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[sinjon]

I am not sure what you call the ' protection between gun barrel and turret, but is there a good simple
way to model it.
Plasticine would seem to be ideal if you could add a hardener, any ideas please?
(the guns are static)
scale 1:128

Colin

[Colin Bishop]

It's called a blast bag. If it's not a big item you could try something like Milliput maybe...

Colin

[modelman66]

hmmmmm actually you can get a metal putty you mix the two components together it is very much like plasticine but sets rock hard ,you can drill,tap file and sand when cured http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_catalogId_10151_storeId_10001_partNumber_526616_langId_-1 

[Umi_Ryuzuki]

I used to take a bit of black nylon fabric, and cut about a 50-75mm square.
I would punch a hole in the center, and slide that over the gun barrel.
Then pull edges toward the barrel end. At this point I would then place a zip
tie around the cloth where the barrel passed through. The edges would then be
swept back over the zip tie toward the turret cover and the edges could be tucked
into the gun port.

Depending on the scale, a thin wire can be substitued for the zip tie to reduce the
ballooning at the leading edge. Just pull or push the bag till it is taught. Then adjust
the shape.

 

[sinjon]

Thanks chaps, its Monday morning and I have three way to go, will start with Halfords - its just down the road, but I quite like the black nylon approach, however the barrels are rather small, and my fingers rather chunky.
Blast bags Colin? can you explain why, I thought they were there just to keep the water out !

Colin

[Colin Bishop]

Blast bags are there for weather protection but they also serve the purpose of blocking back blast into the gunhouse through the gunports when the guns are fired which could interfere with the operation of the guns or even injure the crew. You also need to check the correct colour as the bags were made from different materials according to the period. During the WW1/WW2 era they were often of white painted canvas, hence my suggestion of Milliput (white version).

Have a look here: http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/Gun_Data.htm

Colin

[derekwarner]

Gents.... plastic bags may represent the protection used in modern small calliber gun mounts [with high recoil speeds]....but in previous years alternate methods were used

British Vickers 4"/5's had the gun mounting mantlet plates covered with Peredite X which was a forerunner of TEFLON

American FMC 5"/54 calliber had teflon coating on the mantlet plates

Both examples used a rubber bladder on the extremetry of the mantlet to mount interface to keep the water out......Derek

[sinjon]

Thank you Colin, hugely informative, I wonder why also 'bloomers' perhaps a navy joke!
With my Bismarck there seems to be choice - in some photographs of models they are white, some grey, some black, I will keep looking.
On the Missouri they do seem to be black.

Colin

[TCC]

On RN ships, they seem to be canvas and some come with wire stiffeners or support. I've just been reading about a turret officer in the Invincible? At Dogger Bank or Heligoland and he was getting blasted by spray over the bow and fro the hoses on the forecastle so that after a while, he had sore eyes. (he then learnt to duck when the fire gong sounded)

But he suggested in the after action report that they should fit 'canavs blast bags with wire stiffeners' as the inside of the turret was soaking and theer was no-where for the water to go. They had to bail it over a 'sea wall'? (2ft high?) and throw it down the turret trunking. He suggested a drain in one corner.

So what do they look like? well the unstiffened variety are just canavs cut to shape and laid from point to point and allowed to sag, with folds, whre they will. Most often, they are taughtish on top with a slight droop and there's a big belly underneath with mucho folds.

They have seems that run parallel to the barrels... so they [13.5" blast bags] are made from strips of canavs and, I suppose, they are sewn into a tube that narrows a touch. The 12" seem to be far simpler affairs with maybe 1 seem on the top and bottom but that's not an authoritive census of them.

QUEEN MARY is the only ship I've seen with transverse seems and they hold the bag out some and take the droop out of it, unless I happen to be looking at images of new bags on her?

Colour: they mostly seem to be painted white or black.

On LION, only the fore or abeam facing secondary guns had blast bags, those facing aft were naked. PRINCESS ROYAL seems to have all her secondary fitted so.

Actually, they're the subject of a nice mini-article.

[derekwarner]

As Colin notes....."On the Missouri they do seem to be black".......yes ....BB63 docked at HMA Garden Island Naval Dockyard in late 1987....[my work place] .......I was privileged to go on board & view the FWD triple 16" turret......amazing....each of the three [enclosed] gun emplacements within the turret had their own service elevators to lift each  projectile + the silk charged cordite bags - cupro nickle hydraulic system pipe work @ 560 PSI & naturally a fire retardant fluid 95/5? & all bright & shiny....courtesy of that great FMC corporation

At that period, those leather recoil bags were burnished black ....yes with "Jack Tar & Boot Polish"

Just to digress.... each triple 16" turret weighed approx 4000 tonnes....which was a similar to the total weight to each of our FFG or DDG destroyers....... .....Derek

[Ron1]

Here,s what they looked like on IRON DUKE 1916

[TCC]

Deggsie, the BB 63 was a spam ship, yes? Different navy old boy...

Ron's got the pic... showing the seems!