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Author Topic: Stuart D10 question  (Read 10466 times)

benjaml1

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Stuart D10 question
« on: November 28, 2009, 11:34:12 am »
Hello, I have just received my D10 which was purchased on e-bay & was assured that it was well machined. I find that the crankshaft wobbles +/- 1.5mm on the flywheel end & +/-0.5 mm on the drive end. My question is ( although I think I already know the answer) is: Is this normal ???  The crankshaft is built up, not one piece....
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SteamboatPhil

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2009, 02:58:48 pm »
No its not normal (which I think you guessed). One option would to be remove the bearings (which may well be brass), check the crankshaft dia, bore out the bearings and sleve (with phoz bronze). You may well want to check the centre bearing as well, although that one will be quite tricky to do something with.
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2009, 03:12:01 pm »
Looks like the crank is made up of shafts & webs. The drive side mains & big ends being silver soldered & the flywheel drive component being attached by pinning, aggrevating the "wobble". If the gentleman doesn't accept returns, looks like I'm going to have to pull this thing apart & get it like I want....

OH! the reversing mechanism doesn't work either but I think that's just a matter of timing.
Do you think I should insist that he accepts it back ? It was advertised as reversing" which it won't do.... My first poor result on e-bay after 112 transactions... Hey Ho !!

Thanks for your input ......
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Engineman

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #3 on: November 28, 2009, 03:41:49 pm »
Possiibly the engine can be repaired by simple replacing of the journal bearings with new ones. I am strongly recommend to check the crankshaft for alignment as well.
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MCR

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #4 on: November 28, 2009, 03:58:16 pm »
I purchased a boiler from Ebay which turned out to be soft soldered and painted to cover up the fact  <*<I had no other choice than to take a saw to it (see my other thread). I hope this is not the case with you.
Mark
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #5 on: November 28, 2009, 04:09:44 pm »
As for the crank & bearings, do Stuart sell these as machined parts or just blanks ? Lots of good advice Thanks.... :-))
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Engineman

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #6 on: November 28, 2009, 05:50:29 pm »
Not sure about STUART, but check this: http://www.miniaturesteammodels.com/category199_1.htm
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #7 on: November 28, 2009, 05:56:23 pm »
Thanks for the support....  :-)) No pun intended...  :embarrassed:
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flashtwo

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #8 on: November 28, 2009, 06:16:08 pm »
Hi,

See here for D10 spares:-

http://www.stuartmodels.com/part_cat.cfm?cat=3

Having machined a D10 recently, I think it is the brass extrusion BX480 that is basis of the bearings. Obviously it will require machining and the centre bearing is split.

You will have to enquire with Stuarts if they can supply one ready machined.

Ian G.
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #9 on: November 28, 2009, 06:22:52 pm »
Thanks for that..

I have sent an e-mail to the gentleman & if no luck I will persue it through e-bay & paypal. He advertised it as a reversible engine when in fact it it doesn't reverse. I think I have him there. If not, looks like I'm going back on the lathe.. Been a while...  %)
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flashtwo

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2009, 06:39:17 pm »
Hi,

I recently had trouble with my D10 not reversing reliably . It was caused by too much slack between the slide valve nut and and the valve rod. I found that I had cut the valve rod thread too deeply by not opening out the die sufficiently.

I remade two new valve rods and adjusted the timing. Then I had trouble with the valves not seating properly and letting by. I filed the valve nuts to have more rounded corners and this gave the valve some movement perpendicular to the valve face, but not compromising the vertical tightness. Again I adjusted the timing and the engine reversing is now very reliable.

The eccentrics need to be correctly positioned and locked onto the drive shaft for the timing to be correct and also the linkages from the Stephenson's linkage must also be adjusted for length.

Have you a copy of Stuarts "How to build a vertical engine". It is the workshop manual for the engine and explains step-by-step how to construct and time the engine- its well worth having.

Ian G.
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2009, 06:43:38 pm »
I don't have a copy but it looks like it's on my Christmas list.  Again, many thanks...  :-))
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SteamboatPhil

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2009, 06:52:17 pm »
I would also check that if Stuarts do a machined crankshaft the diameter, as the bearings on your engine may have been made to a different size to the Stuart drawings.
Well worth persevering with the engine though.  :-))
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #13 on: November 28, 2009, 06:57:53 pm »
Got a drawing coming & some questions in on their help desk.... I'm an excellent machinist, well ....I used to be before the autumn of years sullied my vision..  :embarrassed:
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Vintage

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2009, 07:21:52 pm »
If it wasn't as advertised then tell the guy that you're returning it  :-)) I certainly wouldn't want to start rebuilding something that was badly machined.

He has an obligation, regardless of his returns policy, to refund your money if it wasn't "as described".

eBay changed their feedback system sometime ago - it's now no longer possible for the vendor to leave negative feedback for a buyer.

Good luck!

Mark.
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #15 on: November 28, 2009, 07:30:22 pm »
I feel the same way & am awaiting his return e-mail ( trying to be nice.) The engine needs a lot of work but it's always a gamble when you purchase something hand made on e-bay. Still going with a D10 though. If not this one, another...
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #16 on: November 29, 2009, 01:16:41 am »
Thank you for the reality check Mark. Upon close examination the engine is a bag of nails. I paid premium for this because of the description. " Good workmanship", "Reversible". Pictures tell a story but not in finite detail. Sadly people like these give e-bay a bad name. It isn't what is said, it is what isn't said that is the problem. I have learned a lesson & that is to ask question after question until satisfied...Then it's still a gamble but at least you have the written recorded comment to fall back on...

Great forum, great site, thank you all for your comments & support....
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Underpressure

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #17 on: November 29, 2009, 10:05:42 am »
There are those who unfortunately use Ebay as a dumping ground. I have heard this said in the world of Brit Motorcycles "this carb is rubbish, I'll stick on Ebay" and the like.

I hope you get everything sorted out.

Neil
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Inkmark

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #18 on: November 29, 2009, 11:52:34 am »
Hi Guys
I built a D10 from a machined parts kit many years ago and the crankshaft flexed from day one.
True not by a great deal but with time it will only get worse.
I mounted a bearing outboard of the flywheel such that it was supported both sides, seemed to make matters a bit better.
Model long gone but the thread has nudged me to go find the D10 in the loft and see what its like now.

Cheers
Mark
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #19 on: November 29, 2009, 12:53:09 pm »
The Gentleman ( note.. capital G) has contacted my with a sincere apology & offered the engine at half my purchase price ( which I turned down.) My quest continues & my faith in mankind restored.  :-))
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Vintage

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #20 on: November 29, 2009, 03:10:00 pm »
I like a happy ending   :-)

Seriously though, there's nothing worse than trying to rectify someone else's mistakes - particularly when you've bought an item in good faith & on the understanding it needs little or no work....

I'm glad you received the response, from the vendor, that you did - they're not all crooks & he, in all probability, was unaware of the issues.

Good luck finding another  :-))

Mark.

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Circlip

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #21 on: November 29, 2009, 06:10:43 pm »
Trouble is with Fleecebay is that ANY lump of patinered brass is "Vintage" and any steam engine is usually "Stuart" (Most being OWNED by someone called Stuart). Did the boiler have a test cert Mark?? yes it did look good, but how many are painted?  The pedigree of lots of steam bits can be assesed from the adverts "Found" in a collection, "Don't know what it is but" and sellers other item lists. If it ain't new, caviat emptor.

  Although Paypal has a bad reputation in some quarters, it does lean in favour of the purchaser.

  Regards  Ian
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Underpressure

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #22 on: November 29, 2009, 08:14:19 pm »
The trouble is that almost anything 'steam' is selling at present, and at top prices too.

I have bid on a number of items recently and the final price has been way above what I would pay. I have even seen items selling above the price that something similar could be bought new.

Ebay Translations: Vintage = Rusty and covered in dust
                          Rare = You will find eight more of these on Ebay
                          Built by an Engineer = Thrown together in a damp shed by my mate
                          Built by my late uncle / father /relative = Thrown together in a damp shed by my mate
                          I don't know anything about this = I know exactly what this is, but I'm assuming you don't.

Neil
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #23 on: November 29, 2009, 10:16:06 pm »
Well...You're are all gonna hate me for this. Tired of flaccid crankshafts, leaking glands & dubious workmanship I am now the proud owner of a Stuart Turner "Sun" engine. Well actually it's a complete NOS factory machined kit as built by Stuart Turner no less. Little bit of surface rust here & there but should clean up nicely. 180 deg crank may require some kind of self starting mechanism ( my question to the panel ?)  but it has a lot less moving parts to go wrong & is "right" for my scale model boat. Not so mesmerizing as the watch like mechanisms of the D10, Launch & Compound/Triple expansion but it will get her down the pond.

It will take a few weeks to get here but watch this space..  :-)
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benjaml1

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Re: Stuart D10 question
« Reply #24 on: December 01, 2009, 02:05:04 pm »
FULL refund received, nice to see that quality people still exist out there.... :-))
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