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Author Topic: OH NO Another Slo-Mo  (Read 35587 times)

steamboatbob

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OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« on: September 28, 2008, 05:04:11 AM »

Hi guys,

This is my first build thread so please be gentle with me as i need a little constructive criticism.

Background
Hmmmm- ok i have built a 1400 long paddlesteamer "PS-PILAT" from plans
i am currently doing the "build the bismarck" that martin is also attempting
African Queen Alas i do not have any photos of her as she went out the door to a new member of my club.
Kyosho-Wave Master
Graupner Jet-Sprint

and have been a cabinet maker for around 10 years so working with wood is almost second nature to me now

this was my paddlesteamerits around 1450mm long almost 5feet in the old language


ok here goes
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2008, 05:22:54 AM »

Step 1
Lay out tools so they all look nice and pretty (LOL)


also decide before you start building this monster about a few things like How it is to be powered, battery, drive system, i will explain these at a latter date but for now

this one will be powered by a 6 turn Feigao Brusless Motor 5070 Kv
twin Lipo Batteries at 11.2 V
Xpower 100Amp ESC, computer programable
Fullers Fast Electrics Crumbgrabber Hydro Drive Hardware.
these items are all water cooled, except the batteries, so i also need to think about how i am to make this happen.

the other major thaught you should look at is the finiching process you will go for and how you are going to construct this beast as the instruction from billings is very vague to be honest so I have invested in a lot of planking clamps and Titebond3 PVA glue as this is water proof when dry (i use this product at work for wet areas and it holds extremly well in damp situations) and i have decided to go with the west system epoxy to finish off the veneering.

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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2008, 05:24:40 AM »

Step 2

make a decent building slip as this boat definately needs one

here is mine
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steamboatbob

  • Guest
Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2008, 05:27:30 AM »

Glue on the main frames to your slip making sure that they are square and that they dry square as this will cause many problems later on if it is not done properly



after this is done then the main support beams can be placed along the hull

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steamboatbob

  • Guest
Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2008, 05:30:24 AM »

i came across my first mistake at this point when i rechecked my hull for squareness and as it turned out my last frame was slightly twisted so out came the saw and a slight adjustment


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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2008, 05:36:54 AM »

next came along the fun bit

Sanding the hull frames  ::) i have made this easier on myself by making a sanding pad from a length of wood 291mm*100mm this allows you to slip on a sanding belt from a belt sander and using to dowles on one side gives you a very flat surface to sand from but dont get carried away as you can sand too much away very quickly as shown below



the yellow arrow was where i had sanded away too much as the front triangular piece needed to be tapered off, the green arrow shows where i will need to sand down to the frame
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2008, 05:50:25 AM »

Next bit

Planking

this is easy but if you have not done it before
1 - Get as many planking clamps as you think you will need i have around 30 as this suits me for most models that i have built
2 - Draw a center line down the full length of the hull this should have been done to the frames before removing them from the sprues but i got sidetracked
3 - test fit your first plank and check the frames to see that you have not sanded any hollows in the framesas it will show up later
4 - get all you clamps ready and glue ready to use
5 - put a small amount of glue on the frames and clamp down the planks not rushing but be mindfull of the glue setting
6 - wait for the glue to cure for this first on as all your planks will follow this line
7 - for the consecutive planks dry fit the plank first and remove any glue from the frames that has gone hard i use a small plane blade to do this
8 - Mark out the next plank and drill holes using a 1.2mm drill bit for the clamps to sit in
9 - put down a little glue on the frames and run a small bead along the first plank
10 - clamp the plank in place and also to help line up the planks perfectly put a spring clamp in between the frames to level out your planks as shown in picture 2

srry bout the image quality of this one


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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2008, 05:55:16 AM »

i have decided to add a little support on the side to help when i amplanking down there a scrap 5mm square length is placed over the thin ply already in place for the same reason

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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2008, 06:27:55 AM »

OK

after putting 3 planks either side of the centre line it is time to stop planking for now and start on the bottom of the boat as the base will need a coating of epoxy on both sides to stop it from bowing and looking ugly as a finished product and as the instructions from billings tells you to plank the entire top section before doing th bottom i decided on doing it my way as you cannot acces the bottom of the boat after planking the top section.

firstly carefully cut the hull away from the building slip taking care not to damage the frames
secondly give a good sanding to the bottom to get it flat
you need lots of clamps and always test fit the piece before putting it in place as many other builds on this forum have stated billings wood is not cut accurately but fortunately i have not come across any YET!!! O0

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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2008, 09:31:50 AM »

do not throw away the slip after you have cut it from the hull

after applying the bottom sheet i have moved to the inner sides of the sponsons as they need to be planked and strengthened as i am putting a turn fin in this area

the first planks are fairly easy just remember to soak the planks in water first as they need to be bent a little



then after this has cured overnight get your slip that was cut away and glue them inbetween the frames to add a lot of support to this area as shown below these should slide in nicely

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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2008, 03:16:04 PM »

here are some of the main tools i have used for the build

my big sander, i use this quite a lot

a violin makers block plane,80mm long, speciality woodworking shops should carry these they are extremly good at taking off bulk amounts of wood very quickly and accurately but they must be kept sharp

and my chisel

 
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2008, 03:25:05 PM »

ok all sanded and ready for the base of the sponsons to go on the inner walls have now been bulked up from 1mm thick to around 6 mm thick so this should take the load pressure placed on them from the turn fins.

after i put the sponson bottom on for a dry fit you can see below the difference in the cut sizes and what billings expect you to sand away  >>:-(
i should have expected this after reading orbys build thread

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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2008, 03:52:31 PM »

now this was fixed by running a pencil line on the frames and shaving it back to that point as in the past when i have built billings boats this is generally the best way of doing things as they tend to oversize the miliply to allow for mistakes, so instead of adding a lot of material i will take off a small amount.
 
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steamboatbob

  • Guest
Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #13 on: September 29, 2008, 01:21:54 AM »

i will be going on holiday for a week down to the winery regions of West Australia for nice good look and sample of their reds so feel free to comment on my build and ill get back to you guys in a weeks time

 O0 ;D
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steamboatbob

  • Guest
Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #14 on: October 04, 2008, 04:56:36 AM »

ok this is just a little off track but along the same lines

and i know many people will ask this question of themselves
this is only for electric setups as i have no idea about nitro and gas engines and as there are no local lakes around with the council approval to do so i have been stuck with electrics.

How do i choose my racing hardware ????
well to be blunt there is no answer
but the following steps will help you on the way

you need to ask yourself

1 What is my budget???
2 what performance am i looking for
3 What type of boat do you have

Motors
Brushed are the cheaper version for a boat like mine you could get away with a graupner speed 600 race BB motor
brushless the possibilities are endless but are a lot more expensive a setup to organise
          cheaper brands would be FEIGAO which are a decent motor around $70 USD
          the more reliable but a lot more expensive brands would be NEU $200-$300 USD

ESC
i must say if you can spend as much money on a decent esc as if you have the wrong setup your boat can turn into a big fireball very quickly
the are many brands around but lookaround on the internet and find one but if you are running brushless try and get an esc that is computer programable as they are easier to use

BATTERIES
Ni CD - good,cheap starting point but they develop a memory and you can find yourself buying new ones very freequently and are very heavy
NiMH -  no memory (supposedly) little bit more expensive than NiCD but a good all rounder
LiPo - extremly light but Can be very Expensive and most clubs have rules about charging Lipo batteries as they can rarely explode while charging (i have seen this happen and it is not a good sight)
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=z3o_2mwRPdw
watch the link to see what happens to a lipo if not charged properly

Hardware rudders and the rest of that junk
Depending on the type of boat you have wll depend on the type of hardware you can use
there are a few places around which will sell you a setup for a fast electric
http://www.drcwebservices.com/ffe/hardware.htm this is a good place to start
http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/ this is also a good shop wich sells everything you will need

if you guys need any more answers on this just post in here and i shall attemp to answer you

i will be posting my full hardware setup for my boat very shortly just as a reference
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #15 on: October 04, 2008, 08:25:23 AM »

ok this is what i have purchased and where from for my slo mo as the hardware you get is just not really that good



1. ESC. Xpower 100Amp water cooled with computer programable interface (plugs into a usb port and use the downloaded software to configure it)
   this was purcased from http://www.offshoreelectrics.com/

2. Motor is a Feagio L 5070 (KV basically that means 5070 rpm per volt) also purchased from offshore electrics
    Motor is cooled by a standard watercooling jacket from same place
    Motor Mount is fully tilt and hight adjustable also availablie from Offshore Electrics

3. Gold plated Banana plug terminals for the wiring 5Male 5Female

4. water cooling bulkhead inlet Stainless Steel
    water cooling outlet Stainless Steel

(all of the above items can be found at offshore electrics0

5. rudder and flexshaft mount (called crumbgrabber package ) this pack i got from Fullers Fast Electrics this set has a water pickup in the rudder predrilled to get some cool action happening. http://www.drcwebservices.com/ffe/Default.htm and is the 1/8 version. this just requires a little stiffening on the rear of the boat and bolts straight on

Items Yet To Be Purchased

6. Batteries i am thinking lipos atm as this setup has a high power drain and most other types of cells will not cope with this amount of drain and around the 11.2 mark for voltage

7. Prop this is one area that i know diddly squat about so i might be calling on some knowledge when i get to this stage
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #16 on: October 04, 2008, 08:33:13 AM »



these two little uprights might prove to be a difficult fix i think i am going to just add a little material to the top like orby did but kep the same profile happening
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #17 on: October 04, 2008, 12:33:18 PM »

anyhow i started to put the outside botoms on the sponsons first as this seems to be the way to go so the front section can be sanded to fit
view of the top of the boat showing both sponsons on the inside hte right hand side has cured and hes been sanded flat



this is the finished sponson cured and ready for resin



this is the sponson on the right which needs the glue to cure and sanding back flush to make a nice join



these sponsons need a very sharp corner on the inside of them so if you are doing this build please do not chamfer these corners as this will lead to bad cornering a sharp sponson is always better in the turns. but this can be helped by a turn fin which i will cover later in the build.
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #18 on: October 05, 2008, 09:01:47 AM »

ok here is the work done so far today

1. here is one i prepared earlier i thaught about the front end and decided to score the ply and clamped into place overnight to bend it,firstly score a few lines in the direction of the bend then put a bit of boiling water in a tupperware tub (don't let the missus see you doing this  ;D I got an absolute earfull )  leave in there for five minuts. clamp into place and hey presto one very curved bit of ply in the right shape. a word of warning though dont let the ply sit in the water too long as the glue will separate and you then have to find a bit of ply which can be troublesome.



2. i added a little support down the centre of the underside for a little added strength as i found out from hagars post about his slomo about a site with actual photos of the origional slomoshun which showed the front piece should be in two sections rather than the single rounded piece that billings supplied so i have cut the front bit in two and am using the extra support to make it straight.



3. oh boy what fun this is just a pic here of how i have glued on the front piece and also showing the ridge. I have left the front pieces oversized for now as when i come to start my epoxying the internals hopefully today it won't leak out of the gaps and these can be planed off or sanded later on.

 
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Hagar

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #19 on: October 05, 2008, 09:34:27 AM »

Hi Steamboat,
Looking good, but I have a few Q's.
Are you building from a kit, or from scratch. If the later, which scale are we in. In some of the pictures, it looks pretty big, in others not so big.
I'm doing one to, in 1/8 scale.
Its actually by first boat build, so still got lots to learn.
I like the way you did a few of the top planks, then cut it off the board to do the bottom. Wish I had thought of that. I have been wodering how I am going to "varnish" the inside...

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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #20 on: October 05, 2008, 10:32:38 AM »

This one is the billings kit 1:12 scale
she works out at around 700 mm long without rudder and prop and 300 wide at the sponsons

most of the photos are taken very close up

and sadly to report my daughter just had fun with a whole buch of epoxy i had just mixed and i had to throw it out she mixed in her finger paints while my back was turned (two year olds are fun like that) :D

and suffice to say i did not have enough resin to complete the underside  >>:-(
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #21 on: October 05, 2008, 10:58:12 AM »

hi guys,
Now with resins and getting that perfect glassy finish i shall let you guys in on an industry tool i use at work called a "CABINET SCRAPER". as i have seen other build threads and seen people using glass razors and other sharp and dangerous items.

A cabinet scraper, to put it bluntly is a small piece of high carbon steel around the same size as a credit card and ranging in thickness from .05 mm to 2.5mm along one edge of a cabinet scraper there is a burr so you cannot cut your fingers on them using this burr dragged over a veneer it will bring it up to a shine its almost like using a bit of 1500 grit paper but it leaves a flatter surface on solid timber it will actually put a shine on the wood without using resins or enamel paints.

you should be able to find one in a speciality woodworking hardware most model shops do not have a clue about these

the link below is a site which basically tells you about them

http://www.woodzone.com/articles/scrapers/index.htm

and another site which is very useful

http://woodgears.ca/scraper/index.html

all give good info in regards to scrapers and they perform better than a razor or glass

give me a pm if ya want more info or look around on the web as there are various shaped scrapers out there i use a curved one myself but its all up to you O0
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #22 on: October 06, 2008, 03:16:18 PM »

HI guys just reporting in that the first batch of resin has finally gone on and been sanded back. I will be placing a 2nd and third thicker layer on the inside of the boat before i continue any more real building but there were a few things to note during the sanding, at the second frame from the front a lot more resin is required at the join from the sponson bottoms to the front bottom panels as the ply is extremely thin and after sanding it back flat i almost can see daylight.



the other major part i modified was the bottom part of the 5th frame from the front was completely cut away as to allow the motor and mount enough room to be put into the hull very soon i will be installing the hardware to give myself an idea as to where everything will go. the install is not a final one except that i will be gluing th motor mount to the bottom and sorting out a good place to put the servo, esc, watercooling ducts outlets and inlets i will also need to make a stuffing tube for the flex cable but am a little unsure about it atm but i think a quick trip down to one of my mates will sort that out.



I am also starting to think that the plastic recesses for the motor cowling will not be going on as i need as much space as possible at the moment and the top of the motor is only 6mm from the bottom of the planking.

anhow till next time
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steamboatbob

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2008, 10:45:43 AM »

OK next stage


this is after two coats of resin with at least two more to go so it will be sanding night tonight for me as you guys can see it is fairly bumpy until that smoothness has appeared.

but i have just test fitted the more important hardware for the moment as this will dictate the positioning of everything to make a good centre of gravity. The boat atm weighs in at .760 kg with all hardware onboard, so is a bit lightweight but there is a lot more to go in receiver, batteries

here are a few piccies of what they look like, the stuffing tube was a tester i made in aluminium. just use a propane torch and give a gentle curve but it gives me a good template for me to make one out of brass at a latter stage of the build.

if you have any queries Pm me or whack in a post and I'll answer as soon as i can


the little stainless steel thingy sticking out to the left of the rudder is a water line bulkhead nozzle it will allow me to use the water pickup on the rudder, and not need a separate waterpickup that will put the boat offline in a straight run
 

the little stainless steel thing on the right sponson is the water outlet I just thaught that this would be a good place to put it so i can have sight of the water comming out so during any water fun i can tell if my water cooling is working or not.


one real good hint here ( Make sure you take the ruddy teflon tubing out before you bend the tube  :embarrassed:  i forgot and kinda ruined one )
but i have enough leftover pieces to make a new one so no harm done just heat the pipe over a gentle curve like a big tin of coffee something that has a diameter of around 150mm and you should be right as rain but dont sit the pipe in the heat for a long time as the tube will distort and your flex shaft will become very tight and place a bigger amp load on your motor and esc.

i found that when i got the tubing from my local hobby shop they had a flex shaft in the same size as my stuffing tube so when i made the second one (the first was ruined by the melted teflon). I placed the flex cable inside the stuffing tube and then heated it up i found this to be an excellent way to make sure your stuffing tube does not crease or distort in shape.

Happy Building

STEAMBOATBOB
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w3bby

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Re: OH NO Another Slo-Mo
« Reply #24 on: October 09, 2008, 12:52:14 PM »

the little stainless steel thing on the right sponson is the water outlet I just thaught that this would be a good place to put it so i can have sight of the water comming out so during any water fun i can tell if my water cooling is working or not.
You would be better off putting it on the left sponson as with a surface drive, right mounted rudder and turn fin the boat will run much better on a clockwise circuit. Thus the outlet on the left side will be easily visible every time the boat goes by.
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