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Author Topic: Stud extractors  (Read 3634 times)

funtimefrankie

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Stud extractors
« on: December 20, 2009, 04:41:32 pm »

Well, my daughter rang up for me to get her some heater coils for her Corsa diesel..... 41.
"when you bring can you fit them?"...
new 8mm long reach socket and 3/8"  T bar to fit 8....
40 mile round trip plus the Mersey Tunnel toll...

Settle down in the sleet and wind and the first on snaps off, leaving it flush with the head...the other three went Ok, but it didn't seem to start too well after.

Anyway whats the best way to get the remains out.......... are those stud extractors any good? OR am I better sending her to a garage ????
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justboatonic

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2009, 05:02:21 pm »

Its a question of will you make a bad job worse by using a stud extractor! If its snapped of I'd say its pretty much seized up. Think I'd be inclined to use a garage.
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riggers24

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2009, 06:02:42 pm »

If you haven't used them before I would send her along to the garage. The amount of damage I have seen done to parts at work by people who think they know how to use them is frightening.
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John W E

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2009, 06:18:59 pm »

Hi there Funtimefrankie

If you have never used stud extractors before; it may pay you to send the car to the garage - as has been suggested - stud extractors are great when used properly - meaning that one has to drill a hole, through the centre of the stud/or, in your case the heater coil, leaving a thin threaded shell left in the hole.   This is where the stud extractor is screwed into the hole which you have drilled, the strud extractor being of the opposite hand thread to the stud & therefore removing it.

However, if you drill all the way through the heater coil by accident you will put debris inside the cylinder - and therefore you will have to remove the cylinder head to clean it out.   So the decision is yours as they say - but good luck with it.

aye
john e
bluebird
 
  oh happy days.........long gone.......been there done it......... oh .......... glad of garages nowadays  %% {-) O0
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sheerline

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #4 on: December 20, 2009, 06:51:44 pm »

As Bluebird says, you will end up with swarf inside the cylinder, You may get lucky, if you get the stump out and fit a new heater coil all may be ok and the swarf may blow out when the engine runs but it could damage the engine if it gets lodged between the piston crown and the bore. It can embed itself in the alloy piston and scratch the bore if it stays there... not good.
I would seriously suggest you get suitable advice on this, but it may be costly to rectify.
One possible way of eliminating the swarf problem would be to remove an injector and put an airline into the cylinder and apply positivee pressure, this would blow the swarf out as you drilled but it's not guaranteed.
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Shipmate60

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2009, 07:00:18 pm »

The heaters should be in the inlet manifold so not that bad a job to take off the manifold.

Bob
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funtimefrankie

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #6 on: December 20, 2009, 07:30:18 pm »

I'm pretty sure it's in the head not the manifold.

There is a hole in the centre so it could be used as a pilot.........
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RickF

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2009, 11:55:31 pm »

The theory of stud extractors is fine - the practice is not. In effect you are drilling a hole in a stud that is seized in its thread, then inserting a tapered tool that is going to grip the stud ... and expand it! in nearly 50 years of bodging I've never made one work properly.

My usual solution on old engines is to drill out as big as possible, attempt to remove the residue and try to recover the threaded hole with a tapered tap. If this fails then it's a stepped stud. I guess that that is not possible in your case, so heating the block is probably the best option.

Rick
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Wasyl

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2009, 04:00:52 pm »

Any chance you can apply some heat, i.e. good plumbers gas torch ,would do,then drill pilot hole, you can judge how far to go by looking at an old one, then fit extractor then apply heat then turn,

Wullie
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hopeitfloats

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #9 on: December 22, 2009, 08:46:28 am »

if there is a chance of drilling into the cyl head put grease or cutting compound on the drill bit. that will catch the swarf but obviously its better not to get that far.   i am going against the general consensus here by adding that i  rarely have trouble extracting studs with an extractor.  if you decide to do it get a good quality extractor. some of the cheap ones wont grip and they definately dont like too much heat. usually the extractor will have stamped on it which size drill bit to use to.
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Martin [Admin]

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Marks Model Bits

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2009, 09:51:55 am »

I had a similar problem that came into the garage where I used to work, but it was a snapped spark plug.
I got the seized, snapped off end out of the head by using a large, flat bladed screwdriver with a hex at the top of the shaft, it was tapped into what was left of the spark plug body and at the same time the screwdriver turned with a spanner (2 person job) The tapping easily loosened the siezed thread and the remains of the plug were in the scrap bin in less than 5 minutes. The swarf that went inside the cylinder was removed using a strong magnet which was attached to a piece of copper wire.
Worked for me !!!!

Mark.
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Circlip

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2009, 09:56:22 am »

You've probably got it sorted by now Frankie but the extractors that rely on twisting into a pre drilled hole will expand the "Tube" generated by drilling. Hindsight I know but you should have heated the engine before attempting to change them. Hope you fitted the new ones with a doseing of Copper-Slip??

  The first Vid on u tube hardly warrants an extractor as a reverse cutting drill (Yes they do make them) would have spun the threaded bit out, sheared by overtightening.

   Without recourse to garage services, the only way you might have success is by attacking with a blowlamp and copious ammounts of penetrating fluid and using a straight bladed screwdriver in the hole. Heat is the key as shown on the last Vid.

  Ahh, the joys of motoring, winter every time.

  Regards   Ian.

 Straight from the horses mouth, Mark and I typing at the same time. O0
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nemesis

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2009, 05:38:53 pm »

Hi, Sorry to be a killjoy but you may end up getting a new head
                                             Nemesis
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sheerline

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #14 on: December 22, 2009, 09:29:25 pm »

I avoided saying that, it's Christmas you know and we don't want people depressed.
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Shipmate60

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #15 on: December 22, 2009, 09:53:24 pm »

Which Engine is fitted to the Corsa.

Bob
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Wasyl

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #16 on: December 22, 2009, 11:12:26 pm »

A Diesel I suspect {-)

Wullie
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funtimefrankie

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #17 on: December 23, 2009, 09:42:52 am »

It's a 2004 1.2 diesel, I think its really nearer 1300cc....

I've not had a report back as to how it starts on three heaters, if it's good enough I'll leave well alone...
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Wasyl

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #18 on: December 23, 2009, 11:10:54 am »

It,ll start on 3,just wait approx 5/10 seconds after the light goes out,the heater plugs are at their hottest, then turn the key,obviously you,ll have unburnt fuel in the dead pot but after a minute or two it will be ok,

Wullie
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funtimefrankie

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #19 on: December 23, 2009, 11:03:39 pm »

The latest is, she's getting in a proper man to look at :-))
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nemesis

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #20 on: December 28, 2009, 04:43:45 pm »

Hi, Keep us posted as to the outcome, as my mate is a mechanic he says that this job is the pits
    & what he says about designers can not be printed here,
                                                          Nemesis
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malcolmfrary

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #21 on: December 29, 2009, 10:45:37 am »

Hi, Keep us posted as to the outcome, as my mate is a mechanic he says that this job is the pits
    & what he says about designers can not be printed here,
                                                          Nemesis
How true.  All designers ought to be made to actually work on their creations.
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kiwi

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #22 on: December 29, 2009, 11:03:00 am »

Hi,
As a mature age designer I totally agree. You wouldn't believe what I can design & draw, but you could never build it, even though the computer says its ok. To much sitting on their young arses, in airconditioned comfort, and most never see what it is they have designed. By the time their design hits the populous, they are well into the next throw-away-design to replace it. Not designed to be fixed, throw-away-and-buy-a-new-one. No thought (engage brain style), but its computer designed, so must be right. Little do they know (or care) that the computer is just a fancy pencil (with the same brains as the pencil), and its the body pushing the pencil which should be doing all the thinking, and talking to the poor guys who have to build and repair said item of machinery.
Not my scene anymore. Prefer the age of built-to-last, and easy to work-on-IF-something-does-go-wrong.
That's progress, so they tell me. Whinge over.
Now back to my model boats
kiwi
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Circlip

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #23 on: December 29, 2009, 11:41:18 am »

It's a sad reflection and as an old F*rt used to "Fixing" things rather than landfill, how many would drag a tape recorder with a mains converter and BIG batteries behind them wearing a pair of WW2 Ex USAF headphones down the high street to keep oneself entertained??   %)

   Regards  Ian.
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funtimefrankie

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Re: Stud extractors
« Reply #24 on: February 24, 2010, 07:44:57 pm »

The offending part has now been extracted for 40. Not sure if the new heater plug(s) has helped the cold starting, she's been told there something wrong with the fuel pump pressures.
Anyway she's being made redundant next month so she might have to sell it.
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