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[RipSlider]

Hello all.


Sorry, I have another couple of questions:

Pillar drills:

I can see a vast number of uses for a pillar drill in modelling. However, I'm not sure I have the space, or in fact a strong enough floor, to have a full sized, floor standing unit, although it would make my life far easier if I did!

I do currently have a "pillar drill" attachment for my dremel, but it's not very tough, doesn't have a vast amount of drop, and I'm not quite convinced that it's actually much good. I do seem to get a bit of wobble in it.

I was wondering if anyone has come accross a half way house - ideally, I would like a bench mountable pillar drill that is a good bit bigger than the dremel stand, and would have more drop height, and a half or full sized chuck, which would allow for a bigger range of drill sizes. Does such a thing exist? If it does, does anyone have any good/bad reports about them? Should I just take the plunge and get a floor standing unit and work out a way of making it fit in? There seem to be some good second hand deals around, and I would use it for a lot more than just model boats.


bench vice.

I am still struggling to find an enginners vice.

There are lots of them about, but I am looking for one which has the spring release system in it which means you can't over-tighten, and can squeeze the level to pull the vice in and out, rather than lots of winding.

I can't find one of these anywhere. I was wondering if someone has ever seen them for sale anywhere?

I have been scouring the local car boot sales. I did find one, but the person in front of me brought it! Garhh


Thanks for any advice

Steve

[andygh]

Do you mean this kind of thing? There's loads of them about, I have the Clarke version and it's perfect for anything I've thrown at it

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/44021/Power-Tools/Benchtop-Woodworking/Titan-SF16N-9-230V-Pillar-Drill

There are many of these about too they're quite expensive though, second hand might be a good idea. Luckilly I managed to "aquire" one when a company I worked for moved premises 

http://www.knighton-tools.co.uk/acatalog/Mechanics_Vice_Quick_Release_Record.html

[Reade Models]

I bought the Screwfix pillar drill recently (my 2nd) It's really useful.  9 speeds and a 50mm vertical travel.

Mine was on offer at the time, £39.50 from memory.

Malc

[David_S]

Bench-sized pillar drills seem to be available everywhere (and all look as if they come form the same factory in China). Even here in Finland hey cost only about 50-60 Euros, which seems pretty reasonable for such a versatile tool. I have the Dremel drill mount as well but have not used it for some time, in fact not since I bought my pillar drill.

[catengineman]

I have never seen a hand vise with fast grip action

and my view is the work is easier to align when you have a hand vise which is quite light to handle

I have three sizes and on the smallest one the screw handle has been modified = just a hole so that the handle can be taken out (this is so I can mount it at 90 deg to the chuck in another vice)

R,

[RipSlider]

Do you mean this kind of thing? There's loads of them about, I have the Clarke version and it's perfect for anything I've thrown at it

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/44021/Power-Tools/Benchtop-Woodworking/Titan-SF16N-9-230V-Pillar-Drill

There are many of these about too they're quite expensive though, second hand might be a good idea. Luckilly I managed to "aquire" one when a company I worked for moved premises 

http://www.knighton-tools.co.uk/acatalog/Mechanics_Vice_Quick_Release_Record.html

Brilliant. That's the vice ordered. Thanks very much for that one Andy.

I ordered the 4 1/2" one. But now I'm wondering if I should cancel the order anbd get the 6" one instead? Any thoughts?


Steve

[Tug]

Steve,

If you needed a 5 inch for something you are b*****d  But if you got the 6 inch,
it will do everything the 4 1/2 does and more, But a lot heavy-ier though, hows your bench?
sometimes an advantage 

I use the 6 inch vice¿ for everything, and like a greedy sob I am, I have a 2 inch in the house for the little jobs, [and a 5 inch in the caller for emergencies]

[Roger in France]

VICES: Always go for the largest, heaviest one you can fit (and afford). A good trick with a large vice is to secure a smaller clamp in its jaws and use the latter to secure/work on a small, light job.

PILLAR DRILLS: Some years ago when I was a Trading Standards Officer we tested some of the cheap drills available (thinking of it, it could have been 15 years ago!). There were some electrical wiring problems and some chucks which bored oval holes! I guess they will have improved.

My advice is to say to the seller, "I will just take this home and run it through its paces to make sure it is working as it should". Get the name of the person you said it to and make a mental note of when and where. Better still have a friend there to witness you saying it. Then go home and test it thouroughly, as soon as possible and certainly within 48 hours.

If buying remotely (by post or on the Internet) when the goods are delivered and you are asked to sign for them, write on the form you are asked to sign, "Contents of and condition unknown" before you sign.

Roger in France.

[Colin H]

Bought my pillar drill from the Depot and find it very acceptable. Good thing is their returns policy if you don't like it take it back and they will refund you no problem.


Colin H.

P.S. Have also used it with router bits when I can't be "xxxxx" to unpack the router, its slower but still functional.

[tigertiger]

PILLAR DRILLS: Some years ago when I was a Trading Standards Officer we tested some of the cheap drills available (thinking of it, it could have been 15 years ago!). There were some electrical wiring problems and some chucks which bored oval holes! I guess they will have improved.

Look for the CE marking.

The Chinese tools have improved tremendously in the last 20 years.
Especially machine tools in the last 10 years.
Some industrial tools are equal to Western made tools now, and are still less than half the price.

Part of this is that the Chinese market is also now more aware of what products should be capable off and they have also been exposed to quality.

Off topic, but I have actually seen a huge improvement in textiles in the home market in the last 12 months. I suppose the customers want to know why all the western brands are made in China, but they cannot buy the same quality in local brands.

[Reade Models]

and some chucks which bored oval holes

I'm having trouble undestanding that?

Malc

[tigertiger]

I figured it meant the shaft the chuck is connected to had some lateral travel.

But I know what you mean Malc.

[Roger in France]

OK, Malcolm, you asked for it 

I discovered that some poor quality pillar drills when used by an operative had some inaccuracies in their manufacture such that there was play in the drill shaft and possibly eccentricity in the chuck jaws. When a Morse Twist Drill was held in the chuck, the motor running and the said Twist Drill was applied to the workpiece with a downward force, the resulting hole in the workpiece was not truly circular.

Hope that's clearer!!!!

It will be a lot less exacting judging competitions  ::)

Roger in France.

[Reade Models]

the resulting hole in the workpiece was not truly circular.

Sorry Roger, I didn't mean to bait you - OK, well maybe just a little? 

I once saw a female factory worker using a pair of pliers trying to catch a metal plate which was spinning around merrily on the end of a bench drill.  (Some mothers do have 'em).

Regards, Malcolm

[Tug]

Holding things with pliers?

I witnessed a time served engineer, middle aged [a very good one I must add] holding an earth braided strap with pliers whilst using a bench drill,

I took him to casualty. (that don't look spelt right) Tug

[Proteus]

Maybe the reason the hole was oval was because you don't put Morse taper drills in chucks , they go in Morse tapers !

Proteus

[tobyker]

I got my bench pillar drill from Aldi (where else?) and I recently rescued a Record 35 engineer's vice with 5" wide jaws from a shed demolition. Vice free to good home; collect from Saltcoats N Ayrshire. or I could deliver up to 15 miles or so. PM me.

[RipSlider]

Hello all.


Thank you for the good advice.

I do have one follow on question:

I can find two sorts of bench drills.

There is a cheaper version ( I thnk the same thing rebadged ) which controls speed via pulleys, and a more expensive version with electronic speed control.

If there is a need to change speeds a lot, I would go with the electonic version, but I was wondering if that actually happens, or in most cases you chaps just set it to one speed and then leave it be.

In this case, I'd just go with the cheaper version.


Thanks

Steve

[Tug]

My drill is the pulley type and I leave it pretty much always on the slow speed, it you misjudge the depth go too deep... you don't go to far so as not to be recoverable, Tug

[David_S]

I've not changed the speed on mine since I bought it and set it to the slowest available. Been like that for 3 or 4 years now.

[RipSlider]

Do you not need to re-set it to fast is your drilling metal?

I thought metal was drilled best at high speed. I know my firneds business has just brought a set of fiendishly expensive drills and drill bits for drilling holes in chassis in cars as the slow drills bounce off the modern metals like boron steel. 12,000 rpm apprently and £80 a drill bit.

Not planning on spending that sort of money in ANY way, but I will be drilling some metal, although mostly wood.


Thanks for all the advice so far chaps.

Steve

[tigertiger]

I don't plan to use boron steel in any of my models.

Yet 

[RipSlider]

and of course neither am I   

But if I have a drill that can do 500 -> 2,500 rpm, would I want to be drilling metal at the higher speeds?

Ta

Steve

[Tug]

when the drill snaps, as indeed it will, just think how far the bits will fly at 12,000 rpm,
And you are in its path!

naw slow and easy, the thing to remember is to give the drill some work to do, cutting oil and pressure. Tug

[tobyker]

I think its the speed of the cutting edge against the metal that is significant - so the smaller the drill the faster in order to cut efficiently. Too slow and you'll blunt it, or it'll dig in and break in the hole. And if it shatters - you will have the safety guard down, won't you?