get 10 off it? Maybe a bit more. The outside is the biggest bit and I have to leave that quite thick. Any weight out of the head means more chance of getting airborne with the wings on.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 15, 2020, 12:47:24 pm
Nodules painted and wings fitted. They blend in a bit better now, dont know whether to glue the nodules on or not. Anyway, outside for a couple of photos, very windy, one set of wings blew off. Back indoors.
 Had a couple of friends round for a visit last night. They persuaded me to try the wasp with the wings on.... in my shed, very restricted flying space, my assistant cradled it till it actually lifted off, with the wings on, I was a bit surprised but landed real quick. So it does lift them, and didnt look as if it was struggling, wont know for sure till I get a better test, but looked promising.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 15, 2020, 05:36:12 pm
I superglued the nodules in place, the whole setup was just too wobbly. I had the wings on the nodules so the carbon stubs would guide the nodules to the right place. I held them firmly in place and quickly pulled the wings out so they didnt get glued in as I want them removable. My only worry is that if it ever (lol.) rolls over in a crash, will it tear off the sheeting its glued to, or just snap the rods? The rods are most likely to go, the balsa bits of the wasp are pretty tough. There is a 3/16 hardish balsa brace between the quad arms, the wing stubs fit into these hardpoints. I am thinking of carving the nodules some more, theres only one coat of yellow and one black on them so I will be better doing it now. They need refining, as its all glued on, with better support, I can afford to downsize them a little. And make them a bit more 'ball and socket-y looking, I tried to give this effect with just paint but I think carving will really help the look. Where its legs join the body, I carved the ends to look same kind of way, hard to notice them with so much yellow to catch your eye everywhere.
 Another reason for carving is that due to the rear wings only having short rods in them, they flop down at the ends, close to the props. So angling the front wing up allows the rear wing to rest on top of it, this means the downward sloping slots are unused and the balsa forming part of them can be pared away during my ball and socketing. They blend in ok, I just want to refine them a bit now, wish I hadnt glued them on, carving is going to be slightly awkward now. Lol. Luckily I am taking off small amounts, so bit easier.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 15, 2020, 07:52:36 pm
This was my string on its legs carrying idea. Lol...
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 15, 2020, 08:05:32 pm
That would certainly turn a few heads  :o :o :o {-) {-)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 15, 2020, 09:59:44 pm
I would still put money on nobody shouting a warning.... Hey mate, there's a giant wasp on you! Hopefully get a flight tomorrow, maybe try out a video with the phone on my transmitter. It is hard to do tho, I tried videoing jetranger yesterday, crashed, then discovered I hadnt recorded any of it.
I did have a new idea regarding the wasp and its flying indoor-ability, it is pretty big, more so now with the wings.... I would like a smaller one for indoors.............
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 15, 2020, 10:07:08 pm
I was looking my bareframe Syma X7, I had just been flying it in my sed, without the standard bodyshell on, it is really quiet and flies for longer, it is sharp on the controls but really nice once you get used to it.
 It also has the ability to fit inside and lift a 25g bodyshell, without doing anything to quadcopter. Not bad, but hard to get projects light enough to fly on this setup. I wondered how much bigger the wasp rotor spacing is compared to the little X7, its exactly twice, at 9 inch spacing, so a scaled down indoor flyable wasp would be 11 inches. Mmmmm, I need to get a drawing happening.
 Truth is, I am a bit scared to fly the wasp outside, in case I stack it, I am sure the head wouldnt look too good with a tree trunk impression up the middle, the legs are candidates for getting smashed as well. The segments are quite strong by themselves. If the wind stops I will definately feel more confident about having a decent flight. With or without wings, I have only tried it indoors so far. There is the embarrassment factor of going to the open bit I fly in, people do walk past quite often. I personally have never seen anyone walking around with a 2 ft wasp, I would probably think they were a bit strange.... but still wonder what they were doing with it. Lol.
 I am hoping to be confident enough with it to be able to buzz the roofing guys working on a house up the back. Lol.
 
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 15, 2020, 10:11:22 pm
Hopefully get a flight tomorrow, maybe try out a video



Looking forward to seeing that one Andy  O0
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 15, 2020, 10:24:31 pm
First job is to get my wasp plans, what there is of them, mostly scraps of tracing paper with half cut out sections. I dont know if I have a chance of hitting under 25g, but I will give it a go. I need to half all my dimensions so that simplifies it a bit. My only complicating feature is that I want the quadcopter to detach easily as I still like to fly it in my stubby skycrane. I have a 4 inch square of my 2x 1/32 balsa superlight ply. This will do most of the abdomen formers.
 Another one will be made up for the large front former of abdomen. I am looking forward to this smaller project, I have done one already, this one is going to be more fiddly tho.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 15, 2020, 10:27:23 pm
My medical pod in photos above is made from a fast food tray, I used its rounded formed edges to get my shape, interesting project and turned out pretty light.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 16, 2020, 11:54:21 am
It flies fine with the wings on, I was trying to move it up and down at one point to flap the wings, it worked a bit. About as heavy as I would like to load it. Its pretty much finished now anyway
Video here.   https://youtu.be/ZaXHFI3IGfs
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 16, 2020, 12:08:36 pm
I am building a mini wasp for indoor flying. First job is to get my wasp plans, what there is of them, mostly scraps of tracing paper with half cut out sections. I dont know if I have a chance of hitting under 25g, but I will give it a go. I need to half all my dimensions so that simplifies it a bit. My only complicating feature is that I want the quadcopter to detach easily as I still like to fly it in my stubby skycrane. I have a 4 inch square of my 2x 1/32 balsa superlight ply. This will do most of the abdomen formers.
 Another one will be made up for the large front former of abdomen. I am looking forward to this smaller project, I have done one already, this one is going to be more fiddly tho. After I started writing this, I got stuck in and got the mini wasp abdomen done...... I have since sheeted the front of it. I have broken the formers a few times trying to hold sheeting on firmly while the glue sets. It is a bit more solid now.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 16, 2020, 09:19:29 pm
The mini wasp abdomen is quite heavy already. The big wasp weighs about 250 without the quad bits and battery. I have to get the mini wasp at 25g to fly. This means it is a tenth of the weight. The reason I mention this is that the mini wasp abdomen is close to 10g already, the big wasp abdomen was 40g at this stage, mini wasp abdomen should be about 4g if I am to be on target for 25g all up. Its not looking good, there wasnt much weight I could have removed, it is pretty fragile already. I will keep going. It may have to be a 2 legged, wingless, balsa coloured mini wasp.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 16, 2020, 11:57:30 pm
Started on the thorax, this is it at exactly half the size of the big one, jeezo, not much spare room in there. But it does fit. No idea how the weight is going to go, Just need to keep building and see. Worst case is it just hangs from the ceiling and I keep flying my stubby skycrane. I am hoping it flies tho, I am just a bit shocked the abdomen weighed so much. I didnt half the material sizes, 1/32 sheeting would be 1/64 on my small one, also I used 1/16 sq stringers on both. All adds up. I dont think I could work with 1/32 sq!
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 17, 2020, 12:39:01 pm
The mini wasp abdomen is quite heavy already. The big wasp weighs about 250 without the quad bits and battery. I have to get the mini wasp at 25g to fly. This means it is a tenth of the weight. The reason I mention this is that the mini wasp abdomen is close to 10g already, the big wasp abdomen was 40g at this stage, mini wasp abdomen should be about 4g if I am to be on target for 25g all up. Its not looking good, there wasnt much weight I could have removed, it is pretty fragile already. I will keep going. It may have to be a 2 legged, wingless, balsa coloured mini wasp.
 The thorax is at 6g, not much to add, sheeting either side and a hatch of some sort on top. This will probably leave me about 7g, for the head, legs and paint..........dont know if I can manage that. I could probably open the abdomen carefully and remove some material inside but it wouldnt be very much.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: JimG on March 17, 2020, 12:44:41 pm
Have you tried to get what is known as "contest" balsa from some of the specialist free flight suppliers. This is a very light balsa, much lighter than normal.
Jim
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 17, 2020, 04:27:36 pm
Hi Jim, to be honest, I could build a bit lighter but it makes it really fragile. Also thought about sanding the sheeting thinner as well before sticking it on. There are bits inside that I can remove, with some difficulty, but possible.
I had thought about carving a set of plug halves and vacuum moulding the main bit, but thats onother project.
I think its going to be real close, will see soon enough. I have the head laminated, its weighing in at just over 4g unfinished, so at least its on target for being 1/10 th of the big one, its 34g.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 17, 2020, 04:42:28 pm
Progress so far, front legs are alloy wire, pretty light and take the weight ok. Total weight so far is also shown. I can maybe lose a few grams off this, but not a lot.
I meant to say that using superglue seems to add a lot of weight, pinning and woodglue would take ages too. It may be a project in future to make a superlight version, on this one, the three main bits dont glue together, so I can try a dragonfly abdomen and head. I definately think a dragonfly abdomen could be built lighter.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 17, 2020, 05:55:20 pm
Well, I decided to give it a try, its got most of the main bits on it, flew fine with a couple of pilot errors, the quadcopter frame is a tight slide in fit. Next thing will be a hatch and finish off the head and get it all ready for painting. Test flight video here. https://youtu.be/hJUj48JFbw8
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 17, 2020, 05:56:02 pm
And some legs.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 17, 2020, 09:48:16 pm
Made up the hatch, for ease of working on the wasp, I tack glued the hatch on, I will probably be leaving the quad in there for a good while, its still easily removable. I lost a bit of weight off the head during final sanding. I hope to get a coat of yellow on the 3 sections and will see how it looks, I may have to just do one coat.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 17, 2020, 11:45:21 pm
First coat of yellow on it. That didnt take long, nearing the finish already, I still have yellow areas to re coat once I draw on the markings when the yellow is dry. Then a coat of black markings. Pretty sure it will be near max weight then. Legs are still to do, will see what flying is like after painting, might not cope with any legs extra. And I definitely think wings are not going to be possible. I may do the other legs 'retracted' to save them breaking, they need to be superlight specials. Front leg shrouds.... Probably need to be balsa, as light as I can find. Maybe simplified a bit for
 'not knocking bits off every landing- ability'
 It's looking good though, black will set it off. One main difference between this one and the big one is the props barely miss the head on the small one. But they do miss. I have the props relatively lower in the thorax, as I have the lights all taped on top of the quad board, needing extra height. I am pretty sure this one will get flown more than the big one, until better weather comes. Everywhere is twice as big for wasp flying now. Lol.

Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 17, 2020, 11:49:09 pm
Just how close the props are, small amount of sanding left to do when I took this picture
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 17, 2020, 11:59:01 pm
That's a crackin' pace you're working at Andy - good luck with your 'mini-me' wasp. (or you could call it a wisp or even a quisp {-)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 18, 2020, 10:29:22 am
Its quite a small model so nothing takes too long, apart from the paint drying. Lol.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 18, 2020, 10:58:32 am
Is it a swarm yet? Lol. Still waiting on the yellow drying so I can draw the markings on. I will be doing another coat on head and abdomen, the thorax will only get yellow on markings that are going to be yellow, this should save some weight of yellow and still have shiny yellow bits. Black seems to cover well with just one coat. Still thinking about the legs, got to be light, and either tucked out of the way or fairly strong. I did think about string or something but the front legs need clad in balsa so may as well do the rest from balsa as well. Fiddly carving ahead.....
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 18, 2020, 02:23:41 pm
Second coat of yellow. Photo doesn't really show it well but its good bit shinier. Once this is dry it will be time to paint the black on, cant wait, it really transforms it. Still no legs, I am going to measure the big ones legs and start drawing up the legs for the small one. Dont know if I will have the spikes, carving balsa to fine points at this size will leave them highly snappable. Its only semi scale anyway. I am liking the way the head comes off for battery changing, much better than having a hatch. And I can make different heads, I definately fancy doing a dragonfly head and abdomen for the small one.
 The big one might end up with new head featuring moving jaws, I still have a 3v supply I can switch from the transmitter. With the big one's head sitting at 34g, I am sure I could build a hollow one with a tiny motor and gearbox to work the jaws or wave the antenna. Or just fly it as it is.
 Does the little one count as giant scale if its a half scale model of the full size model ( which is 20 times life size) lol.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 18, 2020, 05:31:54 pm
Two wasps, their controllers and their batteries. The small one's transmitter has a number 7 on it, because this is how much it cost, delivered, second hand but unopened. Add £5 max for balsa and glue and its a £12 rc wasp, not to mention an enjoyable little project. I have two of the little syma x7 quads, the other, standard one cost 15 delivered. The same shop is selling them for £10 now, amazing value, I am going to buy a couple more soon as I have any funds.
 I just love building these bodies at the moment, its a different kind of challenge.
 I have been modelling for 40 years odd now, started on plastic kits, boats, went on to cars then planes and helis and quadcopters. Indoor flying has always been something I wanted. Now its definitely here. I have always swapped back and forward through different modelling disciplines. Planes have been my most prolific building item with well over a hundred, boats next, probably around 30,followed by cars then helis then full size (but tiny)  boats at 4 so far.
 I intend to use motor pods from the big quads to power a plane and I also want to recreate an airboat I built about 30 years ago, in a smaller size, the original was just under 4 feet long and powered by an os35fp aero engine. Oily beast it was too, even with an exhaust deflector tube. Glad I went electric, from that point of view. Another os35fp powered project was the pike, the prop ran in a shaped trough built into the boat. It would have cut down on prop thrust but it put the motor as low as it would go. Stills from a video and my sketch show the pike.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 18, 2020, 05:34:23 pm
Mini wasp flight with yellow paint still tacky with crash into phone, video here
https://youtu.be/8ZeC0pw0pGQ
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 18, 2020, 09:26:30 pm
Black markings painted on abdomen and thorax, still to paint head, I will use my method with latex glove stretched over to sketch on. Hope to do that later.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 18, 2020, 11:37:02 pm
Head painted, still some matt black to go on some areas but basically finished. Will need to wait till paint dries so I can have a test flight to see if its worth making legs for it. Big ones head weighs more than the mini wasp bodyshell (minus the quad)
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 19, 2020, 12:02:33 am
Pc fan is for faster drying, and blowing balsa dust onto it. Lol.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 19, 2020, 11:56:29 am
Its turned out pretty well, it looks just as menacing as the big one, maybe more so because it looks more like there's a possibility of a wasp getting to that size. I know they dont, so far anyway. Also, if they were that size in real life, there would be more chance of hitting the bigger one with a bat, golf club or whatever. Lol.
 Well happy with it, nice, different little model for very little outlay. I have had the quadcopter about a year, had plenty of fun with it in standard spaceship form, then bare bones with the body off, then inside the stubby skycrane and now its a waspling. Lol. It can be removed, the hatch is only tack glued in 4 places, but the paint is all along the edges, so that might cause difficulty. I will be leaving it in there for a while anyway. I hope to get another couple of these if they are still available when I get some funds.
 Cant wait for a test flight, its still well tacky tho, best waiting........ Wheres me nano quadcopter? Get a nano wasp happening. Lol. I have a cheerson cx 10, tiny, was good flier then the battery gave up. I need to see if I have any tiny lipos of a suitable size. They are expensive to buy, compared to the price of the original quad. My silverlit z century benefitted from fitting a smaller battery, it actually flies for longer now? I have had numerous small rc toys, some bad, some good, now they are 'some parts' lol. The z century's new battery was from a terrible twist and tilt control rc car, really hard to drive, especially as I was used to driving my mini, beetle and capri race cars . It got tried a few times then shelved.
  Photo shows sketched out leg parts for the small wasp. Pretty fiddly at this size tho.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 19, 2020, 01:07:16 pm
Wind has dropped enough for a giant wasp test flight outdoors. Recorded using phone mounted on transmitter, so I am trying to fly and keep wasp in the middle of the screen, bit of practice needed. Video here
https://youtu.be/NCzrqIw56Ys
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 19, 2020, 01:24:09 pm
Fantastic achievement Andy - can't be easy to control and video at the same time - great to see your persistence has paid off  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 19, 2020, 01:31:04 pm
Thanks very much Ray, I like it when people get to see my 'stuff', even more if they like it. I flew the mini wasp outdoors too, but its transmitter wont take my phone or I would have recorded it. The dog doesnt seem too bothered, I hope she would get out the way if a real one that size appeared.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 19, 2020, 02:33:03 pm
Video of wasp flying in a more open area. Flies well.
https://youtu.be/FsbY2RokgRI
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 19, 2020, 03:49:11 pm
Mini wasp with painting finished, few small crashes. Lol
https://youtu.be/MkdjHIAR9pY
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 21, 2020, 12:47:56 pm
I have had a few days flying both wasps, they both have their own characteristics, the small one is noticeably more loaded up. The big one has a bit more power in reserve, but more breakable if you do make a mistake, having said that, they have both been crashed a few times now,  the waspling has a few dings and dents on its face, big one has had a few heavy landings too, worst damage was a cracked antenna, so they are pretty durable considering their lightweight construction. They are easier to fly, I think, than a standard quad as you can instantly tell which direction they are facing. Not always easy to tell with a standard quad.
 One of my friends suggested producing a plan, I dont know if there would be any demand for it tho, its not your usual build. It is pretty straightforward construction for someone that has built a model or two. I would need to look into how much it would cost to get some printed up. Next time I have funds, I will make enquiries. There are some differences between the two sizes obviously but they both feature the same build method. Both donor quads are at an all time low price just now.
 The small one might be getting a dragonfly conversion kit. I will get a chance to draw the parts required for it soon, hopefully. The photo shows a dragonfly with its thorax in virtually same scheme as the wasp, so its a good candidate for basing mine on. I am running low on foam bits to make the head from, I couldnt even manage a big enough single piece for the mini wasp head, had to join two bits for that. Most of my foam stock went on building the two rc shark fins several years ago, and a big 46 powered delta.
 
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 21, 2020, 12:56:45 pm
I'm just guessing this - the dragonfly abdomen would need to be made of a heavier material to counter balance the head/thorax?


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 21, 2020, 01:17:20 pm
Hi Ray, I was thinking that due to it being longer, it would end up balancing out. Wont know for sure till I build it though.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 21, 2020, 10:05:43 pm
I was just thinking that if it does end up front heavy, I can add a small weight at far end of abdomen.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 21, 2020, 10:14:51 pm
That would be achievable, maybe a small ball-bearing or similar item.
Interesting anyway  :-)


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 21, 2020, 10:18:51 pm
I have slivers of lead sheeting I used for balancing free flight gliders, a small bit of that should be enough, hopefully
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 24, 2020, 04:02:45 pm
I had the wasp flying yesterday, my highest flight with it so far, about 50 feet up above my back garden with loads of phone wires about, bit nerve wracking but flew well with no problems. I have tested an unmodified quad of the same type up to what I estimated to be over 400 feet with no problems, apart from a fairly strong wind to contend with. I was actually very impressed with this, I never expected it to have such good range for something that cost me £20. It was only due to this test that I trusted my wasp at height. The tailslide problem on the jetranger has made me wary of flying it any higher than 10 feet or so. The wasp doesn't seem to suffer from this problem, the seaknight doesnt have it either, I dont know whether to suspect the jetranger's control board, or maybe a rear motor. Further testing required, all part of the fun. Lol.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 26, 2020, 05:28:02 pm
It was gonna escape😁
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Capt Podge on March 26, 2020, 05:37:17 pm
  {-) {-) {-)


Brilliant! 🤗


Regards,
Ray.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 27, 2020, 06:01:01 pm
A couple of days ago, an idea popped into my head about showing my video of the wasp, out in the open (ish) bit off grass out front, to the youtube guys 'flite test' they do all sorts of stuff, flying tanks, battleships. Paper covered foam board planes, fpv combat, reviews etc. However, I couldnt find a direct way of messaging them, maybe I missed something, but I thought any department might get it and pass it on, so I found one at STEM support whatever that is.,and sent them the link with a very brief description and asked if they had seen anything similar?
 Waited, nothing, forgot totally about it, then yesterday got an email saying it was amazing, how long did it take to build, and would I mind him showing it to the other guys? I replied Show it to anyone you want. Then I had a thought, and sent another one saying I think the wasp would sell well but I dont have resources to produce it, you guys are welcome to make them as long as you make me your scottish tester, and send me some of your old discarded goodies. Worth trying😁 I am scottish, with very low modelling budget, unless I sell some of my long hours and high cost, back in the day, projects for such cheap prices its like giving away your pet hamster to a total stranger.
Title: Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
Post by: Andy M on March 31, 2020, 08:49:43 pm
Waspling gets spray painted pipe cleaner legs, had to use a black one, kids craft box was low! Lol.