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[ian kennedy]

Thanks John,

Some excellent advice and cracking looking DRO's, just out of interest how much and what machine are they fitted to please?

Cheers

Ian

[bogstandard]

Ian,

The lathe already came with DRO's for the saddle and cross slide, and I had a spare display head from when I upgraded my mill from 2 axis to 3 axis, so I only had to buy two read scales.

This is my lathe

http://www.chesteruk.net/store/crusader_lathe.htm

But I had the vendor modify it some to allow me to get a lot more movement on the saddle, and a larger swing.

The DRO's came from here

http://www.machine-dro.co.uk/index.php?target=categories&category_id=24

But these only show the display heads, you have to factor in the cost of the read scales as well. They go from £100 each upwards, depending on the length required. So around £400 for a two axis one.

Unless you go for the Newall system, about double these prices, these are about the best you can get. You can buy cheaper setups on ebay, but they aren't up to it on quality and features, and by the time you add in import duty, just pay the little extra and go for a better system.

I had to do a fairly major setup on the tailstock, because the ram always rotates slightly, so I had to design and build a carriage system with a built  in slip joint to take that out of the equation. I can now drill with the same accuracy as the other slides. I had to do that mod, as some of the work I am doing is critical on hole depth.

This is how I fitted the compound slide read head.



How I got over the rotation of the ram



And the finished tailstock setup.



You can set up using much cheaper equipment, but you can guarantee that you will have continuous trouble. I went down that route with my old mill, and almost every day I had to fiddle with something to get it running correctly. The main problems were swarf and liquid penetration, plus continually having to change batteries.
I still used one on my new mill, but that is only for drilling depth, and I had a friend make me up a transformer so that it ran from the mains, and I just put a capacitor across the battery terminals. It doesn't suffer as the old ones did, it is away from the cutter and suds.

This pic shows the cheaper type of scales and the associated display head. You can get ones that have three displays in one, so with three scales, and the head you could most probably make up a cheap 3 axis system for under £200.



I hope this has answered your questions.

John

[ian kennedy]

Many thanks John,

I must admit the crusader is a tad out my price range at the moment, in time i would like to CNC the lathe i purchase.....a conclusion i came to after talking to some chaps at the Harrogate show last year.

The conversions look quite simple and not too pricey, I don't suppose you have any experience of WARCO or TOOL CO lathes or possibly know someone who has? I have been Lathe browsing a fair bit tonight and the more i look at the more spec i seem to want !!!!

Your previous advise of power, bed stiffness and swing seem good basic rules to judge machines by, it would seem i have to get my oily mitts on some of these beasts to see if they are right for me.

Cheers

Ian

[bogstandard]

Ian,

I cannot comment on CNC, as I have no need to make thousands of an item, and if only one was required I could most probably have made it before you got your software up and running. I specialise in manual machining, one offs and the like, with the occasional small batchwork.


It took me six months to make my lathe decision.

It not only had to fulfill my needs (or modified to do so) but it also had to shoehorn into a very specific space. I only had about an inch to spare in length.

I would have liked a Jet lathe, even though expensive, they are about the best far eastern lathe you can get for build quality and features. But the one I wanted just wouldn't fit.

No matter what lathe you get, it will never match your ideal specs. I would have preferred to have an imperial leadscrew, as they are much easier and more versatile to use, but they are not available here, but are in the US. Most probably due to EU regulations.

You will find the same lathe you want from almost all suppliers. But there will be slight variations between the ones offered, and you really do have to look at the small print. Chester were the only ones to offer an 18 speed head for my model, all the others only had 9 speeds. Not that I really need them, but there might be a time when the extra speeds will come in handy.

I have bought most of my machinery over the years from Chester, purely on the features they offer and after sales service. They might look more expensive, but you usually get a lot more than what the others offer. Also they are local to me, so if anything does go wrong, an hour or so round trip and I will be up and running again.

You really do have to shop around and don't go for the first one with the most bling, posh chrome handles only cost a few squid.
Get your ideal features down on paper, give yourself a maximum budget, then just troll websites until you find what you want. If you find large discrepancies between prices from suppliers, check to see what comes with the machine. One might only supply a basic chuck, where another you will get the whole range of accessories.

In these hard times, an up front cash sale can sometimes get you a very good discount. I daren't tell you how much I got off my lathe and mill, purely because I paid cash up front for both at the same time, in the case of the lathe, months before it was delivered. Not at the show, but at the showroom later.

If you don't ask, you don't get.

Best of luck on your search.

John

[Colin Bishop]

I have been following this topic with some interest as I've always wanted to get into the lathe side of things despite that sort of work not really being my strong point. All I have at the moment is one of the little metal and plastic Unimat jobs. I see that on the Chester website there are a couple of small lathes priced at around the £300 mark. Are either of these suitable as a starter modeller's lathe? I only build relatively small scale models so  it wouldn't be used for heavy work but the ability to turn up small brass or aluminium fittings would be very useful.

Colin

[Bunkerbarge]

Colin,

This is my lathe:

http://www.chesteruk.net/store/conquest_lathe.htm

which can be purchased in many colours from many different manufacturers at slightly different prices.  You can buy spares from the United States here:

http://www.littlemachineshop.com/


and there are no end of web sites offering guidance and information about this machine such as this one:

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/silkstone/minilathe/minilathe01.htm


Being Chinese you do have to put a bit of thought into the set up and it's not a bad idea to take it apart and check every thing out properly but it is a great lathe for the money and a world apart from the one you have.  I would highly recomend it as a first 'serious' machine that can do a lot for the modeller who has a bit of interest. 

This is basically the same lathe:

http://www.chronos.ltd.uk/cgi-local/sh000001.pl?REFPAGE=http%3a%2f%2fwww%2echronos%2eltd%2euk%2fcgi%2dlocal%2fss000001%2epl%3fpage%3dsearch%26SS%3dlathe%26PR%3d%2d1%26TB%3dA&WD=lathe%20250&PN=copy_of_copy_of_Clarke_300m_Variable_Sped_Lathe___Accessories%2ehtml%23aCL300M_2e_2e#aCL300M_2e_2e

and so is this:

http://www.warco.co.uk/Mini-Lathe-354285CE76.aspx#

The cost being basically adjusted to suit the accessories you get with it.

I would go along to any one of the model engineering exhibitions where all the UK suppliers, such as those above, will have thier own version on display but they are basically the same machine.  I bought one with digital readouts which stuck the price up a bit but that's personal choice.

[Colin Bishop]

Thanks Bunkerbarge - some food for thought there. Maybe I need to go on a course....

I'll have a read of the Mini Lathe site first I think.

Colin

[walktheplank]

I have a small Axminster lathe, still learning how to use it, think it depends on what you want it for, and how much you are going to use it, how much you can afford.
i have put a link for you to have a look at. Sonic.
http://www.axminster.co.uk/category-Axminster-SIEG-Micro-Lathe-Accessories-370507.htm

[Colin Bishop]

Thanks Sonic. Some interesting stuff there and I have bookmarked the site. I think you have hit the nail on the head there. Will the amount of use I would get from it justify the cost, and perhaps more importantly, the time taken to learn to use it properly? Very hard to tell at the moment - I shall have to do some more reading. One problem is that I am not by nature an engineer. Artistic impressions are more in my line which is why I prefer working to smaller scales when you can get away with that approach. Still, it's always possible to learn something new.

Thanks,

Colin

[omra85]

Sonic, I have the Warco version of your lathe. For the odd job with smallish stuff it's great value for money.
The 'extra' bits like the vertical slide are well priced and allow you to expand your ability.
You even get used to the 'arm twiddling' to get the saddle along the bed 
A few good tipped tools and the world's your lobster (although probably with the eyes drilled in the wrong place) 

Danny
 

[Peter Fitness]

Will the amount of use I would get from it justify the cost,

Colin, when I bought my lathe, at a cost of A$900, my first job was to turn up 2 drive pulleys. When I proudly showed my handiwork to my wife, her comment was "Very nice, dear, and they only cost $450 each".  I explained that as I made more things, then the item cost would reduce proportionately. When that didn't appear to impress her, I said, "but it's also the satisfaction of making as much as possible myself, and that is priceless". I think (?) that was accepted 

Peter.

[Colin Bishop]

You have a very perceptive wife Peter. But I think your basic argument is right. nothing ventured, nothing gained. Anyway, what else would you have spent the money on?

Colin

[Peter Fitness]

what else would you have spent the money on?

Good point, Colin, I'll keep that as a reply for a future occasion. 

Peter.

[MCR]

I am using a micro mini lathe supplied by Chester it is slightly bigger than the normal offering came with DRO much more mass in the basic design needed to go on the steroid's to lift it!
Due to miss management with a face plate I did do damage to the plastic gears in the Head stock,while in California I made a visit to Pasadena and purchased metal replacement gears, tailstock lock ,saddle lock and carrage stop great additions to the lathe.
This is my first attempt at a real project. I am rather pleased to date. By the way I am sure that what ever lathe I had purchased it would not have been big enough or had the features I was looking for but in terms of money spent on hobby Vs money spent on family its a good deal

[Colin Bishop]

That's really impressive MCR. Way beyond what I had in mind which was just miscellaneous fittings etc. Obviously these lathes are pretty capable!

Colin

[MCR]

I have to say that I have had lots of help from a fellow club member which has illustrated that knowledge is far more important than the gear you use.
Without such help I would have been far more frustrated, best advice seek out those in your club with the KNOWLEGE.

[bogstandard]

Colin,

You mentioned that you already had a small lathe.

Sometimes, having a big all singing all dancing machine can get in the way of making what you really want to make.

Take a leaf out of watch and clockmakers books and go manual.

All those fancy shapes they use on clocks didn't use CNC, they were all done by hand.

Here are a couple of vids to watch

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=sr6sCnE-NsE

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=q6-4oyIoku4

So maybe your little plastic lathe can do the artistic things you want to do, rather than chasing a larger lathe.
For those who don't have a lathe or can't afford one, an old electric drill clamped to the bench can do the same sort of job. Just make up a rest out of a bit of angle iron, make yourself a basic graver and away you go.

I still go back to hand graving when I want to make something 'special'.

John

[Colin Bishop]

You are probably right John, I need to practise a bit more with the little one to become a bit more familiar with what it can and can't do. I've had it for years but never really got into it. Having been through the links that Bunkerbarge recommended it's clear that there is a steep learning curve to overcome and I'd need to be sure that the effort would pay off before committing myself.

Colin

[Bryan Young]

Odd that I've seen no mention of the offerings from Proxxon. Unless I missed it. I have the smaller of the 2 produced and am more than happy with it. Ideally I would have liked the larger one but as my workbench and the lathe storage cupboard are about 12' apart The lathe had to be portable. Try getting hold of the Proxxon catalogue. Lots of goodies and info. BY.

[Tankerman]

  Colin, as an alternative to some of the small lathes suggested so far I would like to draw your attention to this one:
  http://www.millhillsupplies.co.uk/package_prices.htm#LATHES
  It is a little bit pricey, American built and an accurate and easy to use lathe that is perfect for model-makers. I prefer it to the Unimat product.

  Chris

[Colin Bishop]

Thanks Chris but, as you say, it does look a bit pricey. Bryan, the cheapest Proxxon lathe I can find still costs over £700 - is that the one you have?

Colin

[Bryan Young]

Thanks Chris but, as you say, it does look a bit pricey. Bryan, the cheapest Proxxon lathe I can find still costs over £700 - is that the one you have?

Colin

Colin, (and others who may be interested) the price in my catalogue for the "little one" is around £600 ( 10% off if you are a member of TMBC!), and the bigger one is a tad over £1000. But to my little mind you are buying a quality product. Still would like the big one though! BY.

[Roger in France]

For all Proxxon equipment try,

www.letrainmagique.com

Based in Strasbourg, speaks French; German and English.  Good (very good) prices and excellent service.

Lathe PD 230/E  799€.

For me the postage is relatively cheap but I do not know what things would cost to UK.

Roger in France

[ian kennedy]

Hi chaps,

The lathe hunt continues, since sunday i have seen a Boxford AUD and a Chester comet vs lathe.

I liked the Boxford, but i think it may be to heavy for my needs, does anyone have experience of the Chester comet vs? It looks quite robust and fairly well equiped for my needs and i think it is a C4 type machine? mentioned on various mini lathe web sites. Is there anything in particular to watch out for on this manufacturers machine or are they good all rounders?

Cheers

Ian

[bogstandard]

Ian,

As previously stated, my US friend thinks the C4 is the best thing since sliced bread, and he has had a few lathes.

With all these lathes, usually they would require a good clean down as they usually come packed in a preservative grease. While being cleaned down, you should really give it a good going over and do a bit of final tweaking of the gibs. A lot of people try to use them straight out of the box and become irate when it doesn't perform as well as it should. That couple of hours spent on correct setup pays for itself over and over.

I have checked over a few places, and found that Warco don't seem to list the C4 clone, I just couldn't find one that matched.

The Axminster one

http://www.axminster.co.uk/sessionID/QOL/product-Axminster-SIEG-Axminster-SIEG-C4-Metal-Bench-Lathe-715020.htm

Works out at around £850 incl. shipping, with a standard basic tool holder, but you do get a cheapo steam engine kit thrown in.


The Chester one

http://www.chesteruk.net/store/comet_variable_speed_lathe_450mm.htm

Comes in at £700 with free shipping and free free quick change toolholder.

The difference in price is rather astounding for basically the same machine.

Ebay also throws up a few from about £740 all in up to well over £800

The difference in price would allow you to buy a few extras such as a 4 jaw independent, faceplate, a few more toolholders or steadies.

Have a look over the Chester forum to see what others think about the machine, or ask the question on there.

http://www.atfreeforum.com/chesteruk/


John