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Author Topic: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!  (Read 49606 times)

Flying Sparks

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #50 on: February 24, 2010, 08:02:12 pm »

Hi Red, Ah, I see what you mean now, trade acceleration for top speed. If it was an aeroplane more prop pitch would give you more top speed but less acceleration, I would guess that a boat is the same. But then it would pull more amps so less duration. How many amps are you running at? I know you have a 120A esc but what is your motor rated at?

Phil.
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #51 on: March 07, 2010, 11:14:55 pm »

Hi Phil, sorry for late reply, only just realised we have crawled onto page 2! Its a 65amp motor, but now running  a 2:1 gear ratio.

The whole lipo thing is a but of a pain, they have to be handled with such care. I have a lipo low voltage warning on both packs, but they seem a bit over zealous and kind of put you off when jabbing the throttle. Under full load they say the cells are over discharged, but after a run they test fine and have not got near the low voltage, also the esc has a low voltage safeguard, you just seem to be worrying about them all the time, whereas nimhs, you can run till flat. Later in year when the boat has some mileage behind it I want to get two 12v nimh packs and run on 24v, just to see what the difference is  like, so if anyone in the Wirral area has 2 good high ah nimh pack I can blast................ :embarrassed:

If it runs the same length of time, and same sort of speed, I will ditch the lipos, they seem to be more trouble than they are worth!
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Flying Sparks

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #52 on: March 08, 2010, 07:45:46 am »

I use Lipos in all of my aeroplanes but I don't rely on the low voltage cut off to end the flight, I always fly using a countdown timer. With a new model after a flight I then recharge the Lipo making a mental not of how much I put back into the pack and after a few flights I the have an idea of how long I can fly for. I treat the packs very conservatively trying to use no more than about 75% of the rated capacity. The great thing with Lipos is you can charge ready for use as they don't self discharge unlike nimh that need to be charged soon before use. I do agree though that nimh can be abused a lot more without giving problems and they make better balast!

Phil.
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #53 on: March 19, 2010, 01:15:11 am »

well last sunday it went quicker, and no problems, although I think the c rating at 30c 40c burst isnt enough, at full throttle my low voltage lipo alarms are going off, and they are fine on lower throttle, running on 2 x 3 cell 5000mah turnigy lipos (22.2v).

Modified 52.5mm "x" prop, with the 2 blade trailing edges trimmed by 1mm to lessen the load, no heat issues, so next time out its an ally "x" prop. The torque could now be too much for the cheap plastic props, the boat now wants to roll when pushing full throttle, video quality is rubbish, its fine on the camcorder, and on pc, but rubbish when uploaded, cant explain it!

   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VObcKxNWh_c
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #54 on: April 11, 2010, 12:07:50 am »

ok so I have run the ally prop, and was very suprised to find that it was slower than my converted 52.5mm "X" prop. Still dont think I am there yet with setup, and time off work, weather, family commitments etc really eat up test time! On 6 cells it goes really well, the videos just dont make it look that way  :((, I ideally  want to run on 5 cells, then that means I can have two runs, as I have two sets of 5 cell configuration, and 6 cells flat out is only 10 mins!, but a great 10 mins!! :}. So I have ordered from MFA a smaller motor gear, which will hopefully reduce acceleration and increase top speed for the bigger lakes. I currently have a 14t motor gear, and 30t shaft, so this 12t motor gear might do the job, and on 5 cells and a bigger prop just might give the answer, but as always its test test and more test.

I can of course just run a 12v lead acid and run all day, but thats not what I want, but earlier this week I had a short sail on a very small lake in Crosby (Liverpool). Unfortunately the local council have neglected their duties ignoring the upkeep of the lake as there was a load of rubbish in the water so we cut short the sail as it was only a matter of time before the prop was fouled, its the first time the boat was run slow! :embarrassed:

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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #55 on: April 11, 2010, 12:23:19 am »

on last video you may have heard a question saying was that full throttle? As I was connecting battery, I think I moved the throttle stick before the esc has set, meaning that the full throttle position had been lost. That evening I recharged the 2 lipo packs, reset the throttle on esc and darted up to Hoylake at 8.00pm. It was just going dusk, and a really mild sunny evening, so had a good thrash around with the nav and cabin lights on.

AS I was on my own it was impossible to video, but when I was running the batteries down I balanced the video camera on the bank and (foolishly!) thought it would be funny to see how close I could get to the camera! :embarrassed:

Its a short video, but you might aswell have it on here :-))

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nightowl2912

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #56 on: April 23, 2010, 08:49:21 pm »

any updates
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #57 on: April 25, 2010, 11:41:56 am »

finally got to stretch her legs on a big lake, due to previous impatience not letting esc set, I think esc is not reading full throttle, but goes well. You can hear the power increasing after first few seconds on a long stretch, From memory, I think the esc has a soft start which is a default, its reprogrammed on a pc/laptop so I will have to do that again.

 Left handers are real nice at speed, right handers suffer from as bit of prop torque, first 2 mins are warming up, then a bit at higher speed. Last night I changed the gear ratio to give higher top speed, slower acceleration, for the big lakes :-))

Hope to try that within the next few days, but I have a feeling the drive belt may now be too long with the smaller gear, its a bit too loose. For anyone contemplating building any variation/size of a Huntsman, its a real  nice boat and thrives on that rougher water that most other boats dont like, it handles great, my very old cheap rudder servo that was only intended for a test holds well

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Er5FfXMxrxg
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TugCowboy

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #58 on: April 26, 2010, 11:21:38 am »

Not sure why I hadn't picked up on this thread before but I absolutely adore your boat, such a beautiful build and stunning results. Congratulations mate she is a stunner.

Alex
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #59 on: April 26, 2010, 11:17:33 pm »

thanks Alex! :}

had another blast tonight, but back on the small test lake in fear of explosions and having to wait for the boat to float in :embarrassed:

still playing with setup, I fitted a 2 teeth smaller motor pinion, changing the ratio from 2:1, to 2.5:1. The idea being less acceleration, more top speed, for the big lakes. Ran 5 cells, on the same modified 52.5mm prop as described earlier, went very nice, changed to 6 cells much better. Now I have fitted an absolutely superb little gizmo that only cost 15 (Thanks to HS93 for finding this!). It fits permanently if required in line with esc and battery, and measures battery voltage (with built in alarm for low volts), amps, watts, and will scroll continuously through all, and retains max readings, how have I managed without this! only prob is now I know I am frying the motor! :((

I am drawing max 66.7amps, motor is 65amps, 80amp surge, so well on the limit here. But could not rest there, fitted a 55mm "X" prop, never had this big on, and went for it! :} max amps on 6 cells a whopping 72.6a!, is that a record for a scale boat! (ha ha !), it was absolutely ballistic, but it reduces battery run time. Now I think it could be time to get a proper 3 blade prop, then you will see a nice red sunset in the Hoylake area {-)
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build
« Reply #60 on: June 10, 2010, 01:26:29 am »

had a blast out last night, the 2.5:1 ratio works real nice, its just a matter of swopping props to accommodate large or small lakes. Temperature of motor seems to be under control, but I think the cooling coils around the motor, which is an out runner with a static outer can is not really doing anything. I have thought about mounting a fan, but room isn't really there, so I think its back to thinking of water cooling the mount.

I ran on 19.2v nims, 4600mah, but they seemed to struggle, and got very hot, so I think they where unable to deliver the amps quick enough, the c rating is unknown. Back to the lipos, 22.2v, 5000mah, 30c rating, speed up by a third, I think its the higher c rating that can deliver the amps quick enough. It s a wild ride, even on a smaller prop due to size of lake, but its real good fun, I just cant get enough of this boat, really looking forward to getting quality nims, high mah and c rating, and running on 24v, then I can run till flat, unlike the lipos which need to be pampered. in this video, when hard accelerating, you can hear the lipo voltage monitors beeping as the packs are working flat out! Its only a matter of time before there is a big bang :}, the volt meter mentioned previously recorded a max amp draw of 99.8, good job the esc is rated at 120amps! :-))

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_VzprATn0M
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Flying Sparks

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #61 on: June 10, 2010, 07:20:20 pm »

Quote
the volt meter mentioned previously recorded a max amp draw of 99.8, good job the esc is rated at 120amps!

 :o :o :o Holy smoke nearly one hundred Amps!!!! Don't fry your motor  %%

Have you taken any video of your Huntsman on the big lake? It would be nice to see her realy open up.

Thanks for sharing.

Phil.
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #62 on: June 10, 2010, 11:44:24 pm »

Hi Phil, long time no speak! :-)

Yes I have been on a big lake with a 55mm "X" prop, it was real good, but I was on my own so could not video. The last one was with my youngest son and he struggled a bit keeoping up, and predicting where I was going to turn next. Hopefully quite soon I will be out with a boater friend, then he can drive, with a gps in the boat, and I can finally get that ellusive video on a big lake :-))
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Flying Sparks

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #63 on: June 11, 2010, 12:53:23 pm »

Hi Red

I've not contributed much lately but I have been around, looking forward to seeing your "big lake" video.

Is that a saltwater lake on your video?

Phil.

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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #64 on: June 12, 2010, 07:38:25 am »

Its a recently rebiult lake at Hoylake, Wirral, and is only about 15 mins from my house so is handy for testing. Its a fresh water lake, but the problem I have encountered is its only yards from the beach. High tides are very unusual, but not long ago there was one, and now there is salt water in the lake, meaning its a wash down of the boat after being there to protect the chrome fittings, lovely location for the Huntsman as I am waiting for some choppy water to get it airbourne :}
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Flying Sparks

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #65 on: June 12, 2010, 09:06:55 pm »

Does the salt cause any problems with the esc or motor and shaft?

I thought you might like to see some photos taken at the Wicksteed Mayhem do this year. Unfortunately the esc burnt out, not sure why I'm only pulling just over 20A wide open throttle. I did find a bit of weed around the propshaft but only a little and I could still turn the shaft OK by hand. It was only a very cheap controller so I'm no to upset. Got a new new pukka water cooled esc now, just need to set it up and give it a run.




Phil.
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #66 on: June 12, 2010, 09:36:00 pm »

2nd pic a great shot Phil, not much hull left in the water :} these boats go so well, whar is your set up, motor, esc, batteries etc? Is the boat a wood hull?

Paul
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Flying Sparks

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #67 on: June 13, 2010, 08:04:43 pm »

Hi Red

The motor is a 950Kv 40A outrunner, physically it's about the same size a a 540 motor. It had a cheapy 60A air esc and 4 cell 4400 Lipo. The hull is a Precedent 34" wooden version that is in dire need of a repaint. Go well though  :}
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ghost123uk

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #68 on: September 09, 2010, 10:29:18 am »

Wow Mr RED181, that is just suburb work  :-)) - and great performance in the end  %%

Although I am no expert, I bet a pair of trim tabs would give some extra degree of "trim-ability" - I know the r/c controlled ones on my multi racer made a huge difference and where often used to compensate for differing water or race / sport settings & conditions. I even used to use the "mixer" function on the TX to adjust their angle with the use of the rudder.

I just got my semi scale Huntsman / Huntress / Swordsman (still not sure !!) and your efforts make me think I should re-build mine into a more accurate scale job. Mind you with the work you have put in on yours, mine would only ever be a poor relative (me not having the patience, skills or time available to do the level of work you have done)

As I only live in the South Wirral, and it appears you live in the North Wirral, perhaps, next time you are taking yours for a blast, I could meet up and see it in action. (I could also bring mine and pick your brains a little  ;) ) (pm with phone number etc to this effect sent)

EDIT = RED181, can you let me know if you got the pm ok as it did not appear to "send" correctly  :embarrassed:
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #69 on: September 09, 2010, 07:51:08 pm »

got the pm Ghost, I got A LOT of help with mine, I really like the look of your boat, it looks like a real racer, the front windows do represent Swordfish rather than Huntsman, why not do it like the Huntress in Bonds "From Russia With Love"? , the fuel barrels used in the film would be unique!

Would love to get together, only prob is my run time flat out is 15 mins! so bring plenty of fuel for your boat to keep us busy! I am still pratting around with different props, its amazing the difference that just a prop can make. Between my friend and I, we have quite a few prop shop 2, 3 and 4 blade props, varying pitches and blade construction, unfortunately they are all 4 mm (Well, I have one, he has the rest! :embarrassed:) . SHG have just made me a stainless 5mm shaft, turned down to a 4mm thread so we can now test with the other props. I tried last week a massive 3 blade brass prop, the amp draw almost halved, but the boat virtually turned over, one of the vents and windows where ripped off it went that far over! :} , so its currently in dry dock awaiting delivery of more alclad chrome paint to finish new vents and window frames, I am convinced something like a 50mm 3 blade cleaver will produce the performance I want with more efficiency than the plastic "x" props I currently use, I love testing and trying to improve, far more than just sailing around, each to their own eh?!! :-)) Will be in touch, any questuions just ask
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Perkasaman2

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #70 on: September 10, 2010, 11:06:17 am »

Hi Red, You appear to be at the stage in the tuning of the boat that the original racers reached and your action pics replicate those of the originals when running near flat out/calm conditions. Your brushless motor seems to have considerable torque to generate such an extreme sideways hull reaction/rotation. Could you give the size of this  prop as a reference point.  :-) 
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ghost123uk

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #71 on: September 10, 2010, 12:09:21 pm »


got the pm Ghost, I got A LOT of help with mine, I really like the look of your boat, it looks like a real racer, the front windows do represent Swordfish rather than Huntsman, why not do it like the Huntress in Bonds "From Russia With Love"? , the fuel barrels used in the film would be unique!

Come the winter, I may mod my boat to be a bit more scale like.
On the other hand, I might just glaze the windows and play with it  %)

! I am still pratting around with different props, I love testing and trying to improve, far more than just sailing around, each to their own eh?!! :-))

Totally agree, that's half the fun in having a high powered boat (or plane).
Just sailing around would get boring for me (us) - (no offence to those who do not get bored by doing that)
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #72 on: September 10, 2010, 09:02:51 pm »

Ghost,

Been thinking about your boat, if it was mine, and as many Fairey bioats where commission build, I would leave it unique as it is, and paint it in the Ford cross channel racing colours, just a thought! :-))

Will get together at Gautby sometime, pref when the water gets a bit choppy so we can catch some air!
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ghost123uk

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #73 on: September 11, 2010, 10:14:02 am »

Ghost,

Been thinking about your boat, if it was mine, and as many Fairey bioats where commission build, I would leave it unique as it is, and paint it in the Ford cross channel racing colours, just a thought! :-))


Actually a similar(ish) thought had occurred to me.
I have managed to find the contact details of the guy that owned it last (and built it I wonder ?)
I will contact him to get some "provenance" and if it is old and / or scratch built, I will leave it alone and keep it original.
 

Will get together at Gautby sometime, pref when the water gets a bit choppy so we can catch some air!

Any time  :-))

Used to love racing the Multi in choppy water  :-)) - Lots of trim tab and a course pitch prop  :-))
It (they) do go faster with a slight chop on the water, I think it must be due to slippery air bubbles under the hull, trouble is, when it gets too rough, the prop spends half it's time out of the water, you need a quick throttle finger to back off when that happens !
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red181

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Re: Complete Huntsman 28 Brushless build, with tears & Laughter!
« Reply #74 on: October 20, 2010, 08:09:28 am »

sorry for duplication from another new thread, but I wanted the video to be attached to this build thread also. Its an on board camera, at Gautby Road in Birkenhead, prop testing! :-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSdb8C9e_JY
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