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Author Topic: RIVETS  (Read 3976 times)

kayechuk

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RIVETS
« on: February 25, 2009, 03:04:56 PM »

i am trying to apply rivets to a fiberglass hull.i am using a syringe and needle.i have tried various glues that start out okay,but when dry the have collapsed.any ideas would be appreciated on what glue or material to use,thanks <:(
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John W E

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2009, 03:13:57 PM »

hi  kayechuk

Have you  tried pva glue
This the funnel from HMS York  thousands of rivets on it
aye
bluebird
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boatmadman

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2009, 05:45:26 PM »

Try superglue gel.

Ian
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DickyD

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2009, 07:11:52 PM »

hi  kayechuk

Have you  tried pva glue
This the funnel from HMS York  thousands of rivets on it
aye
bluebird
Where do you get clear PVA from John ? {:-{
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Colin Bishop

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2009, 07:54:56 PM »

Doesn't PVA normally dry clear anyway?  {:-{

Colin
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John W E

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2009, 08:06:07 PM »

hi ya there

Colin, I think what Dicky is referring to - have a look at the Syringe - it is actually empty - all I do is dip the 'needle' of the syringe into the pva glue and then dab it onto the area I am working on.

I found that if I fill the syringe up with pva glue, it goes hard too quickly, inside the needle and one has to use excessive force to try and free the blockage from the needle.

Also, one hasnt much control over the amount of pva glue one is putting on the surface - so lot easier, as I have said, to just dip the end of the needle into the glue.

anyway, Mr Bishop - just cos you are now over to the dark side - no need to stop posting in Name that Ship  ok2 :-) I think Dicky needs your help now with the one on there at right now  %% %% {-) O0

aye
john e
bluebird
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Colin Bishop

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2009, 08:08:38 PM »

Quote
anyway, Mr Bishop - just cos you are now over to the dark side - no need to stop posting in Name that Ship 

I am following it John. But it's all obscure grey jobs at the moment.... :((

Colin
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Bunkerbarge

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #7 on: February 25, 2009, 09:11:13 PM »

When I put the rivets on the hull of the Ben Ain I tried samples of many different glues and found that the one that stood proud the best was cyano gel.  The trouble is that cyano soaks into fibre glass so putting blobs of gel straight onto a fibre glass hull will not work very well.

It makes a huge difference though if you spray the fibre glass hull with a primer such as car body primer first.  This seals the surface and the cyano then sits on top and forms a much better blob.
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Subculture

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2009, 10:42:12 PM »

JB weld mixed with a little a thixotropic additive makes for great rivets.

red181

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2009, 11:01:01 PM »

nice work Bluebird, you must be very patient, out of curiosity, how long would something like that funnel take?

there is always this:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=140298101029

not used it myself, a lazy mans way!! :D
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John W E

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #10 on: February 26, 2009, 08:12:53 PM »

well hi there, the funnel actually to make it from the material - took approximately one day - but the actual sticking of the rivets on - I have done these over 3-4 days - to stop meself going 'mad'.

aye - there is some riveting to do on the masts as well - but I am erring on hesitancy  - cos Ive just given the funnel a coat of paint and they dont show up unless they are in the right sort of light  :-))

so....the old thought goes through the mind, is it worth the hassel.  :-)) :-)) ;)

aye
john e
bluebird
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craftysod

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #11 on: February 26, 2009, 08:55:42 PM »

Why not try another method that has been mentioned before,when your missus aint around nick the pins from her sewing box,
put in hull/funnel etc spray with colour and plead ignorance
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andyn

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2009, 09:29:23 PM »

Why not try another method that has been mentioned before,when your missus aint around nick the pins from her sewing box,
put in hull/funnel etc spray with colour and plead ignorance

Just done that with my mums sewing stuff on a lifeboat for my Algerine  :-))
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Bryan Young

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2009, 04:57:53 PM »

I haven't seen it mentioned but surely the size (and protrusion) of rivet heads depends on the scale you are building at. At 1:48 scale they are barely perceptible, at 1:96 forget it. A rivet hed is not a lot over 1", standing proud a bit less than 1/2". On my ferry that is at 1:24 scale (1/2" = 1') this comes out at a trifle over 1/32". And I still think that oversize "rivets" look worse than no rivets at all. One of our club members has a Clyde Puffer with a commercial hull....and the "rivet" heads measure out at nearly 3" diameter. Looks ridiculous. BY.
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Arrow5

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2009, 05:13:33 PM »

The rivets on my Springer are about soup plate size when measured {-)
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John W E

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2009, 06:16:03 PM »

Bryan

Nice to see you’re are still banging the same drum but singing from the wrong hymn sheet  %) %) the majority of modellers, when they build a model either from scratch or kit, they build it for themselves NOBODY ELSE unless they are being paid for it.  So, therefore, the only person the model has to please is themselves – whether a small detail i.e. a slightly over scaled rivet/slightly large grating – will not bother the modeller.    He/she is enjoying building the model and sailing it.    He/she is also gaining experience by experimenting with different techniques – and one these techniques are mastered and they are comfortable with it – and it looks right to them – they, if they wish, can begin to worry about scale appearance.

So, rather than bag the old drum – about the scale – why not put some useful information in by explaining one or two methods that you may use!  Unless, you have left them in the shop!

Aye
John E
Bluebird
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DickyD

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2009, 06:24:35 PM »

Behave John   <*<

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Bryan Young

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2009, 10:03:47 PM »

Bryan

Nice to see you’re are still banging the same drum but singing from the wrong hymn sheet  %) %) the majority of modellers, when they build a model either from scratch or kit, they build it for themselves NOBODY ELSE unless they are being paid for it.  So, therefore, the only person the model has to please is themselves – whether a small detail i.e. a slightly over scaled rivet/slightly large grating – will not bother the modeller.    He/she is enjoying building the model and sailing it.    He/she is also gaining experience by experimenting with different techniques – and one these techniques are mastered and they are comfortable with it – and it looks right to them – they, if they wish, can begin to worry about scale appearance.

So, rather than bag the old drum – about the scale – why not put some useful information in by explaining one or two methods that you may use!  Unless, you have left them in the shop!

Aye
John E
Bluebird

John. give it rest..please. These snipes are becoming tiresome. Bryan.
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John W E

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2009, 04:32:04 AM »

remember we all have to give constructive, encouraging advice - that is what this Forum is all about - if you read the original opening topic - the gentleman is asking how we assimilate rivets not the scaling or whether they look right - but how we manufacture them.   As I say whether its up to scale - appearance is up to the individual to decide surely.
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #19 on: February 28, 2009, 07:11:56 AM »


                 :police:
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John W E

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #20 on: February 28, 2009, 09:39:10 AM »

 <*< <*< <*< <*< %) %) %) %) :} :} :} :} :-))
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Tom@Crewe

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #21 on: February 28, 2009, 10:07:08 AM »

I did it another way for my paddle tug.

The plan had the plating marked out so I took some 0.1 mm card cut out the plate shape. marked out the rivet portions then with a 1mm piece or metal rod rounded off at the end, on my cutting mat gently pushed in the card at the marked points. reversed the card and attached to hull with pva glue when whole thing finished sealed with pva glue thinned out and painted.
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SteamboatPhil

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #22 on: February 28, 2009, 12:03:52 PM »

I have to say the weathering looks really good too  :-))
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John W E

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #23 on: February 28, 2009, 12:38:30 PM »


hi there Tom

By, its a riveting build this one Tom, is there any chance of us seeing a couple of photographs of the full model.   We can then drool over it  :D :D {-) %%  Looks a lovely model from the pic of the bow.

aye
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TCC

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Re: RIVETS
« Reply #24 on: February 28, 2009, 01:48:35 PM »

I've just done some 'rivetting' to the top of a turret. I found PVA to be no good as it dries to nothing. Therefore, I next went with epoxy, mixed a little bit and applied with the pont of a cocktail stick. The first session and it went well, however, the rivets are diff sizes and some mishapes and diff spacing in there but it only took me 10 mins.

The second session I actually marked out where to put the rivets with pencil dots and I was more careful. But next day I found the epoxy had settled and the small raised dots had flattened into small flat circles that looked completely different to the first days... I had to cut them off.

The 3rd I took my time and just put a bit on and took pains to keep the line straight. These look great as they're all the same size, even spacing and they are all round headed and raised enough.

The moral of this is success, or not, I found is down to technique of applying the epoxy... you have to keep the footprint of a dab small and build it up while not applying to much mix.. or it'll settle like my 2nd session. So I'd practice on an off-cut of something and I'd get them right before before I worked on the actual item.

Re: scale. while Bryan is technically right, I think modellers have to create the impression that there are rivets there... it's about the look of the thing and the impression it creates over the technical sizes of things. That said, I do agree that huge rivets are more off-putting than none. IMHO.
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