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Author Topic: Cheddar Models - Pelican  (Read 30867 times)

Solitary Sailor

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Cheddar Models - Pelican
« on: July 25, 2009, 05:10:21 pm »

Hi guys

I have an old steam engine, bought some time ago. I believe it to be a "Cheddar Models" Pelican twin oscillating steam engine with a vertical boiler. The boiler needs a couple of replacement parts, namely, a new sight water level tube, and both brass elbows which hold the glass tube. As I am hoping to get this working without having to buy a new boiler, any help would be most appreciated.

I think my next project, I would like to be steam powered. it is my understanding that the "Pelican would be suitable to power a boat up to 1100 mm length ... would this be correct. Possible model contenders would be "Mountfleets" "Cruiser". Suggestions welcome ... though not promising to listen  :}
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2009, 05:19:22 pm »

I guess a few pictures might help with identification   %)

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gondolier88

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2009, 05:26:10 pm »

Hi SolitarySailor,

You have a nice engine there- the best place to get a replacement glass would be Maccsteam-

http://www.maccsteam.com/Fittings/Fittings.html

My suggestion- Krick Alexandra open steam launch- you need to show a vertical boiler off, not hide it under a deck.

Happy hunting.

Greg
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2009, 05:26:13 pm »

Well, it would help if I had actually attached the photos  :embarrassed:
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gondolier88

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2009, 05:29:06 pm »

Ah, right- what you have here is the 'Puffin' marine plant, not the 'Pelican'.

You can power allsorts with this- recommend a Krick launch still, but the Victoria not the Alexandra.

See my build-

http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=16870.0

Greg
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2009, 05:35:09 pm »

Thanks Greg

Is this forum great or what ... post a question and get an instant answer  :-))

This boiler has not seen much use, and none in the last 8 years. I guess I should find somewhere to pressure test it ... maybe a welding supply business, as I doubt there are any model boiler manufacturing businesses local to South Florida, and I know a welding supply operator who does pressure testing on Oxygen and Nitrogen cylinders

Thanks again Greg
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gondolier88

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2009, 06:12:53 pm »

Hi,

Don't mention it mate.  ;)
US model engineering societies are even more keen on on boiler testing than ours- any of your local ones will have boiler testing facilities.

I should have looked at your location really- but being in the US it is probably in your interests to get freindly with Nick at Monahan Steam Models, he is in California- makes some of the best engines on the market and some good steam fittings- he may be able to help with the water gauge.

Out of interest, why do you need the whole gauge- would not just a new glass do?

Greg
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2009, 06:19:38 pm »

Hi Greg

Just had a look at your build thread, that's one very nice model.

Believe it or not,  once had the kit for Victoria, it was what I originally purchased the "Puffin" for (thanks for the correction  :-)  )

However, with the demise of a relationship gone stale, my model of Victoria, still in the box, had nowhere to live, and so was given away  <:(  Ah, what could have been ... should have been  :((

Now that there is no mrs, nor girlfriend, I get to do what I want  :-)) If things get a bit messy ... well, I'll clean it up when I'm done  :P

I do have two sons who live with me permanently, although their main concerns in life seems to be ... "Dad, what's to eat around here", and boy, can they get through food faster than it grows, (on the money tree of course).
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2009, 06:22:46 pm »

Greg

In answer to your question of the water gauge ..e is a photograph of the real damage. As you can see, the top fitting is probably OK, but the bottom is a goner.

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gondolier88

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2009, 06:32:24 pm »

What a shame, you could always get another..... O0 ;D

Yeah definitely a new water gauge!!

You might also want to think about getting a new safety valve- the ones supplied were a bad design when they were new- what condition that O-ring is in now who knows!!!

Greg
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bogstandard

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2009, 06:47:19 pm »

You can in fact get a good idea of when it was made just by a few clues.

First off, it is the early type of much sought after Puffin. It uses what they called 'investment castings' in the manufacture. These are very good and high quality bronze castings, and should last a lifetime if kept well oiled. My engine has at least a 1000 hours running time, maybe a lot more, and the castings show no signs of wear. The only wear items are the viton piston rings, and the bottom cylinder cover/piston rod bearing. Mine ran for half it's life before it required new ones making. The big ends seem to be bomb proof.

If you look at the close up side shot, you can see the springs that hold the cylinders against the faces. If you notice, there are two different types. The one on the left is a bronze spring and suffered from fracturing and distortion. The RHS has the later stainless replacement spring, which cured the problem. So I would suggest get a new pair of springs. It won't cause problems, but you might have a spring failure at an inopportune time.

The other clue is the pin sticking out of the rear crank disc. On later engines of this type, it is double the length of yours. This allowed the easy bolt on fitting of a small oscillating water pump.

The boiler you have is the early pattern one. A very good steamer, should be 5 to 6 minutes from cold to ready to go. It uses the earlier horizontally placed ceramic burner with piezo ignition. The burner suffered if any water went down the chimney from spurts from the oil/water condenser, or you overfilled the boiler allowing water to sit on top of the boiler, under the top cover and find its way down to the burner via the vertical boiler tubes while the boiler was cold. It made the ceramic burner top face disintegrate over time, and so become very inefficient.

I don't know if your boiler has the same fault as mine had with the sight glass fittings. I think they were made of an inferior grade of bronze, or even brass, and so corroded very badly. Luckily, my boiler bushes were large enough to re-tap to the next size up and correct bronze fittings fitted. As mentioned before, the safety valve is very basic, and uses an easily replaced viton o-ring. But it worked and worked well and never caused me any problems. It is still fitted to my old boiler.

Just a few clues give such a lot of information. If I remember rightly, sometime around the mid 80's to just a couple more years later at the latest.
I have had a few of this casting design Puffin thru my hands, but I still prefer the old version I have, which is the same as yours. Before the 'plant' became available as a set, you could buy the 'investment castings' kit under the name of 'Isis' I think, to make your own engine. £38 a set rings a bell.

I suppose one day it will become a collectors item.

Bogs


Bogs
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2009, 06:58:54 pm »

Thanks for that information Bogs

Don't suppose you'd happen to Know what the thread size is for those elbow fittings perchance?

I also have a feeling that should I try and unscrew the top fitting, that the same thing will happen to it. Yes, you are quite correct, the corrosion on these fittings was what did 'em in.

In thinking about it, I may have had this little setup, for longer than I originally thought, as I did purchase it new, though how long the local distributor had it in stock, I've no idea ... see what marriage, kids and divorce can do to a man's mind  <:(
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Proteus

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2009, 07:01:48 pm »

Gerry Watson ex Cheddar employee sells the bits you want and he will post to USA

http://stores.shop.ebay.co.uk/Clevedon-Steam__W0QQ_armrsZ1




Proteus
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #13 on: July 25, 2009, 07:09:31 pm »

Thanks Proteus

I guess I'd better start by stripping the engine down to see what else might be required. And it looks like it could do with a bit of tender loving care, to bring her back to life.  :-))
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Proteus

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2009, 07:11:16 pm »

Mark all the parts so they go back in the same place as some faces are bedded in inc cylinder bottoms etc



Proteus
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #15 on: July 25, 2009, 07:12:59 pm »

Thanks for that advise .. I'll just take it one piece at a time.
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gondolier88

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #16 on: July 25, 2009, 07:18:15 pm »

Water gauges are standard 1/4" X 40 ME thread.

Greg
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gondolier88

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #17 on: July 25, 2009, 07:27:01 pm »

By the way- to get the old fittings out without having to re-tap the boiler bushes-

1- Drill the fittings centrally to a diameter of around 4mm (3/16 inch)

2- Flux up a bit of brass rod 4mm diameter

3- Solder in the rod using soft solder- if you are careful to stop asd soon as the solde runs the boiler bush stays intact as silver solder melts at a much higher temperature

4- wait for the solder to solidify then spray liberally with WD40 while warm- this will penetrate the threads

5- get some mole grips or pliers and gently work the fitting loose- making sure that only linear force is applied, not a wiggling motion as you could fracture the bush joint. Apply GENTLE heat and spray more WD40 as you go.

Greg
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #18 on: July 25, 2009, 07:35:44 pm »

Thanks for the extra info Greg ... will give it a try


By the by, here is something I did before marriage  :-))

The only part I did not do was the crankshaft ... had that professionally done by a guy on the Kingston Road in S W London over 30 Years ago
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2009, 07:41:51 pm »

Some more

It's  a Stuart Turner Triple Expansion Marine Engine fro castings and blank steel ... believe it or not, a large percentage was made using an Emco Unimat 3 lathe, although it did do the headstock of the lath and the motor in by the time it was complete. It's never been run, so I have no idea if it works, although showing it to the gentleman who did the crankshaft for me, he was sure it would. It has just sat in its display case gathering dust, while marriage family and sundry necessities have driven life's course in opposite directions.  ok2
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gondolier88

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2009, 07:43:31 pm »

Oh thats beautiful!!! You need a lovely twin furnace scotch boiler and a tug to put that peice of engineering excellence in.

A truly wonderful engine.

Have you had it under steam?

Greg
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #21 on: July 25, 2009, 07:44:47 pm »

Last One

It never ceases to amaze me as what directions life's circumstances lead us to.
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gondolier88

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #22 on: July 25, 2009, 07:46:33 pm »

WOW I posted previous before I saw the other pics- thats one of the best examples i've ever seen- the proper feed and vacuum pumps complete with seperate cylinder pressure gauges so the engineer could see if the engine was truly working expansively.
 :o :o :o :o
It is SUCH a shame to have it static- they need to be run to be truly enjoyed.

Greg
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Solitary Sailor

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #23 on: July 25, 2009, 07:53:32 pm »

I guess I'm bragging a bit, but finishing this model was one of the proudest moments of my life ... yes yes, I know ... little things for little minds. But believe me, it took a lot of hours, and I have No formal training in engineering .. None whatsoever. Though Like you Greg, as I believe you mentioned somewhere, I'm in the service trade industry, although the opposite end to you ... I do air conditioning, as an independent contractor.

As I said, this model I did over 30 years ago, and never done anything like it since. Again, that's what marriage and family does to you   {:-{
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bogstandard

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Re: Cheddar Models - Pelican
« Reply #24 on: July 25, 2009, 07:59:33 pm »

I think you will find that the top boiler fitting shouldn't be the same sort of problem. The problem I think was caused by leaving a little water in the boiler at the end of each run.

I tried every which way to get the bit out without damaging the thread, but the thread was shot as well. But as I said, there was enough meat on my bushes to go up a size.

The first statement above, about leaving water in the boiler, is a very good excuse for fitting a sight glass with a blowdown valve on the bottom, as the only other ways to remove the water would be to use a long syringe or turn the boat upside down. Not the sorts of things you want to do after a days sailing, and waiting for the boiler to cool down. It will also allow you to get a good reading on the sight glass, because as it was, it couldn't be trusted to give an accurate display of the level whilst steaming, by doing a quick blowdown restored the accurate sight level.

Bogs
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