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Author Topic: soldering joints  (Read 2213 times)

dan

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soldering joints
« on: April 08, 2009, 12:29:17 PM »

hi guys,
im about to solder some thin brass wire on a mast. how do i get a really strong joint with this solder, normally when i solder the joins fall apart very easily if they are knocked? so what should i do to over come this problem?
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Mark47

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2009, 12:58:29 PM »

hi guys,
im about to solder some thin brass wire on a mast. how do i get a really strong joint with this solder, normally when i solder the joins fall apart very easily if they are knocked? so what should i do to over come this problem?

Sounds like you could have dirt/grease on the joint before making the connection. Use very fine wet and dry on both areas to be soldered, then wash with pure alcohol, then handle as little as possible until joint has been made. :-))

It could be you have not got enough heat on the joint. Apply a little more heat by holding the iron on the joint for a further second or two. This can have its own down fall as heat can transfer along the brass and release other joints already completed. So make sure everything is taped/pinned securely down. :-))

You could just need a better soldering flux. Something like Bakers fluid is very popular on this forum. :-))

Mark
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dan

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2009, 01:00:38 PM »

cheers, mark ill give that a try
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Marks Model Bits

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2009, 01:30:12 PM »

If you are still having problems Dan, give me a shout and I will give you a crash course and show you how to do it.

Mark.
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dan

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2009, 03:00:47 PM »

thanks mark i might very well need your help.

i gave it a go and it went horribly wrong >>:-(. like mark47 said, my joined came undone because thy are so close together (most are 2mm apart) and my soldering iron died. so I'm tempted to just use some strong glue.  {:-{
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cos918

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2009, 05:55:11 PM »

were you have joints that are close to each other .One trick is to put a heat sink on the done joints ie a metal clip or two.This means it takes longer to heat up the done joint than the joint you are doing.

John
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dan

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2009, 07:15:46 PM »

hi john,
i was planning on doing that but there was not enough room to fit the clips on  {:-{
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wombat

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2009, 09:21:09 PM »

hi guys,
im about to solder some thin brass wire on a mast. how do i get a really strong joint with this solder, normally when i solder the joins fall apart very easily if they are knocked? so what should i do to over come this problem?

A few things - as already mentioned, for a good soldered joint you need to have cleanliness - both parts should be cleaned with fine wet & dry. Also use a decent rosin cored flux.

Also you need a good mechanical joint - clamp the pieces so they cannot move with respect to each other while you solder them - a slight movement especially when the solder is going through the "pasty" phase will ruin the joint, it will just fall apart.

Third thing is to get a good thermal contact between the two pieces - the temperature has to be enough to melt the solder over the two pieces - ensure the solder is flowing over both sufaces - sometimes if you don't heat one part enough, you will get a ball of solder over one part, but it has not actually flowed over the surface and there is a gap. Make sure the solder wets boths surfaces

Wom
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dan

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2009, 09:27:53 PM »

when i put solder on the iron before i touched the brass, like wombat said, it turned into a ball. then when i went to apply the solder to the brass it would not flow. is this because of the temperature?
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wombat

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2009, 09:50:41 PM »

sounds like the tip on the iron is dirty or oxidised - it needs to be tinned. With the iron hot, try dipping it in flux then wiping it off with a damp cloth. The bit should be bright and silver. when you put solder onto the bit it should flow not form a ball - if it is forming a ball you will not get a good joint. When soldering remember to wipe the bit frequently on a damp cloth or sponge to keep it clean.

It is possible that you have got the temperature too high and this is causing the tip to oxidise.

Wom
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dan

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2009, 09:55:08 PM »

hi wombat,
its a gas powered soldering iron so its quite hard to control the temperature. so I'm guessing it might be gettin too hot and oxidising, so ill buy a new soldering iron tomorrow hopefully and ill see if this makes a difference. thanks for the info as well  :-))
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malcolmfrary

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2009, 01:01:16 PM »

Apart from cleanliness, the other important thing is to make sure the iron not only gets hot enough, but stays that way while applying heat to the join.  This implies an iron with enough basic power and a tip big enough to transfer the heat very rapidly to allow you to get in and out before the heat applied travels to where it can do damage.
Most modern irons have an iron plated tip.  When the iron plating dies, the tip is effectively a deader.  It can be temporarily resurrected by filing and tinning, but the copper will eat away rapidly.  A new iron plated tip should never be cleaned with anything more vicious than a cloth or kitchen towel.  If an acid fluv is used, cleaning is even more important as hot acid will chew its way through the iron very rapidly.
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derekwarner

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2009, 04:17:51 PM »

Some good points here by others  O0

1) absolute cleanliness is 100% critical
2) Bakers soldering flux is an excellant agent [Zinc Chloride 400g/l]
3) remember the task is not to melt the solder.......but to get joint to the temperature where solder applied to the heated area will melt & flow
4) best not to mix resin cored solder & Zinc Chloride.......... so only use 60/40 solder
5) these little gas butane torches offer a great alternate to conventional soldering irons
6) larger material sections..to smaller material sections ......joints can be achieved due to the higher temperature & localised heat area  :-)  Derek
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Pat Matthews

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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2009, 06:19:19 PM »

As above:
1. Good mechanical joint... either large areas soldered together (lapped), or drill a hole for a wire, etc.
2. Clean, and use a paste flux.
3. pre-tinning both parts helps.
4. And if you really need strength, use real silver solder (jewelry grade, not that 3% electrical stuff). Requires a lot more heat and special flux.
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Re: soldering joints
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2009, 12:29:30 AM »

When you hit the hardware store ..and electronics shop's ..
look at the melting points of the solder or ask if you can obtain it ,visit the mfgr's website ..
I have been able to find a few different solder's that have different melting points ..start with the hottest and move to the coolest as work progress's
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