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[RipSlider]

Gentlemen and ladies (And Martin13 ) of Model Boat Mayhem

I have a confession to make. It would seem that I totally lack the ability to cut frames for boats.

Having spent 3 hours this morning trying to create 2 simple frames, I have abandoned the attempt, in a foul mood, after 7 aborted operations.

Cats have been kicked, wives have been cursed at ( and then grovellingly apologised to - I'm not thick -  ) and the goat has recieved a torrent of abuse. However, this is just displacement behaviour.

What should be a simple cut - I'm just trying to cut some elipse shapes in 3mm ply - all I seem to produce is a ragged arsed mess. Not only do I struggle to get the wretched shapes transferred to the wood in a way that I can use ( who invented the "stick templates onto the wood" process?? - what a pain in the backside :( :(   ) I also have to content with the fact that, when it comes to chopping up pieces of wood, which, if we are honest, even the village simpleton can manage - I can't keep the saw on track, and end up with a wavey edged mess that bears only the vaugest of similarities to the original template! grr....

So, I'm looking for help.

Either

a) Some kind soul to write post a fool proof procedure for taking the shape of a former of a plan and delivering a bullet proof process for turning it into a lovely looking bit of wood

or

b) an even kinder soul who will, for a suitable monetary reward, chop me up some bits of wood fairly neatly if I send them the shapes.


Please let me state right here and now - as I know many people will view this admission as shameful ( how can a man call himself a modeller if he can't crank out a few formers on a scroll saw?? etc etc ) that I can honestly do other bits of modelling much better. I can lay on body filler so well it barely needs sanding. And I can produce lovely things with GRP and carbon firbe. And I'm a dab hand with the old air brush. It just so happens I either have a mental block, or my hands have a hand block, when it comes to knocking out wooden items.

Now that I have admitted my awfull secret to the world, if anyone could provide advice or a 1-off cutting service, I would be forever in your debt.

Thanks in advance

Steve

[FullLeatherJacket]

Steve

Cut outside the line with your scroll saw; lay the frame down flat on the shooting board with the edge that you need to shape hanging over the 3mm edge, then sand back to the line with the Permagrit block. You can make your own sanding block from a piece of 2" x 2" PSE timber and some 120 Grit Ali Ox paper, stuck on with double-sided tape. Link attached. When you've sanded back to the line, turn the frame round a bit and sand the next portion of the curve, working around the shape until you get back to the beginning.

http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=10367.msg96961#msg96961

Works for me.

FLJ

[dougal99]

I find using a hand held jigsaw is sometimes more controllable than using a scroll saw. Sanding back is always required. 

Never say die

Doug

[John W E]

hello there Steve

First of all, I think the best policy is to apologise to all the animals you have insulted and abused in your frustration and then, the most difficult job of all - apologise to the Mrs

Then....go for a short walk, forget about it....come back with a fresh mind and a fresh approach.

If you are not happy with copying and sticking on frames/templates, try the approach of using tracing paper - copy and tracing onto the building material.  Then, may I ask what type of saw you are trying to cut the frames out with?   Because, if you are cutting 3mm ply with a steady hand and a good sharp Stanley Knife, you should be able to cut through using that method.

As FLJ says, cut on the good side of your line - remember to leave at least 0.5mm then sand to it - using either FLJs method with a shooting board or a sanding block.   

If you persist in using a saw - then the golden rule is - let the saw do the work, do not force the saw into the material or the material into the saw.

The other thing is  - if you can cut the frames out  leaving a sizeable area around your frame markings, you will find it is easier to handle the material.   If you have a look at the build threads, Cervia Tug/Plan for beginners, there are some hints in there for tracing and cutting frames out.

Nil Disparandum my mate.

We have all been there - PATIENCE is the key & don't let it get your goat

aye
john e
bluebird

[RickF]

The other alternative is to go down to your local laser cutting depot, find out what type of drawing files they need and give the whole job to them! Here's a firm that might do it http://www.belairkits.com/index.asp

I haven't tried this solution myself, but I share your feelings with regards to frames. I can do them but I loath the job! The only advice I'd offer in addition to all the other good tips above is use "Spraymount" to glue the plan to the wood. It costs more, but doesn't make the paper soggy and distorted.

Rick

[das boot]

Another poor soul like myself, my condolences Steve...been there, done that, divorced the wife and ate the goat. I too am incapable of doing anything with wood, I hate the stuff. I can't even draw a straight line on a piece of wood, let alone cut one.

I haven't made a model boat in wood for donkey's years [wood is for making fires, not making model boats] In the past I used either fibreglass or ABS, and now I'm returning to the fold I shall continue to avoid the stuff like the plague and carry on using fibreglass or ABS.

Go plastic my friend...or find a friendly carpenter man who will do the job for you for a slight crossing of his palm with the good old folding pictures of Her Majesty.

Cheers,

Rich

[tobyker]

1. There's always carbon paper under the plan and on top of the wood, draw over the plan and there you are.
2. I use lots of cereal packets to make templates - get the shape of the card right, draw round the card with a fine pencil, cut and sand till the line disappears.
3. I had a fretsaw which came with coping saw type blades. I couldn't cut a thing with it however tight I tensioned the blade but when I fitted piercing saw blades all was well. Piercing saw also very useful for cutting thin ply.
4 Cut straight lines around the shape with a steel rule and stanley knife, and sand the rest off with a Permagrit block, and if all else fails,
5. Say a prayer to the carpenter's son first?

[dreadnought72]

I cut these 1/4 inch plywood frames by hand using a fretsaw...



(The blunt end of my Dreadnought)

I cut to around a millimetre or so of the outer line, and finished the curves off with a sanding block. The inner lines (which are slightly scrappy) were cut by saw to the line, then I used a light sanding to remove the worst of the burrs.

I'm no woodworker (got a C-4 in the subject 31 years ago at school, keeping up a family tradition!) but it's just a question of clamping the frame firmly while sawing, using sharp blades, and taking your time. I must admit I don't particularly like doing the job, but I find seeing a hull start to rise from mere plans is inspiration enough!

Andy

[walrus]

use a blade with about 15tpi the blades supplied with scroll saws are too fine let the saw do the work I cut 2inch often

[mickyrubble]

Hi steve,
 make sure you have a saw which has a sharp blade and never force it into the wood but let the weight of the saw cut at its own pace.Never try cutting exactly on the mark ,better to cut 1mm off and sand back,i use a dremmel drill with a drum sander.If you intend to do a lot of sawing it maybe worth buying a small band saw,which i think are worth their weight in gold.Some band saws have a sanding disc built into them (dewalt has one).
As for marking out,i use a method called cartooning which i have been told was the method artists used to transferr drawings onto walls when painting frescos.Place your plan on the wood and pin it down with drawing pins ( or tape) and useing something like a map pin mark though the plan into the wood (as some plans only show half frames ,you will have to flip the plan over and line up the centre line marks  though the holes into the wood to get the outher half frame).You must  line up the centre line marks correctly,then its just a matter of joining up the marks in the wood.On thighter curves place the marks closer together.
Over the last 20 odd years most of my models have  been static period sail  (some commision work)and have found that this method works best for me .Hope this is of some help.

[RipSlider]

Just wanted to say thank you to all of you chaps for the advice.

This weekend I'm going to have another attempt at some frames. New saw blades, shooting board, and a few of those posh sanding blocks are all on the list to be made/purchased on sataday.

Sunday will either see me launching another torrent of abuse at all around me, or I will be wreathed with grins and smiles.....


Steve

[GaryM]

Good luck Steve
Let us know how you get on.

regards
Gary :)