Model Boat Mayhem - Forum

Masterclasses => FAIREY SWORDSMAN - A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS => Topic started by: Martin [Admin] on March 23, 2008, 09:56:30 PM

Title: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Martin [Admin] on March 23, 2008, 09:56:30 PM

Please feel free to share your Questions and comments on Bluebird's  A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS - Swordsman   build in this thread.

(  Build thread:     A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird (http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=7668.msg74039#msg74039)  )

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: GaryM on July 16, 2008, 11:13:24 PM
Hi Bluebird

Received my plans of FLJ, mind you I had to wait 17 long hours after phoning till they were delivered to the door! :o  :)

It will be a while before I start, but I was wondering whether it would still be classed as a 'beginners' model if I were to double the size?  Or should I stick to the plans?
I suppose it's because I'm a bit clumsy and I like 'big'

Also where is it best to source 'Liteply' & 'Obechi' my local stores (Wick's, B & Q, Homebase, Focus etc.)  all supply sheets of 'plywood' in various thicknesses, but no branded names and no Balsa.

regards
Gary :)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on July 16, 2008, 11:25:26 PM
http://www.slecuk.com/

No, Gary. You make your own ball and chain doubling the thing to 48"!
But if you do..............  ;)
FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: GaryM on July 16, 2008, 11:37:46 PM
Thanks FLJ O0 - I think :)

I really want 48" but at the same time don't want to run before I can walk, so to speak. :)
Most of all I want to be dead proud of a model I've constructed myself from some bits of wood. :)  I would also like it to be big. :)

regards
Gary :)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on July 17, 2008, 08:22:40 AM
Gary
How about a compromise - 36" (i.e. x 150%) with two Speed 600 ECOs in it? Now THAT I could drool over.......... 8)
FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on July 17, 2008, 11:34:40 AM
hi there Goodmorning GaryM

If you have a look at the photograph which I have just posted - the model of the whaleback in the background is 40 inches long.  Comparing that with the Swordsman in front of her shows that the Swordsman is not that 'small'.   The Swordsman is just right for the beginner especially where there is not much or very little experience from building from a plan.   Double that & one will double their mistakes.   Anyway, FLJ just wants you to spend more money on two speed controllers  :P .

aye
john e
bluebird
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DickyD on July 17, 2008, 01:33:56 PM
More done to the whaleback John. Not on the build yet ?  ::)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: GaryM on July 17, 2008, 08:52:49 PM
Thanks FLJ and Bluebird,

I guess I'm going to go with Bluebird, in retrospect the size isn't so important, it's the finished model and how 'easy' it was to construct.
I'll still be getting my ESC etc from ACTion. :)

regards
Gary :)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: banjo on July 17, 2008, 10:10:18 PM
 O0

A wise move....in doubling the size you more than quadruple the power requirements...   (I think) or was that for aircraft?

 :o
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on July 18, 2008, 09:05:29 AM
Hi ya there GaryM

Glad to hear that you are going to stick to the original size for this model.  The trick now is to sit back and really enjoy the build - because this is one of the best builds I have ever done from a plan - it was very enjoyable.

As far as power requirements go and electrical stuff, a word of caution here - FLJ has a new speed controller on the block - a 130LOX.  Although the 130LOX is very small - this speed controller is only used to drive Gin and Tonic mixers  :P so please be wary of it.  :-X

aye
John e
bluebird
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on August 26, 2008, 03:03:25 PM
hello one and all

I have had several emails asking me which/what type of tissue I used to cover the hull with on this build; the answer is basically, it is an aircraft tissue; the same stuff I used to cover the model Keilcraft aeroplanes with.   All I did, was went into the model shop, and then I asked for some lightweight tissue; I am unsure as to whether you can get various grades of this tissue; but, no doubt someone will tell us.

The stuff I used was very thin and light and it was not fibreglass tissue.

aye
john e
bluebird
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: hazegry on January 13, 2009, 02:55:53 AM
I went to model boats magazine and they didnt have the plans listed does anyone know where I could get an electronic copy? I could have a print shop print it out for me this looks like a nice build for me and the kiddo. thanks
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on January 13, 2009, 07:50:45 AM
I went to model boats magazine and they didnt have the plans listed does anyone know where I could get an electronic copy? I could have a print shop print it out for me this looks like a nice build for me and the kiddo. thanks

So I go down to the print shop and have it scanned so I can E-Mail it to you so you can go to the print shop and have it printed............do you own a print shop, by any chance?! As the geezer wot designed and drew it, I can supply these at cost plus postage.
I have a fresh copy already printed out, directly from the original tracings. It's yours for a fiver, delivered to your door.
PM me if you're interested.
FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: andrewh on January 13, 2009, 08:56:25 AM
Tissue factoids:

John, by getting model aircraft covering tissue you purchased high wet strength - which is important if you like to cover "wet" ie making the tissue moist before covering, laying it over the structure reasonably straight and glueing or doping into position.  The tissue shrinks firmly as it dries so it covers tightly.

There are indeed different weights of aircraft tissue (or at least there used to be) "lightweight" and "heavyweight", and these are still available, but take more searching for.

If anyone wishes to cover "dry" then florists tissue, or the packs that come from stationers will do the trick, although they are not very strong.

5 Star make a wide variety of covering tissues (Starspan) in at least 2 weights
http://www.starspan.co.uk/

Mike Woodhouse supplies a large variety of coverings - including polyester and carbon fibre tissues
 http://www.freeflightsupplies.co.uk/
look under "LW coverings"  (btw Jap tissue means high quality, high wet strength tissue with one side glossy - normally very lightweight)

hope this may help somebody
andrew
stick and tissue freak

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: hazegry on January 13, 2009, 08:05:38 PM
PM sent and yes I have access to a print shop
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on January 14, 2009, 06:58:52 PM
Andrewh - hi there

as far as the tissue is concerned which I used on this model - when I applied this extremely lightweight tissue; I didnt bother water shrinking it - the reason being I was following instructions which I had acquired from FLJ on the finishing of this model;

there was no mention of water shrinking the tissue - If I recall rightly I used thinned down dope (no not me wife)  %% to stick it to the balsa wood hull.   Then, when this had dried I gave further applications of thinned down dope on top of the tissue.    No doubt, if you ask FLJ, very nicely ... he will be able to furnish anyone with the finishing instructions.

aye
john e
bluebird
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on January 14, 2009, 07:51:03 PM
http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=7710.0

Ninth post onward refers.

HTH

FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: manoss27 on March 04, 2009, 06:22:38 PM
hi i am from greece and new in this hobby... i will try to construct my rc boat (swordsman) it will be my first... i found the user guide in forum very usefull thank you!!!!

but i cant find the plans..... :((

please can somebody help me to find the plans please????

thank you all!!!
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on March 04, 2009, 07:21:07 PM
hi i am from greece and new in this hobby... i will try to construct my rc boat (swordsman) it will be my first... i found the user guide in forum very usefull thank you!!!!

but i cant find the plans..... :((

please can somebody help me to find the plans please????

thank you all!!!

Hello Manos
I can supply copies of the 2-sheet plans. I normally ask for £5 to cover the cost of Xeroxing them plus the postage within the UK. This might be a little more to Greece. If you are interested then please send me a Private Message and we can go from there.
FLJ (aka Dave Milbourn, Designer of Swordsman)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: tomh on April 15, 2009, 01:30:47 AM

Hi
    After a lapse of about 30 years my interest in model boats has been rekindled. After reading through the forum I am determined to do it properly and would like to start with the Swordsman and work my way up. Is it possible to get a copy of the plans? I would be most grateful for any help

Thanks and regards

Tom
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on April 15, 2009, 08:55:00 AM

Hi
    After a lapse of about 30 years my interest in model boats has been rekindled. After reading through the forum I am determined to do it properly and would like to start with the Swordsman and work my way up. Is it possible to get a copy of the plans? I would be most grateful for any help

Thanks and regards

Tom

Tom
I now have these plans in digital format (PDF) so if you can get a copy shop to print them out (A1 size) then you're welcome to a copy of the file. Just send me your E-Mail address. If not, I can send a printed set by post for £5 to UK.
FLJ ('im wot designed it)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: tomh on April 16, 2009, 10:01:45 AM
Hi Dave

Plans are great, had them printed today and now organising materials for my first build. I really appreciate your help.

Regards

Tom
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on April 16, 2009, 11:23:21 AM
Tom

You're welcome, mate - and thanks for the OK. I paid top dollar to have those beggars scanned, but it'll save time schlepping down to the copy shop in future.

I'd be interested to see the results of anyone's efforts with this model - we've passed on maybe 20 sets of plans since John did his Masterclass build.

And to Roy CBR............please don't  put a Darke Horse 785 in it. There's precious little water left in Oz as it is, without your model boiling off what's left in your pond.........

FLJ

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 16, 2009, 04:23:23 PM
hi there FLJ

It seems a lifetime since I actually built that little model from your plans.   Funny thing is, I have just set it all up again, with a new battery pack - Hopefully I am taking her down to the Marine Park Lake for the official re-opening of the sailing lake and building by the council officials.
aye
john

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on April 16, 2009, 04:29:52 PM
hi there FLJ
It seems a lifetime since I actually built that little model from your plans.   Funny thing is, I have just set it all up again, with a new battery pack - Hopefully I am taking her down to the Marine Park Lake for the official re-opening of the sailing lake and building by the council officials.
aye
john

That'll put a smile on your face,dude! Chase a duck or two for me.
FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on July 05, 2009, 10:25:26 PM
Hi there

Dodged a thunderstorm tonight and actually sailed the owld Swordsman -  :-))  - I have changed the props around - originally she had a 3 blader on of 35mm diameter.   I swapped it for a 35mm 2 blader racing prop to see how she would perform - to be honest with you there wasnt much difference so I swapped to a 40mm 2 blader and I had to remove the cabin roof to let air into the motor - as it was getting rather WARM  %%  - the motor isnt water cooled.  For anyone buiklding this model; it may be a thought to add a cooling coil to the motor  :-))

Still its a lovely and enjoyable model to sail - very pleasing - literally threw it in the water & away she went.

aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DickyD on July 06, 2009, 10:03:56 AM
Very nice John, I'm getting a bit worried about you, you seem to be spending an awful lot of time at the lake lately. {:-{
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: adam62 on January 14, 2010, 07:57:33 PM
HI
 this is the first thing i've put on the forum . I have been studying this build and Bluebirds build notes has wetted my appetite to have a go , however , i have trouble seeing if i have sent a PM to FLJ about some "electric plans " . Any ideas ,
     yours adam62
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: craftysod on January 14, 2010, 08:12:46 PM
A good choice there Adam.
A quite straightforward and pleasing build.
John's build is very helpful,dont worry about if Dave has got your pm.
If he has received it,you will get a quick reply.
I will pm him with your name,so you will get a reply.
Regards
Mark
p.s dont forget to download John's pictures for reference
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on January 14, 2010, 08:22:10 PM


HI
 this is the first thing i've put on the forum . I have been studying this build and Bluebirds build notes has wetted my appetite to have a go , however , i have trouble seeing if i have sent a PM to FLJ about some "electric plans " . Any ideas ,
     yours adam62
hi Adam62 if FLJ has received your pm he will respond if not FLJ SWITCH ON YOUR HEARING AID
 %)

bluebird

john e

ps good luck with the build if stuck give a shout  :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on January 14, 2010, 08:37:10 PM
"Plans were sent at 19:52hrs, Sir!"

Where's the photos of all of these boats I've been sending out plans for? I know John has finished his and I saw another at Llanberis, but there must be more than two?
Don't be shy!

FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: craftysod on January 14, 2010, 08:42:42 PM
This is where mine got to Dave,sold it as i wasnt happy.
Going to build another,when the slipway is clear.
(http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh293/craftysod/PICT0114.jpg)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on January 14, 2010, 08:50:30 PM
I've just read through John's build notes and found a Bloob's Blooper. Where the finishing notes say to use sanding sealer thinned 50/50, it's 50% sealer and 50% thinners (not, as John says, 50% sealer and 50% clear dope). It should be like 'whole' milk in consistency or it won't soak into the tissue, and you'll get brush-marks and runs in it.

Mark
Thanks for the photo. That's three.......................and counting.
FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on January 14, 2010, 09:07:32 PM
HELP please don't shoot the messenger  %% %% %% I was only following instructions laid down in stone tablet by a Mr Dave Milbourn in May 1999 Model Boats Magazine - it does say "thin 50-50" but thin with what???? but now I know...duh lack of communicado between management and sub-ordinate ..........  %) %) %) {-) {-) well Dave I tell ya what mine still hasnt fallen apart yet !!!!

aye bloobs
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on January 14, 2010, 10:43:39 PM
Hwell Dave I tell ya what mine still hasnt fallen apart yet !!!!

It's the way ya mak 'em, Sand Dancer!
FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: kiwi on January 15, 2010, 09:29:57 AM
Hi FLJ,
mine sorta shrank. Its only 12" long and should have it done by the end of the month, then will see if adding water brings it upto full size.
I hope to actually build one from your plans at 24" a little later in the year.
This one was drawn from a combination of your plans which you sent late last year, the original plans I purchased way back in the late 60's, and photos. My workshop is a vertical computer desk in the corner or the lounge, hence only small builds at the moment.
cheers
kiwi
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on January 15, 2010, 12:05:37 PM
That's pretty!
Four and counting............
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: adam62 on January 18, 2010, 04:48:45 PM
You might like to know that my plans are now of my stick and on to A1 sheet . Nice boy in well known stationers let me have a double copy free , certainly going back there .   I have now put them on to grease proof paper (traced ) and will attempt to stick them to the liteply ready to be cut round , although i can't do any of this on my own as my son James is dead keen to help ! Hoping to get to Portishaed next sunday to see what goes on and to make contact , always helps to pick someones brains .
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on January 18, 2010, 07:02:57 PM
1 Place your plan on a flat, smooth surface and secure it with tape.

2 Lay the tracing paper over it and secure it with tape.

3 Using a pencil, trace the plan with as much or little detail as you need.

4 Once you have finished tracing the plan, remove the plan from underneath the tracing paper.

5 Turn the tracing paper over so that the tracing is face down and the blank side of the paper is facing up.

6 Coat the WHOLE blank side of the paper with graphite (lead) using your pencil.

To coat the blank side of the tracing paper, hold your pencil almost completely sideways with the lead touching the paper and move your pencil lead back and forth to create an even coat of gray or black surface.

7 Obtain a new surface, building material, to transfer your drawing.

8 Place the drawing paper on a flat, smooth surface and secure it with tape.

9 Place the tracing paper gently on top of the building material with the graphite surface face down. You may secure it in place as well.

10Trace the image, with pressure, onto the building material.

11Gently remove the tracing paper when you have completed tracing the drawing. You will now have your transferred drawing on your desired surface.

The above was copied off the internet on how to trace - because I have been asked once or twice when I trace, do I cut the traced image out - no I dont - but obviously I do once its been put on the building material.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on February 04, 2010, 03:14:29 PM
(http://)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on February 04, 2010, 03:21:57 PM
hi here is my build of swordsman a bit more tweaking and its ready to launch   :D larry
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on February 07, 2010, 07:47:38 PM
Hi there

Lovely model of the Swordsman - how did you manage to get the chrome around the windscreen Larry?

Cracking model

aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on February 08, 2010, 08:56:02 PM
hi bluebird chrome windows on swordsman is greeting card craft card purchased from Wilkinson's store in bristol pattens photo copied from plan prite stick glued to back of card then with a sharp surgical type knife cut with care cut round patten then cut round the outer profile of srceens onto card mount board or any good card you now have a patten to cut out clear styrene  now it gets tricky now with clear contact glue i use Bostitch allpurpose smear the edges of card chrome frames when tacky with care stick chrome frames on to clear screens now treat chrome card edges with clear humbrol now lightly cover faces of chrome frames this is to make it water repellent now with screens now bonded together with bostic ap position units over screen cut outs it worked for me i use card  a lot on my models see my puffer on scratch building from scrap i am trying out some chrome fablon on some on some more small units so far so good i this helps cheers Larry O0
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ivanhoe on April 08, 2010, 08:32:10 PM
I suppose that you can call me a  born again boater.  I have come back to model boats after around 40 years. 
The last kit I built back in the days of yore was the Aerokits Swordsman, and  I found this build whilst trying to see if I could get the plan for the 33" Aerokits model, but I have now decided to give this version a try instead as a re-introduction to the hobby.

I live in Northern Ireland, so there are large amounts of open water available in the shape of numerous loughs (lakes) within a short distance of where I live, if my build of this smaller Swordsman is successful I shall probably build the bigger model for i/c power later on.

I have pm'ed FLJ with a request for the electronic version of the plan, and hopefully will be building shortly.  If I consider the results to be good enough I will post pics at a later date.

Wilf
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on April 08, 2010, 08:49:55 PM
hi there you cant go wrong with this model build is a dodle if you follow the links it performs lovley on the water and theres plenty info on line for details cheers larry
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ivanhoe on April 11, 2010, 07:08:46 PM
Can I ask for a little advice on r/c for the Swordsman?

I have a 35mhz 4-function outfit, used previously for aircraft, that I want to use in this boat, but of course the Rx aerial is much too long for a boat, what's best to do about it? I obviously don't need the range that I do for A/c so is it ok to cut the aerial wire and attach it to a whip aerial? (I have serveral rx's so cutting an aerial on one would be no problem)
Back in my previous modelling life all r/c was on 27mhz (as I believe is still legal for boats) but I'm darned if I can remember what aerial setup I used in boats then, it's a LONG time ago!

Any help much appreciated, thanks

Wilf
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 11, 2010, 07:12:50 PM
hi ya there Wilf

I am afraid 35 mhz is illegal for surface craft such as boats and cars in UK.  You would definitely need to have a 40mgz set or a new 2.4 ghz which everyone is going crackers for - or - dig out your old 27 mghz - but definitely the 35 mhz is a no-no on surface craft.

john e

bluebird
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on April 12, 2010, 02:27:47 PM
hi there by a .set  spektum dx5e you will have no problems i have 1 trani and 5 receivers all work well on all boats all same set up.larry :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 12, 2010, 07:21:34 PM
Hello there Wilf

If you fancy a model with a bit more umph in it, try and get hold of last month and this month's model boats mag.  I did a build for the Shamrock in there - and this is another plan by FLJ same sort of style as the Swordsman; but, you can upgrade the motor a little better.   After I finished the build for the magazine, I upgraded the motor in the Shamrock to a Graupner 600E and by hey it doesnt half fly.    There's another bit of food for thought for you.

aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ivanhoe on April 13, 2010, 08:16:18 AM
hi ya there Wilf

I am afraid 35 mhz is illegal for surface craft such as boats and cars in UK.  You would definitely need to have a 40mgz set or a new 2.4 ghz which everyone is going crackers for - or - dig out your old 27 mghz - but definitely the 35 mhz is a no-no on surface craft.

john e

bluebird



Now that shows you what I know!

Bit of a blow that, so I suppose I must look around for a new system, or go back to flying and give up the idea of getting back into boats
Oh well, we'll have to see

Thanks for the info

Wilf
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: HS93 (RIP) on April 13, 2010, 08:47:46 AM
what TX do you have on 35mhz and does it have a buddy lead socket or better still a module ?

Peter
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ivanhoe on April 17, 2010, 04:08:08 PM
hi ya there Wilf

I am afraid 35 mhz is illegal for surface craft such as boats and cars in UK.  You would definitely need to have a 40mgz set or a new 2.4 ghz which everyone is going crackers for - or - dig out your old 27 mghz - but definitely the 35 mhz is a no-no on surface craft.

john e

bluebird

Further to my R/C problems.  I've got hold of a used Futaba "Attack" 2-fuction transmitter on 40mhz since my last message.  I just need to find a 2-function 40mhz Rx now at a sensible price, and then I should be cooking! I have all the battery packs and servos anyway.

The build is going OK, I've ordered a couple of 540 motors, and I'm looking for shaft and tube now, I'll post photos if the finished vessel is good enough!

Wilf



Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: BoatyBoy on April 17, 2010, 06:18:57 PM
http://www.howesmodels.co.uk/RadioControl/viewProduct.php?ProdID=1274 (http://www.howesmodels.co.uk/RadioControl/viewProduct.php?ProdID=1274)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 17, 2010, 07:36:20 PM
hi there Wilf

check that Futaba attack transmitter to make sure it is either FM or AM for your receiver.   As for the receiver Boatboy has put on, that is a Cirrus 4 channel FM receiver and if your transmitter is AM, you will have problems.

I do know the AM receivers are just as cheap for the 2 channel ones.

aye
john e
bluebird
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: knoby on April 17, 2010, 08:33:03 PM
Hi all, just a few pics of my 17 inch swordsman as far as it has progressed. Its built using a George Turner hull & a scaled down set of drawings from the model boats free plan. I was at a show & saw the hulls for sale & knew i had the plan somewhere, so I thought it a good opportunity to get acquainted with brushless motors on the cheap. i made the whole top removable in one piece, as on the larger swordsman models, to allow plenty of room to move things about as i guessed(correctly as it happens) that there would be lots of experimenting. it was first tried with a 1200kva outrunner that I scrounged from a friend who into electric flight, 6 ancient nimh cells from my car racing days & a 35 amp esc.

First run was disappointing, although proved the boat worked OK. Currently theres a 2800kva outrunner in it ( scrounged from the same source) this gives a much better speed, but the bec on the controller cuts off after 4 mins running. So theres some work to do yet, however its been shelved for a while while i work on another project, but i will return to it as soon as I can.

Cheers Glenn.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on April 17, 2010, 09:10:19 PM

(http://s4.postimage.org/kptk9.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aVkptk9)

(http://s4.postimage.org/kpZL0.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aVkpZL0)

(http://s4.postimage.org/kq6er.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aVkq6er)

(http://s4.postimage.org/kqdIS.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aVkqdIS)

(http://s4.postimage.org/kqvaS.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aVkqvaS)

(http://s4.postimage.org/kqHEA.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aVkqHEA)
swordsman in action cheers larry  :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ivanhoe on April 18, 2010, 03:23:03 PM
hi there Wilf

check that Futaba attack transmitter to make sure it is either FM or AM for your receiver.   As for the receiver Boatboy has put on, that is a Cirrus 4 channel FM receiver and if your transmitter is AM, you will have problems.

I do know the AM receivers are just as cheap for the 2 channel ones.

aye
john e
bluebird



Thanks for the advice, John, there is nothing on the tx to say if it's AM or FM unfortunately, just has "Attack digital proportional T2DR" does anyone know how I find out? (Short of trying rx's till one works!)


Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ivanhoe on April 21, 2010, 11:45:28 AM
As a rank beginner (as far as electric power in boats goes) could someone supply me with a "child's guide" to suppressing the 540 motor in the Swordsman?  I have the motor, and the suppressers, which came with it, but I don't know exactly how you solder them in place. I assume  it must be to the power connectors?
Any help very much appreciated.

Wilf
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 21, 2010, 12:26:27 PM
Hi Wilf this may help :-)) half way down the page

http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=13888.0

aye
john e

bloobs
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ivanhoe on April 21, 2010, 04:43:45 PM
Hi Wilf this may help :-)) half way down the page

http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=13888.0

aye
john e

bloobs



Just what I needed, thanks a lot, John  :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ivanhoe on April 27, 2010, 01:29:18 PM
Still working my R/C installation out, I now have sorted-out a 27mhz fully working system for my Swordsman, can I now go back to my original question about the Rx aerial?

Is it OK to just run the aerial round the hull, perhaps under the deck? or is it better to fit some form of whip aerial?  If the latter, do I shorten the aerial wire to attach to the whip, or leave it full length?  Obviously with a boat this size, range is not really a consideration, I would think that it would be well out of sight long before it was out of range!

I know these questions may seem extremely simple to most people, but I have forgotten most of what I once knew about R/C in boats, so please bear with me!

Wilf
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: red181 on April 27, 2010, 11:08:55 PM
lovely pics Larry :-))

wilf, you could run the antenna wire inside the hull, for cosmetic reasons, but you will shorten the range. Some Huntsman and Swordsman do have large aerials on the real boats, halfway down the side, have a look on the Fairey owners club site at owners pics, so you could achieve a realistic look with the aerial outside the boat

(http://s2.postimage.org/tfOoS.jpg) (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=TstfOoS)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on April 28, 2010, 07:51:39 AM
(http://www.action-electronics.co.uk/images/swordsman2403.jpg)
If you look carefully you can see a yellow wire which disappears under the deck at the transom position. There's a 10" whip aerial there which plugs into a short length of brass tube set into the deck, and the aerial connection terminates in a 1mm socket. The corresponding plug is soldered to the shortened Rx aerial wire and the Rx is fitted out of site in the engine bay, just under the windscreen position.
I have a few of these 1mm plugs and sockets kicking around somewhere - just haven't got round to putting them on the price list yet!
FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ivanhoe on April 28, 2010, 11:56:30 AM
(http://www.action-electronics.co.uk/images/swordsman2403.jpg)
If you look carefully you can see a yellow wire which disappears under the deck at the transom position. There's a 10" whip aerial there which plugs into a short length of brass tube set into the deck, and the aerial connection terminates in a 1mm socket. The corresponding plug is soldered to the shortened Rx aerial wire and the Rx is fitted out of site in the engine bay, just under the windscreen position.
I have a few of these 1mm plugs and sockets kicking around somewhere - just haven't got round to putting them on the price list yet!
FLJ


Many thanks, FLJ, that makes it very clear, I'd probably never get this boat finished if it weren't for the help of the folks on this forum!


Wilf
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: wotu2uk on June 06, 2010, 01:26:59 AM
I know that this is preaching to the converted, but a note of caution concerning 40 and 27 MHz aerials.
If you need to join to a boat mounted whip, ensure that the total length is the same overall as the
original wire aerial from the receiver, ie: if your whip aerial is 10 inches long, shorten the aerial wire to the
base of the whip by 10 inches.

Shortening or lengthening the aerial from standard will result in reduced range.

John
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Testsubjec on August 16, 2010, 08:47:00 PM
Evening Guys,

I am looking to start building this little beauty after a number of years away from the hobby. I havenít built anything since I was child when me and my father use to take on projects which lasted months!! Those were the days spending time in his workshop (the hut) on evenings after school and during those Sunday afternoons.

Looking on, I am now looking forward to acquiring the tools needed for me to complete this project and have noticed that I cannot seem to find anywhere selling the small G Clamps or Quick Clamps and also selling the types wood needed.

If anyone out there is able to point me in the right direction it would be much appreciated.

Thanks
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DickyD on August 16, 2010, 08:53:40 PM
Send a personal message to bluebird he'll help you out.

Scroll down the forum index page to "Members List"

Find bluebird on this list

Click on name

When box opens click on "Send this member a personal message."

Away you go.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: FullLeatherJacket on August 16, 2010, 11:07:50 PM
Lite ply is available in sheets from SLEC.
FLJ
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Testsubjec on August 18, 2010, 03:16:21 PM
Thanks for the information. Just getting the tools and materials together now, so hopefully should be able to start work on this boat within a couple of days.
Title: swordsman plan
Post by: LarryW on September 29, 2010, 10:45:58 AM
  hi is the free download plan still aveble if so where..... cheers larry
Title: Re: swordsman plan
Post by: sentry on September 29, 2010, 11:17:14 AM
Hi Larry,
 I think  FLJ has one as I believe he got so fed up of people coping it and selling them on flea bay he has in in some sort of file to down load Hope am Right and hope its of help.
                                 Regards, Sentry.
Title: Re: swordsman plan
Post by: LarryW on September 29, 2010, 05:29:32 PM
thank you ; ..........larry .
Title: Re: swordsman plan
Post by: The long Build on September 29, 2010, 06:26:21 PM
Hi Larry
Have sent you a PM

Regards
Larry  %%
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: gwa84 on December 11, 2010, 12:40:50 AM
hi all are the hard coppy plans stil available from FLJ i cant pm him as he is showing as a guest on mayhem so no pm option hope i can still get them  :}
Title: Re: swordsman plan
Post by: gwa84 on December 11, 2010, 12:41:53 AM
is FLJ still aroun would like a hard coppy of the plans if ther still available  :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Martin [Admin] on December 11, 2010, 07:12:19 AM
Try PM'ing ACTion
Title: Re: swordsman plan
Post by: gwa84 on December 11, 2010, 11:21:43 PM
it seems thease plans are no longer available is ther enybody out ther that would part with a coppy ? for a price of course  :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: rolfman2000 on December 15, 2010, 09:15:39 AM
I would like to get a set of these drawings, as I do like the Swordsman design.  May even try to do the one from the Bond movie.

Cheers,

Dave
Title: Re: swordsman plan
Post by: rolfman2000 on December 15, 2010, 09:16:18 AM
it seems thease plans are no longer available is ther enybody out ther that would part with a copy ? for a price of course  :-))

And another one pleeeeease ???

Even a scan file which I could get printed myself

Cheers,

Dave
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: HS93 (RIP) on December 15, 2010, 09:20:51 AM
I would like to get a set of these drawings, as I do like the Swordsman design.  May even try to do the one from the Bond movie.

Cheers,

Dave

that was not a Swordsman but a Huntress
what size are you building ?
Peter
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: rolfman2000 on December 15, 2010, 09:26:48 AM
that was not a Swordsman but a Huntress
what size are you building ?
Peter

Ah well, me age shows again...Doh !!!

Just the Smaller one... I would like something around the 24 to 36 inch size please... The wife gets Irate if my modles take up more room than her in the car.  %)

Cheers,

Dave
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: HS93 (RIP) on December 15, 2010, 09:50:47 AM

This is the best Plan I have seen , if you want a smaller boat do what I did and go to my local plans shop and get them reduced by the amount you want, I think it is the most accurate plan available, if you want a huntress you just trim the overall huntsman by chopping the rear, read the full size boats info http://www.faireyownersclub.co.uk/default.asp?content=boats&type=huntress

the best plan I think

http://www.myhobbystore.co.uk/product/16697/fairey-huntsman-mm680
Have a look at the build of the Huntsman   
http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=14357.0

peter
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on December 15, 2010, 09:57:05 AM
Hi if you email this gent at ACTion and ask nicely you may get the plans for free as a download
action.rc.electronics@gmail.com
 
 AYE
BLOOBS
 
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: HS93 (RIP) on December 15, 2010, 10:32:18 AM
Hi if you email this gent at ACTion and ask nicely you may get the plans for free as a download
action.rc.electronics@gmail.com
 
 AYE
BLOOBS
 
Why don't you use your normal Nom-de-plume

Peter HS93
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: ACTion on December 15, 2010, 01:40:46 PM
These plans are not available from ACTion.
DM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: gwa84 on December 23, 2010, 04:31:36 PM
thanks for all the help getting plans extra the parts have arrived along with the wood from slek so building has commenced today  :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Martin [Admin] on December 23, 2010, 04:43:08 PM
Where did you get the plans from in the end?
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: rolfman2000 on December 23, 2010, 05:38:51 PM
Where did you get the plans from in the end?


Plus 1

Cheers,

Dave  :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: gwa84 on December 24, 2010, 12:12:14 PM
hi all martin got a set of original plans from the mag from The long Build along with another mag with a plan i will be doing in the future it would be nice if there was a readily available supply for these so pleasant to build i have the hull almost done already wondering weather FLJ would give permission fr people to copy and send them out as i assume theirs a copyright issue
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: gwa84 on December 28, 2010, 11:44:41 PM
making good progress with this build cant believe haw fast it goas together  :}

(http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj298/wiplash84/100_0884.jpg)

(http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj298/wiplash84/100_0883.jpg)


time for paint soon :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on December 29, 2010, 05:10:33 PM
looks good so far ,trick bit i found was the cockpit screen , and trim, but the pool runs are great .
   so good i have just scaled up plans to 32 ins length , for next build with twin motors , modeled on off shore racer.
(http://s2.postimage.org/1u72jmgx0/swordsman5.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/1u72jmgx0/)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on December 29, 2010, 07:19:07 PM
hi ya there, what we will have to do is come up with another plan for a different model - this one seems to be pretty popular, but the plan now seems difficult to sources apart from paying over the top on ebay

looking good - mate.

Ive been looking at the plan for an easy build pilot boat from My Hobbies Store Plans - or it may have been Marine Modelling plans.......another plan for beginners maybe....

aye
john e
bluebird
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: gwa84 on December 29, 2010, 07:32:26 PM
would definitely be interested in something similar to the lasro sprite been wanting the model for ages but cant justify 60 quid for the kit just like the look of it

also a quick question haw did you attach the cockpit wind screen to the wood
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on December 29, 2010, 07:40:29 PM
I stuck it with flour and water....nay nay and thrice nay

Really. First of all I attempted to glue the acrylic sheet with superglue, but did it bond, IT DID NOT.   Anyhow, I ended up using UHU, glue contact adhesive which is still, to this day, sticking very well

aye
john e
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on December 29, 2010, 08:22:20 PM
http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/mar3062.html

Hi this is the plan maybe....for the pilot boat  %)


aye

john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: triumphjon on December 29, 2010, 09:03:16 PM
re windscreen , although my fairey huntsmen are larger at 1/12th scale , ive warmed up my screen halves oveer a heated peice of pre shaped steel , then shaped the plastic over the steel , removing it and holding it to the required shape , having a longer lower sides than normal allows me to screw them into the inner faces of the cockpit ! to join the two halves of screen ive used a 2" long section of brass channel 1/4" x 1/8" which has been cut , angled in the centre and resoldered , then the screen joints are glued to both the top and bottom of the screen . 
(http://s1.postimage.org/fxxv7x8k/huntsman28_underside_023.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/fxxv7x8k/)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on December 29, 2010, 09:11:58 PM
gwa84 hi there

Just having a look at the actual plans for the build regarding the windscreen - and it has just jogged my memory - the windscreen has tabs on the edge of it which actually locate and slots which one has to cut in the cabin roof/cabin sides to which these tabs locate and then glue.  I seem to recall making these tabs slightly 'longer' and also making the windscreen in 2 halves - split down the centre line & I used the mast in the centre of the windscreen as a joining point.  Doing it this way I found made it a lot easier for assembly.

Hope this is of some help.

aye
john e
bluebird
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: gwa84 on December 29, 2010, 11:32:06 PM
thanks bud will try it that way hope it works  :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: triumphjon on December 29, 2010, 11:49:18 PM
mine hasnt got anything down through the cabin roof , a small fillet of car body filler has been used to blend the screen into the roof line ! the central join is also masked by my walnut mast that is glued onto the screen joiners top & bottom with epoxy glue , the wire for the mast light goes through the small gap in the screen and down into the forward cabin .
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on December 30, 2010, 06:28:21 PM
It's nice to have a back-up longbuild - thank you for that.

We did have a backup plan in motion which we can stop now thanks to the new supply  :-))

Plans are still going ahead for a new beginners build of a different boat - as has been requested.

aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: ACTion on January 12, 2011, 02:25:06 PM
Further to correspondence with the Editor of Model Boats magazine, I've just been told that the plans will be introduced into the My Hobby Store range in the near future. Meanwhile anyone requiring just the PDF version can contact either Larry W via this Forum or Paul Freshney at Model Boats. His contact details are in the magazine and on the Model Boats website.
DM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: rathikrishna on January 12, 2011, 02:53:22 PM
Thanks for the pictures and instructions...
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: ACTion on January 12, 2011, 04:34:38 PM
Sorry - wrong Larry! Contact is Long Build aka Larry R.
DM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on January 12, 2011, 04:40:11 PM
thank you ,l but i am still here to help larry w :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: ACTion on January 17, 2011, 01:48:13 PM
This just received from the Editor of Model Boats magazine:

Hi Dave
I have sent today sent the Swordsman plans to our illustrator for adding MHS box etc. Once that is done, which may be 2 to 3 weeks, it will be re-introduced into the plans service and a suitable announcement made on the website and in the magazine.
In the  meantime if anyone asks you, then I will send them your PDFs and the person can always go and get them printed themselves canít they?

DM

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: kdc on January 23, 2011, 02:08:01 PM
Way back at the beginning of this thread someone asked about tissue covering as specified in the original magazine instructions. 
As I am an aeromodeller I have used the following method of tissue covering for aircraft and I reckon it will work on boats just as well.  ( the Swordsman I am building is not quite to that stage yet )

The balsa & ply is doped and allowed to dry.   Tissue ( from a model shop ) cut oversize to suit each section,  is soaked in water for a few minutes and lightly wrung out.  It should be slightly wet but not dripping wet.  The wet tissue is then applied to the model and it will be found that it clings like a magnet.  You then straighten out the wrinkles a little and apply dope with a brush to the parts that are lying flat.  That is correct, you dope it on top of the tissue whilst wet!  It sounds wrong but the dope evaporates the water away and penetrates.  ( obviously the wood must be previously doped and left to dry - minutes usually -to avoid the water soaking in )When the main part is dry then dope any remaining parts that are not stuck down, trimming & cutting as necessary to fit.  Then another coat or two of dope.  For aircraft care has to be taken to ensure the dope does not warp the wings when it dries, but this should not affect boat hulls.  Maybe any lightweight boat parts could warp. When dry, paint is applied.

Tissue could be applied dry if you prefer but its a bit more fiddly.  Also nylon  ( used either wet or dry ) could be used instead of tissue to strengthen the model.  It is applied as above.  The texture shows through slightly needing more coats of paint.

I suppose glasscloth & the latest water based products might have the advantage of less smell but tissue and dope still works.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on January 23, 2011, 06:09:47 PM
hi there

The original idea for using tissue over the top of the build - so I believe was - that the grain in the lite-ply is course and difficult to fill

so a layer of tissue, along with subsequent layers of dope applied to the hull would improve the surface - thus enabling a good surface to be achieved when painting

However, dont forget, this was in days gone-by and the reason in the build which I used the tissue method was to keep in true keeping with the plan build.  Now though

if I were to do this build again, I would advise using a finishing Zepoxy or similar.   This would serve 2 real purposes - give a good finishing surface to paint on (if applied

correctly) and also toughen the skin of the lite-ply.

aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: ACTion on February 26, 2011, 09:20:37 AM
I've just been advised by Paul Freshney that the plans are now available again from My Hobby Store under reference MM2058 @ £9.95. There will be a brief write-up in the Model Boats magazine which will also mention John's build on this Forum as a reference source for builders.
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Colin Bishop on February 26, 2011, 09:41:55 AM
Just to follow up on Dave's post above, you can see the details on the Model Boats Forum here: http://www.modelboats.co.uk/forums/postings.asp?th=48826&p=1

Colin
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: tomarack on June 25, 2011, 03:08:31 PM
Hello, everyone, I am from China, this is my last year doing Fairey Huntsman :-)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on June 25, 2011, 03:57:02 PM
HI RUNABOUT,    nice one nice details ,  could you suply more details on build ?,and how about a few
 pictures on the pool  .    LARRY......
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Martin [Admin] on June 25, 2011, 04:55:05 PM
Yes, very nice model Runabout!   :-)
Please tell me how you made the railings??
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: tomarack on June 25, 2011, 05:06:52 PM
Thank you for your appreciation, send a friend a boat last year, to retain no more photos, paste only the remnants of a few pictures, I'm sorry, my English is very bad. Railings are welded stainless steel tube, which is the traditional Chinese knitting with props,
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: The long Build on June 25, 2011, 06:03:58 PM
Yes, very nice model Runabout!   :-)
Please tell me how you made the railings??

and how you got the curve on the planking ?.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on June 25, 2011, 06:12:17 PM
Hi ya Runabout

Nice model - is this one scratch or kit built?   Just wondering where the hull came from ?   :-))

aye john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: tomarack on June 26, 2011, 03:52:02 AM
Hi ya Runabout

Nice model - is this one scratch or kit built?   Just wondering where the hull came from ?   :-))
Hello: bluebird fiberglass hull last year to try an experiment with gypsum products, now have damage to the negative mode, positive mode still preserved.
aye john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: tomarack on June 26, 2011, 03:58:12 AM
and how you got the curve on the planking ?.
The wooden deck is a piece posted up, of course, is the need to pre-bend
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: johnboscoirl on September 03, 2011, 09:29:02 PM
Thanks Bluebird for plans and tutorial, very new to boat modelling, you have given me a lot of knowledge and inspitation to go ahead with this project.  Well done and many thanks. :-)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: fletch62 on October 16, 2011, 07:29:42 PM
just been reading some build posts of the swordsman and had an thought ive got the plans already also have a cmb 12 ic race engine doing nothing so looks like ive got build to do will post pictures when get started
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: fpravenscroft on June 19, 2012, 06:28:05 PM
hello i'm new to this site and have been lurking in the background for several months now i wonder if the plans are still available for this boat
if so where from and how much?
regards
peter
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on June 19, 2012, 06:58:00 PM
Hi Peter and welcome to mayhem this will help you get started -

http://www.myhobbystore.co.uk/product/33952/swordsman-plan-mm2058


 :}
aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: fpravenscroft on June 20, 2012, 02:52:14 PM
many thanks for a quick reply
regards
peter
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: fpravenscroft on June 20, 2012, 03:09:28 PM
plans ordered many thanks
regards
peter
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: fpravenscroft on June 30, 2012, 03:37:55 PM
can someone put me out of my misery and tell me where part 19 fits most of the framing is now done so i want to make sure before i put the skin on
regards
peter
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on June 30, 2012, 04:24:12 PM
hi ya, I am going through the plans as we speak and if Dave is reading this he will tell you quicker.....be back in a min.

aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on June 30, 2012, 04:40:11 PM
hi again, phew......found em

Part 19: its the RX battery tray and it sits on top of the keel at the back of the boat between the rudder post and the servo mounting and it is glued directly on top of the keel - not essential though  :-))  

Gis mare warning next time - I have a funny filing system in place for me plans - find them in the end its called - can we have some pics of your build  :-)) :-))

hahah

aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: fpravenscroft on July 01, 2012, 01:59:29 PM
thanks for that
i'll take some photo's as i go along they will not be as good as yours though
regards
peter
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: fpravenscroft on July 01, 2012, 03:35:56 PM
some photo's as promised
regards
peter

(http://s14.postimage.org/3mdkuth6l/028.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/3mdkuth6l/)

(http://s15.postimage.org/tqt5fmdzr/029.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/tqt5fmdzr/)

(http://s16.postimage.org/luyt876oh/030.jpg) (http://postimage.org/image/luyt876oh/)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Manfjourde on July 18, 2012, 06:05:56 PM
Just joined the forum after a dry spell of boating. I've been reading about the Swordsman and builds - wondering if I can get a digital of the plans to save on shipping to the US?
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on July 21, 2012, 07:06:59 PM
hi ya
Manfjourde
I know Dave from ACTion (he originally drew these plans) used to be able to send them via email I think

However, since Dave handed the plans to MyHobbies store (again, for the 2nd time  ;D) I am unsure if Dave still sends them electronically - you check with Dave from ACTion)  :-))

aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Manfjourde on August 02, 2012, 06:01:03 AM
Thanks! Got the plans! One question - anyone know where I can find 2mm liteply in the US? Can I substitute 1.5mm for it? We have 1/8" instead of 3mm and that is my plan since they are the "same"
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: ACTion on August 02, 2012, 07:43:14 AM
If you can't obtain Liteply by mail order from the UK then I suggest medium or hard 1/8" balsa for the deck and frames and 1/32" birch ply for the skins.
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Manfjourde on March 06, 2013, 06:06:14 PM
I found some 3mm lite ply in the U.S. For the parts that requite the 2mm you say it would be better to go with 1/32"? I was thinking 1/16" because that is closer to the 2mm mark but I'll go with 1/32" if you think it's better. Thanks!
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: badger on January 20, 2014, 10:33:49 AM
CAN ANY BODY LET ME HAVE A PDF COPY OF THE SWORDSMAN PLAN WITH IMFO ON WHAT SIZE TO PRINT IT TOO.IE A4 OR WHAT. ITS WILL BE MY FIRST BUILD OF A BOAT I AM NEW TOO MODEL BOATS .I WILL ALSO NEED A RECEIVER 27 MHZ AM. I WAS PLEASED TO HAVE BEEN GIVEN A TRANSMITTER AND SERVOS. ANY HELP WOULD BE VERY WELCOME.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                   MANY THANKS BADGER.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Tug-Kenny on January 20, 2014, 10:37:09 AM
Hi Badger and welcome to Mayhem.

Please do not type in capital letters as it's regarded as shouting on the web.   :-))

Best of luck with your new build and quest.

ken


Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on January 20, 2014, 11:20:17 AM
hi ya Badger and welcome to the Forum
 
I am unsure whether anyone can supply you with the plans in PDF format.   Maybe someone on the Forum has them and may offer you them.  I do know Mr Milbourn who originally drew this plan and offered it in PDF format has since handed over the plans/rights to My Hobbies Store - so you could obtain them in printed form for £12.50 and well worth it too.  At least then you dont have the bother of wondering if the plans are printed out correctly or trying to resize them and running into all sorts of printing problemos etc.    A link follows to take you to the printed version of the Plans:-
 
http://www.myhobbystore.co.uk/product/33952/swordsman-plan-mm2058 (http://www.myhobbystore.co.uk/product/33952/swordsman-plan-mm2058)
 
aye
 
John
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on January 20, 2014, 12:34:58 PM
I AM NEW TOO MODEL BOATS .I WILL ALSO NEED A RECEIVER 27 MHZ AM. I WAS PLEASED TO HAVE BEEN GIVEN A TRANSMITTER AND SERVOS. ANY HELP WOULD BE VERY WELCOME.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                   MANY THANKS BADGER.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mini-Micro-2ch-2-Channel-27mhz-AM-Receiver-Reciever-RC-/260637900221?pt=UK_ToysGames_RadioControlled_JN&hash=item3caf3abdbd (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mini-Micro-2ch-2-Channel-27mhz-AM-Receiver-Reciever-RC-/260637900221?pt=UK_ToysGames_RadioControlled_JN&hash=item3caf3abdbd)
 
aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: LarryW on January 20, 2014, 03:33:42 PM
Hello Badger,
                       Welcome to model boating , plans are at hobby store ,  as 27meg radio for get it ,
                  go for2.4ghz gear planet is a good starter,.... or look at Howes Hobbies for more choices ,... 27meg is a aircraft allocated channel


                           best of luck in starting cheers Larry....
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on January 20, 2014, 03:39:09 PM
hi ya Larry
 
27 mghz - although an old frequency - and is prone to a lot of interference from CB radios etc - is for land and air use - it is, apart from 2.4 mghz frequency, the only frequency allocated to be used with aircraft/boats/cars/tanks.
 
aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Dessie B on January 21, 2014, 04:22:44 PM
Hi guys, after reading this, I was inspired to 'ave a go at my own Swordsman. Have the hull almost complete now, but skinned with 1/16 ply ( because I had some). I found the blog very usefull, thanks. ok2  I hope my model comes out as good as some of the photo's on here, WOW.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Gazza on April 05, 2014, 09:53:08 PM
Well. . .   I started on mine the other week its the 33" Phillip Connolly plan and scaled up to 50"  :-))
then with a 26cc 2 stroke . .  oh yes

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/t1.0-9/1510625_797930513569691_1984895101_n.jpg)
And yes that's a 3 seatter settee in the back ground LOL
 
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/t1.0-9/p526x296/1451442_802006903162052_783354984_n.jpg)
 

 
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: wally on July 16, 2014, 09:01:59 PM
Evening all.

Well after much deliberation i've decided to build a Fairey Swordsman from the Dave Milbourn plans that I was kindly sent by a forum member.

I have decided to scale them up to 125% as I felt the original was a little small.

I've cut out all the parts and have a couple of queries if you'd be so kind.

1. Are the smaller holes in ribs 11 & 12 for wiring only?

2. Should part 14 sit horizontally parallel to the keel as the cut part #3 has an angle on it?

I'll try posting some build pictures as I go along and i'm sure i'll be back with more questions.

Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on July 17, 2014, 08:06:12 AM
Morning Wally
 
To answer your questions - yes sort of and yes and yes  :-))
 
The frame with 3 holes in - the centre large hole is for the prop shaft and coupling to pass through.
 
Good luck with the build - I think you will be having to put a lot of extra stiffing in along with supports into the build - if you are building it all from 3mm lite ply.   No doubt you will have to build up the thickness of the frames of various other parts - cos of the size that you are building your model at.
 
If you go back through this questions and answers thread there is a photograph of the Swordsman alongside an RAF model to compare the sizes and I think you will be surprised at the size of this 'little' model.
 
aye
john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Gazza on November 02, 2014, 11:50:54 AM
Ok so I had better catch up on this thread  so carrying on here goes

The rear was in need of adding some timber to fit the transom bulkhead too

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xaf1/v/t1.0-9/10590414_888954347800640_9126355995452642471_n.jpg?oh=232f7cd74cf4c63d88c4b2fc4f98dad2&oe=54DD2353&__gda__=1424944098_9ff19a20874e6c06fb632f4c47983df7)
 
Gimme some skin Bro . .  LOL  Adding some skin and filler as I go. . .
 
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10153195_806353242727418_4861394253510176298_n.jpg?oh=d4d2ce71e13f12f49f79383f74fa3b5a&oe=54F0B005&__gda__=1420548569_5e18ad99d11cfcd3be194bdd915f22a4)
 
 Now that looks better. .  bit of filler rub down and . . . .

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/r270/10600625_888952377800837_3380125471431550475_n.jpg?oh=8b7f3df54c0fe5c398ab7911b0530e02&oe=54AD0CE3&__gda__=1423540663_1dcdb3c291a8c23adc9863d3af354de1)
Yep thats about  it

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10622753_888952451134163_5772235359564553479_n.jpg?oh=4b6e6679987131f935490b923cc52398&oe=54F1369A&__gda__=1423947298_dfe06a08d2369f73a8493d079d29cc1a)
 
So this new FOAM stuff in a tin . . .
 
(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xaf1/v/t1.0-9/1509112_814959391866803_1321820740654854649_n.jpg?oh=5e23edeabbf99e827c5a36d21aa6250b&oe=54ED6BA8)

and to add the last bit

(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/10170821_814705035225572_9091979916513143661_n.jpg?oh=65dedadb3697a8bc3e2ac4b228f5f4cc&oe=54ECECD9)

Adding more wood . .. 

(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/10259725_817008061661936_2655579079767062836_n.jpg?oh=b1df4b7e36fc08cc737a5ed66f4f525f&oe=54AE677B)
 
Making sure the Cabin sits just right and then a varnish on top deck

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/r270/1975058_888991897796885_1144692926680749253_n.jpg?oh=25a26bd65040598d4171889394721e4a&oe=54F257FD&__gda__=1423353425_db25ce9df7d88ba4ecc307d58e906a56)

Yep it fits so out with the spray cans . . .
 
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10540905_888952367800838_8954642540913371643_n.jpg?oh=183d556b5396b544a03ddfe4f46b6391&oe=54AB25CE&__gda__=1423730294_ebb030174ccecc9c63b2482821561b5d)
 
Clamp in the plastic for the windows

(https://scontent-b-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/r270/10014568_888951961134212_4872923621916896170_n.jpg?oh=d651231bb5f6f18dae6076487ca77b39&oe=54EFA17F)
 
A trip to Maplins for a water proof box ( wanted a big one with clear lid )
Throttle on the right with a Micro switch  FAIL SAFE KILL SWITCH   :-))

(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/r180/10635979_888964141132994_2237004037285520432_n.jpg?oh=391e842cd8fd9970f139420ff970f724&oe=54E2E067)
Bit of blue on the rear
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/r270/1521709_888951974467544_3930247088166719811_n.jpg?oh=3ecac8764019a9dd7227804081cf74a9&oe=54E42E8B&__gda__=1424014916_5397208f444de8362bcbcd225d11eb89)

OK Kids Bath time . . .
.
 
(https://scontent-b-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10622869_888952347800840_8003580115823260524_n.jpg?oh=7fdeb8628aa25896c1237438e3809592&oe=54E41905)

The Gel battery on ther rear was the amount needed to balance her out as the Tuned pipe gave that little bit of extra weight on the Port side
OK sea trials. . . . Or local lake will do

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10570527_888951914467550_7178353060613589622_n.jpg?oh=e1ab3dc0b556e8cc992938c8136381a5&oe=54ED1CA6&__gda__=1424454686_26705b9f1352007e08279fd375f16635)
 
(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10294260_10203906820940352_6788590722454702251_n.jpg?oh=7028b246f3073dd2401ddf51e1510ec5&oe=54AB63FC)
And then of course the video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgMZPxAtzck&list=UUquqBKNMFvWTZfAiGu2kwbQ&index=1 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pgMZPxAtzck&list=UUquqBKNMFvWTZfAiGu2kwbQ&index=1)
Well thats it folks I built this as I was getting fed up with the price of Model glow fuel around the £30 a gallon mark . . .  hello fuel makers its a hobby . . . and a gallon of petrol and oil mix works out to around £7 a gallon
( two stroke oil is around £11 a Litre and you mix 300mm to a gallon sort of )
So thats my Swordsman build. . .
I have added a pulpit rail and figures just to get the finishing touches done .. .
She runs for about 15 minutes on a tank full and the joy of a big boat on a lake in summer is so refreshing
so £120 of ebay for the QJ (zenoah look alike engine ) cant fault it in total its cost me around £400 with motor wood. . . wood glue . .  paint fittings etc
Would I build another . . . well yes im looking at a MTB around the same size
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: inertia on November 02, 2014, 03:54:19 PM
Good stuff, Gazza! Reminds me a lot of the original Huntsman 31 (46") prototype on Danson Park lake circa 1972. Fuel for our HP 61 was around three quid for a gallon. You can't beat a Fairey deep-vee for corners; turns like it was on rails.
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Gazza on November 03, 2014, 01:04:06 PM
Thanks Dave . .   :-))
Yes its a shame how the price on model stuff keeps going up. . . the model fuel is a killer to the hobby I think. .  any way it will be at the Warick show hopefully Leicester King Lear Lake
 
Gazza
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Gazza on November 10, 2014, 09:38:05 AM
Warwick Show  :-))
 
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10384730_931339740228767_5246110359042396332_n.jpg?oh=446e1afb734b0b7d2b40645672f651ed&oe=54E7DA45&__gda__=1424091801_5bb70070d1f4c23a2873dac88c4a59ae)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: danielcardona on November 17, 2014, 08:25:19 PM
Hello all

regarding the sheeting for the sides of the swordsman, the plan calls for 2mm liteply which is hard to find and very expensive here. i have a good amount of 3mm poplar, which is similar to liteply and i know it will do good for the main frames, but regarding the sides i was thinking to use 3mm balsa or maybe 2.5mm balsa.

do you think it will do just fine, i was considering using fiber cloth for sheeting instead of tissue and dope.

any thoughts?

regards
Daniel
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: inertia on November 17, 2014, 11:11:10 PM
I'd use the 2.5mm balsa, especially if you're going to fibreglass it afterwards.
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Gazza on November 25, 2014, 01:45:42 AM
Well. . .   I started on mine the other week its the 33" Phillip Connolly plan and scaled up to 50"  :-))
then with a 26cc 2 stroke . .  oh yes


And yes that's a 3 seatter settee in the back ground LOL
 
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10388559_940325199330221_6134637693724439548_n.jpg?oh=9a7355d3749f6aa27c031f4e123e962e&oe=5509267F&__gda__=1423827477_e5afc5dd56f8280100276f78bacc711b)

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: babblefish on January 16, 2015, 11:23:12 AM
I'm about to order a set of plans for this boat, but I have a silly question; if I order a back issue of Model Boats magazine from myhobbystore, will I get the actual magazine with any included free plans or will I get just a digital copy of the magazine sans plans?
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: inertia on January 16, 2015, 12:17:26 PM
I have sent you a private message about this.
DM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: babblefish on January 27, 2015, 11:23:00 AM
I have a silly question. I was reading through the build thread for the Swordsman, but don't quite understand how the parts outlines are being transferred to the liteply. I understand the part about laying the tracing paper over the plans and tracing the patterns onto the tracing paper, but how are the lines being transferred to the liteply without the use of carbon paper? Heh, just the fact that I even know what carbon paper is shows my age, doesn't it? :)
-Wes
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: inertia on January 27, 2015, 11:40:40 AM
If you use a softish pencil to trace the shapes (e.g.no harder than HB) then you can turn the tracing paper over, so that the traced side now faces the ply, and go over the back of the lines with a pencil. This will rub the original tracing lines on to the ply.
I use the map-pin method; I place the plan over the ply and push a map pin thorough it into the ply at every point where one line joins another. I then remove the plan and join up the holes with a sharp pencil. For a curve I just push the pin through every inch or so and join up the dots using a French Curve or a flexible strip of wood.
Some advocate taking a copy of the plan, cutting out the shapes and gluing them onto the wood. This introduces the possibility of shrinkage of the paper and the parts not being the right shape once cut out.
As someone once said, suit yourself!
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: babblefish on January 28, 2015, 12:52:42 AM
Oh, Ok, thank you. For a moment there I thought some kind of magic tracing paper was being used. I'll try that and if all else fails, I'll go see if carbon paper is still available.
-Wes
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Gazza on March 29, 2015, 02:38:06 PM
Hey Admin .... can you please update the Forum so we can EDIT our OWN POSTS
I have noticed that as I have moved Photos from the web and placed on another site they no longer show up so would be nice to reload pictures back into the posts
 
Regards Gazza
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Glyn Roberts on May 03, 2015, 04:49:23 PM
Hi  FLJ,

I liked the look of the Swordsman so I built it for a young lad.  I am using the MFA RE-540/1 3-pole dc motor but do not know what ESC to put with it and what Battery pack to use.  Want to keep the price down to reasonable level.  I would like to thank you for the plans and work that you have put into the Swordsman.

Regards Glyn

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Stavros on May 03, 2015, 05:11:56 PM
FLJ is no longer a used name on here but Inertia is the same person.....message him and he will help you
 
 
Dave
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Glyn Roberts on May 03, 2015, 05:32:49 PM
Hi  Inertia,

I liked the look of the Swordsman so I built it for a young lad.  I am using the MFA RE-540/1 3-pole dc motor but do not know what ESC to put with it and what Battery pack to use.  Want to keep the price down to reasonable level.  I would like to thank you for the plans and work that you have put into the Swordsman.

Regards Glyn       Sorry got your handle wrong.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on May 03, 2015, 06:13:56 PM
Hi there Glyn

The Swordsman I built has one of these controllers from fleabay

www.ebay.co.uk/itm/231312228705?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Don't tell Dave cos next time he seems me he will clip me round the lughole for not chosing ACTion - but - I wanted to try one of these Chinese things and this one works okay.

aye

john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Glyn Roberts on May 03, 2015, 08:48:06 PM
Hi John,

Thanks for that tip reasonble price to,  What battery pack would match with this hardware?  not lipo as a young lad will be using,  what size Nihm would be right?

Regards Glyn     (put your earmuffs on) %%   Just realized that it was your Build Class that I followed.  Top Rate stuff.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on May 04, 2015, 06:12:15 PM
Hi ya Glyn

Normally I use 1 x 7.2 - 4300 mAh Ni-MH battery pack - which lasts a good say (to be truthful) if I keep me finger off the accelerator - 3/4 of an hour :-)
that is constant running.

I normally take 2 or 3 battery packs down to the lake with me.

As you know us modellers spend more time talking that we do sailing - so the boat spends more time just drifting about the lake when she is in the water.

:-)

Aye
John
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Glyn Roberts on May 06, 2015, 09:20:19 PM
Hi John,

Thanks for info, I ordered a 7.2V 4300  ( or thought I did)  :embarrassed: and got a 3000.   Will the 7.2V 3000 be OK or should I reorder. 

I decided to veneer the boat deck as you did but cheapest piece of veneer was £20  so I planked with Bass for £5.

Regards Glyn
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Tug-Kenny on May 07, 2015, 09:28:24 AM

You will have lost 1.3 amps so the run time would be less.  As a matter of interest, you could see if you can get a 5000  amp hour battery for even longer run time. The size of the battery should be the same, but the cost will rocket.    :}

ken
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Glyn Roberts on May 07, 2015, 02:04:34 PM
Hi Ken,

Thanks for that info, now I understand the meaning of the numbers I can make an informed decision.

Thanks with regards Glyn.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Tug-Kenny on May 08, 2015, 10:46:05 AM

My pleasure.   :-))

As a matter of interest, the Chinese are producing a 7000 MAmp battery these days. I have bought one for my Tamiya truck and will see if it really does improve running time.  Mind you, the Chinese amps do seem to be over stated, even on their speed controllers.     tehe

cheers

ken
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Glyn Roberts on May 08, 2015, 03:29:00 PM
Thanks Ken,

I will keep that in mind for my next project, that will be the Dumas Dauntless twin motors will need lots of power.

Regards Glyn
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: SwordsmanDreamer on August 05, 2015, 04:26:09 PM
Hi there


Unfortunatly I have lost that part of the plan that covers the transom. i.e. part 15. Can anyone give me the dimension accross the chines on the transom please ?


Thanks


Nick
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: inertia on August 05, 2015, 07:28:08 PM
Hi there
Unfortunately I have lost that part of the plan that covers the transom. i.e. part 15. Can anyone give me the dimension across the chines on the transom please ?
Thanks
Nick
PM me your regular E-Mail address and I'll send you a copy of the plan.
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: SwordsmanDreamer on November 04, 2015, 01:03:20 PM
Dear all


I was talking to the chap at the local model shop the other day, and as i am approaching the point of putting the prop shaft in etc., was trying to price the hardware up.


One of the things that he said to me was that nowadays people dont have separate battery packs for the motor and the receiver / servos - one battery pack will do . Is that good advice ? Presumably this might mean some modification to the internal layout, and may have some impact on the weight distribution (dont know how important that woudl be - i'm used to gliders).


Also, how important are the spray rails ? I'm tempted to leave them off.


How best to align the prop shaft (laterally (side to side)), appart from eye-checking and maybe measurement. How perfect has this to be ? Presumably  a little bit out can be accomodated by the rates on the transmitter ?


Thanks


Nick
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: inertia on November 04, 2015, 02:07:17 PM
Nick
Many speed controllers have Battery Eliminator Circuitry, which will supply a reduced voltage from the main motor battery to the receiver. Don't change the structure. You may need to add a small amount of lead at the back to compensate for the absence of a Rx pack, but it's best to try the model under power on the water first. Don't be tempted to ballast it down to the waterline like a displacement hull - it'll be too heavy.

DON'T leave the spray rails off. If you do then not only will the model not plane properly but the bow-wave will spill up and over the sides and deck and swamp it. I had that experience with an earlier design, so I decided that Alan Burnard had put them on the real thing for a very good reason and I wasn't about to go against his vast experience as a powerboat designer. Anyway they aren't that difficult to make and fit.

In my experience eyeballing the prop shaft for lateral alignment front-to-back is sufficient. Before you glue the tube in place, fit the motor to its ply mount; fit the coupling to the motor and screw it to the prop shaft, then glue the ply motor mount squarely in place. That will hold the motor and prop shaft in alignment while you epoxy the tube at each end of its slot; it's easier to see any misalignment when looking inside at the motor and coupling than it is at the back end of the tube. There really isn't sufficient scope here for making a horlicks of it bad enough to affect the steering of the model.

Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on November 04, 2015, 05:00:21 PM
Hi Nick

following on and also asking a question at the same time - Are you building the Swordsman from this plan build?

The reason I ask this is - if you have the plans - the prop shaft length that you require should be illustrated in the plans and also the same with the coupling.

Setting up of the prop shaft should be straightforward, if you are following this build in the Masterclass. 

You make up a little template from scrap plywood which gives you the angle and the position of the prop tube on the hull and it is temporarily glued into place whilst you epoxy the tube into place permanently.
 
http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,7668.msg74050.html#msg74050

The model, which was built for this topic, has had  2 types of speed controllers. :-

-  The first one was an Electronize with a BEC which is a bit heavier than a small pack of batteries.   

-  The second speed controller is my mate Dave's pet hate - its the blue aluminium type from Yongggg Konnng which tend to go poof with some blue smoke :-)   As to date I have had no problem with it.    This also has a BEC - needless to say it is lighter than the Electronize one.    Neither of these speed controllers' weights made any difference to the performance  - it is still a nippy little model.

No need to go over what Dave says about the spray rails on this model - as they are needed to enhance the performance.  Unless of course you wish to make the model into a submarine :-)

Aye

John
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: boxer on June 29, 2016, 09:16:50 AM
Hi


Fitting the bow piece did you do anything to be able to shape that piece ie soak or heat
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: inertia on June 29, 2016, 09:31:58 AM
Boxer
Make sure you cut out the part with the grain as shown on the drawing. I hold parts like this in the steam from a kettle until they will bend easily, then I hold them at about the right degree of curve until they've cooled down. Sufficient curve will be retained to make gluing them quite easy, especially if you use a slow-setting cyano like SloZap. Steaming also works well for the chine rails and other curved stripwood parts.
Dave Milbourn
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on June 29, 2016, 10:56:27 AM
Will this help  :-)) :-))
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: boxer on July 06, 2016, 10:45:28 AM
Another question just about to start stage 1 and I am doing something wrong stage 1 part 4 seems longer than what it should be will post up pic later
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: boxer on July 06, 2016, 12:25:21 PM
Where it goes on plan part 4 looks about 40mm too






(http://i974.photobucket.com/albums/ae228/INEEDMOREPICS/image_zpsvzmfrv0y.jpeg) (http://s974.URL)
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: inertia on July 06, 2016, 12:58:03 PM
The front and rear parts of the keel are NOT glued together. There is a gap for the prop tube. If you align the ends of part 4 with the slots in the keel parts then this should give you that gap. Make sure that the keel is dead straight along its bottom edge when you join the two ends to parts 4. Here is a picture of a similar model which shows what I mean.
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: inertia on July 06, 2016, 01:49:36 PM
Boxer
I take it that you are aware of Bluebird's excellent build log of the Swordsman? Have a look at Reply #2 here  http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,7668.0.html (http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,7668.0.html), which shows how John did that part of the job. It's always worth having a look here first as it could save you time and trouble if you aren't sure about a procedure.
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: danielcardona on September 07, 2016, 06:56:10 PM
Hello Guys

I ask before if I could use Balsa for skinning the Hull of the Swordsman. 2.5mm cover with fiberglass cloth would be enough I think but i was thinking, If I would Use 3mm liteply will it add too much weight for this model?
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on September 08, 2016, 04:26:26 PM
Hi there
the original model was built with, I believe, two or three mm thick lite ply skin.  To be honest its that long now since I built the model I cant remember now.  Technology has moved on leaps and bounds.  There is now new Epoxy Resins which are water-based, along with light weight materials would be ideal to skin the hull over the top of lite ply or balsa.

I have built similar models recently to the Swordsman and used the water based resins which are quite good (by the way the resin is Deluxe Exe-Kote which I used).   I also used the light weight woven roven matting which is the one some of the Aircraft lads and lasses use to skin the wings - its the lightest of the light of materials and it went on really well.   More like a lightweight silk.

John
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Ed Boyce on March 02, 2017, 03:59:50 AM
To build or do over


Part I


Newbie builder and poster.  Am from Arkansas near White River.  Have started lots of model boats before but never got over the hump.  Have a lot of half built hulls in shop.


Part II


Found Bluebird's build log and ordered Dave Milbourn's plan to build Fairey Swordsman. Plan makes sense. Bluebird's build log makes it look easy even for me.


Part III


Materials here are not generally available at Wal-Mart.  I reached out to HobbyLobby across the river. They have "craft ply" in 1/8 inch (3ply basswood) to take place of 3mm lite ply and 1/16 solid basswood sheets to suffice for 2mm.  Using available materials I built up keel, made chip board templates, sanded ever so carefully, only to find out.....


Part IV


My carefully crafted keel will lay flat on one side but on the other there is a bow of anywhere from 5mm to 12mm; hold the stern to the table the bow tip is 12mm off of the table.


Part V


1. Do I go go ahead and build it up for experience?
2. Is my wood sorry?
3. Is there a wrong way to clamp glue laminates?
4. Would 5 ply birch lay flatter?
5. Other suggestions.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: SwordsmanDreamer on February 28, 2018, 03:03:41 PM
Hello , it seems a shame that no one has replied to you, so here goes, for what its worth.


I'm a bit puzzled how your keel can lay flat on one face, but not on the other ? (I assume you mean that it lies flat if you put a 3mm chock under each end , given that it is joined in the middle by a lapping piece of (if memory serves) 3mm (but then this is assuming that you have joined the fore and after pieces of the keel, which may be invalid assumption)).


However, even if it does have a bow/warp, you could do things like pressing it flat and gluing some doubling pieces along its length, and leaving it to dry under weight / pressure. Make sure that the surface it is lying on is definitely flat. By the way i don't mean to patronise you here, so apologies if you have already done this. But probably even if you left the warp in, it would straighten up OK when you glue the bulkheads and stringers in place, as long as you have it pinned down over the plan to make sure that the bulkheads are aligned while it is drying. Probably even then if the keel was a bit squiffy, when the hull skin is put on , you can sand the liteply so as to get the keel line as exposed to the water,  straight. I must get on with mine, i have a hull and decks but no superstructure. 


Cheers.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: surfer71 on April 25, 2018, 12:13:07 PM
I love that thread.... really got me thinking again about that Iconic boat to build.. now.... to get some plans????  :P
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Onetenor on June 08, 2018, 03:48:26 AM
Soak your keel in Ammonia then lay on a truly flat surface with another thick board  (Timber ) and load it with as much weight as you can. Old Irons (smoothing ) are good but tinned goods books rocks anything heavy. Leave a week to really dry out. Lt should now be flat. If not make a new one. In one piece if you can Suitable resin bonded ply should be found in a builders supplies yard. Often Offcuts are available. Good luck :}














































i
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: ChrisF on December 26, 2018, 07:27:45 PM
Some other builds that never got finished I guess!
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: chas on December 26, 2018, 11:08:43 PM
If you go back to the masterclass section, you will find the complete build. You've posted in the q&a section, the clue is in the section titles. Do you need some help with the build?

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: SwordsmanDreamer on April 12, 2019, 08:20:46 PM
Dear all[/size]Would anyone like to recommend a prop shaft / rudder / prop / motor etc for the Dave Milborun 24 inch Swordsman ?I know that the shaft has to be 8mm O/D, approx 200mm in length. I haven't bought anything like this before. The local model shop appears to have closed. I have been looking on the internet, there are many options, but as to how one chooses between them...ON the plan it advises a 750 motor. Is this still the best option (things may have moved on since then, as per having a separate battery for the receiver and speed controller etc).What shape of prop do i want (perhaps it doesnt matter much ) ? And the material ?Thanks
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DaveM on April 12, 2019, 11:02:41 PM
That's "540" and not "750". For a brushed motor I would suggest an MFA 540/1 motor with a 7.2v NiMH pack (or 2S LiPo). If your speed controller has battery eliminator circuitry (BEC) then you won't need a seperate receiver battery. I used a PropShop (now Protean Design) 3-blade 1.3" dia x 1.5" pitch General Scale pattern cast metal prop and an SHG M4 tube and shaft. Google for more details on those items.

There will be a new kit out very soon for a 1/16 scale Swordsman, manufactured by SLEC. It's similar in size to the old plan but much closer in appearance to the real thing and has a fully removeable cabin for better access to the motor, battery and radio. I hope to have my own model at the Wicksteed Park meeting next month.

And the name's 'Milbourn' please.....

DaveM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 13, 2019, 12:28:20 PM

Hi there, when I first wrote this article I was sure I had put all information required in the write-up about all the hardware I used such as sizes & etc.   I do know its an 8 inch propshaft with a M4 thread one end and plain the other end.   The model I build I have tried various sized motors and speed controllers and I found that a 500 motor was quite adequate to give this model quite a bit of speed, driving a 2 blade 35 mm plastic prop - the other thing is I had a 7.2 4300 mAh battery in the model and also using a Mtroniks speed controller.  I have just recently purchased some other items from a guy on Ebay who I have dealt with many times (I don't have any personal connection with him, but, he has always given exceptional service and any problems / faults would be rectified straight away).  Here's a link for the prop tube from the same guy - he may be a bit more expensive, but well worth it.



https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/8-MODEL-BOAT-PROP-SHAFT-4mm-INNER-SHAFT/191471534488?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=490557176997&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: coch y bonddu on April 13, 2019, 03:50:49 PM
I can vouch for the Shafts that Steve Tranter of Model Boat bits sells they are Highly reccomended




Dave
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: SwordsmanDreamer on April 13, 2019, 08:35:36 PM
Dear all, thanks for the advice. I don't have any of the hardware yet, so the prop shaft and the rudder will be the first purchases.


Apparently I can't use the 35mhz radio from my glider days, so will have to get a radio as well.



Sorry to get your name wrong Dave, not intentional, just a typing mistake.


Cheers.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DaveM on April 13, 2019, 11:14:32 PM
Sorry to get your name wrong Dave, not intentional, just a typing mistake.
Cheers.
That's OK - I've seen a lot more exotic versions of it than that! My advice would be to go brushless if you're starting from scratch.

DaveM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 14, 2019, 03:40:28 PM

Hi there, just noticed it has been suggested that if you are a novice to go brushless - well - basically it may be easier to learn with 'brushed' motors to wire up along with other things to keep it simple.   You wont have to worry about setting your transmitter up and programming the brushless motor for lipo cells and soforth - to keep it simple - buy a NiCad pack, a basic speed controller such as Mtroniks which are plug and play- the majority of them you don't have to worry about adding a further power pack for your receiver as the majority of Mtroniks have what is called a BEC batter eliminating circuit - which does away with the 2nd battery as I have already stated.   This keeps things extremely simple.


Obviously, gaining a lot more experience in this hobby, then decide whether brushless motors are the way to go for yourself.  :-))


Obviously, you do as you wish to do - as long as you are able to overcome some of the problems.


john
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DaveM on April 14, 2019, 05:24:03 PM
John
Purely as a matter of interest, do you have any brushless motors?   8)
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 14, 2019, 05:38:21 PM

Hi Dave - aye - I have :-)


I have a good collection of brushless motors and speed controllers and also a good understanding of their advantages and pitfalls.  With this in mind I am planning a few projects for future builds using them; but its like everything else in this world; best to begin with the basics and guide a person from there.
john



Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DaveM on April 14, 2019, 07:52:04 PM
John
I'm not sure I agree with you there.
The only thing you can learn about 'the basics' by using brushed motors is about the basics of using brushed motors. When I designed Swordsman twenty years ago brushless motors were just not available - certainly not like they are these days. I held out against them until about five years ago when Paul Freshney convinced me to try one. There's no way I would recommend a brushed motor for this model these days; they bear no comparison with those little computer-made Turnigy jewels. Brushless ESCs are all equipped with BEC and require no additional wiring (OK - so there are three motor wires to plug into the ESC instead of two). If you're wary of using LiPo batteries then they will work quite happily from NiMH packs. All of the marine ones I've bought came with a factory-set default which was entirely suited to the models I operate, and the increase in efficiency and low size/weight make using one a no-brainer for a small scale powerboat like this.
Given the choice of equipment that you already have, which would you fit into a 1/16 scale Swordsman?
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: ChrisF on April 15, 2019, 10:38:26 AM
I'm a relative newcomer (about 2 years) to model boats, well any models, and count myself lucky that I've started when advances have taken place with regards to Tx, motors and batteries.

With that in mind I embraced brushless and never really considered brushed at all. Yes, programming an ESC, if required, can be a little daunting, but other than that there is plenty of information available to guide a newcomer through what is required and how to connect it all up. It takes a little effort but that is all part of the interest for me.

Chris
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: SwordsmanDreamer on April 19, 2019, 10:09:50 PM
Dear all. Thanks for the advice so far.


Some more questions: Brushless motors vs the other sort (brushed ?). It seems that the brushless are say £33, and the others £7 or so. So, would a brushless motor be approx 4 times "better" / more powerful / somehow superior ? (But perhaps one doesnt buy like-for-like (i.e. a 540 brushless is perhpas not a replacement for a 540 non-brushless)).


I'd like the boat (24 inch Swordsman) to go as fast as reasonably possible, but don't want to spend a fortune.


Prop shafts - does one have to pump grease into them ? Or do they come pre-greased ?


Motor-to-shaft connection - i had assumed that the shaft would be threaded on both ends, but apparenlty some are plain on one end (the inboard I think). Does this mean that the coupling piece uses some kind of clamp mechanism to attach the coupling to the shaft (and presumably to the motor shaft ) ? It's a bit hard to tell from the photos i have looked at, but it looks like they might use grub screws - is that correct ? A bit like the jaws of a lathe i suppose.


Thanks


Nick

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DaveM on April 19, 2019, 11:02:39 PM
£33? This one will do the job very nicely on a 2S pack https://www.componentshop.co.uk/lc2826-17t-1050kv-leopard-outrunner-brushless-motor.html (https://www.componentshop.co.uk/lc2826-17t-1050kv-leopard-outrunner-brushless-motor.html)
Brushless motors are considerably more efficient than brushed motors i.e. less current and more power.

There's more discussion on your other points elsewhere.
DaveM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 20, 2019, 09:01:32 AM

hi ya there Nick


If you have a read again the build article which I did for this plan of the Swordsman I believe I explained the majority of things that you are asking about.  Also have a read of other builds in Masterclass and they will furnish you on bits of advice on couplings & etc. but my main advice would be - and it is strongly recommended - that if this is your first build of a model boat, you stick to what it says on the plan =- thus avoiding serious pitfalls.    It has been mentioned on other threads about deviating from plans and their instructions and how they can cause major problems for them who are new to the game.  :-)


John
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: JimG on April 20, 2019, 09:46:20 AM
Brushless versus Brushed motors?There are a number of pros and cons for each.Brushed tend to be cheaper and are simpler with only two wires and a simpler esc. They do often have a problem with sparking at the brushes which can cause radio interference although less common with 2.4GHz radio, supresser capacitors can be fitted to reduce this. Brushes do wear especially in higher powered motors, racing motors tend to have replaceable brushes because of this. Wear causes the commutator to become dirty increasing the resistance at the brushes causing extra heat and power loss. As they are being used less commercially now there tends to be less variety and different winds to suit different prop sizes.Brushless are inherently more efficient as without the resistance of brushes they lose less power to heat. They do need a special esc but these are now common and simple to use If you want a reversing motor you must make sure you get an esc with reverse, many are for aircraft which do not use reverse. There is a much greater range of brushless motors available with a wider range of windings to suit different props. Often the same size of motor comes in a range of KV settings ( KV is revs per volt) so you can choose one to suit your needs. A scale tug with a large prop will use a low KV motor (500 to 1000) while a fast electric with small diameter prop will need a high KV motor (2000 up).
There are two type of brushless , inrunners or outrunner. The major difference is that an outrunner has the outer casing revolving, tends to be slower revving and give more torque (can turn larger prop). If you are using high power inrunners are easier to cool as the casing does not revolve.If you are using more than one motor then you can use just one esc with brushed but brushless need an esc for each motor.
Jim
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DaveM on April 20, 2019, 10:08:50 AM
£33? This one will do the job very nicely on a 2S pack https://www.componentshop.co.uk/lc2826-17t-1050kv-leopard-outrunner-brushless-motor.html (https://www.componentshop.co.uk/lc2826-17t-1050kv-leopard-outrunner-brushless-motor.html)
Or this one on 3S (11.1v). https://hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-d2836-11-750kv-brushless-outrunner-motor.html (https://hobbyking.com/en_us/turnigy-d2836-11-750kv-brushless-outrunner-motor.html)
I have one of these in my 1/12 scale Huntress and it's a cracker. Incidentally either of these motors will fit into the same glass-nylon mount used for the brushed 540 so there's no need to alter any of the ply parts shapes. You can see one of the two grub screws which hold the coupling onto the motor shaft. The other end of the coupling is threaded M4 to match the prop shaft. As for the added complication of a brushless motor installation, the only difference you'll see is that there are three wires from the speed controller as opposed to two. Tricky stuff, eh?  8)
DM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 20, 2019, 10:25:08 AM
The Fairy  must be the only  type of model boat you have made  Dave  :}
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DaveM on April 20, 2019, 10:32:47 AM
John

You forget the Model Slipway stuff I did.....but I have to confess to an addiction to Fairey Marine powerboats. Liz says I build them at the wrong scale - she'd prefer 12" = 1ft - but I doubt she'd welcome a 31ft boat sitting in the driveway and it would be wasted on the Trent @ 4mph. My friend Scott Pett has had a Huntsman 31 in his garden since about 2009 and he's still not finished renovating it!
https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipPYwnZ9HOa2TVcPY1cC0PvUCrbhRBQ9n8wP7xrg63ItNuyUEddcHOdCZz4n1JzfEA/photo/AF1QipO4DocVhtarTF5LtFmzfNmcKh6eY9xZuiws9kk-?key=QU9id0p5eF9GMkM1VDhERTkweFVpQnZBLXBKb2RB (https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipPYwnZ9HOa2TVcPY1cC0PvUCrbhRBQ9n8wP7xrg63ItNuyUEddcHOdCZz4n1JzfEA/photo/AF1QipO4DocVhtarTF5LtFmzfNmcKh6eY9xZuiws9kk-?key=QU9id0p5eF9GMkM1VDhERTkweFVpQnZBLXBKb2RB)
Dave M
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DaveM on April 20, 2019, 01:57:03 PM
Incidentally either of these motors will fit into the same glass-nylon mount used for the brushed 540 so there's no need to alter any of the ply parts shapes.

Oops! Clanger alert! It's the larger 35mm diameter brushless motors that fit the 540 mount. These 28mm ones fit the 380/400 glass-nylon mounts, so you'd need to alter the top of the keel to cater for that. Sorry-pardon!

DM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 20, 2019, 03:26:24 PM

 %) I say old boy, if one sticks to the plan - one has to alter nothing - you didn't have anything to do with the design of that crashing rocket on the moon did you? :-)  that motor didn't work either did it? :-)



Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: DaveM on April 20, 2019, 04:32:53 PM
%) I say old boy, if one sticks to the plan - one has to alter nothing - you didn't have anything to do with the design of that crashing rocket on the moon did you? :-)  that motor didn't work either did it? :-)
Nope, but it wasn't made of plywood and it wasn't brushless either... :P
DM
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: John W E on April 20, 2019, 05:07:24 PM

hi there, here are two of the best brushless motors you will ever get - even Sir DM will have to agree to this one, especially when the pair of them will fit nicely in a 41 inch Fairy of the Skies and I wonder who has a plan for that sitting on his desk? :-)


John
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: SwordsmanDreamer on April 20, 2019, 09:04:20 PM
Dear all thank you for the interesting information.


Mind you, I'm am bit puzzled about how asking about couplings and prop shafts etc qualifies as deviating from the plans - unless that was referring to using a motor other than the 540 ?


Best regards


Nick

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: SwordsmanDreamer on May 11, 2019, 09:37:04 PM
Hello All

So it looks like I need a prop shaft that is threaded on one end, but plain (if that is the right word) on the other end ? (No mention of this in the build notes that i can see - but the pictures appear to show a thread on the inboard end - hard to make out whether the outboard end does or not. What is the "normal" practise (if there is one) ? Dave Milbourn seems to imply that his Huntress has a threaded inboard end ( " The other end of the coupling is threaded M4 to match the prop shaft.") , but the outboard end could be either I imagine. I see that some adverts for props that i have seen mention "dog" style props - presumably some kind of spline arrangement (as oposed to a thread) ? But some say "M4" - so presumably M4 metric -but that could mean threaded, or it could just mean the shaft size alone and therefore not necessarily threaded ? Then I guess there is the issue of the thread direction vis-a-vis the shaft turning direction for steaming ahead (i.e. the risk of the prop undoing itself ) ?

Thanks
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: derekwarner on May 12, 2019, 01:08:48 AM
Nick....


If the propeller has an M4 internal thread, by convention the terminology for the prop shaft for that end is M4........if the diameter of the shaft were also 4.0 mm, it is termed as 4 mm diameter. You may also need a thin width M4 locknut to lock the propeller


Again by convention the coupling 1/2 side of the shaft [near the motor] would be 4 mm diameter which is mated to a close toleranced [reamed] 4 diameter hole in the coupling half.....


The coupling 1/2 for the motor is naturally to suit the motor shaft


These reamed coupling holes minimize run-out and vibration


The mention of "dog style" usually refers to the coupling type, not the propeller


Left hand + right hand propellers usually refer the directional of rotation of the propellers for twin engined vessels.......but both of will have a right hand tapped internal mounting hole
 %)


Derek

Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: RST on May 12, 2019, 01:50:04 AM
Nick,

Suggest you have a google around for 4mm / M4 prop shafts -the propshaft is "normally" something like 4mm OD for an M4 thread (etc).  4mm prop tube OD's usually 6 or 8mm (your choice, 90% of the time I'd go for 6mm, and for a cpl of £ I buy the clamp-on oiler saddle now unless an oiler tube is included).  There are still some folk who wouldn't spend their last 'hapenny unles it were for something "proper" imperial, but it's so outdated I wouldn't bother unless you desperately want. 

I personally hate shafts threaded at both ends.  Back in the day I got on OK with them, but I find the last few years everyone seems to cut the threads so the unthreaded length is significantly shorter than the prop tube now (even when I've ordered custom shafts).  I usually find a spinning thread on a plain bearing generates unecessary vibration and noise, plus, if nuts on both ends inadvertantly tighten, it locks the shaft absolutely solid.  Threads on either end of shafts almost always the usual "lefty loosey, righty tighty".

You can google "Dog Drive" propellers to see if you wish -prevalent in the US, usually only ever seen them on racing boats, and dirt cheap Asian eBay toys here.  "Dog Style" I'd argue isn't directly related to either, but more often seen associated with the propeller end on models.  Not worth the hassle unless youre absorbing serious power usually.
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: ChrisF on May 12, 2019, 01:19:41 PM
Hi Nick

I've standardised on the maintenance free Raboesh prop shafts that I get from Cornwall Model Boats. I go for the 15000 rpm ones to be on the safe side. They are the more usual threaded prop end and plain motor end.

Yes, they are more expensive, but they are quality and you don't have to mess around with lubricating with oil/grease, and in the scheme of thing i.e. the total cost of the boat, personally I think it's money well spent.

Cornwall model Boats also do a good range of couplings including a dog-leg one (which may be what you are referring to?) from Robbe.

Chris
Title: Re: Q & A - Swordsman A PLAN FOR BEGINNERS by Bluebird
Post by: Martin [Admin] on July 12, 2019, 05:56:06 PM

Topic Split:
https://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,63335.0.html