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[RipSlider]

Hello all.

This may be a very basic question for some, but I was abysmal at Technical Drawing in school, so for me this is a difficult job.

In my head, I have the shape of some sections of a hull. The shape is pretty complex, and I want to explain it to people with the aid of a diagram.

My actual drawing skills are, to be honest, terrible - stick men is about as far as I go, so technical drawing where I can use a ruler etc is hopefully the way to go.

I have done the side view, which I fond pretty easy, but this doesn't convey the "cunning" bits of the pictures and shapes in my head. What I am struggling with is the front and back views of the hull - I just can't make them look anything like the shapes I am trying to convey.

Seeing as we have a lot of enginners  and all round clever chaps on here, I was wondering if anyone could post a beginners guide/crash course on how to draw out hull shapes and also front and back views of hulls? - proper diagrams, rather than my current wonky, cartoony sort of drawings?

I'm guessing there is a method to it, but I can't see what it is.

Thanks in advance

Steve

[Martin13]

What type of boat/hull/shape are you trying to draw. Is this a conventional shape or something you invented in your head - Hope you are not experimenting again

Martin doon under

[boatmadman]

Had you thought of using some software to design/draw your hull?

Delft ship has a free basic version which is good for hull design, it takes a bit of learning, but gives good results.

http://www.delftship.net/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1

Ian

[RipSlider]

What type of boat/hull/shape are you trying to draw. Is this a conventional shape or something you invented in your head - Hope you are not experimenting again

Martin doon under

definately "something I invented in my own head" catorgary...

Steve

[DickyD]

What type of boat/hull/shape are you trying to draw. Is this a conventional shape or something you invented in your head - Hope you are not experimenting again

Martin doon under

definately "something I invented in my own head" catorgary...

Steve

In that case Steve you probably need more help than we can provide. You need someone to know what is going on in your head. Hmmmm, psychiatrist, thats it, a psychiatrist.   

[dougal99]

Hi Ripslider,

Not really sure what your after so will have a go at an answer with the attached diagram. The solid black lines represent the hull lines (one set shown for clarity). The pale blue, red, yellow and green lines are projections of the dimensions from one plane to another. The dark blue line is at 45 degrees and the dimension lines are projected to it and at 90 degrees to transfer the dimensions from one plane to another. If your hull is a complex shape the transfer process needs to be done for several points to give the required curve. A hard chine hull can be drawn by transferring the extreme points and joining them with a straight line.

This harder to describe than do I hope I've made it clearer and not muddier.

Doug

[RipSlider]

Thanks for the advice guys.

apart from Martin being mean and making me sob in front of my computer (   :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(  ) it's been very helpful.

Dougal. Tomorrow I'll toddle off to the shops and get myself a set sqaure and curves set. I've not seen that way of drawing before with the single angled line - makes it much easier to draw up plans while I sit in a hotel room without the need for a drawing desk, long slidey ruler thingy etc etc etc.

Ian,

Have downloaded the programme, and very clever it is as well. I think I have the basics of it, now I just have to wiggle all those lines about - which is going to take AGES. Do you use it? Is there a way to drag the points with a mouse? I'm using the arrows on the x/y/z axis box thingy at the moment, which is good, but slow. Have read the tutorial, but can't see a mention of it.

Thanks again chaps ( apart from Cruel and nasty Martin - Boo ! Hiss!      )

Steve

[boatmadman]

Steve,

Yes you can use the mouse to drag the points. You need to have the control net selected, then click on the point and drag with the mouse. You need to be aware that you cannot drag the points in the perspective window, only in the other three windows.

I am using this program to design my next boat, which will be my version of the Bourbon Orca.

If you think I might be able to help, ask away.

Ian

[RipSlider]

Thank you sir.

Problem I have now is working out how to select the "control net".

Is this a button/function, or one of the nets making up the hull shape?

Also, do you know how I can add more points? I would like to add more detail, but when I click the "Add...Point" button, the point appears on the knuckle line, rather than the where I actually want it to be.


To everyone else:

The programme itself is actually very good indeed. 15 minutes of fiddling about and I got the basics. Still not up to producing the next generation of super yachths, but I reckon that it's a programme you can good at very quickly.

Give it a try - it's free.

steve

[boatmadman]

Steve,

The control net button is directly below the Transform menu, hover the mouse, it will tell you.

To add a point, select the line you want it on, the colour will go from red to yellow, click edit, edge, split and the new point will be added midpoint on the selected line.

Ian

[RipSlider]

Thank you sir.

I forsee an evening of fiddlin with points and lines. Hundreds of the wretched things....

Actually it's kind of enjoyable really.

Am I right I have to love every single point? Is there a way to move a few rows of points and have the programme fit the rest of the points around it? For example, if I move row 1 and row 3, do I still have to move all of row three as well, or can it calculate itself?


Oh... Another question.

On one of the views ( top right - I think it's the side view ) there is an orange line like a bell curve. As you move points the line alters it's shape. Is this dscussing balance, or does it have another function?

Thanks

Steve

Thanks

Steve

[boatmadman]

I havent found a way to get the program to move points for me, I have had to do every one individually. Some of the features are disabled in the free version, one of which is fairing curves, which, I think would take a lot of the drudgery out of it.

I just updated my version, the line you are talking about is one of the properties defined in the tickbox in project, hydrostatics.
Ian

[Big Ada]

Hi Steve,
If its a one off design why not get a lump of blue foam a hacksaw blade and some files and sand paper and hand carve a prototype hull?.

Regards,
Len.

[RipSlider]

Hi Steve,
If its a one off design why not get a lump of blue foam a hacksaw blade and some files and sand paper and hand carve a prototype hull?.

Regards,
Len.

I had a crack at that ( but using the much more sexy looking orange foam ) but I'm trying to make a shape with lots of "in and out-y" bits and so, if I'm honest, all I ended up doing was making a mess.

This doesn't bode well when it comes to me actually making the wretched thing, but, as Martin13 reminded me yesterday, I've got another on boat on the boil at the moment of which bragging has been done, money has been spent and promises made to Mrs Steve that the boat ( unlike some other previous projects ) will absolutely, definately, honestly, be completed.

I reckon it'll take me until I finish that project before I've actually got a picture of my next project.

Sigh...

[Alastair_I]

Steve,  Have you come across Google Sketch-Up? I find it great for visualising ideas and checking proportions.. it's not very good at curves, although rough approximations are possible.. ok for semi-scale and fun flights of fancy..

[RipSlider]

I've been honing my sketch-up! skills for a while now - if's very good indeed for designing plumbing systems for fish tanks!

However, I want to do some quite complex curves and bends, so it's not really the best thing.

Thanks for the tip though.

Steve

[Alastair_I]

lol

I first came across sketch-up on the reef forums and used it to design a custom nano tank!  I've just started playing about with it for very simple boat concepts.. (I'm  avery simple modeller  )

[RipSlider]

Ha!

I started using it for *exactly* the same thing... firstly to design a sump, then a 'fuge, and then the whole plumbing setup!

Working out how to create elbows in pipes took me weeks....


Steve

[Alastair_I]

I just used it for the tank.. made the pipework up in situ as the location was too complex to plan!

Any rough sketches you could post of the hull design that's been giving so much grief?  :)

[boatmadman]

Yeah, give us a taster Steve

[RipSlider]

Right now, I have to say that my attempts at drawing are so pitiful that I don't want to put them up.

However, I have been provided with information about a cunning gadget by a chap at work that allows you to draw complex curves easily and repeatably. I'm off to get one tomorrow, will have a couple of hours shouting and cursing at a piece of paper, and see if there is anything postable in the evening....


Steve

[RipSlider]

I just used it for the tank.. made the pipework up in situ as the location was too complex to plan!

Any rough sketches you could post of the hull design that's been giving so much grief?  :)

Just the tank???

You should have done what I did. Made a guess at how big your thought Mrs Alistair_I would let you get away with and then ring up a tank maker and provide him with the dimensions - adding a few inches as you go! 

I use a durso system and a 5 chamber sump, so I needed SketchUp! to do the planning, I went through about 30 drafts before it was right - I reckon it saved me a fortune - every time I thought I had a cunning plan, I'd post it in the forums, get suggetions, and then go and do another draft.

Steve

[Alastair_I]

Mrs_A has just seen tha latest 'leccy bill.. and let's just say that step up to running a 150W halide 10hours a day, every day, from running a rather weak T5 rig appears to be having a bigger effect than I predicted..  much as I'd love a 1,000+litre tank, the running costs would get in the way of all my other hobbies.. the current tank was a custom build by Keith, to my own designm

Come on.. lets see even just a rough sketch..  All the boat models I'm seeing are far too serious so a flight-of-fancy design sounds great.. (is there a seperate forum for whimsical boat modellers?).. Oh.. and any pictures of the tank? 

[Bryan Young]

Right now, I have to say that my attempts at drawing are so pitiful that I don't want to put them up.

However, I have been provided with information about a cunning gadget by a chap at work that allows you to draw complex curves easily and repeatably. I'm off to get one tomorrow, will have a couple of hours shouting and cursing at a piece of paper, and see if there is anything postable in the evening....


Steve

Would that be a set of French Curves. Can't draw without mine.

[George Steele]

One pre-computer method of drawing plans of ships included a drafting table, a steel straight edge, wooden or plastic "splines", a dozen "ducks" (lead weights with a "hook" in one end to hold down a spline), some  "ship curves" and "french curves", a triangle or two, pencils, pencil sharpener, eraser, drafting paper, dividers, strips of paper, an understanding of Simpson's rule for computing volumes, if you could afford it a planimeter) a table of weights of lumber , a good chair to rest in and two weeks of concentrated work to complete a set of lines, also an architect's ruler and probably a few thing I have missed.