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Author Topic: vintage electric motor  (Read 15104 times)

elvis

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vintage electric motor
« on: November 17, 2009, 04:34:04 pm »

hi all.
i have for sale a vintage electric motor.i have had this for the last 29 years.
the motor is 90mm long x60mm tal x 110mm wide. it as a 6mm drive shaft coming out of both ends and as 2 square coils on the outside of the armature. it is a fully open frame and i cannot find a name on the motor.
£10 plus £3 postage.
thanks
elvis
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elvis

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2009, 04:51:44 pm »

sorry forgot to upload a picture
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garston1

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2009, 05:27:51 pm »

Hiya, it sounds like a vintage Taycol to me  :-))
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elvis

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2009, 05:29:56 pm »

hi there.
will put a picture up soon.
thanks
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Vintage

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2009, 05:51:04 pm »

it sounds like a vintage Taycol to me  :-))
Yep - almost certainly a Taycol "Supermarine" or "Supermarine Special".

The name should be stamped into one of the paxolin end plates  :-))

Mark.
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2009, 06:17:13 pm »

 :-)
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Colin Bishop

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2009, 06:32:19 pm »

I think it's the Supermarine Double Special - there was one on display at Warwick.

Colin
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Wasyl

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2009, 07:29:30 pm »

Hiya, it sounds like a vintage Taycol to me

Well done Martin,and that was before the pic, :-)) :-))
even with the pic,i did,nt have a clue,I thought it was one of them things that was used to fiddle electricity, {:-{

Wullie
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des321

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2009, 09:57:06 pm »

Thanks for the pictures. I now realise I have a Taycol Meteor. I took it out of a boat that came back to me a couple of years ago. I originally built it 50 years ago and recently re-furbished the entire boat and fitted a new motor. I think I will have to find out if the Meteor still works, and if so re-use it.
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Colin Bishop

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2009, 10:14:06 pm »

It may not be a Meteor. The Meteor, Asteroid, Torpedo andTarget all looked very similar. The Asteroid and Meteor were fitted with reversing switches.

Colin
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tony23

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2009, 11:19:43 pm »




I thought it was one of them things that was used to fiddle electricity, {:-{

Wullie

how do you know about them then  :} :} :} :embarrassed:
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dodgy geezer

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2009, 11:26:56 pm »

I'd be interested in that motor - PM has gone out
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Wasyl

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2009, 11:57:51 pm »

how do you know about them then

Thats for me to know,and you to find out {-) {-) {-) {-)

I used to work in  Property Maintenace, and came accross all sorts of weird and wonderful gadgets,that were made in order to steal electricity and gas,one of the crudest has to be...a 6in nail with a 2.5mm cable attached and some halfwit had driven the nail through a mains cable crude but effective...free electricity,another was when some unscrupulous tennants removed the gas meter,and connected a hose on to the inlet pipe then linked it to their cooker, %%

Wullie
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elvis

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2009, 06:58:41 am »

sold pending payment.
thanks
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elvis

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2009, 01:50:57 pm »

hi all
well back on line after the floods.
a few bridges missing and a lot of diversions and very slow driving any place, but we got lucky this time and the water missed use.
but still thinking of all the others it got. (we had it bad 4yrs ago)
hope dg got the motor ok.
all the best
elvis
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dodgy geezer

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2009, 05:39:21 pm »

Elvis is back in the building!

Good to hear you and yours are well. Motor received and fine at this end - now I need to build a 1960s hull to put it in, and research how to use a modern speed controller with a field-wound motor....
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kiwimodeller

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #16 on: December 06, 2009, 09:49:04 am »

D.G. I suggest you have a look at the Sea Queen copy that Jotika now sell. I have an original 1960 Sea Queen with the Taycol Double Special in it. It has a 12volt 7AH sealed battery and still needs a bit more lead ballast as well. It will run well over an hour before there is any drop off in performance with that size of battery and you could put a second battery in if you want as there is plenty of room. I run modern radio control with an Electronize 15amp speed control operating through a bridge rectifier so it only reverses the current to the fields not the armature. I can dig out a wiring drawing if you need it. Hope this helps, Ian.
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dodgy geezer

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #17 on: December 06, 2009, 10:41:40 am »

I run modern radio control with an Electronize 15amp speed control operating through a bridge rectifier so it only reverses the current to the fields not the armature. I can dig out a wiring drawing if you need it.

A rectifier? That's intriguing. I had assumed I would use up a channel for a reversing switch. Yes, a circuit diagram would be very interesting, if you have something readily available....
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kiwimodeller

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2009, 10:10:19 am »

I was helped by members of this forum several years ago (A search of old postings on Taycols might help) and by a local TV repairman who produced the rectifier out of an old TV. I remember it had +ve and -ve terminals and two with wave symbols beside them. I will have another look at the boat and find the diagram in the next day or two. I also had to do a fair bit of work to suppress the Taycol RF. I have an earth from the motor frame to the prop shaft, capacitors between the terminals and from the terminals to the motor fram and Ferrites on the leads. All the info on what to do is available as a very good downloadable article on RF Suppression from the website of Model Solutions of Canada who are listed in the Mayhem Traders Directory section. The link is http://modelsolutions.ca/articles.htm Hope this helps, cheers, Ian
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kiwimodeller

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #19 on: December 09, 2009, 08:41:13 am »

I do not have the facilities or skills to do a drawing and scan it to the forum so will just have to try and describe the connections as best I can. Looking at the motor from the terminal end one lead from the speed controller goes to the terminal at top left marked Bat The other lead from the speed controller goes to one of the terminals on the rectifier which has a wave symbol beside it. Leads from the +ve and -ve terminals of the rectifier go to the two terminals on the motor in the top right hand corner marked Rev and Forward. If the motor runs the wrong way when the control is pushed to forward reverse these wires. The rectifier has on it BA60  C7K but I believe that almost any rectifier will do. The above applies to the Supermarine Double Special, I think from memory that there were a couple of other connector plates between other terminals on some of the motors that had to be removed to separate field and armature windings. I also remember at one stage setting up a Supermarine (not the Double Special like you have) using all four connections frm the rectifier. I have just found some more drawings so could help with connections for the Supermarine and Special if needed. Hope this helps, let me know how you get on. Cheers, Ian.
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dodgy geezer

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #20 on: December 09, 2009, 10:39:36 am »

Thanks, Kiwi, there's a lot there and your explanation is good. I can now understand how the idea works.

I think BA60 is a general Bridge Rectifier number - you will need to get one which can take the voltage and amperage. 12v is probably no problem - most will take that, but I don't know what the max amps are likely to be....

I do not understand the difference between the Supermarine and the Supermarine Double Special. In my collection so far I have a Meteor and a Standard, but this is the first big motor I have. I note that some pictures show the big twin-coil motor with brushes working from the side, and some working axially - also some motors have a one-pole reverse connector. Mine has axial brushes and no one-pole reverse. It has two connector plates to join the field windings to the brush windings.

I have sketched up a couple of simple drawings using Paint to illustrate what I think is happening. The first shows a rectifier in normal use - an AC supply is connected across two terminals, and DC (with a lot of ripple!) comes out of the other two. As the AC supply switches polarity, the polarity of the DC output remains the same.

The second sketch shows a field-wound motor connected to a brushed speed controller with reverse facility. The speed controller can change polarity, just like the AC supply (though not so often!). When it does, the polarity fed to the field coils will change. But the feed to the brushes, coming off the rectifier, will not change. This is the correct situation for a field-wound motor to reverse rotation....
 
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Vintage

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #21 on: December 09, 2009, 12:41:51 pm »

Hi DG


I do not understand the difference between the Supermarine and the Supermarine Double Special.
 

From an old catalogue it states:-  "The Supermarine Special has the same electrical & other characteristics & dimensions as the Supermarine. The essential difference is in the modified terminal arrangement by which radio or remote control may be operated through a single pole change-over switch or relay, instead of the double-pole".

I know others have said, earlier in the thread, that your motor is a "Supermarine Double Special" but I'd be interested to know if it has that stamped into the paxolin end plate? I have one here & it's considerably larger than the one shown in the photos above, I'll post images if you're interested.

Mark.
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dodgy geezer

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #22 on: December 09, 2009, 02:39:26 pm »

Hi DG

From an old catalogue it states:-  "The Supermarine Special has the same electrical & other characteristics & dimensions as the Supermarine. The essential difference is in the modified terminal arrangement by which radio or remote control may be operated through a single pole change-over switch or relay, instead of the double-pole".

I know others have said, earlier in the thread, that your motor is a "Supermarine Double Special" but I'd be interested to know if it has that stamped into the paxolin end plate? I have one here & it's considerably larger than the one shown in the photos above, I'll post images if you're interested.

Mark.

Vintage - yes, I would be very interested in your pictures, and also any old catalogue data (scans...?) you may have. I would like to get a larger collection of Taycols, but have no comprehensive list of the motors and their charachteristics. I believe there was an 'Asteroid', and a 'Comet', which has a permanent magnet...

As you may have noted, I have avoided naming the motor I recently obtained from Elvis (thanks, mate!) because I am not sure of the name. I always thought that there was a difference between the 'Supermarine' and the 'Double Special' which I thought were two different motors. The motor I have does not have single-pole reverse (though the paxolin end-plate is drilled for an extra terminal which would probably be part of that upgrade. Interestingly, my Meteor and Standard both have single-pole reverse...

None of my motors have anything stamped into the paxolin - paxolin is not a good material for stamping. My Standard and Meteor both have their respective names stamped into the long brass mounting angle strip attached to the end-plate - the larger motor only has small brass mounts and has no name stamping of any kind anywhere. 
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Colin Bishop

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #23 on: December 09, 2009, 03:51:37 pm »

The Double Special was a more powerful version of the Supermarine Special, it also had single pole switch reversing and was rated 4.5 to 6.5 amps as against 2.5 to 5 amps for the SS.

This photo was taken at the Warwick show.

Colin
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dodgy geezer

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Re: vintage electric motor
« Reply #24 on: December 09, 2009, 04:24:18 pm »

So the designation 'Special' refers to the single-pole reverse? That suggests that there might exist:

a 'Supermarine'
a 'Supermarine Special'
a 'Double'
a 'Double Special'

I have seen a picture somewhere of a large Taycol motor with a conventional 'drum' brush set, rather than the flat plate which all my motors have. Could this be the 'Double'? Since the one I have (picture at the top of this thread) has no single-pole reverse, I suspect it is a 'Supermarine', but there is no name mark actually on the motor...
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