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Author Topic: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation  (Read 57056 times)

Martin [Admin]

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #25 on: May 02, 2008, 04:32:03 PM »

Here a re-decking I saw at Wicksteed park lake a couple of years ago....

I liked the idea of the open topped radio box that formed a sort of internal cofferdam.



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catengineman

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #26 on: May 02, 2008, 05:01:09 PM »

Smart build makes my Tito look thrown together :(
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Capt Jack

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2008, 12:35:25 PM »

Smart build makes my Tito look thrown together :(

It was !!!! {-)
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catengineman

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2008, 03:01:16 PM »

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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2008, 02:06:36 PM »

I've been working away on the deck and sorting out a few areas there. One of the key construction considerations in going into this project was the fact it would be used in tug towing and handling competitions. To meet my needs in that area, I needed a deck that was water tight and STRONG.  In my tug class, I have to pull a 350lb. barge. The Billings design wouldn't cut the mustard. The deck would soon be lifted off as soon as the hawser went tight.
  To that end, the one piece deck that aid s the water problem and also makes it quite strong. To increase the strength, I've reinforced the underside of the deck at pints where berthing bollards and towing bollards are fixed. I'll be making the towing bollards from brass rod with 4-40 threaded rod from below each bollard post. On the underside of the deck the threaded rod well be fastened with a large washer and lock nut sealed with a touch of silicone sealant. In the photos you'll see the reinforcing pieces.
  To seal the deck I'm going to coat it with fiberglass resin, both sides (hope to get that done today). The top side will be sanded smooth after installation, and painted.
I've left two aft hatches to access the steering gear. On the drawing a hawser drying rack is shown. I'm taking advantage of that one to act as a dike to prevent water accessing the hull. The contents of the drying rack will be lifted out in one piece to access the gear. I've settled on a cover for the bollard side hole. That'll come in the fullness of time.
  I've also done a rough up of the tween deck to carry the radio gear and servo. It'll be removable and bow weaight can go beneath it,
  The remainder of the top side should be straight forward, however, I do have an idea for the winch that may be of interest to tug competition people. More on that later.

oldiron
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banjo

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #30 on: May 04, 2008, 03:30:38 PM »

 :)
Towing strong point..

The towing bit on my Tito goes through the deck and is secured in a hardwood block epoxied to the hull.  (see pic from remote cam inside hull)

might be an idea for you?

(its 1/4" mild steel  U shaped)
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catengineman

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #31 on: May 04, 2008, 03:37:30 PM »

:)
Towing strong point..

The towing bit on my Tito goes through the deck and is secured in a hardwood block epoxied to the hull.  (see pic from remote cam inside hull)

might be an idea for you?

(its 1/4" mild steel  U shaped)

I have the same idea but do you mean the Gog eye, my working winch is affixed to a deck and has steel braces for strength.
I lift my Tito in and out of the water via the Gog eye and another forward.
R
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banjo

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #32 on: May 04, 2008, 04:07:23 PM »

 O0
Gog eye....why aye....Oh my... {-)
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catengineman

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #33 on: May 04, 2008, 04:37:04 PM »

If this will help

Both lift points are bonded to the hull with resin so I know they strong enough  O0

R,
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banjo

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #34 on: May 04, 2008, 04:52:08 PM »

 :)

The weight of Tito I trust only to web straps around the outside....  I am sure that you have made it secure but being an old cynic, and if it can happen it will, then one of these days you will be lifting it by the deck, on the tilt, and thats when the tears will flow....mine too.
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banjo

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #35 on: May 04, 2008, 04:53:03 PM »

BTW we are stealing his thread!!!

sorry oldiron
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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #36 on: May 04, 2008, 05:33:27 PM »

BTW we are stealing his thread!!!

sorry oldiron

Not a problem......its all good stuff. I like your Tito idea. Thanks for the tip Never thought about using the Gog eyes to lift in and out of the water, beats wading in up to my personals in cold water.
 On my Master (see SSMaster new construction thread) I soldered the towing bolards to a brass plate then screwed that to an equally larrge brass plate under the deck. I did a smiliar arangement on the forward towing bollard. I can lift half the weight of the 25lb vessel with either bollard, but i don't think I'd push my luck lifting the whole thing. Never thought about doing it with the Smit.

oldiron
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banjo

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #37 on: May 04, 2008, 06:24:21 PM »

 :)
John
Are you going to fit any bulkheads or deck beams?
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #38 on: May 04, 2008, 06:33:24 PM »

Both lift points are bonded to the hull with resin so I know they strong enough  O0

Sorry for another butt in......   Never seen that before Catengineman, very clever!  O0
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catengineman

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #39 on: May 04, 2008, 06:48:45 PM »

Sorry for this butt in    Thank you Martin there is a VS tug out there with the same idea  (Venture) O0
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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #40 on: May 04, 2008, 06:56:29 PM »

:)
John
Are you going to fit any bulkheads or deck beams?

  I wasn't going to fit bulkheads, but I do have four deck beams. There are only three in the photos, I've added another one since. I've got the underside of the deck resin coated now too (since I posted the pics this AM). I was going to ask you about the bulheads as I noticed you put them in yours. You mentioned about the hull being floppy once you removed the old deck. Was your hull fiberglass or a plastic PVC type of material? Mine is blown fibreglass and was quite stiff without the bulheads, hence I just went with deck beams to support the deck and give some lateral support to the hull.  I don't know if Billings change their hull materials over the years. Dumas did that with their Brooklyn kit.....went from fiberglass to floppy plastic.
  On your build I noticed you used an adhesive called Z-Poxy. Its a product I haven't heard of. Is it made to use with plastices so there;'s no distortion?
  I did an oil tanker (1925 vintage) and used styrene on the decks scribed to simulate steel plate. I held it down with water base contact cement. It doesn't distort plastic and doesn't smell, but holds like crazy. Just wondered if your stuff was a similar item.

oldiron
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banjo

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #41 on: May 04, 2008, 07:11:51 PM »

 :)

http://zap.supergluecorp.com/zapepoxy.html

Its from USA.  That site will give you all the gen.

Mine was an old ABS hull.

I wanted to isolate the "back end"  What H2O that may come in via the rudders stays where it is.  Its a faultfinding aid!
It has stiffened up the whole boat famously without having to rely on the deck for strength.
BTW my local post office was closed Sat by the time I got there & its a Bank Holiday tomorrow but it will be in the POST soon.....
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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #42 on: May 04, 2008, 07:47:18 PM »

:)

http://zap.supergluecorp.com/zapepoxy.html

Its from USA.  That site will give you all the gen.

Mine was an old ABS hull.

I wanted to isolate the "back end"  What H2O that may come in via the rudders stays where it is.  Its a faultfinding aid!
It has stiffened up the whole boat famously without having to rely on the deck for strength.
BTW my local post office was closed Sat by the time I got there & its a Bank Holiday tomorrow but it will be in the POST soon.....

  Under the heading of you're never too old to learn something new..... I've heard of ZAP cyano glues, but didn't know they had a line of epoxy type adhesives too. Interesting, and thanks for the URL.  Its funny with the States, we don't always get evrything north of the border that they have.........sometimes thats just as well.
   Good idea on the fault finding aid. I can see where that would be of benefit

oldiron
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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #43 on: May 22, 2008, 12:37:55 PM »

 The progress on the Nederland has slowed a bit due to comitments on a much larger vessel. However, huge thanks to Banjo, he sent me a set of Kort nozzles I was missing. A couple of  beers coming your way Banjo....best bitter I hope.
  I've mounted the nozzles with no problem. I've made two bollards, one for towing and the other (a Gob eye?), from solid brass rod.. They have been reinforced under the deck with steel bar.. Hopefully this should be strong enough. The deck will be sealed down with epoxy or fiberglass resin so there shouldn't be any chance of it lifting.
  Hope to get back at it shortly to permanently install all the bits and fasten the deck down.

oldiron
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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #44 on: May 26, 2008, 12:38:13 PM »

  Been working on getting the Becker rudders installed in the hull  in a nice straight and true fashion. I've found it to be somewhat awkard due to to the thickness and shape of the blown fiberglass hull. An ABS hull is much thinner and, I suspect, much more even in crossection. Thus when the rudders are installed they will tend to stay more or less upright instead of splaying out like the tail fins on an F16 fighter, as happens with the glass hull. Time for a solution. Hence this tale:
  To begin with I picked a scrap bit of wood that had a reasonably square crosection. Then I measured the exact distance between the skegs on the Kort nozzles installed on the tug. I translated this distance to the block of wood and drilled two holes to accept lengths of brass tube. The inside diameter of the brass tube is such that it comfortably accepts the fastening arrangement of the rudders.
  The block of wood was placed under the hull with the tubes coming up through somewhat oversize holes in the hull. Ensuring the tubes are straight up and down in all directions the area around the tubes, inside the hull, is to be epoxyed.  When the epoxy has set up the tubes are cut off square above and below the hull. There is now a recptacle straight and true and in line with the skegs to accept the rudders.
  I expect this may be of assistance in other builds when trying to get multiple rudders lined correctly.

oldiron
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dougal99

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #45 on: May 26, 2008, 02:11:00 PM »

Old Iron

Simple, effective and definitely in the 'why didn't I think of that category'.  Thanks for sharing.

Doug
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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #46 on: December 27, 2008, 12:48:11 PM »

 I return once again. I left this build back in late summer due to other time commitments that come along with the changing seasons. One of the biggest being I don't like spending time in my downstairs workshop when its nice outside.
 Never the less I got back at the project this fall and we continue.
 The motor mounting base was permanently installed in the hull using silicone sealant to attach the board to the hull. I used this as it is impervious to water, fill in the profile inconsistency's in the fiberglass and provides some degree of sound isolation of the motor operation from the fiberglass hull.
  Once installed an leveled the motors were installed along with the prop hafts and couplings. The deck was now fastened to the hull using the epoxy. The deck sat nicely inside the hull and on top of the previously installed wood lip.
  After this is was off to the bath tub for a float test. With the battery installed, and no weight forward it road a little bow high, as expected. I have plenty of room, forward for lead shot ballasting. This will be done when the water line and full weight is finally established.
  At this point I was happy with the result.

John

 
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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #47 on: December 27, 2008, 12:58:59 PM »

Now was time to start on the deck house structure. I used birch plywood for this as it gives a fine grain on the outside that is easy to fill and provide a smooth metal like finish when painted. When I finished its construction I covered it with a very fine body filler that is ideal for model use and is easy to sand. Body people use it as a finishing filler/leveler when doing body work on cars. This was sanded till smooth then scratch primered. There was n trace of wood grain anywhere on the deck house when done.
  The handrails where then installed using traditional brass techniques.
  The pilot house I constructed from styrene with my best guess as to internals based on photos and the limited information on the drawings. If anyone has some good pics of the pilot house interior I would appreciate seeing them.

John
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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #48 on: December 27, 2008, 01:05:47 PM »

Pilot house pics...........
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oldiron

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Re: Smit nederland ..........again!!!, with a variation
« Reply #49 on: December 27, 2008, 01:07:26 PM »

Pilot house..............
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