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[White Ensign]

... don´t trust in any scientists statements anyway. The last time a "Super-Technology" was invented (for the benfit of mankind, of course) it has lead to two "Big Bangs" as well and after 60 years still people die by the nuclear contermination.
If this would lead to a new power-technology, which makes us ready to start for the journey to planets which we will not reach in one lifetime, powered by spaceshuttles which are not build yet- why don`t we care about the planet on which we are living now?

Hydrogene-oxygene-power was first introduced in 1937. This brilliant technology is still not available to the masses for powering the cars, producing electricity in their houses and heat them due to cold periods.
Why?
Be cause there is a lobby which is not interested in making such technologies available for everybody and for the benefit of mother earth. We still run on petrol, heat with gas, coal and oil and live like we have another world in spare.
So if some scientists want to tell me, that something new is for the benfit of mankind- I doubt it very much.
So the repeat of the Big-Bang is a nice experiment- but it`ll be better to care about the "where-we-go" instead of "where-we-come-from".
The Big Bang experiment is not neccesarily a step forward- it is just the try of an explanation what has happened in the past.

Just my penny..... (now back to the workshop....)  ::)

Jörg

[White Ensign]

... but what di I know?

The first inventor of the Big Bang Thingy I may ask- but then it`s too late to do something with the answer. So my creator knwos what he has done there and I`m not important enuogh that he will explain it to me. And I am honest enough to say: I surely won`t understand it...

So why to care about the idea behind gods creation? If he wants us to understand it- he will make it obvious.

Still can`t understand why he has left the space on Noahs arc for mosquitos, siders, rats, wasps, hornets..... and that is actually more important.... OUCH!!!! (another one hit me)...  >:(

[Reade Models]

The one thing that this Big Bang/CERN thing has certainly done is to get you lot thinking - and expressing those thoughts very eloquently.  I don't think that I've previously read a thread on this Forum were such philosophy (and theology) were better expressed?

Good, long carefully worded posts too - great debate!

Maybe there is hope for the human race after all?

Malc

[sheerline]

Only the best on THIS forum Malc!

[polobeer]

"I can only reiterate my previous observation; some things are best left alone"

Like fire ? And travelling faster than 10mph ? And knowing the Earth is round ? And knowing it isn't at the centre of the universe ?

Who decides at what point we are allowed to ask no more questions ? Anyway, at least this is (currently) a peacefull use for the money. There are plenty of politicians that think a good war would be a better use for it. Cruise missiles cost how much per go ?

Phil

Yes, and where does much of the so called research for peaceful purposes end up? Being used via the backdoor to develop more lethal and technologically advanced weapons of mass destruction. I am not criticising genuine pragmatic advances in our development (like fire, which was probably discovered by accident anyway); what I am referring to are the scientific projects that seem to provide zero benefit to the masses, but which consume untold amounts of money, magically appearing from the coffers of the participating countries even though we are told that this is a "credit crunch" and that we all need to cut back. Tell me precisely what has been achieved by sending a human to the Moon for example? Are you feeling some of the benefits (whatever they might be)? As an analogy, it is like the telephone; before mobile 'phones were invented were we all waiting outside telephone boxes in long queues to tell our friends and family that we were "just standing inside a telephone box looking at the queue outside" or texting a garbled incomprehensible communication (like many noisy pointless conversations and text bleeps you hear on trains)? Were we heck as like. The need has been artificially created by advances in science and technology. Why not make use of tried and trusted methods? Ask questions by all means but make sure they are not going to spin out of control.

Simon   :(

[Philipsparker]

"Tell me precisely what has been achieved by sending a human to the Moon for example? "

Microcomputers, teflon, and the superpowers spent years firing rockets into space as a substitute for firing them at each other.

Phil

[Philipsparker]

"... don´t trust in any scientists statements anyway" - better then than soothsayers and astrologers.

The trouble with science is it requires thinking and unless you get it directly from the horses mouth whatever you hear will have been filtered by the media. Many national newspapers do not employ science correspondants any more and so put the press release in the hands of someone more used to dealing with reporting on Big Brother. Strangely this means that what you get is often less than accurate. Hence the MMR controversy when much of the publics information came from "fat woman on Trisha" who knew nothing but because she was on the telly, managed to terrify parents into thinking something was wrong. This lead to a huge drop in imunisation and the resurgence of measles.

[portside II]

Well said Phil ,thats one thing i have noticed and started to notice even more in the media sector , for example how many times have you sat sown to watch the news and seen all the dom and gloom in the world first then at the end we here something nice ,why when asking for aid for the third world do they show some poor child with flies on its face crying , oh well thats easy cos they want you to piity them and make you feel that if you give then that child will benefit . Would you still have the same opinion if they showed a child with an automatic rifle hijacking a food truck and shooting wildly into the air ,i dont think so.
The media i thought was there to inform us of what is happening in the world and to give us a non biased view of the events ,not to fill us with fear and dispair by trying to convince us that we are all doomed .
Oh well big bang little bang ,if it helps humanity to exist and live on this planet without destroying it i'll go with that .
Just one more thing what did happen to the ceramic engine and ever lasting light bulb,and all the other positive inventions that are hidden away because they would change the world and the fat cat industry's and goverments would'nt gain from, i mean what if you only ever bought one set of light bulbs for your house  .
daz

[Umi_Ryuzuki]

You are using one of the benefits of super colliders at this instant.

If the scientist were to record ever bit of data out of one atomic collision, it would fill up every hard drive on earth.
So they have programmed the computerS to select the best collisions out of each event for analysis. The data is then shared throughout the faciity via networked computers. Then made available to scientist around the world via a larger network... the world wide web... The internet you are using now was developed to link computers so that the computers could more quickly analyze  the data from the experiments and distribute that data around the world.
.
.
.

My favorite comparison from the Apollo projects is that they sent men to the moon using slide rules. And that
Neal Armstrong made the lunar landing velocity calulations on a computer in center console of the lunar module
 that was no more sofisticated than  a simple credit card sized caculator today. The cell phone that most people carry in their pockets is more sophistcated than the computer that they took to the moon.

I imagine that miniaturization is possible by understanding the smaller components of molecular and atomic structure.

[polaris]

Personally I am all for censorship of the press and media - and D Notices on hugely more than at present. The media very successfully does 60% of of what terrorists want, and, by picking on peoples fears to sell their rags, distort anything that comes their way to suit their purpose - the trouble is that seemingly 80% of the British public fall for it every time!!! ::) Oh well...... The media is a fickle beast as we know, get a story going, get people wound up suitably, but, guess what, as soon as something better comes along, what was so important gets dropped like a hot brick! When will most of the public learn to think for themselves and not believe or rely on the press and media? - if info. is wanted the I.net is there... but this is too much work I suppose! Read a rag, believe about 50%, and it's about 30% right! :)

Regards, Bernard

[portside II]

I agree with you Bernard ,
yes your right about the bull that the media spew out on a daily basis (thats why i rarely buy any paper) even when there is a D notice slapped on a story the media often chose to ignore it and claim that the public have a right to know ,and the point is usually battled out in the courts and using tax payers money to fund it .
I would say the content of a newspaper is more 60% of it lies or well adjusted truth to sell the paper in the first place.
daz

[catengineman]

I'll go along with you Portside & polaris on the media even in the papers that display half dressed women the pictures are basically lies

R,

[dougal99]

I'll go along with you Portside & polaris on the media even in the papers that display half dressed women the pictures are basically lies

R,

So are you saying that they are basically half undressed or some other proportion that is misleading?  ???

[catengineman]

Had to borrow Daughters paper! err I can only remember seeing women with the top lot on show but now it seems they are without any coverings but just posed in a way not to reveal ALL .

Just goes to show when I last looked at a 'paper' never mind buy one. :)

Scandal, sex, violence, doom and gloom? oh and don't forget the special offers "collect and get a free whatsit"
I think its just a ratings war between all the media and no I watch very little TV too busy in the workshop or being with the spanner.

[dougal99]

I only do the crossword, Suduko. codeword etc the rest just makes me weep. 

[andyn]

http://hasthelargehadroncolliderdestroyedtheworldyet.com/

[Colin Bishop]

Course it hasn't. We're doing pretty well without it.....

[Martin (Admin)]

http://hasthelargehadroncolliderdestroyedtheworldyet.com/

      

[The long Build]

Nope Not Yet... But they get to have another go possibly this coming June...

What I want to know is if this is

"designed to simulate the "Big Bang", which started the universe 15 billion years ago, by smashing sub-atomic particles together at energies never before achieved.

Scientists hope this will help them find the answers to big questions, such as what causes mass and whether hidden dimensions exist in space.

There is also a possibility of tiny black holes being created in the Collider. Experts insist that if this happens, they will pose no threat."

Who's to say that it wasn't some ruddy scientist 15 billion years ago who created the current universe by doing exactly as above!!
Also How do they know that these small black holes are harmless as they have never made one before..or have they ? and does any one trust experts..? after all don't they say life is a continual cycle..

[Hagar]

From what I have read, If the worst thing happens and they do a boo boo, the resulting black hole will result in the world being swallowed whole in the time it takes to turn off a light.
So we wont even know it happened.

If true that is nice. No panic, on mass trafficjam as every one tries to get home to their better halfs. On the down side, no spending spree on the company card, or telling the boss what you really think of him.

Knownig how the average sceince project gets eaten buy the military, Should Cern figure out how to make little black holes that could eat a person, a room or a small country, You can bet the military will want one. Just think no more war. Dont like him, lets send him a black hole. Problem solved.

[wombat]

I remember there was all this BS about the formation of black holes and the end of the earth back in the late 70s and early 80s when they were about to turn on JET at Culham.

If I follow the physics correctly....

Tiny black holes are not stable - it all comes down to the ratio of the surface area to the volume... the smaller the volume the greater the ratio. The smaller they are the faster they lose energy

The prediction for the black holes that are likely to be seen at the LHC are expcted to be miniscule: diameters of 10^-4 fm (10^-19m) with a lifetime of about 10^-26 seconds. Given the high vacuums that are likely to be seen in the LHC, I cannot see that these mini-black holes would consume anything more than a couple of sub-atomic particles or the odd atom before they evaporated. The challenge will be to detect the tiny "puff" of energy as the holes collapse.

Wom